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Bart Kamp

Then went outside to watch the P. parade

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1 hour ago, Sandy Larsen said:


The teaching of cursive was being done away with earlier in the century, but is gaining acceptance in the curriculum again.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/once-all-but-left-for-dead-is-cursive-handwriting-making-a-comeback/2016/07/26/24e59d34-4489-11e6-bc99-7d269f8719b1_story.html?utm_term=.a215f635e220

I think it is supposed to be taught in third grade, but so far it hasn't been taught to our third grader.

 

Thank you Sandy Larsen for that Washington Post link.  That restores the feeling that there are some in the American educational system willing stand up and do the right thing for students.  Cursive writing is to valuable to abandon for experimentation.

The reason your third grader has not been taught yet is you have to have someone able to teach cursive writing.  It may take a while to re-train teachers. 

Edited by John Butler

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8 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

By the way,  has DVP had a couple of bad weeks in a row or what?

First, he looked silly with the wallet found at 10th and Patton.  Which his mentor, Vince Bugliosi, actually wrote was Tippit's wallet.  In my book, The JFK Assassination: The Evidence Today, I showed this was provably wrong.  But somehow Davey failed to note this in his puff piece "review" of the door stop.

Now, he is desperately trying to escape this new evidence through semantics, plus the fact that Oswald was never allowed the opportunity to write his own declaration.

I mean, talk about desperation time.

If I do say so myself, this also warrants a clean-up on isle 4 https://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/25535-x-ray-shows-bullet-metal-on-the-corner-edge-of-the-harper-fragment-fbi-claimed-the-exact-opposite-on-11271963/

 

I'm not sure if anybody else has noticed this.

Edited by Micah Mileto

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Did not the notes of Will Fritz say that Oswald said he was out front with Shelly?

That could not have been after since Shelly was not out front at that time, right?  He and Lovelady said they ran across the street.

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6 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:


Here we have a perfect example of LN "reasoning," with Francois saying Bart is wrong before he (Francois) even sees the material.

This is further demonstration that Francois is an ideologue.

 

Typical nonsense from Larsen.
We're used to that, sadly…
I know what Kamp is claiming, namely that Oswald was outside when the shots were fired, which is wrong, since it has been proven that he was inside.
I know what documents Kamp uses since he uploaded them on his website, which I visited and read.
Therefore, I know what he claims, I know that it is ludicrous, and I have every right to tell him that he is wrong.
Actually, your post is further demonstration that you, Larsen, are an empty, mean-spirited, dishonest ideologue !!!!

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1 hour ago, James DiEugenio said:

Did not the notes of Will Fritz say that Oswald said he was out front with Shelly [sic]?

That could not have been after since Shelly [sic] was not out front at that time, right?  He and Lovelady said they ran across the street.

http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2015/10/jfk-assassination-arguments-part-1052.html#Out-With-Bill-Shelley-In-Front

James Bookhout's FBI report aligns with Fritz' "Shelley" note, with Bookhout filling in more of the details about what Oswald MEANT when the topic of "out with Bill Shelley in front" came up during Captain Fritz' interrogation of Lee Oswald. Bookhout's report on Page 619 of the Warren Report makes it quite clear that when Oswald told Fritz that he "went outside and stood around for five or ten minutes with foreman Bill Shelley", Oswald was unquestionably referring to a point in time that was AFTER the assassination of President Kennedy and also definitely AFTER the second-floor lunchroom encounter that Oswald had with Marrion Baker and Roy Truly as well.

 

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I think this is what Vanessa was referring to when she mentioned the testimony of Holmes.  This is from the original Sean Murphy thread that launched this whole idea of PM and LHO and it was quoted by Terry Adams.

 

Mr. BELIN. By the way, where did this policeman stop him when he was coming down the stairs at the Book Depository on the day of the shooting?

Mr. HOLMES. He said it was in the vestibule.

Mr. BELIN. He said he was in the vestibule?

Mr. HOLMES. Or approaching the door to the vestibule. He was just coming, apparently, and I have never been in there myself. Apparently there is two sets of doors, and he had come out to this front part.

Mr. BELIN. Did he state it was on what floor?

Mr. HOLMES. First floor. The front entrance to the first floor.

...

Mr. HOLMES. There was a commotion outside, which he later rushed downstairs to go out to see what was going on. He didn't say whether he took the stairs down. He didn't say whether he took the elevator down.

But he went downstairs, and as he went out the front, it seems as though he did have a coke with him, or he stopped at the coke machine, or somebody else was trying to get a coke, but there was a coke involved.

He mentioned something about a coke. But a police officer asked him who he was, and just as he started to identify himself, his superintendent came up and said, "He is one of our men." And the policeman said, "Well, you step aside for a little bit."

This comes very close to placing LHO outside, if the vestibule refers to the space between the outer and inner doors as one exits  to the foyer.  

The other reason this is key is that it clearly denotes that the soda machine encounter did not take place on the second floor.

 

PS My God,  DVP is recycling that whole Bookhout nonsense which Bart Kamp exposed as a sham last week. So that means we can count Fritz and his notes. 

BTW, I don't think DVP knows what Bart means when he says Go Home.  You have to be from UK.  But i agree.

Edited by James DiEugenio

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LOL. Jimmy's all mixed up. He thinks he can take this testimony by Harry D. Holmes and somehow come to the conclusion that Oswald was outside the building at the time of JFK's assassination.... 

HARRY HOLMES -- "There was a commotion outside, which he [LHO] later rushed downstairs to go out to see what was going on. He didn't say whether he took the stairs down. He didn't say whether he took the elevator down."

The above testimony not only clearly indicates that Oswald was talking about a point in time that was AFTER the shooting, but it also clearly indicates (assuming Holmes has paraphrased Oswald's statements correctly) that Lee Oswald was NOT on the first floor at all when all this "commotion" was going on outside. Hence, we find the words "rushed downstairs" and "he didn't say whether he took the stairs down" and "he didn't say whether he took the elevator down".

Now, why on Earth would anyone (even a rabid Anybody-But-Oswald CTer like Los Angeles' own Jimmy DiEugenio) utilize such "rushed downstairs" testimony to try and support their belief that Lee Harvey Oswald was located outside on the front steps of the TSBD Building (or even on the first floor of that building) when the assassination was occurring in Dealey Plaza on 11/22/63? That's crazy.

And, in fact, that precise testimony provided by Harry Holmes is used by Vincent Bugliosi in his book, as Vince tries to make the point that Oswald "slipped up" during his final interrogation session on 11/24/63 and accidentally placed himself on the sixth floor during the assassination....

  • "During Sunday's interrogation Oswald slipped up and placed himself on the sixth floor at the time of the assassination. .... In his Sunday-morning interrogation he said that at lunchtime, one of the "Negro" employees invited him to eat lunch with him and he declined. .... He said before he could finish whatever he was doing, the commotion surrounding the assassination took place and when he "WENT DOWNSTAIRS," a policeman questioned him as to his identification, and his boss stated that he was one of their employees. .... WHERE WAS OSWALD AT THE TIME THE NEGRO EMPLOYEE INVITED HIM TO LUNCH, AND BEFORE HE DESCENDED TO THE SECOND-FLOOR LUNCHROOM? [Answer:] The sixth floor." [All emphasis Bugliosi's.] -- Vincent Bugliosi; Page 957 of "Reclaiming History"

-------------------------

Let me also add this other relevant testimony from Harry Holmes (which CTers will likely try to ignore)....

DAVID W. BELIN -- "Did anyone say anything about Oswald saying anything about his leaving the Texas School Book Depository after the shooting?"

HARRY D. HOLMES -- "He said, as I remember, actually, in answer to questions there, he mentioned that when lunchtime came, one of the Negro employees asked him if he would like to sit and each lunch with him, and he said, "Yes, but I can't go right now." He said, "You go and take the elevator on down." No, he said, "You go ahead, but send the elevator back up." He didn't say up where, and he didn't mention what floor he was on. Nobody seemed to ask him. You see, I assumed that obvious questions like that had been asked in previous interrogation. So I didn't interrupt too much, but he said, "Send the elevator back up to me." Then he said when all this commotion started, "I just went on downstairs." And he didn't say whether he took the elevator or not. He said, "I went down, and as I started to go out and see what it was all about, a police officer stopped me just before I got to the front door, and started to ask me some questions, and my superintendent of the place stepped up and told the officers that I am one of the employees of the building, so he told me to step aside for a little bit and we will get to you later. Then I just went on out in the crowd to see what it was all about." And he wouldn't tell what happened then."

MR. BELIN -- "Did he [Oswald] say where he was at the time of the shooting?"

MR. HOLMES -- "He just said he was still up in the building when the commotion-- he kind of----"

MR. BELIN -- "Did he gesture with his hands, do you remember?"

MR. HOLMES -- "He talked with his hands all the time. He was handcuffed, but he was quiet---well, he was not what you call a stoic phlegmatic person. He is very definite with his talk and his eyes and his head, and he goes like that, you see."

-------------------------

Replay.....

"He just said he was still up in the building when the commotion..."

 

Edited by David Von Pein

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9 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:


Here we have a perfect example of LN "reasoning," with Francois saying Bart is wrong before he (Francois) even sees the material.

This is further demonstration that Francois is an ideologue.

 

Both these two clowns are an utter waste of time.

Not bringing anything to the table but denials. Von Pein thinks rehashing earlier destroyed arguments work. And Carlier is just little....

from this post on they will be treated with my silence as life is simply too short. 

I suggest the rest of you tries doing this as well even when your finger tips itch to go after them it simply is not worth it dealing with deniers who play a rather stupid game.

 

Go home the pair of ya. 

 

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41 minutes ago, Bart Kamp said:

from this post on they will be treated with my silence.... 

Hopefully that means Kamp's constant whining will cease.

Thank the Maker!

Edited by David Von Pein

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"Hello everybody, my name is Bart Kamp,
I have always been a spoiled child.
When someone is inside a building, I like to say that they are outside that building. But if reasonable people disagree with me, I throw a tantrum and decide to stop talking.
I am right. I know that I am right because I keep repeating to myself that I am right.
I am right, I am right, I am right.
Ouside is inside and inside is outside.
I am right.
If you don't agree, I'll call you a clown and I'll beg other people to stop talking to you.
Remember : inside means outside !!!!"

 

Edited by François Carlier

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11 minutes ago, François Carlier said:

"Hello everybody, my name is Bart Kamp,
I have always been a spoiled child.
When someone is inside a building, I like to say that they are outside that building. But if reasonable people disagree with me, I throw a tantrum and decide to stop talking.
I am right. I know that I am right because I keep repeating to myself that I am right.
I am right, I am right, I am right.
Ouside is inside and inside is outside.
I am right.
If you don't agree, I'll call you a clown and I'll beg other people to stop talking to you.
Remember : inside means outside !!!!"

 

Seriously Francois. Do you actually have something to contribute to this debate apart from this dreck?

I'll get to you in a minute Von Pein. 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Vanessa Loney said:

I'll get to you in a minute Von Pein. 

Okay, Loney.

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Ochus Campbell said he saw Oswald in the locker room just inside the vestibule door, just after the shooting. How could he, if Oswald was upstairs?

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20 hours ago, Rich Pope said:

Every police interrogation I've ever seen in the movies or on tv shows the first thing every interrogation begins with...the police plopping down a tape recorder and hitting the record button.  Yet, the Dallas Police didn't do this.  Hmm....They said the room was small.  Too small for a compact tape recorder?  Give me a break.

19 year old Buell Wesley Frazier gave a signed Statement that weekend without a lawyer (or a recorder) present. In fact the whole weekend was conspicuous by its lack of lawyers. Did even one of the witnesses actually have a lawyer present during their interviews that weekend?

So the DPD weren't hampered by the absence of lawyers (or recorders) in taking witness Statements. They seemed to manage just fine with just a pen and paper. And we know that Oswald was talking because he repeatedly denied having shot anyone and as Fritz said 'he denies everything'. 

It should have been easy for the DPD to get all that in writing and signed by Oswald. Perhaps even before they charged him with the President's murder.

 

 

 

 

 

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58 minutes ago, Vanessa Loney said:

Seriously Francois. Do you actually have something to contribute to this debate apart from this dreck?

I'll get to you in a minute Von Pein. 

 

 

Be honest, for a change, and start acknowledging that the guy who is as closed-minded as he is deluded is Kamp !
YES, I have something to bring : logic and the truth.
Kamp brings nothing but nonsense and vanity. And he is so unsure of himself that he flees from the debate.
So stop being silly and open your eyes !

Edited by François Carlier

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