Trump?

[Cliff Varnell]

27 minutes ago, Robert Prudhomme said:

Sounds like Republican propaganda, Doug. Plant the seed that Obama might pardon Clinton and the subconscious conclusion is drawn that she must have been guilty in the first place and, therefore, all Democrats must be guilty of something.

You folks have no idea how comical all of this is from our perspective, north of the 49th Parallel.

 

I know, I know...but don't go too hard on the Americans.

In October of 2015 Bernie Sanders said what everyone was thinking -- "People are sick of hearing about your damn e-mails!"

The e-mail onslaught continued with incredible ferocity for more than a year after that.

We were battered, an abused people.

Like torture victims who will say anything to get them to stop -- lots of Americans voted for Trump strictly out of Clinton Fatigue.

[Cliff Varnell]

2 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

Its ridiculous to blame the election on Comey. 

Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone.

Nothing empty about my snark!

[Cliff Varnell]

2 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

Its ridiculous to blame the election on Comey.  

HRC lost the Rust Belt.  Wisconsin had not gone for GOP president in something like 34 years.

http://www.jsonline.com/story/news/local/milwaukee/2016/11/10/milwaukee-elections-head-says-voter-id-law-hurt-citys-turnout/93607154/

Voter suppression, Jim.

Google it.

...I haven't seen "Game of Thrones."

I've read a little about it here and there.

Am I someone fit to write an authoritative review of "Game of Thrones"?

Of course not.

Same goes for The Donald J. Trump Show -- Starring Donald J Trump and the lovely Ivanka! (a/k/a CNN/MSNBC/FOX)

If you haven't been watching you know quad-x all about the 2016 election, Jim.

[Sandy Larsen]

4 hours ago, Cliff Varnell said:

3 take-aways from the 2016 Prez Election in order of importance:

1)

On June 16, 2015, Donald Trump announced for President and cable news -- CNN, MSNBC, and Fox -- turned into 24/7 Reality TV.

It was the Donald J. Trump Show starring Donald J. Trump featuring the lovely Ivanka.

The networks made a fortune.  They wanted this pilot show to get a 4 year run so they allowed Trump and his surrogates to constantly prevaricate unchallenged, and they obsessed on ginned up Clinton "scandals"  and harped on the horrible optics of e-mails and the Clinton Foundation.

Of course, Trump provided so many horrible optics it became a blur, a new outrage every day. 

It all came down to the last two weeks of the campaign.  If it were Trump's optics in the public eye, he loses.  If it's Clinton's optics in the public eye, she loses.

2) 

James Comey violated the Hatch Act which prevents civil servants from pernicious political activity.

Comey could have checked out every one of those e-mails in one day tops but instead he put Hillary back in the spotlight and it killed her campaign.

Accuse Comey of treason?  I wouldn't go that far except for all the other instances of Republican treason over the last 48 years.

3) 

The Republican Party declared war on the Democratic Party in 1994.  Only the Democrats didn't see it and most are in denial today.

When the GOP took control of Congress after the 1994 mid-terms they launched investigation after investigation into the Clintons.  Their goal was to generate Clinton Fatigue with non-stop accusations, charges, innuendo, smear.  Whitewater, Travelgate, Filegate, Christmascardgate, Monicagate.

It worked.  Monicagate cost Al Gore the 2000 election because a lot of old folks in Florida were mad at the Democrats over Bill's behavior.

Since 1994 Republicans have ceaselessly tried to undermine the legitimacy of Democratic Presidents.

They claimed that Obama wasn't born in the country; they blocked his agenda at every turn even when he pushed for their policies; they attempted to shut down the government every two years.

And then 8 Benghazi hearings going after Obama and Clinton over non-existent issues  The last Benghazi Committee turned up the e-mails -- and the GOP had it's "gotcha" narrative set.  Along with a compliant corporate news media, the Republicans ratcheted up the personal attacks to the point where, in the words of Bernie Sanders, "people are sick of hearing about your damn e-mails."

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/oct/13/bernie-sanders-hillary-clinton-damn-email-server

In 2016 the American people were down to the marrow of our bones sick of two things: gridlock in Washington and hearing about Clinton's damn e-mails.

They voted for Trump to get relief from both.

It took James Comey to put this voter suppression strategy over the top.

 

Spot on Cliff.

 

Edited November 12, 2016 by Sandy Larsen

[Ron Ecker]

8 hours ago, Robert Prudhomme said:

Hi Ron

I've heard about this. I've also been studying a similar case involving the GW Bush Administration, in which it seems there are 22 million emails on a private server that are unaccounted for.

http://www.newsweek.com/2016/09/23/george-w-bush-white-house-lost-22-million-emails-497373.html

Now, is this worse than Hillary's case, about the same as Hillary's case or not as bad as Hillary's case? Is Bush a "crook" too?

Very interesting. I would say that Bush is definitely a crook for violating the Presidential Records Act, to the tune of millions of emails. 

His biggest crime was the invasion of Iraq. But of course no reasonable prosecutor would indict hm. 

[Cliff Varnell]

16 minutes ago, Ron Ecker said:

Very interesting. I would say that Bush is definitely a crook for violating the Presidential Records Act, to the tune of millions of emails. 

His biggest crime was the invasion of Iraq. But of course no reasonable prosecutor would indict hm. 

Imagine if the Democrats held hearings on the Iraq War lead-up and the use of torture.

Bush/Cheney would be locked up, where they belong.

But the Democrats don't do that.

Terrible mistake.

 

[Douglas Caddy]

6 hours ago, Cliff Varnell said:

 

Hilarious!

Of course there have been news articles -- it was all part of the political assassination of Hillary Clinton.

From the Wall Street Journal Weekend Edition (Nov. 12-13, 2016):

 

Peggy Noonan writes: “But so much depends upon the immediate moment. Trump must move surely now. When you add up the votes of Mrs. Clinton, Jill Stein, Gary Johnson and others, you get 52%. Between 47% and 48% voted for Mr. Trump. I was an enormous achievement but a close-run thing and precarious.”

 

Holman W. Jenkins, Jr. writes: “Grab that low-hanging fruit, Mr. Trump. You and your team deserve credit for eking out an electoral-college victory. But you lost the popular vote. You won fewer votes than Mitt Romney did in 2012. You barely surpassed John McCain’s total in his blowout 2008 loss. For a mandate that doesn’t fall apart with the first scandal or shapely ghost from your past, earn it with success on the growth front.”

[Douglas Caddy]

Planning for protests against Trump is underway nationwide.

 

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/13/us/trump-protest-rallies.html

[James DiEugenio]

10 hours ago, Cliff Varnell said:

This is the sort of thing Jim DiEugenio wouldn't know about because he's obsessed with Hillary's damn e-mails.

Moscow had contacts with Trump team during campaign, Russian diplomat says

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/moscow-had-contacts-with-trump-team-during-campaign-russian-diplomat-says/2016/11/10/28fb82fa-a73d-11e6-9bd6-184ab22d218e_story.html

Yawn.  Its been out there on Huffpo for days now Cliff. What else is "new" in Varnelland.

[James DiEugenio]

10 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

Jim, Did you read what I wrote? I was talking about your suggestion that Obama should have propped up Qadaffi's son in the Libya crisis and that it ignores political reality and would have relegated Obama to the political waste basket. And I think your insistence that Hillary "had a bad influence" on Obama is a lame attempt to absolve Obama as he had appointed her, and signed on off everything she did, and certainly would share whatever blame.

Kirk:  You make it sound like Libya was some kind of mini Vietnam.  The American public had almost little of no interest in the place.  How did it threaten our national security?

It was HC and Susan Rice, and Samantha Power who forced it on Obama and the country.

And if Obama would have explained that this settlement would prevent bloodshed and Al Qaeda from entering north Africa, I think that would have persuaded a lot of people. And saved some lives in France.  IMO what happened there was pretty much the worst that could have happened.

Edited November 13, 2016 by James DiEugenio

[Cliff Varnell]

1 hour ago, James DiEugenio said:

Yawn.  Its been out there on Huffpo for days now Cliff. What else is "new" in Varnelland.

Nothing challenging from Jim DiEugenio, that's for sure.

[Kirk Gallaway]

1 hour ago, James DiEugenio said:

Kirk:  You make it sound like Libya was some kind of mini Vietnam.  The American public had almost little of no interest in the place.  How did it threaten our national security?

It was HC and Susan Rice, and Samantha Power who forced it on Obama and the country.

And if Obama would have explained that this settlement would prevent bloodshed and Al Qaeda from entering north Africa, I think that would have persuaded a lot of people. And saved some lives in France.  IMO what happened there was pretty much the worst that could have happened.

Again, Read my post Jim. You're the one who brings up Clinton and Libya incessantly that you'd think it was Vietnam. "Persuade a lot of people"?? Unfortunately not  in the political realm. it could have just as well been  sinister advice by PNAC to cast Obama's career's  into political neverland. There's a reason it didn't happen. It's called political reality,  not what we wish for.

 

Jim, at the beginning of the year you were the only I can remember on this board who came out for Clinton. What happened? Was it a book you read?

Was it anything like the epiphany Gary Mack must have felt when he could no longer convince himself about "Badgeman"?      

Just thought I'd add in a reference to the Kennedy assassination.

 

Quote

http://heavy.com/news/2016/11/hillary-clinton-pardon-barack-obama-pardoned-clemency-will-the-president-pardon-hillary-trump-video-josh-earnest-white-house-press-secretary-gerald-ford-nixon/

 

 

Doug, that you state with such certainty indicates to me that you seem pretty convinced they have an open and shut case against Hillary Clinton.That you think that Trump will choose to prosecute tells me that you think he is a pathologically divisive person and is learning nothing from current trials. I think the distraction of a prolonged court trial would be disastrous for everyone including Trump.And what for? Trumps followers already have Hillary out of the picture. What would really be gained. If you're right, we're into a national disaster.

[Douglas Caddy]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/politics/2016-election/swing-state-margins/?tid=sm_fb

107,000 votes gave victory to Trump.

[Robert Prudhomme]

On 12/11/2016 at 2:38 PM, Douglas Caddy said:

Hardly a landslide, eh? (oops, not sure how the above intro got into my post)

Edited November 13, 2016 by Robert Prudhomme

[Cliff Varnell]

23 minutes ago, Douglas Caddy said:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/politics/2016-election/swing-state-margins/?tid=sm_fb

107,000 votes gave victory to Trump.

He'll end up losing the popular vote by close to 3 million.

This is not a legitimate regime.

Comey is a traitor.