America: The worlds first post industrial state

[Terry Mauro]

Can anyone document this repeated assertion that the US shut down 42,000 factores in this decade? That seems unbelieveable, since 30,000 factories times 500 workers equals 15,000,000 workers, which seems impossible. It could be many of these factories had much less employees, like small machine shops.

http://www.economyincrisis.org/content/america-worlds-first-post-industrial-state

“All great economic empires eventually become fat and lazy and squander the great wealth that their forefathers have left them, but the pace at which America is accomplishing this is absolutely amazing,” he writes.

To illustrate his point, Snyder presents a whole host of facts “that will make you weep.”

For instance, since 2001, America has lost 42,200 factories. Roughly 75 percent of those factories employed over 500 workers.

“We are witnessing the deindustrialization of America,” he writes. “Tens of thousands of factories have left the United States in the past decade alone. Millions upon millions of manufacturing jobs have been lost in the same time period.”

In fact, the nation has lost 32 percent of its manufacturing jobs since 2000. That puts the number of American workers in the manufacturing sector at under 12 million for the first time since 1941.

http://www.businessinsider.com/24-statistics-about-the-united-states-economy-that-are-almo st-too-embarrassing-to-admit-2010-10

[John Simkin]

I saw a documentary on BBC this week on the decline of Gary, Indiana. I was amazed by the way that this place had been destroyed by the recession.

[Craig Lamson]

I saw a documentary on BBC this week on the decline of Gary, Indiana. I was amazed by the way that this place had been destroyed by the recession.

Gary was destroyed LONG before the current economic downturn. It's been a dump for decades.

[Terry Mauro]

I saw a documentary on BBC this week on the decline of Gary, Indiana. I was amazed by the way that this place had been destroyed by the recession.

Gary was destroyed LONG before the current economic downturn. It's been a dump for decades.

Intentional policy too, I might add. The same with Detroit and all the other "former" industrial centers in the USA.

Actually it's a form of warfare against the United States.

[Craig Lamson]

I saw a documentary on BBC this week on the decline of Gary, Indiana. I was amazed by the way that this place had been destroyed by the recession.

Gary was destroyed LONG before the current economic downturn. It's been a dump for decades.

Intentional policy too, I might add. The same with Detroit and all the other "former" industrial centers in the USA.

Actually it's a form of warfare against the United States.

Sheesh.....

[Terry Mauro]

I saw a documentary on BBC this week on the decline of Gary, Indiana. I was amazed by the way that this place had been destroyed by the recession.

Gary was destroyed LONG before the current economic downturn. It's been a dump for decades.

Intentional policy too, I might add. The same with Detroit and all the other "former" industrial centers in the USA.

Actually it's a form of warfare against the United States.

Sheesh.....

Awful isnt it? I am surprised you didnt attribute this contraction to "s-it happens".

Please do tell what you know about the dynamic driving our economy these past 40 years.

[Craig Lamson]

I saw a documentary on BBC this week on the decline of Gary, Indiana. I was amazed by the way that this place had been destroyed by the recession.

Gary was destroyed LONG before the current economic downturn. It's been a dump for decades.

Intentional policy too, I might add. The same with Detroit and all the other "former" industrial centers in the USA.

Actually it's a form of warfare against the United States.

Sheesh.....

Awful isnt it? I am surprised you didnt attribute this contraction to "s-it happens".

Please do tell what you know about the dynamic driving our economy these past 40 years.

Unions, governmental regulations, poor businees choices, better money to be made elsewhere....

Now I'm sure you are going to tell us the British did it....

[Steve Knight]

USA has a population of roughly 260,000,000? So 15,000,000 is about 5.7%?

That's a big chunk of people.

All those companies moving overseas for cheaper labour costs? or just crashed completely and gone?

UK is pretty much in the same boat, I think. Almost no industry left, which is a shame for the birthplace of the Industrial Revolution.

I'd have to say I think the US will replace it easier if the need arises (the Gods forbid another Pearl Harbor, but look at the US Industrial complex before and a year or so after that attack, and you'll see where I'm going). UK's going to make much more of a mess doing that, if we ever can again.

[Len Colby]

Can anyone document this repeated assertion that the US shut down 42,000 factores in this decade? That seems unbelieveable, since 30,000 factories times 500 workers equals 15,000,000 workers, which seems impossible. It could be many of these factories had much less employees, like small machine shops.

http://www.economyincrisis.org/content/america-worlds-first-post-industrial-state

“All great economic empires eventually become fat and lazy and squander the great wealth that their forefathers have left them, but the pace at which America is accomplishing this is absolutely amazing,” he writes.

To illustrate his point, Snyder presents a whole host of facts “that will make you weep.”

For instance, since 2001, America has lost 42,200 factories. Roughly 75 percent of those factories employed over 500 workers.

“We are witnessing the deindustrialization of America,” he writes. “Tens of thousands of factories have left the United States in the past decade alone. Millions upon millions of manufacturing jobs have been lost in the same time period.”

In fact, the nation has lost 32 percent of its manufacturing jobs since 2000. That puts the number of American workers in the manufacturing sector at under 12 million for the first time since 1941.

http://www.businessinsider.com/24-statistics-about-the-united-states-economy-that-are-almo st-too-embarrassing-to-admit-2010-10

You're right there's something wrong with his numbers. First he indicated about 20,000,000 industrial jobs had been lost since 2001 then that 6 million industrial jobs had been lost since 2000

Edited October 16, 2010 by Len Colby

[John Dolva]

One has to include in the picture wealth distribution, 'money' flow, market imbalance and also consider the necessity of imbalances to a capitalist economy. Nationalism serves usually the purpose of justifying division amongst the worlds wage slaves, prepping them for their masters wars that serve the purpose of destroying markets and rebuilding them, destroying infrastructure, disposing of excess labour and so on to keep market growth happening. At the moment markets are created that often are artificial such as the latest gadget and speculative formats that really have no real value .

Another factor is that a large underemployed section is more likely to scramble for economic viability, so these are merely symptoms of a repetitive cycle that capitalism must by its nature go through, ultimately it is also that which will bring about its downfall same as the first capitalist revolution in england ushered in the dictatorship of the bourgeisie and brought and end to feudalism there and kick started the industrial revolution.

[Terry Mauro]

One has to include in the picture wealth distribution, 'money' flow, market imbalance and also consider the necessity of imbalances to a capitalist economy. Nationalism serves usually the purpose of justifying division amongst the worlds wage slaves, prepping them for their masters wars that serve the purpose of destroying markets and rebuilding them, destroying infrastructure, disposing of excess labour and so on to keep market growth happening. At the moment markets are created that often are artificial such as the latest gadget and speculative formats that really have no real value .

Another factor is that a large underemployed section is more likely to scramble for economic viability, so these are merely symptoms of a repetitive cycle that capitalism must by its nature go through, ultimately it is also that which will bring about its downfall same as the first capitalist revolution in england ushered in the dictatorship of the bourgeisie and brought and end to feudalism there and kick started the industrial revolution.

Without the production of real physical wealth, there is no wealth. This includes modern infrastructure. Monetary values, financial values are all based on the production of physical wealth. Without the production of physical wealth all these financial numbers are fictitious. The quadrillion dollar derivatives market for example is completely fake, it's not real. The take down of our industrial centers in the United States since the assassination of President Kennedy has led to national bankruptcy.

$1 billion from the sale of derivatives contracts for example is not = $1 billion from steel production for example.

Edited October 16, 2010 by Terry Mauro

[John Dolva]

For the wealthy there are no national boundaries. They operate globally and various nations work forces are merely tools. Marxs' alienation of labour and labour as being the fundamental creator of real wealth while consumers of that which their wages can never match unless there is a market imbalance. Market imbalances sooner or later begs a correction. It is this time when nations square up against each other and also the reason for Marxs exhortation that working ( men, given the time ) of the world unite. Seize that which is rightly yours because you created it.

This is the class war.

edit add re JFK, the threatened end of segregation radically alteres market forces.

Another thing to consider is the less discussed prison industrial complex that thrives in the US with a practically endless supply of very low wage earners into which much manufacture has shifted, and within that swelling rank, to a large extent facilitated by the drug flood for weaponry exchange and with a heavily disproportionate black and poor prison population often with no real hope of regainng a chance to climb out of his cycle of poverty except by means that recycle them so they never again resume a position of economic viability, if they ever had one.

Edited October 16, 2010 by John Dolva

[Len Colby]

Can anyone document this repeated assertion that the US shut down 42,000 factores in this decade? That seems unbelieveable, since 30,000 factories times 500 workers equals 15,000,000 workers, which seems impossible. It could be many of these factories had much less employees, like small machine shops.

http://www.economyincrisis.org/content/america-worlds-first-post-industrial-state

“All great economic empires eventually become fat and lazy and squander the great wealth that their forefathers have left them, but the pace at which America is accomplishing this is absolutely amazing,” he writes.

To illustrate his point, Snyder presents a whole host of facts “that will make you weep.”

For instance, since 2001, America has lost 42,200 factories. Roughly 75 percent of those factories employed over 500 workers.

“We are witnessing the deindustrialization of America,” he writes. “Tens of thousands of factories have left the United States in the past decade alone. Millions upon millions of manufacturing jobs have been lost in the same time period.”

In fact, the nation has lost 32 percent of its manufacturing jobs since 2000. That puts the number of American workers in the manufacturing sector at under 12 million for the first time since 1941.

http://www.businessinsider.com/24-statistics-about-the-united-states-economy-that-are-almo st-too-embarrassing-to-admit-2010-10

You're right there's something wrong with his numbers. First he indicated about 20,000,000 industrial jobs had been lost since 2001 then that 6 million industrial jobs had been lost since 2000

This is indeed erroneous. Snyder’s math and reading skills are quite deficient. He cited an article from the John Birch Society’s American Prospect. The relevant sentence is

“Since 2001, the country has lost 42,400 factories, including 36 percent of factories that employ more than 1,000 workers (which declined from 1,479 to 947), and 38 percent of factories that employ between 500 and 999 employees (from 3,198 to 1,972)”

http://www.prospect.org/cs/articles?article=the_plight_of_american_manufacturing

But of course the 36% referred to the proportion of factories with over 1000 workers that closed not the percentage of all closed factories that employed that many people as the phrase “which declined from 1,479 to 947” should have made clear. The same goes for the phrase “38 percent of factories that employ between 500 and 999 employees”. Doing first grade math reveals that according to source 532 factories with over 1000 worker and 1226 with “between 500 and 999 employees” that comes out to a total of 1758 or just over 4% of the 42,200 factories.