Jason Ward

The interesting thing is that weeks before Kennedy's arrival, DPD was aware that The Walker Group was planning something for 22NOV63 DPD was aware that The Walker Group was behind the assault on Adlai Stevenson Neither the DPD nor FBI nor Secret Service saw fit to alert Washington to this knowledge 1. DPD knows not later than 5NOV63 that General Walker is sponsoring anti-Kennedy activities and the assault on Adlai Stevenson. What did Hoover know, and when? SOURCE FBI Oswald Headquarters File 105-82555, Section 196

I wish I could. The 50+ years of certainty that that the "mysterious" way Oswald gets from London to Helsinki is evidence of CIA-sponsored secret travel is going to be hard to overcome. We have seen in this thread that London to Helsinki on 10OCT59 is not mysterious at all considering the BEA flight options apparently unrecognized by investigators. Between Southampton on 9OCT59 and Heathrow the next day, I'm not aware of any evidence we can use to re-construct Oswald's activities in the UK. We know Oswald checked in to Helsinki's Hotel Torni around midnight on 10OCT59, after what must have been a long day of travel. It's just impossible to know if he took the BEA flight shown above in this thread. I also think it's possible that he took a flight from London to Stockholm, then took a ferry on to Helsinki, as the CIA report above implies as a possibility. We just don't know. EXACTLY Here's several scenarios that simply don't make sense IMO: Oswald arrives in Le Havre, ostensibly for Switzerland's Albert Schweitzer college. Why not just take a train or bus from Le Havre to Switzerland instead of crossing the channel? Oswald arrives in Le Havre, secretly destined for Helsinki. Why jot just take a flight from Amsterdam or Paris or a train instead of crossing the channel? Oswald was always destined for Helsinki. Why not book his transatlantic passage directly to a more convenient port, as his travel agent also wondered about? Oswald was always planning to stop in the UK. Why not book his transatlantic passage directly to the UK instead of crossing the channel in this peculiar way? Oswald was working for the CIA or other instrument of US intelligence. Why not just fly him straight to Helsinki and avoid all this European nonsense? Why waste 2 weeks of seasickness getting from DFW to Helsinki travelling in the style of a poor directionless student? Oswald intended to go to Helsinki either at all times or after arriving in Le Havre. Why lie to British authorities about staying a week in the UK when a transit passage to Helsinki is his real plan, keeping in mind a UK transit visitor apparently causes much less notice and official record? I think all these scenarios and questions they raise tend to suggest Oswald wasn't going to Helsinki until after he arrived at Southampton. What do you think? Maybe we can keep open the possibility that while floating across the Atlantic visiting Big Ben, Parliament, Stonehenge and so forth strike his fancy. He gets off the SS Marion Lykes in Le Havre and asks around about how to get to England. The Marion Lykes crew might know of this option to Southampton, I guess, and be able to advise Young Oswald if he asked them. This channel crossing is in any case odd, and is hard to imagine being part of ANY long-established plan IMO. Possibly. I hold open the possibility that Oswald is independent and illogical all by himself, without outside influence. He has to have help - but the channel crossing is probably known to shipping crews and harbor urchins hanging around Le Havre. I stop short of smelling this. We all have a habit of attaching later events to earlier events and then assuming that the earlier event was connected or part of the later event. You claim you were a teenager once, is this true? When you wandered Europe for a month without [I presume] mafia, corporate, or CIA instructions, did you ever make route choices that make no sense if you were in hindsight trying to get from point A to point B? Oswald is 19, not well educated, was court-marshaled in the Marines for striking an officer, and was so efficient with firearms that he managed to accidentally shoot himself. He's always broke. For this and many other reasons, I hold open the possibility that Oswald is just your average ne'er do well given to spontaneous illogical decisions. Similarly, I also hold open he idea that he was easily influenced. I hold open the possibility that Oswald was on some kind of mission for someone, but I discount the possibility that he is anyone's idea of a good sleeper agent to send into the Soviet Union. Just my opinion. Whoever chooses and employs Oswald in any capacity, is desperate in my opinion. This is the last guy chosen for any team. Around here speculation tends to become fact. Very few look at raw evidence. Looking at the historiography of the JFK assassination, the whole London-Helsinki jaunt is badly under-researched and continues to this day to rely too much on he original 1964 CIA opinion that the Finnair flight is the only option, unworkable though it is. 1. In 1975 the CIA is still unable to find the BEA timetable above in this thread and is at a loss to explain Oswald's London-Helsinki segment, fueling conspiracy theorists. 2. The 1979 HSCA report likewise leaves us to believe that London to Helsinki cannot be explained: SOURCES 1 CIA "miscellenous JFK documents" NARA 104-10310-10067 2 House Select Committee on Assassinations Final Report, Section 5, p 211.

THE RADICAL RIGHT TESTIFYING BEFORE THE WARREN COMMISSION PART III: ROBERT SURREY Surrey begins by saying "I do not wish to testify as concerns the wanted poster or the "Wanted for Treason." US Chief Justice Earl Warren admonishes Surrey that witnesses do not have the luxury of wanting or not wanting to testify, they are required to testify unless there is "a privilege" Surrey says he will invoke the protection against self incrimination as guaranteed by the 5th Amendment to the US Constitution Chief Justice Warren acts as Surrey's attorney and advises him that he can intermittently invoke the 5th Amendment by answering only the questions he chooses to answer Johnson Printing Company is Surrey's employer (the former employer of Robert Krause (see above in this thread)) Surrey admits he is the President of the American Eagle Publishing Company The Assassination Story is but one of many products published by American Eagle, Surrey testifies The Assassination Story is a 10 day compilation of Dallas newspaper coverage in the wake of the assassination, Surrey says Oswald received money transfers from Western Union, Surrey says, based on a Dallas Times Herald article Surrey wonders out loud if the Warren Commission will investigate the source of this money given to Oswald via Western Union The national news media filters and manipulates the news, Surrey says, so that it is "possibly" untrue when delivered to a national audience ....but local media is more accurate and not so easily "muzzled" as the national media, Surrey claims WC member congressman Boggs is confrontational with Surrey over the implication that the WC could be muzzled or not seek the truth General Walker's race riot at Ole Miss was untruthfully reported by the national media, Surrey says General Walker's employee, "Mrs Osburn" and her husband selected the articles in The Assassination Story, according to Surrey General Walker and Robert Surrey are the joint partners who own American Eagle Publishing Company Surrey declines to answer when asked who printed the Wanted for Treason handbills - he pleads the 5th. He also declines to answer: whether he knows Robert Krause, whether he is familiar with Lettercraft Printing, or whether he created the copy for the handbills Surrey is the only witness "out of hundreds" who invoked the 5th amendment and refused to answer a question, congressman Boggs says for the record Surrey declines to answer the question asking if he supplied the frontal and profile pictures of JFK used in the Wanted for Treason posters Surrey cannot afford a lawyer, he claims Surrey refuses to answer when asked if he knows Clifton and Dorothy Mercer Surrey seems to deny knowing Bernard Weissman - although the testimony here is confused. General Edwin Walker did not participate in printing the Wanted for Treason handbills, Surrey claims, and then pleads the 5th about this question 4011 Turtle Creek Blvd, General Walker's residence, functions as the merchandise storehouse for American Eagle Publishing Company Surrey refuses to answer several more questions about the anti-JFK handbills, invoke the 5th Amendment General Walker and Surrey are associated for the last 3 years, Surrey says Surrey admits that the neighbor's dog barks at all new visitors to Walker's house The neighbor's dog does not bark at Surrey because Surrey is a frequent visitor to Walker's house Surrey says there are areas within 30 yards of Walker's home that could be used to bury a rifle Charles Klihr is the owner of the car shown in CE 1005, Surrey suggests Surrey is present on 10APR63 fifteen minutes after the attack on General Walker at his house Surrey provides many details around the specific location of Walker's home using aerial photographs and picture General Walker may be the target of electronic eavesdropping, Surrey says General Walker was bleeding in "four or five places" the night he was shot, Surrey says General Walker still had plaster in his hair from the impact of a bullet into his wall, Surrey says Newspaper reporters arrived on 10APR63 at Walker's house 08APR63 Surrey sees two men "peeking in windows" and so forth at Walker's house CE 520 is shown to Surrey - he denies knowing the middle person (Oswald) Chief Justice Warren asks Surrey if he was present when Adlai Stevenson was assaulted in October 1963, Surrey says he was not A new 4 door Ford sedan, brown or maroon, occupied by two men, was seen by Surrey on 08APR63 around General Walker's house, Surrey says CONCERNS Why does Robert Surrey plead the 5th so much in his testimony when no other witness does? Why is congressman Boggs so confrontational with Surrey about any suggestion the WC will not do its job? Does Earl Warren have a fuller grasp of the Radical Right in Dallas than he lets on - as indicated by his direction question to Surrey and Surrey's possible presence at the Adlai Stevenson assault? How do newspaper reporters know about the attack on Walker so soon Why do Surrey and Walker believe Walker's house is bugged? Is there any other reference to Oswald receiving money from the Western Union office, which in turn implies out-of-town sponsorship, as Surrey suggests? Is there any connection to a dark colored Ford in Dallas anywhere in this case, as the car seen by Surrey around Walker's house? Surrey intends to say that the attack on Walker was not a lone nut, but part of at least a 2-man conspiracy, does he not? Is WC attorney Jenner trying to trap Surrey with the questions about the neighbor's barking dog? Don't we have testimony elsewhere that the dog was quiet on the night of the Walker attack? Is Jenner coming close to saying that the dogs must have recognized the shooters since they were quiet? 1 Mary Ferrell offers this interesting sidenote about Bob Surrey and his daughter: 2 Robert Surrey in the only picture I could find. Why is he so small a part in assassination literature? 3. Surrey says this car at General Walker's house belongs to Charles Klihr. SOURCES: 1 - Mary Ferrell, The Mary Ferrell Foundation. https://www.maryferrell.org/php/marysdb.php?id=6921&search=karen surrey 2 - Mark Bridger, Dealey Plaza Echo, Vol 7, Iss 1, p 22 3 - Warren Commission Hearings and Exhibits, CE 5

I don't want to prematurely announce something of a breakthrough here, but do you guys agree with me that the BEA (British Euroopean Airlines) timetable I show below makes it perfectly possible for Oswald to fly from London to Helsinki and match the hotel check in time? Did the CIA simply not realize the option of other airlines besides Finnair? Does this go some way to potentially answering a 50+ year old mystery of Oswald's journey from London to Helsinki? Granted, this timetable is from 1958 but the 1960 timetable shows the same route and times. 1. Why has there been a 50+ year mystery over how Oswald could have travelled from London to Helsinki in time to check in to the Hotel Torni? The CIA apparently only checked with Finnair but did not look into BEA: SOURCE: Bjorn Larsson & David Zekria, Airline Timetable Images http://timetableimages.com/ttimages/complete/complete.htm#Europe

Hi Mervyn, Part of the problem here is that the Finnair flight departing London on 10APR59 does not arrive into Helsinki early enough to justify Oswald's check-in time at the Hotel Torni, according to Richard Helms at the CIA. Besides all my other problems/oddities I'm also something of an aviation history buff. Naturally, I wasn't able to find the Finnair timetables from 1959, but I was able to find them from 1958 and 1960. The route from London to Helsinki is in no case direct, if Finnair was indeed his travel provider; there's lots of route possibilities indicated on their historical route maps. 1. 1958 & 1960 Finnair route maps. No nonstop flights from London to Helsinki. 2. Richard Helms and the CIA thought the Finnair flight from London arrived too late in Helsinki to match Oswald's check-in time at the Hotel Torni. SOURCE: 1 Bjorn Larsson & David Zekria, Airline Timetable Images. http://timetableimages.com/

Hi Mervyn, From the evidence I can find that there is little assurance for any assumption about Oswald's travels between his departure on 10OCT59 from London Heathrow Airport (then known simply as London Airport) and his appearance at the Soviet frontier with Finland on 15OCT59 aboard a Moscow-bound train. The CIA tells us in a cable (above in this thread) that there are a couple different arrival conduits in Helsinki from Stockholm. QUERY: Why was the CIA looking at routes from Stockholm and not simply London, according to their cable above in this thread? Additionally, according to Jay Epstein, travelers between Finland and Sweden receive no passport stamp because the countries are in the same customs union. Do you agree with me that it is equally possible that Oswald either A. transited Stockholm on the way to Helsinki, or B. Visited the Soviet embassy in Stockholm while nominally having a hotel room in Helsinki? 1. What is the source of the Swedish newspaper article claiming Oswald was in Stockholm? Why is the CIA investigating transit modes between Helsinki an Stockholm as indicated in the above CIA cable? Is it plausible Oswald visited Stockholm while already staying in Helsinki or on the way to Helsinki? This is speculation from Jay Epstein: 2. Jay Epstein says passport stamps would not reveal travel between Sweden and Finland: 3. Is this evidence Oswald intended to stay in the UK longer than overnight? Would there even be a record of Oswald in the UK from British authorities if he was merely in transit? SOURCES 1 Alias Oswald by W.R. Morris and R.B. Cutler, R.B.. Publisher: GKG Partners, 1985. p 74 {citing Epstein, below} 2 The Legend of Lee Harvey Oswald by Edward Jay Epstein. Readers Digest Press 1978. p. 288 3 HSCA Russ Holmes Work File, NARA 104-10408-10434

Hi Paul, Thanks for the Life magazine article on the young Radical Right wingers who organized the hostile "Welcome Mr Kennedy to Dallas" newspaper ad. I encapsulate Bernard Weissman and Larrie Schmidt in this from the article: "Schmidt may sound like a high school boy cooking up a secret initiation, but he's deadly serious." Yes indeed these passionate anti-communists are serious, but they lack the experience and wherewithal to do much harm. I see off-duty army buddies at a Munich beer hall getting worked up over the success of the Soviet space program, a U-2 shot down over Russia, nearby communists in Europe, and Castro. Filled with liquid courage and beer soaked clarity of mind, they plan to takeover the entire American Right Wing so that they can....shift it more to the Right. Their biggest success is acting as front men for the the Hunt family, the John Birch Society, and the local gentry of the Dallas Right in placing an anti-Kennedy newspaper ad. The Red Scare is alive and well even after the official end of McCarthyism. Americans, especially southern Americans, see communists everywhere, from the White House to the PTA. Maybe one takeaway I get from Bernie Weissman is: where do budding conservative operatives and passionate nationalists head to straight from their army days in Europe? .....Dallas. 1. The PTA as an organ of Communist conspiracy in the US: 2. Kentucky as ground zero in the Communist takeover of America 3. General Walker's distress signal??? SOURCE: The University of Texas at Austin, Dolph Briscoe Center for the Study of American History.

Indeed? Indeed. https://www.maryferrell.org/pages/Featured_Mary_Ferrell_Chronologies.html?search=chronologies Mary Ferrell's work is a masterpiece resource! The entire Mary Ferrell Foundation website is a goldmine of information. I am neutral as to whether there is a true correlation here, but I'm happy to help independent research free of foregone conclusions. We've had the same dogma for 50+ years in this area. Fresh voices and fresh approaches are much needed. Since you focus on this comment I make above in a post, may I expand on this thought? AFAIK, there is no documented evidence of a plane (or other) ticket purchased by Oswald that would get him between London and Helsinki. However, we have substantial evidence that Oswald: A. Arrived in the UK at Southampton on 09OCT59 B. Departed the UK from Heathrow Airport, then known as London Airport, on 10OCT59 C. Checked in to Helsinki's Hotel Torni on 10OCT59 ..which when taken together as weighted evidence, tends to argue against the possibility that passport stamps were faked, in my view. There is in fact no reason to fake and document Oswald's movements IMO - 4 years after these European travels when Oswald's passport was seized in the assassination investigation. They could have simply never found his passport, which would have been arguably more convenient for conspirators. The London-Helsinki question is raised by Oswald's passport; this question is inconvenient to those who advocate Oswald is a Lone Nut in all his endeavors, with no higher ups programming his moves. I suggest inconvenient evidence is not faked. Ian Griggs penned this interesting article about Oswald's hotels in Helsinki: https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=4270#relPageId=10 Perhaps we can find a little more in Oswald's life between '61 and '63 such that "leap forward" is instead filled with more interesting details? 1. CIA internal cable describing Oswald's arrival at around midnight in Helsinki at the Hotel Torni with some indications as to Oswald's possible mode of arrival SOURCE 1 CIA Oswald 201 file, Vol 43

The Radical Right testifying before the Warren Commission Part II: Bernard Weissman Age: 27. Weissman halted his previous deposition because he wanted to seek he advice of a lawyer. Weissman appears before the WC with his lawyer, which is rare – others with a lawyer include General Edwin Walker & Robert Surrey. “Welcome Mr. Kennedy to Dallas” ad in the 22NOV63 Dallas Morning News is the subject of the testimony, according to WC attorney Jenner. While in the army, Weissman met Larrie Schmidt in Munich; together they made plans to start a “conservative organization” in Dallas. 4NOV63: Weissman arrives in Dallas. Larrie Schmidt calls Weissman in OCT63 to boast of Adlai Stevenson’s public humiliation in Dallas. General Edwin Walker has employed Larrie Schmidt’s brother, according to a letter Weissman receives from Schmidt. Weissman is “worried” about associating with General Edwin Walker because of potential negative publicity. William (Bill) Burley is a rommate of Weissman’s who is also pestered by Schmidt to come to Dallas. CUSA = Conservatism USA, a group founded by Larrie Scmidt in 1961, while still in the army in Munich. Walker’s command was about 70 miles away from Weissman in Munich, although Walker had left the army during the period discussed in Weissman's testimony.. AMBUS = American Business, meant to be the profitable business entity matched with the political CUSA entity. Weissman is part of a group that hung around the same Munich bar, The Gastatte Lukullus. This group of 5 is the “inner circle” of a planned conservative business-political effort: AMBUS/CUSA. Weissman, Schmidt and the CUSA group intend to “infiltrate” other conservative groups and takeover leadership, one day combining them into the CUSA. Weissman says Larrie Schmidt’s brother drinks too much and is “a moron,” who happily lives on $35 a week and a free room at General Walker’s house. Weissman speaks repeatedly of “the Walker organization,” and is asked to elaborate. Weissman was sick of “seeing America as a weak sister all the time,” under both Eisenhower and Kennedy. Weissman was asked to change his name by the conservatives because it seems Jewish. Weissman is Jewish. H L Hunt of Dallas is noticed in a magazine, Hunt is imagined as a supporter in the CUSA organizational planning. Weissman brought money to the Dallas Morning News to run the “Welcome Mr Kennedy to Dallas” anti-Kennedy ad. Joe Grinnan, John Birch Society officer and independent oil operator, hands $1462 to Weissman for the anti-Kennedy ad. Nelson B Hunt also funds the ad. Weissman wrote the ad copy along with Larrie Schmidt. Weissman and Schmidt create a fictitious “committee” as a named sponsor of the anti-Kennedy ad. “We didn’t want anything to happen in the way of physical violence to President Kennedy,” Weissman says. The “local liberals” were oppressing the conservatives in Dallas after the Stevenson incident, Weissman says. Weissman’s anti-Kennedy “Welcome Mr Kennedy to Dallas…” ad received perhaps 20 favorable responses and 40 unfavorable response letters to the PO box, and $22 contribution. Weissman was in Dallas for 3.5 weeks only and leaves days after the assassination because his name was printed in the anti-JFK "Welcome Mr Kennedy to Dallas..." ad Weissman did not know J D Tippit, Jack Ruby or Lee Harvey Oswald at any time. 22NOV63: Weissman says the radio is calling the attack on JFK a right wing plot. 22NOV63: Weissman and Schmidt are watching the events unfold on TV in a bar. “I hope he is not one of Walker’s boys,” Weissman says upon hearing of Oswald’s arrest Stanley Marcus, owner of Neiman Marcus and a “rabid liberal” according to Weissman, blames the radical right for the assassination in a 23NOV63 Dallas Times Herald article. Weissman says they [the liberals] “had us on the run,” in the aftermath of the assassination. Weissman wants to immediately inform the FBI about the ad and related details, but JBS leader Grinan says no. Weissman volunteers that his employer is on Beckley but this is purely coincidental to Oswald’s address on Beckley. Mark Lane is wrong to claim that Weissman met Ruby and Oswald in the Carousel Club, Weissman says. Weissman has never been to the Caousel Club and never knew Ruby nor Oswald. In a live radio broadcast, Weissman accused Mark Lane of obtaining false testimony. Weissman admits to a meeting with Robert Morris, General Walker’s lawyer. General Walker’s car has “wanted for treason” hadbills visible to Weissman, but Weissman has no connection to the handbills. Robert Surry, Robert Klause, J Monk, Ashalnd Birchwell, General Edwin Walker, and Clifford Mercer are not known personally to Weissman. Weissman seems to imply Jack Ruby may have been watching the PO Box published in the "Welcome Mr Kennedy to Dallas..." anti-JFK ad, but in any case affirms someone surveiled his PO box and followed him at the post office CONCERNS Why does Weissman worry on 22NOV63 that Oswald is “one of Walker’s boys?” Weissman presents himself as manipulated by Larrie Schmidt. Is this accurate or is he trying to shift blame? There are lots of bars mentioned in Weissman's testimony– at least 4. The Larrie Schmidt CUSA group is born in their Munich army buddies drinking spot. Is most of this something of a hairbrained drunken bar idea that somehow gets wrapped up in the assassination? Weissman describes himself as a domestic liberal and against racism. Is this believable considering his associations in Dallas with Walker's group and the John Birch Society? Overall, is Weissman's testimony perhaps most valuable for giving us an insight into the passionate, politically frustrated young men who are anti-communist & anti-JFK minded in 1963? Why does Weissman mention Jack Ruby as possibly watching Weissman's PO box? Is there a connection between Walker’s PRO BLUE conservative indoctrination program given to US troops in Germany and the formation of the CUSA group in Munich by Larrie Schmidt - which leads to the "Welcome Mr Kennedy to Dallas...." ad? Why was the Radical Right immediately blamed in the media for the assassination on 22NOV63 so much that Weissman feared for his safety? Was it merely an assumption or was there early evidence of a right wing plot? The replacement of the Radical Right with the Lone Nut commie sympathizer is a spectacular reversal in assassination coverage; does not one journalist continue to pursue the far right? Overall, isn't Weissman a small fry? Isn't he a rather naive, politically confused, easily manipulated pawn of Schmidt and others? Is his only purpose to the extreme right in providing a name to use in the anti-JFK "Welcome Mr Kennedy to Dallas" ad? 1. Bernard Weissman is the order placer and bagman for the Dallas Morning News 22NOV63 ad: 2. Are Weissman and Schmidt useful idiots to the extreme right; or are they merely idiots??? 3. Bernard Weissman. Is he ever heard from again after the Warren Commission? SOURCES: 1 Warren Commission Hearings and Exhibits, "Weissman Exhibit No. 1" 2 Dr Jerry Rose, "The Friends of General Walker." The Third Decade, Vol 5, Iss 5, p 16. July, 1989. 3 http://spartacus-educational.com/JFKweissmanB.htm

Hi Bill, Many thanks for joining us! I count around 90 Dallas law enforcement witnesses who gave testimony to the WC. To keep this manageable and with some prompting by Paul Trejo, around 25 seem especially prominent - most of all because of their presence at the TSBD or Tippit's murder scene or the Texas Theatre. Strictly from their own words, I say of particular interest are Captain Fritz & Buddy Walthers; although they had a lot of helpers. Walthers is Superman on 22NOV63 because he appears on all the historical scenes. Sheriff Bill Decker is I suspect a critical figure as well, but he says almost nothing and I think everyone holds him in such awe that they ask him almost nothing. Postal Inspector Harry Holmes is, strictly in terms of his WC testimony, the Oscar® winner for best performance. Or, I should say, he is the Oscar® winner for best performance if you are looking for signs of mendacity and conspiracy. He's a terrible witness and a terrible actor. His testimony alone busts the case wide open to an almost obvious conclusion that Oswald was framed, in my reading. My perhaps sophomoric study of 20-odd cops as they testify before the WC is above in this thread. Do you have any disagreements? Anyone else to add to the list? Isn't one of the columns of support towards implicating the Radical Right in the assassination the inescapable evidence that they Forever After insist on a conspiracy in Dealey Plaza? Insofar as Dallas law enforcement also insisted on conspiracy in their testimony - which many did - is it too much of a jump to align their motivations with the Radical Right?. Both General Walker's Minutemen / John Birch Society / White Citizen's Council types AND many in Dallas law enforcement wanted the communists blamed in a conspiracy. Capt Fritz, Sorrels, Hosty, et al., in my review of the evidence only reluctantly go along with the Lone Nut narrative. They make a lot of effort in WC testimony and later to let everyone know what they really think* - that Oswald is a KGB-trained assassin, supported by Castro financially and mysterious others in Dealey Plaza logistically. 1. Are the cover-up and the assassination perhaps more illuminating when studied as two separate modules? Are there two separate motives; one for the murderers and one for those who produced the cover-up? -Bill Simpich, State Secret, Chapter 6. {my added red line} https://www.maryferrell.org/pages/State_Secret_Chapter6.html 2. Is Captain Fritz the tactical commander on 22NOV63 delivering both the staged evidence against Oswald and the exceptionally quick arrest of the presidential assassin? -Bill Simpich, State Secret, Chapter 6 https://www.maryferrell.org/pages/State_Secret_Chapter6.html * or, what they really want us to think

Hi Mervyn, I believe the evidence indicates Oswald boarded the SS Marion Lykes in New Orleans. See documents below. There is testimony from Oswald's travel agent that had he known Helsinki was Oswald's true destination, the travel agent would have booked an easier route. I'll post below the relevant document if I can find it quickly. 1. Is it useful to adopt a working hypothesis that the evidence shows Oswald did not plan on going to Helsinki? The evidence points to this assumption IMO. If Oswald DID plan on going to Helsinki, this implies a higher level of planning and indeed a certain amount of deception as this means Oswald lied to several people both official and unofficial. If Helsinki were part of his plan, even if it were part of a planned defection, why would Oswald hide it? If Helsinki was the plan, why the circuitous route through New Orleans, France, and the UK? 2. I think I might adopt a working hypothesis that the evidence shows Oswald's sudden London to Helsinki move is something that occurs to him or is told to him only at or after getting on the Marion Lykes. Maybe he decides on Helsinki or is told during his transatlantic voyage about Helsinki. Maybe it's in New Orleans before embarking that Oswald becomes destined for Helsinki. Maybe he decides or is told about Helsinki in France, maybe he decides or is told after he gets off the [second] ship in Southampton...It is a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma. There's no evidence Oswald bought a ticket from London to Helsinki at any time, which is one big problem here. I think it is reasonable to hold open the possibility that Oswald really thinks he's going to go to Switzerland for school. Or, like many teenagers, Oswald believes what he apparently told his similarly-motivated cabinmate 18 y.o. Billy Lord on the SS Marion Lykes, such as [me paraphrasing]: "I'll wander around Europe for awhile, see the sights, maybe go to school in Switzerland, maybe find another school somewhere else, whatever strikes my fancy. America is so boring and the Europeans have a different way of life..." See Billy Lord's testimony a few posts up. Don't you think someone -anyone- approaching Oswald and offering him a pathway to the James Bond mystique might have almost unbelievable influence over him? Apologies. I made an assumption based on the evidence but my assumption was wrong! BTW, I didn't mean you traveling from yesterday's war-torn Rotterdam was easy and routine, I mean Holland of today sans border checkpoints. I agree 100% with this possibility. He didn't think he was going on some boring job or a sedate, relaxing vacation. Like many 19 year olds, I say Oswald imagined this liberating departure from America was either: a. the time of his grand adventure, untethered to the usual obligations that keep the rest of us in humdrum daily life ....or.... b. some kind of beginning to the rest of his life in terms of occupation, while also including aspects of (a), his grand adventure. I am fascinated by Jim Root's work in this area. Connecting Oswald to Walker in the 1950s is a monumental step in the archaeology of available evidence, if it can be done. Ok. I'll look into it. Travel between New Orleans and DFW is not an unfamiliar journey for Oswald. I would assume bus is the cheapest and most available option, but I will post any evidence about this I find. I don't think rail was do-able without odd connections in Houston or elsewhere as the system was rigidly north/south and east/west and rudimentary even then (but then again Oswald connects in Le Havre for London...) There is a little evidence Oswald had travel money saved up from his time in the Marines. See document I post below. Money is always a big issue with Oswald. He is always broke. Yes - important questions, except replace New Orleans (or DFW?) for Galveston. 1. Oswald is in New Orleans at the Liberty Hotel before boarding the SS Marion Lykes for Le Havre - according to Oswald on his Lykes Brothers passenger information card. Why doesn't he stay with his aunt and uncle in New Orleans? Why would he go to New Orleans to get to Helsinki anyway??? 2. The FBI summary report of Oswald's voyage from Texas to the USSR via New Orleans, Le Havre, Southampton, London, and Helsinki (that we know of.....?) 3. Oswald's life aboard the SS Marion Lykes: 4. Oswald's travel agent says he would have put Oswald on an easier route to Helsinki if Helsinki was indicated as Oswald's destination: 5. Oswald's savings from the Marines? 6. Swedish Newspaper account has Oswald in Stockholm SOURCES: 1 - CE 1948 - Lykes Brothers Passenger Questionnaire 2 - FBI Summary Report, Warren Commission Document 1, p 49 3 - Testimony of George Church Jr before the Warren Commission. Vol 11, p 116 4 -HSCA CIA collection, NARA 180-10147-10163 5 - HSCA Russ Holmes Work File, NARA 104-10423-10061 6 - HSCA Russ Holmes Work File, NARA 104-10408-10434

What does a man's reading habits tell us? Is this a James Bond fan? 1. From the inventory of Oswald's furnishings at his rooming house on Beckley in Dallas: 2. From a New York Times look into Oswald's library books. November 29, 1963. Section C, p. 21

Hi Mervyn, Although I am suspicious of forced dichotomies as a way to oversimplify history, your binary hypotheses for what Oswald was doing in the UK and Europe might be useful as a fresh template to understand him. Most Americans and definitely most assassination fans want to assign a plan to all events, and especially want to assign maximum assigned project duties to Oswald - the man who was officially crowned Kennedy's assassin. But Oswald was an unimpressive teenager in every measurable way. (Nothing wrong with that!) You interestingly point out that in 1963 Mervyn Hagger took some time off to aimlessly wander around Europe with no plan whatsoever. Were you a CIA operative? If not, might we likewise grant Oswald the capacity for aimless wandering? Your overnight accommodation at a West German police facility would in the case of Oswald serve to "prove" his involvement in a government conspiracy. I read your story as proof you are in the CIA, MI6, and possibly more - or, perhaps you were just a normal kid, I can't decide. I like your somewhat bipolar hypotheses - that Oswald was either a low level intelligence operative or a harmless free spirit - because it need not be an absolute dichotomy. Maybe Oswald had a job on this trip. Maybe he merely wanted a job. Maybe he was auditioning for a job, maybe his 19 y.o. Ian Fleming-saturated mind thought he could insert himself into CIA/KGB intrigues by this trip. Maybe someone told him this would be a good start, an unpaid apprenticeship. Maybe instead of going to Amsterdam for sex and pot like normal American kids, Oswald is something of a Cold War tourist looking for a Cold War job? It could be mix of two extremes - he was perhaps a wanderer, like Mervyn Hagger in the summer of 1963; but he was also perhaps on a low level mission, or perhaps hoping to be awarded a mission...how about we keep the options open? Jason (PS - I like to post evidence and let everyone make their own judgments. Sometimes it's entirely on point, sometimes it's stuff I found while looking for the point of the thread. If you think it's irrelevant, let me know.) 1. This document was withheld in full until November, 2017. It is from a 1977 CIA internal report narrating their response to the assassination. 2. Helsinki was almost as sexy as Berlin in terms of Cold War intrigue delivered for public consumption. Anatoliy Golitsyn is a major figure in the Cold War saga and defected at Helsinki months after Oswald defected in the opposite direction. This CIA document was also withheld in full until November 2017. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anatoliy_Golitsyn 3. This IMO is the another interesting UK-related clue and is I think widely known among assassination fandom as it was never kept secret. {the redacted portions are almost certainly references to a British police or intelligence service}

Apologies, Paul, that was me oversimplifying the evidence in a way that you rightfully suggest may be misleading. I expediently married two known facts: General Walker organized the October 1963 assault on Adlai Stevenson (spitting, hit on the head with a sign, etc.) Adlai Stevenson warned Kennedy to avoid Dallas because of this Walker-sponsored assault I am aware of no evidence that Stevenson mentioned General Walker by name to JFK as part of this warning. The FBI and Secret Service in Dallas were aware that General Walker was behind the assault on Stevenson, as shown by sources printed in this thread, but there is no evidence that Forrest Sorrels and James Hosty reported this detail to Washington. The ATF was all over the Minutemen and was not so keen to protect them as Sorrells and Hosty, but their duty portfolio did not extend to presidential protection, so they may have likewise remained silent about Walker's role. Even so, Hoover had multiple tentacles of domestic intelligence and I think he'd be very interested in understanding the Stevenson incident. Did Hoover know Walker was behind the Stevenson incident before JFK went to Dallas? I will look into the reports he received right now as it's clear Hoover knew very well of the extreme right's capacity for violence and their hatred of Kennedy. Jason 1. The FBI has a bulky correspondence file related to General Walker and his fans: 2. Before General Walker became a person of interest in the Kennedy assassination, he was a person of interest to the FBI for other reasons: 3. Isn't it fair to call General Walker an earlier conspiracy theorist? This continues the discussion of DPD police chief Jesse Curry and his book, and his attempt to blackmail General Walker with his book. (side clue: who is AR indicated as the letter's typist?) Walker can't stand the Lone Nut theory and is a Warren Commission/DPD critic. 4. Walker is a FBI, Nixon, and UN critic who apparently the FBI decides in 1970 is now fit to ignore. Walker jumps the shark? SOURCES: 1 FBI files on Edwin Walker Walker, 116-165594, section 3 2 FBI cross-referenced files to General Walker, pp. 10 & 378, https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=145525&search=hoover_edwin+walker#relPageId=1&tab=page 3 & 4 FBI files on Edwin Walker, 82-2130

Hi Jeremy, While I agree that Oswald's beeline to Helsinki as the one place in the world issuing immediate Soviet entry visas is inexplicable, I do not conclude that this means his defection is a planned US intelligence operation. IMO too often around here EVERY inexplicable piece of evidence is said to be the work of the CIA. The CIA is the answer whenever there is no answer. This has been in effect for 50 years and I'd like to start working with a different hypothesis. Using CIA to fill in the blanks has left us in 1968 with Jim Garrison's able work as the end of assassination research, and perhaps permanently handicapped us because Garrison's work became an Oliver Stone film. So while I agree information from an intelligence source has apparently arrived in Oswald's hands, I do not agree that the only explanation for Helsinki is that he is a defector working for US intelligence. This leap to a conclusion has already been thoroughly explored for over 50 years, so what's the harm in trying out different ideas to see where fresh thinking might lead? Maybe Mervyn is on to something, maybe Paul Trejo is on to something, maybe Jim Root is on to something, and maybe not automatically invoking the CIA or some murky "US intelligence" entity will open up something entirely new? Maybe you will join us in challenging conventional wisdom? Jason

Mervyn, I appreciate very much that you are confident enough to seek your own answers. Most of the assassination fans just regurgitate the same tripe over and over and often contest with themselves to see who can spew forth a detail of their religious doctrine first. They seek to defend their fandom and violently oppose independent inquiry outside of the fan group. They've created a mythology - like Harry Potter - complete with iconic characters, rituals, time worn villains, and well rehearsed storylines repeated over and over. We're in a false dichotomy. Between the Warren Commission defenders and the defenders of the ratified conspiracy religion, there is almost no one pursuing a Third Way or a Fourth Way or ..... except you and a very few others. We've already shared some information and I admit I don't see all the hints and connections you do. But we all need fresh thinking. There's nothing different in 90% of what is said around here versus what Mark Lane and Jim Garrison said over 50 years ago. I hope the adversarial atmosphere from the fan boys doesn't deter you. I'm not even sure if JFK's murder is your first priority here, but your angles are interesting! Jason

Mervyn, apologies if you feel what I offer in this post drifts off your topic of Oswald in the UK. I want to throw it out there because I feel the best hope now is that undiscovered unofficial evidence might yet surface that will finally solve everything. Someone might remember something their dad said about an American in Southampton in the 50s. Someone might remember a strange story their aunt told them of a young American they met on a train, boat, or plane around Britain in the late 50s/early 60s. Someone might have a diary or a letter stuffed in a box in the attic that contains a decisive clue.... so perhaps there is just the tiniest tiny chance that by posting this story from a Southampton pub we might turn up something new? You reminded us that James Earl Ray also got to the UK - he and Oswald are among the least likely Americans to ever pass through London IMO, if we take them at face value. Jason ====----====----==== 1. There's dozens of reports like this in the FBI documents from apparently reliable witnesses. Not all are possible instances of advanced assassination knowledge such as the Southampton pub story, and I haven't noticed that there's any other example quite like this from the UK. Maybe Thomas Kerr Smith is just crazy, or a drunk, or mistaken, but he's rated as honest by the professionals who interviewed him. Is it possible that somewhere in the sea of leads like this -which were never really pursued- there might still yet be an undiscovered clue? {"confidential source abroad" is often FBI-speak for the police or intelligence apparatus of a friendly foreign government} e SOURCE: 1 - FBI JFK Headquarters File, Section 53, page 121

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum You should post evidence if you want to convince people of your CT. Opinions without evidence have no credibility. Anyone who comes on this site, and cites opinions as evidence instead of primary sources is, in my view, an amateur. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem I assume this isn't directed at me since I haven't defended Dale Myers? .... .... .... Jim, I think we've each made our point and so I will call a temporary truce. If your point here is to reassure like minded CTers - just keep on what you're doing. If you want to convince those of us (me included) who have no CT to advocate, evidence as primary sources are required. I think you have a lot to offer researchers because you have an impressive knowledge of the many CTs and the many works by conspiracy theorists going back decades. You are in this sense potentially a kind of librarian that we might turn to and ask - hey, Jim, who went deep into Tippit or the magic bullet or General Walker? ... and you would have a good list available for a researcher to get started. I don't understand why you are so angry with Paul Trejo, and by extension me. If you don't want to read about Walker and the radical right, fine. But is repeatedly insulting me for "patty caking" in a field you don't like enhancing your credibility? I think it would be wonderful if a few people worked on the radical right, a few people worked on the CIA, a few people worked on the FBI, a few people worked on the 2 or 3 (?) Oswalds, and so forth. Why so upset I choose an area few look at? Why attack research you don't like? goodnight Jason

I invite you to post evidence on this forum. I invite you to stop citing essays you wrote and stop asking us to visit your website. Jason

Fascinating. Is this forum about Jason Ward? Where's Paul B to lecture you about posting only substance? ..and yes "my" technique is insisting on primary sources, aka evidence. You have such deep admiration for your own opinions that you actually now believe your own essays are evidence. Don't you want to convince anyone who prefers evidence - or do you only care about those who are persuaded by opinions? You have never posted a primary source that I have ever seen. You cite essays you wrote or the essays of other conspiracy theorists. The essays you wrote cite other conspiracy theorists, not primary sources. I presume you accept an essay from Gerald Ford or Gerald Posner as entirely credible? Jim Douglass's book is a secondary source. Ruth Paine's testimony is a primary source - and it is readily available. Why not post it? Douglass and you and all CTers cherry pick evidence to make a point - which is why the primary source is required. We don't need your editing or Douglass's editing. Bring us the evidence. Why don't you post the documents from the National Archives? Your reason for being here is to talk about me? attack those who don't agree with you? or does it have anything to do with the Kennedy assassination? One out of the 23 citations in your essay is entirely first rate and academic quality. 22 out of 23 cites are to secondary sources and the opinions of others. The only place in your essay that is entirely convincing is in fact the only place where you cite the WC instead of another conspiracy theorist: yes indeed a FBI document says that Todd's initials are on the bullet, which is the extent of the primary sources you offer. Then show us the FBI documents, not your conclusions. Posting evidence is easy to do. Sending us to an essay you wrote citing other conspiracy theorists is even easier of course.... Jason

Essays are not evidence. No matter how highly you personally regard John Hunt and his "milestone" essay - opinions are not evidence. I don't see even a SINGLE reference to any primary source or the Warren Commission - your cites are ENTIRELY the opinions of conspiracy theorists. Jason CORRECTION: I see precisely one place where you cite the WC. I see 22 references to the opinions of other conspiracy theorists.

Your "reference" is nothing but a daisy chain of conspiracy theorists citing other conspiracy theorists in an absurd echo chamber where primary sources are nowhere in sight. You cite yourself, Gary Aguilar, Tink Thompson, et al., as if the conclusions of conspiracy theorists in a feedback loop are evidence. Naming those who who think Dale Myers lacks credibility is of no bearing on the credibility of Dale Myers. Can I politely ask you to pause your enmity for me personally and consider a point in abstract? Because I am not one of your disciples and because I choose to engage Paul Trejo, I know your imperative is always to attack me....but...would you accept the opinion of Gerald Ford or Richard Helms or Gerald Posner as credible if there evidence was nothing but the opinions of Gerald Ford or Richard Helms or Gerald Posner? Opinions and conclusions are not evidence. Jason

I always click through, even from the likes of you. As usual your "evidence" is no evidence whatsoever - it's merely your conclusion and click bait for a cheesy website. YOU ARE NOT A SOURCE. YOUR OPINION IS NOT EVIDENCE. Let the evidence speak for itself and save us your pre-determined CIA-is-in-control-of-the-world "reference" that cites as "evidence" other conspiracy theorists. Please.

LOL, from the guy who can't afford an image hosting service.😄

And let me say it again, if you don't want to post your evidence, that is your problem, not mine.