Marilyn Monroe

[John Simkin]

According to Sarah Churchill’s recently published book, The Many Lives of Marilyn Monroe (2004), it was GeorgeSmathers who first leaked the story to the press about her affair with JFK. The story first appeared in an article by Dorothy Kilgallen the day before Monroe died (Kilgallen was herself to die in similar circumstances as Monroe on 8th November, 1965).

Why should George Smathers do this? One possibility is that Smathers was trying to link JFK with Monroe’s death. According to Matthew Smith’s Victim: The Secret Tapes of Marilyn Monroe (2003) the CIA was involved in a plot to implicate the Kennedys in Monroe’s death as punishment for the Bay of Pigs disaster.

If Smathers was involved in any conspiracy to kill JFK one would expect those close to him like Grant Stockdale to find out about it. One person who might have discovered what was going on was his secretary, Mary Jo Kopechne, and her flat mate, Nancy Carole Tyler, who was Bobby Baker’s secretary. According to Penn Jones, it was Kopchne and Tyler who leaked the story about JFK replacing LBJ by Smathers as vice president.

Nancy Carole Tyler died in a plane crash, near Ocean City, Maryland, on 10th May, 1965.

Kopechne went on to become Robert Kennedy’s secretary. She was to die in Edward Kennedy’s car on 18th July, 1969.

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKsmathers.htm

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKkopechne.htm

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKbakerB.htm

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKtylerN.htm

[Linda Powell]

Hi John - thanks for this info (assuming it's in response to my recent bio posting - if not, thanks anyway!). I hadn't heard of the Smathers connection so I'll put that on my list to look into, also the books you mention.

You probably also know that it's said Kilgallen had been trying to reach both Marilyn and Bobby during the last week of Marilyn's life and that she'd also published some speculation in her column about their romance - without naming Bobby specifically.

I've also pondered the Kopechne death and you may know of this site http://www.ytedk.com/chapter5.htm which gives an outline of events.

Cheers

[John Simkin]

I've also pondered the Kopechne death and you may know of this site http://www.ytedk.com/chapter5.htm which gives an outline of events.

No, I did not know this website. Thanks for the link. Yes, the posting was in response to your biography (another reason for members to add their biography).

Please feel free to start threads on the Monroe case in the History and Politics sections of the forum. However, if they relate to JFK post them here.

The forum is a good place to test any theories you may have on the case. Members will be only too willing to check them over for you.

[Wim Dankbaar]

I repeat my post from the RFK discussion:

It is possible that the conspirators had "the goods" on the Kennedy's, enough to force Bobby to keep his mouth shut.

For example, I am convinced Marilyn Monroe was pregnant from JFK, refused the abortion that Giancana would arrange in Chicago, just like with Judyth Exner, then fell victim to JFK's request to Giancana to solve the problem. Giancana sent a private plane with his men to the west coast on the early morning of August 4, 1962, and RFK was there personally to make sure the evidence would suggest suicide.

I'd say that's enough to make sure Bobby won't call for an investigation (into his brother's death).

Wim

[Linda Powell]

Wim - I feel it's unlikely that Giancana was involved in Monroe's death, despite the claims made in 'Double Cross' by Sam Giancana Jnr.

You may be familiar with Donald H Wolfe's 'The Assassination of Marilyn Monroe' (UK title) in which he refers to eye witness testimony given by Norman Jeffries (the son-in-law of Eunice Murray, Marilyn's housekeeper). For me and many others I feel, his is the most compelling statement to emerge and explains much that was previously missing or confusing from the statements of others. It is clear from his account that RFK and two other men, who were later identified as 'security officers' from LAPD, were responsible for the lethal injection of barbiturate given to Monroe.

You're probably also familiar with Fred Otash and his (as far as I know) consistent accounts of hearing the tape recorded violent quarrel between MM and RFK on the day she died.

Robert Slatzer is of course well known for his investigation into MM's death and his 'The Life and Curious Death of Marilyn Monroe' offers compelling evidence for RFK's personal involvement in her death and at no point do the mafia feature in the death scenario. I haven't been able to get a copy of his second book on the subject 'The Marilyn Files' despite strenuous efforts on my part, so until I've read it I can't say if he continued to believe that RFK was involved in her death.

Marilyn's alleged pregnancies are often cited as a source of tension between her and JFK/RFK and it's said - though I don't know what the evidence is - that she had had a number of abortions throughout her life.

For my book, I'm researching specific dates in order to build up the fullest possible picture of where she and the two Kennedy brothers were and what they were doing between February and August 1962. So far, though there are many gaps yet to be filled, I've not found any suggestion of pregnancy during this period. Of course if I should find any convincing evidence for such I will include it in my assessment of events.

Your suggestion that Giancana had 'the goods' on RFK may well be correct if he had a copy of the tapes made by Otash et al. It's believed that RFK was behind the seizure of tapes made by both Otash and Spindel, but it's also believed that Hoffa was among those who had tape recordings. There's been speculation in the past about why Hoffa didn't expose any incriminating evidence he had against RFK, but perhaps when viewed in the context of the JFK assassination and both RFK's and the Kennedy family's apparent acceptance of the lone-nut theory, it makes sense.

I'll leave it here for now, as I don't want to take up room on this forum and would like to start a separate one for Marilyn under 'History'.

Thanks

[John Simkin]

You may be familiar with Donald H Wolfe's 'The Assassination of Marilyn Monroe' (UK title) in which he refers to eye witness testimony given by Norman Jeffries (the son-in-law of Eunice Murray, Marilyn's housekeeper).  For me and many others I feel, his is the most compelling statement to emerge and explains much that was previously missing or confusing from the statements of others.  It is clear from his account that RFK and two other men, who were later identified as 'security officers' from LAPD, were responsible for the lethal injection of barbiturate given to Monroe.

I am not convinced that Robert Kennedy was involved with Marilyn Monroe. JFK was for a brief time (as so many women were) but the relationship does not appear to have been very important and it is unlikely that he would have passed on highly secretive information.

What we do know is that George Smathers and Dorothy Kilgallen were both involved in leaking information linking the Kennedy brothers to Monroe. Knowing what we do about Smathers and Kilgallen, this information was almost certain to have come originally from the CIA. Interestingly, this information was released just before and just after the death of Monroe.

This FBI document appeared on the internet a few years ago:

Central Intelligence Agency report on Dorothy Kilgallen and Marilyn Monroe (3rd August, 1962)

Wiretap of telephone conversation between reporter Dorothy Kilgallen and her close friend, Howard Rothberg; from wiretap of telephone conversation of Marilyn Monroe and Attorney General Robert Kennedy. Appraisal of Content: (Blacked Out).

1. Rothberg discussed the apparent comeback of subject with Kilgallen and the break up with the Kennedys. Rothberg told Kilgallen that she was attending Hollywood parties hosted by the "inner circle" among Hollywood's elite and was becoming the talk of the town again. Rothberg indicated in so many words, that she had secrets to tell, no doubt arising from her trists (sic) with the President and the Attorney General. One such (illegible) mentions the visit by the President at a secret air base for the purpose of inspecting things from outer space. Kilgallen replied that she knew what might be the source of the visit. In the mid-fifties Kilgallen learned of secret effort by US and UK governments to identify the origins of crashed spacecraft and dead bodies, from a British government official. Kilgallen believed the story may have come from the (illegible) in the late forties. Kilgallen said that if the story is true, it could cause terrible embarrassment to Jack and his plans to have NASA put men on the moon.

2. Subject repeatedly called the Attorney General and complained about the way she was being ignored by the President and his brother.

3. Subject threatened to hold a press conference and would tell all.

4. Subject made references to "bases" in Cuba and knew of the President's plan to kill Castro.

5. Subject made reference to her "diary of secrets" and what the newspapers would do with such disclosures.

This is not of course a genuine document and is just another attempt to link the death of Monroe to John and Robert Kennedy. Why? I suspect a group of people, possibility the same group behind the assassinations of these two men, were trying to undermine their careers. Not that the fact that both men had affairs, they could survive that kind of scandal. What really posed a threat to them was linking them to the death of a famous film star. Therefore, if Monroe was murdered, the likely motive was an attempt to set up Jack and Robert Kennedy (In the same way that Edward Kennedy was set up over the death of Mary Jo Kopechne.)

The one thing that I do know, if Robert Kennedy was involved in the death of Monroe, he would have made sure he had a cast-iron alibi and would not have been anywhere near the scene of the crime.

I suspect that Dorothy Kilgallen was not murdered because of what she found out about the assassination of JFK. She died because she knew too much about the death of Marilyn Monroe.

[James Richards]

I am not convinced that Robert Kennedy was involved with Marilyn Monroe.

I agree, John. This document below suggests RFK was not involved with Monroe.

james

[Wim Dankbaar]

James,

Would you expect RFK to CONFIRM he or JFK was having an affair with Monroe?

Wim

Edited June 24, 2004 by dankbaar

[James Richards]

Would you expect RFK to CONFIRM he or JFK was having an affair with Monroe?

No Wim, I wouldn't.

I was just stating what the document suggested.

james