Pamela Brown

Impressive list. Still, I see Lee as a self-styled agent-provocateur who got swept up into things he did not understand, until it was too late...

Interesting. I have wondered why there seems to have been so little discussion about the fact that Lee had no connection to he M/C after he left NOLA. Ruth and Marina packed up all their belongings and brought them to Irving. Lee didn't live there; just came to visit. Nobody saw him with the rifle. He apparently never said a word about it. But Ruth and Marina had no hesitation connecting him to the rifle; and, of course, everyone believed them...

I couldn't agree more. Utterly captivating. Marina had the WC in the palm of her hand to start with because of her beauty and, of course, she played the helpless widow to a hilt -- and some of that was real. But gradually even they came to perceive that there was a lot more to her knowledge of Lee and the assassination than what she was telling them. I think she plays her roles well. Very well. Including the recanted iteration...

John Butler said: Marina and Oswald meet before anything is actually thought of or put into works for the JFKA. Following my hypothesis, Marina and Lee would have met when either the JFK/A or another program involving tracking US defectors was active or evolving. I do not see Lee as a spy. Agent Hosty told me he didn't think Lee was smart enough, and I would have to agree. But he said Marina was, and she has shown herself to have many layers of deception and mystery, and is capable of sophisticated maneuvering. If anything, I see Lee as a wanna-be spy, who kept dangling himself and waiting to be picked up. I think his frustration at that caused him to attempt suicide in the USSR. His frustration made him an ideal candidate to be tracked and monitored, however, and used to ends of which he was unaware -- until it was too late. "I'm just a patsy!" he cried. "I have been arrested because I went to the Soviet Union". At that point, he was beginning to get the picture. And, unfortunately for all of us -- as who will ever forget the shock of watching him killed before our eyes and without any semblance of due process -- it was too late for his life to have been spared...

Interesting. I agree that Marina had connections of some sort that were being used to track Lee's whereabouts and activities, and that her uncle in GRU was a likely connection for that in USSR, and then George de Mohrenschildt and later Ruth Paine in the US... But to what end would the intelligence connections be of value? If they are Soviet, then don't we have possible Soviet involvement in creating the patsy for the assassination of JFK? Why would they want to do that?

On a side note, (please don't cringe) the entrance of Judyth Baker into the CT community by way of inserting herself into the lives and reputations of our most respected researchers with the sole intent being to turn everything upside down and turn everyone against each other -- for which she did a pretty good job for quite a while -- can be viewed in a somewhat different light. Here's my hypothesis: When Marina recanted some time ago she, in effect, destroyed any possible credibility of the Warren Commission Report. Those overseeing the Ongoing Coverup realized this. This may have been done as a sort of limited hang-out, to get Marina involved as one of the 'good guys' with the CT community. That happened. She appeared on Oprah with the LaFontaines who wrote Oswald Talked, and a biopic was done about her, ending with her newfound belief in Lee's innocence. But that may have backfired. Too much actual information could have been coming forth as a result about her actual involvement in tracking and possibly informing others of Lee's behavior and possible complicity in the cover-up after the assassination. After all, the WC didn't fully believe her and Jim Garrison wanted to treat her as a hostile witness. So, in that light, Judyth was trotted out -- after Ed Haslam had made a path for her, of course, with MF+TMV and his claim of meeting a 'false' Judyth (he didn't, he was in cahoots with the real one, in my book) -- plus, they are both from Bradenton, FL...They immediately went to CBS and 60 Minutes, home of Dan Rather and his skewed and inaccurate version of the Zapruder film, etc etc... The objective would have been to remove any focus from Marina and get everyone running around in Judyth -- and Fetzers'-- rabbit trails...and, of course, finally destroying the CT research community from within. And if you think I'm off my rocker, I sincerely apologize. I did spend seven years keeping an open mind to her, after all. So maybe I am entitled... What do you think?

You may be right.

I think you're right. A honey trap...so many red flags... The timetable was already set. The plan was in place. I don't know when I've seen so many doors open so quickly.

Interesting. My hypothesis puts the moon race at the heart of what happened to JFK...

In a somewhat different way, this is eerily reminiscent to me of Lady Bird having set out a nice white suit for Jackie to change into from the bloody pink suit in order to have her photo taken with LBJ at his swearing in...to which Jackie, refusing, defiantly said, "I want them to see what they have done." This speaks volumes...VP Pence stood alone, knowing, in a worst-case-scenario, that Pres. Trump had set him up...an unthinkable situation could have resulted if Pence had not held his ground...

Good find! I am stunned. I did not know of this. Looks like the uncle in MVD lived in Minsk (previous page) https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1133#relPageId=561 Her aunt in Krakow is "Palina" and I am not finding anything else (yet) out about her. https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1133#relPageId=562 Very odd indeed... This article questions the trip...along with a lot of other things... https://worldview.stratfor.com/article/mystery-marina-oswald

I don't know at this point how cognizent I think Lee was about what was happening to him. It seems to me the outrage and violence he showed in his relationship with Marina might have been a result of his feeling like he had been suckered into something he didn't understand. I think Lee was tracked and observed by both KGB and CIA. Per Joan Mellen, he may even have met RFK. That, of course, would open the door to his having been wittingly involved somehow. So it's not impossible he was an informant. Agent Hosty told me, however, that he didn't think Lee was smart enough to be a spy...but Marina was...

You're welcome...as perhaps you can see, I don't see the assassination of JFK having stemmed only from within the US...

Let's start from the perspective/hypothesis that if you're going to set someone up as the patsy for an assassination, what do you need to do beforehand? I think it is only logical that the person be tracked in terms of their whereabouts and also their mindset, ahead of time. Lee seemed to think he was taking a Russian bride, which would give him greater credentials as he switched from side-to-side. But he soon realized Marina was something more than that. It was at that point he began to separate himself from her. He even tried to send her back to the USSR. (Thank you, Beatles)... I think Lee's growing realization that he was indeed being tracked and observed and information was going to others contributed to his increasing anger and frustration at Marina...

Chris Bristow said: "I do think there is reason to doubt Marina's involvement. Changing her story on the number of photos is suspicious. There is a possibility of coercion as part of a cover too. I think her father was a ranking intelligence official which is also suspicious if true, and I believe she could have been a low level operative..." It was her uncle who was involved with the government and may have been KGB. Agent Hosty tried to convince me that Marina was a sleeper agent. At the time I just wanted to ask him about Lee. Now, it does not seem impossible that she was being used to keep track of his whereabouts (which he seemed to sense and made more difficult). She may have been reporting that to someone. Ruth Paine and George deM are logical possibilities...