Dr. John C. Lilly and MKULTRA

[Guest Mark Valenti]

Are there any new hunches, guesses, or just plain suspicion about connections between:

Dr. John C. Lilly

National Institute of Neurological Diseases and Blindness

MKULTRA

Jose Rivera

Dr. Robert B. Livingston

I've read earlier posts about Adele Edisen's encounter with Jose Rivera but I'm finding tenuous indications backward to John Lilly.

Might be nothing, could be something.

[Dave Weaver]

Are there any new hunches, guesses, or just plain suspicion about connections between:

Dr. John C. Lilly

National Institute of Neurological Diseases and Blindness

MKULTRA

Jose Rivera

Dr. Robert B. Livingston

I've read earlier posts about Adele Edisen's encounter with Jose Rivera but I'm finding tenuous indications backward to John Lilly.

Might be nothing, could be something.

Mark,

i have received this information, from someone who is not a member, in reply to your post:

Dr. Robert B. Livingston was the head of NIMH and in his role funded the MK Ultra experiments at the government owned hospital in Lexington KY.

Dr. Robert B. Livingston was Professor Jim Fetzer's partner in writing his first book Assassination Science "Catfeet Press".

[Guest Mark Valenti]

Are there any new hunches, guesses, or just plain suspicion about connections between:

Dr. John C. Lilly

National Institute of Neurological Diseases and Blindness

MKULTRA

Jose Rivera

Dr. Robert B. Livingston

I've read earlier posts about Adele Edisen's encounter with Jose Rivera but I'm finding tenuous indications backward to John Lilly.

Might be nothing, could be something.

Mark,

i have received this information, from someone who is not a member, in reply to your post:

Dr. Robert B. Livingston was the head of NIMH and in his role funded the MK Ultra experiments at the government owned hospital in Lexington KY.

Dr. Robert B. Livingston was Professor Jim Fetzer's partner in writing his first book Assassination Science "Catfeet Press".

Thanks, Dave. I believe there's a lot of information to be gained by a careful study of Lilly and the issue of mind control.

[Dave Weaver]

Are there any new hunches, guesses, or just plain suspicion about connections between:

Dr. John C. Lilly

National Institute of Neurological Diseases and Blindness

MKULTRA

Jose Rivera

Dr. Robert B. Livingston

I've read earlier posts about Adele Edisen's encounter with Jose Rivera but I'm finding tenuous indications backward to John Lilly.

Might be nothing, could be something.

Mark,

i have received this information, from someone who is not a member, in reply to your post:

Dr. Robert B. Livingston was the head of NIMH and in his role funded the MK Ultra experiments at the government owned hospital in Lexington KY.

Dr. Robert B. Livingston was Professor Jim Fetzer's partner in writing his first book Assassination Science "Catfeet Press".

Thanks, Dave. I believe there's a lot of information to be gained by a careful study of Lilly and the issue of mind control.

Mark,

this is also from my source.

Livingston was one of the founders of the Cybernetics Society (i.e. Mind Control) along with representatives of the CIA, IBM etc. .

http://www.asc-cybernetics.org/organization/history.htm

Does anyone think it's strange that he got involved in the JFK assassination? Maybe the Fetzer books are just another means of "mind control" and "brainwashing"?

[Dave Weaver]

Dr. John C. Lilly

Source:

http://www.mindcontrolforums.com/hambone/people.html

In 1952, during the CIA's MK-ULTRA mind control program, Lilly briefed the intelligence community on his work to map out the brains of animals using implanted electrodes. He abandoned this line of work because he felt it was unethical.

In 1952 he studied the effects of sensory deprivation tanks, and also briefed the intelligence community with his progress. Lilly refused to let any of his work be classified, and ended up leaving the National Institute of Health when he found that he could not work without the interference of the government.

(Marks, John, The Search for the Manchurian Candidate, Times Books, 1979, pg 142-4)

While experimenting with sensory deprivation and LSD and ketamine, Lilly came to believe that he was in psychic contact with the aliens of what he called the Earth Coincidence Control Office. The aliens were guiding events in Lilly's life to lead him to work with dolphins, which were psychic conduits between aliens and humans. The aliens are acting for the survival of organic lifeforms against artificial intelligences, called solid state lifeforms.

(Lilly, John, The Scientist, J. B. Lippincott Company, 1978)

While Lilly implies that he left the NIH because of unethical government interference, his Communications Research Institute (founded in the 1958 to study dolphins) was partially funded by the Air Force, NASA, NIHM, the National Science Foundation, and the Navy. He was assisted in this work by Gregory Bateson.

(Lipset, David, Gregory Bateson: The Legacy of a Scientist, Prentice Hall, 1980, pg 241)

In February, 1979, Lilly attended an LSD reuinion party, hosted by Dr. Oscar Janiger, along with Laura Huxley, Sidney Cohn, Willis Harman, Alfred Hubbard, and Timothy Leary, among others. (Lee, Martin and Schlain, Bruce, Acid Dreams, Grove Press, 1985, 213)

Section Chief for the National Institute of Health, Section on Cortical Integration in the National Institute of Neurological Diseases and Blindness and in the National Institute of Mental Health, Bethesda, Maryland (1953-1958)

Founder and Director of the Communications Research Institute, Saint Thomas, United States Virgin Islands, and Miami, Florida (1959-1968)

Chief of Psychological Isolation and Psychedelic Research for the Maryland Psychiatric Research Center, Catonsville, Maryland (1968-1969)

In 1964, Lilly held seminars at the Esalen Institute, and was Group Leader and Associate in Residence from 1969 to1971.

Fellow with the Center for the Advanced Study of Behavior, Palo Alto, California (1969-1970)

Treasurer of Human Software, Inc., Malibu, California (1973-present)

On Board of Advisors of the Albert Hoffman Foundation.

Author of:

* Man and Dolphin, 1961

* The Dolphin in History, University of California, 1963

* The Mind of the Dolphin, Doubleday & Co, 1967

* Programming and Metaprogramming in the Human Biocomputer, The Julian Press, 1967

* The Center of the Cyclone, The Julian Press, 1972

* The Dyadic Cyclone, Simon & Schuster, 1976

* Lilly on Dolphins

* Simulations of God: The Science of Belief, Simon & Schuster

* The Deep Self, Warner Books, 1977

* The Scientist, The Julian Press, 1968

* Communication between Man and Dolphin, Crown Publishers, 1978

* John Lilly, so far..., 1990

* Tanks for the Memories, 1995

http://sound.photosynthesis.com/JOHN_C.html

Edited December 14, 2006 by Dave Weaver

[Guest Mark Valenti]

Lilly's reputation is that of an inquisitive, slightly eccentric good guy -- but the events of his life placed him in close proximity to the intelligence community.

[Dave Weaver]

Interresting documentary in the context of this thread:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89S_o7fOwpA

[Dave Weaver]

From my source:

Jose Delgado is one of the most famous of the brain butchers. Delgado is also an intimate of the late Dr. Robert B. Livingston of "Assassination Science".

See Livingston's Curriculum Vitae on pages 190-191 of Assassination Science

http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/delgado.htm

Dr. Robert B. Livingston also had a long professional and personal relationship with Dr. Walter Freeman the man who is accredited with popularizing the "lobotomy". Walter Freeman performed the "botched" lobotomy on JFK's sister Rosemary Kennedy. Making her a vegetable for life.

Could not someone ask Jim Fetzer to explain this peculiar background of his fellow "conspiracy traveler"?

Jim Fetzer is also a strong devotee of Cybernetics and Artificial Intelligence.

[Ashton Gray]

I believe there's a lot of information to be gained by a careful study of Lilly and the issue of mind control.

I concur wholeheartedly. I also believe we finally are beginning to see unearthed, in spots here and there, at least some of the roots and creepers of a vast underground system of psychs who have been doing the bidding of CIA for decades.

This isn't the place for a full roster (I mean of just what is known), and I hope more about Lilly and Livingston is dug out here, but when I get a chance I'm going to pull together some of these names of "mental health" <SPIT!> individuals and organizations with known and possible connections to CIA, as well as to the Rockefeller-oil-banking contingent.

I'm finding some intriguing history that traces way back to the earliest "mental hygiene" <SPIT> society in 1909—predecessor to the World Federation of Mental Health and its offshoots—followed very rapidly by Averell Harriman's mother, in 1910, funding the Eugenics Record Office as a branch of the Galton National Laboratory in London. It's downright astounding how soon afterward fascism officially was founded.

By 1928, the Rockefellers had set up the psychiatrist madman (but I repeat myself) Ernst Rudin with his own floor at the Kaiser Wilhelm Institute for Genealogy and Demography in Berlin. Rudin was an honored speaker that year at the meeting of the International Federation of Eugenics Societies, speaking on "Mental Aberration and Race Hygiene," and in 1930 led the German delegation to the Mental Hygiene <SPIT!> Congress in Washington, D.C.

I apologize: I've already dived into what should be in a new thread, and didn't mean to hijack this one, and don't want to. It's just that there are extraordinary parallels and connections between these core "mental hygiene" and "mental health" organizations, the horrors of World War II, and the subsequent creation of CIA—with staggering connections to the same moneyed interests who backed and promoted the "mental hygiene" and eugenics scum.

Nor was MK-ULTRA, or even its "official" CIA predecessor programs, the earliest dabbling of the American intelligence cult into mind control. As early as 1943 OSS's Captain George Hunter White was experimenting with surreptitious administration of drugs in interrogation, advancing in his later career to conduct CIA's hideous LSD experiments on unwitting civilians and secretly film them.

So from before its inception, CIA and mental manipulation were joined at the hip. It therefore is impossible for CIA to have been otherwise than also joined at the hip with every leading "mental hygiene" <SPIT!> and "mental health" <SPIT!> organization. Only the brightest and the best. <SPIT!>

Ashton

[Jack White]

I highly recommend OPERATION MIND CONTROL by Bowart and

THE CONTROL OF CANDY JONES by Bain.

Jack

[Guest Mark Valenti]

I highly recommend OPERATION MIND CONTROL by Bowart and

THE CONTROL OF CANDY JONES by Bain.

Jack

Thanks for the replies thus far - I've also found Bill Kelly's research to be illuminating. This area is truly a Pandora's Box.

[Ashton Gray]

From my source:

Jose Delgado is one of the most famous of the brain butchers. Delgado is also an intimate of the late Dr. Robert B. Livingston of "Assassination Science".

A quote of note from the good Doktor Delgado:

• "We need a program of psychosurgery for political control of our society. The purpose is physical control of the mind. Everyone who deviates from the given norm can be surgically mutilated.
  "The individual may think that the most important reality is his own existence, but this is only his personal point of view. This lacks historical perspective.
  "Man does not have the right to develop his own mind. This kind of liberal orientation has great appeal. We must electrically control the brain. Some day armies and generals will be controlled by electric stimulation of the brain."
  —Dr. Jose Delgado testifying before Congress
  February 24, 1974 edition of the Congressional Record, No. 262E, Vol. 118.
  

He gave that touching plea in the halls of Congress while CIA had its super-secret Remote Viewing program going on just across the river.

Another bit of "Fun With Dr. D":

• Monday, 17 May 1965
  The New York Times runs an article on Dr. Jose Delgado, a pioneer of the technology of Electrical Stimulation of the Brain (ESB), entitled “Matador With a Radio Stops Wild Bull.” The story details Dr. Delgado's experiments at Yale University School of Medicine, and work in the field at Cordova, Spain. Describing the work in Spain, the Times says:
  "...Dr. Delgado pressed a button on a small radio transmitter in his hand and the bull braked to a halt. Then he pressed another button on the transmitter, and the bull obediently turned to the right and trotted away. The bull was obeying commands in his brain that were being called forth by electrical stimulation by the radio signals to certain regions in which fine wires had been painlessly planted the day before."
  

The "Yale University School of Medicine" reference should not be allowed to get lost.

Ashton

Edited December 14, 2006 by Ashton Gray

[Michael Hogan]

I also believe we finally are beginning to see unearthed, in spots here and there, at least some of the roots and creepers of a vast underground system of psychs who have been doing the bidding of CIA for decades.

Ashton, you may already be familiar with this stuff, but I thought I'd post these links in hopes that you might find something new and of interest.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2090-1313808,00.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...5061502685.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/30/internat...ner=rssuserland

http://www.wanttoknow.info/mindcontrol10pg#ciadocs

http://store.aetv.com/html/product/index.j...=&subcatid=

[Ashton Gray]

I thought I'd post these links in hopes that you might find something new and of interest.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2090-1313808,00.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...5061502685.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/30/internat...ner=rssuserland

http://www.wanttoknow.info/mindcontrol10pg#ciadocs

http://store.aetv.com/html/product/index.j...=&subcatid=

All of great interest, Michael, and I recommend them all to everyone who passes this way. Thanks again.

I also urge everyone to go to The Black Vault's Content page (which is linked to on the wanttoknow page you posted above) and try to help them out with a donation for making all of those CIA documents available.

Ashton

Edited December 15, 2006 by Ashton Gray

[William Kelly]

Are there any new hunches, guesses, or just plain suspicion about connections between:

Dr. John C. Lilly

National Institute of Neurological Diseases and Blindness

MKULTRA

Jose Rivera

Dr. Robert B. Livingston

I've read earlier posts about Adele Edisen's encounter with Jose Rivera but I'm finding tenuous indications backward to John Lilly.

Might be nothing, could be something.

Mark,

i have received this information, from someone who is not a member, in reply to your post:

Dr. Robert B. Livingston was the head of NIMH and in his role funded the MK Ultra experiments at the government owned hospital in Lexington KY.

Dr. Robert B. Livingston was Professor Jim Fetzer's partner in writing his first book Assassination Science "Catfeet Press".

Thanks, Dave. I believe there's a lot of information to be gained by a careful study of Lilly and the issue of mind control.

Mark,

this is also from my source.

Livingston was one of the founders of the Cybernetics Society (i.e. Mind Control) along with representatives of the CIA, IBM etc. .

http://www.asc-cyber...ion/history.htm

Does anyone think it's strange that he got involved in the JFK assassination? Maybe the Fetzer books are just another means of "mind control" and "brainwashing"?