QUOTE (David Guyatt @ Sep 30 2007, 05:08 PM)

QUOTE (Terry Mauro @ Sep 30 2007, 04:39 PM)

I wasn't aware of this fact at the time, but I vividly recall my father always castigating the French for not having paid the U.S. back for the war debts they incurred and owed to us from WWI and WWII.
Terry,
I think it likely that things were more complex to this than most imagine.
There was much animosity between the US and France dating back from the way De Gaulle was treated by Churchill and Roosevelt. You might recall that France left NATO and threw it out of Paris. De Gaulle also suspected (or wanted to suspect) that the US was behind attempts to assassinate him. So, I expect there was more to the French demand to have their dollars converted to gold than met the eye at the time.
On the US delayed decision to participate in WWII, there has also been quite a bit of conjecture and high feelings. On the one hand there was a large volume of pro-Hitler sentiment at the corporate level. Hitler was financed by America and had powerful allies in Britain and France also. On the other hand, US interests were served by entering the war only after Europe and Britain had been sufficiently pummelled by the Nazis that the US would emerge as the dominate world power by a long shot.
The still secret War and Pace Study project by the Council on Foreign Relations that commenced in 1939 (what is known about it anyway) clearly spells out America's national interest to be gained from the war.
From:
http://shwi.alternatehistory.com/American%...Geopolitics.txt.
Quote:
AMERICA'S MINIMUM LEBENSRAUM- THE GRAND AREA
The extensive studies and discussions of the Council group determined that, as a minimum , most of the non-German world, as a new American 'Grand Area', was needed for elbow room.' In its final form, it consisted of the Western Hemisphere, the United Kingdom, the remainder of the British Commonwealth and Empire, the Dutch East Indies, China and Japan itself.(50) Noam Chomsky summarizes the concept of American Lebensraum:
"The Grand Area was to include the Western Hemisphere, Western Europe, the Far East, the former British Empire (which was being dismantled), the incomparable energy resources of the Middle East (which were then passing into American hands as we pushed out our rivals France and Britain), the rest of the Third World and, if possible, the entire globe."(51) The whole China was also included.
Unquote
David
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From: http://shwi.alternatehistory.com/American%...Geopolitics.txt.
"It was John O'Sullivan who in 1845 formulated the concept of American Lebensraum - the Manifest Destiny Doctrine. He coined the term to signify the mission of the United States "to overspread the continent allotted by Providence for the free development of our yearly multiplying millions."(1)
For Josiah Strong, the American missionary imperialist par excellence, the Manifest Destiny had geopolitical destination-the creation of a world empire. The Americas would be the greatest of all empires. "Other nations would bring their offerings to the cradle of the young empire of the West, as they had once taken their gifts to the cradle of Jesus."(2) Since the destiny and its destination were preordained by God, Americans possessed supreme title to space, preempting and superseding the right of others. Combined with the Monroe Doctrine, the theological rationale of the Manifest Destiny Doctrine provided an almost evangelical explanation of the geopolitical manifest design to conquer and subjugate space, first the whole Western Hemisphere and then, beginning with the war against Spain in 1898, the whole world. As Carl Schmitt has pointed out, in 1898 USA embarked on a war against Spain and latter against the world which has not ended yet. In this context the American war against Yugoslavia is only a continuation of the one hundred years war which the United States began in 1898.
In the history of the United States the expansionist impulse has been as powerful as religion. The continuity of American expansionist war aims since the time of the Manifest Destiny Doctrine has been the most predominant feature of American foreign policy in which the three components of American expansionist Weltanschauung confluence: The Manifest Destiny Doctrine - the theological component - conquest preordained by God and Providence to carry the will of the Almighty, and subsequently, conquest to establish democracy or in the interests of democracy or mankind, The Monroe Doctrine - the geopolitical component and the Open Door Doctrine - the economical component.
It was at the end of the last century that the intellectual foundations of the American geopolitical doctrine were formulated by Frederick Jackson Turner, Brooks Adams, Admiral Mahan, and its implementation begun by Theodore Roosevelt and subsequently Woodrow Wilson. The geopolitical concepts advanced by Frederick Jackson Turner, Brooks Adams and Admiral Mahan "became a world view, an expansionist Weltanschauung for subsequent generation of Americans and ... important to understand America's imperial expansion in the twentieth century," writes the noted American historian William Williams. The policies of American Lebensraum, called "Open-Door" imperialism, and the enlargement of the American empire through expansion of the perimeter of the Monroe Doctrine, is the explanation of America's foreign policy during this century, including the present policies of NATO expansion, assertion of American preponderance of power over the whole Eurasia and the war against Yugoslavia.
The architects of the American Lebensraum provided also the rationale for NATO. NATO as a geopolitical construct is firmly anchored in the "Frontier thesis" of the American expansionist foreign policy, appearing as a function and instrument of the Atlantic Grossraum, as envisioned by Turner, Adams and Mahan. Or as Senator Tom Connally stated: "the Atlantic Pact is the logical extension of the Monroe Doctrine." The creation of the NATO signified the extension of the Monroe doctrine to Europe - Europe would become for the United States another Latin America, points out the American historian Stephen Amrose. (3)"Thank you for providing that link, David.
I must tell you that I have, since first learning of the concept of Manifest Destiny in Elementary School, abhorred the very basis upon which it was formulated. For one thing, the twisted issues involving the methods of teaching it to school children. I would never have connected The Monroe Doctrine, which I was taught was aka, The Policy of Isolationism, which would have seemed antithesis to the expansion policy of Manifest Destiny in my little pea-brain of mind. At least, that's the way it had been explained to me, as a child. Why would the robber barons be hellbent on expanding and taking over every square foot of real estate they could get their hands on, if their ultimate goal would be to isolate themselves from the rest of the world?
Also, the treatment of the people who were already established in their own civilizations here in the Western Hemisphere, why were they not considered as human beings, and treated as viable traders, merchants, and commerce entities, in and of themselves? Which has always left me with a disconcerting question as to who gave these European moneyed venture capitalists the "divine" right to ride roughshod over those who were already established on this continent and in this hemisphere?
It is cited that this continent was "pre-ordained by God and Providence..." according to whom? Some bible thumping religious fanaticism which deemed it the right to automatically subjugate and plunder property, preempting and superseding the rights of others? Can you see how sanctimonious and utterly detestable this all comes across as?
You may counter that it was the sign of the times, or that this was the way the world was perceived from an 18th Century P.O.V. But, that doesn't make it morally sound. We have quite a few large, indelible stains on this tapestry known as The United States of America and its Manifest Destiny Doctrine[s]. I certainly need not use this post to point them out, without risk of appearing rhetorically redundant on the subject.
There were only three instances in the historical record that I can recall where I ever felt even a modicum of national pride in the United States, as a country. It was during Abraham Lincoln's term of office and what he stood for with the Emancipation Proclamation, his Gettysburg Address, and the Fourteenth Amendment, the United State's involvement in WWII, with the defeat of Axis powers, and during John F. Kennedy's administration and his attempts to make good the rights of all men, equal before the law, the New Frontier, Peace Corp, and his foreign policy in bridging the chasm between Communism and Capitalism.
Other than those three, I cannot think of anything glowing and illustrious to say about carbon monoxide-emitting combustible engines, petroleum energy resources, strip-mining for coal and other minerals, clear-cutting of rain forests, and other ecological abuses perpetrated against the earth and its people by global industrial and manufacturing power-based cabals.
It's a distinct possibility that man has finally burned out his welcome here on this planet. The race has certainly shown no signs of slowing down it's sense of propagation, nor its insatiable consumption. In the end, we will eventually get what we deserve, and end up reaping what we've sown.
Thanks for enlightening me, which has served to reinforce my prior disgust and contempt for these bombastic, preferential-seeking, supreme opportunists, attempting to disguise their chicanery, and the malcontented rationale they used to justify their irresponsible abuse of power and annexation of other's personal property, in the name of God and Providence, no less.