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William Kelly

Oswald Arrested

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Can anyone pinpoint the first or the first few news radio or TV broadcasts out of Dallas that the President had been shot?

And also at what time - was it broadcast that Oswald had been arrested - and was a suspect in the assassination?

Thanks

BK

JFKcountercoup

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Can anyone pinpoint the first or the first few news radio or TV broadcasts out of Dallas that the President had been shot?

And also at what time - was it broadcast that Oswald had been arrested - and was a suspect in the assassination?

Thanks

BK

JFKcountercoup

Bill,

The way to pursue answers to the questions you are asking is to do a "close reading" (as our friend James Angleton would say) of both the AP "A" wire and the UPI "A" wire.

I did exactly that some decades back, obtaining copies of each, and then annotating them carefully and creating chronologies--and up until very recently, kept both the AP and UPI "A" wires handy almost as a "desk reference" to understanding the "real time chronology" (insofar as the release of public information was concerned) on this event.

I obtained my UPI wire copy by actually visiting the UPI office in New York City, where I ended up having extensive conversations with an important vice president, who knew Merriman Smith.

I don't presently remember where I obtained my AP wire from.

But I can assure you that both documents are critical to understanding the event--and the AP "B" wire is also important.

As I recall, the AP A wire is valuable because when a "fact" would change, the AP wire would actually run a "correction" (e.g., changing the floor on which the rifle was found, etc.)

At present, both of those "desk reference" items are in some storage box, but, here are the answers (both from memory, and from detailed computer notes I made years ago) to your question(s):

FIRST NEWS THAT THE PRESIDENT HAD BEEN SHOT:

UPI "A" wire:

First UPI "A" wire transmission:

Dallas, Nov. 22 (UPI) –Three shots were fired at President Kennedy’s motorcade today in downtown Dallas.

JT1234PCS

(NOTE: "1234 PCS" means "12:34 Central Standard time")

The next UPI transmission is labeled "UPI A8N DA" and is interrupted by a "FLASH" and signed off with a time stamp of 12:39 PM CST:

The first transmission (above) was the result of Merriman Smith excitedly talking to someone at the UPI Dallas office, who then typed it onto the actual teletype machine, and then pressed "send". Then came another, and that reads as follows:

UPI A8N DA

URGENT

1st Add Shots, Dallas (A7N) XXX Downtown Dallas.

No casualties were reported.

The incident occurred near the country sheriff’s office on main street, just east of an underpass leading toward the Trade Mart where the President was to MA

FLASH

FLASH

KENNEDY SERIOUSLY WOUNDED

PERHAPS SERIOUSLY

PERHAPS FATALLY BY ASSASSINS BULLET

JT 1239PCS

Then Smith commandeered a phone at Parkland, called New York, and --as I recall--some of his next transmissions were sent from New York City.

A detailed account of the goings-on at the UPI office were published in a book a few years back--"Kennedy Assassinated" by Wilborn Hampton, who was actually on the phone with Merriman Smith. (I have corresponded with Hampton, by email).

Now let's turn to the AP "A" wire. Here's the way the AP wire starts, with its very first transmission at 12:40 CST (and, as I recall, this comes from Altgens, who ran to a phone, and then to his office, but I could be in error on the details. [Gary Mack probably knows this sequence very well.])

BULLETIN

Dallas. Nov. 22 (AP) President Kennedy was shot today just his motorcade left downtown Dallas. Mrs. Kennedy jumped up and grabbed Mr. Kennedy. She cried, “Oh, No!” The motorcade sped [on?]

D 1240 PCS NM

ƒ

K

BULLETIN MATTER

Dallas-FIRST ADD KENNEDY SHOT X X X SPED ON.

AP photographer James W. Altgens said he saw blood on the President’s head.

Altgens said he heard two shots but thought someone was shooting fireworks until he saw the blood on the President.

Altgents said he saw no one with a gun.

MM 12:41 PCS A NM

In both the case of AP and UPI, the initials on the typed line specifying the time of transmission are those of the teletype operator.

* * *

You asked: "At what time was it broadcast that Oswald had been arrested (and was a suspect) in the assassination:

I made specific and detailed notes on exactly that matter--so I will now past that document right into this post:

Here's the format of the information that will now follow:

First AP Story Naming Oswald (2:35 PM CST)

Second AP Story Naming Oswald (3:22 PM CST)

(with more definite link between LHO & JFK slaying)

First UPI mention of LHO (3:46 PM CST)

(now portrayed as JFK's assassin, and linked to FPCC)

So much for "format". Now here's the paste-in (originally, in 3 column format):

Time [CST]- - - - AP/UPI- - - - - Comment

FIRST AP STORY NAMING OSWALD (2:35 PM CST)

(but not yet making definitive connection with JFK assn)

2:35 AP Dallas, Tex., Nov. 22 (AP) -- The Dallas Police Department today arrested a 24 year-old man, Lee H. Oswald, in connection with the slaying of a Dallas policeman shortly after President Kennedy was assassinated.

He was also being interrogated to see if he had any connection with the slaying of the President.

Oswald was pulled screaming and yelling from the Texas Theater in the Oak Cliff section of Dallas.

SECOND AP STORY NAMING OSWALD (3:22 PM CST)

(With more definite link between LHO & JFK slaying)

3:22 AP ((Called by AP "first lead arrest"; this is 1st AP mention of LHO))

Dallas, Nov. 22 (AP) -- A 24-year-old man who said two years ago he wanted Russian citizenship was questioned today to see whether he had any connection with the assassination of President Kennedy.

He was identified as Lee Harvey Oswald of Forth Worth. He was pulled screaming and yelling from the Texas Theater in the Oak Cliff section of Dallas shortly after a Dallas policeman was shot to death.

On Nov. 1, 1959, Oswald told the U.S. Embassy in Moscow he had applied for Soviet citizenship. He said he had been a tourist in Russia since October 13, that year.

Oswald was reported to have a Russian wife.

The Fort Worth Star-Telegram confirmed that the man held in Dallas was the same Oswald and said his mother was being taken to Dallas Police headquarters to see him.

First UPI mention of LHO (3:46 PM CST)

(now portrayed as JFK’s assassin, and linked to FPCC)

Designated: “UPI A 104/Bulletin”

((Research Note Re UPI: Although this "3:46 PM" dispatch is the first UPI mention of Oswald, it is not the first UPI mention of an arrest in the JFK case.

For that, see UPI’s 3:08 PM (CST) for completely false version of the theater arrest—but with no mention of Oswald (just a “suspect”) and with Tippit being located inside theater, shot there, and suspect being arrested there.

This UPI UPI dispatch (at 3:46 PM CST) is critical because it identifies LHO as “the prime suspect” in the JFK assassination and links him to the Fair Play for Cuba Committee.

* * *

Dallas, Nov. 22 (UPI)--Police today seized Lee H. Oswald, identified as chairman of a "Fair Play for Cuba Committee," as the prime suspect in the assassination of President Kennedy. (more)

Police said Oswald, 24, was accused in the slaying of a Dallas policeman shortly after the shooting of the President.

Police Capt. Pat Gannaway* said the suspect was an employee in the building where a rifle was found.

Gannaway said the suspect had visited Russia and was married to a Russian. This was not immediately confirmed. (More)

*Note, 8/16/06: In retrospect, it now seems clear that Gannaway, of the DPD Intelligence Division, was an important player. Note to me: remember his sitting alone with Robert Oswald, and explaining the Texas Theater arrest making plain to him that his brother had murdered a policeman (See RO’s book on this).

* * *

Please note: I have also examined the network broadcast tapes. In almost all cases, the network anchors were simply "reading the wires"--so it is the two wire services that are the primary sources when it comes to analyzing how the "Kennedy assassination story" was disseminated to the American public (and to the world).

ALSO NOTE: I did this "AP/UPI" analysis back around 1975, and spent a lot of time entering it into my computer around starting around 1998.

The key point is that both the AP and UPI "A" wire are primary sources--and better than any "secondary wire" (e.g., the "radio wire" prepared by AP for radio announcers, etc. That is a different wire service product, and is not as detailed.)

Finally, this point: the UPI executive with whom I spoke, extensively, back in 1971, had a close relationship with Merriman Smith. And based on those conversations (which focused on Smith's behavior in the years following the assassination)--I had little doubt that Merriman Smith had foreknowledge of Kennedy's assassination, and was an "asset" used by those involved in this affair to "play the story" correctly from the outset (while at the same time promoting his own career, and winning a Pulitzer prize for his 'wonderful reporting'). Remember: Smith's "three shots were fired" was transmitted on the wire at 12:34 PM, which means it went from his lips to UPI's Wilborn Hampton, who took the call; then to staff editor Don Smith, who actually wrote the copy (along with Hampton, I think); and then it was handed to teletype operator Jim Tolbert, who actually punched out the words onto perforated paper, and fed the punched paper-tape into the teletype machine, pressing "send" at 12:34 PM CST. That's rather impressive. Subsequently, Merriman Smith's son --a helicopter pilot (as I recall)--was killed in Vietnam (circa 1967); and subsequent to that, Merriman Smith committed suicide.

FYI: I also was in touch with Smith's wife (Gayley Smith) and from that I received further corroborating information that Merriman Smith had some kind of critical foreknowledge of this entire affair. (He also was friends with Admiral Calvin Galloway, the CO of Bethesda naval hospital.)

All that, of course (the Galloway/Merriman Smith relationship, and the conversations they had, as related to me by Smith's wife, Gayley) is "another story."

I hope you find this information helpful.

* * *

Bill: If you (or anyone reading this post) should obtain a nice pristine copy of either the UPI and/or AP A wire, or know where one exists, I would be very appreciative if you would let me know where that is available, and/or provide me with a copy.

IMCO ("in my considered opinion"): Understanding the chronology of both of these wire services is critical to understanding how the media was "played" on November 22, 1963.

Of course, there were probably certain other "media assets" that were utilized that day, but in this post, I have focused on the two wire services, because of the major role they played in determining the radio and TV "network coverage" that emanated from New York.

DSL

2/15/12; 6:45 PM PST

Los Angeles, California

Edited by David Lifton

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DVP:

What you have posted here is from UPI's "Broadcast News Desk" in Chicago. It is not the UPI "A" wire.

The broadcast desk fed the info from the "A" wire, with some rewrites, to its "broadcast clients."

For more on the broadcast news desk, see this link:

http://www.loyno.edu/~lorenz/jfk.html

DSL

2/16/12; 1:05 AM PST

Los Angeles, California

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Good thread thanks much fellas, for the information.if of any interest here is , it says the report from Altgens,FWIW.. but i cannot see a time, perhaps i am missing it..?? bSome may be interested in this site...thanks b

http://www.stevenkasher.com/html/artistresults.asp?artist=147&testing=true&offset=18

Edited by Bernice Moore

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After saying he heard 2 shots as quoted in Lifton's first comment, Altgents told the WC in July 1964 that he wasn't sure of how many shots he heard. The 8-month old misinformation in the media made Altgents and many more witnesses less confident about their own memories. Misinformation works, and Governments know this. The website History Matters, which in my opinion has done a terrible job keeping track of witness' accounts of the shots, claims Altgens heard 3 shots. History Matters itself quotes Altgents as vouching for two shots only in his WC commission, although again he said he wasn't sure. Where did History Matters get "3"? http://www.history-matters.com/analysis/witness/index.htm

James Altgens

OCCUPATION :

AP Photographer

LOCATION :

South Side of Elm

Front Of Limousine

SOURCE OF SHOTS :

Knoll

NUMBER OF SHOTS :

3

AP DISPATCH: November 22, 1963.

At first I though the shots came from the opposite side of the street. I ran over there to see if I could get some pictures. But it turned out to be just more confusion. . . I did not know until later where the shots came from.

DEPOSITION: July 22, 1964.

7H517

Mr. LIEBELER. Did you have any idea where the sound came from . . . ?

Mr. ALTGENS. Well, it sounded like it was coming up from behind the car from my position—I mean the first shot, and being fireworks—who counts fireworks explosions? I wasn’t keeping track of the number of pops that took place, but I could vouch for No. 1, and I can vouch for the last shot, but I cannot tell you how many shots were in between. There was not another shot fired after the President was struck in the head. That was the lst shot—that much I will say with a great degree of certainty.

Mr. LIEBELER. What makes you so certain of that, Mr. Altgens?

Mr. ALTGENS. . . . What made me almost certain that the shot came from behind was because at the time I was looking at the President, just as he was struck, it caused him to move a bit forward. . . . It knocked him just enough forward that he came right on down.

Edited by Andric Perez

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Thanks to all who answered,

And I agree with DL, that a copy of the original AP and UPI wires is a must.

I am focused on two items however, when JFK was shot was sent over the wires, and when Oswald was arrested was sent over the wires.

Also interested in when Oswald in USSR and FPCC were announced.

I believe that it was from these wire services that the Cabinet Plane learned of the assassination.

BK

JFKcountercoup

Gary Mack Notes:

Bill,

The firs tnews of the shooting to come out of Dallas was the report by Merriman Smith, which appeared on the UPI teletype wire in newsrooms around the world five minutes after the shooting.

As for Oswald being named, below is an edited note I recently sent to another researcher about this very question. Locally, WFAA and WBAP radio named Oswald at 2:43 CST. The NBC television network coverage mentioned Oswald's name at 3:23 CST. (The Sixth Floor Museum has the original WFAA radio tapes and a digital copy directly off the original WBAP tapes.)

…..here's the info about the first (Dallas-Fort Worth) radio report with Oswald's name:

16. 2:43 pm WBAP's David Daniel interrupts for word from Dallas Police of the arrest of"a 24-year-old man, Lee H. Oswald" in connection with the shooting of Dallas Police Officer J.D.Tippit. He's being questioned to see if he has any connection with JFK assassination. "Oswald was pulled screaming and yelling" from theTexas Theater in the Oak Cliff section of Dallas. After a pistol istaken from him during a scuffle, he's quoted as saying, "It's all over now."

AsI mentioned (earlier), Fort Worth radio station WBAP and Dallas radio stationWFAA both had the Oswald name at this time (Central time). The two competing stations monitored each other and I suspect WFAA had the info firstand WBAP just passed it along with out attribution.

Had WBAP come up with the info, David Daniel would have put the reporter on the air or name him or say something like, "WBAP has just been told by Dallas Police…." [i'm a former radio guy….that's how the biz works]. I haven't listened to the original WFAA tapes in years, though we have them; my memory is that it was theirreporter who first learned Oswald's name from police.

The important thing is that local news had Oswald's name before the national media…..I'll recheck another source at the house tonight.

How do I know the stations monitored each other? Take a look at this weird,unique broadcast arrangement at the time: http://boards.radio-...?topic=184316.0

Gary

Edited by William Kelly

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SECOND AP STORY NAMING OSWALD (3:22 PM CST)

(With more definite link between LHO & JFK slaying)

3:22 AP ((Called by AP "first lead arrest"; this is 1st AP mention of LHO))

Dallas, Nov. 22 (AP) -- A 24-year-old man who said two years ago he wanted Russian citizenship was questioned today to see whether he had any connection with the assassination of President Kennedy.

He was identified as Lee Harvey Oswald of Forth Worth. He was pulled screaming and yelling from the Texas Theater in the Oak Cliff section of Dallas shortly after a Dallas policeman was shot to death.

On Nov. 1, 1959, Oswald told the U.S. Embassy in Moscow he had applied for Soviet citizenship. He said he had been a tourist in Russia since October 13, that year.

Oswald was reported to have a Russian wife.

The Fort Worth Star-Telegram confirmed that the man held in Dallas was the same Oswald and said his mother was being taken to Dallas Police headquarters to see him.

Oswald's Russian connections were first reported at 3:22 PM Central time, so that's 4:22 PM Eastern time. About two and a half hours later the #3 man at the State Department, Under Secretary for Political Affairs W. Averell Harriman, arrived at the White House to tell President Johnson that the Soviets were not behind the assassination.

Surely no legitimate assessment of Soviet innocence could be made in such a short period of time -- two and a half hours! -- unless Harriman knew who did it.

To me, Harriman's appearance at the White House minutes after LBJ arrived is far more damning than anything Mac Bundy may have said on some deep-sixed AF1 radio transmissions.

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After saying he heard 2 shots as quoted in Lifton's first comment, Altgents told the WC in July 1964 that he wasn't sure of how many shots he heard. The 8-month old misinformation in the media made Altgents and many more witnesses less confident about their own memories. Misinformation works, and Governments know this. The website History Matters, which in my opinion has done a terrible job keeping track of witness' accounts of the shots, claims Altgens heard 3 shots. History Matters itself quotes Altgents as vouching for two shots only in his WC commission, although again he said he wasn't sure. Where did History Matters get "3"? http://www.history-matters.com/analysis/witness/index.htm

James Altgens

OCCUPATION :

AP Photographer

LOCATION :

South Side of Elm

Front Of Limousine

SOURCE OF SHOTS :

Knoll

NUMBER OF SHOTS :

3

AP DISPATCH: November 22, 1963.

At first I though the shots came from the opposite side of the street. I ran over there to see if I could get some pictures. But it turned out to be just more confusion. . . I did not know until later where the shots came from.

DEPOSITION: July 22, 1964.

7H517

Mr. LIEBELER. Did you have any idea where the sound came from . . . ?

Mr. ALTGENS. Well, it sounded like it was coming up from behind the car from my position—I mean the first shot, and being fireworks—who counts fireworks explosions? I wasn’t keeping track of the number of pops that took place, but I could vouch for No. 1, and I can vouch for the last shot, but I cannot tell you how many shots were in between. There was not another shot fired after the President was struck in the head. That was the lst shot—that much I will say with a great degree of certainty.

Mr. LIEBELER. What makes you so certain of that, Mr. Altgens?

Mr. ALTGENS. . . . What made me almost certain that the shot came from behind was because at the time I was looking at the President, just as he was struck, it caused him to move a bit forward. . . . It knocked him just enough forward that he came right on down.

Thanks for that video. Here Altgens again mentions two shots.

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http://spot.acorn.net/jfkplace/09/fp.back_issues/16th_Issue/misc.html

Wired

An original roll of Associated Press "wire copy" detailing breaking developments in the John F. Kennedy assassination was auctioned off for $10,000 this past March.The roll was purchased by Judi Kaller, who says she will exhibit it in her antiquities shop, located in a Macy's store in Manhattan.

The wire copy --- a press term for articles and information transmitted by telex to subscriber news organizations --- was offered for sale by 55-year-old Donald Zammit, who said he found it among his late father's personal effects.

The assassination wire copy consists of about seven feet of teletype paper.............b..

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