Bizarre Behavior?

[James Richards]

Not that this relates directly to the assassination of John Kennedy, but it might reflect on a level of covert operator who is dirtied deliberately then dangled openly to see who he attracts. Then again, he might just be completely nuts.

Case in point is Bobby Joe Keesee, a Korean War veteran, winner of the Bronze Star and Purple Heart. In 1962, Keesee steals a light plane in Key West and flies it to Cuba. At this point, Keesee is listed as absent without leave from the army at Ft. Huachuca in Arizona. Also aboard the plane is an alleged CIA man named Buddy Carson and a Latino named Jose. Keesee dropped them in the jungle about 40 miles from Havana where they were supposedly going to act as spies for the United States. Keesee takes off and is subsequently forced to land where he is captured by Cuban authorities. Keesee claims asylum but the Cubans hand him over to U.S. officials thinking that his name is Bobby J. Gish. The Americans know him as Bobby Joe Keesee.

Keesee is then charged with transporting a stolen car (a Rambler) from California to Texas; the first of 153 Federal charges.

Keesee claims that he was encouraged by CIA man Buddy Carson to do this and to also cash several bad checks at military reservations across the United States. Carson claimed this was to forge the reputation of an army fugitive which would allegedly help him if captured by the Cubans.

In 1969, Keesee was in the Middle East. He was supposedly visiting Israel but on a sight seeing excursion into Jordan, he was seized and held hostage for 36 hours. No other details there.

In 1970, Keesee hi-jacked a light plane out of Thailand and forced the Thai pilots to fly him to a beach in North Vietnam. He leaves his passport on board and makes a dash for the jungle as the plane comes under fire from a village close by. Keesee is captured and interrogated by the North Vietnamese where his front teeth are knocked out and his fingernails are pulled out. They think he is a spy. He was then released with 107 military POW's which included John McCain.

In 1974, Keesee was held in San Diego on Federal charges that he 'aided, abetted, induced and caused' the kidnapping of U.S. Vice Consul John Patterson who was beaten to death shortly after his kidnapping. His remains were found in the Sonora Desert.

Like I said, he could just be nuts.

James

Edited February 26, 2006 by James Richards

[Mark Stapleton]

Not that this relates directly to the assassination of John Kennedy, but it might reflect on a level of covert operator who is dirtied deliberately then dangled openly to see who he attracts. Then again, he might just be completely nuts.

Case in point is Bobby Joe Keesee, a Korean War veteran, winner of the Bronze Star and Purple Heart. In 1962, Keesee steals a light plane in Key West and flies it to Cuba. At this point, Keesee is listed as absent without leave from the army at Ft. Huachuca in Arizona. Also aboard the plane is an alleged CIA man named Buddy Carson and a Latino named Jose. Keesee dropped them in the jungle about 40 miles from Havana where they were supposedly going to act as spies for the United States. Keesee takes off and is subsequently forced to land where he is captured by Cuban authorities. Keesee claims asylum but the Cubans hand him over to U.S. officials thinking that his name is Bobby J. Gish. The Americans know him as Bobby Joe Keesee.

Keesee is then charged with transporting a stolen car (a Rambler) from California to Texas; the first of 153 Federal charges.

Keesee claims that he was encouraged by CIA man Buddy Carson to do this and to also cash several bad checks at military reservations across the United States. Carson claimed this was to forge the reputation of an army fugitive which would allegedly help him if captured by the Cubans.

In 1969, Keesee was in the Middle East. He was supposedly visiting Israel but on a sight seeing excursion into Jordan, he was seized and held hostage for 36 hours. No other details there.

In 1970, Keesee hi-jacked a light plane out of Thailand and forced the Thai pilots to fly him to a beach in North Vietnam. He leaves his passport on board and makes a dash for the jungle as the plane comes under fire from a village close by. Keesee is captured and interrogated by the North Vietnamese where his front teeth are knocked out and his fingernails are pulled out. They think he is a spy. He was then released with 107 military POW's which included John McCain.

In 1974, Keesee was held in San Diego on Federal charges that he 'aided, abetted, induced and caused' the kidnapping of U.S. Vice Consul John Patterson who was beaten to death shortly after his kidnapping. His remains were found in the Sonora Desert.

Like I said, he could just be nuts.

James

James,

What a bizarre character. I suspect he wasn't just nuts. Sounds like the CIA were in there somewhere. I don't suppose the transportation of the Rambler might be related to the assassination. Was it light green?

[James Richards]

Mark,

Bizarre is right. The mention of the Rambler also caught my attention. I have no idea though what model it was.

There was also the case of Melvin Russell Blair, holder of the Distinguished Service Cross with Oak Leaf Clusters, Silver Star, two Bronze Stars, Combat Infantryman's Badge and various other army decorations. In 1958, Blair tried to rob the Treasurer of the Del Monte Lodge at Pebble Beach in a kind of feeble attempt.

When he was arrested he produced a letter vouching for his character signed by Charles Willoughby.

James

[Robert Howard]

When he was arrested he produced a letter vouching for his character signed by Charles Willoughby.

Yup, he was definitely nut's.

But seriously James, this story reminds me of how problematic doing research is; I mean, it is like the CIA Related religious organizations ala The Tolstoy Foundation, David Ferrie's Old Catholic Church connection's see (Peter Levenda's The Sinister Connections Vol 1 & 2) when this aspect of JFK Assassination stuff hits 'today's mainstream' it put's the collective 'us' in the position of 'really out in left field' although it is IMO obviously pertinent subject matter.

But getting back to your post when I saw the Nash Rambler comments it made me think of something I came across recently, 'Nancy Perrin Rich Testimony - WC' - 'another Nash Rambler of his own.'

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/rich_n.htm

"Mr. HUBERT. How did they accept your suggestion that you would bail out?

Mrs. RICH. I don't know. We left. I wasn't going to wait around to find out.

Mr. HUBERT. So you never did report it to the authorities.

Mrs. RICH. No; I never did.

Mr. HUBERT. Why?

Mrs. RICH. Well, my husband got picked up in Dallas, and I will never know

if this was true--he said it wasn't--the policeman said it was. My husband had a .45. It was not registered.

Mr. HUBERT. You mean a pistol?

Mrs. RICH. Yes; a service automatic. He had no right carrying it. He had it in the car. At that time he had a little old Nash Rambler station wagon of his own. This cop says when he picked my husband up my husband was standing in a little clearing beside the road there on the way out to Rayburn, brandishing a gun around saying he was going to kill somebody. He come to find out if it was a cop he was going to kill. I will never know to this day whether this was true or not.

FWIW, I sincerely believe allegations that Nancy Perrin Rich was a 'habitual xxxx' were 'oh so much BS, she had bona fides, and the allegations were just that.

[Nathaniel Heidenheimer]

A couple or three connections here to the Bartholemew articles.

1. The Rambler-- not sure if were talking about the same one

2. the Willoughby connection suggests this guy may have come out of China Lobby (connections to Diem).

Lansdale made this transition from Far east to Cuba in 1962, according to Newman.

James--have you seen the Bartholomew article yet? They contain everything including the kitchen sink,

I am trying to enlist curious sifters who might lend a critical eye.

[Robert Howard]

A couple or three connections here to the Bartholemew articles.

1. The Rambler-- not sure if were talking about the same one

2. the Willoughby connection suggests this guy may have come out of China Lobby (connections to Diem).

Lansdale made this transition from Far east to Cuba in 1962, according to Newman.

James--have you seen the Bartholomew article yet? They contain everything including the kitchen sink,

I am trying to enlist curious sifters who might lend a critical eye.

I am reasonably sure that Richard Bartholomew's article is in reference to another Nash Rambler, which leads me to my next statement, I had attempted to contact Richard, in the hopes of inviting him to join the Education Forum, but never heard back from him, later I heard that he was no longer pursuing JFK related research. I always say never say never, but it would be an understatement to use the phrase 'bitterly disappointed' upon hearing the news.

I think his article some 150 pages in all, I believe is some of the best info to come out in a while, maryferrell.org thinks so too, the article is linked under their articles section.

I stipulate that IMO we have entering another era in the 'JFK Saga'

Example

The two most recent JFK related books, A Farewell to Justice - Joan Mellen

and Ultimate Sacrifice - Lamar Waldron & Thom Hartmann, there has been 'more than the usual amount of 'controversy.'

Thinking persons as we all are, I do not feel a need to rehash what those controversies were, nor is that the point.

The point that I am trying to make is that 'the idea' or concept that 'a book' about the Kennedy assassination in this day and age can be published without a 'firestorm of controversy' is part of a new dynamic, that is in itself a continuation of the conspiracy vs Warren Commission, HSCA, AARB lone nut, hocus pocus.

In the past, until the late 70's I would say, the 'market audience' for books about the JFK Assassination was primarily directed towards the generation that lived through the event and the succeeding generation. Anyone familiar with the Gallup polls taken over the last 40 years, realizes that a vast number of Americans agreement that there was a conspiracy, has been to the JFK Research community the 'great equalizer' with regards to the gov't shenanigans involving 'not going all the way involving key aspects that could have brought closure. (If one needs to be given examples you probably should not be on the Forum to begin with) Pardon my candor.

I will only cite one of the most recent ones, the well documented request by researchers to have Michael and Ruth Paine testify before the Review Board. Tunheim vacillated uhm, aw we can't pay their air fare to bring them here, the hearings are almost over, yada, yada, yada.

Poof, the 'dramatic finale' of the last public sojourn into the labyrinth ends without their testimony, a disgrace and I would add an 'intentional disgrace'.

As a follow-up, a recently de-classified document stated that 'Ruth Paine had requested information concerning Lee Harvey Oswald as far back as 1957,' (do not ask me to find it, if you are sincerely interested the hard work will do you good, if your not sincere your wasting precious time)

In other words with regards to the new Era, compare the present scenarion with when 'The Man Who Knew Too Much' which is filled with very controversial, information, but also dilligently researched, did not encounter (as far as I remember) the type of criticism compared to my two examples. Breach of Trust, is an exception, because it is researched dilligently, as is Someone Would Have Talked. Those two books are an example of the 'new high standard.'

I couldn't help but notice that there are 22 pages of discussion on 'Final Judgment,' at the risk of being seen as a prevaricator, what does that have to do with JFK Research? Do not get me wrong, the book is anything but dull, I will not comment on it, because the Jewish cabal, anti-Semitism et cetera is more than enough to make me stay away, from a topic that is very conjectural to begin with. (I do think it shows flashes of great research, followed by page after page of advancing the 'argument' of his scenario, which is self-defeating.

Anyway

So, the new paradigm is simply that the new generations being raised in a culture where dissent is 'Un-American, and the Founding Fathers injuction that with regards to preserving democracy requires 'eternal vigilance' is an anachronism at best and not even emphasized in 'Outcome Based Education' probable.

So the great equalizer, has lost its punch.

The New Paradigm is 'just the fact's Mam.'

Specualtion is at best, problematic.

Let the Writer beware!

Edited February 26, 2006 by Robert Howard

[James Richards]

Robert and Nathaniel,

I seriously doubt the Rambler Keesee stole is the one connected with the JFK assassination. The problem however is that like most things related to this murder, confusion reigns supreme. I don't believe I have ever seen any solid evidence that connects the Rambler to Ruth Paine. She drove a 1955 Chevrolet which she was photographed with standing in front of her garage.

We have the Rambler that Richard Bartholomew investigated and we also have another 1959 Rambler wagon owned by Howard K. Davis. Gerry Hemming has spoken about this one here on the forum. To add to the mix, Rip Robertson also owned a 1959 Rambler wagon.

The Bartholomew article is an excellent piece indeed but if George Wing did own the vehicle in November of 1963, and this was the vehicle on-site, what role did Wing play as he wasn't the driver according to the description given by Roger Craig?

If I remember correctly, in a related article penned by Bartholomew, the possibility is raised that Wing was present on No Name Key in October of 1962 and a photograph was produced in support. The man in question isn't Wing but it still leaves this curious individual with unknown connections.

James

[Robert Howard]

Robert and Nathaniel,

I seriously doubt the Rambler Keesee stole is the one connected with the JFK assassination. The problem however is that like most things related to this murder, confusion reigns supreme. I don't believe I have ever seen any solid evidence that connects the Rambler to Ruth Paine. She drove a 1955 Chevrolet which she was photographed with standing in front of her garage.

We have the Rambler that Richard Bartholomew investigated and we also have another 1959 Rambler wagon owned by Howard K. Davis. Gerry Hemming has spoken about this one here on the forum. To add to the mix, Rip Robertson also owned a 1959 Rambler wagon.

The Bartholomew article is an excellent piece indeed but if George Wing did own the vehicle in November of 1963, and this was the vehicle on-site, what role did Wing play as he wasn't the driver according to the description given by Roger Craig?

If I remember correctly, in a related article penned by Bartholomew, the possibility is raised that Wing was present on No Name Key in October of 1962 and a photograph was produced in support. The man in question isn't Wing but it still leaves this curious individual with unknown connections.

James

Thanks for clarification, my only response is this part of the story is so central to the assassination, but it never has been given scrutiny, not only by the 'investigative bodies' but Bartholomew's article is the only one I have seen written by a researcher. I don't suggest no one has ever written about it but I couldn't tell you of any book that gives more than a cursory re-counting of it. I haven't read EVERY book about the JFK Assassination there is, but still.

As Far as George Wing, he could have loaned it to someone, especially if he knew no attempt would be made to follow it.

Edited February 27, 2006 by Robert Howard

[Thomas Graves]

Robert and Nathaniel,

I seriously doubt the Rambler Keesee stole is the one connected with the JFK assassination. The problem however is that like most things related to this murder, confusion reigns supreme. I don't believe I have ever seen any solid evidence that connects the Rambler to Ruth Paine. She drove a 1955 Chevrolet which she was photographed with standing in front of her garage.

We have the Rambler that Richard Bartholomew investigated and we also have another 1959 Rambler wagon owned by Howard K. Davis. Gerry Hemming has spoken about this one here on the forum. To add to the mix, Rip Robertson also owned a 1959 Rambler wagon.

The Bartholomew article is an excellent piece indeed but if George Wing did own the vehicle in November of 1963, and this was the vehicle on-site, what role did Wing play as he wasn't the driver according to the description given by Roger Craig?

If I remember correctly, in a related article penned by Bartholomew, the possibility is raised that Wing was present on No Name Key in October of 1962 and a photograph was produced in support. The man in question isn't Wing but it still leaves this curious individual with unknown connections.

James

_____________________________________________

This is the post I referred to in the thread "Could it be-- Rip Robertson and friend?"

FWIW, Thomas

_____________________________________________

Edited February 3, 2008 by Thomas Graves

[Chuck Robbins]

Robert and Nathaniel,

I seriously doubt the Rambler Keesee stole is the one connected with the JFK assassination. The problem however is that like most things related to this murder, confusion reigns supreme. I don't believe I have ever seen any solid evidence that connects the Rambler to Ruth Paine. She drove a 1955 Chevrolet which she was photographed with standing in front of her garage.

We have the Rambler that Richard Bartholomew investigated and we also have another 1959 Rambler wagon owned by Howard K. Davis. Gerry Hemming has spoken about this one here on the forum. To add to the mix, Rip Robertson also owned a 1959 Rambler wagon.

The Bartholomew article is an excellent piece indeed but if George Wing did own the vehicle in November of 1963, and this was the vehicle on-site, what role did Wing play as he wasn't the driver according to the description given by Roger Craig?

If I remember correctly, in a related article penned by Bartholomew, the possibility is raised that Wing was present on No Name Key in October of 1962 and a photograph was produced in support. The man in question isn't Wing but it still leaves this curious individual with unknown connections.

James

FYI - One of Bernard Weissmans' associates worked as a car salesman. The information is in one of the letters Larrie Schmidt sent to Weissman.

Care to venture a guess what type of cars this friend had sold? Did I hear you say Rambler? Car dealers are known for having "loaner" cars, which were used for test driving, etc. I wonder if this could be where the car came from?

Chuck