Heavy Set, Middle-Aged Man Put in Police Car …

[Richard Hocking]

Earlier posts in this thread have referenced various individuals we should expect to see in the photographic and film record of the front of the TSBD just after the assassination, and the Dallas Police Command Post situated there. Specifically, there are references to photos of arrests and/or individuals being taken into police cars that so far, have not been located.

Here are some additional references that help to illuminate this issue.

During the Garrison Investigation, Bill Boxley and Bill Turner went to California on a mission to talk to an informant on Edgar Eugene Bradley. They ended up interviewing Carol Aydelotte, who knew Bradley well. The interview contains valuable information on Bradley, and included a section that has relevance to this thread. Below is an excerpt of a memo from Bill Turner to Garrison dated February 16, 1968

http://jfk.hood.edu/Collection/Weisberg%20Subject%20Index%20Files/T%20Disk/Turner%20William%20Weyand%20Garrison%20File/Item%2013.pdf

"... An assortment of photographs was shown to Mrs. AYDELOTTE, including the photograph of the men in front of the School Book Depository apparently under arrest following the assassination. Without hesitation, she pointed to the photograph of the lead man and said, "That's Gene BRADLEY."

Combined with Roger Craig's testimony, there are now at least two witnesses placing Edgar Eugene Bradley in front of the TSBD after the Assassination, and at least one witness who viewed a photo of that event (3 if you include Boxley and Turner).

A poster on the ReOpenKennedyCase forum has posted a timely link to an excerpt of Howard Brennan's testimony with another interesting reference to the film record in front of the TSBD.

Mr. BELIN. All right.

Will you put a mark to "G" at the end? And I believe you said that the car that you talked to the Secret Service agent in was at point "G" approximately?

Mr. BRENNAN. Right.

Mr. BELIN. Now, are these accurate or approximate locations, Mr. Brennan?

Mr. BRENNAN. Well, don't you have photographs of me talking to the Secret Service men right here?

Mr. BELIN. I don't believe so.

Mr. BRENNAN. You should have. It was on television before I got home my wife saw it.

Mr. BELIN. On television?

Mr. BRENNAN. Yes.

Mr. BELIN. At this time we do not have them.

Do you remember what station they were on television?

Mr. BRENNAN. No. But they had it. And I called I believe Mr. Lish who requested that he cut those films or get them cut of the FBI. I believe you might know about them. Somebody cut those films, because a number of times later the same films were shown, and that part was cut.

Mr. BELIN. Who would Mr. Lish be with?

Mr. BRENNAN. The FBI.

Mr. BELIN. All right.

We thank you very much for that information.

http://reopenkennedycase.forumotion.net/t388p675-prayer-man-on-the-education-forum

Earlier, Thomas Graves asked if Brennan could have mistaken Dallas Police Inspector J. Herbert Sawyer for SS agent Forrest Sorrels. We have to remember that Sawyer was in full Dallas Police Dress uniform including White hat, badges, and rank insignia on his jacket. Sorrels was in plain clothes suit.

Brennan's reference to "Mr. Lish" raises serious questions regarding supression of portions of the film that was shown on TV, featuring Secret Service and the Dallas Police interviewing the witness in front of the TSBD. We have film and photos of Brennan talking to Inspector Sawyer, but so far, none of Brennan talking to the Secret Service Agent his wife saw on TV on November 22.

Since Brennan remembered Sorrels by name, I believe there is enough here to consider the possibility that Bradley was impersonating Forrest Sorrels before Sorrels arrived at the TSBD, and that was the reason the footage was later cut from the film originally shown on TV.

Richard,

Good work!

Now,

Regarding Edgar Eugene Bradley...

According to a Tom Bethell's diary, the photo of "two men apparently under arrest" in which Mrs. Aydelotte, in December of 1967, identified Edgar Eugene Bradley, had earlier been published in the Fort Worth Star Telegram newspaper (date unspecified).

One can only hope that Mrs. Adyelotte didn't identify Bradley as the tall, sandy-haired "tramp" from one of the Three Tramp photos that were published in the Fort Worth newspaper!

I seem to remember that in one or two of those photos, the older, third "tramp" (E. Howard Hunt?, Chauncey Holt?, Gus Abrams?) was almost completely "hidden" behind the tallest "tramp," giving the impression that the policemen were escorting only two hobos, not three. I wonder if it wasn't one of these apparent "two tramp" photos in which Mrs. Aydelotte picked out her ex-friend "Gene Bradley" ?

Does anyone know of any photos of two non-tramps, "apparently under arrest" in front of the TSBD, published in the Fort Worth Star-Telegram?

--Tommy

Part of Bethell's diary from McAdams website:

[...]

6. A Fort Worth Star-Telegram photograph showing two men in front of the School Book Depository apparently under arrest following the assassination was shown to Mrs. Aydelotte. According to [bill] Turner, "Without hesitation, she pointed to the lead man and said: 'That's Gene Bradley.'"

[...]

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/bethell6.htm

Tommy,

The unspecified date that the photo was published in the Fort Worth Star Telegram newspaper is a major problem. It would not be surprising for the paper to have published dozens of photos during the end of November and through December … possible arrest suspects and witnesses in police cars who could be mistaken for suspects. What we know for certain is that Mrs. Aydelotte positively identified Bradley in one of those photos taken in front of the TSBD.

Considering age and physical characteristics, looking at the photos of Bradley, it’s difficult for me to imagine anyone confusing him with any of the tramps shown in the photos on Houston St. Neither would I describe the two younger tramps as “distinguished looking” (per Craig’s description). I can’t say it’s impossible for someone else, just that it seems improbable to me that Mrs. Aydelotte was looking at the tramp photos.

We know there are numerous other references to individuals we have not located in the photo record yet (Dougherty, Braden, Bradley, heavy set, middle-aged man, the subject arrested by Denham, and others). We know these individuals were there, and that all had encouters with police. Is it possible that the FWST newspaper published any of these photos before they were apparently extricated from the photo/film record? This option seems more plausible.

Agree with you final sentence. If the FWST has a historical, dated archive of all the photos published in that time frame, we might be able to legitimately parse a group of photos … and some of them just might be very interesting.

[James Richards]

Do we know who this guy is being led away from the TSBD?

[Thomas Graves]

Do we know who this guy is being led away from the TSBD?

James,

Could that be Arnold Rowland?

I believe Rowland is shown in The Lost JFK Tapes, starting at 24:37 on the DVD, pointing to an upper TSBD window right after the assassination and telling a reporter, "That's where the guy was. Up there." It happens very quickly because the reporter's head blocks our view, but It looks like "Rowland" is pointing towards the left (west) side of the front entrance, not the traditional "6th floor sniper's nest" window on the right (east) side. At 24:41 you can see that "Rowland" was wearing a short-sleeved white dress shirt (apparently under his sport coat) on 11/22/63.

This later youtube "interview" of the verified Rowland, outside the TSBD, clarifies the issue. He was pointing to the 6th floor window on the far west end of the building.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4y9_d9L6NOU

Cheers,

--Tommy

PS Could that be deputy sheriff Alan Sweatt accompanying the guy you are asking about in the photo you posted?

PPS At 24:44 of the DVD, I believe that the man entering the frame from the left is either Roger Craig or Bill Shelley. Roger Craig did say that he spoke with Arnold Rowland about ten minutes after the assassination.

PPPS Now I'm starting to doubt myself on this. At 24:36 of the DVD it looks like the guy I'm talking about is pointing in the direction of the traditional 6th floor "sniper's nest" window. And at 24:38 it looks like he briefly cocks his head and looks up at it, too.

Edited December 16, 2013 by Thomas Graves

[James Richards]

This is Arnold Rowland.

[Richard Hocking]

I believe the photo of the young man in the white shirt is Arnold Rowland. I have not ID'd the man in the jacket and tie on the far left of the photo. That man is in numerous photos and film in front of the TSBD.

The JFK Lost Tapes film also shows a couple being led down the street by another man. The couple look too old to be Rowland and his wife, and they are visible only from behind very briefly. There are no children with them. If I can figure out how to capture a screenshot, I will post it.

[Robert Howard]

The photo J. R. posted is part of the footage I referenced where the young man being led by the arm in civilian clothes or a plainclothes detective was seen in The Lost JFK Tapes, the angle of the camera shot was, what I can only guess was shot from the TSBD [or the helicopter?] At any rate since the angle was above and from the rear, the viewer has no way of seeing he is wearing a badge.

Regarding the earlier photo of the man in the hardhat inside the car. I was fortunate to have seen a copy of Brennan's book; in it he mentions that he was not interviewed by the FBI until later that evening, circa 7:30 pm after being questioned while in and around the front of the TSBD.

What he mentions that is the most interesting is that his steamfitter job at Wallace & Beard that was at Dealey Plaza that day consisted of "a crew" of himself and six others, including his "friend" George White. I certainly wouldn't think the George White would be George "Hunter" White, but the name association was noted.

The main thing, in my mind is I can find no record of an interview with a steamfitter named George White, which leads me to suspect he may be the very person who is taken away, in the aforementioned photo. As by Brennan's own statements, it couldn't be him. I also know that Harrison Livingstone suspected a link between "Wallace & Beard" and the estate being guarded

the day of the assassination. See DPD Harry Olsen in The Far Right & the Murder of JFK. I am one of those who thinks Livingstone and Bill Pulte came close to figuring that out.

for more on George Hunter White, see

frank olson blog

The Dance of the Railroad Men Considered

http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?absPageId=388418

Edited December 16, 2013 by Robert Howard

[James Richards]

Tommy,

This is Alan Sweatt.

James

[Richard Hocking]

The photo J. R. posted is part of the footage I referenced where the young man being led by the arm in civilian clothes or a plainclothes detective was seen in The Lost JFK Tapes, the angle of the camera shot was, what I can only guess was shot from the TSBD [or the helicopter?] At any rate since the angle was above and from the rear, the viewer has no way of seeing he is wearing a badge.

Regarding the earlier photo of the man in the hardhat inside the car. I was fortunate to have seen a copy of Brennan's book; in it he mentions that he was not interviewed by the FBI until later that evening, circa 7:30 pm after being questioned while in and around the front of the TSBD.

What he mentions that is the most interesting is that his steamfitter job at Wallace & Beard that was at Dealey Plaza that day consisted of "a crew" of himself and six others, including his "friend" George White. I certainly wouldn't think the George White would be George "Hunter" White, but the name association was noted.

The main thing, in my mind is I can find no record of an interview with a steamfitter named George White, which leads me to suspect he may be the very person who is taken away, in the aforementioned photo. As by Brennan's own statements, it couldn't be him. I also know that Harrison Livingstone suspected a link between "Wallace & Beard" and the estate being guarded

the day of the assassination. See DPD Harry Olsen in The Far Right & the Murder of JFK. I am one of those who thinks Livingstone and Bill Pulte came close to figuring that out.

for more on George Hunter White, see

george_hunter_white2.jpg

frank olson blog

The Dance of the Railroad Men Considered

http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?absPageId=388418

Robert,

I do not have Brennan's book, but in his testimony he mentions giving statements to the police and also mentions being interviewed by Forrest Sorrels. Sorrels also claims to have talked to Brennan in front of the TSBD. Later he takes both Brennan and Euins to the Sheriff's office.

Does Brennan give any more detail about his interview with Sorrels?

BTW, several photos of Sorrels have been posted in the Vince Palamara thread about Clint Hill.

[Richard Hocking]

Tommy,

This is Alan Sweatt.

James

There is a man who resembles this guy on the steps of the TSBD in several photos.

This looks like him next to Inspector J. Herbert Sawyer.

Edited December 16, 2013 by Richard Hocking

[Robert Howard]

To be honest with you, I was X-Mas shopping and saw it in a used bookstore for a hefty sum, ie jacked-up. I just skimmed through it, and was fortunate to remember what little I shared here. I would also take everything he said with a tremendous grain of salt. It was a very egocentric account of his experiences, to say the least.

[Thomas Graves]

Tommy,

This is Alan Sweatt.

James

There is a man who resembles this guy on the steps of the TSBD in several photos.

This looks like him next to Inspector J. Herbert Sawyer.

I agree, that looks like the guy in the photo James posted. Here's a screenshot of him talking with Inspector Sawyer (mostly hidden) and Buddy Walthers (I think) from 00: 24:41 of the TLJFKT (The Lost JFK Tapes) DVD by National Geographic. The young man (Arnold Rowland?) who has just pointed to a window where he saw a sniper is also partially visible in the screenshot...

(Hmmm. Still trying...)

--Tommy

Could somebody please give me some suggestions on how to upload a small version of a screenshot?

The screenshot's specs are "1366 X 768 , size = 698 KB". How can I get it down to no more than 3.4 KB, as required by this website, and have it still be in a viewable form? Does it matter what format the files for these "photos" are in? JPEG, GIF, etc? (I'm "learning" Windows 8 .......)

Thanks.

Edited December 17, 2013 by Thomas Graves

[Richard Hocking]

Tommy,

This is Alan Sweatt.

James

There is a man who resembles this guy on the steps of the TSBD in several photos.

This looks like him next to Inspector J. Herbert Sawyer.

I agree, that looks like the guy in the photo James posted. Here's a screenshot of him talking with Inspector Sawyer (mostly hidden) and Buddy Walthers (I think) from 00: 24:41 of the TLJFKT (The Lost JFK Tapes) DVD by National Geographic. The young man (Arnold Rowland?) who has just pointed to a window where he saw a sniper is also partially visible in the screenshot...

(Hmmm. Still trying...)

--Tommy

Could somebody please give me some suggestions on how to upload a small version of a screenshot?

The screenshot's specs are "1366 X 768 , size = 698 KB". How can I get it down to no more than 3.4 KB, as required by this website, and have it still be in a viewable form? Does it matter what format the files for these "photos" are in? JPEG, GIF, etc? (I'm "learning" Windows 8 .......)

Thanks.

Tommy,

My suggestion for screenshots would be to use an online photo hosting service like Photobucket. You can open a free account. That way you do not have to change the size/quality of your photo. Alternatively you can use software to create a smaller version of your jpg and decrease the resolution, but you will be creating a fuzzy photo with less detail.

Below is a link showing some photo hosting sites.

http://email.about.com/od/freeimagehostingservices/tp/Top-Free-Image-Hosting-Sites.htm

[Richard Hocking]

Do we know who this guy is being led away from the TSBD?

For a couple days, I have been digging up old threads, and viewing info on this and other forums about the photo that James posted of the young man in the short sleeve white shirt.

He appears to be young enough to be Rowland, who was 18 at that time. And like Rowland, he saw something in the upper floor window(s) of the TSBD. But there are other observations that lead me to believe this man is not Arnold Rowland as I originally thought.

In the Nix film, there is a passing view of Rowland standing with his wife on Houston Street as the limo passes. Rowland is wearing a long dark overcoat, and also is wearing glasses. Below is an excerpt of WC testimony:

Mr. BELIN. Do you remember what your husband was wearing?

Mrs. ROWLAND. He was wearing a plaid sports jacket, probably. I am not sure which sports jacket, but I think he was wearing a plaid sports jacket that was blue and had some black and grey in it.

Mr. BELIN. Was he wearing any overcoat over the sports jacket?

Mrs. ROWLAND. Oh, no; I wasn't wearing that brown coat, I don't think. I think I was wearing an olive coat. He probably had his overcoat, but it is more of a raincoat.

Mr. BELIN. Were you wearing gloves?

Mrs. ROWLAND. Yes.

Mr. BELIN. Was he wearing gloves?

Mrs. ROWLAND. Yes.

Mr. BELIN. Were you wearing a hat?

Mrs. ROWLAND. No; a scarf.

The young man in the photo posted by James Richards is wearing only a short sleeve white shirt. The sport jacket, overcoat, glasses and gloves are missing.

Also missing is Arnold's wife, Barbara Rowland. We know from their WC testimony that they were both taken to the Dallas Sheriff's Office where they were interviewed by officers. Forrest Sorrels also interviews the couple while they are in the office.

One more thing. In JFK The Lost Tapes there is a brief scene showing the back of a man and woman being escorted away from the front of the TSBD. The couple appear to be wearing attire similar to the Rowlands as they appear in the brief glimpse we see in the Nix film. Importantly, the man is still wearing his overcoat. I now believe this couple to be Arnold and Barbara Rowland.

I do not have the DVD so I currently cannot do a screenshot, but the scene is right around the 30-31 minute mark.

I am back to square one on the ID of the young man in the short sleeve white shirt.

Below is a list of people who claimed to see a Rifle, a Rifleman, or individuals in the company of a man with a weapon, on the upper floors of the TSBD:

Howard Brennan

Richard Randolph Carr

Malcolm Couch

James Crawford

Robert Edwards

Amos Euins

Ronald Fischer

Ruby Henderson

Robert H. Jackson

Arnold Rowland

Norman Similas

Carolyn Walther

James Worrel

Do any of the above meet the physical description of the man we see in the photo posted by James, and also seen in a brief clip in JFK The Lost Tapes?

[Thomas Graves]

Do we know who this guy is being led away from the TSBD?

For a couple days, I have been digging up old threads, and viewing info on this and other forums about the photo that James posted of the young man in the short sleeve white shirt.

He appears to be young enough to be Rowland, who was 18 at that time. And like Rowland, he saw something in the upper floor window(s) of the TSBD. But there are other observations that lead me to believe this man is not Arnold Rowland as I originally thought.

In the Nix film, there is a passing view of Rowland standing with his wife on Houston Street as the limo passes. Rowland is wearing a long dark overcoat, and also is wearing glasses. Below is an excerpt of WC testimony:

Mr. BELIN. Do you remember what your husband was wearing?

Mrs. ROWLAND. He was wearing a plaid sports jacket, probably. I am not sure which sports jacket, but I think he was wearing a plaid sports jacket that was blue and had some black and grey in it.

Mr. BELIN. Was he wearing any overcoat over the sports jacket?

Mrs. ROWLAND. Oh, no; I wasn't wearing that brown coat, I don't think. I think I was wearing an olive coat. He probably had his overcoat, but it is more of a raincoat.

Mr. BELIN. Were you wearing gloves?

Mrs. ROWLAND. Yes.

Mr. BELIN. Was he wearing gloves?

Mrs. ROWLAND. Yes.

Mr. BELIN. Were you wearing a hat?

Mrs. ROWLAND. No; a scarf.

The young man in the photo posted by James Richards is wearing only a short sleeve white shirt. The sport jacket, overcoat, glasses and gloves are missing.

Also missing is Arnold's wife, Barbara Rowland. We know from their WC testimony that they were both taken to the Dallas Sheriff's Office where they were interviewed by officers. Forrest Sorrels also interviews the couple while they are in the office.

One more thing. In JFK The Lost Tapes there is a brief scene showing the back of a man and woman being escorted away from the front of the TSBD. The couple appear to be wearing attire similar to the Rowlands as they appear in the brief glimpse we see in the Nix film. Importantly, the man is still wearing his overcoat. I now believe this couple to be Arnold and Barbara Rowland.

I do not have the DVD so I currently cannot do a screenshot, but the scene is right around the 30-31 minute mark.

I am back to square one on the ID of the young man in the short sleeve white shirt.

Below is a list of people who claimed to see a Rifle, a Rifleman, or individuals in the company of a man with a weapon, on the upper floors of the TSBD:

Howard Brennan

Richard Randolph Carr

Malcolm Couch

James Crawford

Robert Edwards

Amos Euins

Ronald Fischer

Ruby Henderson

Robert H. Jackson

Arnold Rowland

Norman Similas

Carolyn Walther

James Worrel

Do any of the above meet the physical description of the man we see in the photo posted by James, and also seen in a brief clip in JFK The Lost Tapes?

Excellent post, Richard, as always!

Until I set up a photobucket account (at your suggestion) and try to post some screenshots, I'll just make two little observations.

In all of the films and photos I've seen of Rowland standing with his wife on Houston as the limo passes by, it looks like he's wearing sunglasses, not "regular" prescription glasses. ( In his WC testimony Rowland was asked if he (ever) wore "glasses," and he said 'No.")

I know the guy in James' photo probably isn't Rowland, but it is possible that it is him and that he had simply taken his jacket(s) and sunglasses off after the assassination, and given them to his wife to "hold" for him as he walked off to be questioned. He might even have taken the jacket(s) off because of the excitement and the fact that it was warming up at that time of the day.

The other observation that I'd like to make it that the young man who points to an upper floor window around 24:36 in The Lost JFK Tapes DVD (while being escorted to the front entrance by a police sergeant, a reporter, and a cameraman) is also wearing a white, short sleeved, buttoned-down shirt.

Regarding the identity of the guy in James' photo and of the guy in the Lost Tapes DVD, the witnesses from your excellent list that I want to take a closer photographic "look" at are: Robert Edwards, Ronald Fischer, Robert H. Jackson, Norman Similas, and James Worrel.

A few years ago, forum member Todd W. Vaughn claimed that the guy I've been talking about (who is viewable on the DVD around 24:36) was "quite possibly" Robert Edwards. (See thread "Is This Witness Arnold Rowland", post #21.)

I just went to that post again and noticed a link to a short youtube video of the same "clip" that starts at 24:36 in the Lost JFK Tapes DVD:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuFOp02l8EI

If you look closely, you can see Inspector Sawyer in the background, and, I believe, Buddy Walthers, Alan Sweatt, and maybe even Roger Craig (or Bill Shelley??) entering the frame at the far left near the end.

Also note that the white-shirted young man appears to be pointing in the direction of the traditional sixth floor "sniper's window" at the very beginning of the video, and it looks like he briefly cocks his head and looks in that direction, too.

--Tommy

Edited December 18, 2013 by Thomas Graves

[Richard Hocking]

Do we know who this guy is being led away from the TSBD?

For a couple days, I have been digging up old threads, and viewing info on this and other forums about the photo that James posted of the young man in the short sleeve white shirt.

He appears to be young enough to be Rowland, who was 18 at that time. And like Rowland, he saw something in the upper floor window(s) of the TSBD. But there are other observations that lead me to believe this man is not Arnold Rowland as I originally thought.

In the Nix film, there is a passing view of Rowland standing with his wife on Houston Street as the limo passes. Rowland is wearing a long dark overcoat, and also is wearing glasses. Below is an excerpt of WC testimony:

Mr. BELIN. Do you remember what your husband was wearing?

Mrs. ROWLAND. He was wearing a plaid sports jacket, probably. I am not sure which sports jacket, but I think he was wearing a plaid sports jacket that was blue and had some black and grey in it.

Mr. BELIN. Was he wearing any overcoat over the sports jacket?

Mrs. ROWLAND. Oh, no; I wasn't wearing that brown coat, I don't think. I think I was wearing an olive coat. He probably had his overcoat, but it is more of a raincoat.

Mr. BELIN. Were you wearing gloves?

Mrs. ROWLAND. Yes.

Mr. BELIN. Was he wearing gloves?

Mrs. ROWLAND. Yes.

Mr. BELIN. Were you wearing a hat?

Mrs. ROWLAND. No; a scarf.

The young man in the photo posted by James Richards is wearing only a short sleeve white shirt. The sport jacket, overcoat, glasses and gloves are missing.

Also missing is Arnold's wife, Barbara Rowland. We know from their WC testimony that they were both taken to the Dallas Sheriff's Office where they were interviewed by officers. Forrest Sorrels also interviews the couple while they are in the office.

One more thing. In JFK The Lost Tapes there is a brief scene showing the back of a man and woman being escorted away from the front of the TSBD. The couple appear to be wearing attire similar to the Rowlands as they appear in the brief glimpse we see in the Nix film. Importantly, the man is still wearing his overcoat. I now believe this couple to be Arnold and Barbara Rowland.

I do not have the DVD so I currently cannot do a screenshot, but the scene is right around the 30-31 minute mark.

I am back to square one on the ID of the young man in the short sleeve white shirt.

Below is a list of people who claimed to see a Rifle, a Rifleman, or individuals in the company of a man with a weapon, on the upper floors of the TSBD:

Howard Brennan

Richard Randolph Carr

Malcolm Couch

James Crawford

Robert Edwards

Amos Euins

Ronald Fischer

Ruby Henderson

Robert H. Jackson

Arnold Rowland

Norman Similas

Carolyn Walther

James Worrel

Do any of the above meet the physical description of the man we see in the photo posted by James, and also seen in a brief clip in JFK The Lost Tapes?

Excellent post, Richard, as always!

Until I set up a photobucket account (at your suggestion) and try to post some screenshots, I'll just make two little observations.

In all of the films and photos I've seen of Rowland standing with his wife on Houston as the limo passes by, it looks like he's wearing sunglasses, not "regular" prescription glasses. ( In his WC testimony Rowland was asked if he (ever) wore "glasses," and he said 'No.")

I know the guy in James' photo probably isn't Rowland, but it is possible that it is him and that he had simply taken his jacket(s) and sunglasses off after the assassination, and given them to his wife to "hold" for him as he walked off to be questioned. He might even have taken the jacket(s) off because of the excitement and the fact that it was warming up at that time of the day.

The other observation that I'd like to make it that the young man who points to an upper floor window around 24:36 in The Lost JFK Tapes DVD (while being escorted to the front entrance by a police sergeant, a reporter, and a cameraman) is also wearing a white, short sleeved, buttoned-down shirt.

Regarding the identity of the guy in James' photo and of the guy in the Lost Tapes DVD, the witnesses from your excellent list that I want to take a closer photographic "look" at are: Robert Edwards, Ronald Fischer, Robert H. Jackson, Norman Similas, and James Worrel.

A few years ago, forum member Todd W. Vaughn claimed that the guy I've been talking about (who is viewable on the DVD around 24:36) was "quite possibly" Robert Edwards. (See thread "Is This Witness Arnold Rowland", post #21.)

I just went to that post again and noticed a link to a short youtube video of the same "clip" that starts at 24:36 in the Lost JFK Tapes DVD:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuFOp02l8EI

If you look closely, you can see Inspector Sawyer in the background, and, I believe, Buddy Walthers, Alan Sweatt, and maybe even Roger Craig (or Bill Shelley??) entering the frame at the far left near the end.

Also note that the white-shirted young man appears to be pointing in the direction of the traditional sixth floor "sniper's window" at the very beginning of the video, and it looks like he briefly cocks his head and looks in that direction, too.

--Tommy

Tommy,

Looking forward to your screenshots. BTW, in the last part of your previous post, you asked about which format to use for photos. I would suggest uploading high resolution jpeg (jpg) photos to your image hosting site account. You can then link to them without taking up any space on the Ed Forum server.

It’s possible Rowland could have taken off his glasses, overcoat and sport jacket and given them to his wife to hold.

But there is something that makes me think that did not happen. If you scan forward to the spot in the Lost JFK Tapes that is shot from the camera looking down at the crowd in front of the TSBD from above, there is a brief segment of the Deputy escorting the White-short-sleeve-shirt guy towards the intersection. Immediately following that segment, there is a street level view of Rowland and his wife being escorted towards the Sheriff’s office. He is wearing the sports jacket, and they are being escorted by a different officer. It seems improbable that he would be wearing the overcoat and Jacket on Houston, take them off for a few minutes while in front of the TSBD, and then put the jacket back on as they walked back across Houston Street.

I found a reference to another photo that might be valuable for this thread. In a review of “Biting the Elephant” by Rodger Remington, James DiEugenio references a photo in the Doubleday version of the Warren Report that shows James Worrel, Robert Jackson, Amos Euins, and Arnold Rowland. Unfortunately, I have the St. Martin’s Press version. If someone on the Ed Forum has the Doubleday version, perhaps they could scan the photo and post it.

Good spot on Roger Craig appearing fleetingly on the left side of the film segment you mentioned. I agree it looks like him rather than Bill Shelley.

If you are taking requests for screenshots, the shot of Rowland and his wife would be a nice one