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Keyvan Shahrdar

John Connally injury photographs

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James Gordon did an investigation into Connally's wounds awhile back, and did further research on the "tangential" bullet strike to the rib. It was very informative, and better explained the information the doctors tried to convey post-op.

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19 hours ago, David Josephs said:

https://deeppoliticsforum.com/forums/showthread.php?13277-Incredible-Wounds-of-Governor-Connally&p=84677#post84677

These are a few xrays... 

I have yet to see any images of the injuries themselves

Don't you find it strange that there are no pictures of his injuries?

Also, why did they cut JFK's suit off and Connally's suit was taken off?  Do you find that strange as well?

Here is Connally's suit

article-2462106-18C34FD800000578-456_634

Here is JFK's suit:

jfk74f1.jpg

 

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Hello Keyvan:


There are no contemporaneous photographs taken of John Connally's various injuries/wound sites. I do have one photograph of Connally pointing out the position of the exit wound to his right distal radius but this was taken some time after his wounding event. I also do not believe there was  a need to cut Connally's suit jacket off of him upon his arrival at PMH; do you feel there was some reason as to why this "cutting" should have taken place?

Gary

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8 minutes ago, Gary Murr said:

do you feel there was some reason as to why this "cutting" should have taken place?

Gary....

You cut it off so they don't have to try and contort him to push his broken arm and hand thru 2 sleeves...

 

You're right Keyvan....  great observation...   they got it off him and it was being cleaned before they had a chance to do anything....  how'd they get the blood out of that shirt?

DJ

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10 minutes ago, David Josephs said:

You cut it off so they don't have to try and contort him to push his broken arm and hand thru 2 sleeves...

David:

Possibly true, but in this instance the fracture to the distal end of Connally's right radius was the least of their worries and if one is inclined to believe John Connally he did not even realize that the fracture to his wrist had occurred until after he come out of surgery. If true, I doubt Connally would have suffered any undue pain as a result of his arm being removed from his suit jacket sleeve. As you are probably aware, the real injury causing considerable pain and concern was obviously the much more serious wound of the chest.

If you are talking about the "they" that got the blood out of Connally's shirt, the "they" in this instance was Nellie Connally. And having personally handled all of the Connally clothing I can confirm for you that she did not get the blood stain out of his shirt. The shirt she hand dipped/soaked in cold water and then dried. The suit components on the other hand were professionally dry cleaned, again at the instructions of Nellie Connally.

Gary

Edited by Gary Murr
remove strike through

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10 minutes ago, David Josephs said:

You think they were trying to hide something... specifically?

I just find it odd that the emergency room cut off JFK's suit off and for Governor Connally, who must have been ready to collapse, conveniently removed his suit and shirt.  I would have thought that his suit would have been cut up. 

I can't help but think that Connally may have had more than one bullet hit him.  I have not seen any photographs of the injuries to his body.  Why not?  Why is this being kept from the American public?

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I don't find it unusual that they didn't take pictures of his wounds.  He was taken immediately to surgery where they were trying to save his life.  Once the surgery was done the wounds were bandaged.  Granted, if there had been a trial such pictures might have been useful.  At the time investigators were concerned with apprehending A shooter.  They did, they "had their man".  When Oswald was shot it became a moot point.  Did The Warren Omission ever ask to see his wounds or if any photographs of them were available?

For many years all I heard or read was that Connally had been hit in the right side of his back and it came out the chest breaking a rib.  I pictured it barely missing the clavicle, and, the top of a lung as I'd never read that it did so.  A few years back I read it went in at the edge of his arm pit, traversed a rib and came out his right nipple.  This confused me.  Touching the center of my right arm pit with my left middle finger my left arm straddles my right nipple, at not much of a downward angle.  I thought how could this be if he was shot from the 6th floor?  Wouldn't he have to be already bent way over forward.  I thought it sounds more in line with a shot from say the Dal-Tex building (that missed JFK?).

Here are a couple of interesting articles on the subject.

https://www.history-matters.com/essays/jfkmed/BigLieSmallWound/BigLieSmallWound.htm

https://ratical.org/ratville/JFK/PG/PGchp5.html

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42 minutes ago, David Josephs said:

You think they were trying to hide something... specifically?

 

Just an opinion, but one based as you may know on my twelve year research into the Connally wounding, I think the short answer to this question is no. Part of my reasoning for an answer of this nature is based upon what to me appears to have been complete disinterest on the part of initially the FBI and eventually and more importantly a complete lack of interest in acquiring this clothing for examination by the Warren Commission – at least until it was too late. I have a complete chapter on this subject matter in my three volume as yet unpublished work on the Connally wounding. This includes a precise tracking of the clothing from the time it is removed from his body at PMH to the point of its eventual arrival at the FBI lab in April, 1964. Of course the real tragedy here is that the cleaning processes applied to the various articles of the clothing by and at the behest of Nellie Connally destroyed, to a large extent, vital evidence potentially helpful to understanding the how of the Connally wounding process. As you are probably also aware, initially the wounding of John Connally was not even scheduled to be a part of the WC investigation.

As far as a lack of photographs of the Connally wound sites in their PMH state this, in my opinion, was unnecessary. However, had the Governor died as a result of his wounds unquestionably photographs would have been taken of the various wound sites, and I dare say a much better autopsy would have been performed.

FWIW, or my two cents…

Gary

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14 minutes ago, Keyvan Shahrdar said:

I can't help but think that Connally may have had more than one bullet hit him.  I have not seen any photographs of the injuries to his body.  Why not?  Why is this being kept from the American public?

Especially the chest wound....   I have yet to see a single actual image of the chest/rib injury....

we have plenty of xrays of the wrist... & we have this drawing   

Except the drawing is of the left hand ... when you orient the image so the writing and the page # is correct....

5aba9adfb2b1a_DrawingofJCwristpost-1924-0-46948200-1385323656-smaller.thumb.jpg.8d2674a25cad20b00bfd50fcaf175dcf.jpg

Also, the bullet was said to have entered the TOP of the arm and exited from the BOTTOM...

Given what we see here... how is that even possible when confined to the SBT?
Has he been shot yet here?   Does his hand just involuntarily clinch the hat after shot?
Where could a shot come from to do the damage described?

5abaa14871355_JFKandJCposition-howdoesbulletenterJCwrist.thumb.jpg.eec87433138d461f5e54b437ac896d7d.jpg

img_1137_52_300.png

 

 

post-6369-0-74333400-1385381514.jpg

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In the 1966 LIFE Magazine article, Nellie Connally said that neither the FBI nor the Warren Commission expressed any interest in John Connally's clothing...until AFTER she attempted to clean it. I'm guessing that if something was being hidden, it wasn't the Connallys hiding it.

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41 minutes ago, David Josephs said:

Also, the bullet was said to have entered the TOP of the arm and exited from the BOTTOM...

And of course, this is the real problem in discussing the wound to Connally's right distal radius. The wound of entry was not on the top of the distal end of the right radius but rather the point of entry was more to the side of the radius. Similarly it did not exit at the bottom of the “arm”, in truth a misnomer. If one really wants to see what happens when a bullet does strike the back of the “arm” and exits from the bottom, as hypothesized by many, look no further than the photographic images of the resulting damage exhibited in CRDLR 3264, pp 36 -37[MF link below]. The point of exit of the true wounding missile was the underside of Connally’s right wrist, virtually hidden in the creases of the wrist, and as I recall not much more than a centimeter in horizontal length.

As far as Dr. Gregory’s drawing of this radial wound of entry, I asked Robert Shaw about this. As he explained it to me, this drawing, which is in the left hand margin of the first page of Dr. Gregory’s post-op notes, is oriented as it is because Dr. Gregory drew the image with his right hand while looking at his left distal radial/hand area for reference. This diagram also represents how the wound of entry looked after it was repaired by Dr. Gregory, part of the wound left open to the air, something facilitated by the cutting of a window in the cast after it had been applied to the Governor’s right distal radial ending and wrist.

Link to CRDLR 3264 

 https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=62296&search=%22CRDLR%22#relPageId=1&tab=page

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18 hours ago, Gary Murr said:

 

Just an opinion, but one based as you may know on my twelve year research into the Connally wounding, I think the short answer to this question is no. Part of my reasoning for an answer of this nature is based upon what to me appears to have been complete disinterest on the part of initially the FBI and eventually and more importantly a complete lack of interest in acquiring this clothing for examination by the Warren Commission – at least until it was too late. I have a complete chapter on this subject matter in my three volume as yet unpublished work on the Connally wounding. This includes a precise tracking of the clothing from the time it is removed from his body at PMH to the point of its eventual arrival at the FBI lab in April, 1964. Of course the real tragedy here is that the cleaning processes applied to the various articles of the clothing by and at the behest of Nellie Connally destroyed, to a large extent, vital evidence potentially helpful to understanding the how of the Connally wounding process. As you are probably also aware, initially the wounding of John Connally was not even scheduled to be a part of the WC investigation.

As far as a lack of photographs of the Connally wound sites in their PMH state this, in my opinion, was unnecessary. However, had the Governor died as a result of his wounds unquestionably photographs would have been taken of the various wound sites, and I dare say a much better autopsy would have been performed.

FWIW, or my two cents…

Gary

Gary,

Events in the JFK assassination that don't get investigated interest me, and I assume most people as well. 

1. Zapruder frames of the babushka lady turning on a high-density light device are troubling.

2. The three tramps not identified until 1989, troubling.

3. No photographs of Connally injuries, troubling.

 

I question Gov. Connally's injuries.

Did the bullet ricochet or passed through the wrist? (No photograph, we can't tell!)

How many shots in the chest area? (No photographs, we can't tell)

Was there an entry hole in the back of the chest? (No photographs, we can't tell)

Was there an entry hole in the front of the chest? (doubt it, but no photographs)

The entry hole to the thigh?  (No photographs)

 

From reading this thread, I understand that you have done extensive research on this subject matter, thank you for your insights.

Edited by Keyvan Shahrdar

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