New Article by John Armstrong

[Sandy Larsen]

19 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

How many folks named "Lee Harvey Oswald" do you suppose there were in the USA in 1963?

Whatever the number -- will you then argue that ALL OF THEM were involved in the JFK Assassination?

Paul,

We are not talking about the United States of America, which had a population of 150 million in the 1950s. We are talking about a single school in New Orleans. Do you honestly believe there could have been two students of the same age, attending the same school, the same year, sharing the same name, Lee Harvey Oswald? AND with the first one attending only the first semester, and the second one only the second semester?

That would have been one hell of a coincidence!

Especially considering that a similar situation occurred involving the same Lee Harvey Oswald at yet another school!

 

[Paul Trejo]

2 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

Paul,

We are not talking about the United States of America, which had a population of 150 million in the 1950s. We are talking about a single school in New Orleans. Do you honestly believe there could have been two students of the same age, attending the same school, the same year, sharing the same name, Lee Harvey Oswald? AND with the first one attending only the first semester, and the second one only the second semester?

That would have been one hell of a coincidence!

Especially considering that a similar situation occurred involving the same Lee Harvey Oswald at yet another school!

Sandy,

Sounds like spy fiction at first glance.

Yet I want to see your evidence, slowly -- sentence by sentence -- in time sequence.

Please show me your documents for the first school to prove it wasn't a bureaucratic error.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited December 14, 2017 by Paul Trejo

[Jim Hargrove]

DJ,

I don’t think we need to ask our hosts to protect us here.  If Mr. Walton wants to try and “debate” using elementary school taunts and name-calling, that reflects on him, not us.

Megathanks to the Education Forum hosts and mods for putting up with all of us and making this free debate possible. 

[Sandy Larsen]

1 hour ago, Paul Trejo said:

Sandy,

Sounds like spy fiction at first glance.

Yet I want to see your evidence, slowly -- sentence by sentence -- in time sequence.

Please show me your documents for the first school to prove it wasn't a bureaucratic error.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

 

Paul,

Here is Oswald's school record for Public School #44 in New York City:

There's a top section, middle section, and bottom section. Focus on the middle section

The middle section gives the final "Rating" (a score on a scale from 0 to 100) Oswald received in each class he took. Each COLUMN represents a semester. Above each column it gives the beginning date ("Year Beginning") and grade level ("Official Class"). The third column over from the left is the one of interest. You will see that that semester began in September 1953 ("9/53") and was the first semester of eighth grade ("8-8").

Note: The "Official Class" was notated as follows:  "[current grade level] -- [next grade level]".  For example, the first semester of 8th grade was written as "8-8" whereas the second semester of 8th grade was written as "8-9".

Looking at column 3, we see that for the first semester of 8th grade Oswald received a score of 65 in Language Arts (English), 65 in Mathematics, 65 in Social Studies, 80 in Directed Physical Activities (physical education), 65 in Music, and 40 in Fine Arts. Also an 80 in a class I can't make out.

Do you have any questions before I show the Beauregard Junior High School record? The one Oswald also attended during the first semester of 8th grade?

 

Edited December 14, 2017 by Sandy Larsen

[Paul Trejo]

1 hour ago, Sandy Larsen said:

Paul,

Here is Oswald's school record for Public School #44 in New York City:

There's a top section, middle section, and bottom section. Focus on the middle section

The middle section gives the final "Rating" (a score on a scale from 0 to 100) Oswald received in each class he took. Each COLUMN represents a semester. Above each column it gives the beginning date ("Year Beginning") and grade level ("Official Class"). The third column over from the left is the one of interest. You will see that that semester began in September 1953 ("9/53") and was the first semester of eighth grade ("8-8").

Note: The "Official Class" was notated as follows:  "[current grade level] -- [next grade level]".  For example, the first semester of 8th grade was written as "8-8" whereas the second semester of 8th grade was written as "8-9".

Looking at column 3, we see that for the first semester of 8th grade Oswald received a score of 65 in Language Arts (English), 65 in Mathematics, 65 in Social Studies, 80 in Directed Physical Activities (physical education), 65 in Music, and 40 in Fine Arts. Also an 80 in a class I can't make out.

Do you have any questions before I show the Beauregard Junior High School record? The one Oswald also attended during the first semester of 8th grade?

Sandy,

Nice record of 9/1952- 3/1953 and 9/1953 grades of Lee Harvey Oswald at Jr. High School in New York City.

It's interesting that Lee's grades were low in the semester of 9/1952, but rose sharply in 2/1953.  Perhaps this is because Lee was truant for much of 9/1952, or perhaps Lee registered late in the semester.

By all means, share the next file with us, please.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited December 14, 2017 by Paul Trejo

[Sandy Larsen]

2 minutes ago, Paul Trejo said:

Sandy,

Nice record of 9/1952- 3/1953 and 9/1953 grades of Lee Harvey Oswald at Jr. High School in New York City.

It's interesting that Lee's grades were low in the semester of 9/1952, but rose sharply in 2/1953.  Perhaps this is because Lee was truant for much of 9/1952, or perhaps Lee registered late in the semester.

By all means, share the next file with us, please.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

 

Thanks Paul.

Here is the school record for Oswald attending Beauregard Junior High School in New Orleans:

 

Texas school records used rows for semesters and columns for classes taken... the opposite of the way New York did it. Each row represents one semester. If you look at the far right of the rows you will see that the top two rows are for the 1953/54 school year. The third row gives the total score for that school year. That is, for each class taken in those two semesters, the average of the two scores  is computed and entered on the third row. As you can see, the same was done for the three rows below those, for the 1954/55 school year.

The row to focus on is the top one, which has been highlighted yellow, as this is the first semester of the 1953/54 school year. (The first semester of a school year typically begins in September, but may begin in August depending upon which state the school is located in.)

Looking at top row, we see that for the first semester of 8th grade Oswald received a score of 70 in General Science and 70 in Physical Education. (I can't make out the second digit in the General Science score. So the score maybe a little higher than 70.)

And there we have it. During the first semester of the 1953/54 school year, Oswald attended two school simultaneously. And although he attended only part time at Beauregard, this contradiction cannot be explained away by saying the boy was attending one school early in the day and the other school later in the day, because the two schools are located in different states.

Now, if this was the only evidence we had of Oswald being in two places at the same time, then I would chalk this contradiction up to being some kind of weird hard-to-explain error. But there are several other cases, and as a whole the evidence is very strong.

 

[W. Tracy Parnell]

1 hour ago, Sandy Larsen said:

And there we have it. During the first semester of the 1953/54 school year, Oswald attended two school simultaneously. And although he attended only part time at Beauregard, this contradiction cannot be explained away by saying the boy was attending one school early in the day and the other school later in the day, because the two schools are located in different states.

And if there were no alternative explanations this might be powerful evidence for the H&L theory. But of course, there are other explanations such as this one provided by Greg Parker:

https://reopenkennedycase.forumotion.net/t1500-one-more-attempt-at-those-darn-school-records

If you disagree, get over to his site and debate him. It would be a moderated debate with the very fair Vanessa Loney as moderator.

[David Josephs]

On ‎12‎/‎14‎/‎2017 at 12:18 PM, W. Tracy Parnell said:

And if there were no alternative explanations this might be powerful evidence for the H&L theory. But of course, there are other explanations such as this one provided by Greg Parker:

https://reopenkennedycase.forumotion.net/t1500-one-more-attempt-at-those-darn-school-records

If you disagree, get over to his site and debate him. It would be a moderated debate with the very fair Vanessa Loney as moderator.

Tracy - I've posted this before...  I agree with you and Greg that the BJHS record does not...NOT... prove that an Oswald was attending school in NYC and BJHS at the same time... the records were created so they show an Oswald attending in NYC during the Fall 53-54 school year thru January 8, 1954.  The BJHS record shows the results from WHAT I CAN TELL are 3-6 weeks of the FALL semester at BJHS.  The student received a grade in one class, General Science, a 70... and no grades for the other classes he MAY have sat in on...

That doesn't mean I conclude these are accurate records... 

==============

He writes:  This whole thing hinges on Mr Head changing his mind about what "re-ad" meant when in fact, he got it right the first time.  Mr. Head was not however a teacher at Beauregard so his umming and ahhing over the meaning is understandable. What's not understandable is any sane person wanting the facts, to keep ignoring the meaning which best makes sense of the records by making the figures add up correctly.

In Oswald's case, the total number of school days was indeed, 180

Additionally... if we add Sandy's NY 78 and his Beauregard 90 days... we get... the total number of "re-ad" days of 168 as shown on the Beauregard record

Again- "re-ad" is simply short for "re-adjust" or "add in" - you do that by noting the number of days available in the balance of the school school year after absences
170 to 186 instructional days (with an average of 180).https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academic_term
 

===================

GP, shown just above, explains that the "Re-Ad" # plus the Absent # equals the total # of days a student could potentially attend....  OR the total # of school days MINUS absences equals Re-Ad.

Except the record shows 179 "Re-Ad" for the 53-54 year plus the 5 absences equals 184 days in that school year... (71.8 are TOTAL UNITS and have nothing to do with school days)
But as shown, 184 school days is fine.... (170 to 186)

The 168 that Greg refers to here is for the following school year... with 180 days.  168 "Re-Ad" days plus 12 absences equals 180 total days... for 1954-55

Except none of the grade cards from 54-55 school year offers up 12 total absences.  They show 5, 5, 5, 6, 8, & 9 days absent for the 54-55 year...

If these are accurate records for this child Tracy...  Why is the 54-55 school year master record different from the grade cards from which the record is supposedly created?

Let's look a bit more at 54-55...  despite your skepticism, KUDLATY states that Oswald attended Stripling in the fall of 1954 for about 6 weeks.

Frank J. Kudlaty - began teaching at Stripling in fall of 1951; Assis Principal of Stripling in 1963; quit in 1964; now Superintendent of Schools in Waco, TX - was told by his boss, Weldon Lucas, the day after the assassination to meet two FBI agents at Stripling to pick up school records on Lee Oswald-gave those records to FBI; they showed him their badges for ID, he did not copy records (no copy machine at the school); obtained no receipt for records; does not know names of FBI agents; did not know or remember Oswald; thought Oswald attended 9th grade (not sure); files were incomplete

Marge Oswald lived in and/or owned 2220 Thomas, across the street from Stripling, from 1947 when  Lucille HUBBARD drives Mrs. O to 2220 Thomas to pick up some belongings.
Turns out 2220 Thomas was owned by a close friend of FRED KORTH and was the house Marge Oswald was living in on 11/22/63.

H&L offers interviews of students who clearly remember little Oswald across the street from the school as well as stories of visits and playing with other neighborhood children.

I realize this hinges on believing KUDLATY...  whether one does or not is up to the individual...  like Palmer.  They said what they said and followed it up with the same story... in fact correcting the one person who claims to have heard something different in their discussions.

We MUST agree that the FBI is complicit in the "changing" of evidence" - yes?
We are NEVER shown by example what a "normal" record and supporting data looks like....
The total # of days is wrong on the NYC record and the # of days is wrong on the BJHS record... both copies from originals the FBI took...      

The originals are gone. 

===============

But I'd like to stay with this for a moment....  the record below can be interpreted in reality - as GP eludes to - in reality the numbers "12" and "168" are completely made up...  "12" has no basis in reality by looking at the source material for that number...  why Tracy, is this "real" record so wrong for the 54-55 year?

Why is it so hard to accept the evidence related to Oswald at 2220 Thomas at various times in her and little Ozzie's life?

Mr. JENNER. And, at that time, I take it your brother Lee was attending Arlington Heights High School? That would be 1952? 
Mr. OSWALD. Just a minute, please. In 1952 Lee was 13 years old. He would be attending W. C. Stripling Junior High School then. 

Mr. JENNER. As soon as he finished the sixth year at Ridglea Elementary School, he entered W. C. Stripling High School, as a seventh grader? 
Mr. OSWALD. Yes, sir--junior high school. 

And then he lies about visiting them in 1952.....  in NYC.. which Ed Pic testifies to.....

Mr. OSWALD. This was July or August of 1953. I had my orders to go to Miami, Fla. I took a 10-day leave and left Millington, Tenn., by car and came to New York City and spent 10 days in New York with Lee, mother, John, and his family. 

(the Bronx Zoo is supposedly Aug 1953)

Mr. JENNER. He was in New York City, was he not? 
Mr. OSWALD. 1953, yes, sir. 

He goes to NYC in July 1952

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 12, 2018 by David Josephs

[Jim Hargrove]

And, of course, Mr. Parnell would like you NOT to debate this subject here because what is on the web page he references is complete nonsense.  Without any evidence whatsoever,  Mr. Parker claims that the 89 days in the top “Re-Ad” column of the Beauregard cumulative record includes days Oswald attended PS 44 in New York City.  There are no forwarded records from PS 44 in Oswald’s Beauregard file.  The only mention of PS 44 in the Beauregard file is in a record that indicates he previously attended “PS #44-Byron Junior High" in New York City.

But there is no “Byron Junior High” in New York City and, according to the New York Historical Society, there never was.  Since there are PS 44s in at least four of the five New York City boroughs, how would Beauregard have requested information from an incorrectly identified school?  And if they had received information, why didn't they know the name of the school?  And if they did get information about Oswald's course work in NYC from a school they couldn't identify, why was Oswald in New Orleans given a passing grade in an entirely different course from the NYC courses he supposedly took that very semester? John wrote: “Perhaps a false name for the school was provided so that Beauregard school personnel would be unable to obtain Oswald's New York school transcripts by mail.”  H&L critics will tell you they have a better explanation, but they don't.

It is abundantly clear that "Oswald's" passing grades in the first semester at Beauregard had nothing to do with New York City.  It is also abundantly clear that the very next semester, one Oswald attends Beauregard School in New Orleans and the other Oswald attends Stripling School in Fort Worth, Texas.  By the way, both the NYC and Beauregard school records are published in the Warren volumes.

[Sandy Larsen]

3 hours ago, W. Tracy Parnell said:

And if there were no alternative explanations this might be powerful evidence for the H&L theory. But of course, there are other explanations such as this one provided by Greg Parker:

https://reopenkennedycase.forumotion.net/t1500-one-more-attempt-at-those-darn-school-records

If you disagree, get over to his site and debate him. It would be a moderated debate with the very fair Vanessa Loney as moderator.

Tracy,

For Paul's sake (so he wouldn't have to read Greg's long explanations) I clicked the link to Greg's page, to see if he'd come up with anything new.

It turns out that he and I agree on the meaning of "Re-ad" and what it is used for. I was late figuring that out because it is irrelevant to my argument, and so I didn't care much about it. I think Greg understood the correct procedure for calculating Re-ad a long time ago but was unaware of the the rationale for applying that procedure. The rationale behind it has to do with school funding.

But as I said, the Re-ad number is irrelevant to my argument... the argument I gave Paul.

Other than that, Greg apparently believes that Oswald attended the NYC school for a while -- perhaps half a semester -- got his grades there, then transferred to the NO school, finished up the semester there, and got his grades for those classes too.

You can't do that. In order to graduate to high school, a junior high school student is required to get a minimum number of credit units in certain core subjects like math, science, and English. In order to earn those credits the student must finish the course material, do homework, pass tests, and get a passing grade. Clearly if a student leaves a school half way through a semester, he won't come close to passing the class. He will get no credit from the school being left behind and will have to resume taking those same classes at the new school. He will get credit upon passing the class there.

So if Oswald did what Greg suggested, we would see no grades/credits earned at PS 44 in NYC, but instead some number of passed classes and credits earned at Beauregard in NO.

 

 

[Sandy Larsen]

2 hours ago, David Josephs said:

Tracy - I've posted this before...  I agree with you and Greg that the BJHS record does not...NOT... prove that an Oswald was attending school in NYC and BJHS at the same time... the records were created so they show an Oswald attending in NYC during the Fall 53-54 school year thru January 8, 1954.  The BJHS record shows the results from WHAT I CAN TELL are 3-6 weeks of the FALL semester at BJHS.  The student received a grade in one class, General Science, a 70... and no grades for the other classes he MAY have sat in on...

That doesn't mean I conclude these are accurate records... 

 

Just so that there be no confusion, my argument -- the simple one I presented to Paul Trejo -- assumes that the school records are real. If they were tampered with, that in and of itself would indicate that the FBI was hiding something from the public. Are we to believe they were hiding poor grades? Or great grades? Nah... they were hiding something sinister.

 

[W. Tracy Parnell]

Jim, David and Sandy,

I would like to see any or all of you go over to Greg's site and debate him on this issue. Maybe with a moderated debate, you could get to the bottom of it. I don't have the time or interest to debate it. But Greg is interested and has an alternate theory-why not debate him?

[Michael Walton]

21 hours ago, Jim Hargrove said:

DJ,

I don’t think we need to ask our hosts to protect us here.  If Mr. Walton wants to try and “debate” using elementary school taunts and name-calling, that reflects on him, not us.

Megathanks to the Education Forum hosts and mods for putting up with all of us and making this free debate possible. 

Jim - read my last reply to you.  It's respectable.  It's simply asking you that instead of going around in circles here, go to Consortium News.  Have Armstrong reach out to R Parry and say, "Look, we've been working on this for 20 years. We strongly believe we have a very good chance of breaking the JFK case wide open with this.  Can you just take a look at it and if you think there's a viable story for your readers, we can work with your reporter."

How hard would that be to do Jim? This is not "elementary school tactics" as you say - go to them and see if you can get this public and if they accept it, think of the potential history-making implications here.

But honestly I have to ask myself - why am I even typing this, doing the initial legwork for you? YOU and Team Hardly need to take the next step with it, not one of your detractors.

[Michael Walton]

21 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

Paul,

Here is Oswald's school record for Public School #44 in New York City:

Oh Sandy not those school records again!  Greg Parker and others totally debunked this as simple cases of written errors in the record.  I mean come on, don't you have anything new here?  A photo, perhaps, of the two LHO's together with the Secret Agent in the middle with his arms around both...and the two Marges behind the two LHO's?

[Jim Hargrove]

Beauregard personnel clearly didn’t know which of the four or five "PS 44" schools in New York City "Oswald" attended before Beauregard, and so it is unlikely that they obtained any records at all from that school.  With all those PS 44s in the five boroughs of NYC, and none of them was named “PS 44 Byron Jr. High,” as indicated on the Beauregard cumulative records.  H&L critics will just say mistakes happen, but I think there is a better explanation, which is that Beauregard was deliberately given the wrong NYC school information.

Why?  You have to look at the full picture. From New York City to New Orleans to Fort Worth, it is easy to trace the schools attended by both Oswalds.

John Pic told the Warren Commission that in the fall of ‘52 his brother enrolled in a school just a few blocks from his Manhattan apartment.  In his book, Robert Oswald said "Lee entered the 8th grade at P.S. 44 on Columbus Avenue at 76th St." This school is William J. O'Shea Junior High School, PS 44 in Manhattan, and is 2 1/2 miles from Pic's apartment. But the Warren Commission/FBI puts Oswald, at this time, at Trinity Lutheran School and PS 117 in the Bronx, and then at P.S. 44 in the Bronx, all eight miles or so from Pic’s apartment.

Assuming John Pic and Robert Oswald were right, it was LEE Oswald who attended school in Manhattan at least part of the time that HARVEY went to school in the Bronx.  And it was HARVEY who was perpetually truant and soon in trouble with NYC authorities. All of this may have been more easily untangled but right after the assassination, after Judge Florence Kelley gave the FBI original NYC school records of Oswald's attendance, the originals all disappeared and the FBI soon gave the Warren Commission photographs of the documents.

HARVEY Oswald and his caretaker had to flee New York City because a scheduled court appearance over his truancy would have been too dangerous.  His caretaker mother could barely remember any of the details of her “son’s” alleged biography, and who knows what HARVEY might have said to a judge.  LEE Oswald and Marguerite soon had to flee New York as well, and for a very simple reason.  HARVEY Oswald had been perpetually truant, not LEE.  When hauled into court for truancy, can you imagine how angry LEE would have been?  The solution for both problems was found in New Orleans.

We've been discussing the Beauregad records in this thread, which show that one Oswald was in New Orleans while the other was in New York City. In the very next school year, Lee Oswald is at Beauregard and Harvey Oswald attends Stripling School in Fort Worth.

H&L critics would like you to believe that Stripling School assistant principal Frank Kudlaty was lying when he recalled giving LHO’s records to the FBI, as was Oswald’s Stripling classmate Francetta Schubert when she recalled Oswald’s presence at the school, and that Robert Oswald was mistaken when he testified to the Warren Commission that his “brother” attended Stripling, and when he was quoted in local newspapers twice before the assassination saying his brother attended the school, and that either John Armstrong or Ricardo Galindo, Stripling School principal in the late 1990s or both are lying because John reported that Mr. Galindo said it was “common knowledge” that Oswald attended Stripling.

Why?  Because all the school records published by the Warren Commission give no time for "Lee Harvey Oswald" to have attended the Fort Worth school.  According Warren Commission documents, Oswald was attending school elsewhere.

Frank Kudlaty was told by his principal to meet the FBI at Stripling School immediately after the assassination.  Mr. Kudlaty turned over the school records to the FBI, but they all disappeared.

Here’s Part 1 of a three part interview with Mr. Kudlaty:

 

In 1959, at the time LHO began his assignment as a secret agent in Russia, Robert Oswald told reporters that his brother had attended Stripling School.  

Fort Worth Star-Telegram Article from November 2017

 

Robert also told the Warren Commission that his brother attended Stripling:

Mr. Jenner: And, at that time, I take it your brother Lee was attending Arling­-
ton Heights High School? That would be 1952?
Mr. Oswald: Just a minute please. In 1952 Lee was 13 years old. He would be
attending W.C. Stripling Junior High School then.
Mr. Jenner: I see. For the school year 1951-52?
Mr. Oswald: Yes, sir. Junior high school there was from the seventh to the ninth
grades. And as soon as he finished the sixth year at Ridglea Elementary School,
he started attending W.C. Stripling Junior High school.
Mr. Jenner: As soon as he finished the sixth year at Ridglea Elementary School,
he entered W.C. Stripling High School as a seventh grader?
Mr. Oswald: Yes, sir--junior high school.

Oswald’s Stripling classmate Fran Schubert recalled watching Oswald walk home from Stripling School to 2220 Thomas Place, where “Marguerite Oswald” lived at various times, including at the time of the assassination.

 

 

There are other witnesses to Oswald’s attendance at Stripling as well.  Stripling School principal Ricardo Galindo, told John in the late 1990s that it was “common knowledge” that Oswald attended the school, which is also indicated by a Fort Worth newspaper article from just last month.  John spoke to several other students and teachers at Stripling who recalled Oswald there but, of course, according to H&L critics, John is lying about that too.

In the online edition of the Fort Worth Star-Telegram from just last month, it was reported that even people without much knowledge of “Lee Harvey Oswald” knew he attended Stripling School.  It reports that Oswald’s “teachers and classmates remember him at Stripling, though there is no official record.”

Read it here:

Fort Worth Star-Telegram Article from November 2017

 

Edited December 15, 2017 by Jim Hargrove