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Alberto Miatello

Who was the nurse collecting the TRUE bullet falling from Connally's thigh?

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IN DECEMBER 2011, ROBERT HARRIS SAID:

David, this is insane. I have never seen a more illogical and misinformed set of arguments.


IN DECEMBER 2011, DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

That's because you reside in Conspiracy Fantasy Land with respect to everything connected with the assassination of President John F. Kennedy.

Your eagerness to promote your various crackpot JFK conspiracy theories has blinded you to even the possibility that the things you deem "conspiratorial" could have a simple non-sinister answer.

And let's face facts, Bob, most things in life are NOT "conspiratorial". And most people are NOT willing to engage in deliberate frauds or cover-ups when it comes to the assassination of United States Presidents.

In short, every single thing that you think leads down "Conspiracy Avenue" can just as easily be explained in ordinary, non-conspiratorial ways. And I think that even you know this is true. And so do most other conspiracy theorists. They just can't admit it to themselves, mainly because they've invested so much time and effort in chasing down shadows and unprovable gunshots at "Z285" and non-existent bullets that nurses supposedly picked up and put in their pockets, etc.
 

More:

http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2016/02/jfk-assassination-arguments-part-1104.html

Edited by David Von Pein

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Bob:

What evidence do you have that Lt. Alexander ever had possession of what you continue to maintain is a "bogus" receipt, duly prepared by Audrey Bell and signed, in turn, by Robert Nolan? Have you ever seen, or can you produce, another receipt from what in your opinion must be "thousands" that passed through the office from Lt. Alexander?

Edited by Gary Murr
Addressed to Bob

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David, it has been explained to you over and over and over again, why Connally did not come forward about that bullet, sooner than he did.

You should also remember that the JFK case was far from the most important thing in his life. He was a consummate politician and literally bankrupted himself in a failed attempt to run for the Presidency. He also worked hard to support other Democratic candidates.

Not only was that kind of thing far more important to him than the JFK case, but causing a controversy between himself and the FBI could hurt him politically.

But we can only guess about his motivations. What settle the matter is that WADE AND NOLAN MET THE SAME NURSE WHO RECOVERED THE BULLET.

Wade said,

I also went out to see (Gov. John) Connally, but he was in the operating room. Some nurse had a bullet in her hand, and said this was on the gurney that Connally was on.

And Nolan said

Nolan: I was talking to a man who was one of governor Connally's aides. His name
was - I think it was either Stinton or Stimmons (Bill Stinson). And he was an
aide to the Governor. And she came up and told him that she had the bullet
that came off of the gurney.

And Stinson also stated that this was a bullet, not a fragment, which means that Nolan was correct when he said the nurse told him that. How else could Stinson have known this was a whole bullet.

This is what settles the matter. Case closed, David. Live with it.

 

 

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35 minutes ago, Robert Harris said:

Why is it that Lt. Alexander of the DPD never turned over this supposed receipt to either the PD or the FBI? It would have been critical to maintaining the chain of custody, yet he kept it in his office instead of doing what he had done a thousand times before, when this kind of thing was sent to him.

Assuming he didn't have Alzheimer's, what is the most likely explanation?

That's right, he didn't pass it along because he knew it was bogus.

How do you know precisely what Alexander did with it? And how do you know it wasn't seen by other members of the DPD or FBI?

Maybe somebody made a copy of it, and all that remains now is the copy that Gary Murr dug up for himself in the late 1990s.

In any event, that document positively has the handwriting of THREE different people on it, including Nolan's and Bell's writing. I guess you think the FBI (or somebody) forged BOTH Nolan's and Bell's signatures on that document, right? You must think their signatures are forgeries, since you're now saying you think the memo is "bogus".

What a surprise! Bob Harris thinks something is fake! But it's not too much of a shocker that Bob is now calling the hospital memo a "bogus" document. Because if he were to admit the truth---that Nurse Bell gave the bullet fragments to Officer Nolan after all---Mr. Harris would have to abandon one of his most treasured theories that he's put decades into promoting. And I doubt we'll ever see that happen.

Edited by David Von Pein

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30 minutes ago, Gary Murr said:

Bob:

What evidence do you have that Lt. Alexander ever had possession of what you continue to maintain is a "bogus" receipt, duly prepared by Audrey Bell and signed, in turn, by Robert Nolan? Have you ever seen, or can you produce, another receipt from what in your opinion must be "thousands" that passed through the office from Lt. Alexander?

Gary, the evidence is that it was addressed to him. As you stated yourself,

The answer I contend is on the memorandum itself - the individual and entity to whom Audrey Bell originally and "normally" addressed the document and envelope - "Lt. Alexander, Crime Lab."

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23 minutes ago, David Von Pein said:

How do you know precisely what Alexander did with it? And how do you know it wasn't seen by other members of the DPD or FBI?

Maybe somebody made a copy of it, and all that remains now is the copy that Gary Murr dug up for himself in the late 1990s.

In any event, that document positively has the handwriting of THREE different people on it, including Nolan's and Bell's writing. I guess you think the FBI (or somebody) forged BOTH Nolan's and Bell's signatures on that document, right? You must think their signatures are forgeries, since you're now saying you think the memo is "bogus".

What a surprise! Bob Harris thinks something is fake! But it's not too much of a shocker that Bob is now calling the hospital memo a "bogus" document. Because if he were to admit the truth---that Nurse Bell gave the bullet fragments to Officer Nolan after all---Mr. Harris would have to abandon one of his most treasured theories that he's put decades into promoting. And I doubt that that will ever happen.

We know exactly what Alexander did with it - NOTHING.

As Gary suggested, it was taken by the HSCA years later, who subpoenaed Parkland hospital for everything related to the JFK case.

And you need to stop blurting out things that you can't prove to save your life. We don't know if those signatures are authentic. What we DO know is that this supposed receipt, contradicts nearly everything that Bell and Nolan told us about this issue. It also contradicts the statements of Connally, Stinson and Wade. 

There has to be a reason why Alexander would refuse to send this document to Will Fritz or the FBI. The FBI had a great way to convince a few Parkland people to go along with them - they simply stated what they honestly believed - that evidence of conspiracy could lead to war with Russia. But not all of them were eager to take part in the scam.

 

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35 minutes ago, David Von Pein said:

What a surprise! Bob Harris thinks something is fake! But it's not too much of a shocker that Bob is now calling the hospital memo a "bogus" document. Because if he were to admit the truth---that Nurse Bell gave the bullet fragments to Officer Nolan after all---Mr. Harris would have to abandon one of his most treasured theories that he's put decades into promoting. And I doubt that that will ever happen.

David, it's one thing to misrepresent me, but it's another to deliberately lie about why I said what I did.

My conclusions are based purely on the evidence - evidence that you have been evading for years. Nolan never signed a receipt at all and Bell would never have said that the man she dealt with was NOT in uniform if she had dealt with Nolan (in full dress uniform) and watched him sign off as a "Texas State Trooper".

Alexander must have known that this thing was phony, which is why he refused to send it to Will Fritz. All of the evidence DPD processed, was catalogued and listed along with descriptions. That "receipt" is nowhere to be found.

Pretending that I form my conclusions based on some mythical need is hugely insulting, and you KNOW that is pure BS.

 

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49 minutes ago, Robert Harris said:

Alexander must have known that this thing was phony, which is why he refused to send it to Will Fritz.

You have no idea whether Fritz saw the memo or not. So stop pretending you do know.

 

Quote

All of the evidence DPD processed was catalogued and listed along with descriptions. That "receipt" is nowhere to be found.

But the "description" of the event (Nolan getting fragments from Bell) WAS indeed "catalogued" by the DPD. And we can all see it for ourselves in CE2003, at 24 H 260 (which is a document mentioned to Bob several times previously, but Bob prefers to believe this is yet another fake document; but this one in CE2003 is a DPD inventory of items, not an FBI list; so I guess Bob needs to implicate Fritz and the DPD in this part of the "Bell/Nolan cover-up" as well).....

http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh24/html/WH_Vol24_0139b.htm

As the documents build up (and there's at least two now that verify that Nolan received fragment(s) from Nurse Bell), I need to ask Bob the same question I asked some of the members of this forum in a discussion pertaining to Oswald's Postal Money Order....

"How many things that appear to be legitimate about the Hidell money order does it take for a stubborn CTer to admit that the money order is, in fact, very likely a legitimate document? .... At what point do the LEGITIMATE LOOKING THINGS on the document make you want to stop pretending everything's been put there by conspirators?" -- DVP; January 2016

 

Quote

Pretending that I form my conclusions based on some mythical need is hugely insulting, and you KNOW that is pure BS.

You've now got TWO very good reasons to abandon your theory about Audrey Bell never giving any evidence to Bobby Nolan----those two things being: the hospital memo unearthed by Gary Murr and the DPD inventory sheet in CE2003.

But you still won't give up the notion that Bell never gave anything at all to Nolan, will you Bob? You will instead continue to rely on the decades-old memory of various people to promote your theory, instead of accepting those two pieces of HARD EVIDENCE which totally destroy your theory.

Edited by David Von Pein

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15 hours ago, Robert Harris said:
16 hours ago, Michael Clark said:

Isn't there a video of Conally describing hearing something drop? I could swear I saw that video.

I don't think so, Michael.

 

That's odd. Because I also recall Connally describing something drop to the floor. That's how I became aware of this issue.

Perhaps what I saw was a video with a narrator describing how Connally heard something drop.

 

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Cut the crap, David.

There is NOTHING in the DPD archives that even remotely describes the receipt we are talking about. Alexander obviously, refused to send it to Fritz, who would have catalogued it along with all the other evidence.

And yes, the "description", AKA third hand statements that Bell passed a "fragment" to Nolan was certainly in the files, but not a single person outside of the FBI, claimed that Bell told them that. Strange, isn't it that she told NO ONE about this except the FBI, who at the very least, lied about the quantity that Bell processed, then lied about what Nolan and Stinson told them?

 Bell told us exactly what happened and who she gave her fragments to - FIRST HAND.

 

Edited by Robert Harris

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5 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

That's odd. Because I also recall Connally describing something drop to the floor. That's how I became aware of this issue.

Perhaps what I saw was a video with a narrator describing how Connally heard something drop.

 

Well, if you can find it, please post a link to it.

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3 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

That's odd. Because I also recall Connally describing something drop to the floor. That's how I became aware of this issue.

Perhaps what I saw was a video with a narrator describing how Connally heard something drop.


Probably the latter (in red) is what I saw. With the narrator's source being Nellie or Herskowitz, given what Robert Harris said:

15 hours ago, Robert Harris said:

I have no idea who Connally may have told about this, other than Nellie, who told Herskowitz that he told her.

 

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18 minutes ago, David Von Pein said:

You've now got TWO very good reasons to abandon your theory about Audrey Bell never giving any evidence to Bobby Nolan----those two things being: the hospital memo unearthed by Gary Murr and the DPD inventory sheet in CE2003.

It is hilarious to hear what you think are "very good reasons".

1. An unverified receipt that the officer who received it, refused to put into evidence, and which contradicted everything those two people told us.

2. Third hand statements by people who never in their lives, heard Bell or Nolan confirm that she passed an envelope to him.

David, if a conspiracy advocate presented "evidence" like that, you'd be laughing your proverbial ass off, and rightly so:lol:

 

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49 minutes ago, Robert Harris said:

Cut the crap, David.

There is NOTHING in the DPD archives that even remotely describes the receipt we are talking about. Alexander obviously, refused to send it to Fritz, who would have catalogued it along with all the other evidence.

Huh?? Why on Earth would you think the RECEIPT ITSELF would need to be "catalogued" and therefore show up in an "INVENTORY OF EVIDENCE" list like the one we find in CE2003? (Is that what you meant?) Do you think the HOSPITAL MEMO itself should have been mentioned on the DPD's inventory sheet? ~shrug~

 

Quote

And yes, the "description", AKA third hand statements that Bell passed a "fragment" to Nolan was certainly in the files, but not a single person outside of the FBI, claimed that Bell told them that. Strange, isn't it that she told NO ONE about this except the FBI, who at the very least, lied about the quantity that Bell processed, then lied about what Nolan and Stinson told them?

Nobody lied about this incident at all. Nobody. Audrey Bell was simply mistaken about the person to whom she gave the envelope containing the Connally bullet fragments. And via your own interview of Bobby Nolan, we know that Nolan himself didn't actually SEE what was inside the envelope. He had no idea what was in there. And Henry Wade's memory of the event must have also faded quite a bit too. He very likely conflated information concerning the "stretcher bullet" (CE399) with information about the envelope which contained only FRAGMENTS from Governor Connally's wrist. (What year did Wade say what he said about the "bullet" and the "gurney", Bob? I'm not sure when it was. Can you please inform me.)

 

Quote

 Bell told us exactly what happened and who she gave her fragments to - FIRST HAND.

And she was obviously wrong. And the hospital memo plus CE2003, both of which existed in November of 1963, provide the PROOF she was wrong/mistaken.

Edited by David Von Pein

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5 minutes ago, Robert Harris said:

1. An unverified receipt that the officer who received it, refused to put into evidence, and which contradicted everything those two people told us.

2. Third hand statements by people who never in their lives, heard Bell or Nolan confirm that she passed an envelope to him.

Somebody PLEASE get the Comma Police out here to help Bob. All those needless commas are making me dizzy (yet again).

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