How Corrupt Was the Clinton Presidency, Compared to Other Administrations

[Guest Robert Morrow]

I would love Mr. Morrow to tell me the true story behind the deaths of LeBleu, McKeehan, Williams, and Willis.

How much do you really know Robert?

I really don't know. I think you are referring to the initial BATF raid on the Branch Davidians when 4 of them died?

I know a reporter who studied this closely. The whole reason the BATF made the raid on the Branch Davidians was because there was a move in Congress to end the BATF and merge it with some other bureaucracy, perhaps the FBI.

The BATF leadership had a congressional hearing coming up and they wanted to have a big feather in their cap to show Congress, so they engineered the fiasco raid on the Branch Davidians, causing 4 of the agents to lose their lives.

They could EASILY have arrested David Koresh whenever he went jogging or every Thursday night when he went to play in a band at a local restaurant.

As it was, it blew up in their faces. Then there was the huge stand off.

Then was the final raid on the Branch Davidians when so many of them were murdered by the government. That final raid was not ordered by Janet Reno, who had just become the Attorney General. It was ordered by Hillary Clinton through Vince Foster and Webb Hubbell - pretty much telling Janet Reno to force the issue.

I should not have to tell the reader how extremely close Hillary was to both Webb Hubbell and Vince Foster.

Reno did not want to, asking is there some way we can avoid it (avoid a climatic assault on the Branch Davidians' home.)

But, apparently, Hillary was upset that the Branch Davidian-BATF standoff was taking the headlines away from her "healthcare reform" and she wanted it over with and she forced the issue - with disastrous results.

Post disaster, Bill Clinton hid from the public and Janet Reno stepped forward to take "full responsibility" for the disaster. Bill Clinton always hated Janet Reno after that, jealous that she had the bravery to accept responsibility.

But the person who made the call, I believe, was Hillary Clinton.

Lyndon Johnson had a saying "Power is where power goes" ... and at this time in 1993 Hillary Clinton was a huge power in the Clinton Administration.

Edited March 31, 2012 by Robert Morrow

[Glenn Viklund]

Yawn.

Tom Scully, where are you?

I agree on both accounts, JImbo.

[Guest Robert Morrow]

The Clinton Chronicles is a very important video. Most of that stuff about the Clintons in that video is true.

There are two problems with the "Clinton Chronicles." 1) I do not think that Vince Foster was murdered by the Clintons or anyone else. I think he committed suicide and his deteriorating relationship with Hillary combined with the Washington pressures led to that.

You can see Ron Kessler's book, which I have, for an update on this: http://www.amazon.com/The-Secrets-FBI-Ronald-Kessler/dp/0307719693/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1333216063&sr=8-1

Secondly, the "Clinton Chronicles" only tells us half the story of what was going on at the elite levels of politics. Of course, Bill Clinton was deep into the CIA drug running of the 1980's. That has been documented time and again. The Clinton Chronicles talks about Mena and all the drug running there but leaves out that the Bushes/CIA/Oliver North/Felix Rodriguez, Barry Seal were up to their ears in that.

Excellent article on Mena: http://www.whale.to/b/morris.html

Bill Clinton was just part of the team when it came to the drugs.

Back to the Chronicles: the beating of of Gary Johnson on 6/26/92 really did occur by 3 big beefy guys with short crewcuts who looked *just like* Arkansas state troopers.

The murder of Jerry Parks is quite suspicious and occurred on 9/26/93.

Unlike many (most) Clinton-haters, I think that Vince Foster was a pure suicide for the reasons I have stated. Never have I ever accused the Clintons of murdering Vince Foster. As per the Arkansas state troopers, Vince and Hillary were an item and this was an open secret in Arkansas.

Here is an excellent web page to learn about the drug crimes that were going on in Arkansas in the 1980's: http://idfiles.com/

Also, here is another excellent web page on what happened to Patrick Knowlton, who was at Fort Marcy Park about the time Vince Foster's body was found.

The FBI ran a criminal, harassment campaign on Patrick Knowlton because they did not like the details of what he was saying, particularly that he did not see a car matching Vince Foster's description in the parking lot.

http://www.fbicover-up.com/articles/ambrose.htm

Again, I do not think Vince Foster was murdered, but I the FBI harassment campaign on Patrick Knowlton was quite real.

Edited March 31, 2012 by Robert Morrow

[Glenn Viklund]

The Clinton Chronicles is a very important video. Most of that stuff about the Clintons in that video is true.

There are two problems with the "Clinton Chronicles." 1) I do not think that Vince Foster was murdered by the Clintons or anyone else. I think he committed suicide and his deteriorating relationship with Hillary combined with the Washington pressures led to that.

You can see Ron Kessler's book, which I have, for an update on this: http://www.amazon.com/The-Secrets-FBI-Ronald-Kessler/dp/0307719693/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1333216063&sr=8-1

Secondly, the "Clinton Chronicles" only tells us half the story of what was going on at the elite levels of politics. Of course, Bill Clinton was deep into the CIA drug running of the 1980's. That has been documented time and again. The Clinton Chronicles talks about Mena and all the drug running there but leaves out that the Bushes/CIA/Oliver North/Felix Rodriguez, Barry Seal were up to their ears in that.

Excellent article on Mena: http://www.whale.to/b/morris.html

Bill Clinton was just part of the team when it came to the drugs.

Back to the Chronicles: the beating of of Gary Johnson on 6/26/92 really did occur by 3 big beefy guys with short crewcuts who looked *just like* Arkansas state troopers.

The murder of Jerry Parks is quite suspicious and occurred on 9/26/93.

Unlike many (most) Clinton-haters, I think that Vince Foster was a pure suicide for the reasons I have stated. Never have I ever accused the Clintons of murdering Vince Foster. As per the Arkansas state troopers, Vince and Hillary were an item and this was an open secret in Arkansas.

Here is an excellent web page to learn about the drug crimes that were going on in Arkansas in the 1980's: http://idfiles.com/

Also, here is another excellent web page on what happened to Patrick Knowlton, who was at Fort Marcy Park about the time Vince Foster's body was found.

The FBI ran a criminal, harassment campaign on Patrick Knowlton because they did not like the details of what he was saying, particularly that he did not see a car matching Vince Foster's description in the parking lot.

http://www.fbicover-up.com/articles/ambrose.htm

Again, I do not think Vince Foster was murdered, but I the FBI harassment campaign on Patrick Knowlton was quite real.

I'd like to side with Tom Scully, regarding Robert Morrow. How many more threads is this man going to be allowed to destroy before decisive action is taken?

[Guest Robert Morrow]

Glenn, we have answered your question. In fact I was the one to quote the relevant sections of the Webb Hubbell book on what Bill Clinton directed.

And as far as talking "off topic" it usually takes two to tango on that, so why don't you complain about everyone else?

Additionally, it is good to have background material on the parties in question. Why would Bill Clinton want to seriously investigate the JFK assassination if he has been in bed with the CIA since 1968? I think the CIA had a big role in the JFK assassination.

Read "How the Clintons will Destroy John McCain" by Jack Wheeler. The relevant section is Cord Meyer telling Jack Wheeler that he recruited Bill Clinton into the CIA in 1968 and that they even paid for his trips into Eastern Europe.

Try this link: http://www.gofrakyourself.com/topic/2932637/1/Discussions/how-the-clintons-will-destroy-john-mccain.html

Jack Wheeler: "Someone who has been a CIA asset since he was recruited by London station chief Cord Meyer while a student at Oxford in 1968?

(Back in the 90s years after he retired, if Cord drank a little too much Scotch, he would laugh derisively at those conspiratorialists who accused Bill Clinton of being connected with the KGB.

"They all darkly point to Bill's participation in anti-war peace conferences in Stockholm and Oslo, and his trip to Leningrad, Moscow, and Prague while he was at Oxford. ‘Who could have paid for this?', they ask. ‘It had to be the KGB!' they claim." Cord would shake his head. "What rot - we paid for it. We recruited Bill the first week he was at Oxford. Bill's been an asset of The Three Bad Words ever since." Cord passed on in 2001.)"

Edited March 31, 2012 by Robert Morrow

[Michael Hogan]

Glenn, we have answered your question. In fact I was the one to quote the relevant sections of the Webb Hubbell book on what Bill Clinton directed.

And as far as talking "off topic" it usually takes two to tango on that, so why don't you complain about everyone else?

Additionally, it is good to have background material on the parties in question. Why would Bill Clinton want to seriously investigate the JFK assassination if he has been in bed with the CIA since 1968? I think the CIA had a big role in the JFK assassination.

Read "How the Clintons will Destroy John McCain" by Jack Wheeler. The relevant section is Cord Meyer telling Jack Wheeler that he recruited Bill Clinton into the CIA in 1968 and that they even paid for his trips into Eastern Europe.

Try this link: http://www.gofrakyourself.com/topic/2932637/1/Discussions/how-the-clintons-will-destroy-john-mccain.html

Jack Wheeler: "Someone who has been a CIA asset since he was recruited by London station chief Cord Meyer while a student at Oxford in 1968?

(Back in the 90s years after he retired, if Cord drank a little too much Scotch, he would laugh derisively at those conspiratorialists who accused Bill Clinton of being connected with the KGB.

"They all darkly point to Bill's participation in anti-war peace conferences in Stockholm and Oslo, and his trip to Leningrad, Moscow, and Prague while he was at Oxford. ‘Who could have paid for this?', they ask. ‘It had to be the KGB!' they claim." Cord would shake his head. "What rot - we paid for it. We recruited Bill the first week he was at Oxford. Bill's been an asset of The Three Bad Words ever since." Cord passed on in 2001.)"

It seems that Morrow is a devotee of Jack Wheeler. He quotes him above.

Sources like this are where Morrow gets his "background material on the parties in question."

Here are some other things Dr Jack Wheeler believes:

All forms of leftism and liberalism are based on an atavistic belief in Black Magic. All are based on the primitive fear of the envious Evil Eye.

The only Americans who owe reparations to the descendants of slaves are the descendants of slave owners. These people are one and the same,

i.e., American blacks are a racial mix of white slave owner and black slave. Blacks owe reparations to themselves.

The next insanity to come in the homosexual assault on the American Family will be PHM: Polygamous Homosexual Marriage. Pathologically

promiscuous homosexuals will consider their "marriage" a legalism that will in no way prevent them from adultery en masse. To maintain the

pretense of "marriage" however, they will have to quickly begin agitating for the legalization of group sodomization as "just another form

of the married life-style".

The "Original Jurisdiction" clause in the Constitution (Article III, Section 2, Clause 2) offers a way to quickly obliterate Roe v. Wade

and teach the Supreme Court a lesson it badly needs to learn: to never again invent non-existent rights in The Constitution.

http://www.tothepointnews.com/content/view/1117/90/

[Ron Ecker]

Ron:

You cannot be serious.

Fiske looked at the Foster death. Starr looked at the Foster death.

Unless I am sadly mistaken, and you can correct me, I will reiterate that the special prosecutors depended for their investigation(s) in this politically charged case on the FBI, just like the Warren Commission did. Is it necessary to say any more?

Finally, Starr gave all the materials to Henry Lee. Henry Lee's report completely vitiated Ruddy's report. In fact, it targeted all the distortions in Ruddy's report.

I did a web search and could find only a "Foster Report" from the OIC, of which Lee was one major participant. (The same Henry Lee, I assume, who, according to a ruling by the judge, withheld evidence from prosecutors in the Phil Spector murder trial.) If this is the report to which you refer, Lee or the report certainly does not "vitiate Ruddy's report" and "distortions." I haven't had time to read it all and don't know when I will, but I read the section on the Foster autopsy, since the autopsy is a key part of the cover-up. Ruddy stated that no x-rays were taken, because, get this, the guy in charge said the x-ray machine was broken. If true, I assume that this dead White House official simply wasn't important enough for the folks at the autopsy to borrow an x-ray machine. Or could there have been another reason for no x-rays? I was anxious to see the observations of Lee et al on this, and guess what. They don't even mention x-rays. Isn't that odd?

So much for vitiating Ruddy's "distortions."

[Guest Robert Morrow]

Glenn, we have answered your question. In fact I was the one to quote the relevant sections of the Webb Hubbell book on what Bill Clinton directed.

And as far as talking "off topic" it usually takes two to tango on that, so why don't you complain about everyone else?

Additionally, it is good to have background material on the parties in question. Why would Bill Clinton want to seriously investigate the JFK assassination if he has been in bed with the CIA since 1968? I think the CIA had a big role in the JFK assassination.

Read "How the Clintons will Destroy John McCain" by Jack Wheeler. The relevant section is Cord Meyer telling Jack Wheeler that he recruited Bill Clinton into the CIA in 1968 and that they even paid for his trips into Eastern Europe.

Try this link: http://www.gofrakyourself.com/topic/2932637/1/Discussions/how-the-clintons-will-destroy-john-mccain.html

Jack Wheeler: "Someone who has been a CIA asset since he was recruited by London station chief Cord Meyer while a student at Oxford in 1968?

(Back in the 90s years after he retired, if Cord drank a little too much Scotch, he would laugh derisively at those conspiratorialists who accused Bill Clinton of being connected with the KGB.

"They all darkly point to Bill's participation in anti-war peace conferences in Stockholm and Oslo, and his trip to Leningrad, Moscow, and Prague while he was at Oxford. ‘Who could have paid for this?', they ask. ‘It had to be the KGB!' they claim." Cord would shake his head. "What rot - we paid for it. We recruited Bill the first week he was at Oxford. Bill's been an asset of The Three Bad Words ever since." Cord passed on in 2001.)"

It seems that Morrow is a devotee of Jack Wheeler. He quotes him above.

Sources like this are where Morrow gets his "background material on the parties in question."

Here are some other things Dr Jack Wheeler believes:

All forms of leftism and liberalism are based on an atavistic belief in Black Magic. All are based on the primitive fear of the envious Evil Eye.

The only Americans who owe reparations to the descendants of slaves are the descendants of slave owners. These people are one and the same,

i.e., American blacks are a racial mix of white slave owner and black slave. Blacks owe reparations to themselves.

The next insanity to come in the homosexual assault on the American Family will be PHM: Polygamous Homosexual Marriage. Pathologically

promiscuous homosexuals will consider their "marriage" a legalism that will in no way prevent them from adultery en masse. To maintain the

pretense of "marriage" however, they will have to quickly begin agitating for the legalization of group sodomization as "just another form

of the married life-style".

The "Original Jurisdiction" clause in the Constitution (Article III, Section 2, Clause 2) offers a way to quickly obliterate Roe v. Wade

and teach the Supreme Court a lesson it badly needs to learn: to never again invent non-existent rights in The Constitution.

http://www.tothepointnews.com/content/view/1117/90/

That is irrelevant. You and DiEugenio need to learn that truth and lies come from all places liberal, conservative, leftist, libertarian, Republican, Democratic, communist.

Jack Wheeler is an uber-GOP insider. He is also friends with Jeb Bush. Absolutely he has deep CIA connections and one of his close friends was Cord Meyer who ran Operation Mockingbird. One of the top jobs of Operation Mockingbird for decades has been covering up the JFK assassination.

Cord Meyer told Wheeler sometime before his death in 2001 that Bill Clinton was CIA since 1968 and I think that is quite significant.

I had emailed Wheeler originally because I wanted to quiz him on the E. Howard Hunt deathbed revelations and see if he thought Cord Meyer was involved in the JFK assassination. Wheeler said that he did not think so, but that he (Wheeler) had long suspected Lyndon Johnson in the JFK assassination.

Jack Wheeler also said that Ray Crump and no one else was the killer of Mary Pinchot Meyer (Cord Meyer's former wife and a mistress of JFK). Wheeler said that Ray Crump was lucky that he had a smart lawyer.

Really, Michael Hogan, can you come up with a higher quality post than that?

(Side note: I am a devotee of Ron Paul, not Jack Wheeler.)

Edited March 31, 2012 by Robert Morrow

[Michael Hogan]

Glenn, we have answered your question. In fact I was the one to quote the relevant sections of the Webb Hubbell book on what Bill Clinton directed.

And as far as talking "off topic" it usually takes two to tango on that, so why don't you complain about everyone else?

Additionally, it is good to have background material on the parties in question. Why would Bill Clinton want to seriously investigate the JFK assassination if he has been in bed with the CIA since 1968? I think the CIA had a big role in the JFK assassination.

Read "How the Clintons will Destroy John McCain" by Jack Wheeler. The relevant section is Cord Meyer telling Jack Wheeler that he recruited Bill Clinton into the CIA in 1968 and that they even paid for his trips into Eastern Europe.

Try this link: http://www.gofrakyourself.com/topic/2932637/1/Discussions/how-the-clintons-will-destroy-john-mccain.html

Jack Wheeler: "Someone who has been a CIA asset since he was recruited by London station chief Cord Meyer while a student at Oxford in 1968?

(Back in the 90s years after he retired, if Cord drank a little too much Scotch, he would laugh derisively at those conspiratorialists who accused Bill Clinton of being connected with the KGB.

"They all darkly point to Bill's participation in anti-war peace conferences in Stockholm and Oslo, and his trip to Leningrad, Moscow, and Prague while he was at Oxford. ‘Who could have paid for this?', they ask. ‘It had to be the KGB!' they claim." Cord would shake his head. "What rot - we paid for it. We recruited Bill the first week he was at Oxford. Bill's been an asset of The Three Bad Words ever since." Cord passed on in 2001.)"

It seems that Morrow is a devotee of Jack Wheeler. He quotes him above.

Sources like this are where Morrow gets his "background material on the parties in question."

Here are some other things Dr Jack Wheeler believes:

All forms of leftism and liberalism are based on an atavistic belief in Black Magic. All are based on the primitive fear of the envious Evil Eye.

The only Americans who owe reparations to the descendants of slaves are the descendants of slave owners. These people are one and the same,

i.e., American blacks are a racial mix of white slave owner and black slave. Blacks owe reparations to themselves.

The next insanity to come in the homosexual assault on the American Family will be PHM: Polygamous Homosexual Marriage. Pathologically

promiscuous homosexuals will consider their "marriage" a legalism that will in no way prevent them from adultery en masse. To maintain the

pretense of "marriage" however, they will have to quickly begin agitating for the legalization of group sodomization as "just another form

of the married life-style".

The "Original Jurisdiction" clause in the Constitution (Article III, Section 2, Clause 2) offers a way to quickly obliterate Roe v. Wade

and teach the Supreme Court a lesson it badly needs to learn: to never again invent non-existent rights in The Constitution.

http://www.tothepointnews.com/content/view/1117/90/

That is irrelevant. You and DiEugenio need to learn that truth and lies come from all places liberal, conservative, leftist, libertarian, Republican, Democratic, communist.

Jack Wheeler is an uber-GOP insider. He is also friends with Jeb Bush. Absolutely he has deep CIA connections and one of his close friends was Cord Meyer who ran Operation Mockingbird. One of the top jobs of Operation Mockingbird for decades has been covering up the JFK assassination.

Cord Meyer told Wheeler sometime before his death in 2001 that Bill Clinton was CIA since 1968 and I think that is quite significant.

I had emailed Wheeler originally because I wanted to quiz him on the E. Howard Hunt deathbed revelations and see if he thought Cord Meyer was involved in the JFK assassination. Wheeler said that he did not think so, but that he (Wheeler) had long suspected Lyndon Johnson in the JFK assassination.

Jack Wheeler also said that Ray Crump and no one else was the killer of Mary Pinchot Meyer (Cord Meyer's former wife and a mistress of JFK). Wheeler said that Ray Crump was lucky that he had a smart lawyer.

Really, Michael Hogan, can you come up with a higher quality post than that?

(Side note: I am a devotee of Ron Paul, not Jack Wheeler.)

It is not irrelevant at all, even if you think so. Your posts on this and other forums have come under attack from far more people than just me and Jim DiEugenio. There are good reasons for that.

You are always telling "folks" what to Google.

You need to Google reputable source. Then you need to Google critical thinking. Then you need to Google devotee.

Don't forget to Google truth.

Most of all you need to Google common sense.

I doubt any of it will sink in.

Edited March 31, 2012 by Michael Hogan

[Len Colby]

I know this thread has drifted off topic, but I've researched Bill Clinton quite a bit myself. In my opinion, he may be the single most corrupt politician of all time. Considering how widespread political corruption is, that's really saying something.

The Clinton Body Count was all too real. The Vince Foster case alone should have caused him to be impeached. The number of unnatural deaths around him was frighteningly surreal. I've communicated with Linda Ives, mother of Kevin Ives, one of the two boys who died on the train tracks back when Clinton was Governor of Arkansas. These victims were real, and their families are real, too. The Ives family was apolitical- they weren't "enemies" out to get Clinton. Their son happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, and he died. Then the authorities lied about it, including the coroner, whom Clinton defended repeatedly, despite his monumental incompetence.

Trooper Danny Ferguson's wife "killed herself." A month later, her fiance "killed himself" at her grave site. That's like a bad movie script. Jerry Parks? Tells his family he's a "dead man," and then is shot and killed while driving his car? How many people die like this? People who weren't Clinton's "enemies" saw a hole that looked like a gunshot wound in Ron Brown's head. People don't magically turn the massive profit that Hillary Clinton did on cattle shares without some "help." The list of their scandals is endless. The only thing that saved them was the mainstream media, who ignored all the truly terrible stuff.

Clinton was totally corrupt. So were both Bushes. So is Obama. The left/right paradigm is used to divide and conquer the people. Sorry to go off topic, too. But I wanted to add my two cents worth.

Right on. You didn't mention Juanita Broaddrick, whose story of being raped by Clinton was credible and, considering everything else about him, almost certainly true.

It's both amusing and sad to see people defending the character of the Clintons.

Broaddrick credible? Let’s see, she is not known to have said anything about it at the time and she went to a Clinton fundraiser a few weeks later. She signed a sworn statement indicating not only that “these allegations are untrue…” but that after her initial meeting with him “ I have had no further relations with him for the past (15) years.” According to her later version of events shortly after meeting him in Van Buren, AK she visited Little Rock contacted him and shortly thereafter was raped. AFAIK there is no evidence they even spoke to each other that day, let alone met, let alone had sex, let alone had unconsentual sex. Clinton was the Attorney General and probable next Governor. It’s kind of hard to believe he could gone into a hotel in downtown Little Rock unnoticed.

Edited March 31, 2012 by Len Colby

[Guest Robert Morrow]

Juanita Broaddick is extremely credible. Here is her letter to Hillary Clinton in year 2000:

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/Juanita.htm

Colby makes a key point. The Clintons got Juanita (a rape victim of Bill) and several other of Bill's girlfriends to sign false affidavits denying any type of relationship or experience with Bill Clinton. I'm sure they were sold this by saying this little piece of paper will keep the prying media out of your life.

I am not a lawyer, but I think that would be suborning perjury: that is if Juanita was actually raped by Bill Clinton and those other women were lying about their affairs in false affidavits.

Juanita told her girlfriend Norma Kelsey and her boyfriend in real time that she had been raped by Bill. Juanita at the time was married and having an affair with a man she later married.

Also, Clinton and Juanita were supposed to be meeting in the coffeeshop of the hotel and Clinton told her there is media down here so why don't we meet in your hotel room? (Who knows if there were indeed media at the hotel. Probably not.)

Juanita’s friend Norma Rogers-Kelsay found here in her hotel room after the rape by Clinton. Juanita says “I was sitting there crying and so upset at the time … I felt like the next person coming through the door [was coming] to get rid of [my] body. I absolutely could not believe what had happened to me.”

Kelsay told Fox news on 2/2/99 that Juanita “was hysterical – her lip was blue and bleeding and her hose was severely torn in the crotch area.” Kelsay says Juanita “told me they had intercourse against her will.” Kelsay told NBC News that Juanita was in “quite bad shape” and her “lips were swollen, at least double in size.”

Juanita has also said that Clinton raped her twice in thirty minutes. She was so shocked and stunned at what was going on. Bill Clinton has proven time and time again that he feels entitled to have sex with whatever woman he chooses.

13 years later in March, 1991, just before Bill announced for President, he pulled Juanita out of a health care conference and Bill’s first words were, “Can you ever forgive me? … That was the old me. I’m not the same now. I’m a new man.” [sellout, p. 131]

Juanita replied “You can just go to hell” and she walked away from Clinton. [sellout, p. 131] In 1998, when rape victim Juanita came public in 1998 she was 1) followed by a man in a car and 2) someone broke into her house and stole the tape to her answering machine and let all 3 of her cats out. [Limbacher, Hillary’s Scheme, p. 184] It was the well oiled, often used Clinton intimidation team.

In 1999 Capital Hill Blue did an extensive story on Bill Clinton and his history of sexual assault. It was titled: "Juanita isn't the only one: Bill Clinton's long history of sexual violence against women dates back some 30 years" by Daniel J. Harris and Teresa Hampton.

This article is MUST READ for anyone seeking to understand Bill Clinton:

http://www.albertpeia.com/oxfordassault.htm

It is where I first heard about Eileen Wellstone, a 19 year old student at Oxford who said Bill Clinton assaulted her after meeting her at a pub.

"In an interview with Capitol Hill Blue, the retired State Department employee said he believed the story Miss Wellstone, the young English woman who said Clinton raped her in 1969.

''There was no doubt in my mind that this young woman had suffered severe emotional trauma,'' he said. ''But we were under tremendous pressure to avoid the embarrassment of having a Rhodes Scholar charged with rape. I filed a report with my superiors and that was the last I heard of it.''

Miss Wellstone, who is now married and lives near London, confirmed the incident when contacted this week, but refused to discuss the matter further. She said she would not go public with further details of the attack. Afterwards, she changed her phone number and hired a barrister who warned a reporter to stay away from his client."

Edited March 31, 2012 by Robert Morrow

[Greg Burnham]

It's really par for the course with a capitalist system, but so many people are so

adamant about defending and protecting the methods of their own destruction

that I've been relatively selfish in my outlook. As long as my family is okay, I'm okay.

[emphasis added]

No offense, but, in my view, the phrase: "capitalist system" is a misnomer and unfairly,

if not inaccurately, creates a prejudice in the reader against Western (particularly US)

ideology. I am not speaking about the "evolved" Western "system" -- and if that is what

you were referencing, then I probably agree with you. But, I do not think that capitalism

necessarily must lead to corruption. The difficulty resides in the common man becoming

actively aware of and monitoring the "danger signs" against liberty.

IOW: Is it really true that citizens need to recognize threats to their liberty ESPECIALLY in

a capitalistic system? I think not.

However, citizens do need to recognize threats to their liberty in ANY system.

Some systems lend themselves to tyranny much more readily than does ours.

But, ours also needs to be scrutinized, daily.

I sympathize with your need to stay hopeful, Greg, but I think you're looking at the

situation through a, shall we say, typical Western lens. Most people in America have

a conceit that we've evolved light years since the Middle Ages or even the Roman,

Greek, and Egyptian civilizations. In actuality, 90+% of that evolution has been in

technology, not in civilization itself. No, we are still living in a feudal system (BTW,

I realize that "feudal" is an imprecise term), but one that appears much more highly

stylized than Europe of 500 years ago. To be fair, there is one big difference, and

that is we have greater (but not great) upward mobility.

Doubt me? Ask yourself how much economic and political power the bottom 75%

of the U.S. has. How easy is it really for the mean or median person to make it into

the top 5%? Possible? Yes (I lived that life). Likely? Not very (most of my classmates

did not follow me). Our system of education continues to churn out exactly what it

was designed to: worker bees with little context or training about either history or

thinking outside of the box. We mock China's creative inability without realizing that

our system isn't necessarily better but that their's might simply be worse.

Getting back on topic, the point is that the Establishment will do whatever it takes

to protect and grow their power. This isn't an evil intent but simple preservation;

it's the same attitude that the aristocracy had when trying to stifle the wave of

revolutions that occurred during the late 18th and early 19th centuries. Luckily,

the American Revolution was successful. However, after escaping the "tyranny"

of Britain, one can see that we eventually created an empire that was eerily similar

to Britain's. Ever ask yourself why that is?

Your observation that it could be worse is correct. Due to globalization, vassals

are no longer the people working the land, making horseshoes, or building our

castles (Cf. Freemasonry). Now, the peons are entire nations or at least most of

nations. You can see this easily if you study Central and South American history.

Their story is the plight of the former European peasant of 500 years ago--i.e.,

how to get ahead when the overall system relies upon your cheap/free labor.

Luckily, the U.S. is at the top of the food chain so our average quality of life is

better than most.

I can look at the sweep of history and believe that this is all normal or natural and

that people will rise up if it gets too bad. However, there are other things about this

system that bother me, specifically when it goes from passive aggressive domination

into active mode. The assassination of JFK is a perfect example of this type of action

and why I believe we should care about solving this crime and exposing the system.

I can condone monopolies and protectionist legislation far more than murder.

Fair enough, Tom. All points are well taken. Thanks for your very well reasoned reply.

-

Edited March 31, 2012 by Greg Burnham

[Guest Tom Scully]

This thread is the new home of all obviously OT posts moved today out of Glenn Viklund's thread at JFK Debate :

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=18942

(This was the opening post when I created this thread, but all the posts moved from Glenn's thread over in JFK Debate were less recent, so they displaced this post down here, into its correct chronological order.)

Edited March 31, 2012 by Tom Scully

[Ron Ecker]

You know Ron, I am really surprised you would put in that stuff about Henry Lee without placing his reply to it. Very unfair to him:

http://riverdeepbook.blogspot.com/2011/03/dr-henry-lees-email-to-la-times-phil.html

I mentioned it because I just discovered it in trying to find Lee's report on Foster with a web search. But I probably shouldn't have included it because I don't believe in killing the messenger on something, whether it's Henry Lee or Christopher Ruddy.

As per the final verdict on Foster's death, I saw a report by Lee on this in which he specifically went after a couple of points by Ruddy, namely the carpet fibers and the tracing of the handgun. He showed they were simply distorted beyond meaning.

It's been years since I researched the Foster case. I don't remember much about fibers and the handgun. Two things that have stuck in my mind are, one, an autopsy with no x-rays. Why wouldn't Lee address that? And two, the car keys that were not in Foster's pockets when they were searched at Fort Marcy Park, but which somehow turned up in his pocket after a visit to the morgue by White House personnel to "identify the body." If Lee has a magic car keys theory, I would like to hear it. I'll read Lee's report when I have the time, but I'll fall out of my chair if he even mentions car keys.

BTW, there were 35 people on Brown's plane. Someone killed him with 33 witnesses, knowing the plane would crash? Or like Weekend at Bernie's, they killed him before, and planted his body on the plane?

Or maybe he was still alive and then they killed him?

Maybe Free Republic will buy this stuff Ron.

He was apparently still alive and killed by someone on the ground. I'm quite sure that whoever had the power to arrange the crash had the power to have people be the first on the scene for anything that needed to be done.

Military pathologists found what they considered to be a bullet hole in the top of Brown's head, but in spite of that there was no autopsy. Why? As I recall, the White House demanded that the body be brought to the U.S. ASAP, the excuse used by the military officer who decided against an autopsy. IOW the Clinton administration stole the body just like JFK's body was stolen from Parkland. Except that JFK eventually got an "autopsy," while Ron Brown's body was promptly sent to molder in the grave.

Why do I "buy this stuff"? If military pathologists say they saw a bullet hole in the top of Brown's head, why don't you "buy it," particularly after an autopsy to settle the matter was avoided?

Do you "buy that stuff" about a big hole in the back of JFK's head? Why do you buy it?

Edited April 1, 2012 by Ron Ecker

[Guest Robert Morrow]

Those are some excellent web links, Jim.:

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=18751&view=findpost&p=249766

Yes, Perot's campaign was falling apart by mid July, 1993. So he probably had plenty of reasons to quit besides a death threat from George Herbert Walker Bush. Not that one had not been issued per Chip Tatum ...

I just called a friend of mine who is a Republican and very active in Texas grassroots politics. I said, what was your source that Ross Perot and Bill Clinton were coordinating during the 1992 campaign to beat Bush; that they were friends?

His answer: he heard it on talk radio with an interview with Arkansas State Trooper Larry Patterson. That jogged my memory.

You need to learn that truth and lies can be found all over the political spectrum. Larry Patterson is one of the great truth tellers in many things relating to the Clintons. This is yet another one. Trooper Larry Patterson would often spend 16 hours/day with Bill Clinton.

I have Larry Patterson's cassette tape "More than Sex: The Secrets of Bill and Hillary Clinton Revealed" on the Clintons and I have listened to it several times; I had just forgotten the part about Perot and Clinton being buddies during the 1992 campaign.

Here is the web link from a Newsmax article in 1999: http://archive.newsmax.com/articles/?a=1999/9/13/220611

"Ross Perot was a presidential candidate in 1992 and 1996. Patterson reveals that Bill Clinton and Ross Perot were friends and describes contact the two had before the 1992 campaign, as well as a series of phone calls between them during the 1992 campaign."

As far as the other allegations of Larry Patterson; they are probably all true including the Bobbie Ann Williams story - although I don't want to get into a debate on that one.

The point is- Perot and Clinton were coordinating in 1992.

Edited April 2, 2012 by Tom Scully
Added a link after first sentence in this post to preserve continuity because this post and 16 that follow it were moved from a thread in JFK Debate