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Dead Secret Service Agent in Dallas?


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#1 Evan Marshall

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Posted 28 March 2007 - 08:35 PM

has anybody ever been able to track down the source for this?

having spent 20 yrs in LE it has always bothered me that such a claim was not verified before being published.

#2 Ken Rheberg

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Posted 28 March 2007 - 10:49 PM

The story of the dead Secret Service agent has never really been explained. It merely died an abrupt but quiet death.

The first mention of the agent's death on the CBS television network actually came from Eddie Barker, news director at CBS affiliate KRLD, who was at the Trade Mart. During his first report for CBS, around a half hour or so after full time CBS coverage began, Barker was fed the information by KRLD's Dick Wheeler, also at the Trade Mart.

Barker reports, ". . . the fact that that one of the Secret Service agents who was riding with the President was killed." He then asks for backup of this from Wheeler, and Wheeler says, "That is the report at this moment." Wheeler had just seconds before indicated that Kennedy's condition as critical was only an "unconfirmed report." Although the story of Kennedy's critical condition was circulating, Wheeler was careful to label it only as "unconfirmed." But not so with the Secret Service agent story.

Then after the "official" report of Kennedy's death by Eddie Barker (called "unconfirmed" by Walter Cronkite) and the quick followup "unconfirmed" announcement of the President's death by Dan Rather via either radio or phone report, Cronkite says, "A Secret Service man was also killed in the fusillade of shots that came apparently from a second story window." Again, this was not referred to as "unconfirmed" but as if it were fact.

More than two hours later, the Secret Service agent story was still alive. In his first televised report, Rather now refers to the agent's death as "unconfirmed," but at the same time he answers the question as to where the story originated from. Rather says, "There is some confusion as to whether a Secret Serviceman also was killed at the time of the shooting. There has been no official confirmation of any Secret Serviceman being killed although there are widespread reports, including one from the Dallas Police Department, that a Secret Serviceman was killed at the same time President Kennedy and Texas Governor John Connally were shot." And that was pretty much it. The story came to an end about that time. No explanation.

But according to Rather, there was more than one source for the story, and one of those was the Dallas PD.

Edited by Ken Rheberg, 28 March 2007 - 10:54 PM.


#3 Jim Feemster

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Posted 28 March 2007 - 11:03 PM

The story of the dead Secret Service agent has never really been explained. It merely died an abrupt but quiet death.

The first mention of the agent's death on the CBS television network actually came from Eddie Barker, news director at CBS affiliate KRLD, who was at the Trade Mart. During his first report for CBS, around a half hour or so after full time CBS coverage began, Barker was fed the information by KRLD's Dick Wheeler, also at the Trade Mart.

Barker reports, ". . . the fact that that one of the Secret Service agents who was riding with the President was killed." He then asks for backup of this from Wheeler, and Wheeler says, "That is the report at this moment." Wheeler had just seconds before indicated that Kennedy's condition as critical was only an "unconfirmed report." Although the story of Kennedy's critical condition was circulating, Wheeler was careful to label it only as "unconfirmed." But not so with the Secret Service agent story.

Then after the "official" report of Kennedy's death by Eddie Barker (called "unconfirmed" by Walter Cronkite) and the quick followup "unconfirmed" announcement of the President's death by Dan Rather via either radio or phone report, Cronkite says, "A Secret Service man was also killed in the fusillade of shots that came apparently from a second story window." Again, this was not referred to as "unconfirmed" but as if it were fact.

More than two hours later, the Secret Service agent story was still alive. In his first televised report, Rather now refers to the agent's death as "unconfirmed," but at the same time he answers the question as to where the story originated from. Rather says, "There is some confusion as to whether a Secret Serviceman also was killed at the time of the shooting. There has been no official confirmation of any Secret Serviceman being killed although there are widespread reports, including one from the Dallas Police Department, that a Secret Serviceman was killed at the same time President Kennedy and Texas Governor John Connally were shot." And that was pretty much it. The story came to an end about that time. No explanation.

But according to Rather, there was more than one source for the story, and one of those was the Dallas PD.



#4 Chuck Robbins

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Posted 29 March 2007 - 05:04 AM

There have been several attempts to explain away this report of a dead secret service agent.

There might have been something to the story.

When you put together the pool of blood reportedly found in the plaza, along with the reports of
people in Dealey Plaza reportedly carrying SS ID, you might arrive at the conclusion that someone
carrying SS ID was shot and killed in the plaza...could this have been the origin of this story?

Naturally, if this person was not a SS agent, the death would have to be suppressed in order to be
able to determine that there had been no conspiracy involved in the killing of JFK.

Sure, this is speculation, but is it unreasonable in light of those early reports?

#5 Don Jeffries

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Posted 29 March 2007 - 05:55 AM

Chuck,

I think it's quite possible that you are correct; the pool of blood and the dead secret service agent might very well be connected. Vince Palamara touched on the history of the reports about a secret service agent being shot in his excellent book "Survivor's Guilt." Imho, we should all pay a lot more attention to the actions (and inactions) of the Secret Service.

#6 Gil Jesus

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Posted 29 March 2007 - 01:58 PM

Chuck, I agree with you that the pool of blood and the dead agent are connected. Vince Palamara told me that he was never able to track down who that agent was.

I suggest that the agent wasn't an agent at all, but a military intelligence operative who was in Dealey Plaza that day. The were 8-12 MI people n the Plaza and according to their commander's testimony before the WC, they may have been carrying SS identification that day.

Another interesting tidbit comes from Bethesda, where according to David Lifton and Harry Livingstone, the body of an "Army or Air Force Major" showed up for autopsy on the evening of the 22nd. The medical people at Bethesda told these authors that they were ordered NOT to log in the body of the Major, a highly unusual departure from normal procedure.

It is hard to imagine a motive, other than one sinister, for not following procedure in regards to this body.

It is again, my opinion, that this body was "used" as a substitute for Kennedys, in as much as the vital statistics (weight of the brain, etc.) was concerned.

It is also my opinion, that this Major could likely be the misidentified "dead secret service agent" that vanished into history.

#7 Steve Thomas

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Posted 29 March 2007 - 03:52 PM

Gil,

It is also my opinion, that this Major could likely be the misidentified "dead secret service agent" that vanished into history.


I do not know if these are related, but...

In a statement written by Parkland Hospital RN Triage nurse, Bertha Lozano, she wrote that on Friday afternoon after the President had arrived and after the little boy with the cut chin had arrived, "A technician came to the desk and asked me to expect a private patient who was bleeding." She also wrote, "Blood technicians came to ask me who "Mr. X" was who did not have an ER number. Hematology also came with the same problem and was told the same thing."

No information about what the Blood Technicians and Hematology were told.

Price Exhibit 20 in 21H214
http://www.maryferre...p;relPageId=238

Steve Thomas

#8 Evan Marshall

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Posted 29 March 2007 - 03:55 PM

Chuck, I agree with you that the pool of blood and the dead agent are connected. Vince Palamara told me that he was never able to track down who that agent was.

I suggest that the agent wasn't an agent at all, but a military intelligence operative who was in Dealey Plaza that day. The were 8-12 MI people n the Plaza and according to their commander's testimony before the WC, they may have been carrying SS identification that day.

Another interesting tidbit comes from Bethesda, where according to David Lifton and Harry Livingstone, the body of an "Army or Air Force Major" showed up for autopsy on the evening of the 22nd. The medical people at Bethesda told these authors that they were ordered NOT to log in the body of the Major, a highly unusual departure from normal procedure.

It is hard to imagine a motive, other than one sinister, for not following procedure in regards to this body.

It is again, my opinion, that this body was "used" as a substitute for Kennedys, in as much as the vital statistics (weight of the brain, etc.) was concerned.

It is also my opinion, that this Major could likely be the misidentified "dead secret service agent" that vanished into history.


getting the SS agents drunk the night before would have been a great aid in succeeding with the shooting-moving them off the limo was probably the final thing "needed" from the SS.

while I agree there were two caskets at BNH, I find Lifton&Livingstone tend to create more problems than they solve.

the fact that the conspiracy had its mis-steps is not surprising. I'm convinced LHO was supposed to be killed in his rooming house or shortly thereafter by the "cops" who stopped by-the backup was probably Tippit and then the Texas Theatre and, of course, finally Ruby. I think Oswald could have proven his innocence and ID'd his handlers and contacts.

anyway, I love a good mystery and this one is a peach

#9 Paul Rigby

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Posted 29 March 2007 - 09:45 PM

getting the SS agents drunk the night before would have been a great aid in succeeding with the shooting...


Or merely provide a semblance of an alibi for their failure to protect.

As for the rumour of an SS death, surely we're are merely looking at tactical sykewar - a planned fabrication designed for deployment on the "battlefield" to cover/explain the removal of the presidential corpse from Dallas? No great mystery.

Paul

#10 J. Raymond Carroll

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Posted 01 April 2007 - 03:57 PM

The story of the dead Secret Service agent has never really been explained. It merely died an abrupt but quiet death.

In his first televised report, Rather now refers to the agent's death as "unconfirmed..... there are widespread reports, including one from the Dallas Police Department, that a Secret Serviceman was killed at the same time President Kennedy and Texas Governor John Connally were shot."

But according to Rather, there was more than one source for the story, and one of those was the Dallas PD.


Ken: Thank you for this info. Can you advise where can one find a transcript of what CBS broadcast that weekend? Is there anything comparable to the NBC log that was published in book form?

#11 Ron Ecker

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Posted 01 April 2007 - 06:31 PM

The were 8-12 MI people n the Plaza and according to their commander's testimony before the WC, they may have been carrying SS identification that day.


James Powell from the same MI unit testified that there were no others there from his unit that day. The "commander," Colonel Robert Jones, also testified (to the HSCA, not the WC) that Powell was on duty (Powell testified that he was off duty), and testified falsely about his own duty position (he was not the unit's operations officer as he claimed). Jones is also the one who called the FBI shortly after Oswald's arrest with information on Oswald from an Army intelligence file. When the HSCA requested this file from the DOD, it was told the file had been routinely destroyed.

#12 Mark Valenti

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Posted 01 April 2007 - 06:38 PM

James Powell from the same MI unit testified that there were no others there from his unit that day. The "commander," Colonel Robert Jones, also testified (to the HSCA, not the WC) that Powell was on duty (Powell testified that he was off duty), and testified falsely about his own duty position (he was not the unit's operations officer as he claimed). Jones is also the one who called the FBI shortly after Oswald's arrest with information on Oswald from an Army intelligence file. When the HSCA requested this file from the DOD, it was told the file had been routinely destroyed.


I think I remember that Jones told the FBI that he had successfully cross-referenced Oswald's name with that of Alek Hidell in his files.

#13 Myra Bronstein

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Posted 01 April 2007 - 07:01 PM

There have been several attempts to explain away this report of a dead secret service agent.

There might have been something to the story.

When you put together the pool of blood reportedly found in the plaza, along with the reports of
people in Dealey Plaza reportedly carrying SS ID, you might arrive at the conclusion that someone
carrying SS ID was shot and killed in the plaza...could this have been the origin of this story?

Naturally, if this person was not a SS agent, the death would have to be suppressed in order to be
able to determine that there had been no conspiracy involved in the killing of JFK.

Sure, this is speculation, but is it unreasonable in light of those early reports?


Possibility 1 = Non SS agent with SS "shoes" shot dead and story suppressed. (As Chuck suggested.)
Possibility 2 = CIA Penetration Agent (infiltrating for life) within SS shot dead and story suppressed.
Possibility 3 = Real SS agent (whether in on the plot or not) shot dead with telltale high blood alcohol level and/or drugs in his system and story suppressed.

#14 Ken Rheberg

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Posted 02 April 2007 - 10:51 AM

The story of the dead Secret Service agent has never really been explained. It merely died an abrupt but quiet death.

In his first televised report, Rather now refers to the agent's death as "unconfirmed..... there are widespread reports, including one from the Dallas Police Department, that a Secret Serviceman was killed at the same time President Kennedy and Texas Governor John Connally were shot."

But according to Rather, there was more than one source for the story, and one of those was the Dallas PD.


Ken: Thank you for this info. Can you advise where can one find a transcript of what CBS broadcast that weekend? Is there anything comparable to the NBC log that was published in book form?


Raymond,

Glad to help. I appreciate your response which gave some life to this slowly dying but important thread. Interesting how it all started. A man with 20 years in law enforcement was looking for the source of the "dead Secret Service agent" story. The answer was given to him: per CBS News, the only known source for the story was a law enforcement agency. The Dallas PD. At that point, the law enforcement thread-starter clammed up. Not one word of acknowledgement that he now had his answer. Will we ever hear from him on this? Why no response? What does he plan on doing with this information? The Dallas PD involvement in generating the story is something apparently no one has ever researched. Our thread-starter would be ideal for following up on it.

The NBC log book you refer to is, I believe, not comprehensive. Just selected reports and discussions throughout their coverage. There is no book from CBS in any form, comprehensive or otherwise. I doubt that you'd be able to get the transcripts from CBS. However, there are a few locations around the country that have copies. One such location is the University of California, San Diego. The transcripts there are on microfiche. Another location is The Center for American History at the University of Texas at Austin (The Scheffler Papers). The official title for 11/22/63 is "The Assassination of President John F. Kennedy as broadcast over the CBS Television Network Friday, November 22, 1963." This 267 page transcript is a must for all researchers. Good luck.

Ken

Edited by Ken Rheberg, 02 April 2007 - 11:04 AM.


#15 Stephen Turner

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Posted 02 April 2007 - 12:50 PM

There have been several attempts to explain away this report of a dead secret service agent.

There might have been something to the story.

When you put together the pool of blood reportedly found in the plaza, along with the reports of
people in Dealey Plaza reportedly carrying SS ID, you might arrive at the conclusion that someone
carrying SS ID was shot and killed in the plaza...could this have been the origin of this story?

Naturally, if this person was not a SS agent, the death would have to be suppressed in order to be
able to determine that there had been no conspiracy involved in the killing of JFK.

Sure, this is speculation, but is it unreasonable in light of those early reports?


Possibility 1 = Non SS agent with SS "shoes" shot dead and story suppressed. (As Chuck suggested.)
Possibility 2 = CIA Penetration Agent (infiltrating for life) within SS shot dead and story suppressed.
Possibility 3 = Real SS agent (whether in on the plot or not) shot dead with telltale high blood alcohol level and/or drugs in his system and story suppressed.


Edited by Stephen Turner, 02 April 2007 - 12:54 PM.
I have just noticed I am re-making Chucks point about need for suppression. Sorry Folks.





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