Gerry Hemming Posted November 7, 2005 Share Posted November 7, 2005 Well, I don't know Hemming. The fact is that Ferrie wasn't under house arrest. They might have wanted him to stay in one place, but its not the same thing. You either misheard or misremembered what Ivon said. -------------------------- Negatory Owen [and this is one of the many snivel factors by Mellen] I asked Jim how they got a judge to sign a criminal complaint affidavit to execute even a "house arrest ??" Lou interrupted to explain that pursuant to the "Napoleanic CIVIL Code" under which LA still operates, they had utilized a "material Witness" warrant; the same kind that hundreds of Muslim detainees were grabbed by the FBI since post-9/11. The "screw-up" was in saving the overtime buck$ for a baby-sitter, which bail bondsman [like my nephew] use renta-a-pigs or P.I.s instead of regular [or reserve] cops/constables. That is why every Cajun in N.O. still has a constable's badge, unless Katrina washed it away !! Cheers, GPH _______________________ Its not just Mellen, but every other book and account, pro- or anti-Garrison. Don't get me wrong, I do enjoy reading your posts and appreciate your presence here, but I don't attach a lot of credibility to this account. And really, I have no problem with accepting it either, if you can back it up. ------------------------------- Just after Oliver odered my 2nd haircut, on the sidewalk across from the "Bannister Office" locale; and in full view of the cordoned off & very amused spectators across the street -- me and Tomas Milian sat down with Joe Pesci on some garbage cans. In less than 20 minutes we had taught the little guy about 15 complicated phrases in Spanish [Cuban slang]. Tomas, though Cuban raised, had lived in Italy for years, and quietly insisted on pure Castillian phrases. We finally agreed that evidence showed that Ferrie used "guajiro" slang with a strong American accent, and thus reached a compromise. It amazed both of us that Joe could pick up these phrases so quickly, and we both then accused him of having at least taken a Berlitz course before filming started. He admitted to "messing" around with half a dozen languages since childhood. When I heard that Tomas was going to be the "boss" killer of Ferrie, I questioned Oliver as to where was the evidence of any "anti-Castro" Cubans having killed Ferrie. Response: Jim Garrison had a surveillance report from somewhere, that: "Cuban" looking men had exited Ferries place within the "time-of-death" window. "...Surveillance...by cops?...or neighbors making reports?" "[shrugged shoulders]" I asked for the OK to go see Garrison to check out exactly which was the case, or both !!" After mentioning that Lou had confirmed "house arrest" -- "...We will see about that later". After doing the scene inside the Bannister office with Joe, Asner, and Jack Lemmon, I went back over to the restaurant [where John Goodman still "hangs", and also where Garrison often had lunched] to once again speak with the owner about doing both a Garrison and Perry Russo set of scenes inside, or at least exteriors. Moi !! An assistant-set locale "director"once again. [Having done the same for the LaFitte 'training camp" set] While there, Hargraves showed up with one of the guys closest to Stone, and over a beer was advised that Garrison got real upset over a certain line of conversation -- and further asked that Kostner not do the restaurant scene to boot !! [This was THE actual restaurant where LHO was reported to have met with government agents, and was also frequented by Garrison quite regularly]. Seems that everybody was "pleasantly" surprised that we had "accidentally" found it ??!! Making mention of LHO to the owner, caused him to wobble a bit; and he said his dad ran things then -- and considering health matters and all, the family would gladly grant access at NO cost -- but no LHO, and no Kostner scenes !! A bonus from Kitman Ho or "bean-counter" Townsend ?? Don't be silly big guy, their giving you, Davy, and Roy unlimited meals & beer there !! Wow !! Thanks-a-bunch. Of course, Jim didn't want to go beyond the anti-Castro Cuban hit on Ferrie, and sure as hell didn't want to talk about a "screw-up". Now it is up to Lou Ivon's small circle to explain, or resolve -- or except that the "minor" scenario is meaningless, and was just more "Theater"!! Milian remained curious as to any evidence of Cubans killing Ferrie, and he asked Kostner about it during the filming of "Revenge" with Tony Quinn in Mexico. No NEWS here, GPH _______________________________ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynne Foster Posted November 7, 2005 Author Share Posted November 7, 2005 Why didn't Garrison record a statement from Ferrie, didn't he suspect his probable death in light of his involvement with Oswald? Ferrie never made out an affidavit, to my knowledge, but the DA's office did interview him, and shortly thereafter, according to Ivon, Ferrie confessed to him that he, Oswald, and Shaw, were all CIA, and that Shaw used the alias Clay Bertrand and hated Kennedy. Still no confession of involvement in the assassination. Please read up a bit before making false statements. You have to trust Garrison to consider that reliable. I inquired about tape recorded evidence. Why didn't he tape record Ferrie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owen Parsons Posted November 7, 2005 Share Posted November 7, 2005 I think at this point I'll be renewing my vow of no-response to Foster and join Dawn, Terry, and Ron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynne Foster Posted November 7, 2005 Author Share Posted November 7, 2005 I think at this point I'll be renewing my vow of no-response to Foster and join Dawn, Terry, and Ron. The point is, Jim Garrison did not expose any original truths about the assassination of John F. Kennedy. He merely reiterated the evidence that the critics developed, and if you take a historic perspective and acknowledge the criticism of competent researchers like Harold Weisberg, we know that he did not do anything to advance the truth about the assassination of John F. Kennedy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Hemming Posted November 7, 2005 Share Posted November 7, 2005 Well, I don't know Hemming. The fact is that Ferrie wasn't under house arrest. They might have wanted him to stay in one place, but its not the same thing. You either misheard or misremembered what Ivon said. -------------------------- Negatory Owen [and this is one of the many snivel factors by Mellen] I asked Jim how they got a judge to sign a criminal complaint affidavit to execute even a "house arrest ??" Lou interrupted to explain that pursuant to the "Napoleanic CIVIL Code" under which LA still operates, they had utilized a "material Witness" warrant; the same kind that hundreds of Muslim detainees were grabbed by the FBI since post-9/11. The "screw-up" was in saving the overtime buck$ for a baby-sitter, which bail bondsman [like my nephew] use renta-a-pigs or P.I.s instead of regular [or reserve] cops/constables. That is why every Cajun in N.O. still has a constable's badge, unless Katrina washed it away !! Cheers, GPH _______________________ Its not just Mellen, but every other book and account, pro- or anti-Garrison. Don't get me wrong, I do enjoy reading your posts and appreciate your presence here, but I don't attach a lot of credibility to this account. And really, I have no problem with accepting it either, if you can back it up. ------------------------------- Just after Oliver odered my 2nd haircut, on the sidewalk across from the "Bannister Office" locale; and in full view of the cordoned off & very amused spectators across the street -- me and Tomas Milian sat down with Joe Pesci on some garbage cans. In less than 20 minutes we had taught the little guy about 15 complicated phrases in Spanish [Cuban slang]. Tomas, though Cuban raised, had lived in Italy for years, and quietly insisted on pure Castillian phrases. We finally agreed that evidence showed that Ferrie used "guajiro" slang with a strong American accent, and thus reached a compromise. It amazed both of us that Joe could pick up these phrases so quickly, and we both then accused him of having at least taken a Berlitz course before filming started. He admitted to "messing" around with half a dozen languages since childhood. When I heard that Tomas was going to be the "boss" killer of Ferrie, I questioned Oliver as to where was the evidence of any "anti-Castro" Cubans having killed Ferrie. Response: Jim Garrison had a surveillance report from somewhere, that: "Cuban" looking men had exited Ferries place within the "time-of-death" window. "...Surveillance...by cops?...or neighbors making reports?" "[shrugged shoulders]" I asked for the OK to go see Garrison to check out exactly which was the case, or both !!" After mentioning that Lou had confirmed "house arrest" -- "...We will see about that later". After doing the scene inside the Bannister office with Joe, Asner, and Jack Lemmon, I went back over to the restaurant [where John Goodman still "hangs", and also where Garrison often had lunched] to once again speak with the owner about doing both a Garrison and Perry Russo set of scenes inside, or at least exteriors. Moi !! An assistant-set locale "director"once again. [Having done the same for the LaFitte 'training camp" set] While there, Hargraves showed up with one of the guys closest to Stone, and over a beer was advised that Garrison got real upset over a certain line of conversation -- and further asked that Kostner not do the restaurant scene to boot !! [This was THE actual restaurant where LHO was reported to have met with government agents, and was also frequented by Garrison quite regularly]. Seems that everybody was "pleasantly" surprised that we had "accidentally" found it ??!! Making mention of LHO to the owner, caused him to wobble a bit; and he said his dad ran things then -- and considering health matters and all, the family would gladly grant access at NO cost -- but no LHO, and no Kostner scenes !! A bonus from Kitman Ho or "bean-counter" Townsend ?? Don't be silly big guy, their giving you, Davy, and Roy unlimited meals & beer there !! Wow !! Thanks-a-bunch. Of course, Jim didn't want to go beyond the anti-Castro Cuban hit on Ferrie, and sure as hell didn't want to talk about a "screw-up". Now it is up to Lou Ivon's small circle to explain, or resolve -- or except that the "minor" scenario is meaningless, and was just more "Theater"!! Milian remained curious as to any evidence of Cubans killing Ferrie, and he asked Kostner about it during the filming of "Revenge" with Tony Quinn in Mexico. No NEWS here, GPH _______________________________ ------------------ Just got corrected by a pissed off Milian cousin in Miami -- and this person says the he "demanded" that Tomas raise the issue with Kostner while working up a VHS deal for "Revenge" in Italy some months after "JFK" came out in early 1992. [CRS again] GPH ___________________________ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynne Foster Posted November 7, 2005 Author Share Posted November 7, 2005 Garrison repeatedly told Harold Weisberg that the "smoking gun" evidence would be revealed at Shaw's trial, but he never delivered. In the final analysis, Jim Garrison discredited himself. His rhetoric proved to be absolutely meaningless, and you all should choose your heroes very carefully, because Jim Garrison proved to be an absolute failure. Perhaps you are just Kevin Kostner fans, and you fail to understand the fact the Garrison, unlike Kostner, was all smoke and mirrors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanet Clark Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 WAY WAY WAY TOO HARSH Garrison used his office to go after the Claw Shaw crowd and folllowed up on David Ferrie Nobody knew the whole story and because his trial didn't prove everything down pat, he still stood up and said "wait something is very wrong here" He knew about Bannister, Clay Shaw, David Ferrie, 544 Camp street, the flights in and out And what did you ever do? slagging garrison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynne Foster Posted November 8, 2005 Author Share Posted November 8, 2005 (edited) WAY WAY WAY TOO HARSHGarrison used his office to go after the Claw Shaw crowd and folllowed up on David Ferrie Nobody knew the whole story and because his trial didn't prove everything down pat, he still stood up and said "wait something is very wrong here" He knew about Bannister, Clay Shaw, David Ferrie, 544 Camp street, the flights in and out And what did you ever do? slagging garrison He also knew that Lyndon Johnson and Hoover were involved in the assassination of John F. Kennedy and did a fine job covering it up. Republicans are currently saying."this isn't about a CIA leak, it's about perjury." You can believe them if you like, but most people are saying, "wait, there is something wrong here", they mean it and it isn't making any difference. When Garrison said "wait, there is something wrong here" it was merely a misleading echo, because if you can't even find a pubic hair in a whorehouse, as Weisberg aptly illustrated, you are deliberately covering up the truth. Despite all the Garison, hero-worship that has infected this thread, this is still the significant truth about the hoaxter and far as I am concerned, I don't understand anybody who thinks that Garrison deserves any credit for anything beyond successfully obscurring the truth about David Ferrie and others. The simple fact of the matter is, if you want to cover up a crime and you are a corrupt DA, you arrest the wrong person. WHY DO YOU THINK LEE HARVEY OSWALD & CLAY SHAW WERE ARRESTED? Jay Epstein put it best: "On the evening of June 19, 1967, NBC devoted an hour to a critical examination of Garrison's investigation, entitled "The JFK Conspiracy: The case of Jim Garrison." The first part of the program dealt with Russo's allegation that he had seen Oswald, Shaw and Ferrie plotting the assassiantion at a party in Ferrie's apartment in September 1963. The NBC reporters demonstrated that at least one other person presentat the party had not seen Shaw or Oswald there, and that Ferrie's bearded roomate, who Russo claimed was Oswald, had been identified by other people at the party as James Lewallen. The program then concentrated on Garrison's investigative methods, and a parade of witnesses was presented to allege that Garrison representatives had attempted to bribe or intimidate them. In addition, NBC revealed that both of garrison's key witnesses, Russo and Vernon Bundy, had failed lie-detector tests before testifying at the preliminary hearing... During the time I studied Garrison's investigation and had access to his office, the only evidence I saw or heard about that could connect Clay Shaw with the assassiantion was fraudulent -some devised by Garrison himself and some cynically culled from criminals or the emotionally unstable." Edited November 8, 2005 by Lynne Foster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawn Meredith Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 WAY WAY WAY TOO HARSHGarrison used his office to go after the Claw Shaw crowd and folllowed up on David Ferrie Nobody knew the whole story and because his trial didn't prove everything down pat, he still stood up and said "wait something is very wrong here" He knew about Bannister, Clay Shaw, David Ferrie, 544 Camp street, the flights in and out And what did you ever do? slagging garrison Shan: So nice to see you back!!! But don't waste your time here, let her just piss in the wind, alone. She can argue with herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stephen Turner Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 Pissin in the wind, love it dawn LOL, BTW didn't dylan record that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Mauro Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 (edited) Pissin in the wind, love it dawn LOL, BTW didn't dylan record that? ******************************************************** "Pissin in the wind, love it dawn LOL, BTW didn't dylan record that?" Hi Stephen, No, Dylan's was "Blowin' In The Wind". It was Jim Croce who penned the words: "You don't tug on Superman's cape. You don't piss into the wind. You don't pull the mask off the old Long Ranger. And, you don't mess around with Jim." And, you can call me the breeze, cause I'm outta here! Sorry, I just couldn't resist that, folks. ;o) Edited November 8, 2005 by Terry Mauro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas H. Purvis Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 Pissin in the wind, love it dawn LOL, BTW didn't dylan record that? ******************************************************** "Pissin in the wind, love it dawn LOL, BTW didn't dylan record that?" Hi Stephen, No, Dylan's was "Blowin' In The Wind". It was Jim Croce who penned the words: "You don't tug on Superman's cape. You don't piss into the wind. You don't pull the mask off the old Long Ranger. And, you don't mess around with Jim." And, you can call me the breeze, cause I'm outta here! Sorry, I just couldn't resist that, folks. ;o) Hey! Considering the number of times that song was played in the pool rooms of New Orleans, it is entirely appropriate, in more than one or two ways. Tom By the way, it was: "You don't Spit into the wind"! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynne Foster Posted November 8, 2005 Author Share Posted November 8, 2005 I think you all ought to focus on the real critics. WAY WAY WAY TOO HARSH Garrison used his office to go after the Claw Shaw crowd and folllowed up on David Ferrie Nobody knew the whole story and because his trial didn't prove everything down pat, he still stood up and said "wait something is very wrong here" He knew about Bannister, Clay Shaw, David Ferrie, 544 Camp street, the flights in and out And what did you ever do? slagging garrison He also knew that Lyndon Johnson and Hoover were involved in the assassination of John F. Kennedy and did a fine job covering it up. Republicans are currently saying."this isn't about a CIA leak, it's about perjury." You can believe them if you like, but most people are saying, "wait, there is something wrong here", they mean it and it isn't making any difference. When Garrison said "wait, there is something wrong here" it was merely a misleading echo, because if you can't even find a pubic hair in a whorehouse, as Weisberg aptly illustrated, you are deliberately covering up the truth. Despite all the Garison, hero-worship that has infected this thread, this is still the significant truth about the hoaxter and far as I am concerned, I don't understand anybody who thinks that Garrison deserves any credit for anything beyond successfully obscurring the truth about David Ferrie and others. The simple fact of the matter is, if you want to cover up a crime and you are a corrupt DA, you arrest the wrong person. WHY DO YOU THINK LEE HARVEY OSWALD & CLAY SHAW WERE ARRESTED? Jay Epstein put it best: "On the evening of June 19, 1967, NBC devoted an hour to a critical examination of Garrison's investigation, entitled "The JFK Conspiracy: The case of Jim Garrison." The first part of the program dealt with Russo's allegation that he had seen Oswald, Shaw and Ferrie plotting the assassiantion at a party in Ferrie's apartment in September 1963. The NBC reporters demonstrated that at least one other person presentat the party had not seen Shaw or Oswald there, and that Ferrie's bearded roomate, who Russo claimed was Oswald, had been identified by other people at the party as James Lewallen. The program then concentrated on Garrison's investigative methods, and a parade of witnesses was presented to allege that Garrison representatives had attempted to bribe or intimidate them. In addition, NBC revealed that both of garrison's key witnesses, Russo and Vernon Bundy, had failed lie-detector tests before testifying at the preliminary hearing... During the time I studied Garrison's investigation and had access to his office, the only evidence I saw or heard about that could connect Clay Shaw with the assassiantion was fraudulent -some devised by Garrison himself and some cynically culled from criminals or the emotionally unstable." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynne Foster Posted November 9, 2005 Author Share Posted November 9, 2005 Key evidence regarding Jim Garrison: This is by Jay Epstein. On January 21, 1969, after nearly two years of concocting and playing out hois charges in the national media, Jim Garrison finally tried the accused, Clay Shaw, in a court of law in New Orleans. Even though Garrison had announced on February 24, 1967, that he had "positively solved the assassination of President John F. Kennedy" -and one week later, arrested Clay Shaw for conspiring to kill the president -it now turned out that he had not yet found any evidence whatsoever of the putative conspiracy that he presented at the trial at the time he made this sensational claim, The conspiracy he laid out in court took place at a single meeting in late September 1963 in the apartment of David Ferrie in which three conspirators, Clay Shaw, David Ferrie, and Lee Harvey Oswald, plotted the "cross fire" and triangulation of fire" in Dallas through which theyplanned to assassinate Kennedy, and this conspiracy was witnessed by the only other person in the apartment, Perry Raymond Russo... The last known person to speak to Ferrie was George Lardner, Jr., of the Washington Post, whom Ferrie had met with from midnight to 4:00 a.m. on February 22, 1967. During this interview, Ferrie described Garrison as "a joke". Several hours later, Ferrie died of a cerebral hemorrhage. [but he was probably murdered because "the joke" needed a corpse like Lee Harvey Oswald, to get away with promoting his bizarre allegations.] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Carroll Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 ...Ferrie described Garrison as "a joke". Several hours later, Ferrie died of a cerebral hemorrhage. [but he was probably murdered because "the joke" needed a corpse like Lee Harvey Oswald, to get away with promoting his bizarre allegations.] Now we have the "bizarre allegation" that Ferrie was murdered to suit Jim Garrison's purpose. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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