Thursday at Ruth Paines House

[David Josephs]

And I’ll ask one last time...

with the FBI and USPS watching Oswald.. how is it possible that there are no contemporaneous reports, or any report prior to Nov 22 that Oswald had ordered and received a rifle and pistol.

Davd... how did they miss that when we have reports all thru Feb, March and April about letters he has sent and received?

Thanks....

ps... 

Mr. JENNER - Was there a rifle packed in the back of the car? 
Mrs. PAINE - No. 
Mr. JENNER - You didn't see any kind of weapon? 
Mrs. PAINE - No. 
Mr. JENNER - Firearm, rifle, pistol, or otherwise? 
Mrs. PAINE - No; I saw nothing of that nature. 
Mr. JENNER - Did you drive them to your home? 
Mrs. PAINE - Yes. 
Mr. JENNER - Were the materials and things in your station wagon unpacked and placed in your home? 
Mrs. PAINE - Yes; immediately. 
Mr. JENNER - Did you see that being done, were you present? 
Mrs. PAINE - I helped do it; yes. 
Mr. JENNER - Did you see any weapon on that occasion? 
Mrs. PAINE - No. 
Mr. JENNER - Whether a rifle, pistol or-- 
Mrs. PAINE - No. 
Mr. JENNER - Or any covering, any package, that looked as though it might have a weapon, pistol, or firearm? 
Mrs. PAINE - No.

 

Representative BOGGS - Did you see the rifle that he had in the room in your home? 
Mrs. PAINE - In the garage, no. 
Representative BOGGS - In the garage, you never saw one? 
Mrs. PAINE - I never saw that rifle at all until the police showed it to me in the station on the 22d of November.

 

Mr. LIEBELER. I see. Did you ever see Oswald sitting on the front porch? 
Mr. ROGERS. Oh, yes; with books, reading. 
Mr. LIEBELER. Did he read a lot? 
Mr. ROGERS. Yes. 
Mr. LIEBELER. Did you ever see any rifle or firearms of any type in his possession at that time? 
Mr. ROGERS. No; I never.

 

[François Carlier]

1 hour ago, David Josephs said:

And I’ll ask one last time...

with the FBI and USPS watching Oswald.. how is it possible that there are no contemporaneous reports, or any report prior to Nov 22 that Oswald had ordered and received a rifle and pistol.

Davd... how did they miss that when we have reports all thru Feb, March and April about letters he has sent and received?

Thanks....

ps... 

Mr. JENNER - Was there a rifle packed in the back of the car? 
Mrs. PAINE - No. 
Mr. JENNER - You didn't see any kind of weapon? 
Mrs. PAINE - No. 
Mr. JENNER - Firearm, rifle, pistol, or otherwise? 
Mrs. PAINE - No; I saw nothing of that nature. 
Mr. JENNER - Did you drive them to your home? 
Mrs. PAINE - Yes. 
Mr. JENNER - Were the materials and things in your station wagon unpacked and placed in your home? 
Mrs. PAINE - Yes; immediately. 
Mr. JENNER - Did you see that being done, were you present? 
Mrs. PAINE - I helped do it; yes. 
Mr. JENNER - Did you see any weapon on that occasion? 
Mrs. PAINE - No. 
Mr. JENNER - Whether a rifle, pistol or-- 
Mrs. PAINE - No. 
Mr. JENNER - Or any covering, any package, that looked as though it might have a weapon, pistol, or firearm? 
Mrs. PAINE - No.

 

Representative BOGGS - Did you see the rifle that he had in the room in your home? 
Mrs. PAINE - In the garage, no. 
Representative BOGGS - In the garage, you never saw one? 
Mrs. PAINE - I never saw that rifle at all until the police showed it to me in the station on the 22d of November.

 

Mr. LIEBELER. I see. Did you ever see Oswald sitting on the front porch? 
Mr. ROGERS. Oh, yes; with books, reading. 
Mr. LIEBELER. Did he read a lot? 
Mr. ROGERS. Yes. 
Mr. LIEBELER. Did you ever see any rifle or firearms of any type in his possession at that time? 
Mr. ROGERS. No; I never.

 

Don't you know that Mrs. Paine was a CIA agent and a l-i-a-r ? Don't you know that Mr. Rogers was a CIA agent and a l-i-a-r, too ?
(Ask James DiEugenio).
Do you really believe them ? If so, then you are gullible.
You should know that the two of them were co-conspirators. If they say that they didn't see Oswald with a rifle, that means that they DID see him with a rifle ! Therefore, it proves that Oswald had a rifle !
That's conspiracy thinking. It looks like you still have a lot to learn !
😁

Edited January 20 by François Carlier

[Derek Thibeault]

So what you are saying is we use Ruth Paine when it suits us but discard her when it doesn't?

[François Carlier]

25 minutes ago, Derek Thibeault said:

So what you are saying is we use Ruth Paine when it suits us but discard her when it doesn't?

I'm saying that it's exactly what James diEugenio and David Josephs do. They spend their whole life spitting on the Warren report and accusing honest people such as Ruth Paine of being CIA agents and l-i-a-r-s, and then, all of a sudden, when it suits them, they quote the Warren report and Ruth Paine to support one of their claims...
Of course, they have no shame, we already know that.

[James DiEugenio]

I am not saying that at all.  And I don't think that David is saying it.

I mean, on the record, when has Ruth Paine ever said anything helpful to the Oswald case for innocence?

 I mean what would be the ratio?  Maybe a thousand to one?  Same with Michael.

What David is saying is that the people one would think would have to have seen the rifle, that is the FBI or Ruth and Michael Paine, have no knowledge of it.  

Now, go ahead and list all the things the Paines said or produced that was incriminating of Oswald.  You would have a list about a mile long.

But with FC, all of that is just fine and dandy, even though much of it is questionable as to the circumstances and provenance. 

She says one thing that is exculpatory, and FC goes batty..

 

 

[Derek Thibeault]

I would assume if she saw the rifle or a weapon she would have said so. It just helps prove her opinion that he did it. There was no rifle in the garage. 

[David Von Pein]

12 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

Ron:

To my knowledge that is accurate about the rods at his rooming house.

All I am saying is that there is some different data around now.  I do not know what to make of it.

http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/The Curtain Rods (Part 1)

http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/Oswald's "Curtain Rods" (Part 2)

Edited January 20 by David Von Pein

[David G. Healy]

amazing what you CAN'T find on DVP's web of "info."

[David Von Pein]

2 hours ago, David G. Healy said:

amazing what you CAN'T find on DVP's web of "info."

What did you have in mind, David?

[Ron Bulman]

3 hours ago, David Von Pein said:

What did you have in mind, David?

The Truth.

[James DiEugenio]

Isn't it just like Davey to be able to tell us when Oswald was lying and when he was telling the truth and why.

I mean, we are talking about a guy who was literally murdered in the arms of the DPD in their basement when Captain Fritz jumped out and left him exposed.  With two horns going off right before the murder by Ruby.  The police then lied about how Ruby got into the basement and then covered up that lie.  It was not exposed until the HSCA inquiry.

And yet, somehow Davey will trust what these guys wrote down as the gospel truth about Oswald.

And yet when Oswald says something exculpatory about himself, he is lying.  Why? Because we know he is guilty.  Same thing that Bugliosi did in his inflated door stop. 

[Cory Santos]

Fc still has not responded to David's points.  All he could do was insult him.  Lets start a timer to see how many days it takes for fc to actually debate a point as opposed to just insulting people.

[David Von Pein]

2 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

Isn't it just like Davey to be able to tell us when Oswald was lying and when he was telling the truth and why.

Pot/Kettle Alert!! (Again!)

[David Von Pein]

Some of my additional thoughts regarding Lee Oswald's "curtain rod" story and his visit to Ruth Paine's house on Nov. 21....

From a 2010 Internet post....

Another question that no conspiracy theorist ever bothers asking regarding the "curtain rod" issue is this one:

Since we know that Lee Oswald had no intention of living in his shoebox-sized room on Beckley Avenue for very much longer, then why in the world would he want to put up some new curtains and curtain rods in the Beckley room? It makes no sense.

And we can know that Oswald certainly had it in his mind to vacate the Beckley roominghouse fairly soon after November 22, 1963, because of his behavior on 11/21/63 at Ruth Paine's house when he pleaded with Marina to come back to Dallas with him. LHO also told Marina on November 21st that he would rent an apartment "tomorrow".

And I somehow doubt that Lee had it in his mind to take his wife and two children back to the walk-in closet he called home on Beckley Avenue in Oak Cliff. Per Marina, Lee had every intention and desire to LEAVE HIS BECKLEY ROOM AS EARLY AS NOVEMBER 22! That's an important point that shouldn't be overlooked or ignored when the subject of Lee Oswald's "curtain rod" fairy tale is discussed.

In short -- Oswald invented the curtain rod story. He lied to Buell Wesley Frazier about the curtain rods to cover up the fact he was going to Irving to get his rifle on November 21st. And he lied again to Frazier about the curtain rods on November 22nd to conceal the fact that he was carrying his rifle to work. It's as simple as that.

Anyone who actually believes that Lee Harvey Oswald had any curtain rods with him on the morning of President Kennedy's assassination is a person who probably also believes that a political fanatic (Oswald) had absolutely no motive whatsoever for murdering a President (Kennedy) who was the chief representative of a country that the political fanatic (Oswald) had grown to despise.

Also.....

Another thought occurred to me recently with respect to Lee Harvey Oswald's unusual Thursday-night trip to Ruth Paine's house in Irving on November 21:

Oswald's visit to Irving on 11/21/63 was the only time that LHO had failed to call Paine's house to let either Ruth or Marina know he was coming. And this could be another key point when reflecting upon Oswald's actions that day.

In Lee Oswald's mind, a call to the Paine house prior to his November 21st visit could have been a bit risky. Because: what if Ruth or Marina, for some unknown reason, had told Lee not to come to Irving that evening? What would Lee have done then? Would he have obeyed Ruth/Marina and stayed in Oak Cliff, thereby eliminating any chance he had of fetching his rifle from the Paine garage before JFK's Friday arrival in Dallas? That's not very likely, granted. But Oswald would have had an additional layer of explaining to do if he had called Ruth's house and was told not to come, but went there anyway.

But the way Oswald planned it (with no call being made to Irving), he doesn't run the risk of being told to stay home. So he simply went to the Paine house unannounced, which gave him easy access to his rifle. And once he arrived in Irving, what were Marina and/or Ruth going to do--throw him out in the streets or tell him to turn around and go back home? Not likely, especially since Lee has no car.

And while it's likely that Lee would have gone out to Irving with Wesley Frazier on Thursday night even if he HAD called Ruth or Marina and had been told NOT to come, it was still a wiser decision by Lee to NOT call the Paine house prior to his Thursday arrival.

And if Oswald had REALLY only been wanting to retrieve some curtain rods from Ruth Paine's home, then the fact that he did not call Ruth or Marina prior to his Thursday visit is even more bizarre and unexplainable, especially considering the fact that he had ALWAYS called Ruth's house prior to all of his other weekend visits.

And THIS particular November 21 visit in question, via such an innocuous and innocent reason for going there on a Thursday (to get some curtain rods), should have certainly elicited an advance telephone call from Lee -- BECAUSE HE WOULD BE COMING TO IRVING ON A THURSDAY, SOMETHING HE HAD NEVER DONE BEFORE.

More food for thought regarding Lee Oswald's unusual trip to Irving on 11/21/63, isn't it?

David Von Pein
January 8, 2010

http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/Lee Harvey Oswald

 

Edited January 21 by David Von Pein

[James DiEugenio]

The above is more of Davey's Kreskin type of mind reading.

Yawn.

BTW, as per the whole pot/kettle thing, this is one of DVP's standard devices to transfer the unjustifiable practices he uses to others.

Three comments:

1. No one will ever know for sure what Oswald said during those hours of detention with the DPD.  The vast majority of it was not written down or recorded. And there is really no excuse  for that.  None, Zero. It is a complete disgrace. And to this day there is room for doubt that it was not recorded.  I have never made any flat statements as to what Oswald said or did not say.  It is only based on notes that may or may not be accurate.   

2. As per the curtain rods story, Fritz said Oswald denied this.  Now, do we know he denied it?  No.  But if he did not, it makes Fritz and Frazier look pretty bad.

3.  To render Oswald's so called unusual trip to the Paine home on Thursday night into perspective, just ask yourself, "When did LHO start work at the TSBD?"  So how unusual was it?

Edited January 21 by James DiEugenio