RFK's Children Interviewed by Charlie Rose--Speak out on JFK assassination

[David Lifton]

Tonight (Thursday, 1/11/13) Charles Rose interviewed two of RFK's children--Robert Jr., and Rory, the film maker. Both said their father didn't believe the official version--and subscribed to a conspiracy. Of course, none of this is really new. But, because they are RFK's children, and because this (taping) event took place in Dallas, perhaps this will--in some way--serve to "open up" the planned 50th anniversary to a diversity of viewpoints. That would be a most welcome development.

However, also keep this in mind: on June 29, 1964, when Robert Kennedy (then, Attorney General) was on a visit to Poland, he made an extensive statement about the Warren Commission, whose report would be released on September 27, in which he expressed unequivocal support for the lone-gunman ("Oswald did it alone") scenario. The headline of that story, which ran on page 1 of the next day's New York Times (6/30/64), was:

Robert Kennedy Says Oswald

Acted on Own in Assassination

The lead on that story begins:

Cracow, Poland, June 29—

Attorney General Robert F. Kennedy said today that his brother had been assassinated by Lee H. Oswald, “a misfit,” who took out his resentment against society by killing the President of the United States.

Answering questions at a meeting of the City Council of Cracow, the Attorney General said that Oswald was “a professed Communist” but had not been motivated by Communist ideology when he shot the President last Nov. 22.

* * *

I am placing the full typed out copy of the text of that New York Times story-which I made directly from the New York Times microfilm (and which today can be accessed via the New York Times Article Archives) at the end of this post.

The bottom line: Robert Kennedy said one thing in public; but, if the account of RFK, Jr. and Rory Kennedy can be relied upon, something entirely different in private, and to his family. But also keep this in mind:

Rory Kennedy was born on December 12, 1968, just over six months after her father's death, so she would be basing anything she says today on what she has been told (e.g., by her mother, or cousins [e.g., John, Jr.] or perhaps read.)

Also note: it was her wedding, scheduled for July 17, 1999, to which John, Jr. was flying when he had the fatal crash. Rory Kennedy recently produced "Ethel," a documentary film about her 84 year old mother. The New York Times said (on 10/17/12) that it was "tone-deaf and maddeningly incomplete. Watching it is a little like reading a classified report redacted by Dick Cheney — so much material is blacked out that it’s almost impossible to follow." Nonetheless, I think it is reasonable to infer that whatever Rory Kennedy said her father believed about his brother's death came from "inside" the family.

As for Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., his situation (about what he knew, and when he knew it") is rather different. RFK, Jr. was 14 years old at the time of his father's death (his D.O.B. was 1/17/54). In his excellent biography on Bobby ("RFK: His Life", published in 2000), Evan Thomas has a short passage--relating to his interview with RFK, Jr., in which he states that Robert Kennedy, Jr. had the clear impression that his father knew of things that he couldn't yet share, with his son. Not surprising, since his son was only 14, and of course RFK had no idea that he'd be dead within a few months.

I also want to call everyone's attention to RFK's phrasing, in Poland (on 6/29/64) that Oswald was "a professed Communist". (Hmmm...)

Anyway, I am pasting in the entire text of the front page 6/30/64 New York Times account; also, the Yahoo news story (an AP dispatch) so everyone can read what both Roy Kennedy and Robert Kennedy, Jr. said on Charlie Rose just last night. Its interesting to compare these two accounts--of what their father said in Poland, on June 29, 1964 (within a day of the time that the definitive reconstruction was run by the Warren Commission, purportedly establishing the viability of the single bullet theory), with what he was telling his wife and which was passed on to the family.

DSL

NYT, 6/30/64, page 1

Robert Kennedy Says Oswald

Acted on Own in Assassination

By Arthur J. Olsen

Cracow, Poland, June 29—

Attorney General Robert F. Kennedy said today that his brother had been assassinated by Lee H. Oswald, “a misfit,” who took out his resentment against society by killing the President of the United States.

Answering questions at a meeting of the City Council of Cracow, the Attorney General said that Oswald was “a professed Communist” but had not been motivated by Communist ideology when he shot the President last Nov. 22.

It was in response to a hesitant question put by a Communist youth leader of Cracow, who attended the council’s meeting, that the Attorney General spoke about Oswald and the assassination.

First Discussion by [Robert] Kennedy

It was Mr. Kennedy’s first public discussion of the accused assassin, aides said.

[The Warren panel investigating President Kennedy’s assassination decided to ask the Federal Bureau of Investigation to look into the news-paper publication of the diary of Oswald, the Associated Press reported from Washington.]

The young Pole apologized for asking “a personal question” but he said Polish youth would like to hear “your version of the assassination.”

Mr. Kennedy responded with a lengthy discussion of the event. He began by saying that “there is no doubt” that Oswald was the killer.

The Attorney General briefly sketched Oswald’s life story, describing him as a man who had embraced Communism, and had gone to the Soviet Union but found no place for himself there. [DSL note: pretty good for someone who says he has not read the Warren Report, etc.]

“He was a professed Communist,* but the Communists, because of his attitude, would have nothing to do with him,” he said. “What he did he did on his own, and by himself.”

*((DSL Note: Why use the word “professed”?))

Discredits Plot Theories

Mr. Kennedy said that the assassination was not a racist plot, such as some persons had speculated.

“Ideology in my opinion did not motivate his act,” the President’s brother said. “It was the single act of one person protesting against society.”

A report on the assassination prepared by a Presidential commission headed by Earl Warren, Chief Justice of the United States, is expected to be published soon. It will be based on an exhaustive investigation into President Kennedy’s death.

The Attorney General is known to be fully acquainted with the findings of the Warren commission. It is presumed by persons close to him that the Commission’s report will reflect the views expressed by Mr. Kennedy today.

* * * * *

TEXT OF THE AP ARTICLE AT YAHOO NEWS - 1/12/2013

HEADLINE: RFK children speak about assassination in Dallas

http://news.yahoo.co...tion-dallas-...

RFK children speak about assassination in Dallas

By JAMIE STENGLE | Associated Press – 37 mins ago

1/12/13 1:10 AM

DALLAS (AP) — Robert F. Kennedy Jr. is convinced that a lone gunman wasn't solely responsible for the assassination of

his uncle, President John F. Kennedy, and said his father believed the Warren Commission report was a "shoddy piece of

craftsmanship."

Kennedy and his sister, Rory, spoke about their family Friday night while being interviewed in front of an audience by Charlie Rose at the Winspear Opera House in Dallas. The event comes as a year of observances begins for the 50th

anniversary of the president's death.

Their uncle was killed on Nov. 22, 1963, while riding in a motorcade through Dallas. Five years later, their father was assassinated in a Los Angeles hotel while celebrating his win in the California Democratic presidential primary.

Robert F. Kennedy Jr. said his father spent a year trying to come to grips with his brother's death, reading the work of

Greek philosophers, Catholic scholars, Henry David Thoreau, poets and others "trying to figure out kind of the existential implications of why a just God would allow injustice to happen of the magnitude he was seeing."

He said his father thought the Warren Commission, which concluded Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone in killing the

president, was a "shoddy piece of craftsmanship." He said that he, too, questioned the report.

"The evidence at this point I think is very, very convincing that it was not a lone gunman," he said, but he didn't say what he believed may have happened.

Rose asked if he believed his father, the U.S. attorney general at the time of his brother's death, felt "some sense of guilt because he thought there might have been a link between his very aggressive efforts against organized crime."

Kennedy replied: "I think that's true. He talked about that. He publicly supported the Warren Commission report but privately he was dismissive of it."

He said his father had investigators do research into the assassination and found that phone records of Oswald and nightclub owner Jack Ruby, who killed Oswald two days after the president's assassination, "were like an inventory" of mafia leaders the government had been investigating.

He said his father, later elected U.S. senator in New York, was "fairly convinced" that others were involved.

The attorney and well-known environmentalist also told the audience light-hearted stories Friday about memories of his uncle. As a young child with an interest in the environment, he said, he made an appointment with his uncle to speak with him in the Oval Office about pollution.

He'd even caught a salamander to present to the president, which unfortunately died before the meeting. "He kept saying to me, 'It doesn't look well,'" he recalled.

Rory Kennedy, a documentary filmmaker whose recent film "Ethel" looks at the life of her mother, also focused on the

happier memories. She said she and her siblings grew up in a culture where it was important to give back. "In all of the tragedy and challenge, when you try to make sense of it and understand it, it's very difficult to fully make sense of it," she said. "But I do feel that in everything that I've experienced that has been difficult and that has been hard and that has been loss, that I've gained something in it."

"We were kind of lucky because we lost our members of our family when they were involved in a great endeavor," her brother added. "And that endeavor is to make this country live up to her ideals."

Copyright 2013 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.

Edited January 12, 2013 by David Lifton

[Don Roberdeau]

Good Day David.... Thank You for providing this recent article, and, the 1964 articles for comparison/contrast.

Best Regards in Research

++++Don

Donald Roberdeau

United States Navy

U.S.S. John F. Kennedy, CV-67, plank walker

Sooner, or later, The Truth emerges Clearly

For your key considerations....

Homepage: President KENNEDY "Men of Courage" speech, and Assassination Evidence, Witnesses, Suspects + Outstanding Researchers Discoveries and Considerations....http://droberdeau.bl...ination_09.html

The Dealey Plaza Map Detailing 11-22-63 Victims precise locations, Witnesses, Films & Photos, Evidence, Suspected bullet trajectories, Important information & Considerations, in One Convenient Resource.... http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/3966/dppluschartsupdated1111.gif

(new info, 2012 updated map)

Visual Report: "The First Bullet Impact Into President Kennedy: while JFK was Still Hidden Under the'magic-limbed-ricochet-tree' ".... http://img504.images...k1102308ms8.gif

Visual Report: Reality versus C.A.D. : the Real World, versus, Garbage-In, Garbage-Out....http://img248.images...ealityvscad.gif

Discovery: "Very Close JFK Assassination Witness ROSEMARY WILLIS

Zapruder Film Documented 2nd Headsnap: West, Ultrafast, and

Directly Towards the Grassy Knoll"....

http://educationforu...?showtopic=2394

T ogether

E veryone

A chieves

M ore

For the United States:

http://www.dhs.gov/dhspublic/

Edited January 12, 2013 by Don Roberdeau

[Martin White]

Interesting post David. Thank you.

The idea that RFK did not privately support the Warren version is reinforced by comments made by Garrison to Mark Lane. Intriguing but the Garrison remarks are only hearsay.

[Don Jeffries]

Thanks so much for sharing this, David.

[William Kelly]

David, RFK,Jr. was 9 years old in 1963, not 14.

BK

JFKCountercoup2: RFK, Jr. "No lone gunman."

[Douglas Caddy]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2261263/JFK-assassination-Robert-Kennedy-speaks-death-uncle.html

[Martin White]

David, RFK,Jr. was 9 years old in 1963, not 14.

BK

JFKCountercoup2: RFK, Jr. "No lone gunman."

Bill,

David said that RFK Jr was 14 at the time of his father's death (68) not 63.

Martin

[William Kelly]

David, RFK,Jr. was 9 years old in 1963, not 14.

BK

JFKCountercoup2: RFK, Jr. "No lone gunman."

Bill,

David said that RFK Jr was 14 at the time of his father's death (68) not 63.

Martin

Thank you Martin, I stand corrected.

I met RFK, Jr. in 1980 when he stayed at my home while on the campaign trail and drove him and his late brother Michael to NYC.

He's a good friend and fishing partner of Dick Russell.

I think what he says is highly significant and could have major repercussions.

There's also two threads going on this topic, perhaps they should be merged?

BK

[David Lifton]

David, RFK,Jr. was 9 years old in 1963, not 14.

BK

JFKCountercoup2: RFK, Jr. "No lone gunman."

Bill:

He was 14 in June, 1968, at the time of his father's death--and that's the death to which I was referring. At issue: how old was RFK, Jr., when RFK was talking to him about his uncle Jack's assassination.

DSL

[Nathaniel Heidenheimer]

This article because it is both national and involves big name recognition must be used to recommend good books to new audiences. There is no other choice at this stage of censorship. See my sample of how to do this on my recent thread about how to use wide angle big recognition articles like this as "Surfboards." Everyone must mediate, or you are risking spiritual death.

[Douglas Caddy]

Now that Robert Jr., and Rory have publicly said that their father didn't believe the official version and subscribed to a conspiracy, don't their widely reported statements (highlighted tonight on ABC national news) make it more difficult and a potential source of embarassment for the City of Dallas not to recognize the legitimate role that should be played by prominent assassination conspiracy believers in marking the 50th anniversary of JFK's murder later this year?

Edited January 13, 2013 by Douglas Caddy

[David Lifton]

Now that Robert Jr., and Rory have publicly said that their father didn't believe the official version and subscribed to a conspiracy, don't their widely reported statements (highlighted tonight on ABC national news) make it more difficult and a potential source of embarassment for the City of Dallas not to recognize the legitimate role that should be played by prominent assassination conspiracy believers in marking the 50th anniversary of JFK's murder later this year?

I agree that the statements of Robert Kennedy, Jr. and Rory Kennedy perhaps will affect the Dallas plans for the 50th. But I want to add (to what I previously posted on this thread) about what their father, Attorney General Robert Kennedy, said in Poland--on 6/29/64, and which was a front page news story in the New York Times on June 30, 1964. So now let's add to that what Attorney General Robert Kennedy then said on September 27, 1964, the day the Warren Report was officially released. That statement was published in the next day's New York Times, and here is the headline, and the full text of that brief article:

Robert Kennedy Says

He Won't Read Report

Robert F. Kennedy, brother of the assassinated President, said yesterday he had been briefed on the Warren Commission report and was “completely satisfied.” But he added that he had “not read the report, nor do I intend to.”

Mr. Kennedy, the Democratic nominee for the senate from New York, issued the following statement:

“As I said in Poland last summer, I am convinced [Lee Harvey] Oswald was solely responsible for what happened and that he did not have any outside help or assistance. He was a malcontent who could not get along here or in the Soviet Union.”

I have not read the report, nor did I intend to . But I have been briefed on it and I am completely satisfied that the commission investigated every lead and examined every piece of evidence. The commission’s inquiry was thorough and conscientious.

Source: New York Times, 9/28/64, page 11, Column 7

And, of course, do not forget that in August, 1964, Robert Kennedy signed his name to a letter --addressed to Chief Justice Earl Warren--stating that he was sure that the Warren Commission was doing its best to find the truth, and that he had no evidence (and knew of no evidence) that would indicate a conspiracy.

These are all pretty serious statements--made by the U.S Attorney General, who was also the brother of the dead President--and cannot be glibly dismissed.

I agree that Robert Kennedy presented one face in public and --apparently--another in private.

It seems to me that some kind of deal was made--and that Robert Kennedy went along with it. Otherwise, this behavior is inexplicable. Also remember: Robert Kennedy wanted to be chosen by LBJ to be his Vice President, which LBJ rejected (around August 7) prior to the Democratic Convention in Atlantic City. So that could explain the 6/29/64 "Poland statement," but that would not account for the other data I have been citing.

Also note: The Naftali book ("One Hell of a Gamble") makes clear--based on data from Soviet files--that in late November, 1963, the duo of RFK and Jackie gave artist William Walton a message to carry to Khrushchev that there had been a major domestic conspiracy (but that the Kennedys would someday be back in power, and would continue the policies of detente, etc.) and yet were adopting an entirely different posture by June 29, 1963, in Poland; in August, in the exchange of letters with the Warren Commission, and on September 27, 1964.

One person who could probably shed significant light on all this--if not provide a complete answer--is RFK's widow, Ethel Kennedy, now in her mid 80's. But, whatever the reason, she (and others) have made the deliberate decision to carry "the secret" --whatever it is--to the grave.

Something else ought to be noted--something that is not common knowledge (at least insofar as I have been able to ascertain).

THE MEETING AT JUPITER ISLAND, FLORIDA - 11/28/63

Normally, Bobby and Ethel were with their family on Thanksgiving. But not in November, 1963. Instead, both Bobby and Ethel flew to Florida, and went to Jupiter Island, an off-shore enclave for certain wealthy individuals, and visited for hours with Kennedy's Secretary of the Treasury, Douglas Dillon, who had a home there.

As students of this case know, Dillon--as Treasury Secretary--was the (nominal) boss of Secret Service Chief James Rowley. Also noteworthy: Dillon (accompanied by his wife, Phyllis) was one of the half dozen or so Cabinet members who, on November 22, found themselves airborne (at the invitation of Sec State Dean Rusk) on a plane to Tokyo, for an "economic conference." If there was anyone who was a Kennedy loyalist--and who would know of any inside information concerning the Secret Service, and Dallas--it would be Douglas Dillon. Upon his return, he would no doubt have demanded, and been given, answers. And I have little doubt that Robert Kennedy--accompanied by his wife--went to see Dillon personally to have that kind of private conversation. "What do you know?. . what have you been told about what happened in Dallas?" Neither Robert Kennedy or Dillon have ever made any public statement about what was discussed, nor do I know of any written record. However, in 1965, Robert Kennedy made an appearance before the American Jewish Committee ("AJC") in New York, and I have a transcript of that appearance. In a nutshell, he spoke about the requirements for public service and singled out the White House Detail of the Secret Service as a group where an individual's political beliefs were relevant, and had to be looked at carefully, when considering employment, because of the sensitive nature of their duties. Of course, this may be just "common sense," but in the aftermath of Dallas, and in light of the unusual meeting of RFK, Ethel, and Dillon at Jupiter Island, on November 28, 1963, I have wondered.

But getting back to the main point, which is the Kennedy family public posture, and particularly that of Robert Kennedy, in the aftermath of his brother's death; and then those who "remained alive" after the assassination of Robert Kennedy in Los Angeles in June, 1968:

They have decided to treat the rest of the world--you, me, and everyone else--as if we are children, who cannot know some deep and dark truth. And so they have made decisions to hold back on information of which they have direct knowledge, and without which we cannot get a complete and accurate picture of our own history. In writing this, I have in mind most particularly Ethel Kennedy, but there are probably other Kennedy family members as well. Of course, I have no specifics, beyond what I have described.

So now we have hints of some darker reality being dropped by two Kennedy offspring--one of whom (Rory) wasn't even born at the time, and the other (RFK, Jr) who was only 14--and some in the JFK research community now think that the major media in this country are going to do some kind of turnaround based on that.

I find that whole position excessively optimistic, and in fact rather ridiculous.

Is Bill Keller of the New York Times really going to behave differently based on this sort of thing?

What I'd like to see is the New York Times (and other major media) approach someone like Ethel Kennedy with a request for a serious sit-down "tell all" account of just what it is that Robert Kennedy told her--between the day of his brother's assassination in Dallas, and the time of his death, in June, 1968--for its hard to believe he didn't tell her "everything"--whatever that was.

And again I remind anyone reading this: Robert and Ethel Kennedy almost certainly did not go to Jupiter Island, Florida, on November 28, 1963, simply to have Turkey with the Dillons (Phyllis and Doug Dillon, both of whom, by the way, were on that plane to Tokyo).

And, to change the focus slightly, I'd also like to remind everyone what the late Secret Service agent Robert A. Steuart, a Dallas Field Office agent who was stationed at the Trade Mart, said in 1993, both to Dallas writer Bill Sloan (and, somewhat indirectly, to JFK researcher Vince Palamara):

"I can't talk about it...There are so many things I could tell you, but I just can't... I can't tell you anything... I'd like to, but I can't.... It was a very heavy deal, and they would know. Someone would know. It's...too dangerous, even now."

Sound like something out of the Parallax View? Yes, it does. But that's what he said. And that was in 1993--some 20 years ago.

There are people who know (or "knew")--and have made the deliberate decision to "take it to the grave" (my quotes).

So we are left with the slim pickins of the hearsay of children, who are reading books written about Dallas, decades later, by various JFK authors.

That's a pretty sad commentary on this state of affairs.

DSL

1/13/13 4:15 AM PST

Edited January 13, 2013 by David Lifton

[Nathaniel Heidenheimer]

RFK 's plans for the immediate future 1964-68 have to be justice-posed with his plans for 68 and beyond.

He had to work within the confines of Johnson and the Democratic Party. Today we recognize that this was not possible for a party bent on becoming a second Republican Party which cooperates in using wedge issues to divide the non-rich. But this was earlier. RFK's position as a Democrat in 1964, was.. complex to say the least.

Edited January 13, 2013 by Nathaniel Heidenheimer

[Nathaniel Heidenheimer]

David Lifton writes:"and some in the JFK research community now think that the major media in this country are going to do some kind of turnaround based on that.

I find that whole position excessively optimistic, and in fact rather ridiculous."

I don't think that most people think the media will now become more open re the assassinations.

I think that nevertheless it is a very significant development in terms of its POTENTIAL to open up new eyes, IF WE USE IT AS A TOOL. We have to do the using. This is very different from entertaining ridiculous notions that this corrupt corporate media will become more open. Thanks for the Florida info. I was unaware of this. The 1965 speech is very interesting also.

[Guest Robert Morrow]

It is about time for the Kennedy family to take their heads out of the sand and the muzzles off their mouths about what the family *really* privately thought about the JFK assassination. And it was not the mafia who murdered JFK.

Author Gus Russo: In his oral history, Robert Kennedy bitterly recounted a remark that Johnson made to someone else after the assassination. “When I was young in Texas, I used to know a cross-eyed boy,” Johnson said. “His eyes were crossed, and so was his character… That was God’s retribution for people who were bad – and you should be careful of cross-eyed people because God put his mark on them … Sometimes I think that what happened to Kennedy may have been divine retribution.” JFK himself had slightly crossed eyes.

On June 3, 1968, Robert Kennedy said “I now fully realize that only the powers of the presidency will reveal the secrets of my brother’s death.” RFK was assassinated 3 days later on June 6, 1968 after winning the California Democratic primary.

Jackie Kennedy in her oral history: “Bobby told me this later, and I know Jack said it to me sometimes. He said, ‘Oh, God, can you imagine what would happen to the country if Lyndon was president?’” … “He didn’t like the idea that Lyndon would go on and be president because he was worried for the country. Bobby told me that he’d had some discussions with him. I forget exactly how they were planning or who they had in mind. It wasn’t Bobby, but somebody. Do something to name someone else in ’68″

JACKIE KENNEDY DID NOT LIKE OR TRUST LYNDON JOHNSON

One of JFK, Jr.’s best friends at the Phillips Academy was Meg Azzoni. In spring, 1977, she and John went to visit Jackie while Caroline was still at Harvard. Meg says: “Jackie told John and I at the ‘break-the-fast’ breakfast, ‘I did not like or trust Lyndon Johnson.’ No one said another word the whole meal in memorial contemplative silence.”