Jump to content
The Education Forum
Guest Rich Pope

Research from Lamar Waldron

Recommended Posts

Guest Rich Pope

The following is an interesting quote from author Lamar Waldron and his book, The Hidden History of the JFK Assassination.  

"...Dallas wasn't the only city where the godfathers planned to kill JFK--and Oswald wasn't the only ex-Marine arrested and investigated for trying to kill JFK.  In Chicago, Thomas Vallee, a seemingly troubled former Marine, was arrested on November 2, 1963, on the morning of JFK's planned motorcade through that city.  As people started to line the streets in anticipation of seeing JFK, the motorcade was suddenly called off--with two different phony excuses hurriedly given--because the Secret Service had learned that four possible assassins were at large.  When arrested, Vallee had "an M-1 rifle, a handgun, and 3,000 rounds of ammunition in his car," according to the House Select Committee.  In interesting parallels with Oswald in Dallas, Vallee had recently taken a job in a warehouse overlooking JFK's Chicago motorcade route, had moved into a YMCA in the fall of 1963 around the same time as Oswald, and had contact with a CIA-supported anti-Castro exile group, as had Oswald earlier in 1963."

To save space, I'll only mention in the attempt to kill JFK in Tampa on November 18, 1963, there were even more parallels between Oswald and Gilberto Lopez, a young man living there at the time.  

Assassination plot #1 :  Chicago -  home of Rosselli's mob family

Assassination plot #2:  Tampa - base of Trafficante's mob family

Assassination plot/success #3:  Dallas -  controlled by Carlos Marcello

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Didn't Jim just tell you a couple of day's ago in detail that Marcello didn't even control the New Orleans mob?  Neither plot nor the assassination was done by the mob.

Chicago involved a couple of possible Cubans who got away and a guy with a history similar to Oswald.  A warehouse on a corner.  A lot like Dallas.  

Tampa was about A Man In An Office Building With A Rifle and Milteer, of the KKK.

Both threats practice runs I've wondered?  But not by the mob.

The mob couldn't have pulled all this off and covered it up

You claim to be a Former CIA employee.  Not an agent.  But anybody the CIA would hire would be smart enough to figure out this is BS.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm a little curious here.

If Marcello wasn't as big as so many others in the national network of mob bosses, why would RFK go farther in dealing with him punitively than almost any other boss; actually kicking him physically out of the country and dropping him off in the dregs of Guatemala?

If Marcello was no big deal in the Mafia hierarchy, why bother?

 

Edited by Joe Bauer

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Joe Bauer said:

I'm a little curious here.

If Marcello wasn't as big as so many others in the national network of mob bosses, why would RFK go farther in dealing with him punitively than almost any other boss; actually kicking him physically out of the country and dropped off in the dregs of Guatemala?

If Marcello was no big deal in the Mafia hierarchy, why bother?

 

Part of it may have been that the FBI had documents available showing that Marcello had entered the US illegally through Guatemala, and so could be swiftly deported there,  But I agree - why do it if Marcello did not compel the DOJ's attention?

Plus it was a shortsighted move by RFK, since Marcello was, after a little inconvenience, returned to the US by his or his peers' soldiers, and his operation was not appreciably dismantled in his absence.

Edited by David Andrews

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If Marcello wasn't the head Mafia boss of Texas, Louisiana and immediate surrounding area, who was?

Who else oversaw Texas which was a huge area of profit in Mafia business such as drugs, gambling, prostitution, extortion, etc? New Orleans and Louisiana as well.

I assume what we are being told is that the Chicago outfit had more control over Texas than Marcello?  We know Ruby dealt with both.

My guess is when Ruby went to New Orleans and did any questionable business there, he dealt with Marcello's men, not Giancana's or Trafficante's.

A point I have made before in postings beginning years ago is how much our country was infected with corruption and especially organized crime corruption most of this last century well beyond the understanding of the majority of Americans and even our main stream history book record.

I believe organized crime corruption was one of America's top 4 or 5 legacies during this time.

The Apalachin meeting in 1957 shouted the hugely widespread power and influence of  organized crime in America at that time.  100 heads of the branches of the Sicilian Mafia met there including those from Montreal, Cuba and Italy.

Think about this incredible reality of the reach and growth of organized crime in America in the 1950's this gathering exposed. These leaders represented a massive criminal corporation that had branches in that many cities and areas of the country.

Many large city police forces were so compromised with corruption by the Mafia,, anywhere from 10 to 30% and more of their police forces were on the take at various times as were many hundreds of Judges on every level as well as mayors, city council members, D.A.s and other elected officials.

Our largest labor union and many others had been taken over by them.

RFK knew that organized crime had become one of America's biggest problems as related in his book "The Enemy Within." He correctly stated that the power and influence of this huge cancer of corruption truly was a major threat against our democracy.

And the most devilish pact of all took place when our own intelligence departments decided to work with elements of organized crime to combat their common enemies.

In many ways, this legitimized the Mafia and allowed them to flourish even more.

Hoover for whatever reasons also fed their growth through refusing to recognize and reign them in.

Presidents have left them alone and even worked with them.

When Nixon pardoned Jimmy Hoffa, it was so obvious he was compromised.

Nixon's VP Spiro Agnew was completely owned by them.

When we discuss and debate the JFK assassination we cannot pretend that all this organized crime corruption had no connection at all to at least the cover-up and maybe the elimination of witnesses who were considered the most threatening to this....imo.

 

 

 

Edited by Joe Bauer

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Joe Bauer said:

I'm a little curious here.

If Marcello wasn't as big as so many others in the national network of mob bosses, why would RFK go farther in dealing with him punitively than almost any other boss; actually kicking him physically out of the country and dropped off in the dregs of Guatemala?

If Marcello was no big deal in the Mafia hierarchy, why bother?

 

Marcello?  He was nobody - nobody, I tell ya.  How do we know this?  Because an assistant district attorney under Garrison, John Volz, supposedly told Jim Di he was nobody (to quote Jim, "Marcello was not that powerful, period").  Here in Conspiracy World, that's good enough for us.  I'm confident that in the Conspiracy World version of reality tough-guy Jim would've walked up to Marcello, slapped him in the face and said "You're nobody, punk.  Get outta my way before my people shove you outta my way."

Volz actually did prosecute Marcello.  However, there have long been persistent rumors of Volz' own corruption and Mafia ties.  They are described here, in an article concerning Volz' mysterious appointment as U.S. Attorney:  https://thelensnola.org/2012/12/18/with-letten-gone-tis-the-season-for-intrigue-and-wild-rumors/.

In any event, here in the Real World "not that powerful" Marcello was about as powerful as they get.  There's a nice four-part summary here that also touches on the JFK assassination rumors, https://gangstersinc.ning.com/profiles/blogs/out-of-africa-the-story-of-new-orleans-mafia-boss-carlos-Marcello.  I quote:

Within thirteen years, Carlos would be possibly the wealthiest Mafiosi in the United States and most certainly one of the most influential. His criminal organization would be generating between one and two billion dollars each year, making it the biggest industry by far in Louisiana. As the leader of the "first Mafia family" in America, he enjoyed unique privileges; for example, he could "open his books" and "make" men into his organization without the approval of the Commission. His control and dominance of the Louisiana Mafia was incontestable. The late Vincent Teresa, a Mafia thief, and enforcer, working out of the New England mob, said of Marcello's crime family:

"It was very tight. They're all in deathly fear of Carlos Marcello because he's got the law, all the politicians in the state, right in his hip pocket. You just can't go against him."

The Marcello control of people at all levels was significant to his domination of the Louisiana Mafia. He ruled this as a despot, with independence and insularity that was unique across the twenty-four or so other criminal groups that made up the national syndicate of American-Italian mob families. Joseph Valachi, a former soldier in the Genovese family of New York, was the first "made" 'member of any Mafia family to turn informant and publicly testify as to the inner working of the Mafia in America. When he was asked at the McClellan Hearing what he knew about Marcello, he replied, "Louisiana? I don't know a thing except they don't want visitors. Once I was going to see the Mardi Gras and I checked it out with Vito (Genovese), which I was supposed to do if I took a trip. He said, 'Don't go.' No explanation, just 'Don't go.' They didn't want anybody there. And I was told if I ever had to go to Louisiana, Vito would have to call ahead and get permission. Genovese himself had to get permission. It was an absolute rule."

Although he was in federal prison, serving time on drug trafficking charges, Vito Genovese was at this time, allegedly, the most powerful mob boss in America. Yet even he would tip his forelock in deference to "The Little Man in New Orleans."

He was in fact, bigger than Ben Hur.

By 1966, Carlos Marcello had been the chief executive of his criminal dynasty for almost twenty years. Through bribery, corruption, intimidation and an inherent ability to control situations, he was probably the wealthiest and most influential Mafia leader in the United States. He had succeeded in getting his way, and getting away with everything, all his life. His political acumen was only matched by his judicious public relations.

Fount-of-misinformation Jim says the real power in Louisiana was one "Joe Carolla."  I have been unable to find any reference whatsoever to a Joe Carolla, but here is a short description of Marcello's connection to the Carolla family, http://www.ocnus.net/artman2/publish/Dark_Side_4/Out-of-Africa-The-Story-of-New-Orleans-Mafia-boss-Carlos-Marcello.shtml:

Since the death of Police Chief Hennessey, the Louisiana Mafia had grown and blossomed under at least two, possibly three leaders. Carlo Matranga had undoubtedly led the family into the twentieth century. He ruled until the early 1920's when he stepped down and retired. He died at the age of 86 on October 28th, 1943. At this point, his place was taken either by Corrado Giacona or Sylvestro (Sam) Carolla.  ...

Carolla, a swarthy, sleepy-eyed hood, had spent a two-year spell in jail for murdering a federal narcotics agent in1932. The sentence had been abruptly terminated with an early release from the ubiquitous Governor O.K. Allen, by appointment, pardoner to the mob. Sam made his fortune smuggling booze and drugs during the 1920s and 30s, and reached a position of such power, he was controlling the municipal government through bribery and corruption. He was low-key and his name did not appear in any newspaper until 1923. Because he had never taken out citizenship, however, he became vulnerable to deportation proceedings. They dragged on for years, but eventually, he was convicted and flown out of the country on May 30, 1947 to relocate in Sicily, his birthplace.

As Carolla was counting down his last days in America, Marcello was working the family members, promoting himself as the natural successor. He had emerged among the capis, or crew chiefs, who ran the organization, as the most probable candidate. His wealth was growing at a remarkable velocity. Money was pouring in from narcotics, gambling, the slot machines and his racing wire service. He opened a casino, calling it the New Southport Club on the East Bank at 1300 Monticello Road, off the Mississippi River Road near the New Orleans Jefferson Parish line. It soon became enormously popular and hugely profitable. …

Late in the evening of May 5th, 1947, a group of men gathered together in a room at the back of The Black Diamond, on North Galvez Street, a nightclub in a seedy part of New Orleans that catered almost exclusively for black people. The mob used this for a rendezvous in the belief that it would reduce the chance of surveillance. On this particular night, they were wrong and agents of the FBN (Federal Bureau of Narcotics) were checking out the expensively dressed white men who disembarked from limousines at the rear of the club and disappeared inside.

Among those noted here that night, were Tom Rizzuto, Nick Grifazzi, Frank Lombardino, Joe Capro and Anthony Carolla, son of Sam; also along were Joe Poretto, Nofio Pecora, and Carlos with brothers Vincent, Joseph, Peter and Anthony. Jake and Nick Marcello, Carlos' nephews were also at the party. Although supporters of Anthony Carolla put forward his name, they were outvoted by Carlos' men, and by the time the meeting was over, he was the newly appointed head of the Louisiana Mafia.

Although the Bureau of Narcotics was on his trail, at this point in time, the FBI was not. Sixteen years later, on July 11th, 1963, an FBI report suggests that Marcello was not the boss of New Orleans. Someone else was.

His name was Leoluca Trombadore. Born in Corleone, Sicily, in March 1888, he emigrated to America, arriving in New York in 1907 when he was 19.  He moved to Louisiana when he was in his mid-twenties, married, had a daughter, was known by everyone as “Mr. Luke,” and lived in New Orleans until he died there, in 1957. He was a second cousin to Giuseppe Morello, the New York-based head of what we know today as the Genovese Crime Family. If Trombadore was the boss, he kept a low profile, and there is little, if any, empirical evidence to support the claim.

[Marcello] Brothers Joe and Vincent were made into the family. Joe became the underboss and Vincent was a feared street soldier. The other four brothers may have been Mafiosi or maybe stayed as associates. There is no evidence to confirm this, although a number of sources claim Salvatore “Sammy” Marcello was a soldier in the family and often acted as the bodyguard and driver to his big brother. Fifteen months after Marcelo’s elevation to the head of the Louisiana Mafia, the FBI began to track his activities and his name appears for the first time in an FBI file on October 15th, 1948.

Anthony never forgot his displacement from what he obviously believed was his rightful ascension, and nineteen years later would bring his grievance up before a national Mafia Commission meeting at a restaurant in New York.

By "Joe Carolla," Jim presumably means Anthony Carolla.  Here is a short description of Anthony Carolla's 1966 attempt to gain greater power during Marcello's reign, https://mafia.wikia.org/wiki/Anthony_Carolla.  He was unsuccessful but would finally assume control in 1990, after Marcello had been sent to prison, suffered a series of strokes and ceded power to other family members.

On September 22, 1966, Carolla and other high ranking Mafia members attended a meeting at an Italian restaurant called La Stella, which was located at 102-111 Queens Boulevard in Forest Hills, Queens, New York. They were gathered around a table in a private dining area in the basement, and while awaiting their first course, New York police raided the building and arrested everyone. There were thirteen of them and all were members of the Mafia. Who had summoned the meeting, and how it was organized and what its purpose was has never been disclosed. The group were all taken to a nearby police station, questioned, searched and then released on personal bail of $100,000 each.

Although there has been speculation about why the meeting was called, it has been alleged that it was to resolve matters relating to the New Orleans crime family. Carlos Marcello, the then current boss of New Orleans, sat at the table with his brother Joe, his underboss, along with Carolla and Frank Gagliano, two of his senior family members. Carolla had apparently been seeking a greater share of the New Orleans mob's action, citing seniority within the family and his family birthright. His father had been Sylvestro Carolla, who had run the family until deportation in 1947. Anthony was also apparently seeking approval to take over the New Orleans Mafia when Marcello eventually retired. Apparently the ruling of the meeting favored Marcello. The meeting was referred to by law enforcement and the press at the time as "Little Apalachin."

It wouldn't be until the 1990s that Carolla would finally assume control of the New Orleans crime family following that fateful meeting in New York in 1966.

So who ya gonna believe, Conspiracy Capitalist Jim's recollections of what a dubious Garrison attorney supposedly told him about a non-existent Joe Carolla or the Real World historical record?  Alas, I'm pretty sure I know the answer.

Jim asks, "Volz was the late federal prosecutor who was assigned to the Marcello case.  He told me that  Marcello was not even the leading mobster in the area.  That was Joe Carolla.  Now if he knew that, then how could Blakey and Billings not know it?"  http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/26094-i-dont-think-lbj-did-it-i-know-he-did/?tab=comments#comment-407667

Oh, I don't know - possibly because IT OBVIOUSLY WASN'T TRUE?

And so it goes in Conspiracy World.

 

 

Edited by Lance Payette

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Joe, I just said that earlier.  Volz told me Carolla was.

As David said, Marcello was deportable because of his citizen ship issue.

But the idea that RFK spent so much time on Marcello, that is not accurate.  RFK spent more FBI hours on Giancana than anyone.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jim, a question I have is which Mafia group had the final say about operations in Texas?

Was it out of towners or were Dallas residents Joe Civello and Joe Campisi in charge of their own turf in Texas?

Both Civello and Campisi attended the Apalachin meeting in 1957.

If you check the attendee list of that meeting, every one invited had a fairly high level of importance in their own location.

Organized crime in America since the early 1900's has done nothing but damage our society and democratic institutions to significant degrees that we never truly have acknowledged.

It has effected us all. And imo has been a part of the JFK coverup.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would also add that circa 67 and 68 other groups - generally known as the Dixie Mafia - were competing with Marcello and had enough nerve and clout to muscle in on several of his ventures and even rob a few of them.  Marcello's reputation has been considerably enhanced by a number of authors who have written about him. -

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I can't really answer your question Joe.  

The problem being that, as Mike Beschloss once said, there is no College of Sam Giancana Advanced Studies.  Therefore, certain authors are free to write what they will about certain Mafia Dons and how powerful they are.  Blakey and Billings took Marcello to the outer limits in that regard I thought.

Larry probably knows more about this than I do, being much closer to the scene.

Edited by James DiEugenio

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, Larry Hancock said:

I would also add that circa 67 and 68 other groups - generally known as the Dixie Mafia - were competing with Marcello and had enough nerve and clout to muscle in on several of his ventures and even rob a few of them.  Marcello's reputation has been considerably enhanced by a number of authors who have written about him. -

 

But in 1963 it sounds as if nobody messed with Carlos Marcello and his many brothers rule in Louisiana and N.O..

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, Larry Hancock said:

I would also add that circa 67 and 68 other groups - generally known as the Dixie Mafia - were competing with Marcello and had enough nerve and clout to muscle in on several of his ventures and even rob a few of them.  Marcello's reputation has been considerably enhanced by a number of authors who have written about him. -

 

I don't pretend to be a student of the Mafia - although, having grown up in Tucson in the fifties (aka Bonanno Country), I'm practically a junior member of the family just by osmosis.  I well-remember how, every now and then, a restaurant would blow up and people would shrug and say "Well, it's not wise to make Joe unhappy."

Regarding the Dixie Mafia, http://www.texarkanagazette.com/news/local/story/2013/dec/02/dixie-mafia/295497/:

The Dixie Mafia was very active in several cities, including Biloxi, Dallas, Fort Worth, Shreveport-Bossier City, Memphis, Atlanta and Tulsa.

There are big scores to be had in larger cities. They are great paces for planning jobs and fencing stolen goods. It’s easy to get lost in the crowds, and there is always plenty of recreation to be had.

Some cities they operated in required a bit of caution. In New Orleans, for example, they had to be especially careful not to step on the toes of resident Mafia boss Carlos Marcello, one of the most powerful figures in the history of American crime.

Marcello’s organization would sometimes use the Dixie Mafia to collect debts and carry out hits. And the old man was willing to let them do business in his fiefdom as long as they played by Marcello’s rules—don’t bring too much heat from the cops, don’t knock over one of his many legal or illegal enterprises and, most of all, don’t forget to send a piece of any score his way.

Every once in a while, a Dixie Mafia figure would fail to show proper respect. Such bad manners carried a terrible penalty. 

It doesn't sound to me like Marcello's reputation needed much enhancement since even other Mafioso were terrified of him.  In any event, Jim's description of "not that powerful, period" is an absurd example of Jim purporting to have "inside information" that is simply wrong.  Tell us more about Joe Carolla, Jim.

The point of these little exercises on my part is to demonstrate how often these Conspiracy Capitalists who try to wow and overwhelm you with their knowledge are actually serving up a pastiche of sloppy research (by themselves or others whom they uncritically parrot), half-truths, complete fantasy, rank speculation and dark innuendo, all garnished with just enough historical truth to give it a veneer of plausibility, especially if you're too lazy to do your own fact-checking (which in my case has seldom required more than 30 minutes).  When you expose them, they just move on as though nothing had happened, as Jim does here.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, Joe Bauer said:

But in 1963 it sounds as if nobody messed with Carlos Marcello and his many brothers rule in Louisiana and N.O..

 

From my reading of documents, and no books, the NOLA mob was, by agreement, a secondary mob outfit with responsibilities, not privileges, in the maintenance of Dallas. The Los Angeles mob seems to be overlooked, often, in this story. David Yaras is a principle connection between Florida and Los Angeles and seemed to be managing a lot of action in Dallas. I think the Los Angeles mob played the biggest, primary mafia connection to the assassination, via connections to Fla. with NOLA carrying the pot and taking the heat.

To be sure, I don’t think the mob dunnit, even if the shooters were mobsters. The conspiracy was was wider, like the assassination of Caesar. It would make some sense if the triangulators themselves were acting on faith that the others were in place, without having a clue as to who they were.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Who were Dallas mob chieftains Joe Civello and Joe Camipisi most beholden to in any organized crime business of high importance on their turf?

Did they do things on their own or did they have a higher source of outside permission and oversight?

Was it Chicago, New York, Florida, LA?  Marcello himself?

When hot headed, hot reputation stripper Jada threatened Jack Ruby with meat hook hanging or castration in their seemingly continuous horrible relationship, didn't Ruby contact people he knew in the Chicago outfit to ask for some help with dealing with her and a few other of his girls in their demands for better pay and work conditions? I believe he did.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Rich Pope
12 hours ago, Ron Bulman said:

Didn't Jim just tell you a couple of day's ago in detail that Marcello didn't even control the New Orleans mob?  Neither plot nor the assassination was done by the mob.

Chicago involved a couple of possible Cubans who got away and a guy with a history similar to Oswald.  A warehouse on a corner.  A lot like Dallas.  

Tampa was about A Man In An Office Building With A Rifle and Milteer, of the KKK.

Both threats practice runs I've wondered?  But not by the mob.

The mob couldn't have pulled all this off and covered it up

You claim to be a Former CIA employee.  Not an agent.  But anybody the CIA would hire would be smart enough to figure out this is BS.  

Jim's wrong.  He's a nice enough guy but he's not right all the time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...