Was "Full-Figured" Gloria Calvery "Running Woman"?

[Michael Walton]

I'm  going  to go out  on  a  limb here and say that the native American  lady with pouffy hair is Calvery.

You  can  see her looking  sad in that one black and white freeze frame. You can also  see her backside in the Z film. The hair matches in both.

So the  woman running  toward the two guys in the newsreel footage looks skinny like Calvary.

The stocky and full figured lady seen in the tire ad cannot  be this skinny native American lady. I'm  guessing  it's simply a case of mistaken  identity.

[Thomas Graves]

12 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

And not only shorter, but smaller in general. (e.g. narrow shoulders.) But look at the wedding announcement. She's a big woman. Look at the shoulders of B.G. and W.I.B.

Yes indeed.  She could have been a linebacker.  (lol)

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Michael Walton replied:

I'm  going  to go out  on  a  limb here and say that the Native American  lady with pouffy hair is Calvery.

[...] 

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My response:

 

Dear Michael,

I assume that when you say "Native American lady" you're talking about the dark-haired woman on the left, here?

 

 

If so, it sounds like you haven't seen light-complected Gloria Little's high school class photos, in which she's identified Gloria Little, just like in the "tire ad."  Do you think the high school misidentified her in all of these photographs?

 

(BTW, "Little" was Calvery's maiden name, as indicated in the newspaper article regarding her marrying Robert Calvery a short time before the assassination.)

 

 

How can you say that light-complected Gloria Jean Little / Gloria Jean Calvery was Native American?  Aren't Native Americans relatively dark-skinned?  Generally speaking?

 

--  Tommy

 

Edited March 5, 2017 by Thomas Graves

[Michael Walton]

Tom - I guess I can only go by what I see.  The "sad" Calvary standing on the left of the three ladies in Dealey looks dark skinned and does not have Caucasian features IMO.  This same dark-skinned lady seems to be the one standing down on Elm, the one with the pouffy hair as seen in your video clip in the Z film.

As for the glasses wearing Gloria Little - the one in the tire ad and the one in the school book and the one in the wedding announcement - she does not look like the dark-skinned Gloria Little (Calvary) mentioned above.  The dark-skinned Gloria has some of the same features as a young Diahann Carroll.  Now, whether that makes her a Native American or an African American, I don't know. She certainly does not look like the yearbook-tire-marriage Gloria, who seems more white-skinned, is stocky, and may even have blue or light-colored eyes.

Confused?  Confusing?  Yes, it does seem confusing.  I can only go by what I see though. If you put the yearbook version and the Dealey version side by side, I doubt there'd be any resemblance between the two.

BTW - this happened many months ago when I posted a photo of an Oswald look a like who was hanging out in Ruby's nightclub.  Like the Calvary issue, some members here said they saw no resemblance in Oswald. I replied that what did you expect - it's not like the government can clone people.  But to find someone who vaguely resembles Oswald and he'd go around in the early part of 63 claiming he was going to come into a great deal of money blah blah, well, even the government wouldn't have been dumb enough to have a black person going around claiming he was Oswald.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7Hr9Lrku-CxVGRwcXdiTjc0Y28

[Thomas Graves]

13 hours ago, Michael Walton said:

What I see --  The "sad" Calvary standing on the left of the three ladies ...

Three ladies?

... in Dealey ...

Where, exactly?  You know, just to make sure we're on the "same page."  Your "three ladies" is confusing me because it means you're talking about four ladies altogether.  Are you referring to the three ladies labeled "Jane Berry," "Betty Thornton," and "Peggy Burney" standing next to an unlabeled, headscarf-wearing, largish female (whom Sandy and I have dubbed "Big Girl," and whom we both currently believe is the real Gloria Calvery)?

... looks dark skinned and does not have Caucasian features IMO.  

I agree that the woman that Thierry "Fake News" Speth, Don Roberdieu, and / or Robin Unger labeled "Gloria Calvary" [sic] along with "Karen Hicks" [sic], and "Carol Reed" back in the day has dark skin and non-Caucasian facial features. I believe this dark-skinned person to be TSBD employee Stella Jacob, a self-described "Indian female" from Oklahoma.

This same dark-skinned lady seems to be the one standing down on Elm, the one with the pouffy hair as seen in your video clip in the Z film.

Not sure who or where you're talking about here.  I haven't used the expression "pouffy hair" to describe anyone. Could you please be a little more precise or go to the trouble of copying and pasting the image you're talking about when you say "down on Elm"?  Thanks.

As for the glasses wearing Gloria Little - the one in the tire ad and the one in the school book and the one in the wedding announcement - she does not look like the dark-skinned Gloria Little (Calvary) mentioned above.

Correct.  That's because that dark-skinned woman isn't Gloria Calvery, but Stella Jacob, a self-described Native American female (according to her FBI statement) who happened to mistakenly say (or more likely was misquoted by someone in the FBI as saying) that she and her two TSBD colleagues, Gloria Jeanne Holt and Sharon Simmons, were standing on the SOUTH side of Elm Street, instead of where they really were standing -- on the NORTH side.

The dark-skinned Gloria has some of the same features as a young Diahann Carroll.  Now, whether that makes her a Native American or an African American, I don't know. She certainly does not look like the yearbook-tire-marriage Gloria, who seems more white-skinned, is stocky, and may even have blue or light-colored eyes.

Correct

Confused?  Confusing?  Yes, it does seem confusing.  I can only go by what I see though.

Sorry, but it is what it is.

If you put the yearbook version ...

I guess you're talking about the photos (plural) of light-skinned Gloria Jean Little (the maiden name of Gloria Jean Calvery)?

... and the Dealey version side by side

Of which particular person in Dealy Plaza? The dark-skinned Native American female misidentified as "Gloria Calvary" [sic] by Speth, Roberdeau, and / or Unger way, way back in the day?  (But who in reality was the Native American, Stella Jacob)

I doubt there'd be any resemblance between the two.

Correct.  That's because they are different people.

Note: We don't have any close up photos of the real Gloria Jean Calvery (nee Little) from 11/22/63.

We have only one photo showing her face from 11/22/63 that I know of -- the one where she's standing far, far away behind a Secret Service car in Betzner 3.

[...]

 

Dear Michael,

I think you're confused.

Perhaps you should read the "Were TSBD employees Stella Jacob, Gloria Holt, and Sharon Simmons misidentified as "Gloria Calvery," "Karan Hicks," and "Carol Reed" on Elm Street?" thread, again.  Or for the first time, whichever the case may be?

--  Tommy

PS  I thought you implied in an earlier post that you aren't interested in this stuff.  Or did I infer that?

Edited March 6, 2017 by Thomas Graves

[Michael Walton]

Tom you  actually  clarified  something for me and that  is the indian gal was not calvery. someone  else id'd her in the photo  as calvery.

To answer  this thread's  question  I  do  not  believe  that it was calvery running  in the  newsreel  footage. the body type seems  skinnier than the real calvery.

it's  not  that  I'm  uninterested  in  this thread. it's  just that they seem  to  go  on  and on in an infinite  loop and the main point of  it  gets  lost in  the  shuffle.

meanwhile  when i start a new thread  about  what  I  think is an interesting  topic nobody  cares and it dies on the proverbial  EF vine. and then others keep posting about  a 4 second  newsreel  clip that's  not  going  to  bring  us  any  closer to closure and it goes on forever.

BTW i like  the  way  you  quote folks here and put your replies underneath  their quotes. for folks who quote a 1000 word quote and then type 5 words in reply i don't  think  they  realize  how annoying  that  can  be.

[Thomas Graves]

On 3/6/2017 at 3:58 AM, Michael Walton said:

Tom you  actually  clarified  something for me and that  is the indian gal was not calvery. someone  else id'd her in the photo  as calvery.

To answer  this thread's  question  I  do  not  believe  that it was calvery running  in the  newsreel  footage. the body type seems  skinnier than the real calvery.

it's  not  that  I'm  uninterested  in  this thread. it's  just that they seem  to  go  on  and on in an infinite  loop and the main point of  it  gets  lost in  the  shuffle.

meanwhile  when i start a new thread  about  what  I  think is an interesting  topic nobody  cares and it dies on the proverbial  EF vine. and then others keep posting about  a 4 second  newsreel  clip that's  not  going  to  bring  us  any  closer to closure and it goes on forever.

BTW i like  the  way  you  quote folks here and put your replies underneath  their quotes. for folks who quote a 1000 word quote and then type 5 words in reply i don't  think  they  realize  how annoying  that  can  be.

Dear Michael,

You're very welcome!

--  Tommy

Edited March 7, 2017 by Thomas Graves

[Sandy Larsen]

On 3/5/2017 at 1:02 AM, Sandy Larsen said:

I may have made a positive identification.

The woman is standing just to the left of presumed Gloria Calvery's group. In this photo, this woman is barely outside of the yellow box, on it's left side
 

Here she is in Altgens 6. She is the woman on the far left. Note her poofy dark hair visible far above her scarf.
 

 

And here she is in Darnell/Couch, on the left half of the frame. Note again her poofy dark hair rising far above her scarf.

Well, maybe I'm wrong. She's wearing a coat in Altgens. Is this a coat or a dress in Darnell/Couch? I think it is a coat, but it seems to be made of thinner fabric here.

Another thing... in Altgens it seems like there is a dark trim around the collar. I don't see it here in Darnell/Couch.

EDIT: Upon looking more carefully, I do believe I see the dark trim on her collar. I had though it was the bottom edge of her scarf, but I don't believe that anymore.

It seem like in Altgens her collar is pulled up straight, i.e. not folded down. Here it looks like it's folded down.

What do you guys think?

If this is a match, it gives me more confidence that it really could be Gloria's Calvery's group we see on the steps so quickly after the shooting.

 

It turns out the identification of this woman is false. I found the woman we see in the Couch/Darnell frame, above, standing in front of the TSBD during the procession in another film. (I forget the name of the filmographer.)

 

[Alistair Briggs]

21 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

It turns out the identification of this woman is false. I found the woman we see in the Couch/Darnell frame, above, standing in front of the TSBD during the procession in another film. (I forget the name of the filmographer.)

Weigman

[Guest]

6 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

It turns out the identification of this woman is false. I found the woman we see in the Couch/Darnell frame, above, standing in front of the TSBD during the procession in another film. (I forget the name of the filmographer.)

 

 

That is Lucy "Lupe"  Whittaker

[Robin Unger]

[Robin Unger]

Woman in white dress and white head scarf

 

Martin frame:

Edited March 6, 2017 by Robin Unger

[Sandy Larsen]

21 hours ago, Robin Unger said:

Woman in white dress and white head scarf

 

 

That's my guess.

 

Martin frame:

 

But what is that dark thing on her back?

 

21 hours ago, Robin Unger said:

 

[Robin Unger]

Re: Marting GIF

I am not sure what the dark thing on her back is, possibly the red headed women to her right was holding a coat or bag in her arms. ?

But she is in a similar location to the white dressed Darnell woman ?

[Thomas Graves]

52 minutes ago, Robin Unger said:

Re: Martin GIF

I am not sure what the dark thing on her back is, possibly the red headed women to her right was holding a coat or bag in her arms. ?

But she is in a similar location to the white dressed Darnell woman ?

Guys,

Has anyone actually watched the Martin clip and the Hughes clip regarding this woman?

Just sayin'

--  Tommy

[Sandy Larsen]

29 minutes ago, Thomas Graves said:

Guys,

Has anyone actually watched the Martin clip and the Hughes clip regarding this woman?

Just sayin'

--  Tommy

I will get to it. Might be able to figure out what the dark thing is on presumed All White Woman's back.