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Posted (edited)

For a little telephone reality check,  a WATS line was a paid commercial line, normally paid for by a commercial entity and that business gave its employees the dial in WATs number for their business use.  I used WATs lines from different employers over the years.  There would be no mystery to it, no need for any special arrangement pressuring a phone company.  The trick would be registering the WATs line to one of the two parties involved or obtaining one for both so either could originate the call..and covering the payments of course.

For a little background on how WATs worked:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wide_Area_Telephone_Service

 

Edited by Larry Hancock

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3 hours ago, David Von Pein said:

I didn't realize that Oswald was released after he was arrested. That's news to me. [Obligatory: :)]

HA HA HA.  Nice.

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3 hours ago, Rich Pope said:

Cory,

You really don't understand how things worked back then.  If the government knocks on your door and you're the only telephone company in Texas, you give the government what they want, regardless of any Justice Department warrants being issued.  Southwestern Bell gave the WATS line information to the Central Intelligence Agency.  The Central Intelligence Agency gave the information to David Ferrie and he gave it to Judyth.  There's no explosive allegations being made her.  It's a simple transaction that allowed for plausible deniability.  And if things get too hot, discredit Judyth Baker.  

Regardless of your list of questions, the shooter is known.  The shooter was arrested and later released by the Dallas Police Department.  

 

 

Ok,

I tried.

I do not have time to waste, if you are not going to answer the questions.

I mean really, how many times can you be asked?  No, the shooter is not known.  So please, educate all of us.  Give us his name.  Name him!  Nope.

But instead, you offer vague answers. 

Its ok.  I see what you are doing.  Really, its ok, you have another purpose for these little posts-which is strange since you said you were going to stop posting.

Since you will not answer the questions, anyone else feel free to try and get a straight answer?

I dont see a point to continuing this if you will not answer even the simple question of who the shooter is.

 

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10 minutes ago, Larry Hancock said:

For a little telophone reality check,  a WATS line was a paid commercial line, normally paid for by a commercial entity and that business gave its employees the dial in WATs number for their business use.  I used WATs lines from different employers over the years.  There would be no mystery to it, no need for any special arrangement pressuring a phone company.  The trick would be registering the WATs line to one of the two parties involved or obtaining one for both so either could originate the call..and covering the payments of course.

For a little background on how WATs worked:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wide_Area_Telephone_Service

 

Yes, and lets give LHO-the patsy who will shoot the president or at least be blamed for it- and JVB a line that is traceable to the CIA as it had to be paid for, or did it?  Aw, I see, a free line was given out no one had documents about.

Ok, so then prove it was given out.  Alas, you cannot because it was part of the super secret club.  Ok, but this proves JVB is credible to you.

But, one asks, how, there is nothing that can prove this line existed but that is the icing on the cake, see, because it so neatly keeps the story true... that is nothing can prove or disprove it.

Shaking my head.  Ok.  Anyone else see the problem here?

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Ok.  Well, it's been nice however, I'm moving on.  It was great chatting with all of you.  I thought this was the forum for me, but I was mistaken.  Good luck on your search and I hope you all find what you're looking for.                

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Henrik Fendt said:

I think Rich Pope was referring to Jack Lawrence (the alleged storm drain shooter), as per this documentary:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nyUqq-4vQMo

 

Henrik,

Yes, I believe you're right, since Rich Pope did extol this video in another thread.

To recap, this video repeats a fairly standard CIA-did-it CT, with the usual Mafia and Cuba Exile quislings, to name eight shooters, including:

 1.  Charles Nicoletti (Dal Tex, shot one, nicked James Tague)
 2.  Charles V. Harrelson (Grassy Knoll; JFK throat wound)
 3.  Frank Sturgis (west window of TSBD, Connaly ribs)
 4.  Eladio Del Valle (County Records Bldg, Connally wrist)
 5.  Harry Weatherford (County Records Bldg, Connally thigh)
   ***  Charles Nicoletti (Dal Tex, chrome frame of window)
 6.  Malcom Wallace (TSBD, JFK upper back)
    ** *  Charles V. Harrelson (Grassy Knoll, missed)
 7.  Curtis Lavern Craford (Storm Drain, Carousel Club)
 8.  Jack Alan Lawrence (Storm Drain, Lincoln-Mercury Cars)

Their positions included the tops of all the surrounding office buildings, the Grassy Knoll and the storm drain on Elm.  Full coverage.

At least 12 shots, claims this video.   Allen Dulles, Ed Lansdale, David Atlee Philiips, Richard Nixon and George Bush all present and accounted for.  It's an all star-cast, so that all bases are covered, evidently.  Though combining multiple source, the evidence as presented is the typical CIA-did-it CTers evidence -- 'because I said so."

HOWEVER -- this video does NOT say whether Curtis Lavern Craford or Jack Alan Lawrence was the storm drain shooter who made the famous JFK head-shot.  IT NAMES BOTH.

Yet, clearly, there was only one head shot, and two men could not shoot from that storm drain.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo

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4 minutes ago, Paul Trejo said:

Henrik,

Yes, I believe you're right, since Rich Pope did extol this video in another thread.

To recap, this video repeats a fairly standard CIA-did-it CT, with the usual Mafia and Cuba Exile quislings, to name several shooters, including:

1.  Charles Nicoletti
2.  Lloyd Harrelson
3.  Frank Sturgis
4.  Eladio Del Valle
5.  John Weatherford
6.  Malcom Wallace
7.  Curtis Larry Crawford
8.  Jack Alan Lawrence

Their positions included the tops of all the surrounding office buildings, the Grassy Knoll and the storm drain on Elm.  Full coverage.

All least 12 shots, claims this video.   Allen Dulles, Ed Lansdale, David Atlee Philiips, Richard Nixon and George Bush all present and accounted for.

It's an all star-cast, so that all bases are covered, evidently.  The evidence presented is the typical CIA-did-it CTers evidence -- 'because I said so."

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

"The evidence presented is the typical CIA-did-it CTers evidence -- 'because I said so."

 

A lot like your Walker scenario, eh, Paul.

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Posted (edited)

OK, now I feel punked.  Rich Pope had pressed me for detail after detail about my CT -- but when asked about his own CT, he fell curiously silent.

When pressed, he let slip that his "secret" CT was simply borrowed from somebody else's CT.

So, now it seems that some fiction writer with an alias of "Rich Pope" was suffering from writer's block and so came onto our Forum to fish for ideas.

Now I feel punked.

--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo

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Posted (edited)

I know it's difficult to come to terms with the fact that the shooter has been staring you in the face after so many years of your own, personal research.  And no, the shooter is not LHO.  It isn't James Files and it isn't Loy Factor.  It's difficult because you really have solved the "mystery" and now what are you going to do?  It's kind of like raising kids.  They go off to college, get jobs and you are now at home with your wife, all alone.  What are you going to do with the time you have on your hands since you don't have to raise your kids any more?

I know what I'm going to do.  I'm going to keep reading JFK books because the subject is interesting.  However, it's not going to be a mad search for names and places.  We already know all of the names and places.  It's just to keep the memory of JFK alive and well in my mind.  Like I said in another post, there are a few people left who know a lot about JFK.  The CIA is still going to redact their names from released documents as not to harm them or their reputation.  

My advice, if I had any would be to understand that there are so many people out there with information concerning the death of JFK.  I know things you don't know, and you have theories about things that I may not agree with.  However, you're never going to get someone to trust you enough to tell you what they know if you approach them with arrogance and ego.  Life just doesn't work that way.

 

 

Edited by Rich Pope

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Paul,

My name is not an alias.  And my casual conversations with you about your CT was nothing more than that, casual conversation.  Like I said, I came to this forum for two reasons.  The first, to prove that James Files could not have been the shooter.  I did that.  The second, was to show how Judyth Vary Baker got the telephone number to speak with Lee Oswald without incurring any long distance phone charges.  I did that as well.

I'm exactly who I say that I am.  My father is exactly who I said he was.  My information is 100% accurate.  I have nothing to prove except your green Rambler station wagon as LHO's get away car is a crock of xxxx.  Lee Bowers, probably the most important witness to the entire thing saw two cars.  A blue and white station wagon and a black Ford.  He saw NO green Rambler station wagon.  

Paul, you weren't punked.  You were just proven wrong .  That's all.  

 

Rich

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Posted (edited)
On 1/9/2018 at 12:02 PM, Rich Pope said:

Paul,

My name is not an alias....I have nothing to prove except your green Rambler station wagon as LHO's get away car is a crock of xxxx. 

Lee Bowers, probably the most important witness to the entire thing saw two cars.  A blue and white station wagon and a black Ford.  He saw NO green Rambler station wagon.  

Paul, you weren't punked.  You were just proven wrong .  That's all.  

Rich

Rich,

Never did I say that the Green Rambler was Oswald's getaway car.

Besides, that car belongs to Roger Craig's sworn WC testimony.  You don't get to swipe it away so easily.

Besides, Lee Bowers saw two cars on the NORTH side of the picket fence.  The Green Rambler was on the OTHER side, so Bowers be couldn't see it if Roger Craig WAS right.

Your mind is clearly made up, however.

As fir JVB, her CT is worth about a nickel, in my reading, for three reasons.

1.  She took decades before coming forward.

2.  Her CT builds on Jim Garrison and lots of later CT material.

3.  She exaggerates what was at most a 6-week affair with Oswald into some torrid romance novel.

You have far more work to do than you realize, if you really want to honor the memory of JFK.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo
typos

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Paul, from this last post of yours:

 

You do believe JVB did have an affair with Oswald?

 

Can you state some points in JVB's story that leaves you believe this?

Edited by Joe Bauer

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6 hours ago, Joe Bauer said:

Paul, from this last post of yours:

You do believe JVB did have an affair with Oswald?

Can you state some points in JVB's story that makes you believe this?

Joe,

I am agnostic on the question of Judyth Vary Baker (JVB) and her alleged love affair with Lee Harvey Oswald.   My point is that it is possible, but is not necessary to any story but her own.   

I disagree with those who portray Lee Harvey Oswald as a choir boy, even though I maintain he wasn't a shooter on 11/22/1963 (and even though I maintain that he was a shooter on 4/10/1963).

Yet the facts of his biography show him working at Reilly Coffee Company from May 10, 1963 to July 19, 1963 -- only about two months.  This was the period in which Oswald met JVB and if they had entered any relationship, it was casual.   At most it lasted 6 weeks in my guesswork, and more likely lasted one week, since during this period we can account for most of Oswald's movements with some assurance.

What opens the door is the WC testimony by his supervisor that Oswald was inexplicably absent during the workday, a few too many times for his supervisor's liking.   (But Oswald went home every night on schedule, during this period, according to Marina.)   So, any affair Oswald had was likely superficial, and if real, may have been intense only in JVB's imagination.

That said, I regard much of JVB's story to be guesswork gleaned from Jim Garrison's work.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo

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Paul,

It is well documented that Lee Oswald got on a bus, received a transfer, and then took a taxi to his boarding house.  You don't get to brush that away so easily either.

You are brushing away three witnesses when you dabble in that kind of arbitrary  behavior.  You brush aside the testimony of Oswald's former landlord who was on the bus and recognized him, the bus driver who gave the transfer, and the taxi driver.  All because it doesn't fit your narrative.

On another interesting note...I believe that Prayer Man is Lee Oswald taking pictures with his Imperial Reflex camera.  Bear in mind that it took 7 minutes for the police (as a whole) to focus their attention on the TSBD.  At first, police were rushing up the hill towards the picket fence of the grassy knoll because that is where everyone was pointing.

Lee, standing in the second floor lunch room buying a Coke is odd because Lee only drank Dr. Pepper and that machine was on the first floor.  Another odd thing is although the Carcano (car-kuh-no) was found on the 6th floor, along with 3 shell casings, no clip was ever found.  No screwdriver was found for those who claim he assembled his rifle and no, you cannot assemble that rifle using a dime.

As far as Judyth Vary Baker is concerned, her and Oswald's stint at Reily Coffee Company was simply a cover job. For the most part, I agree that Judyth and Lee didn't have much time for a full-blown affair.  Except for one time when Anna Lewis, the former wife of one David Lewis, confirms Judyth’s claim that she and Lee went on several dates with Anna and David.

Another interesting thing is where was Lee Oswald headed after leaving the boarding house.  In my book, I list all the safe houses in Oak Cliff.  He may have even been headed for Jack Ruby's apartment.  However, he didn't shoot Tippit.  

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