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Jim Marrs

Tosh Plumlee

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I have known Tosh Plumlee since before the release of Oliver Stone's film "JFK". He has taken me on a guided tour of Dealey Plaza and South Dallas on more than one occasion. While I cannot vouch for 100 percent of his story as I have been unable to substantiate it all, I can state that it has remained remarkably consistent through the years and, over time, has been more and more supported by documents released from the U.S. Government as well as the trstimony of others. From the beginning, he told me that the only person on his Dallas flight of 11-22-63 that he had known previously was Johnny Roselli and that Roselli got off at the first landing at Garland Airport. Tosh also pointed out to me several CIA-backed Cuban "safehouses" in South Dallas as well as the garage apartment behind Oswald's rooming house. Much of what he told me has been verified by outside sources. He also led me to the Oswald apartment on Elsbeth St. and correctly described the odd configuration of the outside door long before we arrived there, indicating to me his prior knowledge of the place. I have been with Tosh on many occasions, including a lengthy driving trip to Florida and Alpha 66 headquarters, and have never seen him in a drunken state. His memory for people, places and dates continues to amaze me. There are now certain individuals who claim that Tosh is unstable, a drunk, a xxxx or a combination of all three. In my book, this is patently untrue. It should be noted that these same individuals have proven not only inconsistent and abusive in their statements, but have totally reversed declarative statements made only a few years ago. It is easy to call names and make accusations. It is not so easy to erase the memories of those who once listened to such self-appointed authorities.

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Always good to hear from Jim Marrs.

An overview:

After participating in the 'triple underpass' thread and reading almost all of the postings and seminar papers I have a general comment on Tosh.

His story checks out.

He stays on the same line, he is interested in the truth, he is embattled for it, and he wants to share his story without being asked to go beyond what he knows.

His knowledge of the air traffic and personalities of the period is proven by James in Australia and other confirmers. His ability to show subtle differences in his own de-classified files shows his "bona fides." His testimony to special Congressional committees has never been shot down.

Zapruder was filmed from Kennedy's right, 90 degrees to the limousine.

However, at the moment of the fatal headshot, JFK is not in profile, he is turned towards his wife. At this moment he had been shot already in the back and in the throat. LOOKING LEFT IT IS ENTIRELY CONSISTENT WITH THE BALLISTIC EVIDENCE THAT THE SHOT CAME FROM THE SOUTH KNOLL, NEAR THE PARKING LOT AND THE RAILROAD OVERPASS. This bullet penetrated Kennedy's upper right forehead and caused the back lower right part of his skull to be blown out as all medical eyewitnesses state (but none of the compromised film or X-rays can confirm).

A shooter from the grassy knoll could not have caused the wound seen in the Zapruder film or the wound described by the doctors, because JFK was looking to his left.

As I have stated before, the Zapruder Point of View and the interest in the north (grassy) knoll, where a third triangulated position may have been in place either at the wall (classic/carhood position) or the fence (badgeman/puff of smoke) have precluded interest, or blinded us to what we call in American Football "the flat" the large open space to the limousine's left, the south knoll, with its good views and escape routes.

Tosh, as an Eyewitness sent by his CIA and JM/WAVE agent handlers

TRACY BARNES and WILLIAM HARVEY, has a very good and uncorrupted memory of events. Other witnesses either were not in a good position, heard distorted echoes under sudden duress, or have been coached and intimidated. The term the CIA used for this observation mission, calling it "an Abort Task," was obviously hocus-pocus and only a cover story, but it warned Tosh and 'Sergio" to be ready for gunfire, and they were.......

While all this is not conclusive, it is compelling.

Edited by Shanet Clark

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Tosh,

What little I know of Tosh he seems like a great person to me. I am getting a bit disappointed in not hearing from Files on all of Tosh's questions. I keep saying give it a few more days. This time he is a bit late in answering. Sorry I am so anxious for his response. I guess it makes time go slower when you are that way.

Tosh did you ask him hard questions? A lot of memory in that if it is hard for him. I am laughing again.

I had to hand write the whole thing my printer isn't working. So, I was writing the entire thing out. Poor Files on that to have to read my handwriting. But I did send it and tonight finally I will resubmit it again to him. Tomorrow I will probably hear from him, after the resubmit. HOPEFULLY. I was going to do that on Sunday but got busy doing other things.

Keep up the good work Tosh. Thanks for the other night and your support to try to calm things down with Terry. Glad you were there at that moment!!!

It calmed me down more, I think. Instead of her. But got me hungry for donuts!!! By the way what did you mean "look at the whole donut, and not the hole?" I think I know what you mean and I do think that is the way you had worded it. Just not one hundred per cent sure my way of interpretations is right on your hidden message.

Again Keep up the Very "good" work. Also, grateful you are here!!!

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I can't say 100% that I BELIEVE Tosh, but I can't say that I disbelieve him either. Most of his story checks out, and I'm willing to give him a chance - I won't write him off as hogwash immediately, but I won't praise him for coming forward either.

The most complicated thing being, of course, what you believe happened in Dealey Plaza. Cubans, mob, LBJ, grassy knoll, south knoll, Depository, Dal-Tex. Too much thinking about on end will make you dizzy. Nobody knows what really happened, and except for Abraham Zapruder & the people in the Presidential car, we can't account for anyone else's movement that day.

This case is a lot like a religion. You pick a version to believe, and you have to have pure faith in it. Unfortunately, Tosh is a part of this, and you can have faith in him - or you can write him off.

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Jim,

He also led me to the Oswald apartment on Elsbeth St. and correctly described the odd configuration of the outside door long before we arrived there,

Was this at 602 Elsbeth, or a different address?

Steve Thomas

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His story checks out.  He stays on the same line, he is interested in the truth, he is embattled for it, and he wants to share his story without being asked to go beyond what he knows.

A shooter from the grassy knoll could not have caused the wound seen in the Zapruder film or the wound described by the doctors, because JFK was looking to his left.

I want to say for the record that I consider Tosh a friend. As such, I believe what he tells me, and have never had any reason to feel differently. Nevertheless, I don't consider being told a story to be sufficient by itself to uphold the standards of rigorous history. An example would be that despite having been told by Tosh that he flew Lisa Howard into Cuba, I didn't use it in my seminar. That doesn't mean that I didn't believe him. I have shared many laughs with Tosh (always a vital element for friendship), we have argued, and I have held him to the highest standards of consistency and scrutiny of which I am capable. I have independently corroborated Tosh sufficiently to satisfy myself that he has not lied to me. To learn differently would be a serious blow to friendship, any friendship. As an admitted covert operative, I certainly can assume that Tosh has lied, plenty. But that is not between us. I believe that he has been a direct witness to history and that he cares about that.

Shanet: I have read and reread Al Carrier's expert and thoughtful analysis of the South Knoll headshot. I'm obviously aware of Tosh's stated impression of a South Knoll shooter. I'm still not convinced to any degree of certainty by Al's argument, nor Tosh's argument that there was no North Knoll shooter on the basis of its degree of exposure. I can't get past the multiple angles and photos of this guy at the end of the Nix film:

There is still work to do. As Tosh said:

"Lets get back to work. Focus on our goals and help each other. Let us disagree with each other in the spirit of truth. Let us laugh and cry together as we unravel the mysteries of this complicated, but simple 'cold- case'."

Tim Carroll

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I want to say for the record that I consider Tosh a friend. As such, I believe what he tells me,

--------------------------

Don't believe him if he says Files is a fraud :D

Like Files, Tosh doesn't know everything, they only know their own part.

Wim

BTW FWIW, I believe the south knoll shot pierced through the windshield and hit JFK in the throat, not in the head. There is no evidence whatsoever for an entry in the left side of the head. There is however evidence for an entry in the right temple (among others Dennis David and David Mantik) The movement (back and to the left) also suggest that. The exit wound in the lower right back of the head is the exit of an EXPLOSION inside the skull, seeking the exit of least resistance, which was that area because a bullet from behind had hit a fraction of a second before. I believe otherwise it would have exited more to the left back side of the head. Just my opinion of course.

Edited by Wim Dankbaar

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Don't believe him if he says Files is a fraud  :D

Like Files, Tosh doesn't know everything, they only know their own part.

Wim

Tosh has not said to me that Files is a fraud. He has said he never knew of Files and never knowingly had contact with him. Life can be gray sometimes. Not being a Files believer doesn't mean someone is necessarily a disbeliever. If Files says Tosh flew him to L.A. to kill Marilyn Monroe, then Tosh would probably say that is untrue. At some point it comes down to a cost/benefit analysis of which stories warrant effort and attention, and which do not.

Tim

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wim

good points.

the film evidence is so compromised it is of limited value.

although I cannot agree with Fetzer that the whole thing is a HOAX (see website)

I am sure frames were removed to de-emphasize the slowness (braking) and many believe that the headshot frames were doctored. Certainly simultaneous or near simultaneous shots complicate the ability of researchers to understand the physics of the film-dubs. I have seen the windshield photo and I see a small crack, not an entrance hole, (usually a bullet sized hole with a corona).

Certainly the south knoll shooter could have fired the under emphasized

throat shot. Probably all three ambush snipers in the triangulated plan hit the President. Back, front and temple. Perhaps a "penetrating" round did the front-left to right-rear damage while a "deer rifle" round from the front-right "pushed" JFK

"back and to the left"

"back and to the left"

"back and to the left"

also, I am convinced by recent (david wimp) analysis, that any forward motion of JFK in the headshot frame of Zapruder was the result of the Brakes being applied by GREER, as agent HELLERMAN'S head also bobs forward at the same time.....

Keep plugging away, we are breaking new ground every day, and informing others.

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Tosh,

I read that you flew Roselli to Bimini once, where he met with Richard Nixon. Do you remember how you knew that he was to meet Nixon there?

Wim

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Tosh,

I read that you flew Roselli to Bimini once, where he met with Richard Nixon. Do you remember how you knew that he was to meet Nixon there?

Wim

Wim: I flew Roselli to Bimini more than once, but I do not recall saying I flew him there to meet with Nixon? Could you show me where I said that, or the source who said I said that? And when? I think you have me confussed with Files. I recall I was told by somebody that Files said Roselli was to meet Nixon in Bimini. I do not know anything about what and who Roselli meet in Bimini, but I doubt it was to meet Nixon. Of course that is only speculation and opinion on my part... the same goes for Files and others who say Rosellie was there to meet with Nixion. Can you be spacific and send me hard copy backup? Thanks

Edited by William Plumlee

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No no, it's in one of your documents, unless I am very mistaken. I will look it up.

Wim

Thanks Wim: There was an FBI document that had said THEY THOUGHT I had flown Roselli to Bimini...,I don' think there was anything said about Nixion. However, I did challenge that document as not being authenic, because it had not been in the 242 FOIA pages released to Bernard Fensterwald in 1981. [Jim Marrs, Peter Lemkin, and I numbered the released FOIA 1981 pages in 1991, in Texas]

I told XXXX that I thought the FBI page and the Flight Plan in New Mwxico had been tampered with and planted by ??? for whatever reasons. These two documents had not been numbered. Any help on this would be apreciated. Thanks again.

Edited by William Plumlee

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This is the document I mean, end of third paragraph:

http://tosh.jfkmurdersolved.com/pdf/fbi1.PDF

I would love it if you could fill in some of the redacted names.

Wim

Thanks Wim: Good work. I did fly Roselli at this time. Later I was told (or perhaps asked, can't remember) by the FBI that it was for a meeting with Blank and Nixon. This was three weeks or so later. I was also later told that same story by another FBI (SAC Tanner) agent in Miami. They thought that Rosellie went there to meet with Blank and Nixon was also there for this meeting. They asked ME if I knew about this. I did not. Hence the statement... "I learned three weeks later from them, the FBI". This PHX-OO-72-73 file was a clasified document, declassified in 1999 and did not go to the HSCA in 1978 as did the other FBI documents that were later declassified in 1981 [There are two sets of different FBI documents, declassified in 1981 and 1999]

As to the blank parts I have to be careful here because this is still classified matters on file as National Security Matters. I know you would like for me to violate that in order for me to help the research community.. but I will not. If I did this WHO would stand behind me? It would be like RATS deserting a sinking ship. Get what you want and then split and write books about it while I go to jail... No ThANKS. I am trying as I write this to get these portions and names declassified...., so far to no avail. Most of these people are still alive.

On another point: I did tell some of the Dick Clark people(1992) that the FBI thought I had flown Roselli to Bimini and I was told by them about Nixon. Joe West was there, as well as others. Later I herd about the Files statement.

Edited by William Plumlee

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