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John Armstrong blasts the mail order rifle “evidence”


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But if he is saying that they knew it had a scope, then why did so many outlets still get it wrong?

Because they simply kept repeating the main $12.78 price for the rifle (without the scope) that was originally reported by Chief Curry on TV on 11/23/63. Nobody in the media took the time in those first few days to seek out what the price was WITH the scope included. Big deal.

There's no cover-up there. Just a lack of details regarding the "With Scope" price.

Again .... big deal. It's only a "big deal" to rabid conspiracy theorists like you, Jim.

Edited by David Von Pein
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But if he is saying that they knew it had a scope, then why did so many outlets still get it wrong?

Because they simply kept repeating the main $12.78 price for the rifle (without the scope) that was originally reported by Chief Curry on TV on 11/23/63. Nobody in the media took the time in those first few days to seek out what the price was WITH the scope included. Big deal.

There's no cover-up there. Just a lack of details regarding the "With Scope" price.

Again .... big deal. It's only a "big deal" to rabid conspiracy theorists like you, Jim.

Wrong again, DVP. The FBI's ignorance of the details (including COST) of the so-called assassination rifle (which Curry indicated was WITH SCOPE for $12.78) continued for NEARLY A WEEK AFTER THE ASSASSINATION. When you look at the FACTS, it's utterly AMAZING that FBI techs could analyze LHO's handwriting so quickly with absolutely nothing to go on....

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MEGATHANKS to Sandy Larsen for explaining to me the COPY IMAGE LOCATION technique here. Now I can GET STARTED!!!

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When you look at the FACTS, it's utterly AMAZING that FBI techs could analyze LHO's handwriting so quickly with absolutely nothing to go on.

What's even more "utterly AMAZING", Jim H., is that you ascribe something sinister to something so easy to figure out in a non-sinister fashion. The press just kept repeating the same incorrect price for the gun. The $12.78 figure was the number in BIG print in the Nov. '63 Klein's ads, so that's the number the media (and Curry) went with. Simple as that.

Klein%27s-Ads.png

Edited by David Von Pein
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What's even more "utterly AMAZING", Jim H., is that you ascribe something sinister to something so easy to figure out. The press just kept repeating the same INCORRECT price for the gun. The $12.78 figure was the number in BIG print in the Nov. '63 Klein's ads, so that's the number the media (and Curry) went with. Simple as that.

Klein%27s-Ads.png

Yo, DVP, thanks for posting the Kleins ads. Especially the one you CIRCLED SO BOLDLY!

That's the $12.78 "6.5 Italian Carbine" J. Edgar Hoover thought INCLUDED a SCOPE. Just look at the ad!!! Look at the picture of a rifle WITH A SCOPE above the $12.78 price! It's easy to see why J.E. Hoover was fooled. Easy to see how he made that mistake, eh?

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Jim H.,

Why do you say "J. Edgar Hoover" made the mistake regarding the $12.78 price? The PRESS and the MEDIA were spreading the "$12.78" price around. Not Hoover.

BTW, I didn't draw the circle in that ad.

Edited by David Von Pein
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Davey:

Curry, of the police said that the FBI reported that price. For a rifle with scope.

I mean you did read the article right?

OK, I see what you mean now.

But keep in mind that when Curry told the press about the $12.78 price for the rifle, the complete information concerning the $21.45 money order had not been revealed to Chief Curry yet. I believe Curry provided the $12.78 info at about 7 PM Dallas time on 11/23, while the money order was recovered at 9:35 PM EST (8:35 PM Dallas time) on 11/23. The SS and FBI knew a little earlier than that, of course, that they were looking for a MO in the amount of $21.45 (see CD87), but the DPD wouldn't necessarily have been privy to the $21.45 price until much later (assuming they were ever provided that figure by the SS or FBI, which perhaps they weren't, I don't really know).

So the press people went with the info they had available as of Curry's makeshift conference at DPD at 7:00 on Nov. 23 --- i.e., Oswald's writing was traced to the Klein's "order letter" (not the money order), with Curry telling the reporters this....

"I believe the gun was supposed to cost twelve dollars and seventy-eight cents, I believe. I believe it was advertised in some magazine for that."

http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10490#relPageId=119

Edited by David Von Pein
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Wowie Zowie, Batman, this is all just SO FUNNY!!!

In the clip offered above by Mr. Von Pein, Frank Reynolds tells America that our man “Oswald” purchased a $12.78 rifle on March 20!

But the official date of the order in the Warren Commission was March 12! That's the date on the Magic Money Order. The WC tells us Klein's had the order at its Chicago office the very next day, March 13.

The March 20 date is one of the dates the FBI put out while it was still making stuff up but hadn't gotten the story straight about the matching handwriting on the magic order form for the $12.78/$21.45/$21.95 Magic Rifle.

From John's article:

A $21.95 rifle or a $12.78 rifle ?

FBI agents had documentation from Louis Feldsott (Crescent Firearms) that showed C2766 was sold to Kleins on June 18, 1962. But the 3 FBI agents who examined Klein's microfilm for 7 hours found no documentation that related to C2766. They did, however, find documentation that showed Klein's sold a $21.95 rifle that was paid for with a postal money order issued on March 20, 1963. This date was noted on Ruth Paine's personal calendar with a hand-written 5-point "star" that she placed next to the "20th" of March. Mrs. Paine then placed a second hand-written 5-point "star" in the upper left corner of this calendar with the notation, "LHO purchase of rifle." Is it possible that on March 20, 1963 Kleins shipped a $21.95 rifle to L.H. Oswald, A.J. Hidell, or someone (Ruth Paine?) at PO Box 2915 in Dallas? Perhaps, but we may never know. The FBI found this information on the Kleins microfilm, but never released information as to the serial number, the name of the individual who purchased this rifle, nor the address to which it was shipped. We only know that a $21.95 postal money order was issued/purchased on March 20, 1963, and sent to Kleins in payment for a rifle that was similar to the one found on the 6th floor of the TSBD.

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The day after the assassination (11/23/63) the FBI advised the Secret Service and FBI informant/Dallas postal inspector Harry Holmes, that a rifle similar to that found on the 6th floor was sold by Kleins for $21.95, and was paid for with a postal money order issued on March 20, 1963 (CD 296). This information could only have come from the Klein's microfilm.

NOTE:
The FBI's failure to announce the correct price of the rifle ($21.45) on 11/23/63, after 3 FBI agents spent 7 hours reviewing Klein's microfilm, is the best indication that Oswald/Hidell's order was not on the microfilm. The only thing the 3 agents found was the sale of a rifle by Kleins that was paid for with a postal money order issued on March 20, 1963 for $21.95. We know that Crescent sold C2766 to Klein's on June 18, 1962, but we will never know if the $21.95 rifle found on the Kleins microfilm was C2766 and we will never know the name of the person who purchased this rifle.

At 10:00 AM, November 23, FBI Director J. Edgar Hoover told President Lyndon Johnson that a money order was used to pay for the rifle. The only information Hoover had at this time came from the Klein's microfilm. Therefore, Hoover was referring to the $21.95 postal money issued on March 20, 1963 in payment for a rifle from Kleins (CD 296). This information ($21.95 postal money order issued on March 20, 1963) was shared with the Secret Service and US postal inspector/FBI informant Harry Holmes on 11/23/63.

NOTE:
The FBI never provided any information as to the serial number of the $21.95 rifle, the model number of this rifle, the name of the purchaser, the location of the post office from which the $21.95 money order was purchased, or the location of where the $21.95 money order was located.

Edited by Jim Hargrove
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I feel kind of sorry for people who insist on making conspiratorial mountains out of ordinary run-of-the-mill molehills.

jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2013/04/Ruth Paine's Calendar

jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2014/12/Oswald Ordered The Rifle

jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2015/10/The Hidell Money Order

Edited by David Von Pein
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