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Ashton Gray

There Was No Bullet Wound in John F. Kennedy's Throat

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For those of you who haven't yet been able to figure out what this thread is about, here is a hint: look at the top of your browser and see what it says there.

If you're still having difficulty, here it is: There Was No Bullet Wound in John F. Kennedy's Throat.

If after finding out, you still can't stay on the topic, could you at least exhibit the courtesy to go be off-topic in another forum?

Now: After 58 pages, not one person has successfully contested the simple physics—demonstrated conclusively on the first page of this thread—that prove that no bullet possibly could have entered or exited the throat of John F. Kennedy at the location of the tracheotomy.

Ashton Gray

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For those of you who haven't yet been able to figure out what this thread is about, here is a hint: look at the top of your browser and see what it says there.

If you're still having difficulty, here it is: There Was No Bullet Wound in John F. Kennedy's Throat.

If after finding out, you still can't stay on the topic, could you at least exhibit the courtesy to go be off-topic in another forum?

Now: After 58 pages, not one person has successfully contested the simple physics—demonstrated conclusively on the first page of this thread—that prove that no bullet possibly could have entered or exited the throat of John F. Kennedy at the location of the tracheotomy.

Ashton Gray

Au contraire, petit guy. We have demonstrated over and over how ridiculous your arguments are. You simply refuse to listen to reason.

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That's not what the evidence shows

What the evidence that is RELEVANT TO THIS THREAD shows is that There Was No Bullet Wound in John F. Kennedy's Throat.

It is physically impossible.

The Walker-did-it theory will turn out to be the correct one.

Great. So show us how Edwin Walker put a bullet into JFK's throat—or how Ronald McDonald put one there, for all I care—without it going through FIFTEEN LAYERS OF TIE FABRIC IN THE KNOT.

Ashton

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"5. Anybody who believes there was any kind of conspiracy involved in the murder, but believes that the conspirators HAD NOT arranged any kind of control at Parkland for the aftermath, is every bit as fall-down funny to me. In fact, having plants at Parkland was absolutely primary to any HOPE of success in pinning it all on Oswald, precisely BECAUSE of the inescapable requirement of being able to CONTROL the bullet/fragments issue and plant false "evidence." (This is another giant unmistakable fingerprint of CIA, and it isprecisely the modus operandi they used in Watergate.)"

It certainly could not have been any of the doctors at Parkland who were part of this plot.

Robert, sometimes posts here make me smile, and sometimes even make me chuckle, but few are able to make me guffaw—so congratulations on this one.

Here, after a wonderful laugh, are a few actual facts:

  1. ADMIRAL GEORGE GREGORY BURKLEY was at Parkland Hospital, by his own admission, within as little as three minutes of the arrival of JFK at Parkland hospital.
  2. ADMIRAL GEORGE GREGORY BURKLEY was already in the small Trauma Room 1 on Dr. Carrico's arrival in the room from across the hall, where Carrico had been tending to John Connally, as Dr. Carrico has testified: "Admiral Burkley, I believe was his name, the President's personal physician, was there as soon as he [JFK] got to the hospital."
  3. ADMIRAL GEORGE GREGORY BURKLEY, while in Trauma Room 1, personally "checked the President's physical condition," "viewed the President" at the "head of the table," and "saw President Kennedy's wounds at Parkland Hospital."
  4. ADMIRAL GEORGE GREGORY BURKLEY personally supplied John F. Kennedy's blood type, which happened very early on, before Nurse Henchliffe left Trauma Room 1 to go get the necessary blood, which she says was within about two minutes of JFK's actual arrival inside Trauma Room 1.
  5. ADMIRAL GEORGE GREGORY BURKLEY then was in Trauma Room 1 with Nurse Diana Bowron, who is documented as having lied about the throat wound.
  6. ADMIRAL GEORGE GREGORY BURKLEY was in Trauma Room 1 with Nurse Diana Bowron and Dr. Carrico when Kennedy's clothing was initially partially removed, including his tie, and the opening of his shirt by Dr. Carrico—at which time Carrico first observed the throat wound.
  7. ADMIRAL GEORGE GREGORY BURKLEY was in Trauma Room 1 when the cutdowns were done to start administering fluids to JFK. Jaqueline Kennedy was still outside Trauma Room 1 on a folding metal chair. Some hospital personnel felt she even was being neglected and arranged for some water for her, and asked if she would like to remove her bloodstained gloves, which she would not do.
  8. ADMIRAL GEORGE GREGORY BURKLEY was in Trauma Room 1, within arms' reach, when Malcom Perry came in and had the conversation with Dr. Carrico about the throat wound, then started the tracheotomy.
  9. ADMIRAL GEORGE GREGORY BURKLEY was in Trauma Room 1 when steroids were administered to John F. Kennedy, and in fact ordered the administration of the steroids himself, and in fact supplied the steroids to be used: SolU Cortef (spelled in evidence as Sol U Cortef). The assertion that Carrico administered steroids on his own is yet another willful and malicious falsehood designed to deceive. The source in testimony of that falsehood is Malcolm Perry himself—entered into the record under the guiding questioning of John J. McCloy himself—and the motive for the lie was to cover up the presence and activities of George Gregory Burkley inside Trauma Room 1.
  10. ADMIRAL GEORGE GREGORY BURKLEY personally went into the corridor and brought Jacqueline Kennedy into Trauma Room 1 only after the tracheotomy incision had been made—when he was damned good and ready for her to be there.
  11. ADMIRAL GEORGE GREGORY BURKLEY had become John F. Kennedy's personal physician only about four months earlier, in July 1963.
  12. DIANA BOWRON had arrived from England at Parkland hospital on 4 August 1963—less than a month after Burkley had been announced as Kennedy's personal physician.
  13. MALCOLM PERRY had returned to Parkland Hospital, after a year away in San Francisco, on or around 1 September 1963—about a month after Bowron's arrival at Parkland.
  14. DIANA BOWRON lied about the throat wound.
  15. MALCOLM PERRY made the incision that destroyed any chance of competent forensic analysis of the throat wound.
  16. DR. ROBERT MCCLELLAND testified that Perry's incistion "obliterated it [the throat wound]."
  17. DR. JAMES JOSEPH HUMES, who performed the autopsy, had no idea when he did that there had been a throat wound. The next morning he called Perry, who said, "Oh, yeah, there was a wound right in the middle of the neck by the tie, and we used that for the tracheotomy." Humes said of what Perry had done to the wound, "Well, they obliterated, literally obliterated—" And: "There was a big gaping tracheotomy wound in the anterior neck [throat]. I learned later that there had been a gunshot [sic] wound in that location, but I didn't know it. That was 99 percent of my problem."
  18. MALCOLM PERRY is the first person who told the entire world, during the press conference at Parkland, the lie that JFK had been shot in the throat from the front, which is patently impossible by all laws of physics.
  19. ADMIRAL GEORGE GREGORY BURKLEY reportedly went up, at some point, to the operating room where Connally was being worked on, and then told Secret Service agent Kellerman that Connally "still has the bullet in him." [bullet—not "fragment."]
  20. According to Connally himself, there was such a bullet—but it fell from his thigh to the floor when the medical personnel rolled him "off the stretcher and onto the examining table." That HAD to have been in the trauma room where he originally was seen by Carrico et al., not the operating room upstairs. According to Connally, a "nurse picked it [the bullet] up and slipped it into her pocket." No one has identified this nurse.
  21. MALCOLM PERRY claimed in Warren Commission testimony that "a bullet was not removed from Governor Connally's leg."
  22. ADMIRAL GEORGE GREGORY BURKLEY oversaw every aspect of the autopsy, and allowed it to be completed with NO IDENTIFICATION OR EVEN MENTION OF ANY THROAT WOUND. Humes had to change his autopsy findings AFTER talking to Perry the following morning, and getting Perry to admit that there had been a hole in JFK's throat, exactly where Perry had sliced for the tracheostomy, which had OBLITERATED the throat wound for any forensic purposes, including autopsy.
Ashton Gray

So, let's see now, Ashton. Next, are you going to tell us Burkley administered poison to JFK in Trauma Room One, via a 1/4 inch diameter needle attached to a syringe; a needle large enough to drink a milkshake through? And then, just for good measure, and with several doctors and nurses watching, Burkley's partner in crime Dr. Malcolm Perry "obliterated" the throat wound in the process of performing a tracheotomy on JFK, just to cover Burkley's tracks?

That has got to be one of the stupidest theories I have ever heard.

Well, congratulations again, then, Robert, because it's your theory, not mine. All I did was recite facts of record.

It looks like you've come up with your own theory that could fit the actual facts. I find that a vast improvement over your usual tiresome efforts to twist and cherry-pick facts to fit loopy theories. I think you may be getting somewhere. My hat's off to you. (I apologize for only having a photo that shows my hat still on.)

Ashton

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We have demonstrated over and over...

Mark Twain sagely said: "Only kings, presidents, editors, and people with tapeworms have the right to use the editorial 'we.'"

You aren't a king or a president (I hope this isn't coming as a disappointment to your reflection in the still waters)—and you sure as hell aren't an editor—so... .

Maybe you ought to get that looked into.

Ashton

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"Well, congratulations again, then, Robert, because it's your theory, not mine. All I did was recite facts of record.

It looks like you've come up with your own theory that could fit the actual facts. I find that a vast improvement over your usual tiresome efforts to twist and cherry-pick facts to fit loopy theories. I think you may be getting somewhere. My hat's off to you. (I apologize for only having a photo that shows my hat still on.)

Ashton"

No, Ashton, that is your theory. You laid it all out for us, and told us the throat and tracheal wounds were caused by insertion of poison via a 1/4 inch needle in Trauma Room One.

Unless, of course, you have the audacity to say you never posted such a thing.

(I would be trying to weasel out of it, too, if I was you)

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Should I retrieve the large bore poison needle posts you made, Ashton?

That is, if you haven't deleted them.

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That's not what the evidence shows

What the evidence that is RELEVANT TO THIS THREAD shows is that There Was No Bullet Wound in John F. Kennedy's Throat.

It is physically impossible.

The Walker-did-it theory will turn out to be the correct one.

Great. So show us how Edwin Walker put a bullet into JFK's throat—or how Ronald McDonald put one there, for all I care—without it going through FIFTEEN LAYERS OF TIE FABRIC IN THE KNOT.

Ashton

The exiting bullet did not go through the tie knot. It passed just outside the tie knot, near the bottom of the knot, and nicked the tail of the tie on its way by.

It also made a round hole exiting the throat, and left no metal traces on the shirt or tie. Care to hear how it did that? You might be surprised at the answer. :)

Edited by Robert Prudhomme

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The Walker-did-it theory will turn out to be the correct one.

Great. So show us how Edwin Walker put a bullet into JFK's throat—or how Ronald McDonald put one there, for all I care—without it going through FIFTEEN LAYERS OF TIE FABRIC IN THE KNOT.

Ashton

Well, you're right, Ashton, that my recent remarks have strayed from the theme of your thread.

As for the alleged throat-wound, I think you made your main point, which is that the Zapruder film doesn't really show JFK clutching his throat, but reacting with both fists to his chin, lapel, and so on. The fact that JFK was wearing a back-brace, which could limit his arm motions, might be related to JFK's reaction.

My only point here was that even if we take the famous frontal-neck-wound off the table, we still have a plausible JFK conspiracy with multiple shooters.

You have already agreed to that in principle, by totally rejecting the Single Bullet Theory in this tread. That's the main point, IMHO.

Thanks for your conversation.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo

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That's not what the evidence shows

What the evidence that is RELEVANT TO THIS THREAD shows is that There Was No Bullet Wound in John F. Kennedy's Throat.

It is physically impossible.

The Walker-did-it theory will turn out to be the correct one.

Great. So show us how Edwin Walker put a bullet into JFK's throat—or how Ronald McDonald put one there, for all I care—without it going through FIFTEEN LAYERS OF TIE FABRIC IN THE KNOT.

Ashton

The exiting bullet did not go through the tie knot. It passed just outside the tie knot, near the bottom of the knot, and nicked the tail of the tie on its way by.

It also made a round hole exiting the throat, and left no metal traces on the shirt or tie. Care to hear how it did that?

Not in the slightest, because it's both ridiculous and impossible.

The nick is not on the back seam-side of the tie. It is on the front. You cannot twist the tail of the tie just below the knot around 180 degrees, as you so often twist the facts to fit your twisted "theories."

BZZZZZZT! But thanks for playing.

Ashton

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As for the alleged throat-wound, I think you made your main point, which is that the Zapruder film doesn't really show JFK clutching his throat, but reacting with both fists to his chin, lapel, and so on.

I never said that JFK did anything at all with his lapel. I said that Varnell and his "cough-up-a-bullet" homey claimed that JFK had grabbed his tie with his left forefinger, and that THEY HAD MISTAKEN THE LEFT LAPEL FOR THE TIE—but JFK also DID NOT HOOK HIS LEFT LAPEL WITH HIS FOREFINGER, EITHER.

In short, they were dead wrong on every single point.

It was Varnell who then falsely claimed that I had said anything at all about JFK interacting with his lapel, based either on Varnell's inability to read what I wrote, or on his willful attempt to twist what I said. Either way he was dead wrong, and I don't really care. The video shows clearly that JFK's hands never went anywhere near his throat, his tie, OR his lapel.

I'm completely sick of the dishonesty in some people trying to rewrite me. I'm going to say it again to all concerned: IF YOU'RE GOING TO CLAIM THAT I SAID SOMETHING, QUOTE ME, DO NOT REWRITE ME!

Anybody who again tries to twist and misrepresent what I have said will go immediately and permanently into the Kook File. I had some of the people in this thread there once, but changed computers and in doing so tried to wipe the slate clean. With some of them, I won't ever make THAT mistake again. They don't change their spots.

Ashton

Edited by Ashton Gray

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That's not what the evidence shows

What the evidence that is RELEVANT TO THIS THREAD shows is that There Was No Bullet Wound in John F. Kennedy's Throat.

It is physically impossible.

The Walker-did-it theory will turn out to be the correct one.

Great. So show us how Edwin Walker put a bullet into JFK's throat—or how Ronald McDonald put one there, for all I care—without it going through FIFTEEN LAYERS OF TIE FABRIC IN THE KNOT.

Ashton

The exiting bullet did not go through the tie knot. It passed just outside the tie knot, near the bottom of the knot, and nicked the tail of the tie on its way by.

It also made a round hole exiting the throat, and left no metal traces on the shirt or tie. Care to hear how it did that?

Not in the slightest, because it's both ridiculous and impossible.

The nick is not on the back seam-side of the tie. It is on the front. You cannot twist the tail of the tie just below the knot around 180 degrees, as you so often twist the facts to fit your twisted "theories."

BZZZZZZT! But thanks for playing.

Ashton

No one ever said the nick was on the back "seam side" of the tie, my little friend. And it is not necessary to "twist the tail of the tie just below the knot around 180 degrees" in order to put a nick on the front of the tail of the tie.

Surely a smart guy such as you can figure out how the front of the tail got nicked by a bullet (or projectile) exiting JFK's shirt. It's really not that complicated, if you think about it a bit.

P.S.

Figure out how the projectile made a round exit wound in the throat yet, despite the fact it was likely not following its original straight path, and was likely "tumbling", although tumbling is not a word you would associate normally with this kind of projectile?

I've already given you and everyone else the answer to this one, though I noticed no one has had the savvy to pick up on it yet.

Edited by Robert Prudhomme

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Figure out how the projectile made a round exit wound in the throat yet, despite the fact it was likely not following its original straight path, and was likely "tumbling", although tumbling is not a word you would associate normally with this kind of projectile?

Round projectile? a ball ...shot from a musket on the knoll?

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Figure out how the projectile made a round exit wound in the throat yet, despite the fact it was likely not following its original straight path, and was likely "tumbling", although tumbling is not a word you would associate normally with this kind of projectile?

Round projectile? a ball ...shot from a musket on the knoll?

Nope. It came from behind, and was not a musket ball, although you are correct about it being round. Let's see if Ashton is smart enough to figure it out before I give the answer.

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And, as I said earlier, this "projectile" would not leave traces of metal on the tie or shirt. It would, however, leave particles of metal in the vicinity of cervical vertebrae C3/C4, just as x-ray tech Jerrol Custer told the HSCA he recalled seeing in the x-rays he saw of JFK's neck.

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