Jack Ruby

[Lee Forman]

Glad of any help here. There's something amiss as relates to Jack Ruby. Need to try to sort it out. Aside from some of the documentation available concerning his movements, I think starting by putting the sightings in chronological order may be helpful.

Jack Ruby sightings - Dealey Plaza

12:15pm? Julia Ann Mercer - says she saw Jack Ruby, and this is removed from her original statement. Green Ford, Texas Plates, with Tool Boxes. Muchmore frames have an interesting green ford pick-up with tool boxes. Driver's side had black letters that said 'Air Conditioning.' [Warren Report, Police Afidavit and On the Trail of the Assassins].

12:? Ruby is with a buddy of his, whom he has called to 'watch the fireworks.' The man is an informer. They stand in front of the Postal Annex building. Does anyone have the name associated, and know the time [MIDP]?

12:20pm? Lee Bowers - didn't say Jack Ruby, but describes a man of his age and build, as being stationed behind the fence.

12:30pm - Wanda Walker says that Jack Ruby was in the offices of the Dallas Morning News, and that he spoke to her for the first time ever, nervously, as if he needed to talk to someone. When the news came in that the President had been shot, he turned white as a sheet [Crossfire, page 327].

12:31pm? Malcolm Couch says that Wes Wise told him that he had seen Ruby walking around the side of the TSBD only moments after the shooting. Couch was forced to back down on this as hearsay - and no record of Wise ever confirming? [Crossfire, 325].

12:33pm? Jean Hill - says she saw a man that she thought was Jack Ruby running from the TSBD towards the grassy knoll. The opposite direction than the heavy set man in his 40s seen by Bowers, and the other side of the plaza from where Mercer says she saw Ruby parked with his pick-up on the curb [Warren Report].

12:40pm? Victoria Elizabeth Adams - says that she was outside the TSBD, and witnessed Jack Ruby standing with a man who appeared to be some sort of Policeman, on the corner of Elm and Houston. [Warren Report].

12:40pm? Phil Willis takes Photo #8, in which he believes is a man that bears a remarkable resemblance to Jack Ruby. It is printed partially cropped [along the face of the individual in question] in the Warren Report.

12:40PM? Mrs. Avery Davis - sees a man that resembles Jack Ruby, assumes he is a policeman, doesn't see his face [box 3, folder 19, DPD records]

12:40pm? Tom Tilson, sees a man that would fit in with Lee Bowers description, sliding down the embankment with an object that appears to be rifle shaped, slams into the side of the car, which is not a green Ford pick-up but a dark car, and drives off. Tilson and his daughter give chase, and Tilson catches up to the man and gets a good look at his face - Tilson believes it is Jack Ruby. [On-line account, below]. The McIntyre photo doesn't mean crap to me personally - if they altered the other photos, no reason to start thinking this one was left alone.

12:? Armstrong has 4 women that say that they saw LHO emerge from the TSBD, and Jack Ruby hand him a pistol. He provides no reference in the on-line account. Anyone have this info, and have an idea as to the time?

What am I missing, anything?

This is going someplace, but I think that even the above demonstrates that there had to be at least one man that resembled Jack Ruby, in stature, in the Plaza that day, and possibly even two [was one Ruby himself, or not?].

We then have some interesting sightings at the scene of the Tippit murder, Parkland, the Texas Theatre, the Cuban embassy, etc. I have some rather bizarre newspaper articles which I would also like to present, and some photos [need to figure out how to upload again].

- lee

Some Reference stuff...

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/tilson.htm

Is Tom Tilson a Credible Witness?

By Peter R. Whitmey

QUOTE

You won't find any reference to Dallas Police patrolman Tom G. Tilson, Jr. in the Warren Commission volumes, despite the fact that he allegedly provided important information to the homicide squad of the Dallas Police on November 22, 1963. Tilson did come forward in August of 1978, however. and was interviewed by a staff member of the HSCA (House Select Committee on Assassinations). A brief summary of his account was included in the 1980 book Conspiracy by Anthony Summers (who mistakenly referred to him as "John Tilson") and a lengthier description of him appears in the 1989 book Crossfire by Jim Marrs. Tilson also appeared as a witness for the defense in the mock trial of Lee Harvey Oswald originally broadcast on Spotlight, and later on A. & E. Tilson even made an appearance along with his friend Madeline Brown at the "open bar" gathering that took place prior to the first annual Assassination Symposium on John F. Kennedy (ASK) held at the Hyatt Regency hotel in Dallas in November 1991 (looking amazingly like Lyndon Johnson).

Tilson has claimed for the last fourteen years (and possibly longer) that on November 22, 1963 he was driving towards Dealey Plaza on Commerce Street with one of his daughters seated beside him just as the motorcade came through the triple underpass. He had already heard on his police radio of the shooting and as he approached the area immediately to the west of the railroad tracks, Tilson spotted a man sliding down the steep bank on the north side of Elm Street. He noticed the man throw something into a dark-colored car on the driver's side, then get in and immediately drive quickly away towards Industrial Boulevard several blocks west of the assassination site.

Even though Tilson was not on duty that day, he instinctively turned around on Commerce and followed the man, who was heading in the direction of Ft. Worth. Although he managed to approach the car close enough to get a good look at the driver, whom he described as matching the physical features of Jack Ruby. He did not attempt to force the driver off the road, but instead he had his daughter, Dinah, write down the license number, make, and model on a slip of paper (to this day he can not recall what kind of car the man was driving, however). Once he reached his home, he gave the information to someone in the homicide department of the Dallas Police, which he described in his 1978 testimony as being elitist, resenting "...any encroachment on its authority." He never heard back from the Department again, and after holding onto the slip of paper for ten years, finally discarded it, around the time of his wife's death.

Warren Report

QUOTE

Miss ADAMS - There was a man that was standing on the corner of Houston and Elm asking questions there. He was dressed in a suit and a hat, and when I encountered Avery Davis going down, we asked who he was, because he was questioning people as if he were a police officer, and we noticed him take a colored boy away on a motorcycle, and this man was asking questions very efficaciously, and we said, "I guess he is maybe a reporter," and later on on television, there was a man that looked very similar to him, and he was identified as Ruby.

And on questioning some police officer, they said they had witnesses to the fact that he was in the Dallas Morning News at the time. And I don't know whether that is relevant or what.

http://www.geocities.com/northstarzone/JFK.html

QUOTE

One Phillip Willis took a series of 12 photos of Dealey Plaza, where Kennedy was shot, in the minutes before and after the assassination. Mr. Willis' photos and testimony before the Warren Commission appear in the Warren Commission's report. He was not questioned about the eighth photo, a shot of the Book Depository entrance shortly after the shooting. As Willis later pointed out, one of the men in the photo "looks so much like Jack Ruby, Oswald's soon to be assassin, it's pitiful". F.B.I. agents questioning Willis agreed with him that the man bore a powerful resemblance to Ruby. When Willis mentioned this to the Commission, no interest was shown. When the photo was published in the Warren Report, a considerable part of the Ruby lookalike's face had been cropped away.

QUOTE

From Bill Sloan's book, 'The Last dissenting witness.'

1. Jean Hill saw Jack Ruby run at break-neck speed from the Texas Book Depository to the fence on the grassy knoll immediately after the shooting of JFK, as she ran towards the fence where she thought the shooter was.

2. She saw a man in a Dallas-police uniform holding a rifle and standing behind the fence on the grassy knoll, immediately after the shooting, right before she was grabbed and escorted away by two Secret Service men.

3. Her boyfriend was J.B. Marshall, the Dallas police officer who was on a motorcycle to the left rear of the president's car and who's helmet and bike got splattered with JFK's blood and brains. He told her that LBJ's Secret Service people instructed the motorcycle cops at the Dallas airport that these changes were being made: (a) the parade route was being changed to cut through Dealey Plaza on Elm Street; ( the motorcycle cops would not be at the front of the presidential limousine as they normally would have been, but would only be at the rear of the presidential limousine; © the order of the cars in the motorcade was changed so that Johnson's car would not be immediately behind the presidential car, but that a carload of Secret Service would be in between the President's car and LBJ's car. Most shocking of all, was his report to Jean Hill that another motorcycle cop witnessed that LBJ started ducking down in his car at least 30 to 40 seconds before the first shots were fired.

4. Arlen Specter, who questioned her in Dallas for the Warren Commission, was the one who proposed the "single bullet theory" that was adopted by the Warren Commission. His butchered transcript of her testimony to the Warren Commission was "heavily edited, completely distorted and shamelessly fabricated."

http://teaching.arts.usyd.edu.au/history/h...rames/jim1.html

QUOTE

The F.B.I. hushed up the fact that it had been informed of a plot to kill the President five days before the actual assassination and began bullying witnesses like Fenella Farrington (see Chapter 5) and trying to silence others like Richard Randolph Carr (see Chapter 18). It went so far as to alter the statements of witness Julia Ann Mercer, who identified Jack Ruby as the man she had seen dropping off a rifleman on the grassy knoll an hour before the assassination. (See Chapter 17.)

http://www.skepticfiles.org/socialis/garevid.htm

QUOTE

f. Julia Ann Mercer, wife of a former congressman, was caught in

a traffic jam near the grassy knoll sometime before the arrival

of the motorcade. She saw a man get out of a pickup truck

carrying a poorly concealed rifle and climb up the grassy knoll.

The next day she identified the driver of the pickup as Jack

Ruby. This was the day before Ruby shot Oswald. The FBI altered

her statement so that it did not mention the positive

identification. The sheriff's office filed a notarized affidavit

that said Mercer was not able to identify the driver. Mercer

said that she had never been brought before a notary and that her

signature on the affidavit had been forged.

http://karws.gso.uri.edu/JFK/the_critics/g...from_front.html

QUOTE

Bowers also said he saw two men standing near the fence on the knoll minutes before the shots were fired. He said one of the men was young and was wearing a plaid shirt or coat. He described the other man as being heavy-set and middle-aged.

Julia Ann Mercer saw two men resembling this description near the knoll about an hour and a half before the shooting. As Miss Mercer was driving west on Elm Street, she got stuck in traffic that was congested because of a green Ford pick-up truck which had illegally parked in the lane on the far right. This vehicle was half on the street and half on the sidewalk. Miss Mercer pulled up behind the truck and stopped as she waited to pull out and pass. While she was waiting to pass, she saw a man at the back of the truck take what appeared to be a brown rifle case, which she described in considerable detail, from the tool compartment of the truck and walk up the grassy knoll. This man, she said, was white and was wearing a gray jacket, brown pants, and a plaid shirt. He was also wearing a stocking-type hat. As she drove around the truck, she took a look at the driver. He was a heavy-set white man with brown hair and was wearing a green jacket.

Realizing the implications of Miss Mercer's account, WC supporters have sought to discredit it. In so doing, they face a very difficult task. Miss Mercer reported her story to the Sheriff's Department within hours of the shooting. She had no conceivable motive to lie, was a person of good character, and gave a clear, detailed account of what she saw. Additionally, her description of the two men in the truck resembled the description of the two men later seen by Lee Bowers standing near the fence on the knoll. Both Mercer and Bowers described two males, one heavy-set and middle-aged and the other younger, and both said the younger man was wearing a plaid shirt.

QUOTE

SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT, COUNTY OF DALLAS, TEXAS

Before me, the undersigned authority on this the 22nd day of November A.D. 1963, personally appeared Julia Ann Mercer, Address 5200 Belmont, No. 208, Dallas, Age 23, Employed: Automat Distributors, 1720 Canton, Dallas.

Deposes and says:

On November 22, 1963, I was driving a rented White Valient automobile west on Elm Street and was proceeding to the overpass in a westerly direction and at a point about 45 or 50 feet east of the overhead signs of the right entrance road to the overpass, there was a truck parked on the right hand side of the road. The truck looked like it had 1 or 2 wheels up on the curb. The hood of the truck was open. On the driver's side of the truck, there were printed letters in black, oval shaped, which said "Air Conditioning". This was a pickup truck and along the back side of the truck were what appeared to be tool boxes. The truck was a green Ford with a Texas license. I remember seeing the word "Ford" at the back of the truck.

A man was sitting under the wheel of the car and slouched over the wheel. This man had on a green jacket, was a white male and about his 40's and was heavy set. I did not see him too clearly. Another man was at the back of the truck and reached over the tailgate and took out from the truck what appeared to be a gun case. This case was about 8" wide at its widest spot and tapered down to a width of about 4" or 5". It was brown in color. It had a handle and was about 3 1/2 to 4 feet long. The man who took this out of the truck then proceeded to walk away from the truck and he reached down to free it. He then proceeded to walk across the grass and up the grassy hill which forms part of the overpass. This is the last I saw of this man.

I had been delayed because the truck which I described was blocking my passage and I had to await until the lane to my left cleared so I could go by the truck.

During the time that I was at this point and observed the above incident there were 3 policeman standing talking near a motorcycle on the bridge just west of me.

The man who took what appeared to be the gun case out of the truck was a white male, who appeared to be in his late 20's or early 30's and he was wearing a grey jacket, brown pants and plaid shirt as best as I can remember. I remember he had on some kind of a hat that looked like a wool stocking hat with a tassell in the middle of it. I believe that I can identify this man if I see him again.

The man who remained in the truck had light brown hair and I believe I could identify him also if I were to see him again.

(signed by) Julia Ann Mercer.

Subscribed and sworn to before me on this the 22nd of November A.D. 1963

(signed by) Rosemary Allen

Notary Public, Dallas, Texas

[Wade Rhodes]

-------------------

Edited March 24, 2005 by Wade Rhodes

[Shanet Clark]

I want to thank Lee Forman for the recent posts.

Does anyone have this picture of "Jack Ruby" in Dealey that was cropped?

[ I have a hard time imagining that anyone would carry a rifle up the grassy knoll(given all the activity behind the fence in the parking lot) but the green truck, the description of the two men, all tie together.]

[James Richards]

Does anyone have this picture of "Jack Ruby" in Dealey that was cropped? (Shanet Clark)

The Willis photo in question shows a guy standing on the far right of frame wearing sunglasses and he does resemble Ruby from that angle. I will send you the Willis image privately so not to use up bandwidth here.

Anyway, Jim Murray took the following image showing the same guy with the sunglasses. It is clearly not Ruby but this guy does bear a striking similarity to Remigio Arce.

FWIW.

James

[Shanet Clark]

Thanks James.

I was looking at Robin Unger's photo gallery and I saw a good frame of "construction worker man" as the motorcade passed him (near DCM/UM)...

He appears to be giving Kennedy the full, two armed "finger" with both elbows up and one forward.

We have discussed his unusual posture elsewhere, and what I see is an emphatic gesture of contempt, you know "stick it up your @$&" which really ties him to Umbrella Man, who was supposedly making a point about appeasement and Neville Chamberlain with his prominent (signal) umbrella......

But lets not sidetrack the JACK RUBY thread.

Was he in Dealey?

[Ron Ecker]

12:? Ruby is with a buddy of his, whom he has called to 'watch the fireworks.' The man is an informer. They stand in front of the Postal Annex building. Does anyone have the name associated, and know the time [MIDP]?

According to a 1977 FBI doc, Arlen Fuhlendorf of the FBI in Dallas was told this by the unnamed informant. He said Ruby called him that morning, and immediately after the shooting Ruby left the corner where they were and headed in the direction of the Dallas Morning News building.

12:? Armstrong has 4 women that say that they saw LHO emerge from the TSBD, and Jack Ruby hand him a pistol. He provides no reference in the on-line account. Anyone have this info, and have an idea as to the time?

According to an FBI doc dated 12/1/63, a Mrs. Evelyn Harris was told by a Lucy Lopez that Lopez's daughter and some other women who worked in a sewing room across from the TSBD saw Ruby walking up and down the street near the TSBD, and saw him hand Oswald the pistol when he came out of the TSBD. Lopez said the women knew Oswald who apparently spoke Spanish well and ate with them at a nearby restaurant.

Is Tom Tilson a Credible Witness?

By Peter R. Whitmey

No, Peter, he's not.

Miss ADAMS - There was a man that was standing on the corner of Houston and Elm asking questions there. He was dressed in a suit and a hat, and when I encountered Avery Davis going down, we asked who he was, because he was questioning people as if he were a police officer, and we noticed him take a colored boy away on a motorcycle, and this man was asking questions very efficaciously, and we said, "I guess he is maybe a reporter," and later on on television, there was a man that looked very similar to him, and he was identified as Ruby.

It sounds like Adams is talking about SS agent Forrest Sorrels. Did Sorrels resemble Ruby? The "colored boy" was Amos Euins, and it was Sorrels who had Euins taken to the sheriff's office after questioning him in front of the building. However, Sorrels did not arrive back at the TSBD till some 20 minutes after the shooting, so if it was Sorrels then Adams reentered the building long after she said she did.

One Phillip Willis took a series of 12 photos of Dealey Plaza, where Kennedy was shot, in the minutes before and after the assassination. Mr. Willis' photos and testimony before the Warren Commission appear in the Warren Commission's report. He was not questioned about the eighth photo, a shot of the Book Depository entrance shortly after the shooting. As Willis later pointed out, one of the men in the photo "looks so much like Jack Ruby, Oswald's soon to be assassin, it's pitiful". F.B.I. agents questioning Willis agreed with him that the man bore a powerful resemblance to Ruby. When Willis mentioned this to the Commission, no interest was shown. When the photo was published in the Warren Report, a considerable part of the Ruby lookalike's face had been cropped away.

As James has pointed out, this man was not Jack Ruby. However, I think there is strong photographic evidence that Ruby or else a lookalike was in DP at the time of the shooting. Either Ruby or his twin is in the same photo in which newsman Robert McNeill appears, in the crowd where the picket fence adjoins the overpass. (Photo in TKOAP p. 49.)

Ron

Edited March 24, 2005 by Ron Ecker

[Shanet Clark]

Ron,

This photo?

Edited March 24, 2005 by Shanet Clark

[Lee Forman]

James,

The scenario witnessed by Adams has the 3-wheeled motorcycle taking off with a suspect. She said that it was the man asking questions, who was standing with this Ruby-like character. I believe you posted that photo before. I can't remember which film I saw it in - Dallas Cinema? Is the Ruby/'CuCu' character standing anywhere in the area as this event takes place?

I still would like to know if Danny is related. He's only been there a month I think? In Altgens 6, Danny is standing with what looks to be 'the wrong crowd.' Just speculation. Although I believe the man standing in front of him is on a radio. We did that somewhere else I think.

Interesting stuff....

Shanet,

Among the other interesting characters in the plaza were those that were acting in the capacity of authority figures. I've been noticing this more and more. I had a bit of an exchange with someone concerning roles and responsibilities of the operatives. I was using my own list, and ammending it with Culligans. I added a few more: Check this out:

Driver [maybe a secondary role for Transporter]

Shooter

Spotter

Recorder

Security

Signalling

Sounds good, right?

Then add:

Diversion

Camoflauge

Watcher

Impersonator

It's an interesting concept. Culligan has operatives whose role was to create chaos, and divert the attention of the SS and DPD. TUM as a signal man? Why, when you have DCM standing right next to him? How about to draw the eyes of every SS man while Kennedy was being fired on.

Camoflauge - that's someone dressed up in everyday Joe clothing who stands very close to the shooter. This role can overlap with others.

Watcher - this role could be filled out by a number of people. That would be to watch Johnny Q. and make a note of anyone making an unauthorized record. Then step up and 'Featherstone' it. New expression.

Impersonator - So who is the man asking questions seen by Adams? Who is the guy claiming to be an SS man? Who is the SS man on the knoll. Who is the man in the Brehm photo? Were those really construction workers? Why so many Ruby sightings? Why so many LHO sightings?

Then add that stuff on the Police cars. What a set-up.

[Ron Ecker]

Ron,

This photo?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, that's Ruby or a lookalike walking under the tree. He can be seen more clearly (as can McNeill) in the book.)

Ron

Edited March 24, 2005 by Ron Ecker

[Ron Ecker]

Jim Murray took the following image showing the same guy with the sunglasses. It is clearly not Ruby but this guy does bear a striking similarity to Remigio Arce.

FWIW.

James

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

James,

Do you have any photos of Arce besides the group photo of the arrested Interpen men? That's the only one I have a printed copy of. Based on that photo, I agree that the similarity is striking.

And the man wearing glasses who's second behind the Arce lookalike resembles Nazario Sargen, does he not?

Also, the guy who is between them looks entirely too slick. He had to be in on it.

Ron

Edited March 25, 2005 by Ron Ecker

[James Richards]

James,

Do you have any photos of Arce besides the group photo of the arrested Interpen men? That's the only one I have a printed copy of. Based on that photo, I agree that the similarity is striking.

And the man wearing glasses who's second behind the Arce lookalike resembles Nazario Sargen, does he not?

Also, the guy who is between them looks entirely too slick. He had to be in on it. (Ron Ecker)

Hi Ron,

That's the only shot of Remigio Arce I have. For those who are interested, you can find it at the photo archives here -

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/PHOTOinterpen16.htm

Kind of makes you think about Danny Arce and that Interpen photograph doesn't it?

The guy with the glasses does resemble Sargen but he looks a bit thin and maybe a bit too old. There are also shots of Sargen at the photo archives under the Alpha 66 heading.

Mr. Slick has also intrigued me over the years. I have tried to find him in other aftermath photographs but with no luck. I think it's time to dust off the box of images I have showing anti-Castro guys and to do some serious comparisons.

James

[James Richards]

I forgot to mention that our friend in the sunglasses can also be found in this image below (center frame). He seems to be interested (as are the other people gathered) in whoever is inside the vehicle. I assume this was during the period when the DPD were arresting several Dealey Plaza spectators.

No sign of Mr. Slick here.

James

[Lee Forman]

I forgot to mention that our friend in the sunglasses can also be found in this image below (center frame). He seems to be interested (as are the other people gathered) in whoever is inside the vehicle. I assume this was during the period when the DPD were arresting several Dealey Plaza spectators.

No sign of Mr. Slick here.

James

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

James, That may be Charles Brehm in the car?

Can't remember the reference. TMWKK? They put him and his son in a car for questioning, and people began to assume he was associated with the shooting, and began to yell obscenities and make an ugly scene? Anyone have that transcript?

Wouldn't happen that real operatives present would make a big deal of placing the blame on an innocent, would it?

- lee

[James Richards]

James, That may be Charles Brehm in the car?

Can't remember the reference. TMWKK? They put him and his son in a car for questioning, and people began to assume he was associated with the shooting, and began to yell obscenities and make an ugly scene? Anyone have that transcript?

Wouldn't happen that real operatives present would make a big deal of placing the blame on an innocent, would it? (Lee Forman)

I believe you are correct about Brehm, Lee.

James

[James Richards]

Yes, that's Ruby or a lookalike walking under the tree. He can be seen more clearly (as can McNeill) in the book.) (Ron Ecker)

Hi Ron,

Here's a blow-up of the man in question. Could this be Jack Ruby?

James

Edited March 25, 2005 by James Richards