Jump to content
The Education Forum
  • Announcements

    • Evan Burton


      We have 5 requirements for registration: 1.Sign up with your real name. (This will be your Username) 2.A valid email address 3.Your agreement to the Terms of Use, seen here: http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=21403. 4. Your photo for use as an avatar  5.. A brief biography. We will post these for you, and send you your password. We cannot approve membership until we receive these. If you are interested, please send an email to: edforumbusiness@outlook.com We look forward to having you as a part of the Forum! Sincerely, The Education Forum Team

David Von Pein

  • Content count

  • Joined

  • Last visited

Everything posted by David Von Pein

  1. The H&L "two schools at the same time" mystery

    Jean always hits the nail squarely on the head. I've yet to see her miss the nail. Here are a few of the miscellaneous "Common Sense" quotations (including some from Jean) that I have collected over the last several years relating to the JFK and J.D. Tippit murder cases [hundreds more can be found here].... "The argument that Oswald was the tool of a high-level conspiracy does seem plausible, until one tries to fit it into the context these theorists always leave out -- the personality and background of Lee Harvey Oswald, the individual." [...] "The reader [of pro-conspiracy books] will understand the difficulty these writers have sidestepped if he or she tries to invent a story that explains why an INNOCENT Oswald went to Irving for 'curtain rods', left his wedding ring behind the next morning, brought a package into the Depository, and so on. Because the evidence against Oswald is strong, any detailed reconstruction that argues a frame-up will inevitably sound less plausible than one that argues his guilt." [...] "The conspiracists' methods produce a surreal world. Every discrepancy is interpreted as a crack in the official stone wall through which one may glimpse the ugly truth of what happened. Behind the wall are disconnected scenes, each with its own set of conspirators. On close examination, many of these scenes evaporate." -- Jean Davison; Pages 25, 276, and 277 of "Oswald's Game" ~~~~~~~~~~ "We already knew that ["Harvey And Lee" author John] Armstrong threw out logic and reason long ago with respect to his [double Oswald] fairy tale, but at least he had his insanity to fall back on. The fairy tale loses even its “internal logic” insanity when he asserts that the CIA got someone to impersonate Marguerite who looked nothing like her. How much longer do we have to wait for Armstrong to inform us that it was a Kennedy imposter who was assassinated? For those conspiracy theorists who feel I haven’t “done justice” to Armstrong by not mentioning every matter, issue, or witness Armstrong cited in his nearly one-thousand-page book--to do so would almost take a book in itself--if justice is giving something its due, the only justice for Armstrong’s book is to put it in a trash can. Every word I wrote about this freaky book is one more word than Armstrong and his theory deserve. Here’s a book that at worst doesn’t deserve First Amendment protections (I’m being facetious) and at best is merely fun and games. And yet, Walt Brown, a serious student of the assassination, while noting a few of the book’s absurdities, gives it a positive review in his publication, JFK/Deep Politics Quarterly, saying it is “required reading.” When someone of Brown’s stature in the conspiracy community tells his readers to go out and “get the book and set aside...everything you previously read about what happened in Dealey Plaza on November 22, 1963” (JFK/Deep Politics Quarterly, April 2004, pp.3–10), he is doing nothing more than encouraging other Armstrongs to go off on similar delirious odysseys into the twilight zone." -- Vincent Bugliosi; Page 578 of "Reclaiming History" (Endnotes) ~~~~~~~~~~ "Any assassins who would have needed only Oswald fingered for the two murders on 11/22/63 must have all (to a man!) been under the influence of large quantities of hallucinogenic drugs when they decided to place a variety of different shooters throughout Dealey Plaza (and on 10th Street for Tippit's killing), as many CTers advocate. And these powerful drugs they must have been on I guess must have had a crazy type of "Miracles Are Possible" effect on all of the shooters and behind-the-scenes schemers -- because only a "miracle" could have rescued such an inane multi-shooter "Patsy" plan from certain failure on that 22nd day of November back in '63." -- David Von Pein; April 7, 2006 ~~~~~~~~~~ "The only possible way for Lee Harvey Oswald to be innocent of shooting J.D. Tippit is if the following idiotic situation occurred (which nobody could possibly even begin to believe happened on November 22, 1963): Somebody other than Lee Oswald shoots Tippit with Oswald's revolver. This "non-Oswald" shooter (who looks just exactly like Lee Harvey Oswald, but really isn't him) then flees the scene of the Tippit crime, dumping four shells on the ground as he runs away. This non-Oswald shooter then meets up with the real Lee Oswald and hands off the Tippit murder weapon to LHO. Oswald then proceeds to the Texas Theater where he is arrested while in possession of the gun that somebody else used to kill Officer Tippit just 35 minutes earlier." -- David Von Pein; June 4, 2013 ~~~~~~~~~~ "When kooks look at the evidence, anything involving Oswald's culpability is "almost, but not quite". He can almost make this shot, but not quite. He can almost make it downstairs from the 6th floor in time to encounter Baker, but not quite. He can almost make it to 10th & Patton from the boardinghouse in time to shoot Tippit, but not quite. So close, but yet so far, as kooks judge things." -- Bud [Usenet Newsgroup Participant]; June 18, 2006 ~~~~~~~~~~ "Now we've got kooks claiming the unfired bullets in Oswald's pants pocket were "planted". And for what possible purpose again? Oh yes, I forgot---the patsy framers got bored and decided to plant needless and useless unfired bullets in Oswald's trousers. Incredible." -- David Von Pein; August 6, 2015 ~~~~~~~~~~ "If there is a suspicious fire, the kooks would investigate the firemen who respond, and ignore the guy with the wicked grin that smells of gasoline." -- Bud; November 22, 2007
  2. The H&L "two schools at the same time" mystery

    Everybody "cherry picks", Bernie. You (no doubt) do it. I do it. All CTers on the planet do it. All God's children do it. In fact, it SHOULD be done. Otherwise, I'd have no choice but to treat all of the junk presented by conspiracy theorists (including the rabid "H&L gang") as worthy of EQUAL consideration. (Does it count as "cherry picking" if I'm "picking" out the FACTS and the LIKELY TRUTH?)
  3. The H&L "two schools at the same time" mystery

    Bernie, Please give me your opinion as to WHY ON EARTH the cops felt ANY NEED to plant the paper bus transfer on Lee Oswald's person. (Or did they merely just SAY they "found" it in LHO's pocket, but didn't physically "plant" it on his person?) There was NO logical reason for the police to want to say that LHO rode on a bus for a few blocks on Elm Street. None whatsoever. The cab ride with Whaley could have easily sufficed for the "evil" DPD purposes. So what was the point of that ruse, Bernie? Just to play some games? Even Oswald admitted he took the bus. But he saw the need to lie about it too, right? Or you probably think LHO never said a word about taking a bus. It was FRITZ who just made that up. Correct? This kind of "IT NEVER HAPPENED" nonsense that you believe, Bernie, makes you almost as ridiculous as the H&L fantasists.
  4. The H&L "two schools at the same time" mystery

    So, Mary Bledsoe was wrong? And what about this bus transfer, Paul? You must think it's a fake, right?....
  5. When did the Coke Appear?

    Indeed, Rich.... http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2010/06/dr-pepper-talk.html
  6. When did the Coke Appear?

    Incredible. Everybody's lying except the accused assassin. Right, Mr. LeDoux? The fantasies that Internet CTers will buy into is mindboggling indeed.
  7. The H&L "two schools at the same time" mystery

    I never said that the Walker shooting proves LHO was guilty of assassinating the President. Never. But you will have to admit, Paul, that by accepting the truth of Oswald's guilt in the Walker shooting, it makes it much easier (for anyone!) to accept the notion that this same would-be murderer (who pointed his rifle at the head of someone ELSE prior to 11/22/63) could have also pointed that same rifle at the head of another political figure (JFK) in November. Correct? (How could anyone say NO to that question?) Can you answer this then, Paul?..... If Oswald was part of a "team" of assassins on 4/10/63, then why did Oswald have to TAKE A BUS to get anywhere both before and after the Walker incident? Where were his "team" members (2 or more you say?) when Lee needed some transportation? Were all of his "team" members lacking automobiles and/or driver's licenses? Or do you think Lee did get a ride from a co-conspirator to go to and from the scene of the Walker shooting? And this "ride" that he got was just never revealed or discovered? The same question, of course, needs to be asked concerning any "team" members (co-conspirators) that Oswald allegedly had on 11/22/63 as well. If he's got some HELP (of any kind), why is Oswald left to wing it on his own just after JFK was shot (via a bus, a cab, and his own two feet)? http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2010/07/hung-out-to-dry.html http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2012/12/edwin-walker-and-lee-harvey-oswald.html
  8. The H&L "two schools at the same time" mystery

    I'll just keep asking this very good question....which Jimmy will probably continue to ignore.... "...somebody please tell me why the police decided to "plant" a bullet that was so mutilated that no ballistics expert would testify that CE573 was THE EXACT BULLET that was involved in the Walker shooting?"
  9. The H&L "two schools at the same time" mystery

    Commission Exhibit Number 1 is still there, Jimmy. So is Marina's WC and HSCA testimony. And the note (CE1), btw, is definitely in OSWALD'S handwriting (in Russian). But Jim D. no doubt disputes that fact, just like he will dispute ANYTHING that points to the guilt of his favorite Patsy named Lee. Right, Jim? Sure, the Walker bullet was described as "steel jacketed" in some of the reports, but those reports DO NOT exonerate Oswald (or his Carcano). Bob Frazier's explanation that I quoted earlier makes perfect sense to me. If you disagree, so be it. (What's new there?) Also.... Since conspiracy theorists think the Walker bullet was switched to CE573 at some later time in order to paint Lee Harvey Oswald as the guilty party in the Walker attack, then can somebody please tell me why the police decided to "plant" a bullet that was so mutilated that no ballistics expert would testify that CE573 was THE EXACT BULLET that was involved in the Walker shooting? In other words, what good did it do to plant ANY bullet if the best the Patsy Framers were going to be able to say is -- CE573 is possibly a bullet fired from Lee Oswald's rifle, but it's so badly damaged, I cannot say definitely whether it is THE exact bullet or not? The very fact that the Walker bullet in evidence today (CE573) is a bullet that CANNOT be tied definitively to Oswald's rifle is a good solid indication that that particular bullet WAS CERTAINLY NOT PLANTED OR MANUFACTURED by the authorities in an effort to frame Lee Oswald for the crime. How anyone could possibly argue with the above common-sense observation is beyond me.
  10. The H&L "two schools at the same time" mystery

    Pot/Kettle alert! James DiEugenio, of course, likes to leave stuff out—such as the following items which Jim apparently thinks are totally insignificant (or just flat-out lies).... There's this testimony provided by the FBI's Robert A. Frazier regarding the color of the Walker bullet: MELVIN EISENBERG -- "Can you think of any reason why someone might have called this [CE573] a steel-jacketed bullet?" ROBERT FRAZIER -- "No, sir; except that some individuals commonly refer to rifle bullets as steel-jacketed bullets, when they actually in fact just have a copper-alloy jacket." ---------- There's also Billy Gene Norvell's identification of the Walker bullet: "On June 12, 1964, Exhibit C148 [aka CE573], a mutilated rifle slug, was shown to Billy Gene Norvell, former Dallas police officer, 1603 Darr Street, Apartment 147, Irving, Texas, by Special Agent Bardwell D. Odum, Federal Bureau of Investigation. He identified this exhibit as the same one which he had found at the residence of Major General Edwin A. Walker, Dallas, Texas, on April 10, 1963, and identified his marking on this slug." -- CE2011 DiEugenio must think either Norvell was a l-i-a-r, or the mutilated rifle slug known as "FBI Exhibit C148" was a completely different bullet from "CE573" (which it wasn't, of course; and no CTer on Earth can ever prove they were different bullets). And, of course, James D. will also just ignore all of the other evidence that proves Lee Oswald took that pot-shot at General Walker on April 10, 1963, such as: ...Commission Exhibit No. 1 (the note Lee wrote to Marina). DiEugenio must think that note is yet another "planted" item to help frame Oswald, or maybe Jimmy thinks Lee was merely worried about getting tossed in jail for jaywalking, and that's the reason Lee left that note (plus the key to their post office box) for Marina. ...Marina Oswald's Warren Commission testimony, in which she tells the world that Lee "...told me that he had shot at General Walker". Plus, Marina told us all the details about the note (CE1) as well. But that's nothing but lies being uttered by Marina Oswald, right Jim? ...Marina's HSCA testimony (excerpted below in an audio file): https://app.box.com/s/yg5l0gdy32rbkgxhqt0vom0fa6xeca32 To throw your words back at you: You really crack me up sometimes, Jimmy.
  11. The H&L "two schools at the same time" mystery

    Jim DiEugenio is so full of baloney and hot air, it's a wonder he doesn't bust wide open. Jean Davison's book, of course, won't ever receive ANY kind of praise from the type of over-the-top "fringe" conspiracy believers who populate forums like this one (aka: the Anybody But Oswald crowd). (Would you really expect such praise—or even a single positive word—from any CTer at this place? Let's get real.) But, regardless of what any CTer dishes out, Jean's book will forever be a great book, because it deals with REALITY instead of dealing constantly in cloak-and-dagger type FANTASY (which is where James DiEugenio resides most of the time). And Jean Davison certainly agrees with me when it comes to the following very critical point.... One of the biggest keys to knowing that OSWALD, HIMSELF, HAD MURDER RUNNING THROUGH HIS OWN VEINS (and wasn't merely being used as a puppet by a band of string-pullers) is the fact that Oswald---all by himself---tried to MURDER ANOTHER HUMAN BEING besides John F. Kennedy in the year 1963. That other person being General Walker, of course. And even CTers know how important the Walker shooting is to understanding Oswald's murderous character. That's why many (most?) conspiracy theorists ALSO deny the obvious truth when it comes to the Walker shooting. Because if those CTers were to ever admit the truth regarding Walker---i.e., that LHO was, in effect, a POLITICAL (LONE) ASSASSIN, in April of 1963---then those CTers would have a much harder time, it seems to me, reconciling Oswald's innocence when it comes to a SECOND political assassination that Oswald was charged with carrying out in Dealey Plaza in November of that very same year. http://www.amazon.com/DVP Book Review/"Oswald's Game"
  12. The H&L "two schools at the same time" mystery

    Looks like Lance hit a nerve. (Good.)
  13. The H&L "two schools at the same time" mystery

    Good for you, Lance! Keep reading it---all the way to the end of its 343 sterling pages....because it's really an excellent, outstanding, and fabulous book which dives into the character and personality of Lee Harvey Oswald (despite the incessant criticism that "True Believer" James DiEugenio of Los Angeles frequently heaps upon it). There are many top-notch quotable quotes to be found in Jean's book, e.g. .... http://Oswalds-Game.blogspot.com
  14. DVP's New Master Video/Audio Index

    Dallas Police Radio Tapes (Extended Version) (46 minutes).... (I got the first 40 minutes of this from the JFK Library website)....
  15. When did the Coke Appear?

    Common Sense Reprise #1.... "With respect to Vickie Adams, the ONLY thing a person needs to accept in order to have Oswald on the back stairs within one to two minutes after the President's assassination is to accept the almost certain fact that Victoria Adams was simply inaccurate in her time estimate about when she and Sandra Styles were on the back staircase. And if she's off by a mere ONE MINUTE, or even less, then her whole story unravels and it then becomes quite easy to accept the fact that Oswald used the back stairs just after shooting President Kennedy from the sixth floor." -- David Von Pein; February 2011 Common Sense Reprise #2.... "What is logical is that, in all the pandemonium, it is unlikely that we would hear shots and head for the back stairs!" -- Sandra Styles
  16. When did the Coke Appear?

    MARTIN WEIDMANN SAID: So, Dorothy Garner, who remained near the stairs on the 4th floor when Adams and Styles went down and who saw Baker and Truly come up, just somehow completely missed Oswald racing down from the 6th floor just moments after Adams and Styles started their descent? Really? DAVID VON PEIN SAID: Why in the world would anyone think Dorothy Garner had her eyes transfixed on the STAIRS every single second immediately following the President's assassination? How silly would that be, considering what had just happened outside those fourth-floor, SOUTH-SIDE windows just moments earlier? Why would she (or anyone) have kept a vigil on the staircase? Therefore, since it makes no logical sense to think that Garner (or ANYBODY ELSE) had their eyes peeled on those stairs every second, Oswald could have easily been on that 4th-floor landing for a matter of--what?--five seconds and not been seen by anyone who was on the same floor. Or do conspiracy theorists REALLY want to contend that Dorothy Garner never took her eyes off those stairs between 12:30 and 12:32 PM? That's incredibly silly to believe that's the case (even if she DID catch a glimpse of Truly and Baker).
  17. When did the Coke Appear?

    WALT CAKEBREAD SAID: It would have taken several minutes to place the rifle in position and then cover it with paper and boxes of books. DAVID VON PEIN SAID: Absolute nonsense. You make it sound like he was constructing the Pyramids. FWIW, it's my own opinion (based on LHO's clipboard being found very near this same area of the stairs and rifle) that Oswald likely pre-arranged his rifle-stashing area near the stairwell in advance of 12:30 PM. But even if he didn't pre-arrange it, Walt's theory is just more of the same over-the-top dreck that Walt always utilizes in order to keep from having to admit what the evidence so plainly shows--and that is: Walt's favorite "patsy" was, in truth, the assassin of President Kennedy -- and Oswald himself hid his own rifle in those boxes before fleeing down the nearby stairway. Simple and Occam-like. But Walt likes the "Pyramids" approach better. DAVID VON PEIN LATER SAID: "Curt Jester", in his post linked HERE, is assigning ludicrous levels of assumed perfection to things that can never be pinned down that accurately. All of these "timelines" revolving around Vickie Adams, Sandra Styles, Bill Shelley, Marrion Baker, and also Lee Harvey Oswald can only be estimated to a certain degree, and can never be micro-analyzed right down to the second....and everybody knows it (even "Curt Jester"). If Vickie Adams' timeline, which is discussed during her Warren Commission testimony HERE, is off just a TINY little bit--then Oswald can make it. That's all it takes. And yet a whole book has been written by Barry Ernest that focuses chiefly on a theory that is completely destroyed if Miss Adams is just SLIGHTLY off in her time estimate. And yet, even though most readers SHOULD realize that Ernest's whole book is based on a TIME ESTIMATE given by a witness, Ernest's book has, amazingly, received glowing reviews from the Amazon readers, averaging 4.4 stars (out of 5 maximum) at Amazon.com (through this writing on May 7, 2013). It goes to show how eager the public is to disbelieve the Warren Commission, and how eager and willing they are to base their pro-conspiracy thinking on something as flimsy as one witness' estimate of when she started down those Book Depository stairs. Kinda sad, isn't it? JEAN DAVISON SAID: I have a question for anyone who accepts Vickie Adams' time line and believes that she came downstairs before Truly & Baker had reached the freight elevator on the 1st floor. If she's right, how does her story prove that Oswald didn't come down those stairs? In the WC version, Baker spotted Oswald just after each man had reached the second floor landing. That means that while Truly & Baker were rushing up from the 1st floor to the second, Oswald would've presumably been hurrying from about the 3rd floor to the 2nd. So where were Adams and Styles during that time, according to Adams? Already outside the building! Can someone explain how her time line prevents Oswald from using those stairs? DAVID VON PEIN SAID: It doesn't prevent Oswald from using those same stairs. And that is something I have also pointed out in my posts in the past: "I'll say this regarding Vickie Adams' timeline....The more I think about this subject, the more I realize that even if Adams DID descend those stairs as quickly as she said she did, that particular scenario really does no harm whatsoever to the "Oswald Did It" conclusion. Why? Because...then Adams and Styles very likely BEAT Lee Harvey Oswald to the stairs. Hence, it's likely that Adams & Styles were always AHEAD of Oswald on their descent down the stairs. And if Adams & Styles were really THAT fast at getting to the first floor, then they could have possibly beaten Baker & Truly too, with B&T only getting on the stairs after A&S had vacated the stairwell." -- DVP; February 17, 2011 COLIN CROW SAID: Did Adams and Styles descend before or after Baker and Truly ascended? DAVID VON PEIN SAID: Conspiracy theorists are defeated either way. If Adams and Styles descended BEFORE Baker and Truly started up the stairs, then there's absolutely no reason why Lee Oswald couldn't have used those same stairs without being seen or heard by the two women. Oswald would have simply been a little BEHIND Adams/Styles. And if Adams/Styles descended AFTER Baker/Truly started up, then the girls were on the stairs AFTER all three men (Baker, Truly, and Oswald) had already used those same stairs. Why is this so complicated for so many CTers? Regardless of which way the timing falls, there's no reason under the sun to conclude that Oswald couldn't have utilized those very same stairs in the northwest corner of the Book Depository Building and yet not be seen by Vickie Adams and Sandra Styles. The conspiracy theorists who try and use "timeline" estimates provided by witnesses to positively prove that Oswald couldn't have shot President Kennedy are relying on very flimsy "proof". Especially in light of all of that OTHER stuff that Oswald left behind on the sixth floor that indicates Oswald was, indeed, up there shooting at the President with a Carcano rifle. Also.... Can any CTer explain how the alleged "real assassin" (or assassins, plural)--i.e., an alleged killer OTHER than Lee Oswald--managed to get downstairs without anyone on ANY Depository floor noticing him/them? CTers never want to face that question of "HOW DID THE REAL ASSASSINS ELUDE DETECTION?" As long as Lee Harvey Oswald can somehow be exonerated via the flimsy "timeline" analysis, most CTers are happy. And to hell with the question I just asked above. TOM SCULLY SAID: Question for David von Pein [sic].... Do you think the time observations of the witnesses you have criticized were any less credible than Gladys Johnson claiming she first talked to OH Lee about three weeks before she said she rented a room to him on 14 Oct., and that Lee told her during that first encounter that he wanted to be near his work? What work. Or the 1:04 time fix of Earline [sic] Roberts who also stated in early December that police had arrived about thirty minutes after Oswald departed. DPD detective Potts established in his testimony that he and other officers arrived at 3:00 pm. Or that Whaley had any idea who Oswald was or what time near exact that Oswald got in or out of his cab? DAVID VON PEIN SAID: No. You're only helping to emphasize my point about "timelines". Timelines always have to be taken with a grain of salt, including each instance you mentioned above. And the Vickie Adams timeline too. Marrion Baker's timeline is more accurate because a detailed reconstruction of his movements was done by the Warren Commission. Now, perhaps such a detailed reconstruction of Victoria Adams' movements should have also been done. Obviously, quite a few CTers think that such an Adams re-creation should have been performed by the Commission. I'll leave it to others to debate whether the Commission was being deliberately deceptive by not doing such a re-creation with Miss Adams. But as far as I can recall, I have always adhered to the "Grain Of Salt" policy when discussing any "witness timeline" issues. All such times must be considered ESTIMATES. And that includes the time estimates provided by Earlene Roberts and Helen Markham and T.F. Bowley too. http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2014/07/jfk-assassination-arguments-part-743.html
  18. When did the Coke Appear?

    I'm very familiar with "The Stroud Letter", Sandy.
  19. Kennedy Videos

  20. When did the Coke Appear?

    Right. Which means, of course, that the very likely solution to this is: Styles and Adams were on the stairs AFTER Oswald, Truly, & Baker. (Unless you want to think that Adams & Styles somehow BEAT Baker & Truly to the stairs, which doesn't seem likely.) It's a pretty simple solution if you ask me---just as I wrote in 2011.... ---Quote On:--- "With respect to Vickie Adams, the ONLY thing a person needs to accept in order to have Oswald on the back stairs within one to two minutes after the President's assassination is to accept the almost certain fact that Victoria Adams was simply inaccurate in her time estimate about when she and Sandra Styles were on the back staircase. And if she's off by a mere ONE MINUTE, or even less, then her whole story unravels and it then becomes quite easy to accept the fact that Oswald used the back stairs just after shooting President Kennedy from the sixth floor. The key to pretty much knowing without a doubt that Adams and Styles were on the stairs only AFTER Lee Oswald used the same stairs is not really Oswald himself--but Roy Truly and Marrion Baker. Because if Adams was really on the stairs as early as she said she was, she would have had virtually no choice but to have seen (or heard) the two men who we know for a fact WERE on those stairs within about 60 to 75 seconds of the assassination -- Truly and Baker. Since Adams saw nobody and heard nobody, the very likely solution is that she was mistaken about her timing (which couldn't be a more common error with human beings), and she was on the stairs AFTER all three men (Oswald, Baker, and Truly) had already utilized the same stairs." -- DVP; February 14, 2011 http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/17359-new-book-on-victoria-adams-by-author-barry-ernest/?tab=comments#comment-219588
  21. When did the Coke Appear?

    Also.... The video Jim DiEugenio posted featuring Sandra Styles does NOTHING to contradict or undermine the quote I posted earlier from Sean Murphy. And Sandy Larsen's post containing additional correspondence between Murphy and Styles only tends to buttress the notion that Sandra thinks she and Adams started down the stairs LATER than what Vickie Adams has claimed, mainly due to this comment from Styles: "I only go by what seems reasonable. I can only report my personal recollections the best I can. I was easily led back then, lol. If she [Vickie Adams] said we went down immediately, I thought that must be true. If the interviewer said that was not possible due to the amount of time it took the police to get over there, I re-thought it and accepted HIS assessment. The truth may lie somewhere in between. What is logical is that, in all the pandemonium, it is unlikely that we would hear shots and head for the back stairs!" -- Sandra Styles [DVP's emphasis]
  22. When did the Coke Appear?

    But the time they left the steps to go to the concrete island doesn't really help your argument at all. You don't think it was possible for 3 measly minutes to have elapsed between the time they left the Depository steps until the time they re-entered the building? You can't be serious! Because THAT'S the key "timing" issue here---the amount of time it took Shelley and Lovelady to RE-ENTER THE BUILDING, not merely the amount of time it took the two men to START their journey to the concrete island and then to the railroad yards. And you don't DENY that they DID travel to both of those locations, correct? So how could it have taken much LESS than three minutes, Sandy? Or do you think they both just LIED about going to those locations right after shooting? Seems to me as if 3 minutes would be a minumum amount of time to do what Lovelady and Shelley always said they did. Why would you disagree with that? And once again --- How did you CONFIRM without doubt that the lady we see in the Darnell Film is Gloria C.? You don't allow for even the POSSIBILITY that it could be someone else?
  23. How the FBI lost the rifle's fingerprints

    MIKE KILROY SAID: Thanks for replying, David. .... Did Oswald have a dime on him when arrested? DAVID VON PEIN SAID: Yes, he sure did. He had three of them, in fact. (See Commission Exhibit No. 1148 for the coinage breakdown.) MIKE KILROY SAID: So you think he dropped his bag in [the] sniper's nest when he came into the building and then later put it together with a dime with the clock ticking there? DAVID VON PEIN SAID: I don't know exactly how, when, and where Lee Harvey Oswald managed to assemble his rifle within the Book Depository on 11/22/63. Nobody knows those details. Oswald took that information with him to his grave, unfortunately. But I have speculated about some of the things Oswald might have done after he got to work on November 22nd, and when he might have done them --- here. Plus, FWIW, I think it's quite possible that Oswald might have temporarily hidden his rifle package out on the loading dock of the Depository when he first got to work on 11/22. More about that here.
  24. How the FBI lost the rifle's fingerprints

    Sandy, From another discussion that took place in March 2013, I can offer up the following information regarding the palmprint that Lieutenant J.C. Day lifted off of Oswald's rifle.... JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID: In an actual court proceeding, [Dallas Police Lieutenant J.C.] Day would have been impeached by Drain and LaTona [sic] to the point that he would [have] been laughable. DAVID VON PEIN SAID: And just exactly HOW would Vince Drain and Sebastian Latona have "impeached" Lt. Carl Day of the DPD? You actually think something Drain and Latona said means that Day couldn't possibly have lifted Oswald's palmprint from the rifle on November 22? If you DO really believe that, you've taken a trip deeper into Rod Serling's T-Zone than even I had figured. I'll also add this: Anyone who thinks that J.C. Day was a [L-word] regarding the palmprint matter needs to read "Reclaiming History", starting on Page 799. A key excerpt: "Warren Commission assistant counsel Wesley Liebeler told the HSCA that in "late August or September" of 1964, he suggested questioning [DPD Lieutenant J.C.] Day further in an attempt to resolve the multitude of questions that remained surrounding the discovery of the palm print. It had occurred to Liebeler and a few other assistant counsels, as it would later to Mark Lane, that perhaps the palm print didn't come from the rifle at all. The Commission, at that time, only had Day's word for it. It wanted something stronger. But when Liebeler approached Chief Counsel J. Lee Rankin about it, he objected. "Mr. Rankin was not terribly enthusiastic about having a couple of Commission lawyers go down to Dallas and start questioning the Dallas Police Department," Liebeler told the HSCA in 1978. "Quite frankly . . . it would have raised all kinds of questions at that time as to what in the hell was going on, what are we doing going down and taking depositions from the Dallas Police Department two months after the report was supposed to be out?" But Liebeler said they realized the problem could be resolved "in another way." Several Commission assistant counsels subsequently met with FBI inspector James R. Malley, the bureau's liaison with the Commission, and FBI fingerprint expert Sebastian Latona. Liebeler asked Latona whether there was a way to prove that the lift came from the rifle. Latona reexamined the lift submitted by Lieutenant Day and noticed pits, marks, and rust spots on it that corresponded to identical areas on the underside of the rifle barrel--the very spot from which Day said the print had been lifted. J. Edgar Hoover sent a letter by courier to the Commission on September 4 to confirm this finding, along with a photograph showing the corresponding marks on the barrel and the lift. Liebeler was satisfied. Now, there was no doubt whatsoever--the palm print Day had lifted had come from Oswald's rifle." -- Vincent Bugliosi; Page 803 of "Reclaiming History" [Also See: 11 HSCA 254-255.] [Another related discussion can be found here.]