When Governor John Connally was wounded

[Guest Tom Scully]

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Mike,

I thought I had addressed that. .....

james.

I thought you had, too, James. BTW.... I am sure you'll will agree that anyone (including Mike Rago) is welcome to post in your thread(s) as long as they avoid redundancy, feigned confusion about your points/opinions leading into a contrived "Q&A", or a tendency to flood your thread(s) with posts which could be grouped (replying to two or more posts in the same post and avoiding the posting of the same points/opinions more than once in a short period of time).

[David Andrews]

Thanks, James - all great material for reviewing the film and rechecking assumptions. I'll be at that tonight.

[James R Gordon]

................................

Mike,

I thought I had addressed that. .....

james.

I thought you had, too, James. BTW.... I am sure you'll will agree that anyone (including Mike Rago) is welcome to post in your thread(s) as long as they avoid redundancy, feigned confusion about your points/opinions leading into a contrived "Q&A", or a tendency to flood your thread(s) with posts which could be grouped (replying to two or more posts in the same post and avoiding the posting of the same points/opinions more than once in a short period of time).

Tom,

I hope I was not an instigator of any problems.

I pulled out with Mike because I was going round in cycles and getting nowhere. I certainly had no wish to cause problems.

I certainly have no wish to stop conversation, indeed I welcome it. I know I am bucking the system and that my proposal is very left field.

I want to address all arguments against in the hope that maybe people will see, if nothing else, there is ambiguity as to when John Connally was injured.

James

[Mark Knight]

Mr. Gordon, I believe your analysis and conclusions have considerable merit. And I believe the timing of Connally's wrist wound actually IS one of the keys to understanding what happened inside the limo. I, for one, believe you may be on the right track.

[James R Gordon]

Mr. Gordon, I believe your analysis and conclusions have considerable merit. And I believe the timing of Connally's wrist wound actually IS one of the keys to understanding what happened inside the limo. I, for one, believe you may be on the right track.

Thank you Mark.

The Connally narrative is essentially the work of Gary Murr. He was unbelievably generous to give me access to his research. Having access to this kind of material, some of which people are unaware even exists, took my work to another level. Part 1 of the study, the JFK injuries I was very proud of. That has been further developed since I last posted on the issue. Part 2a is Connally and is wholly based on Gary's research. I have the appendixes and about a third of the book and I am in awe of his work.

Part 2b, the part that has just been posted was the result of collaboration with Gary. Throughout our conversations he kept commenting on Connally being wounded post Z 313. In a sense during these conversations we bullied each other. I kept telling him it would be a crime not to publish his work and he kept bullying me to look at post z312. When I looked at it I was not a supporter of such a thesis. Gary knew that, but asked that I look at it. What convinced me he was right was this stunning movement by Connally. I know it is very much left field, but I cannot find any explanation for this movement other than Connally is reacting to a shot.

What also led to this view was an important lesson Gary has taught me. He fully convinced me that the nature of the wound tells you where and when. The chest wound was inflicted at a low angle and passed through the body following the angle of the 5th rib. In order to receive such a wound Connally has to be positioned at approx 20º right of forward.. Now he is in that position post 312. And yes he is much the same position at z 230/46. As I outline below the problem with this moment, 230/46, is that it is at the beginning of the Connally turn not at the end.

I commented to Gary in a recent email I sent him something I have learnt through the conversations I have had within this and another forum. Like everyone else I believed that Z 230-246 was the point when Connally was injured. Now Connally always said that once he heard the shot he turned to his right and tried to see if he could see JFK. I don't know how at the Z 280's he never saw him. However not seeing him he decided to look over his other shoulder. The turn is interrupted by Nellie who tries to drag him out of danger. But he still continues and at around Z 315/6 he is beginning to look towards his left. Unfortunately just prior to that is the head shot.

Now the point I am making is that the narrative of the turn is still being conducted. However, many JFK researchers have forgotten that. They assume the turn has been completed by Z 230/246. That, I believe is wrong. The Z230/246 sequence is the beginning of the turn, it is not the end of it. had it been able to be completed the end of the turn would have been post Z 317. So the placing of the evidence of the shot at Z 230/246 is an error. This placement of the wound, and I am guilty as others here, is an error. By placing the wound at this time places it before Connally has even attempted to see jFK and before he decides to look in the other direction.

The conversations, as a result of releasing part 2b, now requires a part 2c. In order to substantiate my theory about the speed of Connally's movement I am going to use William Hoffman's analytical model found in Josiah Tompson's Six Seconds to verify the speed that Connally moves. If Connally's speed comes anywhere near the speed of JFK, I feel that is a major moment. Part 2c, is this analysis.

Part 3 is applying parts 1 + 2 to a 3D model.

Part 4 is looking at anomalies in the assassination.

I am hoping to present all of this in the Spring of 2013. I may be posting the other parts sometime in the future. They are not the presentation but the narrative outline.

Again thank you for your kind words.

James

Edited November 29, 2012 by James R Gordon

[Mark Wengler]

Connally is hit around 233-234 and receives his 7 wounds. I see no other explanation why his cheeks puff out and see his shoulder drops down.

Mark,

It is 5 wounds not 7.

Well if you are convinced that he received his wounds there I doubt I'll be able to change your mind.

But if he received these wounds there can you demonstrate how he achieved his wrist wound. I described that in a reply to David. I will be interested to see your explanation, because his wrist entry wound is blocked for a bullet.

James.

Here is how i see Connally got his wounds. He is hit by a different bullet that JFK. This bullet enters his back travels down hitting a rib shattering 10cm of it and exiting his chest. In some of the frames of the Z Film we see that is where Connally is holding that 10 cal hat of his that is where he gets the wrist wounds.

As to the one in the leg a good nights sleep and a clear head may help me figure that you

[Andric Perez]

Connally was hit when the lapel of his coat flipped, as a result of the bullet passing through that area. The frame is approximately 223 or 224. This shot came shortly after JFK had been wounded at approximately frame 190.

In fact, researchers inifintely at odds with each other, (Pat Speer and McAdams) both agree that a shot caused the flipping of the lapel, with the caveat that Speer believes that this bullet hit both JFK and Connally. See the following link: http://www.patspeer....le-bullet"fact"

Other Conspiracy Theories dismiss the lapel-flip-as-shot view, but I'm with Speer on that one.

Edited December 2, 2012 by Andric Perez

[Mark Wengler]

Connally was hit when the lapel of his coat flipped, as a result of the bullet passing through that area. The frame is approximately 223 or 224. This shot came shortly after JFK had been wounded at approximately frame 190.

In fact, researchers inifintely at odds with each other, (Pat Speer and McAdams) both agree that a shot caused the flipping of the lapel, with the caveat that Speer believes that this bullet hit both JFK and Connally. See the following link: http://www.patspeer....le-bullet"fact"

Other Conspiracy Theories dismiss the lapel-flip-as-shot view, but I'm with Speer on that one.

Can you explain why we see his shoulder driven down and cheeks puff up around Z Frame 233-234

[James R Gordon]

Connally was hit when the lapel of his coat flipped, as a result of the bullet passing through that area.

Other Conspiracy Theories dismiss the lapel-flip-as-shot view, but I'm with Speer on that one.

Andric

I am presently re-writing the booklet. I am aware that it is not written as well as it should have been. When I post it you will have a better understanding of my position.

However let me address you position. Ignoring the SBT, for the moment let me just focus on the Connally wounds.

Accepting that Connally received his wounds at Z223/4 then you require to be aware of the following.

First. Connally had 10cm of his fifth rib smashed.

Second. Many small fragments of bone exited his chest along with the bullet.

Third. Many small sharp fragments remained in his chest and had to be removed by Robert Shaw later.

Fourth. His right lung collapsed.

Now that was his condition after Z223/4.

So what does he do from that point onwards.

First he straightens up.

Second by Z230 having heard a shot to begins to turn to the right.

Third he twists so that by Z280ish he is facing towards JFK and Jackie.

Fourth at Z291 he begins to turn to his left and gets close to facing forward by Z312.

Now your argument is that Connally is able to do all that, as well as show no signs of distress, with 10cm of rib smashed. Most of us have had a bruised rib and know how painful that is. However that is not the case here. His rib is smashed and all around the wound are many sharp fragments that could cause further pain. In addition his right lung has collapsed and breathing will now be very difficult. Anyone who has lost the function of one of his lungs is highly unlikely to be able to do the kinds of things we sees, especially the cycle turn.

So the theory may suggest this is possible. The reality of what had happened to Connally's demonstrates that being wounded this early in the assassination is not possible. If you are right then the list of medical conditions listed above have occurred and therefore is it believable that someone wounded in that way could do all we see Connally do.

James

[Andric Perez]

Connally was hit when the lapel of his coat flipped, as a result of the bullet passing through that area. The frame is approximately 223 or 224. This shot came shortly after JFK had been wounded at approximately frame 190.

In fact, researchers inifintely at odds with each other, (Pat Speer and McAdams) both agree that a shot caused the flipping of the lapel, with the caveat that Speer believes that this bullet hit both JFK and Connally. See the following link: http://www.patspeer....le-bullet"fact"

Other Conspiracy Theories dismiss the lapel-flip-as-shot view, but I'm with Speer on that one.

Can you explain why we see his shoulder driven down and cheeks puff up around Z Frame 233-234

I would have to see the scientific opinion as of how many hundredths of a second are required for a person's cheeks to puff up following a hit to the lung. Is half a second unlikely?

[Andric Perez]

Allow me to add that according to more than one scientist, the third largest movement of Zapruder's camera, surpassed only by the fatal shot and the 190-frame shot, occurred during the following frames:

Alvarez: 220-228;

Hartmann, 227;

Scott, 226-228

All these camera-blurs occur almost immediately after the lapel event, and in the case of Alvarez' analysis, in a very small range where frames 223-224 are included. The evidence in favor of a shot at this point is robust.

The data above can be seen here: http://jfkassassination.net/russ/infojfk/jfk6/blur.htm

[James R Gordon]

Allow me to add that according to more than one scientist, the third largest movement of Zapruder's camera, surpassed only by the fatal shot and the 190-frame shot, occurred during the following frames:

Alvarez: 220-228;

Hartmann, 227;

Scott, 226-228

All these camera-blurs occur almost immediately after the lapel event, and in the case of Alvarez' analysis, in a very small range where frames 223-224 are included. The evidence in favor of a shot at this point is robust.

The data above can be seen here: http://jfkassassinat...k/jfk6/blur.htm

Andric

My point is not that there may have been a shot around the Z224 window, there may have been a shot during that period.

Whether there was a shot or not at this point is not the critical point. To support the SBT at the Z 224 window requires a person to accept that John Connally has been wounded. Nor, with regard to Connally's wounds, am I concerned with the wrist and thigh wounds - the critical wound is the chest wound.

If the SBT takes place at the Z 223/4 window then from this point onwards John Connally has suffered:

a) 20cm of his 5th rib blown away

Has suffered not just the the damage of a bullet exiting his chest but also the secondary wounding of many bone fragments exiting along with the bullet.

c) Has a right lung collapse.

Between Z224 and Z 313 he twists his body twice from a forward position to look behind and then back to look forward again.

He does so within a compartment that only allows him 6 inches between his seat and the car door as well as just over 9 inches from his seat to the compartment divider. So, in addition, the area where he undertakes this turn is very confined. There is no room for an elegant turn.

And we are expected to believe that a man who is over 6'1", who has just suffered a significant chest wound and who also has lost the use of one of his lungs, is able to make this turn twice without indicating any signs of digress.

I find that difficult to believe.

James.

Edited December 3, 2012 by James R Gordon

[James R Gordon]

I am now posting the revised Part 2b document. There was considerable criticism of version 1 on other forums and so I decided to re-think and re-draft the original version. I have deleted the previous version’s link.

The new link is as follows:-

https://www.transferbigfiles.com/f322ff42-660c-47b3-ad11-9bbbe851b93c?rid=KQhhaPOm4D7B_xjJj3LGyg2

This is a significantly larger document that deals with the issue of when John Connally was wounded in far greater detail than was the case in the earlier version. In JFK Assassination forum there was suggestions on other moments when Connally could have been injured. In this revised document I have looked in some detail at them, especially Z 230-246

I am sure there will still be debate on this issue, but I am much happier with my position in this version and how I have explained myself regarding the other windows.

Part 2b is an analysis based on Part 2a which is the document which is devoted to John Connally’s wounds and is a 42 page document. It is not being released at the moment. The essential medical information required for Part 2b is included in that document.

James.