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Paul,

Originally Cecil McWatters said he gave a bus transfer to Oswald.  Then, later he mysteriously changes his story.  Like many witnesses confronted by investigators, stories changed and when the person refused to change the story to match the government's theory, they wound up dead.  Take Lee Bowers for example.  My mom grew-up with Bowers and said he is as honest as the day is long.

Here's the original interview

 

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Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, Rich Pope said:

Paul,

Originally Cecil McWatters said he gave a bus transfer to Oswald.  Then, later he mysteriously changes his story.  Like many witnesses confronted by investigators, stories changed and when the person refused to change the story to match the government's theory, they wound up dead.  Take Lee Bowers for example.  My mom grew-up with Bowers and said he is as honest as the day is long.

Here's the original interview..

Rich,

It's an interesting historical fact that your mother grew up with Lee Bowers.   I agree that Lee Bowers' WC testimony was truthful and strong-minded.

I also agree that he was probably murdered because of his firm position on the JFK Assassination.   Yet did you ever notice that those many witnesses who died mysteriously after taking positions on the JFK Assassination were killed INSIDE DALLAS?

The likely explanation, in my opinion, is that there was a group of renegades from the Radical Right (perhaps including some rogue Dallas Police) who wished to silence anybody who made their detection more likely.

IN ANY CASE, Rich, this has nothing to do with Cecil McWatters.   NOTHING.

You say (and that video says) that Cecil McWatters changed his story.   That's very unclear.  His FIRST story wasn't a positive identification of Lee Harvey Oswald in the FIRST place!  It was hemming and hawing, as if he was trying to please the Dallas Police.  He was not a strong-minded speaker.

FINALLY -- since you already admit that Cecil McWatters changed his story, then why bother defending his story at all?   Just admit that he's already disqualified himself, and let's move on to the next witness.   I can show that they are ALL just as bogus.   It's easy to do.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo

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Posted (edited)
Paul Trejo said:

This accomplice [who was driving a green Rambler] drove LHO near to his rooming house as they talked about what might have happened, and what the other Kill-Fidel plotters might be doing -- and how he might connect with them.

Paul,

Do you have any idea WHY "Rambler Man" decided to just ABANDON Lee Oswald after driving him to his roominghouse on Beckley?

And....

Since you think LHO had an accomplice to drive him from point to point after the assassination, then why did Oswald even NEED to stop at his roominghouse and pick up his pistol (and thus run the risk of being captured)? Why didn't Rambler Man prepare things better and have a couple of revolvers at the ready for their "getaway"?

What a bunch of sloppy, unprepared boobs these conspirators were.

 

Edited by David Von Pein

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Paul,

I'm sorry.  I gave you the wrong Youtube link.  The one I wanted you to see was this one...I believe both of these guys.

 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, David Von Pein said:

Paul,

Do you have any idea WHY "Rambler Man" decided to just ABANDON Lee Oswald after driving him to his roominghouse on Beckley?

And....

Since you think LHO had an accomplice to drive him from point to point after the assassination, then why did Oswald even NEED to stop at his roominghouse and pick up his pistol (and thus run the risk of being captured)? Why didn't Rambler Man prepare things better and have a couple of revolvers at the ready for their "getaway"?

What a bunch of sloppy, unprepared boobs these conspirators were.

David,

You are making SO MANY ASSUMPTIONS in your clip there, but, oh, well...  You want me to guess the role of Rambler Man?    

My guesswork (based on the Walker-did-it CT) surmises that Rambler Man was recognized by Lee Harvey Oswald as part of the Kill-Fidel plot (yet was secretly part of the Kill-JFK plot) and did not want to risk being seen with Oswald any more than absolutely necessary.  

Also, I would guess that Rambler Man told Oswald to walk over to the Texas Theater (which wasn't too far from the rooming house) to meet another Kill-Fidel accomplice there, who would provide more information.   I guess that, because that's basically what Oswald did.

These weren't sloppy boobs --- they were brilliant in their execution of the JFK Assassination and their manipulation of the Patsy.   Brilliant.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo

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Posted (edited)
30 minutes ago, Rich Pope said:

Paul,

I'm sorry.  I gave you the wrong Youtube link.  The one I wanted you to see was this one...I believe both of these guys....

Rich,

What part of their stories nails Lee Harvey Oswald for you?

In my opinion, both of these guys were pals of Dallas Police, and their stories clearly accommodated Police requests for backup.

It's incorrect to decide WC testimony based on videos!  I'm asking you to pinpoint their WC testimony that nails Lee Harvey Oswald.

You have evaded that task -- probably because you have nothing -- because there is nothing.

Why do I disbelieve William Whaley the taxi driver?   Here's why.  Here's a snippet from his WC testimony:

Mr. BALL. Did you notice how he was dressed? 
Mr. WHALEY. Yes, sir. I didn't pay much attention to it right then. But it all came back when I really found out who I had.
...

Mr. BALL. Later that day did you--were you called down to the police department? 
Mr. WHALEY. No, sir. 
Mr. BALL. Were you the next day? 
Mr. WHALEY. No, sir; they came and got me, sir, the next day after I told my superior when I saw in the paper his picture, I told my superiors that that had been my passenger that day at noon. They called up the police and they came up and got me. 
Mr. BALL. When you saw in the newspaper the picture of the man? 
Mr. WHALEY. Yes, sir.
... 
Mr. BALL. Did he look dirty? 
Mr. WHALEY. He looked like his clothes had been slept in, sir, but he wasn't actually dirty. The T-shirt was a little soiled around the collar but the bottom part of it was white. You have to know those winos, or they will get in and ride with you and there isn't nothing you can do but call the police, the city gets the fine and you get nothing. 

In my opinion, that snippet is not the testimony of a credible witness.  He got on a horse named "mistaken identity," and the Dallas Police would not let him get off.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo

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Posted (edited)

Too much "guessing" as far as I'm concerned.  I can hear the defense attorney shouting, "Objection!  Calls for speculation!"  Everyone is a dishonest when it doesn't fit the narrative.  I have a fun question.  Why did Lee Oswald need curtain rods when his room at the boarding house had blinds and curtains?  Was he planning on doing some decorating?

Edited by Rich Pope

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Why do you think they were pals of the Dallas Police?  Did they say they were?  Did any family member say they were?  Did the police say they were?  Besides you, who has said this?

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Posted (edited)
34 minutes ago, Rich Pope said:

Too much "guessing" as far as I'm concerned.  I can hear the defense attorney shouting, "Objection!  Calls for speculation!"  Everyone is a dishonest when it doesn't fit the narrative.  I have a fun question.  Why did Lee Oswald need curtain rods when his room at the boarding house had blinds and curtains?  Was he planning on doing some decorating?

Rich,

Are you really going to raise the "guesswork" card on a web site about Conspiracy Theories?    

In any case, let's move on to your "fun" question.

In my opinion -- based on the publications of AJ Weberman and his interviews of Gerry Patrick Hemming -- the testimony of Buell Wesley Frazier and his sister about Oswald's "curtain rods" fabrication, is completely credible.

Of course Oswald needed no curtain rods -- it was a lie -- a fabrication.   I believe the account given by Weberman explains it all very well. 

Gerry Patrick Hemming, who was recognized by Oswald as a member of the Kill-Fidel Team (yet was a secret member of the JFK Kill-Team) contacted Lee Harvey Oswald from Miami by using a public telephone, and offered him double the price of his Manlicher-Carcano rifle if he would bring it to the TSBD the next morning.

The object was for some pal of Hemming to pick up the rifle outside the TSBD in the morning, no questions asked.  Since Oswald was quite poor, and his second child had just been born, it was an easy sale -- especially since Oswald trusted his Kill-Fidel comrades so well.

This satisfactorily (for me) explains Oswald's surprise request for a ride on Thursday (instead of Friday).   It also explains Oswald's fabrication about "curtain rods."

Now -- "curtain rods" are not the same length as a rifle (even a dismantled rifle) -- yet Buell Wesley Frazier blindly accepted the claim by his good ole pal, Lee Harvey Oswald.   Once done, he had to defend his story to a hostile Dallas environment, which at one point sought to make this teenager into an ACCOMPLICE in the JFK Assassination.  Wesley really had to work to defend his story, but he had no choice.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo

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Posted (edited)
21 minutes ago, Rich Pope said:

Why do you think they were pals of the Dallas Police?  Did they say they were?  Did any family member say they were?  Did the police say they were?  Besides you, who has said this?

Rich,

You said your mother grew up with Lee Bowers.   Did you grow up in Texas?    I'm referring here to Texas culture -- as well as to Dallas culture.  Do you know about Dallas culture in 1970 or 1980?

You asked for my opinion and I shared it with you.  I've read that nowhere else.  

These guys were lifers on the street -- literally.   Bus and taxi -- what a lifetime job.  In such a job, in Dallas culture, the beat cops are likely to be your best pals, because they, too, are lifers on the street -- and heroes, too.

In any case, Rich, you keep evading my key question back to you.   What part of their WC testimony nails Oswald for you?

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo

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Paul,

Just out of curiosity, have you read Stephen King's book 11.22.63 or seen it on Hulu?  I liked the whole thing as "entertainment" except the ending when the main character returns to a world devastated by nuclear war.  

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12 minutes ago, Rich Pope said:

Paul,

Just out of curiosity, have you read Stephen King's book 11.22.63 or seen it on Hulu?  I liked the whole thing as "entertainment" except the ending when the main character returns to a world devastated by nuclear war.  

Rich,

I haven't seen King's movie, 11.22.63, nor am I much interested in fiction -- especially about the JFK Assassination.   There's so much fiction in the CT Community that I'm turned off by it.   It's been decades, so I want to see how this story really ends.   WHO KILLED JFK??  We know that Lee Harvey Oswald was never alone in this exceptionally well-planned maneuver.  

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Paul Trejo said:

David,

You are making SO MANY ASSUMPTIONS in your clip there, but, oh, well...  You want me to guess the role of Rambler Man?    

My guesswork (based on the Walker-did-it CT) surmises that Rambler Man was recognized by Lee Harvey Oswald as part of the Kill-Fidel plot (yet was secretly part of the Kill-JFK plot) and did not want to risk being seen with Oswald any more than absolutely necessary.

[...]

These weren't sloppy boobs --- they were brilliant in their execution of the JFK Assassination and their manipulation of the Patsy. Brilliant.

So Rambler Man decides to pick up Oswald---IN BROAD DAYLIGHT---right in front of the Depository just after the shooting---with tons of witnesses around who could potentially see LHO get into his car??? But then, after getting safely out of Dealey Plaza, Rambler Man decides to not stick around and wait for his co-plotter named Oswald on Beckley Avenue. The Rambler Man, instead, takes off and leaves Oswald to fend for himself, even though Beckley Avenue isn't anywhere near as crowded with "assassination witnesses" as was Dealey Plaza. In fact, there's NOBODY around on Beckley to scare off Rambler Man. (And all that is supposedly part of this "brilliant" assassination plan??)

Face it, Paul, your theory has virtually NO basis in actual FACT. You've got Roger Craig's Rambler story, sure. But when we couple THAT story with the VERIFIED PROOF that Oswald could not possibly have gotten in that Nash Rambler when Craig said he did, the "Oswald Got Into A Rambler" story falls completely apart.

In other words --- Why do conspiracy theorists so often hang onto the WORST evidence and always discard the BEST?

Edited by David Von Pein

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10 minutes ago, David Von Pein said:

So Rambler Man decides to pick up Oswald---IN BROAD DAYLIGHT---right in front of the Depository just after the shooting---with tons of witnesses around who could see LHO get into his car??? (And that's supposedly part of this "brilliant" assassination plan??) But then, after getting safely out of Dealey Plaza, Rambler Man decides to not stick around and wait for his co-plotter named Oswald on Beckley Avenue. The Rambler Man, instead, takes off and leaves Oswald to fend for himself, even though Beckley Avenue isn't anywhere near as crowded with "assassination witwesses" as was Dealey Plaza. In fact, there's NOBODY around on Beckley to scare off Rambler Man.

Face it, Paul, your theory has virtually NO basis in actual FACT. You've got Roger Craig's Rambler story, sure. But when we couple THAT story with the VERIFIED PROOF that Oswald could not possibly have gotten in the Rambler when Craig said he did, the "Oswald Got Into A Rambler" story falls completely apart.

IOW --- Why do CTers so often hang onto the WORST evidence and always discard the BEST?

David,

You make SO MANY ASSUMPTIONS.   Who noticed Rambler Man?   Hundreds of witnesses?  No?   Dozens of witnesses?  No?   A dozen?  No?  Two?  No?

ONLY ONE WITNESS noticed Rambler Man, namely, Dallas Deputy Roger Craig.  He gave his testimony to the WC -- and he was DISBELIEVED.

Why did the WC disbelieve Roger Craig?   Because the rest of the Dallas Police witnesses claimed he was wrong.   They had a BUS TICKET.  They had a BUSS PASSENGER.   They had a TAXI DRIVER.   No matter that their WC testimonies crumble upon first glance -- the Dallas Police were never going to agree to any scenario in which Lee Harvey Oswald had ACCOMPLICES.

You assume that Rambler Man was there to "rescue" Oswald or to "protect" Oswald.  That's your ASSUMPTION.   You have nothing to back that up.

Clearly, given Roger Craig's WC testimony, and the events that transpired, the only task of Rambler Man was to deliver Oswald to his rooming house.  What that might have to do with the Dallas Police who came by that rooming house, honked twice and drove off -- we can't yet connect.  Yet these are the FACTS as reported by WC testimony.

Finally, David, as for your last question there.   CTers differ fundamentally on the WC witnesses that they accept and that they reject.  I accept almost all of the WC witnesses, except for Dallas officials.  That's my main position.  Most Dallas citizens were truthful and innocent of wrongdoing in this case.  Yet in my opinion -- in my CT -- the Radical Right (Walker, Surrey, Weissman...) and the whole Dallas Police and Deputy force are PRIME SUSPECTS in both the JFK Assassination and the murder of Oswald in their care.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

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Posted (edited)
52 minutes ago, Paul Trejo said:

David, You make SO MANY ASSUMPTIONS....

It's rather humorous to see those words—"You make SO MANY ASSUMPTIONS"—being aimed at me by a conspiracist, especially after being treated to the following array of wholly unsupportable "ASSUMPTIONS" authored by Mr. Trejo in just the span of the last three days....

[Paul Trejo Quotes On:]

"The JFK Assassination caught Lee Harvey Oswald entirely by surprise. LHO knew nothing about it."

"LHO still believed that he was part of a top secret plot to kill Fidel Castro (and patriotically lying to the Soviets)."

"From behind the monument of the Grassy Knoll, LHO watched for any Kill-Fidel accomplices."

"This accomplice [in the green Nash Rambler station wagon] drove LHO near to his rooming house as they talked about what might have happened, and what the other Kill-Fidel plotters might be doing -- and how he might connect with them."

"LHO felt certain that his Kill-Fidel connections would give him proper guidance."

"On his way to the Texas Theater, he was stopped by JD Tippit and Roscoe White."

"Roscoe White was a compromised Dallas cop. So was JD Tippit, allegedly. The story goes even deeper when we count all the Dallas cops who were more or less secretly connected with General Walker and the Radical Right in Dallas in 1963."

"LHO was well-acquainted with Roscoe White, who was the "body double" of his own Backyard Photographs."

"Marina had taken one (and only one) photo of LHO with his weapons and wearing black, while LHO and Roscoe worked after hours at Jaggars-Chiles-Stovall to forge four "plausibly deniable" FAKE Backyard Photos with LHO's face pasted onto Roscoe White's body."

"Roscoe White also shot at Tippit."

"LHO and Roscoe White both ran off in different directions."

"LHO watched and waited for his Kill-Fidel accomplices."

"I admit that the bus ticket is real -- however -- I maintain that it was NOT found in Lee Harvey Oswald's pocket. Rather, the Dallas Police got it from some street source and claimed it as a support to the charge that LHO was a Lone Shooter who had NO ACCOMPLICES."


"[Lee Bowers] was probably murdered because of his firm position on the JFK Assassination."

"The likely explanation, in my opinion, is that there was a group of renegades from the Radical Right (perhaps including some rogue Dallas Police) who wished to silence anybody who made their detection more likely."

"I would guess that Rambler Man told Oswald to walk over to the Texas Theater...to meet another Kill-Fidel accomplice there."

"The Radical Right (Walker, Surrey, Weissman...) and the whole Dallas Police and Deputy force are PRIME SUSPECTS in both the JFK Assassination and the murder of Oswald in their care."

"Captain Will Fritz lied and lied and lied."

[End quotes by Paul Trejo, every one of which is filled to the brim with "ASSUMPTIONS"---not to mention make-believe fantasies.]

Can somebody say "POT & KETTLE"?

Edited by David Von Pein

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