Guest Stephen Turner Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 Whilst browsing Mr Mcadams Government sponsored,snooze factory, I came across his "factoids"concerning the three tramps.Fear not.I have no intention of boring Members with them here.(Most are probably only too aware of them anyway)But I thought it may be useful for newcomers to the case, to hear what more seasoned members think of this conundrum. For example, were they part of the conspiracy, who are they, under who's orders were they acting, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ecker Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 I think they were actual tramps named Doyle, Gedney, and Abrams. The fact that Chauncey Holt claimed to be Abrams tends to discredit Holt's well-crafted and perhaps partially true story about his role in the day's events. That the three men were actual tramps is supported by the casual demeanor of the two cops escorting them. The cops, who were real cops, apparently just didn't take them seriously as suspects. One would certainly expect the cops to be more alert and ready to shoot these characters if explosives had been found with them on the train as alleged by Holt. The tramps would not have gained such notoreity and suspicion if Abrams had not resembled E. Howard Hunt as an older man, and if the blonde Gedney could not have been made to resemble the dark-haired Frank Fiorini through use of an overlay, or to resemble Charles Harrelson through the use of imagination and Harrelson's retracted claim to have helped off JFK. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stephen Turner Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 Thanks Ron I must admit to being at a loss as to what there actual role was supposed to be in the assassination. I know Wim Daankbar names them as, Harrelson, Rogers & Holt, but it appears to me on pretty flimsy evidence. Any other Members belive that they were part of the plot?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Simkin Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 I must admit to being at a loss as to what there actual role was supposed to be in the assassination. I know Wim Daankbar names them as, Harrelson, Rogers & Holt, but it appears to me on pretty flimsy evidence. Any other Members belive that they were part of the plot?? I actually believe John McAdams is right on this one. He often is as he concentrates on attacking the more daft aspects of JFK research. That is why McAdams picks on researchers such as Wim Daankbar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ecker Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 The most ridiculous claim is that these two men are one and the same: I recall reading that Gerry Hemming has said Frenchy was a man named Ted Slack. Perhaps Gerry can help us out here. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Simkin Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 For further discussions on this topic see: http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=2945 http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=2934 http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=2843 http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=2122 http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=1455 http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=640 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Geraghty Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 Im still on the fence with regard to the tramps. I dont understand why Holt would lie to his daughter on his deathbed by saying that he was one of the tramps. Harrelson has told me Holt is a xxxx and that he played no part in 22/11. Its just hard to tell whos telling the truth, a man who says he wants to come clean and confess to being part of it or a man who is already in prison and wants to deny taking part. I havent read any of the lafontaines work on the tramps, are there any good articles online about gedney, doyle, abrams? I have been constructing a page on my website with the various theories of who they are. Like most things to do with this case, its quite perplexing John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanet Clark Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 Im still on the fence with regard to the tramps............................... Like most things to do with this case, its quite perplexing John <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I am suprised Ron, who I respect very much, believes them to be the "late named" tramps, Doyle, etc. I, like many others, believed AJ Webeman and others years ago who pinned one Identity on Howard Hunt, and a second on Frank Sturgis. I now believe it was Chauncey Holt, I was swayed be Wim's online case for Holt. (however this doesn't extend to the other tramps or Jimmy Files) Holt's story hangs together and he is strongly resembling the photo. I have seen CHARLES HARRELSON on video confronted with the photo and confess to being in the photo, and he strongly resembled the photo. Charles ROGERS is the type of person we would suspect in this covert domestic joint (deniable) operation in Dallas, but he is not "Frenchy" I suspect Frenchy was an OAS assassin, paratrooper in South East Asia for the French and was shuttled out of the country by a pilot with a similar background as Tosh Plumlee or David Ferrie. With radios, Identification and a two hour wait out in a boxcar, this may have been the fatal "forward shot" team, working behind the wall, fence or underpass structure. Frenchy may have not lived long enough to be exposed like Harrelson and Holt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack White Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 Harrelson...100% Hunt...100% Frenchy...unknown Sturgis...-0% Holt...-0% Gedney...-0% Doyle...-0% Abrams...-0% Rogers...-0% Carswell...-0% Christ...-0% Chrisman...-0% Bradley...-0% Jack (66.6% identified) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ecker Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 I suspect Frenchy was an OAS assassin, paratrooper in South East Asia for the French and was shuttled out of the country by a pilot with a similar background as Tosh Plumlee or David Ferrie. Shanet, It's my understanding that Frenchy got that nickname because he was dressed so well for a hobo, not because someone had evidence that he was from France. Not to say that he wasn't French, but I haven't seen evidence of it. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ecker Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 (edited) Add 30 years to the tramp photos, and I think Doyle, Gedney, and Abrams are just as close in resemblance as the usual suspects. We should also consider the fact that the FBI (which found them, as it should have years earlier) has told plenty of lies, but doesn't lie about everything. It just seems that way. Ron Edited May 17, 2005 by Ron Ecker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Simkin Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 See this new thread: http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=3854 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Richards Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 Harrelson has told me Holt is a xxxx and that he played no part in 22/11. (John Geraghty) Hi John, That is most interesting. After his initial statement which was then retracted, it was my understanding that Harrelson now claims to have been no part of what went down in Dallas. How would he know that Holt was not involved if he wasn't either? Has he ever offered any opinions as to who he believes was behind the assassination? James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Geraghty Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 sorry james, I wrote this incorrectly , what i meant to say was that harrelson called holt a xxxx and that he (harrelson) had nothing to do with the assassination. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Richards Posted May 17, 2005 Share Posted May 17, 2005 sorry james, I wrote this incorrectly , what i meant to say was that harrelson called holt a xxxx and that he (harrelson) had nothing to do with the assassination.John <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Thanks, John. Regarding Frenchy, some time ago I presented this possibility below. Duenas was one of Eddie Bayo's guys and a part of Operation Tilt. I post it as a possible only. James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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