The Diem cables

[Ashton Gray]

You have refused to answer any of my questions.

I'll let honest and prudent people who have waded through seven pages of this topic decide for themselves whether I have honored my promise to engage with you and answer relevant question on this one specific issue of the Diem cables or not, and whether that makes your statement above a damned lie or not. It's in the record.

And they also know exactly and unequivocally what my own position is.

By contrast, here is the precisely on-topic, relevant, pertinent question of material fact that goes to the very core of this entire issue, the question that you have gone through seven forum pages dodging and evading and now have squandered yet another post on, wasting everyone's time, in further dodging and evading. So I'm going to ask you again:

Do you claim that there was one "forged Diem cable," or that there was more than one "forged Diem cable"?

Ashton

Edited November 18, 2006 by Ashton Gray

[Pat Speer]

You have refused to answer any of my questions.

I'll let honest and prudent people who have waded through seven pages of this topic decide for themselves whether I have honored my promise to engage with you and answer relevant question on this one specific issue of the Diem cables or not, and whether that makes your statement above a damned lie or not. It's in the record.

And they also know exactly and unequivocally what my own position is.

By contrast, here is the precisely on-topic, relevant, pertinent question of material fact that goes to the very core of this entire issue, the question that you have gone through seven forum pages dodging and evading and now have squandered yet another post on, wasting everyone's time, in further dodging and evading. So I'm going to ask you again:

Do you claim that there was one "forged Diem cable," or that there was more than one "forged Diem cable"?

Ashton

It makes absolutely NO difference if Hunt forged one cable implicating the Kennedy Administration in Diem's death, or made ten separate cables. It makes no difference if Hunt had earlier versions of the finalized cable in the safe or not. What matters is that he admitted making A cable designed to fill in the historical record re the Diem assassination and indicate Kennedy Administration complicity, and that numerous men without any shared loyalties with Hunt confirmed the creation of this cable. Hunt did this knowing that NIXON'S FORMER RUNNING MATE Henry Cabot Lodge was in fact the U.S. citizen most responsible for Diem's death. The cable was designed, then, not just to implicate the Kennedy Administration, but, more specifically, the Democrtatic elements of the Kennedy Administration, in the murder, and free up Nixon to use the Diem assassination to silence Ted Kennedy's criticism of the Vietnam War. LBJ used the Castro hit turnaround story implicating Bobby Kennedy in his own brother's murder in the same way. When Bobby came out against the war, guess what column appeared in the next day's paper. That's right, the Drew Pearson column claiming Bobby's bloodlust killed his brother and that, even more tellingly, LBJ knew all about this but was sitting on the info. (Give me a break!) In short, the fabrication of the Diem cable or cables was a sleazy politcal act and should be revealed as such. It was also almost certainly an impeachable act, if Nixon had prior knowledge, as stated by Ehrlichman. In order to hide this act, and push your own bizarre view of history, however, you have to make it look like there was no legitimate reason for Nixon's removal. So you stomp your feet and insist there was no cable, and that ALL of the men who expressed knowledge of the cable, including Nixon's closest advisers, conspired against him to invent this cable, (as if they didn't have enough dirt on Nixon already, now really...).

So, once again, I ask you... do you believe Nixon was guilty of an impeachable offense?

Would your e-meter short-circuit if you answered this simple question?

[Ashton Gray]

Pat:

Do you claim that there was one "forged Diem cable," or that there was more than one "forged Diem cable"?

Ashton Gray

[Dawn Meredith]

Pat:

Do you claim that there was one "forged Diem cable," or that there was more than one "forged Diem cable"?

Ashton Gray

So Pat....I am curious as to your answer , too. Why won't ya just tell us, pleeeeeease?

Dawn

[Guest John Gillespie]

Hee, hee...good to get silly in the late afternoon here in Beantown. Check out the link and see if you can send the Dobie and Maynard pic to Pat in lieu of Hunt/Liddy in front of Fielding's office. Go ahead, he'll buy it.

Of course a CIA op can't happen without a Cuban in it. That's Bernard Barker peeking in from the side. No, really. It was right after he met with Hunt and Douglas Caddy at that bar in D.C.

Ashton

_____________________________________

Ash,

Back with a vengeance and making up for that hiatus, I see. I've been LOL-ing practically the whole morning! This one with the pics, above, is an absolute killer. "Hey, Dobe, I'm gettin' all misty."

("Of course a CIA op can't happen without a Cuban in it.")

"Liddyyyyyyyyyyyy, you've got a lot of 'splainin' to do."

Regards,

JG

[Pat Speer]

[

("Of course a CIA op can't happen without a Cuban in it.")

"Liddyyyyyyyyyyyy, you've got a lot of 'splainin' to do."

Regards,

JG

John, do you have one iota of evidence that G. Gordon Liddy and L. Pat Gray ever worked for the CIA? or Mark Felt? EVERY bit of history from this period indicates the FBI and CIA were in the middle of a rivalry. Is it really likely that both Gray--a Nixon appointee--and Felt--by all accounts a Hoover loyalist, were doing the CIA's bidding?

The "CIA overthrew Nixon because he was gonna blow the whistle on their scientology research" theory proposed by the mythical figure in the fedora is looneytunes...

Do you believe it?

[Ashton Gray]

The "CIA overthrew Nixon because he was gonna blow the whistle on their scientology research" theory proposed by the mythical figure in the fedora is looneytunes...

Since I've never said any such thing, and only you have, the following will be known henceforth and forevermore as "The Official Pat Speer Theory of Watergate":

"CIA overthrew Nixon because he was gonna blow the whistle on their scientology research" —Pat Speer

I've added it to my sig properly attributed to you. Thank you for the contribution. It will remain there until you answer this question, which you keep evading:

Do you claim that there was one "forged Diem cable," or that there was more than one "forged Diem cable"?

Ashton Gray

[Dawn Meredith]

The "CIA overthrew Nixon because he was gonna blow the whistle on their scientology research" theory proposed by the mythical figure in the fedora is looneytunes...

Since I've never said any such thing, and only you have, the following will be known henceforth and forevermore as "The Official Pat Speer Theory of Watergate":

"CIA overthrew Nixon because he was gonna blow the whistle on their scientology research" —Pat Speer

I've added it to my sig properly attributed to you. Thank you for the contribution. It will remain there until you answer this question, which you keep evading:

Do you claim that there was one "forged Diem cable," or that there was more than one "forged Diem cable"?

Ashton Gray

Pat: Do you not answer this question because you do not know the answer? Or because you're merely being evasive?

I trust you saw what Ashton posted about Nixon and know that Ashton is no lover of the trickster?

Dawn

[Robert Charles-Dunne]

Apparently the Diem cables weren't the only thing to evaporate from Hunt's safe, we now come to learn. The following is from Forum member Gary Buell's blog at:

http://coverthistory.blogspot.com/2007/01/e.html

"E. Howard Hunt's Missing Report on The Kennedy Assassination"

This is the title of HSCA document #180-10112-10479, which consists of a 35-page report by a House Select Committee on Assassinations investigator Mike Ewing. It is an interesting read and I will give a few excerpts. The report opens with a well-known excerpt from the Watergate tapes.

Nixon: "...well, we protected Helms from one hell of a lot of things."

Haldeman: "That's what Ehrlichman says."

Nixon: "Of course this Hunt, that will uncover a lot of things. You open that scab there's a hell of a lot of things...This involves these Cubans, Hunt and a lot of hanky-panky..."

...information which has only recently become available indicates that Hunt was, at the very least, quite interested in - and concerned about - the asassination of President Kennedy. This new information further indicates that a secret report about certain aspects of the Kennedy assassination (aspects particularly related to Cuba and Fidel Castro) was prepared by Hunt and his future Watergate burglar associates - and was in fact circulated to Charles Colson and the Nixon circle as well as officials within the CIA.

As will be seen from this information, and other long obscure Watergate data, a picture seems to be emerging which places the secret Hunt report on the Kennedy assassination at the heart of the feverish cover-up activities in the immediate days following the Kennedy assassination.

The Watergate burglars were arrested on the night of June 17. John Erlichman had phoned John Dean early on the morning of June 19. The FBI was already hot on the trail of Mr. Hunt due to the fact that his name and White House phone number were found in the address books of two of the burglars. Dean in turn called Charles Colson, who had brought Hunt to the Withe House. Colson confirmed Hunt's status as a White House "consultant" and then, according to Dean, "Colson also expressed concern over the contents of Hunt's safe." The safe was drilled open and the contents destroyed later that same day. The contents of the safe included material related to his work with the Plumbers, including his investigation of Chappaquiddick, as well as forged State Department cables which Hunt had himself fabricated, linking Kennedy to the assassination of South Vietnamese President Diem.

Information which has only recently come to light indicates that in addition to that last item about the Diem murder, the secret Hunt safe also contained information resulting from yet another Plumbers probe - into some of the circumstances of another 1963 assasination - the assassination of President Kennedy.

That information included an interview with Hunt, conducted in late November of 1975, by two reporters for the Providence Journal. Hold told them of a secret probe which included interviewing a Cuban woman who "claimed to have been in the Castro household with one of Fidel's sisters" at the time of JFK's assassination.

Apparently Castro was shocked and saddened by the assassination of the President. One wonders if Hunt had the same reaction. (Actually I suspect that Hunt knew about the assassination even before John Kennedy.) Why was Hunt interviewing this woman? According to Ewing, the most likely explanation is that he was ordered to.

Hunt told the two reporters that he sent a copy of the report to the CIA (as Barker had originally stated) and further, that he had also given the report to his own White House friend and patron, Charles W. Colson.

Hunt's own copy of the report he put into his White House safe. One can only imagine the reactions of White House officials, including Nixon, when they found a report related to the Kennedy assassination in Howard Hunt's safe. This report has still not seen the light of day.

As scrambled as the testimony is at this point, a couple of things are clear. The Hunt report related to the Kennedy assassination is missing. No copy of it has ever surfaced, nor have the tapes that Hunt, Barker, Martinez, and Sturgis made during the probe ever been found.

The last thing in the workd the Nixon men needed at that point was a secret report about the Kennedy assassination coming out of Hunt's safe - written and producted by Hunt and his burglar friends Barker, Martinez, and Sturgis.