Jamey Flanagan

I know that barely anybody here puts any stock in JVB, but whether or not she embellishes things or her involvement in them, quite a bit of that story makes sense. You see a lot of that in Dr. Mary's Monkey and we know how our agencies work with limited hangouts and how much truth they put out in their disinformation schemes so people will throw the baby out with the bath water when it comes to the JVB story. I think it makes a ton of sense that the CIA was working with scientists to try and come up with a fast acting cancer and to get it to Cuba to use on Castro. And that effort was centered in New Orleans and spearheaded by Dr. Oschner. He already has ties to the assassination with INCA and them putting out the record of Oswald being interviewed by Carlos B. Dr. Mary Sherman is there and that explains her strange death, Ferrie and all the cages and mice in his home, Ruby claiming he was injected with cancer causing his rapid deterioration and death, etc. None of this stuff gets talked about enough, of at all. Because it's wrapped in the JVB story people literally just throw the baby out with the bath water water instead. I could very well see Ruby giving Dorothy some info about that operation leading her to want to go to New Orleans and investigate. I could be wrong but my guy tells me it's something like that.

And then you have the whole affair with Joseph Milteer being recorded discussing plans to assassinate the president in the weeks before the president is assassinated and then calls the undercover informant and saying he was in Dallas. And you have pretty strong photographic evidence that he was in fact in Dallas watching the parade and nothing is done. That's pretty ridiculous if you ask me!

Well, if I remember correctly, the guys detained in the Chicago plot didn't really have anything done to them much, did they?

Yeah, I waited all day to watch it and I started falling asleep near the end of the second episode. Woke back up for a bit but slept through most of the third episode. Recorded them so I can go back and watch them if I choose to buy I agree about it being a bland retelling of the official story. When I saw Landis was going to be on there I figured we'd at least get the story of him finding an intact bullet which was the biggest new story in the case in recent times. Unless I slept through that, we didn't get it.

I do have to give credit where credit is due though, our very own @David Von Peinreally is the most knowledgeable of the "official story" crowd I've probably ever seen. He could probably do a better job debating a conspiracy theorist than Posner, lol! Although I disagree with his viewpoint often, I actually do respect DVP but I have no respect at all for Posner types, lol!

I'd say @James DiEugenio and Gerald Posner.

Just saw the trailer a little while ago! Was it just me or did some of the footage from that day look remarkably clear? Like the footage of the Newmans shielding their children? I know some of these films were taken by actual professional cameramen, but I've never seen footage that clear from that day in the Plaza! I'm sure some of the footage was remastered and restored and ran through filters and such, but some of it looked fantastic!

It would be cool if we got some little tidbit from her before she passes. Maybe that she didn't really take the backyard photo like she has always claimed to have taken. Or that she lied about Lee telling her he shot at Walker. Something. Lol! Probably won't happen but would be nice! I doubt she would come out publicly with something like that but I could see her maybe telling one of her children something. Is her husband still alive or has he passed away? Maybe he knew something he'd learned from her.

I haven't read his book but just the other day I listened to a long interview of him that the lone gunman podcast posted and, according to him anyway, him and his wife would see Marina with bruises ever so often and sometimes even see Lee with scratches or cuts where she fought him. And he says that he would have conversations with Lee about how he shouldn't be hitting her. But he also talks pretty bad about Marina and how she constantly belittled and nagged Lee openly and how she had been writing letters to an ex boyfriend in Russia and Lee found out about that and was not thrilled to say the least. I don't think Lee was necessarily a violent man but I think Marina was one of those women who can push a man to violence when he's had enough and unfortunately that was a way of life back then. People tended to look the other way when women came up with bruises. If GDM is to be believed on the matter, then they both fought with each other on occasion and when she pushed him hard enough he would lay hands on her some. I get the impression that he never "beat her up", but would maybe slap her or wrestle around with her. I could be wrong about all of that but it's just my own gut instinct. I don't think he ever loved her, but he was a spy and it was probably part of his mission to marry her. Then she constantly badgers him and belittles him. I'm not justifying it if he did lay hands on her, but I don't think she helped matters in that regard either.

It's just an educated guess, but I feel like he probably did lay hands on her from time to time. I don't think he beat her regularly but I feel like she provoked him quite a bit and at some point he would break and slap her or lay hands on her. I do not believe in hitting a woman no matter what, so when I say she provoked him I'm not saying she deserved to get hit. But I think she did know that he would eventually snap and hit her at some point from her constant badgering and belittling of him. Mostly this impression comes from George DeMorherndshield (or ever how you spell that, lol!). Not that I believe everything he said but he seemed fairly credible to me on common things like that. He didn't try to bury Lee. If anything he tried to paint him in a better light than most. Not to say he that he didn't say things that contributed to the image of an angry lone nut, but I don't feel like he would just make up LHO beating on Marina.

Just got to thinking last night about the assassination and wondering what the next big revelation would be and who it would be coming from. Then I Googled Marina Oswald Porter and saw she was currently 82 years old. Most people associated with the assassination are long gone as we approach the 60th anniversary. Was just wondering what some of you think about the possibility that Marina could reveal something important on her death bed when her time comes or write a last minute book with something new in it, or possibly just tell her daughters some key facts she had been holding on to. What kind of odds do you guys think this could happen? Maybe at the very least she could come forward and say she was a spy initially in the Soviet Union as many have long suspected.

I have a question for you @Vince Palamara Do you think this recent Landis thing and the Gary Louks (may be misspelled, lol!) story about Kinney being the one to find the bullet might be part of a "limited hangout" because they know there is a smoking gun somewhere in the remaining documents that they know will be released at some point pointing to more than one shooter? Does that make sense? Of course, if anything like that ever happened "officially", then they would still say Oswald did it but just had an accomplice.

I'm just curious as to what @David Von Pein makes of this whole Landis affair? Do you think he's lying? Do you think he's maybe a bit senile? Just curious, lol! It's funny cause in this case many on the "conspiracy theorist" side probably think he's lying or that this is a "limited hangout" operation.

I can almost hear @Vince Palamara in his best Michael Corleone impression "Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in!". 😂😂😂

I'm sure most of you in this forum, no matter which side you fall on in the debate, are familiar with the story of Rose Cheramie. But just in case some need a refresher course, here goes...... On the evening of November 20th, a 40 year old woman was found lying on the side of the highway near Eunice, Louisiana. She was bruised and disoriented. She was taken to the nearby hospital in Eunice, which was Moosa Hospital. The woman had no financial basis so the hospital administrator telephoned the Louisiana State Police. A Lt. Francis Fruge came out to the Hospital. He was told that the woman appeared to be on drugs. The woman identified herself as Rose Cheramie. He took her to the Eunice City Jail but within an hour he noticed she was undergoing withdrawal symptoms. She got a little rowdy so a doctor who came to give her a sedative ended up committing her to the East Louisiana State Hospital. During the hour and a half to two hours drive there, Fruge questioned her about several things. She told him she was coming from Florida to Dallas with two men who were either Italian or looked Italian. They had stopped at the Silver Slipper Lounge for drinks and after an argument the manager had kicked her out of the bar. She went out on the road to hitchhike and was hit by a vehicle. A driver named Frank Odom drove her to the hospital after the accident. Fruge asked her what she was going to do in Dallas to which she replied "Pick up some money, pick up her baby, and kill Kennedy." Fruge just wrote her reply off as drug induced delusions. Upon arriving at the East Louisiana State Hospital, in the early morning hours of November 21st, she repeated the story to Dr. Bowers that JFK was going to be killed in Dallas the next day. Dr. Wayne Owen, who also worked at the hospital, said the he and other interns were told if a plot to kill the president in advance. Cheramie told one of the interns that a man named Jack Rubenstein was involved in the plot. The following day, when a news story on the TV set was reporting on the president's trip to Dallas, Cheramie said that this was when it was going to happen. Of course after the assassination, Fruge phones the hospital and said to absolutely not release her until after he can talk to her again. Cheramie divulged that she used to work for Jack Ruby and that she had seen Oswald and Ruby together many times. She gave information about a drug deal that her and her companions were supposed to make which proves to be very accurate. All of this information was given to Will Fritz in Dallas but he wasn't interested. So, I'm sure this has probably been covered before here, but I'm just curious how the Warren Commission apologists dismiss this story so easily? It would be one thing if it were a story only coming from Lt. Fruge. But multiple doctors heard her say many times in advance the JFK was gonna be killed the following day in Dallas. Was she psychic? Just a good guesser? What do you make of her mentioning Jack Rubenstein being involved before the assassination and before he killed Oswald? Were all of them lying or making this up?

Yes Sir! I just made it through the last of Season 1 while at work and they read an email you had sent so I knew at least one of the Education Forum regulars listened, lol! Not to get too off topic but have you heard of anything else big planned for 60 coming up?

Any of you give this one a listen yet? I just stumbled across it today but I've been binging it at work. I'm a little over halfway through with it. I highly recommend it! https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLhuRwXHTZg5VHnLbLsqUJ-M3SLryiNWAa

Was watching this YouTube video that is definitely coming from an Oswald did it slant, but actually gives a little more credence to other theories and is a little more open minded than most straight up Oswald did it docs. They try to shoot down the witnesses who differ from the official story but at least they acknowledge that other people saw or heard different things. The thing about this case is that you can often find great bits of information or ideas even from media that is directly opposed to your own beliefs or point-of-view. There is a point in this video where they address the confusion as to people describing things they saw or heard and what floor it was on. This was the first time I can recall hearing it described this way so I found it noteworthy. Maybe I have heard or read this before but forgot. But I have been studying this case at least since I was 11 or 12 and I'm 45 now and I don't recall anyone pointing out that people could get confused when counting the floors of the TSBD. Because of how the bottom floor doesn't have the windows and then the seventh floor windows look vastly different from the 2nd-6th floor windows. I found this pretty interesting. At least it offers some kind of explanation as to confusion from witnesses about what floor they saw possible gunman in or whatever. Anyway, just thought I'd share that with you guys. Still watching it and as it gets later into the video it definitely gets more one sided, but like I said I can find those nuggets of info, those diamonds in the rough even in the lone nutter stuff.

Was reading Honest Answers from the forum's very own @Vince Palamara and came across the fascinating observations of James Young. One of those ties into the late David Lifton's Best Evidence. Some of it seems to be pure speculation on the part of Young, but he says that upon arrival at Andrews in Washington DC that one of the handles on the ornate bronze coffin of JFK had been broken while offloading it from the plane. Then the part that was probably speculation on his part came in. He thinks this was why JFK was put in a different coffin and that the body was probably placed in a body bag at that point and put into the other coffin. I find that a weak excuse why the body came in Bethesda differently than it left Dallas, but at least it is an attempt to resolve the issue and acknowledges the fact that there was a difference. He also says that two men were sent back to the presidential limo to see if any other bone fragments were left in it and came back with a bullet along with the other material removed from the vehicle. Not related to Mr. Young, but another thing I found pretty fascinating was statements made by Parkland doctors who performed surgery on Connally who said that the slug was skill in his leg. And that was AFTER the so called magic bullet was found on the stretcher. If indeed the slug was still in Connally's leg then the stretcher bullet was not the one (or only one) that passed through the Governor.

Will the real Jim D please stand up! 😂😂😂

I've always thought it was very possible in present day, if you had enough time and money and skilled computer guys, to scan every known image of the assassination and digitize it in a computer to either create a complete picture of the assassination as it happened or more likely expose the fact that many of these films and photos have been altered because they don't even agree with each other.

Yeah, I have to take up for @David Von Pein in that I haven't seen anything myself that has been disrespectful to the late Mr. Lifton. Disagreeing with someone isn't necessarily disrespectful, even if they have recently passed. Just like Mr. Lifton has done his research, as much as I might not agree with the interpretation, DVP has done valuable research as well! I might not always agree with his interpretation either but I do respect his work just as I respect the work DSL has done!

Yeah, I heard that too but never heard just how it went down. I know in the past DSL had said he interviewed witnesses who said that the limo stopped up on the overpass and Jackie was once again trying to get out of the vehicle. That's the only thing I can think of is that maybe then, while stopped, that driver's were switched. Who knows?

Thanks DVP! Now that I think about it I guess it was Groden! And DSL acted like that was an outrageous theory? 😂😂😂

Yes, I listened to the entire video yesterday while at work and there were many statements that made my ears perk up and wonder if I had heard what I thought I had heard. Maybe it's best for his legacy if the book doesn't come out. Some of the theories are quite outlandish yet I've heard Mr. Lifton scoff at theories like Harvey and Lee or Morningstar's theory about Tippit being a body double for JFK which aren't anymore out of the realm of possibility than some of the things he mentioned. I really do hope that his research papers do see the light of day though cause some things could ring true. He didn't mention it in that video but on Night Fright a few years back I know he said that a lady came forward saying she was giving LHO change for a dollar for the Coke machine at the time of the shooting. But then he says more recently that LHO is in the window firing blanks. So did he come to disbelieve that lady or what over the years? Who knows?