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Tim Carroll
PAINTING CASTRO RED
John Simkin
QUOTE (Tim Carroll @ Dec 18 2004, 07:47 AM)
PAINTING CASTRO RED

During the late 1950s the world began to read and hear about a charismatic Cuban revolutionary operating out of the Sierra Maestra mountains. Fidel Castro was an ardent nationalist who had already spent years in one of Batista's prisons for leading an ill-conceived attack on an army installation, the Moncada Barracks, in one of Cuba's eastern provinces. Although sentenced to a fifteen-year term, he had been released after only two years in a general amnesty issued by the Cuban dictator as a sign of his good will and tolerance. Undaunted, Castro had immediately begun planning his next moves. From his mountain hideout, he began to give a series of interviews to American reporters designed to create a romantic and noble image of himself and his band of followers.

Herbert L. Matthews of The New York Times was perhaps the best known of these, although among the others was the famous television personality, Ed Sullivan, whose weekly variety show was characterized more by acts such as "dancing bears, ventriloquists, and magicians," rather than serious interviews with political figures.[1] But even this was perhaps appropriate to the circus atmosphere of personal promotion generated by the public relations-savvy Castro. While meeting with Matthews, Castro arranged for his men to make a jungle clearing look like a busy command post by having them wander through in twos and threes, then change into different clothing and walk by again. This carefully orchestrated skit led Matthews to believe that Castro had hundreds, perhaps thousands, of guerrilla followers.
*


Earl T. Smith, the man Dwight Eisenhower appointed as Ambassador Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary to Cuba in 1957 had a lot to say about this. (1)

Smith gave evidence to the Senate Committee on the Judiciary on 27th August, 1960 on Castro and the CIA. (2)

F. W. Sourwine: Mr. Smith, when you were appointed Ambassador to Cuba, were you briefed on the job?

Earl E. Smith: Yes; I was.

F. W. Sourwine: Who gave you this briefing?

Earl E. Smith: I spent 6 weeks in Washington, approximately 4 days of each week, visiting various agencies and being briefed by the State, Department and those whom the State Department designated.

F. W. Sourwine: Any particular individual or individuals who, had a primary part in this briefing?

Earl E. Smith: The answer is, in the period of 6 weeks I was briefed by numbers of people in the usual course as every Ambassador is briefed.

F. W. Sourwine: Is it true, sir, that you were instructed to get a briefing on your new job as Ambassador to Cuba from Herbert Matthews of the New York Times?

Earl E. Smith: Yes; that is correct.

F. W. Sourwine: Who gave you these instructions?

Earl E. Smith: William Wieland, Director of the Caribbean Division and Mexico. At that time he was Director of the Caribbean Division, Central American Affairs.

F. W. Sourwine: Did you, sir, in fact see Matthews?

Earl E. Smith: Yes; I did.

F. W. Sourwine: And did he brief you on the Cuban situation?

Earl E. Smith: Yes; he did.

F. W. Sourwine: Could you give us the highlights of what he told you?...

Earl E. Smith: We talked for 2 1/2 hours on the Cuban situation, a complete review o£ his feelings regarding Cuba, Batista, Castro, the situation in Cuba, and what he thought would happen.

F. W. Sourwine: What did he think would happen?

Earl E. Smith: He did not believe that the Batista government could last, and that the fall of the Batista government would come relatively soon.

F. W. Sourwine: Specifically what did he say about Castro?

Earl E. Smith: In February 1957 Herbert L. Matthews wrote three articles on Fidel Castro, which appeared on the front page of the New York Times, in which he eulogized Fidel Castro and portrayed him as a political Robin Hood, and I would say that he repeated those views to me in our conversation....

F. W. Sourwine: What did Mr. Matthews tell you about Batista?

Earl E. Smith: Mr. Matthews had a very poor view of Batista, considered him a rightist ruthless dictator whom he believed to be corrupt. Mr. Matthews informed me that he had very knowledgeable views of Cuba and Latin American nations, and had seen the same things take place in Spain. He believed that it would be in the best interest of Cuba and the best interest of the world in general when Batista was removed from office.

F. W. Sourwine: It was true that Batista's government was corrupt, wasn't it?

Earl E. Smith: It is true that Batista's government was corrupt. Batista was the power behind the Government in Cuba off and on for 25 years. The year 1957 was the best economic year that Cuba had ever had.

However, the Batista regime was disintegrating from within. It was becoming more corrupt, and as a result, was losing strength. The Castro forces themselves never won a military victory. The best military victory they ever won was through capturing Cuban guardhouses and military skirmishes, but they never actually won a military victory.

The Batista government was overthrown because of the corruption, disintegration from within, and because of the United States and the various agencies of the United States who directly and indirectly aided the overthrow of the Batista government and brought into power Fidel Castro.

F. W. Sourwine: What were those, agencies, Mr. Smith?

Earl E. Smith: The US Government agencies-may I say something off the record?

(Discussion off the record.)

F. W. Sourwine: Mr. Smith, the pending question before you read your statement was: What agencies of the US Government had a hand in bringing pressure to overthrow the Batista government, and how did they do it?

Earl E. Smith: Well, the agencies, certain influential people, influential sources in the State Department, lower down echelons in the CIA. I would say representatives of the majority of the US Government agencies which have anything to do with the Embassy...

F. W. Sourwine: Mr. Smith, when you talked with Matthews to get the briefing before you went to Cuba, was he introduced to you as having any authority from the State Department or as being connected with the State Department in any way?

Earl E. Smith: Let me go back. You asked me a short while ago who arranged the meeting with Mr. Matthews.

F. W. Sourwine: And you said Mr. Wieland.

Earl E. Smith: I said Wilham Wieland, but Wilham Wieland also had to have the approval of Roy Rubottom, who was then Assistant Secretary of State for Latin American Affairs. Now, to go back to this question, as I understood it, you said - would you mind repeating that again?

F. W. Sourwine: I asked if, when you were, sent to Mr. Matthews for this briefing, he was introduced to you as having any official connection with the State Department or any authority from the Department?

Earl E. Smith: Oh, no. I knew who he was, and they obviously knew I knew who he was, but I believe, that they thought it would be a good idea for me to get the viewpoint of Herbert Matthews, and also I think that Herbert Matthews is the leading Latin American editorial writer for the New York Times. Obviously the State Department would like to have the support of the New York Times...

James Eastland: Mr. Smith, we have had hearings, a great many, in Miami, with prominent Cubans, and there is a thread that runs through the whole thing that people connected with some Government agency went to Cuba and called on the chiefs of the armed forces and told them that we would not recognize the government of the President-elect, and that we would not back him, and that because of that the chiefs of the armed forces told Batista to leave the country, and they set up a government in which they attempted to make a deal with Castro. That is accurate, isn't it, Tom?

Thomas Dodd: I would say so, yes...

James Eastland: Let me ask you this question. As a matter of fact, isn't it your judgment that the State Department of the United States is primarily responsible for bringing Castro to power in Cuba?

Earl E. Smith: No, sir, I can't say that the State Department in itself is primarily responsible. The State Department played a large part in bringing Castro to power. The press, other Government agencies, Members of Congress are responsible...

James Eastland: You had been warning the State Department that Castro was a Marxist?

Earl E. Smith: Yes, sir.

James Eastland: And that Batista's government was a friendly government. That is what had been your advice as to the State Department?

Earl E. Smith: Let me answer that this way, which will make it very clear. When I went to Cuba, I left here with the definite feeling according to my briefings which I had received, that the U.S. Government was too close to the Batista regime, and that we were being accused of intervening in the affairs of Cuba by trying to perpetuate the Batista dictatorship.

After I had been in Cuba for approximately 2 months, and had made a study of Fidel Castro and the revolutionaries, it was perfectly obvious to me as it would be to any other reasonable man that Castro was not the answer; that if Castro came to power, it would not be in the best interests of Cuba or in the best interests of the United States....

In my own Embassy there were certain ones of influence who were pro-26th of July, pro-Castro, and anti-Batista.

James Eastland: Who were they?

Earl E. Smith: Do I have to answer that question, Senator?

James Eastland: Yes, I think you have to. We are not going into it unnecessarily.

Earl E. Smith: I don't want to harm anybody. That is the reason I asked.

I would say the Chief of the Political Section, John Topping, and the Chief of the CIA Section. It was revealed that the No. 2 CIA rnan in the embassy had given unwarranted and undue encouragement to the revolutionaries. This came out in tke trials of naval officers after the Cienfuegos revolution of September I957...

James Eastland: He (Batista) didn't have to leave. He had not been defeated by armed force.

Earl E. Smith: Let me put it to you this way: that there are a lot of reasons for Batista's moving out. Batista had been in control off and on for 25 years. His government was disintegrating, at the end due to corruption, due to the fact that he had been in power too long. Police brutality was getting worse.

On the other hand there were three forces that kept Batista in power. He had the support of the armed forces, he had support of the labor leaders. Cuba enjoyed a good economy.

Nineteen hundred and fifty-seven was one of the best years in the economic history of Cuba. The fact that the United States was no longer supporting Batista had a devastating psychological effect, upon the armed forces and upon the leaders of the labor movement. This went a long way toward bringing about his downfall.

On the other hand, our actions in the United States were responsible for the rise to power of Castro. Until certain portions of the American press began to write derogatory articles against the Batista government, the Castro revolution never got off first base.

Batista made the mistake of overemphasizing the importance of Prio, who was residing in Florida, and underestimating the importance of Castro. Prio was operating out of the United States, out of Florida, supplying the revolutionaries with arms, ammunition, bodies and money.

Batista told me that when Prio left Cuba, Prio and Alameia (Aleman) took $140 million out of Cuba. If we cut that estimate in half, they may have shared $70 million. It is believed that Prio spent a great many millions of dollars in the United States assisting the revolutionaries. This was done right from our shores....

F. W. Sourwine: Is there any doubt in your mind that the Cuban Government, under Castro, is a Communist government?

Earl E. Smith: Now?

F. W. Sourwine: Yes.

Earl E. Smith: I would go further. I believe it is becoming a satellite.

The logical thing for the Russians to do would be to move into Cuba which they had already done, and to take over, which they would do by a mutual security pact.

Then, when the United States objects, all they have to say is:

"We will get out of Cuba when you get out of Turkey."

Thomas Dodd: You are not suggesting-

Earl E. Smith: That is a speech I made in February.

Thomas Dodd: Yes, but you are not suggesting that the Communists will cease and desist from their activities in Cuba and Central and South America, or anywhere else, if we get out of these other places?

Earl E. Smith: Out of Turkey?

Thomas Dodd: Yes.

Earl E. Smith: It would mean a great deal to them if we got out of Turkey. I am no expert on Turkey.

Thomas Dodd: You do not have to be an expert on Turkey, but you ought to be a little bit of an expert on the Communists to know this would not follow at all.

Every time we have retreated from one place, they have moved into new areas.

Earl E. Smith: Senator, I did not say what they would do.

Thomas Dodd: I know, but...

Earl E. Smith: That they would move into Cuba to retaliate with us.


Smith went on to issue a statement to the Senate Committee:

First let me say that to date I have made no public statement regarding my experiences in Cuba because I did not feel that, as a former Ambassador, it was my function to say anything which might be interpreted as critical of the administration which I had served. I have only the greatest respect and admiration for President Eisenhower, whose integrity is beyond question.

However, the establishment of a Communist regime in Cuba involves the defense and safety of this country and as you asked me to testify before you, I do so, recognizing that the welfare of the United States must transcend personal desires and reticence.

From personal experience I have learned that many very influential sources in the United States are dedicated to the overthrow of all dictatorships. They are as opposed to anti-Communist rightest dictators, who are friendly to the United States, as to the Communist dictators whom they regard as progressive. They adopt a doctrinaire attitude toward this question which is so impractical that they ultimately unwittingly defeat themselves. If dictatorship versus democracy were the only question that faced us, it would not be difficult to make a decision. However, as we are in the midst of a struggle for survival, other considerations are pertinent.

If the policy of the United States is to bring about the overthrow of dictators in the hope that democracy will follow, then I believe that the United States must be prepared to take whatever steps are necessary to preserve law and order and relevant chaos during that interim period of transition. If free and open elections are to be held, when a dictator is overthrown, a provisional government must be formed and such government needs outside support to maintain law and order. To do otherwise leaves a vacuum for the Communists to gain control. Such a vacuum did not occur in Cuba while I was the U.S. Ambassador there. Instead, a group was ready to seize power - a Communist group.

If we are to intervene sufficiently to bring about the overthrow of dictatorships, then we should intervene to whatever extent is required to fulfill our purpose. Otherwise, in my opinion, we must wait for the normal self-development of a people and not assist revolution. And we must be prepared to receive the criticism of supporting friendly governments recognized by the United States, although they have been labeled dictatorships. To make my point more clear, let me say that, we helped to overthrow the Batista dictatorship which was pro-American only to install the Castro dictatorship which is pro-Russian.


Smith's wife was Florence Pritchett. (3) Florence was John Kennedy's long time girlfriend (1944-1963). FBI files reveal that JFK made more than a dozen visits to Cuba in order to meet Florence. She also met Kennedy in Miami and Palm Beach, where their homes were conveniently adjoined.

According to one account: "JFK would elude the Secret Service on occasion in order to have trysts with women. He did this in Palm Beach when he hopped a fence to swim with Flo Smith. The Secret Service agents couldn't find him and called in the FBI. They finally turned to Palm Beach Police Chief Homer Large, a trusted Kennedy family associate. The Police Chief knew exactly where to find Jack - next door in Earl E. T. Smith's swimming pool. Jack and Flo were alone, and as Homer put it, "They weren't doing the Australian crawl."

Jackie came close to a nervous breakdown in 1960 because of JFK's relationship with Pritchett. Dorothy Kilgallen (4) was the first one to report on the CIA/Mafia plots to kill Castro. (5) Kilgallen was a close friend of Florence Pritchett. Did she get this information from Smith via his wife. Was Smith one of Kilgallen's sources for the articles she wrote claiming that Oswald was innocent? Penn Jones believes that Kilgallen gave a copy of her manuscript on the case to Pritchett. She died two days after Kilgallen. The manuscript has never been found. (6)

Earl Smith was also active in anti-Castro activities in Florida. (7) He was also director of the U.S. Sugar Corporation and was considered by Ronald Reagan as being one of America's leading experts on Cuba and in 1982 Smith became a member of the Presidential Commission on Broadcasting to Cuba.


Notes and References

1. Earl E. Smith, The Fourth Floor (1962)

2. Earl E. Smith evidence to the Senate Committee on the Judiciary on 27th August, 1960.

3. http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKsmithF.htm

4. http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKkilgallen.htm

5. Dorothy Kilgallen, New York Journal American (15th July, 1959)

6. http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=2358

7. http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKsmithET.htm
Tim Gratz
QUOTE (John Simkin @ Dec 18 2004, 09:41 AM)
[


Earl T. Smith, the man Dwight Eisenhower appointed as Ambassador Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary to Cuba in 1957 had a lot to say about this. (1)

Smith gave evidence to the Senate Committee on the Judiciary on 27th August, 1960 on Castro and the CIA. (2)

F. W. Sourwine: Mr. Smith, when you were appointed Ambassador to Cuba, were you briefed on the job?

Earl E. Smith: Yes; I was.

F. W. Sourwine: Who gave you this briefing?

Earl E. Smith: I spent 6 weeks in Washington, approximately 4 days of each week, visiting various agencies and being briefed by the State, Department and those whom the State Department designated.

F. W. Sourwine: Any particular individual or individuals who, had a primary part in this briefing?

Earl E. Smith: The answer is, in the period of 6 weeks I was briefed by numbers of people in the usual course as every Ambassador is briefed.

F. W. Sourwine: Is it true, sir, that you were instructed to get a briefing on your new job as Ambassador to Cuba from Herbert Matthews of the New York Times?

Earl E. Smith: Yes; that is correct.

F. W. Sourwine: Who gave you these instructions?

Earl E. Smith: William Wieland, Director of the Caribbean Division and Mexico. At that time he was Director of the Caribbean Division, Central American Affairs.

F. W. Sourwine: Did you, sir, in fact see Matthews?

Earl E. Smith: Yes; I did.

F. W. Sourwine: And did he brief you on the Cuban situation?

Earl E. Smith: Yes; he did.

F. W. Sourwine: Could you give us the highlights of what he told you?...

Earl E. Smith: We talked for 2 1/2 hours on the Cuban situation, a complete review o£ his feelings regarding Cuba, Batista, Castro, the situation in Cuba, and what he thought would happen.

F. W. Sourwine: What did he think would happen?

Earl E. Smith: He did not believe that the Batista government could last, and that the fall of the Batista government would come relatively soon.

F. W. Sourwine: Specifically what did he say about Castro?

Earl E. Smith: In February 1957 Herbert L. Matthews wrote three articles on Fidel Castro, which appeared on the front page of the New York Times, in which he eulogized Fidel Castro and portrayed him as a political Robin Hood, and I would say that he repeated those views to me in our conversation....

F. W. Sourwine: What did Mr. Matthews tell you about Batista?

Earl E. Smith: Mr. Matthews had a very poor view of Batista, considered him a rightist ruthless dictator whom he believed to be corrupt. Mr. Matthews informed me that he had very knowledgeable views of Cuba and Latin American nations, and had seen the same things take place in Spain. He believed that it would be in the best interest of Cuba and the best interest of the world in general when Batista was removed from office.

F. W. Sourwine: It was true that Batista's government was corrupt, wasn't it?

Earl E. Smith: It is true that Batista's government was corrupt. Batista was the power behind the Government in Cuba off and on for 25 years. The year 1957 was the best economic year that Cuba had ever had.

However, the Batista regime was disintegrating from within. It was becoming more corrupt, and as a result, was losing strength. The Castro forces themselves never won a military victory. The best military victory they ever won was through capturing Cuban guardhouses and military skirmishes, but they never actually won a military victory.

The Batista government was overthrown because of the corruption, disintegration from within, and because of the United States and the various agencies of the United States who directly and indirectly aided the overthrow of the Batista government and brought into power Fidel Castro.

F. W. Sourwine: What were those, agencies, Mr. Smith?

Earl E. Smith: The US Government agencies-may I say something off the record?

(Discussion off the record.)

F. W. Sourwine: Mr. Smith, the pending question before you read your statement was: What agencies of the US Government had a hand in bringing pressure to overthrow the Batista government, and how did they do it?

Earl E. Smith: Well, the agencies, certain influential people, influential sources in the State Department, lower down echelons in the CIA. I would say representatives of the majority of the US Government agencies which have anything to do with the Embassy...

F. W. Sourwine: Mr. Smith, when you talked with Matthews to get the briefing before you went to Cuba, was he introduced to you as having any authority from the State Department or as being connected with the State Department in any way?

Earl E. Smith: Let me go back. You asked me a short while ago who arranged the meeting with Mr. Matthews.

F. W. Sourwine: And you said Mr. Wieland.

Earl E. Smith: I said Wilham Wieland, but Wilham Wieland also had to have the approval of Roy Rubottom, who was then Assistant Secretary of State for Latin American Affairs. Now, to go back to this question, as I understood it, you said - would you mind repeating that again?

F. W. Sourwine: I asked if, when you were, sent to Mr. Matthews for this briefing, he was introduced to you as having any official connection with the State Department or any authority from the Department?

Earl E. Smith: Oh, no. I knew who he was, and they obviously knew I knew who he was, but I believe, that they thought it would be a good idea for me to get the viewpoint of Herbert Matthews, and also I think that Herbert Matthews is the leading Latin American editorial writer for the New York Times. Obviously the State Department would like to have the support of the New York Times...

James Eastland: Mr. Smith, we have had hearings, a great many, in Miami, with prominent Cubans, and there is a thread that runs through the whole thing that people connected with some Government agency went to Cuba and called on the chiefs of the armed forces and told them that we would not recognize the government of the President-elect, and that we would not back him, and that because of that the chiefs of the armed forces told Batista to leave the country, and they set up a government in which they attempted to make a deal with Castro. That is accurate, isn't it, Tom?

Thomas Dodd: I would say so, yes...

James Eastland: Let me ask you this question. As a matter of fact, isn't it your judgment that the State Department of the United States is primarily responsible for bringing Castro to power in Cuba?

Earl E. Smith: No, sir, I can't say that the State Department in itself is primarily responsible. The State Department played a large part in bringing Castro to power. The press, other Government agencies, Members of Congress are responsible...

James Eastland: You had been warning the State Department that Castro was a Marxist?

Earl E. Smith: Yes, sir.

James Eastland: And that Batista's government was a friendly government. That is what had been your advice as to the State Department?

Earl E. Smith: Let me answer that this way, which will make it very clear. When I went to Cuba, I left here with the definite feeling according to my briefings which I had received, that the U.S. Government was too close to the Batista regime, and that we were being accused of intervening in the affairs of Cuba by trying to perpetuate the Batista dictatorship.

After I had been in Cuba for approximately 2 months, and had made a study of Fidel Castro and the revolutionaries, it was perfectly obvious to me as it would be to any other reasonable man that Castro was not the answer; that if Castro came to power, it would not be in the best interests of Cuba or in the best interests of the United States....

In my own Embassy there were certain ones of influence who were pro-26th of July, pro-Castro, and anti-Batista.

James Eastland: Who were they?

Earl E. Smith: Do I have to answer that question, Senator?

James Eastland: Yes, I think you have to. We are not going into it unnecessarily.

Earl E. Smith: I don't want to harm anybody. That is the reason I asked.

I would say the Chief of the Political Section, John Topping, and the Chief of the CIA Section. It was revealed that the No. 2 CIA rnan in the embassy had given unwarranted and undue encouragement to the revolutionaries. This came out in tke trials of naval officers after the Cienfuegos revolution of September I957...

James Eastland: He (Batista) didn't have to leave. He had not been defeated by armed force.

Earl E. Smith: Let me put it to you this way: that there are a lot of reasons for Batista's moving out. Batista had been in control off and on for 25 years. His government was disintegrating, at the end due to corruption, due to the fact that he had been in power too long. Police brutality was getting worse.

On the other hand there were three forces that kept Batista in power. He had the support of the armed forces, he had support of the labor leaders. Cuba enjoyed a good economy.

Nineteen hundred and fifty-seven was one of the best years in the economic history of Cuba. The fact that the United States was no longer supporting Batista had a devastating psychological effect, upon the armed forces and upon the leaders of the labor movement. This went a long way toward bringing about his downfall.

On the other hand, our actions in the United States were responsible for the rise to power of Castro. Until certain portions of the American press began to write derogatory articles against the Batista government, the Castro revolution never got off first base.

Batista made the mistake of overemphasizing the importance of Prio, who was residing in Florida, and underestimating the importance of Castro. Prio was operating out of the United States, out of Florida, supplying the revolutionaries with arms, ammunition, bodies and money.

Batista told me that when Prio left Cuba, Prio and Alameia (Aleman) took $140 million out of Cuba. If we cut that estimate in half, they may have shared $70 million. It is believed that Prio spent a great many millions of dollars in the United States assisting the revolutionaries. This was done right from our shores....

F. W. Sourwine: Is there any doubt in your mind that the Cuban Government, under Castro, is a Communist government?

Earl E. Smith: Now?

F. W. Sourwine: Yes.

Earl E. Smith: I would go further. I believe it is becoming a satellite.

The logical thing for the Russians to do would be to move into Cuba which they had already done, and to take over, which they would do by a mutual security pact.

Then, when the United States objects, all they have to say is:

"We will get out of Cuba when you get out of Turkey."

Thomas Dodd: You are not suggesting-

Earl E. Smith: That is a speech I made in February.

Thomas Dodd: Yes, but you are not suggesting that the Communists will cease and desist from their activities in Cuba and Central and South America, or anywhere else, if we get out of these other places?

Earl E. Smith: Out of Turkey?

Thomas Dodd: Yes.

Earl E. Smith: It would mean a great deal to them if we got out of Turkey. I am no expert on Turkey.

Thomas Dodd: You do not have to be an expert on Turkey, but you ought to be a little bit of an expert on the Communists to know this would not follow at all.

Every time we have retreated from one place, they have moved into new areas.

Earl E. Smith: Senator, I did not say what they would do.

Thomas Dodd: I know, but...

Earl E. Smith: That they would move into Cuba to retaliate with us.


Smith went on to issue a statement to the Senate Committee:

First let me say that to date I have made no public statement regarding my experiences in Cuba because I did not feel that, as a former Ambassador, it was my function to say anything which might be interpreted as critical of the administration which I had served. I have only the greatest respect and admiration for President Eisenhower, whose integrity is beyond question.

However, the establishment of a Communist regime in Cuba involves the defense and safety of this country and as you asked me to testify before you, I do so, recognizing that the welfare of the United States must transcend personal desires and reticence.

From personal experience I have learned that many very influential sources in the United States are dedicated to the overthrow of all dictatorships. They are as opposed to anti-Communist rightest dictators, who are friendly to the United States, as to the Communist dictators whom they regard as progressive. They adopt a doctrinaire attitude toward this question which is so impractical that they ultimately unwittingly defeat themselves. If dictatorship versus democracy were the only question that faced us, it would not be difficult to make a decision. However, as we are in the midst of a struggle for survival, other considerations are pertinent.

If the policy of the United States is to bring about the overthrow of dictators in the hope that democracy will follow, then I believe that the United States must be prepared to take whatever steps are necessary to preserve law and order and relevant chaos during that interim period of transition. If free and open elections are to be held, when a dictator is overthrown, a provisional government must be formed and such government needs outside support to maintain law and order. To do otherwise leaves a vacuum for the Communists to gain control. Such a vacuum did not occur in Cuba while I was the U.S. Ambassador there. Instead, a group was ready to seize power - a Communist group.

If we are to intervene sufficiently to bring about the overthrow of dictatorships, then we should intervene to whatever extent is required to fulfill our purpose. Otherwise, in my opinion, we must wait for the normal self-development of a people and not assist revolution. And we must be prepared to receive the criticism of supporting friendly governments recognized by the United States, although they have been labeled dictatorships. To make my point more clear, let me say that, we helped to overthrow the Batista dictatorship which was pro-American only to install the Castro dictatorship which is pro-Russian.


* * * * * * * * * *

Thanks for posting this, John. In my opinion, Smith's testimony demonstrates what a thoughtful and intelligent man he was.

It appears to be the thrust of Tim's article that the US, through its actions against Fidel, drove him into Khruschev's arms. That interpretation (Tim likes that word) is, I think, not supported by the facts. Item: one of the first things the Eisenhower administration did after Fidel came to power was to replace Ambassador Smith (because he was known as being "too" anti-Castro). Item: many of Castro's supporters discovered his dedication to communism shortly after he came to power. The list of those who did so is long indeed. Item: Mr. Weyl's seminar demonstrates that Fidel was a student of communism since his college days. Mr. Weyl is a wise man who knows wherof he speaks. As you know, Mr. Weyl was once a Communist himself. When I get around to it I will post the relevant portions of Mr. Weyl's article here.
Tim Carroll
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 01:54 AM)
Smith gave evidence to the Senate Committee on the Judiciary on 27th August, 1960 on Castro and the CIA.  [Is this the testimony that was termed as taking place as early as 1957 in e-mail correspondence, to which I replied that it was nonsensical that there was any such testimony that early when Castro and his rag-tag band were living around a campfire in the Sierra Maestra?] (2)
Earl T. Smith:  However, the Batista regime was disintegrating from within. It was becoming more corrupt, and as a result, was losing strength....
The Batista government was overthrown because of the corruption, disintegration from within, and because of the United States and the various agencies of the United States who directly and indirectly aided the overthrow of the Batista government and brought into power Fidel Castro.

F. W. Sourwine: What were those, agencies, Mr. Smith?

Earl T. Smith: Well, the agencies, certain influential people, influential sources in the State Department, lower down echelons in the CIA. I would say representatives of the majority of the US Government agencies which have anything to do with the Embassy...

James Eastland: Let me ask you this question. As a matter of fact, isn't it your judgment that the State Department of the United States is primarily responsible for bringing Castro to power in Cuba?

Earl T. Smith: No, sir, I can't say that the State Department in itself is primarily responsible. The State Department played a large part in bringing Castro to power. The press, other Government agencies, Members of Congress are responsible...

James Eastland: You had been warning the State Department that Castro was a Marxist?

Earl T. Smith: Yes, sir.

James Eastland: And that Batista's government was a friendly government. That is what had been your advice as to the State Department?

Earl T. Smith: Let me answer that this way, which will make it very clear. When I went to Cuba, I left there with the definite feeling according to my briefings which I had received, that the U.S. Government was too close to the Batista regime, and that we were being accused of intervening in the affairs of Cuba by trying to perpetuate the Batista dictatorship.

After I had been in Cuba for approximately 2 months, and had made a study of Fidel Castro and the revolutionaries, it was perfectly obvious to me as it would be to any other reasonable man that Castro was not the answer; that if Castro came to power, it would not be in the best interests of Cuba or in the best interests of the United States....

In my own Embassy there were certain ones of influence who were pro-26th of July, pro-Castro, and anti-Batista.

James Eastland: Who were they?

Earl T. Smith: I would say the Chief of the Political Section, John Topping, and the Chief of the CIA Section. It was revealed that the No. 2 CIA rnan in the embassy had given unwarranted and undue encouragement to the revolutionaries. This came out in tke trials of naval officers after the Cienfuegos revolution of September I957...

James Eastland: He (Batista) didn't have to leave. He had not been defeated by armed force.

Earl T. Smith: Let me put it to you this way: that there are a lot of reasons for Batista's moving out. Batista had been in control off and on for 25 years. His government was disintegrating, at the end due to corruption, due to the fact that he had been in power too long. Police brutality was getting worse....  The fact that the United States was no longer supporting Batista had a devastating psychological effect, upon the armed forces and upon the leaders of the labor movement. This went a long way toward bringing about his downfall.

Batista made the mistake of overemphasizing the importance of Prio, who was residing in Florida, and underestimating the importance of Castro. Prio was operating out of the United States, out of Florida, supplying the revolutionaries with arms, ammunition, bodies and money.

Batista told me that when Prio left Cuba, Prio and Alameia (Aleman) took $140 million out of Cuba. If we cut that estimate in half, they may have shared $70 million. It is believed that Prio spent a great many millions of dollars in the United States assisting the revolutionaries. This was done right from our shores....


F. W. Sourwine: Is there any doubt in your mind that the Cuban Government, under Castro, is a Communist government?

Earl T. Smith: Now?

F. W. Sourwine: Yes.

Earl T. Smith: I would go further. I believe it is becoming a satellite.

The logical thing for the Russians to do would be to move into Cuba which they had already done, and to take over, which they would do by a mutual security pact.

Then, when the United States objects, all they have to say is:

"We will get out of Cuba when you get out of Turkey."


Smith went on to issue a statement to the Senate Committee:

I have only the greatest respect and admiration for President Eisenhower, whose integrity is beyond question.  However, the establishment of a Communist regime in Cuba involves the defense and safety of this country and as you asked me to testify before you, I do so, recognizing that the welfare of the United States must transcend personal desires and reticence....

If dictatorship versus democracy were the only question that faced us, it would not be difficult to make a decision. However, as we are in the midst of a struggle for survival, other considerations are pertinent.

To make my point more clear, let me say that, we helped to overthrow the Batista dictatorship which was pro-American only to install the Castro dictatorship which is pro-Russian.


                                *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *

Thanks for posting this, John.  In my opinion, Smith's testimony demonstrates what a thoughtful and intelligent man he was.

It appears to be the thrust of Tim's article that the US, through its actions against Fidel, drove him into Khruschev's arms.  That interpretation (Tim likes that word) is, I think, not supported by the facts.  Item: one of the first things the Eisenhower administration did after Fidel came to power was to replace Ambassador Smith (because he was known as being "too" anti-Castro)....   Mr. Weyl's seminar demonstrates that Fidel was a student of communism since his college days.  Mr. Weyl is a wise man who knows wherof he speaks.  As you know, Mr. Weyl was once a Communist himself.  When I get around to it I will post the relevant portions of Mr. Weyl's article here.
*

I had never before heard that Mr. Weyl was once a communist himself. His seminar begins as follows:

"One morning early in 1960, we were reading the New York Times in bed when I happened to glance through a speech by the new dictator of Cuba. I knew very little about Fidel Castro beyond the fact that he was being portrayed as a reincarnation of Robin Hood (or was it Abraham Lincoln?) in the lyrical prose of Times correspondent Herbert L. Matthews. I asked Sylvia (my wife) to read the Castro harangue. We both concluded that it seemed to be the product of an indoctrinated Communist. What if Castro was a Soviet agent?"

I find the most prescient and eventually crucial aspect of Earl Smith's testimony to have been the questions about a correlation of a possible Soviet presence in Cuba with our long-term policy of encirclement, in which we deployed nuclear missiles right on the Soviet border. It was entirely predictable that if Cuba became a Soviet satellite, the same policy might be turned back against us. That is why JFK tried numerous times prior to the Missile Crisis to get the Jupiter missiles out of Turkey. Eventually, he had to make a secret deal to do just that under threat.

But getting back to whether Castro was a communist from the beginning, in the black and white terms John Foster Dulles had promulgated, or if he was a social reformer who was never going to have the approval of the United Fruit Co., the major landowner in all of Cuba and former employer of both Dulles brothers, one cannot leave out the geopolitical discrepencies between long-standing U.S. policies and U.S. intolerance of equitable counterpart policies by any non-aligned nation. If Castro was a Soviet agent from the beginning, why did the CIA, Mafia, and State Department support his revolution - not just with words but with weapons? My interpretation (yes Tim Gratz, I like that word, and its importance is the reason we have CIA and State Dept. analysts) is that under the conditions of the moment, Castro was the most moderate option available.

Finally, there is the comment: "Batista made the mistake of overemphasizing the importance of Prio, who was residing in Florida, and underestimating the importance of Castro. Prio was operating out of the United States, out of Florida, supplying the revolutionaries with arms, ammunition, bodies and money. Batista told me that when Prio left Cuba, Prio and Alameia (Aleman) took $140 million out of Cuba. If we cut that estimate in half, they may have shared $70 million. It is believed that Prio spent a great many millions of dollars in the United States assisting the revolutionaries. This was done right from our shores....

We JFK assassination researchers have generally made the opposite mistake of underemphasizing Prio and his many millions, during the 1963 period.

Tim Carroll
Tim Gratz
[quote=Tim Carroll,Dec 18 2004, 11:03 PM]
[I had never before heard that Mr. Weyl was once a communist himself. His seminar begins as follows:

Tim: I said "as you know" because, although I do not always agree with your interpration of history, I am impressed with your knowledge of the people and events of Cold War history. Weyl was indeed a former Communist and if my memory serves me right he played a role in the Hiss case. He recently published a book called "Encounters with Communism."

I find the most prescient and eventually crucial aspect of Earl Smith's testimony to have been the questions about a correlation of a possible Soviet presence in Cuba with our long-term policy of encirclement, in which we deployed nuclear missiles right on the Soviet border. It was entirely predictable that if Cuba became a Soviet satellite, the same policy might be turned back against us. That is why JFK tried numerous times prior to the Missile Crisis to get the Jupiter missiles out of Turkey. Eventually, he had to make a secret deal to do just that under threat.

Yes, Tim, I agree with you here. That comment is one of the reasons I characterized Smith's testimony as thoughtful. Many scholars believe that both Khruschev and JFK were using Cuba as a pawn over the Cold War in Europe.

Finally, there is the comment: "Batista made the mistake of overemphasizing the importance of Prio, who was residing in Florida, and underestimating the importance of Castro. Prio was operating out of the United States, out of Florida, supplying the revolutionaries with arms, ammunition, bodies and money. Batista told me that when Prio left Cuba, Prio and Alameia (Aleman) took $140 million out of Cuba. If we cut that estimate in half, they may have shared $70 million. It is believed that Prio spent a great many millions of dollars in the United States assisting the revolutionaries. This was done right from our shores....

We JFK assassination researchers have generally made the opposite mistake of underemphasizing Prio and his many millions, during the 1963 period.

Tim: I agree with you, again, that the various connections of Prior deserve further investigation.

Finally, with respect to your comment about Castro being the best alternative to Batista, are you aware of the efforts Wiliam Pawley was frantically making in December of 1958 to find a moderate alternative to Castro, efforts rebuffed by the Eisenhower State Department? (I don't have Hugh Thomas' magisterial history of Cuba with me, but I will refer to it to discuss this episode in greater detail, tomorrow.)
Tim Carroll
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 03:25 PM)
Finally, with respect to your comment about Castro being the best alternative to Batista, are you aware of the efforts Wiliam Pawley was frantically making in December of 1958 to find a moderate alternative to Castro, efforts rebuffed by the Eisenhower State Department?  (I don't have Hugh Thomas' magisterial history of Cuba with me, but I will refer to it to discuss this episode in greater detail, tomorrow.)[/color]
*

Tim Gratz:

I meant no argument with Mr. Weyl having been a communist; I simply had never heard that and didn't have that take from his seminar. In the case of a self-proclaimed communist there is little room for interpretation or debate. But in terms of declaring who was a communist and at what point in time, as I have said, in those days, Earl Warren was considered a communist by many, as was JFK. It's a matter of interpretation.

I wonder if you have ever heard of the Bay of Pigs planning by the right wing elements at the CIA to go ahead with a moderate provisional government, with a plan ready to subsequently replace it with a more Batistiano one?

The Bay of Pigs planning also included manipulating the politics of the Cuban exiles in the aftermath of what was hoped to be a successful takeover. Even many of the Cuban exiles would have been shocked at how far some in the United States were willing to go in this regard. The President’s directive that the exile leadership include more people from the left-of-center orientation to counter charges that the exiles were nothing more than Batisteros in disguise caused some dissension in the CIA’s ranks. E. Howard Hunt’s resentment of the change led him to “resign”[1] or be “fired”[2] from his job as Political Action Officer for the invasion, depending on whose version one believes. He thought these changes amounted to a policy of Fidelismo sin Fidel, Fidelism without Fidel. Hunt’s political orientation, which was distinctly right wing, was far more amenable to Batistism sin Batista.

One of the moderate Cuban leaders, stung by Hunt’s charge, stated: “I don’t know what it means to be a leftist. If it means to be in favor of all the people and for the welfare of the masses, then I am.” Hunt retorted: “Fidel Castro could not have phrased it better.”[3] His ideology was reflected in a quote he was fond of citing: “The liberal’s arm cannot strike with firmness against communism ... because the liberal dimly feels that in doing so he would be somehow wounding himself.”[4] The right wing Cubans and those in the CIA like Hunt who were most sympathetic to counter-revolutionary politics did make contingency plans for the exiles’ leadership after the landing. “Operation 40 [a high level, government-connected Cuban exile group] called for assassinating the moderates after their return to the island following an invasion.”[5] The U.S. supported the creation of a moderate provisional government during the planning, while its own agents were plotting to install a more right-wing one later. The moderates were intended to legitimize the efforts of the exile force while at the same time becoming targets themselves for some later murderous manipulation.

1. E. Howard Hunt, Give Us This Day, (New Rochelle, NY: Arlington House, 1973), 83.
2. Thomas Powers, The Man Who Kept the Secrets: Richard Helms & the CIA, (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1979), 252.
3. E. Howard Hunt, 94.
4. Ibid., 218.
5. Maria de los Angeles Torres, "Autumn of the Cuban Patriarchs," The Nation, (December 1, 1997, v265, n180, 24(3).

Tim Carroll
Tim Gratz
QUOTE (Tim Carroll @ Dec 19 2004, 02:09 AM)
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 03:25 PM)
Finally, with respect to your comment about Castro being the best alternative to Batista, are you aware of the efforts Wiliam Pawley was frantically making in December of 1958 to find a moderate alternative to Castro, efforts rebuffed by the Eisenhower State Department?  (I don't have Hugh Thomas' magisterial history of Cuba with me, but I will refer to it to discuss this episode in greater detail, tomorrow.)[/color]
*

Tim Gratz:

I meant no argument with Mr. Weyl having been a communist; I simply had never heard that and didn't have that take from his seminar. In the case of a self-proclaimed communist there is little room for interpretation or debate. But in terms of declaring who was a communist and at what point in time, as I have said, in those days, Earl Warren was considered a communist by many, as was JFK. It's a matter of interpretation.

I wonder if you have ever heard of the Bay of Pigs planning by the right wing elements at the CIA to go ahead with a moderate provisional government, with a plan ready to subsequently replace it with a more Batistiano one?

The Bay of Pigs planning also included manipulating the politics of the Cuban exiles in the aftermath of what was hoped to be a successful takeover. Even many of the Cuban exiles would have been shocked at how far some in the United States were willing to go in this regard. The President’s directive that the exile leadership include more people from the left-of-center orientation to counter charges that the exiles were nothing more than Batisteros in disguise caused some dissension in the CIA’s ranks. E. Howard Hunt’s resentment of the change led him to “resign”[1] or be “fired”[2] from his job as Political Action Officer for the invasion, depending on whose version one believes. He thought these changes amounted to a policy of Fidelismo sin Fidel, Fidelism without Fidel. Hunt’s political orientation, which was distinctly right wing, was far more amenable to Batistism sin Batista.

One of the moderate Cuban leaders, stung by Hunt’s charge, stated: “I don’t know what it means to be a leftist. If it means to be in favor of all the people and for the welfare of the masses, then I am.” Hunt retorted: “Fidel Castro could not have phrased it better.”[3] His ideology was reflected in a quote he was fond of citing: “The liberal’s arm cannot strike with firmness against communism ... because the liberal dimly feels that in doing so he would be somehow wounding himself.”[4] The right wing Cubans and those in the CIA like Hunt who were most sympathetic to counter-revolutionary politics did make contingency plans for the exiles’ leadership after the landing. “Operation 40 [a high level, government-connected Cuban exile group] called for assassinating the moderates after their return to the island following an invasion.”[5] The U.S. supported the creation of a moderate provisional government during the planning, while its own agents were plotting to install a more right-wing one later. The moderates were intended to legitimize the efforts of the exile force while at the same time becoming targets themselves for some later murderous manipulation.

1. E. Howard Hunt, Give Us This Day, (New Rochelle, NY: Arlington House, 1973), 83.
2. Thomas Powers, The Man Who Kept the Secrets: Richard Helms & the CIA, (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1979), 252.
3. E. Howard Hunt, 94.
4. Ibid., 218.
5. Maria de los Angeles Torres, "Autumn of the Cuban Patriarchs," The Nation, (December 1, 1997, v265, n180, 24(3).

Tim Carroll
*



Tim, interesting post. Weyl by the way was a card-carrying communist, as I understand it. I'll e-mail him and tell him it would be interesting for him to summarize his political history. I'm sure it would be most interesting!

There certainly were a multiplicity of anti-Castro exile organizations of various political philosophies. I am sure you will find interesting the post I will do tomorrow re William Pawley's efforts to find a moderate to replace Batista, efforts which probably came too late and were not supported by the State Department.
Re the political persuasion of the CIA, I am quite certain that Bissell, who really originated the CIA/mafia plots, was a Kennedy supporter in the 1960 election.
I am sure Hunt was quite right wing. I have no idea of Helms' political philosophy (other than that he was no fan of Richard Nixon). I presume (could be wrong) that Angleton's politics were right of center.
Tim Carroll
[quote=Tim Gratz,Dec 18 2004, 03:25 PM]
[quote=Tim Carroll,Dec 18 2004, 11:03 PM]
I find the most prescient and eventually crucial aspect of Earl Smith's testimony to have been the questions about a correlation of a possible Soviet presence in Cuba with our long-term policy of encirclement, in which we deployed nuclear missiles right on the Soviet border. It was entirely predictable that if Cuba became a Soviet satellite, the same policy might be turned back against us. That is why JFK tried numerous times prior to the Missile Crisis to get the Jupiter missiles out of Turkey. Eventually, he had to make a secret deal to do just that under threat.
Yes, Tim, I agree with you here. That comment is one of the reasons I characterized Smith's testimony as thoughtful. Many scholars believe that both Khruschev and JFK were using Cuba as a pawn over the Cold War in Europe.
___________________________________________________________
At the Summit in Vienna in June, 1961, "Khrushchev warned that while Castro was no Communist, 'you are well on the way to making him a good one.' The President had claimed that the United States attacked Cuba because the island threatened American security: 'Can six million people really be a threat to the mighty U.S.?' If the United States felt threatened by tiny Cuba, what was the Soviet Union to do about Turkey and Iran? 'These two countries are followers of the United States. They march in its wake, and they have U.S. bases and rockets.... If the U.S. believes that it is free to act, then what should the U.S.S.R. do?'"*

*Michael R. Beschloss, The Crisis Years, (New York: HarperCollins Publishers, 1991), 200-201.

Tim Carroll
Tim Carroll
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 06:22 PM)
Re the political persuasion of the CIA, I am quite certain that Bissell, who really originated the CIA/mafia plots, was a Kennedy supporter in the 1960 election.
I am sure Hunt was quite right wing.  I have no idea of Helms' political philosophy (other than that he was no fan of Richard Nixon).  I presume (could be wrong) that Angleton's politics were right of center.
*

Tim Gratz:

As with our previous discussion about Trento, this partisan perspective of these matters is overly simplistic and generally irrelevant.

Tim Carroll
Tim Gratz
[quote=Tim Carroll,Dec 19 2004, 02:40 AM]
[quote=Tim Gratz,Dec 18 2004, 03:25 PM]
[quote=Tim Carroll,Dec 18 2004, 11:03 PM]
I find the most prescient and eventually crucial aspect of Earl Smith's testimony to have been the questions about a correlation of a possible Soviet presence in Cuba with our long-term policy of encirclement, in which we deployed nuclear missiles right on the Soviet border. It was entirely predictable that if Cuba became a Soviet satellite, the same policy might be turned back against us. That is why JFK tried numerous times prior to the Missile Crisis to get the Jupiter missiles out of Turkey. Eventually, he had to make a secret deal to do just that under threat.
Yes, Tim, I agree with you here. That comment is one of the reasons I characterized Smith's testimony as thoughtful. Many scholars believe that both Khruschev and JFK were using Cuba as a pawn over the Cold War in Europe.
___________________________________________________________
At the Summit in Vienna in June, 1963, "Khrushchev warned that while Castro was no Communist, 'you are well on the way to making him a good one.' The President had claimed that the United States attacked Cuba because the island threatened American security: 'Can six million people really be a threat to the mighty U.S.?' If the United States felt threatened by tiny Cuba, what was the Soviet Union to do about Turkey and Iran? 'These two countries are followers of the United States. They march in its wake, and they have U.S. bases and rockets.... If the U.S. believes that it is free to act, then what should the U.S.S.R. do?'"*

*Michael R. Beschloss, The Crisis Years, (New York: HarperCollins Publishers, 1991), 200-201.

Tim Carroll
*

[/quote]
Interesting quote. Check my memory, I think the Vienna summit was in 1961.
I am sure you caught, in the colloquy between Dodd and Smith, that Dodd ( a Democrat) was expressing a more reactionary attitude than Smith whose carefully stated opinions were (searching for the right word) nuanced.
(If you agree the summit was in 1961, edit your post and I will edit this one to delete the reference.)
Tim Gratz
QUOTE (Tim Carroll @ Dec 19 2004, 02:47 AM)
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 06:22 PM)
Re the political persuasion of the CIA, I am quite certain that Bissell, who really originated the CIA/mafia plots, was a Kennedy supporter in the 1960 election.
I am sure Hunt was quite right wing.  I have no idea of Helms' political philosophy (other than that he was no fan of Richard Nixon).  I presume (could be wrong) that Angleton's politics were right of center.
*

Tim Gratz:

As with our previous discussion about Trento, this partisan perspective of these matters is overly simplistic and generally irrelevant.

Tim Carroll
*



Agreed!
Tim Gratz
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 19 2004, 03:33 AM)
QUOTE (Tim Carroll @ Dec 19 2004, 02:47 AM)
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 06:22 PM)
Re the political persuasion of the CIA, I am quite certain that Bissell, who really originated the CIA/mafia plots, was a Kennedy supporter in the 1960 election.
I am sure Hunt was quite right wing.  I have no idea of Helms' political philosophy (other than that he was no fan of Richard Nixon).  I presume (could be wrong) that Angleton's politics were right of center.
*

Tim Gratz:

As with our previous discussion about Trento, this partisan perspective of these matters is overly simplistic and generally irrelevant.

Tim Carroll
*



Agreed.
As you know, I think one of the biggest mistakes our country made in the
1960s was the removal of Diem. I remember the controversy over Diem in the fall of 1963. National Review, which greatly influenced my political thinking in those years, was strongly outspoken in defense of Diem. In one sense, the issue could be summed up in the old adage: "You don't change horses in mid-stream." Plus, of course, the Diem overthrow involved our country's encouragement of a violent overthrow of a long-standing government of an independent third party. Although the ultimate responsibility rests with JFK, he was largely influenced by Rep Henry Cabot Lodge. (It would probably going too far to suggest that Lodge's attitude toward the Diem regime may have been influenced by religious differences.)

By the way, our previous discussions (on a different thread) about the Ciem coup were overly simplistic, on both our parts. There was a tremenduous amount of manuevering going on in both Washington and Saigon between late August of 1963 and the Diem coup of Nov 1st. JFK was clearly vacillating because his administration was engaged in a bitter internal debate. It was probably because of the internal dispute that JFK listened to the advise of Henry Cabot Lodge, who was "on the ground" in Saigon.

The best summary I recently encountered (since our earlier interchanges) is in Richard Reeves "President Kennedy: Profile in Power.

You have mentioned possible differences of opinion between JFK and RFK. We know RFK opoposed overthrowing Diem. Here is an interesting passage from Reeves' book.

Context: JFK had cabled Lodge that the White House intended to control the action in Saigon. Both Kennedy's thought that Lodge's cable acknowleding that was perhaps sarcastic. RFK told JFK: "I told you he [Lodge] was going to be trouble." According to Reeves, JFK snapped back at his brother: "You know what's terrific about you? You always remember when you're right."

Reeves, Chapter 53.
Tim Carroll
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 06:52 PM)
Check my memory, I think the Vienna summit was in 1961. 
*

Oops; pure typo, duh., June, 1961; very shortly after April's Bay of Pigs.

Tim Carroll
Tim Carroll
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 06:52 PM)
(If you agree the summit was in 1961, edit your post and I will edit this one to delete the reference.)
*

Absolutely - done! Stupid mistake. SInce laser surgery, the computer screen is right in between needing glasses and not; thereby usually meaning not. A less substantive correction of the Smith transcript is his middle initial being "E" rather than "T."

Tim Carroll
Tim Gratz
QUOTE (Tim Carroll @ Dec 19 2004, 05:14 AM)
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 06:52 PM)
(If you agree the summit was in 1961, edit your post and I will edit this one to delete the reference.)
*

Absolutely - done! Stupid mistake. SInce laser surgery, the computer screen is right in between needing glasses and not; thereby usually meaning not. A less substantive correction of the Smith transcript is his middle initial being "E" rather than "T."

Tim Carroll
*



Tim:

His full name was Earl E. T. Smith.

I have not read it yet (just briefly skimmed it) but hope you get the chance to read the chapter on the Cuban missile crisis in Eric Alterman's new book "When Presidents Lie". Based on my very cursory review, I would characterize Altrerman's analysis as "thought provoking". I would very much like to see your comments on it. Fits in with a lot of your writing, I think.
Tim Carroll
[quote=Tim Gratz,Dec 18 2004, 08:03 PM]
As you know, I think one of the biggest mistakes our country made in the
1960s was the removal of Diem. I remember the controversy over Diem in the fall of 1963. National Review, which greatly influenced my political thinking in those years, was strongly outspoken in defense of Diem. In one sense, the issue could be summed up in the old adage: "You don't change horses in mid-stream."

There was a tremenduous amount of manuevering going on in both Washington and Saigon between late August of 1963 and the Diem coup of Nov 1st. JFK was clearly vacillating because his administration was engaged in a bitter internal debate. It was probably because of the internal dispute that JFK listened to the advise of Henry Cabot Lodge, who was "on the ground" in Saigon.

The best summary I recently encountered (since our earlier interchanges) is in Richard Reeves "President Kennedy: Profile in Power.

You have mentioned possible differences of opinion between JFK and RFK. We know RFK opoposed overthrowing Diem. Here is an interesting passage from Reeves' book.

Context: JFK had cabled Lodge that the White House intended to control the action in Saigon. Both Kennedy's thought that Lodge's cable acknowleding that was perhaps sarcastic. RFK told JFK: "I told you he [Lodge] was going to be trouble." According to Reeves, JFK snapped back at his brother: "You know what's terrific about you? You always remember when you're right."

Reeves, Chapter 53.
[/quote][/color]
*

[/quote]
Thanks for the tip on the Alterman book. That quote from Reeves is a great contribution to this discussion. I love that book. As I have asserted previously, it has generally been treated as unthinkable that JFK and Bobby diverged. Even in such an inoccuous book as Manchester's The Death of a President, it opens with a reception at which Bobby is despondent and ready to leave the administration.

As for Diem and Nhu, those Buddhist monk self-immolation "barbecues," according to Madame Nhu's characterization, were having great effect at the time, although by today's suicide terrorist standards it was pretty tame.

Tim Carroll
Tim Gratz
[quote=Tim Carroll,Dec 19 2004, 06:16 AM]
[quote=Tim Gratz,Dec 18 2004, 08:03 PM]
As you know, I think one of the biggest mistakes our country made in the
1960s was the removal of Diem. I remember the controversy over Diem in the fall of 1963. National Review, which greatly influenced my political thinking in those years, was strongly outspoken in defense of Diem. In one sense, the issue could be summed up in the old adage: "You don't change horses in mid-stream."

There was a tremenduous amount of manuevering going on in both Washington and Saigon between late August of 1963 and the Diem coup of Nov 1st. JFK was clearly vacillating because his administration was engaged in a bitter internal debate. It was probably because of the internal dispute that JFK listened to the advise of Henry Cabot Lodge, who was "on the ground" in Saigon.

The best summary I recently encountered (since our earlier interchanges) is in Richard Reeves "President Kennedy: Profile in Power.

You have mentioned possible differences of opinion between JFK and RFK. We know RFK opoposed overthrowing Diem. Here is an interesting passage from Reeves' book.

Context: JFK had cabled Lodge that the White House intended to control the action in Saigon. Both Kennedy's thought that Lodge's cable acknowleding that was perhaps sarcastic. RFK told JFK: "I told you he [Lodge] was going to be trouble." According to Reeves, JFK snapped back at his brother: "You know what's terrific about you? You always remember when you're right."

Reeves, Chapter 53.
[/quote][/color]
*

[/quote]
Thanks for the tip on the Alterman book. That quote from Reeves is a great contribution to this discussion. I love that book. As I have asserted previously, it has generally been treated as unthinkable that JFK and Bobby diverged. Even in such an inoccuous book as Manchester's The Death of a President, it opens with a reception at which Bobby is despondent and ready to leave the administration.

As for Diem and Nhu, those Buddhist monk self-immolation "barbecues," according to Madame Nhu's characterization, were having great effect at the time, although by today's suicide terrorist standards it was pretty tame.

Tim Carroll
*

[/quote]

As I said, I'd love to get your comments on Alterman's treatment of the Cuban missile crisis. I'm sure his other chapters are equally intriguing. One problem with Key West is its small library. The library had to order books from all over the state so we had adequate information to research our stories. Now that the books are back, it is difficult to recheck them. Too bad there's not a Netflix type of business for books!

I think I mentioned this before. I reject the central thesis of the book, but there is a lot of interesting information in "Triangle of Death", and I think all serious students of the assassination should read it.

Madame Nhu was quite a character.

Have you read a book by one of the members of the last South Vietnamese government bitterly complaining that Nixon lied to them to persuade them to accept the peace accords that settled the War in Vietnam? I forget the name of the book but it was an interesting study of Nixon and Kissinger in action.
Tim Carroll
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 10:32 PM)
Madame Nhu was quite a character.

Have you read a book by one of the members of the last South Vietnamese government bitterly complaining that Nixon lied to them to persuade them to accept the peace accords that settled the War in Vietnam?  I forget the name of the book but it was an interesting study of Nixon and Kissinger in action.
*

The settlement of the war was not significantly different than what was attainable four years earlier, and without the additional deaths and destruction. Peace with honor was the mantra. But how much honor is there in destruction?

Tim Carroll
Harry J.Dean
QUOTE (Tim Carroll @ Dec 18 2004, 08:47 AM)
PAINTING CASTRO RED

During the late 1950s the world began to read and hear about a charismatic Cuban revolutionary operating out of the Sierra Maestra mountains. Fidel Castro was an ardent nationalist who had already spent years in one of Batista's prisons for leading an ill-conceived attack on an army installation, the Moncada Barracks, in one of Cuba's eastern provinces. Although sentenced to a fifteen-year term, he had been released after only two years in a general amnesty issued by the Cuban dictator as a sign of his good will and tolerance. Undaunted, Castro had immediately begun planning his next moves. From his mountain hideout, he began to give a series of interviews to American reporters designed to create a romantic and noble image of himself and his band of followers.

Herbert L. Matthews of The New York Times was perhaps the best known of these, although among the others was the famous television personality, Ed Sullivan, whose weekly variety show was characterized more by acts such as "dancing bears, ventriloquists, and magicians," rather than serious interviews with political figures.[1] But even this was perhaps appropriate to the circus atmosphere of personal promotion generated by the public relations-savvy Castro. While meeting with Matthews, Castro arranged for his men to make a jungle clearing look like a busy command post by having them wander through in twos and threes, then change into different clothing and walk by again. This carefully orchestrated skit led Matthews to believe that Castro had hundreds, perhaps thousands, of guerrilla followers.

On New Years Day, 1959, when Fidel Castro came to power in Cuba, the United States' foreign policy establishment had a wide range of options available. So why was the choice made to alienate Castro, thereby driving him into the Soviet fold? Much of the answer can be found in the U.S.' policy in support of multinational corporations. This single-minded mentality (the business of America is business) had little tolerance for social reforms that might cut into profits and control. The absolutism of American capitalism was a very real factor, as Mills wrote, "in forcing the Government of Cuba to align itself politically with the Soviet bloc, as against assuming a genuinely neutralist and hence peaceful world orientation."[2] In his first speech as the leader of the new Cuba, Castro revealed an intended independence that would have been disconcerting to those that profited most from a subservient Cuba:

"The Revolution begins now.... It will not be like 1898, when the North Americans came and made themselves masters of our country.... For the first time, the Republic will really be entirely free and the people will have what they deserve.... This war was won by the people!"[3]

The shaping of Castro's image as communistic long before he would be forced to publicly adopt that guise was a form of self-prophesy. But initially, even the CIA's own resident expert on Latin American communism concluded after a three hour interview with Castro, that "Castro is not only not a Communist; he is a strong anti-Communist fighter."[4] The Eisenhower administration was alarmed by Castro's protestations about human rights and democracy at the same time that he was seizing control of the press, rigging elections, shutting down the casinos, and nationalizing industry. However, other than the issue of the casinos and the geographical and recreational immediacy to American interests, these practices had all been seen before in Latin American efforts to achieve social reform. But this was after McCarthyism had taken its toll on Western attitudes, and there was no room for shades of pink in that climate. It was the era of all or nothing in the fight against the Red Menace. Such extreme attitudes were reflected in a briefing given to CIA Director Dulles by Kenneth Crosby, a leading American businessman with interests in Havana. Crosby described Castro as "another Hitler" who had "tremendous influence over the people," comparable to that of Rasputin.[5]

Clearer heads, however, have questioned such a totalistic perspective. Thomas Patterson disputes the notion that Castro was always a Communist and committed to a Marxist view of the world before taking power. He notes that "even the veteran foreign service officer appointed U.S. ambassador to Cuba shortly after Castro's triumph acknowledged that Castro's Soviet alliance solidified only after the United States tried to overthrow the bearded leader."[6] More than simply placing the cart before the horse, U.S. policy created a Soviet beachhead in the Western Hemisphere. This constituted enemy-making of the first order.

"One school of thought argues that Castro's objectives, combined with the dynamics of revolution, propelled Fidel into the Soviet orbit. On the other hand, there is the contention that, by its actions and non-actions, the United States drove Castro to seek out the Soviet Union. Nonetheless, there was consensus that if presidents Eisenhower and Kennedy had responded to Cuba as President Carter later did to Nicaragua, Castro more likely than not would have been stymied in his radical course."[7]

Even if it were true all along that Castro was a Communist, few countries subscribed to the blanket criterion of "anything but communism" (the "ABC" of U.S. cold war foreign policy) in determining regime legitimacy.[8] Only a year after Castro came to power, secret official efforts had begun to depose him when Eisenhower's National Security Council deliberated over ways to bring "another government to power in Cuba." E. Howard Hunt, the man the Washington Post called the "Great Gatsby of the cloak and walkie-talkie set,"[9] had been sent to Cuba to check things out for himself and upon returning submitted an itemized list of suggestions geared toward toppling Castro:

1. Assassinate Castro before or coincident with the invasion (a task for Cuban patriots);
2. Destroy the Cuban radio and television transmitters before or coincident with the invasion;
3. Destroy the island's microwave relay system just before the invasion begins;
4. Discard any thought of a popular uprising against Castro until the issue has already been militarily decided.[10]

Before Hunt was to be appointed what James Reston described as "operational head of the CIA-Cuban Bay of Pigs disaster," he was asked whether he was too conservative to handle the Cuban exiles.[11] He responded that he was "a career officer" and that his "political views, whatever they may be, don't enter into it." In fact, the question would eventually prove to be well placed, given Hunt's right wing attitudes; he would eventually require replacement over this very issue. But his extreme operational recommendations were well-received, initiating what is perhaps the shadiest period in U.S. foreign relations. At the time, however, it was old home week, with the veterans of the Guatemala overthrow reunited. Hunt recalled, "We greeted each other warmly and remarked that the old crowd was rallying to the new cause."[12] "The first discussion of killing Castro" according to Richard Bissell, the number two man at the CIA, occurred when "first on [Hunt's] list was Castro's murder."[13]

A meeting of the National Security Council was held after which, on March 17, President Eisenhower approved a four-point military plan, laid out in a top secret policy paper, "A Program of Covert Action Against the Castro Regime." This program had already received approval from the 5412 Committee, "the most secret operating unit of government." Leaving out any mention of Hunt's internal CIA memo recommending that "thorough consideration be given to the elimination of Fidel Castro," the document called for four steps:

(1) creation of a responsible and unified Cuban government in exile;
(2) a powerful propaganda offensive;
(3) a covert intelligence and action organization in Cuba, to be responsive to the exile opposition; and
(4) a paramilitary force outside of Cuba for future guerrilla action.[14]

Hunt was gratified to be informed that the project's action officer at the White House was to be none other than the Vice President, Richard Nixon. He later noted his disappointment that when the time came that he needed him, Nixon "had been supplanted by a new administration."[15]

Michael Beschloss has observed that all of this plotting and planning was conducted at a time when Castro "had yet to seize American property or establish diplomatic relations with Moscow."[16] Publicly, the official American policy was still friendliness toward the new Cuban government. The planned lodgment of a government-in-exile on a Cuban beachhead was never expected to actually topple Castro; the most hopeful prospect was that by presenting a military threat of unknown proportions, and fabricating rumors and propaganda of multiple landings, dissident Cubans might be encouraged to take up arms while borderline supporters would be frightened into quiescence. The idea was that, once established, the exiles would begin "broadcasting to the world as a government-in-arms. In other words, the best the constructed legitimacy of the exile beachhead government could have offered the Cuban people was civil war, a "bitter gift."[17] Of course, once the U.S. were to recognize the new government as the legitimate one, then requests for military support would have indigenous origins, giving the U.S. all the pretext needed, and avoiding any appearance of imperialism. To add to the construction of legitimacy, Hunt was directed to draft a new Cuban constitution which should include "land reform clauses and the rest of it."[18] While some supposed that the exile force would be able to advance toward Havana, Bissell knew better: the isolation of the landing site intended to keep Castro out would just as readily keep the exiles in.

Shortly after conducting a good will tour of America, Castro introduced an agrarian reform law to his Cabinet. The measure would authorize the Cuban government to take back much of the island's land from its owners, many of them being American-based companies. Immediately, the American press began to portray Castro as a Communist. This change was not merely a reflection of ideological sentiment. There was a very real monetary incentive behind the opposition to the agrarian reform. Chief among the companies who vehemently opposed the expropriation of land was the conglomerate, some would say oligarchy, United Fruit, a company that had already been instrumental in the overthrow of the Guatemalan government in 1954.

The Boston-based United Fruit Company had unique connections within the U.S. government. Both John Foster Dulles, the Secretary of State, and his brother Allen Dulles, the Director of the CIA, had been partners in the law firm that represented this company. John M. Cabot, Eisenhower's Assistant Secretary of State for Inter-American Affairs, was the company's major stockholder. Sinclair Weeks, the Secretary of Commerce, had been director of United Fruit's registrar bank.[19] Although some of these officials had divested themselves of their interests in the company, the Washington-United Fruit network was a significant one. These were the days "when the United Fruit Company's reputation for being able to call in the Marines or the CIA to its Central American banana fiefdom was a principal company asset."[20]

Along with United Fruit, a major stakeholder in the control of Cuba was the American Mafia. When Castro ordered the Cuban casinos closed down he made himself a significant enemy of the Mafia. That U.S. foreign policy would be concerned with the interests of United Fruit is not as surprising as that the government would readily climb in bed with the Mafia. In September of 1960, a high-ranking CIA official met with Chicago mob boss Sam Giancana, his West Coast associate Johnny Roselli, and Santos Trafficante, the Florida and Havana underworld chief who had been put in jail by Castro after the takeover of the casinos. The purpose of the meeting was the planning for the murder of the Cuban leader. The Deputy Director for Plans of the CIA, Richard Bissell, thought that hiring gangsters to kill Castro was the "ultimate cover," because "there was very little chance that anything the Syndicate would try to do would be traced back" to the U.S. government.[21] It seems reasonable, however, that this was not merely operationally expedient; it was also a reflection of a mutuality of interests between the American intelligence community and the underworld. Nor was it the first time this partnership had been activated. The alliance had begun during World War II after a series of sabotage incidents on the East Coast culminated in the burning of an oceanliner, the Normandie.

"With Operation Underworld, Roosevelt made the Mafiosi all but official masters of the U.S. East Coast docks and gave implicit protection to their activities everywhere. With his instructions to Patton in 1943, he restored the Mafia to power in Sicily. When he sent Lansky to Batista in 1944, he paved the way for the spread of Syndicate influence throughout the Caribbean and Central America."[22]

The same month that the CIA and Mafia resumed their unholy partnership, this time planning for the assassination of a sovereign head of state, Castro publicly labeled the U.S. activities against his country as subversive and warlike. In a speech before the United Nations in September of 1960, he railed against the international criminality being practiced by the U.S.:

"The government of the United States considers it has the right to promote and encourage subversion in our country. The government of the United States is promoting the organization of subversive movements against the revolutionary government of Cuba.... Does this mean, by chance, that the Cuban government has the right to promote subversion in the United States?"[23]

Castro seems to have been beset by the strange notion that what goes around comes around, turn about is fair play, and some kind of equitable treatment between nations is to be expected. His statements consistently reflect a resistance to the kind of one-sidedness presumed by the United States. Given that legitimacy in international relations involves certain standards and codes of conduct, Castro's expectations may have been legitimate, but misplaced. It was Castro's rejection of the U.S. military double standard in the hemisphere, which assumes Latin America weakness and North American strength, that encouraged him to form an army which could later beat off the Bay of Pigs invasion.

That same summer, Soviet Premier Khrushchev announced that "the Monroe Doctrine has outlived its time, has outlived itself, has died, so to say, a natural death." Reflecting Nietzsche's views on the state of stale, obsolete constructions, the Russian continued, "Now the remains of this doctrine should best be buried as every dead body is so that it should not poison the air by its decay." Noting that the doctrine may have been reasonable in its day, he noted that now it belonged to,

"... the imperialists of the United States of America, the colonialists, who, like vultures, snatch the last crumb out of the mouths of the dying children and old folk just to wax fat and rich. And it is through the Monroe Doctrine that they want to assure themselves the right to go on with this robbery forever."[24]

The representation that Castro posed a Communist threat to the U.S. was demonstrably in place long before any supporting facts were to emerge. The New York Times' reporter, Herbert L. Matthews, had come under attack for his sympathetic coverage long before Castro announced that he was a Communist that "almost brought on a nuclear war." The newspaper reported public demonstrations "protesting editorials on Cuba and editorial writings of Herbert L. Matthews in The Times, as well as information in the news columns that the protesters interpreted as favorable to Fidel Castro, and therefore to communism."[25]

During the 1960 presidential election season, the candidates found that voters considered Cuba and Castro to be the most important foreign policy issue. A big fan of Ian Fleming's James Bond spy thrillers, Kennedy asked the novelist at a dinner party what should be done about Castro. Fleming responded that since Latinos cared primarily about money, religion and sex, the best way to handle the Cuban would be to humiliate him. This suggestion would later be operationalized during the Kennedy administration.

Never one to turn away from political advantage, Kennedy accused the Republicans of permitting "a Communist menace" to emerge "only eight jet minutes from Florida." He continued, "We must make clear our intention not to let the Soviet Union turn Cuba into its base in the Caribbean-and our intention to enforce the Monroe Doctrine." He called for more propaganda and sanctions to "quarantine" the Cuban revolution, along with more support for Cubans who opposed the Castro regime. The twisted result was that those Americans who did not support a belligerent stance toward Cuba voted for Nixon, who was desperately pushing the CIA to take action before Election Day. Those who preferred a tougher stance against Castro voted for Kennedy, who was far more ambivalent about overthrowing Castro by force.

With the transition from Eisenhower to Kennedy, there was a corresponding shift from the former's "hidden hand" approach to the latter's heroic model of leadership, so long exploited in his literary efforts. David Halberstam has written that in Kennedy's time "style became as important as substance, and on occasion more important."[26] That Kennedy recognized the public relations aspect of politics is not surprising. In this, he was only ahead of his time in the implementation of Madison Avenue methodologies. The process of constructing legitimacy involves similar marketing and packaging. Advancing previous models that relied upon historical personages as authorizing figures, Kennedy sought to promote himself as an embodiment of the heroic model. Just as it is not considered unusual that the images of great sports figures are found on boxes of cereal, political leaders package policies in the trappings of personal appeal and lofty rhetoric. Although this approach eventually gave Kennedy a hallowed place in history, his politics of personality would add a volatile element into the mix of U.S.-Cuban relations, pitting him directly against Castro's charismatic leadership.

Notes

1. William B. Breuer, Vendetta: Castro and the Kennedy Brothers, (New York: John Wiley & Sons, 1997), 26.
2. C. Wright Mills, Listen Yankee, (New York, McGraw-Hill, 1960), 186.
3. David J. Finlay, Ole R. Holsti and Richard R. Fagen, Enemies In Politics, (Chicago: Rand McNally, 1967),95.
4. Georgie Anne Geyer, Guerrilla Prince - Fidel Castro, (New York: Little, Brown & Co., 1991), 240.
5. Seymour M. Hersh, The Dark Side of Camelot, (New York: Little, Brown & Co., 1997), 162.
6. Susan Eckstein, "Contesting Castro: The United States and the Triumph of the Cuban Revolution" Political Science Quarterly, (Summer 1995 v110 n2), 335(2).
7. Donald E. Rice, The Rhetorical Uses of the Authorizing Figure. (New York: Praeger Publishers, Inc., 1992), 112.
8. Alexander M. George and William E. Simons, eds. The Limits of Coercive Diplomacy, (Boulder, CO: Westview Press, Inc, 1994), 178.
9. E. Howard Hunt, Give Us This Day, (New Rochelle, NY: Arlington House, 1973), Frontispiece.
10. Ibid., 38.
11. Ibid., Frontispiece.
12. Ibid., 24-26.
13. Thomas Powers, The Man Who Kept The Secrets: Richard Helms & The CIA, (New York: Alfed Knopf, 1979), 147.
14. Peter Wyden, The Bay of Pigs: The Untold Story, (New York: Simon & Schuster, 1979), 25.
15. E. Howard Hunt, 40.
16. Michael R. Beschloss, The Crisis Years: Kennedy and Khrushchev, 1960-1963, (New York, HarperCollings Publishers, 1991), 102.
17. Powers, 117.
18. E. Howard Hunt, 82-83.
19. Robert Smith Thompson, The Missiles of October, (New York: Simon & Schuster, 1992), 57-58.
20. Richard J. Barnet and Ronald E. Müller, Global Reach, (New York: Simon & Schuster, 1974), 57.
21. Wyden, 41.
22. Carl Oglesby, The Yankee and Cowboy War, (Kansas: Sheed Andrews and McMeel, Inc., 1976), 34.
23. Donald E. Rice, The Rhetorical Uses of the Authorizing Figure: Fidel Castro and Jose Marti, (New York: Praeger Publishers, Inc., 1992), 115.
24. Robert F. Smith, The United States and Cuba: Business and Diplomacy, 1917-1960, 1960), 100.
25. William E. Ratliff, The Selling of Fidel Castro, (New Brunswick, NJ: Transaction Inc., 1987), 4.
26. David Halberstam, The Powers That Be, (New York: Dell Publishing Co., 1979), 545.
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Right on history, that I lived in and remember. Thanks.
Tim Carroll
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 06:52 PM)
Check my memory, I think the Vienna summit was in 1961.  (If you agree the summit was in 1961, edit your post and I will edit this one to delete the reference.)
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Tim Gratz:

You were absolutely right to correct my basic, but substantive, typo, citing the Venna Summit as 1963 rather than 1961, as it should have been written. I made the correction within a few short hours, but don't see that you followed-up on your commitment to "edit this one to delete the reference," days later. It was an embarrassing and stupid mistake, as I immediately acknowledged.

Clearly I know my history well enough to remember June, 1963 as the month JFK made his last trip to Europe, where the crowds in each country went virtually berserk with idolotry for the leader of the free world, most interestingly in Berlin. As with the contrast in a few short years between the receptions received by JFK and V.P. Nixon in Venezuela, Kennedy was far more popular globally than he was in his own country, where the civil rights struggle and the residue of McCarthyistic anticommunism had his popularity ratings very low.

As for the topic of this seminar, Painting Castro Red, I will repost the following:

At the Summit in Vienna in June, 1961, "Khrushchev warned that while Castro was no Communist, 'you are well on the way to making him a good one.' The President had claimed that the United States attacked Cuba because the island threatened American security: 'Can six million people really be a threat to the mighty U.S.?' If the United States felt threatened by tiny Cuba, what was the Soviet Union to do about Turkey and Iran? 'These two countries are followers of the United States. They march in its wake, and they have U.S. bases and rockets.... If the U.S. believes that it is free to act, then what should the U.S.S.R. do?'"*

*Michael R. Beschloss, The Crisis Years, (New York: HarperCollins Publishers, 1991), 200-201.

Tim Carroll
Tim Carroll
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 01:54 AM)
Mr. Weyl's seminar demonstrates that Fidel was a student of communism since his college days.  Mr. Weyl is a wise man who knows wherof he speaks.  As you know, Mr. Weyl was once a Communist himself. 
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As I noted in Mr. Weyl's book post: "You were a communist in college 72 years ago [1932]? And then took a sharp turn to the right? I'd like to hear more about that."

Tim Carroll
Tim Gratz
QUOTE (Tim Carroll @ Dec 21 2004, 10:21 PM)
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 01:54 AM)
Mr. Weyl's seminar demonstrates that Fidel was a student of communism since his college days.  Mr. Weyl is a wise man who knows wherof he speaks.  As you know, Mr. Weyl was once a Communist himself. 
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As I noted in Mr. Weyl's book post: "You were a communist in college 72 years ago [1932]? And then took a sharp turn to the right? I'd like to hear more about that."

Tim Carroll
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Tim, as I posted in the Book Forum, many of the most dedicated anti-Communists were former Communists. As I understand it, though, Mr. Weyl was not a "far rightist"; for instance, he rejected any association with the Joihn Birch Society. I think we would both like to hear more from him personally about his political history.
Tim Carroll
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 21 2004, 02:58 PM)
QUOTE (Tim Carroll @ Dec 21 2004, 10:21 PM)
QUOTE (Tim Gratz @ Dec 18 2004, 01:54 AM)
Mr. Weyl's seminar demonstrates that Fidel was a student of communism since his college days.  Mr. Weyl is a wise man who knows wherof he speaks.  As you know, Mr. Weyl was once a Communist himself. 
*

As I noted in Mr. Weyl's book post: "You were a communist in college 72 years ago [1932]? And then took a sharp turn to the right? I'd like to hear more about that."
Tim Carroll
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Tim, as I posted in the Book Forum, many of the most dedicated anti-Communists were former Communists. As I understand it, though, Mr. Weyl was not a "far rightist"; for instance, he rejected any association with the Joihn Birch Society. I think we would both like to hear more from him personally about his political history.
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I'm not sure I agree with the original point that being a former communist evidences that regarding Castro, Mr. Weyl "knows wherof he speaks." Khrushchev was still claiming Castro not to be communist as late as June, 1961. Mr. Weyl's avatar photo certainly doesn't look like he's 90 years old.

Tim Carroll
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