Did the Dallas Radical Right kill JFK?

[Paul Brancato]

Here's how I see it. 

JFK didn't fear Texans. He feared his Joint Chiefs.

The proof is in the pudding. The conspirators thought JFK was a traitor, and that they were the heroes. They weighed personal risk against what they saw as the National Interest. 

Edited October 24, 2017 by Paul Brancato

[Robert Charles-Dunne]

14 hours ago, Jason Ward said:

Hi Robert,

If we determine once and for all whether Oswald beat his wife, whether neighbors called the police about any beatings, or whether Paul Trejo bas the details right about the beating question; how does this get us closer to solving the assassination?

As I see it Marina is something of a victim but totally removed from the murder.   Beaten or not, police called or not; isn't it irrelevant to the crime?

 

Jason

Perhaps you should address those concerns with Paul Trejo, the biased propagandist who seems so intent upon foisting these lies upon an unsuspecting public.

There were no witnesses who saw Oswald beat his wife.  Neighbours did not call police.  Paul Trejo has no interest in getting the details right; only in twisting them to conform to his groundless hypothesis.

Ask **him** how any of these falsehoods put us closer to resolution. 

I only show up occasionally to help clean up where Trejo's fouled the footpath.

 

[James DiEugenio]

Thanks Robert.

Keep it up, there is a lot of clean up.

[Paul Trejo]

23 hours ago, Robert Charles-Dunne said:

...I repost the following from six weeks ago because Trejo lacked the nerve to respond.  Thus, escaping the ramifications of a message that soon wafted into the ether:

Here is the Trejo methodological fraud in high contrast:

QUOTE:

Paul Trejo is congenitally incapable of putting forth an honest argument; he merely invents things that are pleasing to him, then hopes he doesn’t get called out for his inventions.

This all started because Paul said Oswald’s fellow tenants called police to complain Oswald beat his wife.  It was a Trejo invention.  No such instance occurred, nor could Trejo provide proof that it had.  But then proof and truth are unnecessary in his protocols.

Then the accuser switched gears.  In the absence of tenants who called police, there were witnesses to Oswald beating his wife who DIDN’T call the police.

Per Trejo's fevered imagination, there were seven eye-witnesses to Oswald beating Marina, then it was 12 and then it ballooned to 19... 

...<blah, blah, blah>

Robert,

I answered your accusations deftly and correctly -- but you don't listen.

Going back YEARS ago to when this debate began, I had already corrected myself when I said that Oswald's Elsbeth Street apartment neighbors reported to the police to complain about Oswald and Marina fighting (and thought he was beating her) -- that was my typo.  

It wasn't the police -- it was the Federal Police -- the FBI.   I said that YEARS ago -- and you just closed your ears to my correction.

They gave this report -- actually -- to Dallas FBI agent James Hosty.

So -- you're still chasing rainbows, Robert.  Just give it up.

As for the number of eye-witnesses who reported that Lee Oswald beat Marina Oswald -- that number was fixed at 6, according to WC testimony, which I accept, and which you don't (due to your typical CIA-did-it CT). 

As for EAR-WITNESSES, that's a different story -- that includes far more people, as you are well aware.  Again, I cite the Warren Commission testimony in my statement -- I made nothing up.

You're encouraged here by Ernie Lazar's bizarre attacks on me -- and you want to get on board.   OK, so hop on board.  But in only a few more days we are going to see the US Government give up all of its JFK Records, and then in the coming weeks we are going to see real Scholars and Researchers (like Jason Ward) expose the TRUTH about what really happened in the JFK assassination.

I predict (as I have been predicting here for nearly six years) that the Radical Right will be found GUILTY -- and the Dallas Radical Right will be found in the center of the cyclone -- and Ex-General Edwin Walker will be recognized as the master-mind.

I still recommend Dr. Caufield's recent book, General Walker and the Murder of President Kennedy (2015), yet I will emphasize that over the past several years, this Forum was first alerted to the Walker-did-it CT by Harry Dean, Jim Root and me -- especially me.

CIA-did-it, LBJ-did-it and Mafia-did-it CTers can just gnash their teeth.  

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited October 24, 2017 by Paul Trejo

[Harry J.Dean]

Hey Paul will the canada chap with three names  just fade away again?...... answer is, YES ! 

[George Sawtelle]

Jason

you said ... "In summary the far right had the stated purpose to kill Kennedy. They had the gun nuts, the money, the Dallas police, and the irrational belief in domestic apocalypse as a definite future under the Progrssive agenda."

You forgot the most important reason ... they were not afraid of the electric chair. Without that reason, it could have been anybody. But with that reason,  it could only  have been the radical right. Because everyone else named as a suspect was afraid of the electric chair.

It's profound. It's the reason that encapsulates the conclusion of your theory. Wow surprised you would forget.

 

[Ernie Lazar]

1 hour ago, Paul Trejo said:

Robert,

I answered your accusations deftly and correctly -- but you don't listen.

Going back YEARS ago to when this debate began, I had already corrected myself when I said that Oswald's Elsbeth Street apartment neighbors reported to the police to complain about Oswald and Marina fighting (and thought he was beating her) -- that was my typo.  

It wasn't the police -- it was the Federal Police -- the FBI.   I said that YEARS ago -- and you just closed your ears to my correction.

They gave this report -- actually -- to Dallas FBI agent James Hosty.

So -- you're still chasing rainbows, Robert.  Just give it up.

As for the number of eye-witnesses who reported that Lee Oswald beat Marina Oswald -- that number was fixed at 6, according to WC testimony, which I accept, and which you don't (due to your typical CIA-did-it CT). 

As for EAR-WITNESSES, that's a different story -- that includes far more people, as you are well aware.  Again, I cite the Warren Commission testimony in my statement -- I made nothing up.

You're encouraged here by Ernie Lazar's bizarre attacks on me -- and you want to get on board.   OK, so hop on board.  But in only a few more days we are going to see the US Government give up all of its JFK Records, and then in the coming weeks we are going to see real Scholars and Researchers (like Jason Ward) expose the TRUTH about what really happened in the JFK assassination.

I predict (as I have been predicting here for nearly six years) that the Radical Right will be found GUILTY -- and the Dallas Radical Right will be found in the center of the cyclone -- and Ex-General Edwin Walker will be recognized as the master-mind.

I still recommend Dr. Caufield's recent book, General Walker and the Murder of President Kennedy (2015), yet I will emphasize that over the past several years, this Forum was first alerted to the Walker-did-it CT by Harry Dean, Jim Root and me -- especially me.

CIA-did-it, LBJ-did-it and Mafia-did-it CTers can just gnash their teeth.  

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

The problem with your assumption (aka delusion) about the new FBI records being released this week is that (aside from the list of the remaining docs already being published months ago--which clearly reveals that nothing you expect to see is actually going to be part of those documents) the Chairman of the ARRB has stated repeatedly during recent interviews that there are no documents being released which present any new bombshell revelations.  There IS considerable interest in the CIA docs that pertain to LHO's visit to Mexico -- but that will probably just expand upon what is already known or suspected. 

BUT, significantly, as far as I can tell -- in the vast universe of JFK-assassination researchers----nobody (except you) has proposed that new FBI documents will report some entirely new evidence never previously uncovered.   This is significant because, historically, controversial matters always create differing schools of thought (and that means PRINCIPLED researchers have honest disagreements about what to expect or how to interpret evidence) but NOBODY but you assumes that the remaining FBI docs are going to reveal entirely new understandings regarding a "JBS plot" or about any of the principal figures whom YOU think were involved in (or aware of) the assassination plans.

"REAL SCHOLARS AND RESEARCHERS" =  What the hell do YOU know about this category of people?  Even you own favorite "experts" contradict (and often refute) what you believe!

"REAL SCHOLARS AND RESEARCHERS" = publish peer-reviewed articles, books, and conference papers -- and their writings always include pertinent bibliographic information so that "real scholars and researchers" can fact-check their assertions and conclusions.

BY CONTRAST:  ALL of your favorite sources (Harry Dean, Wesley Swearingen, Don Adams, James Hosty)  present NO verifiable factual evidence and their writings do not even have bibliographic notes or references which can be fact-checked because, essentially, they all present nothing more than anecdotal personal memoirs -- which are the ABSOLUTE WORST TYPE of "evidence".   Let me add Jeffrey Caufield to this list because so many of his footnotes are totally incomprehensible and, therefore, worthless.

Edited October 24, 2017 by Ernie Lazar

[Robert Charles-Dunne]

5 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

Robert,

I answered your accusations deftly and correctly -- but you don't listen.

Going back YEARS ago to when this debate began, I had already corrected myself when I said that Oswald's Elsbeth Street apartment neighbors reported to the police to complain about Oswald and Marina fighting (and thought he was beating her) -- that was my typo.  

It wasn't the police -- it was the Federal Police -- the FBI.   I said that YEARS ago -- and you just closed your ears to my correction.

They gave this report -- actually -- to Dallas FBI agent James Hosty.

So -- you're still chasing rainbows, Robert.  Just give it up.

You're as literate as you are honest.  To wit:

NOBODY phoned either the Dallas Police or the FBi.  That's not a typo; it's an evasion to avoid looking stupid.  But you DO look stupid, because nobody - repeat NOBODY - phoned anyone in any level of law enforcement.  You'd know this if you weren't as literate as you are honest:

Mr. STERN. Did you take over from Agent Fain or in some other way?
Mr. HOSTY. No, sir; I did not take over directly. When Agent Fain retired directly from the Bureau he had closed the case. He had a case which we call a pending inactive case on Mrs. Marina Oswald. This case I did take over. It was in what we call a pending inactive status, that is, nothing was to be done for a period of 6 months. Then at the end of the 6-month period it was then turned into a pending case and I went out and attempted to locate Mrs. Marina Oswald for the purpose of interviewing her.
I might add that it is the practice of the FBI to interview immigrants from behind the Iron Curtain on a selective basis, and she was so selected to be one of these persons to be interviewed.
Mr. STERN. When was this?
Mr. HOSTY. This was March 4, 1963, when I began my inquiry as to her present whereabouts. I determined on March 4, 1963, through the Immigration and Naturalization Service records that she had moved from Fort Worth to the Dallas area. She was living on a street called Elsbeth Street in the Oak Cliff section of Dallas.
Mr. STERN. What happened in connection with the case of Lee Harvey Oswald?
Mr. HOSTY. This case was closed at this time. It was closed.
On March 11, 1963, I made inquiry at this Elsbeth address, and determined from the landlady, I believe her name was Mrs. Tobias, that she had just evicted Lee and Marina Oswald from her apartment building because of their alleged fighting and his alleged drinking. They caused a disturbance and she had asked him to leave on March 3, 1963. She told me they had moved a short distance away. She didn't know where. On that same date, I was able to determine from the postal authorities that they had changed their address to 214 Neely Street, also in the Oak Cliff section of Dallas.

You'll note that Hosty was just following up on something six months old.  Nobody called him.  That's YOUR invention.   If he'd received a call from either Tobias on March 3, when the Oswalds were advised they'd be evicted, he wouldn't have had to look up her address on Elsbeth the following day.

5 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

As for the number of eye-witnesses who reported that Lee Oswald beat Marina Oswald -- that number was fixed at 6, according to WC testimony, which I accept, and which you don't (due to your typical CIA-did-it CT). 

Then why on earth would you offer up a list of 19 names?  Your falsehoods are now conflicting with each other.

5 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

As for EAR-WITNESSES, that's a different story -- that includes far more people, as you are well aware.  Again, I cite the Warren Commission testimony in my statement -- I made nothing up.

You don't know the difference between witness testimony and  gossip.  Or your posterior from your elbow. 

5 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

You're encouraged here by Ernie Lazar's bizarre attacks on me -- and you want to get on board.   OK, so hop on board.  But in only a few more days we are going to see the US Government give up all of its JFK Records, and then in the coming weeks we are going to see real Scholars and Researchers (like Jason Ward) expose the TRUTH about what really happened in the JFK assassination.

My excoriating you began well before your most recent folly with Ernie Lazar, who can handle himself and needs no help from me or anyone else.

5 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

I predict (as I have been predicting here for nearly six years) that the Radical Right will be found GUILTY -- and the Dallas Radical Right will be found in the center of the cyclone -- and Ex-General Edwin Walker will be recognized as the master-mind.

I still recommend Dr. Caufield's recent book, General Walker and the Murder of President Kennedy (2015), yet I will emphasize that over the past several years, this Forum was first alerted to the Walker-did-it CT by Harry Dean, Jim Root and me -- especially me.

CIA-did-it, LBJ-did-it and Mafia-did-it CTers can just gnash their teeth.  

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Your predictions are as laughable as your posts.  

[Michael Clark]

I am imagining Jason Ward, looking back through RCD's contributions to this forum and Ernie's rock solid credentials, offerings and breadth of substantial research. I am imagining Jason Ward wondering how he is going to get out of his ill-advised marriage to Paul Trejo's nonsense.

[Jason Ward]

7 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

But in only a few more days we are going to see the US Government give up all of its JFK Records,

Paul,

Because of the various obsessions over the years in the CT community, we will indeed get a big document dump, but a lot of it will be a gigantic pile of irrelevant crap on topics like Cuba.   If you are right about Walker, much of what the government has on him will not see the light of day - yet.   So for you and anyone who wades into the National Archives release, and I hope everyone will, discouragement may come quickly.  I'm afraid that instead of finding out who was conspiring to kill Kennedy, we are more likely to get minutia and 1000-page-long-files of arcane details related to the gigantic circus of wasted money and cash-loving-Cuban-scammers involved in the early 60s CIA Cuban obsession.   

The document release may very well include 100s of new names never before seen in JFK research.  Most of them will be Cubans now dead whose lives were in jeopardy if their relationship with the CIA became public knowledge.  In an astounding case of life imitating art, I predict we will also see in further embarassing detail just how far the CIA in Miami went into a rabbit hole of cloak-and-dagger intrigues straight out of a 007 novel.  From my reading of the document release this year, the CIA isn't hiding anything about Kennedy/Oswald, they are hiding details that show the CIA as a bunch of spendthrift boy-advernturers handing big dollars over to any Cuban who says he will swim back to Havana and topple Castro.  All the Cubans in Miami said that, and got well paid merely by cliaming passionate anti-Castro beliefs.  Castro remained in power not for lack of CIA effort, but rather for CIA efforts aimed at Cuban exiles.

In reality, Miami in the early 60s (as now) is a much more economically prosperous place for Cubans than Cuba.   No Cuban was really so passionate about returning to Cuba, it is clear to me, and these documents will further underline this point.  That's one reason I know the reasoning that claims the Cubans were angry at Kennedy for the Bay of Pigs is an absurd joke - the everyday Cubans loved Kennedy and in fact had no interest of actually fighting in Cuba for the return of their homeland.  Some of the most extreme Cubans were angry about the Bay of Pigs - mostly the ex-Batistia darlings like General Walker's pal and ultra right winger Carlos Bringuier - or perpetual adventurer and commie-fighter Felix Rodriguez.  The Cuban 1% in some irrational sense of reactionaries everywhere, longed for a return to the corrupt mafia-crime paradise of pre-Castro Cuba where everyday Cubans lived in poverty while a few of the elite lived like kings.  But 99% of Cubans, especially those who made it to the US, were happy with Kennedy and America or in any case unserious about any real effort at counter-revolution or counter-Kennedy programs.

Better to keep up the CIA cash gravy train by always promising, but never delivering, the always-imminenet Castro overthrow.  There are many parallels to more recent US policies in Iraq and Afghanistan where easy cash is had by anyone who claims to love democracy - but as in Cuba, they never actually do anything to bring democracy to their people.  In sum, I predict the document dump is going to be 80 or 90% about a bunch of Cuban profiteers and their CIA paymasters wasting tax dollars. The documents will show splashing around the Keys in pretend invasion "practice," and CIA "resources" acting more like a drunken overgrown Boy Scout jamboree with an unlimited credit limit than a squad of dangerous killers who might just as easily target JFK after Castro.

With that said, wherever Walker was directly linked to the assassination through his contacts with Oswald, Hosty, etc., we should get a few more reveals about the general.  The problem is that because conspiracy theorists have taught the US archivists to concentrate on Cuba, and a few other topics of interests to a standard conspiracy theory ideologically grounded in Garrison's CIA-as-omnipotent theory, anything NOT specifically tagged JFK-releated will remain vaulted.  Walker hiring gunmen may remain vaulted; Cubans buying boats and beer for the 284 planned invasions perpetually just about to happen will be documented immensely.  The still hidden stuff should still be accessible in a new FOI, thankfully.

Rex Bradford is working on a new script as we speak which should speed through an early analysis of the document release.  Bill Simpich is working with Rex and the data-crunching I did on the summer release to map and extrapolate CIA cryptonyms in such a way that may be entirely revolutionary in its implications.  You still have to literally read every page because OCR is not good with handwriting, marginalia, idiomatic English, etc.   But we'll know fairly soon whether the new release is fruitful or just more Cuban flotsam and garbage.

 

regards

 

Jaso

 

Edited October 25, 2017 by Jason Ward

[Michael Clark]

3 hours ago, Michael Clark said:

I am imagining Jason Ward, looking back through RCD's contributions to this forum and Ernie's rock solid credentials, offerings and breadth of substantial research. I am imagining Jason Ward wondering how he is going to get out of his ill-advised marriage to Paul Trejo's nonsense.

 

1 hour ago, Jason Ward said:

Paul,

If you are right about Walker, much of what the government has on him will not see the light of day - yet.   

regards

 

Jaso

 

Bingo! Jason lays the blame on his compadre! Lol!

Jason's "yet" is an out, for when nothing is forthcoming to support the Jason Trejo and Paul Ward theory. Lol!

Edited October 25, 2017 by Michael Clark

[Michael Clark]

23 minutes ago, Jason Ward said:

Paul,

Because of the various obsessions over the years in the CT community, we will indeed get a big document dump,

regards

 

Jaso

 

Jason, You seem to forget that you are a CTist, with your Walker-did-it, a-la Trejo theory.

[Michael Clark]

1 hour ago, Jason Ward said:

Paul,

.......but a lot of it will be a gigantic pile of irrelevant crap on topics like Cuba.   

Jason thinks that the documents that are anticipated to be most relevant ones are "irrelevant crap", before he sees them. Sounds like he has taken Paul's predilection for predictions to a new pinnacle of ... ( my plosives-powered alliteration-engine petered-out).

 

I predict we will also see in....

More Trejo-esque predictions...

 

Better to keep up the CIA cash gravy train by always promising, but never delivering, the always-imminenet Castro overthrow.  

Sounds like a CIA-dit-it theory to me. Yet it sounds just like mine.... without the CIA "doin-it".

 

 

But we'll now fairly soon whether the new release is fruitful or just more Cuban garbage.

Jason wants to pre-qualify, in a Trejoesque manner, the evidence we have not yet seen, as garbage, because he knows it will not support his Tejo-married theory.

 

regards

 

Jaso

 

The responses in red are mine. The weaseling is Jason's.

Regards,

Michael

Edited October 25, 2017 by Michael Clark

[Michael Clark]

...

Edited October 25, 2017 by Michael Clark

[Michael Clark]

1 hour ago, Jason Ward said:

Paul,

Because of the various obsessions over the years in the CT community, we will indeed get a big document dump, but a lot of it will be a gigantic pile of irrelevant crap on topics like Cuba.   If you are right about Walker, much of what the government has on him will not see the light of day - yet.   So for you and anyone who wades into the National Archives release, and I hope everyone will, discouragement may come quickly.  I'm afraid that instead of finding out who was conspiring to kill Kennedy, we are more likely to get minutia and 1000-page-long-files of arcane details related to the gigantic circus of wasted money and cash-loving-Cuban-scammers involved in the early 60s CIA Cuban obsession.   

The document release may very well include 100s of new names never before seen in JFK research.  Most of them will be Cubans now dead whose lives were in jeopardy if their relationship with the CIA became public knowledge.  In an astounding case of life imitating art, I predict we will also see in further embarassing detail just how far the CIA in Miami went into a rabbit hole of cloak-and-dagger intrigues straight out of a 007 novel.  From my reading of the document release this year, the CIA isn't hiding anything about Kennedy/Oswald, they are hiding details that show the CIA as a bunch of spendthrift boy-advernturers handing big dollars over to any Cuban who says he will swim back to Havana and topple Castro.  All the Cubans in Miami said that, and got well paid merely by cliaming passionate anti-Castro beliefs.  Castro remained in power not for lack of CIA effort, but rather for CIA efforts aimed at Cuban exiles.

In reality, Miami in the early 60s (as now) is a much more economically prosperous place for Cubans than Cuba.   No Cuban was really so passionate about returning to Cuba, it is clear to me, and these documents will further underline this point.  That's one reason I know the reasoning that claims the Cubans were angry at Kennedy for the Bay of Pigs is an absurd joke - the everyday Cubans loved Kennedy and in fact had no interest of actually fighting in Cuba for the return of their homeland.  Some of the most extreme Cubans were angry about the Bay of Pigs - mostly the ex-Batistia darlings like General Walker's pal and ultra right winger Carlos Bringuier - or perpetual adventurer and commie-fighter Felix Rodriguez.  The Cuban 1% in some irrational sense of reactionaries everywhere, longed for a return to the corrupt mafia-crime paradise of pre-Castro Cuba where everyday Cubans lived in poverty while a few of the elite lived like kings.  But 99% of Cubans, especially those who made it to the US, were happy with Kennedy and America or in any case unserious about any real effort at counter-revolution or counter-Kennedy programs.

Better to keep up the CIA cash gravy train by always promising, but never delivering, the always-imminenet Castro overthrow.  There are many parallels to more recent US policies in Iraq and Afghanistan where easy cash is had by anyone who claims to love democracy - but as in Cuba, they never actually do anything to bring democracy to their people.  In sum, I predict the document dump is going to be 80 or 90% about a bunch of Cuban profiteers and their CIA paymasters wasting tax dollars. The documents will show splashing around the Keys in pretend invasion "practice," and CIA "resources" acting more like a drunken overgrown Boy Scout jamboree with an unlimited credit limit than a squad of dangerous killers who might just as easily target JFK after Castro.

With that said, wherever Walker was directly linked to the assassination through his contacts with Oswald, Hosty, etc., we should get a few more reveals about the general.  The problem is that because conspiracy theorists have taught the US archivists to concentrate on Cuba, and a few other topics of interests to a standard conspiracy theory ideologically grounded in Garrison's CIA-as-omnipotent theory, anything NOT specifically tagged JFK-releated will remain vaulted.  Walker hiring gunmen may remain vaulted; Cubans buying boats and beer for the 284 planned invasions perpetually just about to happen will be documented immensely.  The still hidden stuff should still be accessible in a new FOI, thankfully.

Rex Bradford is working on a new script as we speak which should speed through an early analysis of the document release.  Bill Simpich is working with Rex and the data-crunching I did on the summer release to map and extrapolate CIA cryptonyms in such a way that may be entirely revolutionary in its implications.  You still have to literally read every page because OCR is not good with handwriting, marginalia, idiomatic English, etc.   But we'll know fairly soon whether the new release is fruitful or just more Cuban flotsam and garbage.

 

regards

 

Jaso

 

There is a lot to unpack here.