Michael Hogan Posted October 1, 2007 Share Posted October 1, 2007 Fellow members,I am an advocate for the right to freedom of speech and I, too have been on moderation until I agreed that there were certain lines concerning forum rules that we are not to cross. Many times I will still walk up to the line and look over it, but I try to have enough sense to know when enough is enough. I could go back and find some examples if need be, but as I recall - Jack has gone on to still use swear words and has called people a xxxx and in one post that I seem to recall ... Jack basically said that he wasn't about to not say what he wanted to. Do I think that the moderation thing goes a little overboard when it comes to how we address another members post - maybe? But at the same time this forum is being used by under-aged students and when it gets to where any of us feel that we are more important than the memory of JFK or rights to the students not to have to read profanities and such that accompanies them, then it is time to start considering starting one's own forum where a person needs to be over 18 to join it.... Bill Miller I've witnessed Bill Miller exchanging insults with Jack White on internet forums for well over five years. There is probably no one on this forum less qualified to offer an impartial opinion on the reasons for the recent incident which has absolutely nothing to do with Jack's use of profanity. The issue was about something else entirely. Miller's above post is irrelevant to the reasons why Jack White became subject to moderation. A few months ago I voiced disagreement with Miller's comments about Jack White (saying that it was the type of response that could cause people to lose respect for Bill Miller) and Miller's response was to make a public post indicating that he had personally seen me do something that might cause others to lose respect for me. I had no idea to what he was referring and demanded four or five times that he make the nature of his allegation public. Rather than do so, Miller said that he would send me a private email detailing his charge. Each time Miller was asked to make his allegation clear to readers of the thread he declined to do so saying that I might not want such a thing to be known. I've never opened that email. Bill Miller's invocation of the memory of President Kennedy in his judgments of Jack White's conduct on this Forum as if he somehow had more reverence than Jack is simply disgusting. I've seen him use the same tactic on others that disagreed with him. It's not about President Kennedy's memory, under-age students, or even Jack White. Miller's post seems to be more about him and his ego. His use of the word "I" eight times in an opening paragraph of four sentences indicates that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Daman Posted October 1, 2007 Share Posted October 1, 2007 (edited) There is probably no one on this forum less qualified to offer an impartial opinion on the reasons for the recent incident which has absolutely nothing to do with Jack's use of profanity. Mike ... I do believe you're forgetting Craig Lamson ... The one member here who not only makes it his personal business to disagree with almost every other member on this forum , but does it in such a way that he has turned it into his personal toilet ... His daily abuse towards Jack White and Peter Lemkin is quite disturbing , to say the least . Yet , nothing is ever done to stop or moderate him because of his friendship and similiar agenda with one of the moderators here , Evan Burton . Edited October 1, 2007 by Duane Daman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hogan Posted October 1, 2007 Share Posted October 1, 2007 There is probably no one on this forum less qualified to offer an impartial opinion on the reasons for the recent incident which has absolutely nothing to do with Jack's use of profanity. Mike ... I do believe you're forgetting Craig Lamson ... The one member here who not only makes it his personal business to disagree with almost every other member on this forum , but does it in such a way that he has turned it into his personal toilet ... His daily abuse towards Jack White and Peter Lemkin is quite disturbing , to say the least . Yet , nothing is ever done to stop or moderate him because of his friendship and similar agenda with one of the moderators here , Evan Burton . Duane, I would have preferred that you didn't take one sentence of mine out of context from that post which was directed in a different direction and use it to further your comments about Lamson. I didn't forget about anyone. When you first started posting here, I told you I liked you. I still do. But I've seen you break your own vows so many times and always blame it on being provoked. It's only my opinion, but if you were to start ignoring some people the truth wouldn't suffer a bit. In this section of this Forum, its almost always more about ego than it is the actual truth. The real battle for the truth is being waged on much bigger fronts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myra Bronstein Posted October 2, 2007 Share Posted October 2, 2007 Fellow members,I am an advocate for the right to freedom of speech and I, too have been on moderation until I agreed that there were certain lines concerning forum rules that we are not to cross. Many times I will still walk up to the line and look over it, but I try to have enough sense to know when enough is enough. I could go back and find some examples if need be, but as I recall - Jack has gone on to still use swear words and has called people a xxxx and in one post that I seem to recall ... Jack basically said that he wasn't about to not say what he wanted to. Do I think that the moderation thing goes a little overboard when it comes to how we address another members post - maybe? But at the same time this forum is being used by under-aged students and when it gets to where any of us feel that we are more important than the memory of JFK or rights to the students not to have to read profanities and such that accompanies them, then it is time to start considering starting one's own forum where a person needs to be over 18 to join it.... Bill Miller I've witnessed Bill Miller exchanging insults with Jack White on internet forums for well over five years. There is probably no one on this forum less qualified to offer an impartial opinion on the reasons for the recent incident which has absolutely nothing to do with Jack's use of profanity. The issue was about something else entirely. Miller's above post is irrelevant to the reasons why Jack White became subject to moderation. A few months ago I voiced disagreement with Miller's comments about Jack White (saying that it was the type of response that could cause people to lose respect for Bill Miller) and Miller's response was to make a public post indicating that he had personally seen me do something that might cause others to lose respect for me. I had no idea to what he was referring and demanded four or five times that he make the nature of his allegation public. Rather than do so, Miller said that he would send me a private email detailing his charge. Each time Miller was asked to make his allegation clear to readers of the thread he declined to do so saying that I might not want such a thing to be known. I've never opened that email. Bill Miller's invocation of the memory of President Kennedy in his judgments of Jack White's conduct on this Forum as if he somehow had more reverence than Jack is simply disgusting. I've seen him use the same tactic on others that disagreed with him. It's not about President Kennedy's memory, under-age students, or even Jack White. Miller's post seems to be more about him and his ego. His use of the word "I" eight times in an opening paragraph of four sentences indicates that. Oh, amen. The only thing I can add to this great post is that I can't understand why anybody would continue to suffer through Miller's posts when there is the capability to put him on "ignore." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernice Moore Posted October 2, 2007 Share Posted October 2, 2007 (edited) Halo fellow members...... I do believe it could be called the AAM desease......the "all about me's''...and of course one upmanship as another member has already mentioned.... and in other cases, hmmmmmm who knows...?? These problems also go back many years between some.......and they carry on. .......Nothing new in the research F worlds in otherwards.....as many are well aware.....but also as a member has mention, there are those out there that have set their sites on Jack White, and in the bringing of him down, and in one case. Not mentioning any names, of course, that would be bad press....but whose presence is here, went back bragging of such a few years back onto another F.......after leaving one...perhaps he did not think others were watching both ??... Don't know, didn't care, but he proved his point of what exactly he was up to...and it continues... If a moderator cannot do his or her job without becoming personally entangled in the situation, on a particular thread, then get out of the kitchen...imo..he or she should know the when to step out.......and or sign in as not being the moderator on that particular thread...and take no actions as such.. A problem mentioned by a member, in an earlier post in this thread, is that he could not log in as invisible, I no longer can either, if I wish to..... Is that a problem with settings or does it mean something I am not aware of... Like never mind, Big Brother, is Father Funckle perhaps watching.....?? Just asking.....curious, though it does not mean much one way or tother to moi..I will come and go as I do....Unless I have stepped on anyones toes to warrant such..if so, I would like the reasoning.. Thanks Brothers and Sisters, now all carry on with the meeting, and Praise be, please continue........ B...... Edited October 2, 2007 by Bernice Moore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Daman Posted October 2, 2007 Share Posted October 2, 2007 (edited) Bernice might not want to mention any names but I don't mind . I have been doing a little research on one of our beloved moderators here .... The same moderator who decided to conduct a witch hunt here against me and Jack ... The same moderator who went to his pals at the most dispicable of forums, known as Apollo Hoax , and tried to recruit members there to come here to attack Jack and me ... The same moderator who everyone here thought was such a nice , fair and honest guy... Here are just a few of his offense posts on Apollo hoax ... He goes by the name of Obviousman there ... and Evan Burton here . And I quote ... "Oh yes - Duane is far from being the sharpest knife in the draw. He runs an antique dealership IIRC from his Ed Forum bio. There was also mention of someone with the same name being busted for dope after some domestic incident with his girlfriend - I wonder if it is the same person?" ** (I am guilty of being an antiques dealer , but I never have been busted for dope ...So no , that's NOT me . ) "I do it for pretty much all the reasons previously mentioned. Sometimes a question is asked and I have to dig deep into technical reports I would normally never bother with. I pick up lots of interesting information, gain a greater appreciation. I do it to check on the person asking the questions; sometimes they are a person who has heard the misdirection of the HBs, and just need to be shown how to research the subject for themselves. I do it for the lurkers, who might otherwise just swallow the HB nonsense. I always try to stress researching the facts yourself, consulting experts (plural) in the fields where you don't have the background to make a valid judgment, checking the what people have said is actually what they did say, etc, and most importantly to try and set up experiments to verify the data you have been given. That last one is a killer for the Jack White debates; once people try to reproduce the things he says are impossible, they discover what a fraud he is. Lastly, and not to my credit, I do it because it is so easy to slap these people with a cold wet fish and make them look stupid. It's schadenfreude. 99% of the time, you are unlikely to change the mind of a "hard core" HB." "Hey - just register. They don't have any "exclusion policy". If anyone has problems with the forum, just let Craig, Len, or myself know about it. " "Straydog accuses Jay of withholding evidence from his 'fan club': http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.ph...try111797" "That's right. The ID numbers simply confirm what image he is talking about. Think about it; how can an ID number be "fake"? They are simply numbers assigned to a particular image. He also makes a deal out of GRIN numbers; I'm pretty sure that even GRIN images still give the original image number, although the GRIN server file number is different. I'm pretty sure it's that Jack is starting to suffer from senility or similar. That's not being offensive or cruel; that is an honest assessment. He is getting on in years, he's making unsupportable claims, he's being illogical, and showing signs of paranoia. I genuinely think that Jack is starting to suffer the effects of age on the mental makeup. No-one is immune, even the brightest & best can suffer from it. " "All explained here: http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.ph...911&st=120# For any of that garbage Jack calls "studies" about Apollo on the Aulis website see: http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.ph...opic=5911" "And I see Duane is already playing the victim, saying he'll be banned while actually behaving in a manner which will make his prophesy come true! Now where have I seen that behaviour before?" "I only get the occasional 'bandwidth limit' error. It's because some.. what do you call them, spammers?..... download heaps of stuff via the website, causing the site to exceed its allowance. There is a thread about it on the website somewhere. Now, if I were a woo-woo, I'd claim it's all Duane and Jack's fault, trying to prevent people watching them getting a pasting." "Keep 'em coming, folks. BTW, have alook at the new 'live one' we have on the Education Forum: http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.ph...mp;st=165" "i don't know which is Jack's most prominent feature: his obstinacy, or his ignorance. " "Now, I can't speak about Turbo or Lionking, but I do have some small experience with Duane. An example of his open mindedness (modified for comedic value, not a quote, although representaional): Duane: But NASA never gives any figures for radiation on the Moon. We can't say if they could survive. EB: Sorry, you are wrong. Here are the radiation figures from the lunar landings. Duane: Those figures are from NASA - you can't trust them. EB: Hang on; the only figures available must have been recorded by NASA, but you say NASA figures are invalid and there are no other figures so.....? Duane: I win. You lose. Thanks for playing." "I yam what I yam." .... * ( yes you certainly are ) http://apollohoax.proboards21.com/index.cg...user=obviousman .................. And I think you all get my point . I not only recommend that Jack White be uncensured , but I also recommend that Evan Burton be removed from moderator status , for "Obviousman " reasons. Edited October 2, 2007 by Duane Daman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stephen Turner Posted October 2, 2007 Share Posted October 2, 2007 I am locking this before it gets any further out of hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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