Was Lovelady A Big Fat Prevaricator, Or What?

[Bill Miller]

1 hour ago, Paul Trejo said:

Tommy,

IMHO, the WC testimony of all the TSBD workers tally well if we allow that their minute to minute TIMING was off.

First, Vicki and Sandra hung around the fourth floor gabbing with the girls and looking out of the many windows at the Grassy Knoll for 5-8 minutes, as Sandra seems to recall (not Vickie).

Secondly, Gloria Calvary came running up to Shelley and Lovelady within 20 seconds. After about 40 seconds they decided to take a closer look.

After Shelley and Lovelady got to that  "little old island" They heard someone holler so they looked back to see Baker and Truly run into the TSBD.

Then they walked with a cop to the railroad tracks, saw nothing special, and then returned to the TSBD side entrance where they saw Vickie and Sandra.

Regards 

--Paul Trejo 

You got that right, Paul. Peoples memories of spaces in time when it comes to being stressed or in a state of shock and/or confusion is not to be considered a time clock of the event. If a witness looked at their watch periodically during that same period, then that would be a different matter, but as far as I am aware - that didn't happen. Who hasn't had an experience where they recalled an event seeming as if it took forever to get through while perhaps others thought it went by rather quickly. It happened to me each time I ever went to a dentist.  

[Thomas Graves]

4 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

Tommy,

IMHO, the WC testimony of all the TSBD workers tally well if we allow that their minute to minute TIMING was off.

First, Vicki and Sandra hung around the fourth floor gabbing with the girls and looking out of the many windows at the Grassy Knoll for 5-8 minutes, as Sandra seems to recall (not Vickie).

Secondly, Gloria Calvary came running up to Shelley and Lovelady within 20 seconds. After about 40 seconds they decided to take a closer look.

After Shelley and Lovelady got to that  "little old island" They heard someone holler so they looked back to see Baker and Truly run into the TSBD.

Then they walked with a cop to the railroad tracks, saw nothing special, and then returned to the TSBD side entrance where they saw Vickie and Sandra.

Regards 

--Paul Trejo 

Dear Paul,

How many girls were they gabbing with?  Hadn't most of the gals gone outside to see what Jackie was wearing that day, and to catch a glimpse of her handsome husband?

Who did that leave?  Mrs Gardner?

--  Tommy

[Ray Mitcham]

4 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

Tommy,

IMHO, the WC testimony of all the TSBD workers tally well if we allow that their minute to minute TIMING was off.

First, Vicki and Sandra hung around the fourth floor gabbing with the girls and looking out of the many windows at the Grassy Knoll for 5-8 minutes, as Sandra seems to recall (not Vickie).

Secondly, Gloria Calvary came running up to Shelley and Lovelady within 20 seconds. After about 40 seconds they decided to take a closer look.

After Shelley and Lovelady got to that  "little old island" They heard someone holler so they looked back to see Baker and Truly run into the TSBD.

Then they walked with a cop to the railroad tracks, saw nothing special, and then returned to the TSBD side entrance where they saw Vickie and Sandra.

Regards 

--Paul Trejo 

Paul, please give the citations for your statements.

"Vicki and Sandra hung around the fourth floor gabbing with the girls and looking out of the many windows at the Grassy Knoll for 5-8 minutes, as Sandra seems to recall (not Vickie)."

(Lovelady and Shelley) then returned "to the TSBD[sic] side entrance where they saw Vickie and Sandra. 

 

Edited March 23, 2017 by Ray Mitcham

[Ray Mitcham]

3 hours ago, Bill Miller said:

You got that right, Paul. Peoples memories of spaces in time when it comes to being stressed or in a state of shock and/or confusion is not to be considered a time clock of the event. If a witness looked at their watch periodically during that same period, then that would be a different matter, but as far as I am aware - that didn't happen. Who hasn't had an experience where they recalled an event seeming as if it took forever to get through while perhaps others thought it went by rather quickly. It happened to me each time I ever went to a dentist.  

And I suppose in your world, Bill, when witnesses do look at their watches and the times doesn't agree with the official version, it is be ignored? 

[Paul Trejo]

44 minutes ago, Thomas Graves said:

Dear Paul,

How many girls were they gabbing with?  Hadn't most of the gals gone outside to see what Jackie was wearing that day, and to catch a glimpse of her handsome husband?

Who did that leave?  Mrs Gardner?

--  Tommy

Again, Tommy, it's a question of remembering the minute-to-minute TIMING of the event.   It remains unclear.   (Bill Miller raises a valid point -- that during periods of crisis and chaos, some people have a distorted perception of time lengths.)

The sworn record for the EVENTS themselves continues to tally well -- Shelley and Lovelady saw Vickie and Sandra on the 1st floor of the TSBD some 6-10 minutes after the JFK shots were fired.

No wonder Vickie and Sandra saw nobody else on the stairs with them.

Also, Truly and Baker were up on the TSBD roof, furiously looking around during that time.

Meanwhile -- LHO slipped out of the TSBD -- probably by one of the rear exits.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

[Thomas Graves]

46 minutes ago, Paul Trejo said:

Again, Tommy, it's a question of remembering the minute-to-minute TIMING of the event.   It remains unclear.   (Bill Miller raises a valid point -- that during periods of crisis and chaos, some people have a distorted perception of time lengths.)

The sworn record for the EVENTS themselves continues to tally well -- Shelley and Lovelady saw Vickie and Sandra on the 1st floor of the TSBD some 6-10 minutes after the JFK shots were fired.

No wonder Vickie and Sandra saw nobody else on the stairs with them.

Also, Truly and Baker were up on the TSBD roof, furiously looking around during that time.

Meanwhile -- LHO slipped out of the TSBD -- probably by one of the rear exits.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

 

Dear Paul,

How do you know how long Vicki and Sandra lingered on the fourth floor before going down?

From Vicki's WC testimony (which she said, when she read it for the first time many years later, had been altered to make it look like she and Sandra had seen Shelley and Lovelady on the first floor)?

Because Vicki's "testimony" jibed so well with some of "Future Petty Theft" Shelley's and "Convicted Felon" Lovelady's statements and testimonies?

It's too bad that Sandra wasn't called upon to give testimony to the Warren Commission.  I wonder why that was?

After all, if she had been, they could have had the fun of changing hers, too!

--  Tommy

 

Edited March 23, 2017 by Thomas Graves

[Bill Miller]

3 hours ago, Ray Mitcham said:

And I suppose in your world, Bill, when witnesses do look at their watches and the times doesn't agree with the official version, it is be ignored? 

I just said what I believe based on my experiences as well as others - do you have a point to make?

Edited March 23, 2017 by Bill Miller

[Bill Miller]

2 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

Again, Tommy, it's a question of remembering the minute-to-minute TIMING of the event.   It remains unclear.   (Bill Miller raises a valid point -- that during periods of crisis and chaos, some people have a distorted perception of time lengths.)

The sworn record for the EVENTS themselves continues to tally well -- Shelley and Lovelady saw Vickie and Sandra on the 1st floor of the TSBD some 6-10 minutes after the JFK shots were fired.

No wonder Vickie and Sandra saw nobody else on the stairs with them.

Also, Truly and Baker were up on the TSBD roof, furiously looking around during that time.

Meanwhile -- LHO slipped out of the TSBD -- probably by one of the rear exits.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

It can be as simple as asking one's self why does time seem to go bay faster when being busy over not doing anything. Has not everyone at one time or another gotten side-tracked doing something only to look at the clock to find time had gotten away from them.

Then there are phrases like 'I will be there in a minute' which in reality ended up being five minutes. I reason some Commission testimony where a witness was asked to give an amount of time and the witness replied with words to the effect 'about a minute'.

[Paul Trejo]

2 hours ago, Thomas Graves said:

Dear Paul,

How do you know how long Vicki and Sandra lingered on the fourth floor before going down?

From Vicki's WC testimony (which she said, when she read it for the first time many years later, had been altered to make it look like she and Sandra had seen Shelley and Lovelady on the first floor)?

Because Vicki's "testimony" jibed so well with some of "Future Petty Theft" Shelley's and "Convicted Felon" Lovelady's statements and testimonies?

It's too bad that Sandra wasn't called upon to give testimony to the Warren Commission.  I wonder why that was?

After all, if she had been, they could have had the fun of changing hers, too!

--  Tommy

 

Tommy,

My estimate of the time that Vickie and Sandra dallied on the 4th floor before they came down the stairs is simply a few seconds before they greeted Shelley and Lovelady on the 1st floor.

That would be 5 to 9 minutes by my reckoning.

Sandra wasn't called by the WC but she told interviewer Sean Murphy, that Vickie guessed way too little time before they came down.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo 

Edited March 23, 2017 by Paul Trejo

[Thomas Graves]

9 minutes ago, Paul Trejo said:

Tommy,

My estimate of the time that Vickie and Sandra dallied on the 4th floor before they came down the stairs is simply a few seconds before they greeted Shelley and Lovelady on the 1st floor.

That would be 5 to 9 minutes by my reckoning.

Sandra wasn't called by the WC but she told interviewer that Vickie guessed way too little time before they came down.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo 

And I disagree with you.

And therein lies the rub.

[Michael Clark]

1 minute ago, Thomas Graves said:

And therein lies the rub.

Thats quotable....

[Thomas Graves]

3 hours ago, Michael Clark said:

Thats quotable....

I meant to say the rubber ducky.

--  Tommy

But wait a second.  "Rub" is a slang word for "murder," isn't it, like JFK's murder, for example?

So I like that turn of phrase, after all.

Edited March 24, 2017 by Thomas Graves

[Michael Clark]

Just now, Thomas Graves said:

I meant to say the rubber ducky.

--  Tommy

But wait a second!  "Rub" is a slang word for "a killing," isn't it?

Start a new thread.

[Thomas Graves]

1 minute ago, Michael Clark said:

Start a new thread.

It's bifurcating, isn't it?

Not unlike the-one-and-only Oswald's Intell files did over the years, with more and more "marked cards" in them each time, and sent to different other Intell branches each time, in a couple of "mole hunts", which ended up making some gullible JFK assassination "researchers" think there MUST have been a long-term doppelganger project!

--  Tommy

[Michael Clark]

14 minutes ago, Thomas Graves said:

It's bifurcating, isn't it?

Not unlike the-one-and-only Oswald's Intell files did over the years, with more and more "marked cards" in them each time, and sent to different other Intell branches each time, in a couple of "mole hunts", which ended up making some gullible JFK assassination "researchers" think there MUST have been a long-term doppelganger project!

--  Tommy

Huh?