David Andrews

Kirk, research Cord Meyer in the past threads of this Forum. He's been considered as a conspirator plenty of times.

In Libra, Don DeLillo speculated that Ruby owed the Mob loans on his clubs that he could never pay off. Any hints of that?

CE = counter-espionage? Why be prejudiced against CIA? There's enough mayhem to spread around the intel community.

Story features links to Keeler-period photos and stories on John Profumo and Stephen Ward. Readers unsure about relevance to JFK should check the past threads and the Spartacus network biographies online for work in this area by John Simkin and others. God save. https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/dec/05/christine-keeler-former-model-at-heart-of-profumo-affair-dies

Larry, will your Lancer 2017 talk be uploaded to YouTube at all?

Rockefellers to Harriman-Lodge-Bundy to Dulles to Helms-Phillips-Harvey-Hunt-Morales. There is room to add more influences and operatives at every level, but this is the through line of the story.

And there's the Brown Brothers-to-Sullivan Cromwell link between Harriman and Dulles, which connects upward to the Rockefellers. I doubt even Talbot thinks that Dulles originated the plot. He was just happy to carry out orders he agreed with.

If you listen to Jim DiEugenio's review of the Oswald mock trial recorded for Black Op Radio last week, there's some mention of two Klein's employees telling John Armstrong that the WC rifle/scope combination wasn't sold as a package by Klein's, or mounted by Klein's gunsmiths. The GunsAmerica article also assumes an " en-bloc clip that was found in the gun." +++ OK, the article starts out saying, " our test rifle has the original scope mount and scope found on Oswald’s as well," but later admitting that " Our scope is clearly a replica and not the same model as the Oswald scope, but it is the same power and the mount is identical " Shims as well? I think there are people on this Forum that could research and write this piece more accurately.

I'll take your first point under consideration and give it further study. As far as the Paines - whoever might have directed them later, they would have been brought in as Dulles-Bancroft associates. If they continued under other guidance, it's for the same reasons they got in. Michael was a political adventurer and something of a climber. Ruth was a blind patriot - a past thread on this forum discussed someone at CIA categorizing her as such, and she proved it with her Central America stoolie act.

John Pic is the only witness who was warned about his/her attitude during WC testimony, by Jenner, I believe. You wouldn't know from the bare testimony on the page, it's only counsel invoking military authority over serviceman Pic, and calling a recess, that puts Pic's attitude on the record. Wonder why that went down.

Thanks for the articles you post, Douglas. It is perhaps hard to summon much sympathy for the Zapruders. A lot of people suffered because of JFK's death; few profited directly.

I've said this elsewhere: don't forget that after the war, Dulles sent protege Noel Field on a liberal-politics fool's errand to Moscow, a Dulles experiment that got Field arrested and imprisoned for several years. Dulles failed to discourage Field's family from going to Moscow to plead for his release, and they ended up imprisoned also. I think David Talbot's recent book, among other sources, demonstrated that Dulles did anything but "sleepwalk" in the months after his resignation, and on the assassination weekend. Someone had to direct CIA's covert policy-making during the remainder of the Kennedy administration, and the money powers dictated that it wouldn't be the puppet McCone, nor yet the future regent Dick Helms. I believe that when Dulles snickered that "that little Kennedy" had imagined himself to be a "god" in this anti-democratic universe, Dulles was challenging and dismissing Kennedy's right to usurp the power of the true money gods of the age, and of ages past in the twentieth century, whom Dulles served more pragmatically than JFK. Dulles, who declared that no substantial body of Americans would read the Warren Report, may have felt an omniscient security in using the Paines, who would have a position to protect - and in Ruth's case, have a blind loyalty to the system that prospered her family - as handlers for the Oswalds. Dulles may have felt also that the Paines were the most trustworthy and obedient operatives under these circumstances. Perhaps he also looked at Michael Paine as another Noel Field - worthy of being used and duped because of his suspect political stance, and in the end disposable if he caused any friction. It is telling that as soon as Dulles could no longer physically rule, his long-suffering wife threw a party in their home while he languished upstairs in his own filth and developing pneumonia, until the guests sensed something was amiss and forced open the locked bedroom door to get him to the hospital. I wonder how Clover Dulles was repaid for giving him his comeuppance -- nobody has researched that. The Oswalds, the Paines, the Dulleses (and Allen's siblings), the Kennedys, even the Fieldses -- players in a behind-the-scenes tragedy of families, high and low.

I was wondering if Robert said anything about Marguerite's protests in the years after the assassination, given the Jean Stafford book on Marguerite, her Mark Lane involvement and the news articles about it, and the decades of anti-WCR documentaries and press.

B. A., when I try to open either link (book or CD) in any browser, all I get is a blank New Tab. Any alternatives?

What was Robert's response to Marguerite (or "Marguerite") claiming that Lee was an intelligence agent?

It would be interesting to analyze which names and powers would be on and off this board a decade before and a decade after. A study of power and its conduits.

No more good men going down, please.

Thanks, Ron and Tom.

Ron Ecker, is your Albert Osborne article available online at all? The links above are dead. THANKS

More chunky-gooey-nutty press on the movie: https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/nov/27/spielberg-the-post-pentagon-papers-trump

Reminds me a bit of the Ricky White/Roscoe White thing. Makes me wonder if the White family saw this...

Dick Russell wrote that Richard Case Nagell said that he had gotten Oswald to mail-order the revolver from Seaport Traders under the auspices of participating in Senator Dodd's gun control program, FWIW.

Tom Hume was kind enough to direct me to this info on a previous thread. See the entry for curtjester1 if the link takes you to a choice of posts: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.assassination.jfk/Y08uda_h65c "In the late 1940's and early 1950's millions of surplus military rifles and pistols were imported into the United States, and Canada and sold to sports enthusiasts. The S&W pistol take from Oswald on November 22 was imported from Europe by Empire Wholesale Sporting Goods, Ltd., 300 Craig Street West, Montreal 1, Quebec, Canada. Canadian law exempted wholesalers of surplus firearms from keeping a record of the serial numbers of weapons that were exported from Canada. U.S. Law, however, required that importers record the serial numbers of all weapons imported into the country. "On October 19, 1962 George Rose & Company (aka Seaport Traders), 1221 S. Grand Avenue, Los Angeles, placed an order for 500 pistols from Empire. The guns were sent from Montreal to Century Arms, Inc. of St. Albany, Vermont and then re-shipped to George Rose & Company in Los Angeles on January 3, 1963. (The .38 Smith & Wesson revolver allegedly used to kill Officer J.D. Tippit and a Mannlicher-Carcano rifle (SN 2766) were shipped from Empire Wholesale Sporting Goods to Century Arms. The pistol was re-shipped to George Rose & Company in Los Angeles while the Italian rifle was shipped to Aldens in Chicago)."

Indeed, some of CIA's cryptonyms seem too apt or too humorous to be machine generated. So is DECANTER someone who drank a lot? Or talked a lot? descant 1 a : a melody or counterpoint sung above the plainsong of the tenor 2 : discourse or comment on a theme

Does anyone know what the crypts GPIDEAL and GPFLOOR stand for?