Terry Mauro Posted July 14, 2007 Share Posted July 14, 2007 Whether or not LBJ was a conspirator or even had knowledge of an assassination plot, I submit the following two points about him:(1) He was pretty clearly politically corrupt, was he not? (2) On the other hand, he had some significant accomplishments, primarily among them the civil rights legislation of the mid-sixties. (3) Yet on the other hand, he will long be remembered for the escalation of the war in Vietnam and the incredible number of deaths on both sides of that war. Speaking of which, I want to go back to the intellectual dishonesty of Robert Strange MacNamara who David Talbot quotes as having been told by KFK that the was in Vietnam was unwinnable. I have reservations about whether MacNamara is speaking honestly about JFK's position. If he is not, he is a xxxx. But if he is, that only further indicts him as one of the architects of the war under LBJ. Back to Lady Bird, I suspect many of us here believe she probably went to her grave with at least some knowledge of facts about the assassination. *************************************************************************** He also brought electricity to the rural south during, and following The Depression, and World War II. I believe he was more a victim of circumstances when it comes to what happened to JFK, and even with the escalation of Vietnam. I honestly don't believe he actually realized what was going to happen. And, I find it inconceivable that he would have condoned it, or that it even needed his final seal of approval. It was out of his hands. Everything he was supposed to have said at the Murchison's house that night was out of sheer bravado, and more than likely aimed at RFK. Players such as Hoover, Dulles, Helms, and the rest of that team of operators, had LBJ's Achilles' heel, with all they had on him concerning prior corruption, wheeling and dealing, and Bobby Baker. I still believe he was nothing more than a corn pone hayseed who made good, strictly on his reputation as an early politician who originally set about to help the poor workers of The Depression Era. Somewhere along the way, from the early 1950's through the 1960's he made some dishonest deals, that may have even involved murder, but I'm not convinced that he was totally unaware of the havoc that was being wrought in his name. Yet, by the time he may have become aware, or learned of what his handlers had partaken in to keep him elected and in office, he more than likely found that he was in too deep, over his head, and owed too many to have been able to extract himself from the tangled web he had woven for himself. I also think that Lady Bird was merely a product of her times and of her own family's legacy. It must have been hard, even seemed futile at times, to have to stand in the footsteps JFK and Jackie had left imprinted on The White House, as well as on the heart and memory of a whole nation that had been thrust into a perpetual state of mourning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack White Posted July 14, 2007 Share Posted July 14, 2007 Whether or not LBJ was a conspirator or even had knowledge of an assassination plot, I submit the following two points about him:(1) He was pretty clearly politically corrupt, was he not? (2) On the other hand, he had some significant accomplishments, primarily among them the civil rights legislation of the mid-sixties. (3) Yet on the other hand, he will long be remembered for the escalation of the war in Vietnam and the incredible number of deaths on both sides of that war. Speaking of which, I want to go back to the intellectual dishonesty of Robert Strange MacNamara who David Talbot quotes as having been told by KFK that the was in Vietnam was unwinnable. I have reservations about whether MacNamara is speaking honestly about JFK's position. If he is not, he is a xxxx. But if he is, that only further indicts him as one of the architects of the war under LBJ. Back to Lady Bird, I suspect many of us here believe she probably went to her grave with at least some knowledge of facts about the assassination. *************************************************************************** He also brought electricity to the rural south during, and following The Depression, and World War II. I believe he was more a victim of circumstances when it comes to what happened to JFK, and even with the escalation of Vietnam. I honestly don't believe he actually realized what was going to happen. And, I find it inconceivable that he would have condoned it, or that it even needed his final seal of approval. It was out of his hands. Everything he was supposed to have said at the Murchison's house that night was out of sheer bravado, and more than likely aimed at RFK. Players such as Hoover, Dulles, Helms, and the rest of that team of operators, had LBJ's Achilles' heel, with all they had on him concerning prior corruption, wheeling and dealing, and Bobby Baker. I still believe he was nothing more than a corn pone hayseed who made good, strictly on his reputation as an early politician who originally set about to help the poor workers of The Depression Era. Somewhere along the way, from the early 1950's through the 1960's he made some dishonest deals, that may have even involved murder, but I'm not convinced that he was totally unaware of the havoc that was being wrought in his name. Yet, by the time he may have become aware, or learned of what his handlers had partaken in to keep him elected and in office, he more than likely found that he was in too deep, over his head, and owed too many to have been able to extract himself from the tangled web he had woven for himself. I also think that Lady Bird was merely a product of her times and of her own family's legacy. It must have been hard, even seemed futile at times, to have to stand in the footsteps JFK and Jackie had left imprinted on The White House, as well as on the heart and memory of a whole nation that had been thrust into a perpetual state of mourning. "Convince a person against their will, and they are of the same opinion still." LBainesJ was a SOAB. LBirdJ was just plain old "B". I got LOTS of lowdown on her from the late Madeleine Brown. After LBJ died, it was Bird who managed to get cut off LBJ's monthly stipend to his son, Steven Brown. Madeleine also believed it was she who had Steve "kidnapped" and injected with cancer cells. She knew about Lyndon's other love children, and used it for blackmail. She was his partner in crime. Lots more, according to Madeleine. Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Mauro Posted July 14, 2007 Share Posted July 14, 2007 Whether or not LBJ was a conspirator or even had knowledge of an assassination plot, I submit the following two points about him:(1) He was pretty clearly politically corrupt, was he not? (2) On the other hand, he had some significant accomplishments, primarily among them the civil rights legislation of the mid-sixties. (3) Yet on the other hand, he will long be remembered for the escalation of the war in Vietnam and the incredible number of deaths on both sides of that war. Speaking of which, I want to go back to the intellectual dishonesty of Robert Strange MacNamara who David Talbot quotes as having been told by KFK that the was in Vietnam was unwinnable. I have reservations about whether MacNamara is speaking honestly about JFK's position. If he is not, he is a xxxx. But if he is, that only further indicts him as one of the architects of the war under LBJ. Back to Lady Bird, I suspect many of us here believe she probably went to her grave with at least some knowledge of facts about the assassination. *************************************************************************** He also brought electricity to the rural south during, and following The Depression, and World War II. I believe he was more a victim of circumstances when it comes to what happened to JFK, and even with the escalation of Vietnam. I honestly don't believe he actually realized what was going to happen. And, I find it inconceivable that he would have condoned it, or that it even needed his final seal of approval. It was out of his hands. Everything he was supposed to have said at the Murchison's house that night was out of sheer bravado, and more than likely aimed at RFK. Players such as Hoover, Dulles, Helms, and the rest of that team of operators, had LBJ's Achilles' heel, with all they had on him concerning prior corruption, wheeling and dealing, and Bobby Baker. I still believe he was nothing more than a corn pone hayseed who made good, strictly on his reputation as an early politician who originally set about to help the poor workers of The Depression Era. Somewhere along the way, from the early 1950's through the 1960's he made some dishonest deals, that may have even involved murder, but I'm not convinced that he was totally unaware of the havoc that was being wrought in his name. Yet, by the time he may have become aware, or learned of what his handlers had partaken in to keep him elected and in office, he more than likely found that he was in too deep, over his head, and owed too many to have been able to extract himself from the tangled web he had woven for himself. I also think that Lady Bird was merely a product of her times and of her own family's legacy. It must have been hard, even seemed futile at times, to have to stand in the footsteps JFK and Jackie had left imprinted on The White House, as well as on the heart and memory of a whole nation that had been thrust into a perpetual state of mourning. "Convince a person against their will, and they are of the same opinion still." LBainesJ was a SOAB. LBirdJ was just plain old "B". I got LOTS of lowdown on her from the late Madeleine Brown. After LBJ died, it was Bird who managed to get cut off LBJ's monthly stipend to his son, Steven Brown. Madeleine also believed it was she who had Steve "kidnapped" and injected with cancer cells. She knew about Lyndon's other love children, and used it for blackmail. She was his partner in crime. Lots more, according to Madeleine. Jack ********************************************************************** "Lots more, according to Madeleine." Words spoken of a "woman scorned," perhaps? Listen, Jack. I'm not advocating these people. I'm merely trying to put another slant on it because I don't follow the trail to Dallas, I follow it to Wall Street. But to get back to the case in point, LBJ was responsible for bringing NASA, and aeronautical research to the southland [Houston, Cape Kennedy]. Also, there were more casualties and deaths under Nixon's term, than under LBJ's. And, it was Nixon who expanded the war into Cambodia, destabilizing that country, and causing a multi-million person genocide. If the Joseph Alsop/LBJ transcripts of their telephone conversations concerning the creation of the Warren Commission are correct, then LBJ is extremely peripheral, or not involved, at all, in the assassination, except for aforeknowledge from Dulles and the Brown Brothers of Tejas. If anything, LBJ was an unwitting tool to get JFK down to Tejas into the killing field. And, if anyone should get a finger pointed at them it should be ["future" Republican party man] Connally. Maybe, Connally saw the future. Republicans were going to take control [wink, wink] via their dirty tricks campaigns. "Madeleine also believed it was she who had Steve "kidnapped" and injected with cancer cells." Statements, such as that one, only serve to give credence to what Judyth says she was involved in. "She knew about Lyndon's other love children, and used it for blackmail. She was his partner in crime." Blackmail? Of whom? Women claiming that LBJ fostered their illegitimate children? It sounds as if these women were looking to blackmail him, and Bird was only doing her part in looking out for her own family's "best interests." I'm sure it ain't as cut and dry as Madeleine Brown claimed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack White Posted July 15, 2007 Share Posted July 15, 2007 Whether or not LBJ was a conspirator or even had knowledge of an assassination plot, I submit the following two points about him:(1) He was pretty clearly politically corrupt, was he not? (2) On the other hand, he had some significant accomplishments, primarily among them the civil rights legislation of the mid-sixties. (3) Yet on the other hand, he will long be remembered for the escalation of the war in Vietnam and the incredible number of deaths on both sides of that war. Speaking of which, I want to go back to the intellectual dishonesty of Robert Strange MacNamara who David Talbot quotes as having been told by KFK that the was in Vietnam was unwinnable. I have reservations about whether MacNamara is speaking honestly about JFK's position. If he is not, he is a xxxx. But if he is, that only further indicts him as one of the architects of the war under LBJ. Back to Lady Bird, I suspect many of us here believe she probably went to her grave with at least some knowledge of facts about the assassination. *************************************************************************** He also brought electricity to the rural south during, and following The Depression, and World War II. I believe he was more a victim of circumstances when it comes to what happened to JFK, and even with the escalation of Vietnam. I honestly don't believe he actually realized what was going to happen. And, I find it inconceivable that he would have condoned it, or that it even needed his final seal of approval. It was out of his hands. Everything he was supposed to have said at the Murchison's house that night was out of sheer bravado, and more than likely aimed at RFK. Players such as Hoover, Dulles, Helms, and the rest of that team of operators, had LBJ's Achilles' heel, with all they had on him concerning prior corruption, wheeling and dealing, and Bobby Baker. I still believe he was nothing more than a corn pone hayseed who made good, strictly on his reputation as an early politician who originally set about to help the poor workers of The Depression Era. Somewhere along the way, from the early 1950's through the 1960's he made some dishonest deals, that may have even involved murder, but I'm not convinced that he was totally unaware of the havoc that was being wrought in his name. Yet, by the time he may have become aware, or learned of what his handlers had partaken in to keep him elected and in office, he more than likely found that he was in too deep, over his head, and owed too many to have been able to extract himself from the tangled web he had woven for himself. I also think that Lady Bird was merely a product of her times and of her own family's legacy. It must have been hard, even seemed futile at times, to have to stand in the footsteps JFK and Jackie had left imprinted on The White House, as well as on the heart and memory of a whole nation that had been thrust into a perpetual state of mourning. "Convince a person against their will, and they are of the same opinion still." LBainesJ was a SOAB. LBirdJ was just plain old "B". I got LOTS of lowdown on her from the late Madeleine Brown. After LBJ died, it was Bird who managed to get cut off LBJ's monthly stipend to his son, Steven Brown. Madeleine also believed it was she who had Steve "kidnapped" and injected with cancer cells. She knew about Lyndon's other love children, and used it for blackmail. She was his partner in crime. Lots more, according to Madeleine. Jack ********************************************************************** "Lots more, according to Madeleine." Words spoken of a "woman scorned," perhaps? Listen, Jack. I'm not advocating these people. I'm merely trying to put another slant on it because I don't follow the trail to Dallas, I follow it to Wall Street. But to get back to the case in point, LBJ was responsible for bringing NASA, and aeronautical research to the southland [Houston, Cape Kennedy]. Also, there were more casualties and deaths under Nixon's term, than under LBJ's. And, it was Nixon who expanded the war into Cambodia, destabilizing that country, and causing a multi-million person genocide. If the Joseph Alsop/LBJ transcripts of their telephone conversations concerning the creation of the Warren Commission are correct, then LBJ is extremely peripheral, or not involved, at all, in the assassination, except for aforeknowledge from Dulles and the Brown Brothers of Tejas. If anything, LBJ was an unwitting tool to get JFK down to Tejas into the killing field. And, if anyone should get a finger pointed at them it should be ["future" Republican party man] Connally. Maybe, Connally saw the future. Republicans were going to take control [wink, wink] via their dirty tricks campaigns. "Madeleine also believed it was she who had Steve "kidnapped" and injected with cancer cells." Statements, such as that one, only serve to give credence to what Judyth says she was involved in. "She knew about Lyndon's other love children, and used it for blackmail. She was his partner in crime." Blackmail? Of whom? Women claiming that LBJ fostered their illegitimate children? It sounds as if these women were looking to blackmail him, and Bird was only doing her part in looking out for her own family's "best interests." I'm sure it ain't as cut and dry as Madeleine Brown claimed. Thanks, Terry. Madeleine did not consider herself "a woman scorned". She still "loved" Lyndon till the end, despite knowing of his crimes. She considered Lady Bird a witch. Regarding young Steve suddenly contracting cancer and dying...I was around when it happened. Madeleine and Steve had been attending Jim Marrs' classes on the assassination, along with Jean Hill, and we all got to know them well. Steve was the image of "young Lyndon" of photographs. One Thursday night, only Jean showed up, and told the class that Madeleine had called her in a panic...STEVE HAD DISAPPEARED from Dallas. To make a long story short, about a month later, she discovered that STEVE WAS IN A HOSPITAL IN WASHINGTON DC, SUFFERING FROM AN UNKNOWN ILLNESS. How he got there was a mystery. In a few months she returned to the classes, quiet and subdued, and would not talk about Steve. About a year later he had died from cancer. She connected his strange disappearance with his death. Not many youths his age die of cancer. She blamed Lady Bird for arranging Steve's death. As for other love children, she only mentioned one (THIS IS UNVERIFIABLE) and I will repeat only what she told me. One of Lyndon's other mistresses (Madeleine thought there were several) in HOUSTON became pregnant, and Lyndon "arranged for her to marry his friend Jack Valenti". According to Madeleine Lady Bird was very aware of Lyndon's indiscretions and used them to her advantage. Maybe blackmail is not the right word, but Bird used her knowledge to influence Valenti to stay in line after LBJ was gone, according to Madeleine. She possibly also used what she knew to keep Lyndon in line. It was very clear that when Lyndon died, payments to Steven through a Dallas lawyer STOPPED because of Lady Bird. She did not want siblings popping out of the woodwork to contest the vast inheritances of Lynda Bird and Lucy Baines...HER kids. But we will never know for sure, will we? TEXAS IN THE MORNING is well worth reading. Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack White Posted July 15, 2007 Share Posted July 15, 2007 Whether or not LBJ was a conspirator or even had knowledge of an assassination plot, I submit the following two points about him:(1) He was pretty clearly politically corrupt, was he not? (2) On the other hand, he had some significant accomplishments, primarily among them the civil rights legislation of the mid-sixties. (3) Yet on the other hand, he will long be remembered for the escalation of the war in Vietnam and the incredible number of deaths on both sides of that war. Speaking of which, I want to go back to the intellectual dishonesty of Robert Strange MacNamara who David Talbot quotes as having been told by KFK that the was in Vietnam was unwinnable. I have reservations about whether MacNamara is speaking honestly about JFK's position. If he is not, he is a xxxx. But if he is, that only further indicts him as one of the architects of the war under LBJ. Back to Lady Bird, I suspect many of us here believe she probably went to her grave with at least some knowledge of facts about the assassination. *************************************************************************** He also brought electricity to the rural south during, and following The Depression, and World War II. I believe he was more a victim of circumstances when it comes to what happened to JFK, and even with the escalation of Vietnam. I honestly don't believe he actually realized what was going to happen. And, I find it inconceivable that he would have condoned it, or that it even needed his final seal of approval. It was out of his hands. Everything he was supposed to have said at the Murchison's house that night was out of sheer bravado, and more than likely aimed at RFK. Players such as Hoover, Dulles, Helms, and the rest of that team of operators, had LBJ's Achilles' heel, with all they had on him concerning prior corruption, wheeling and dealing, and Bobby Baker. I still believe he was nothing more than a corn pone hayseed who made good, strictly on his reputation as an early politician who originally set about to help the poor workers of The Depression Era. Somewhere along the way, from the early 1950's through the 1960's he made some dishonest deals, that may have even involved murder, but I'm not convinced that he was totally unaware of the havoc that was being wrought in his name. Yet, by the time he may have become aware, or learned of what his handlers had partaken in to keep him elected and in office, he more than likely found that he was in too deep, over his head, and owed too many to have been able to extract himself from the tangled web he had woven for himself. I also think that Lady Bird was merely a product of her times and of her own family's legacy. It must have been hard, even seemed futile at times, to have to stand in the footsteps JFK and Jackie had left imprinted on The White House, as well as on the heart and memory of a whole nation that had been thrust into a perpetual state of mourning. "Convince a person against their will, and they are of the same opinion still." LBainesJ was a SOAB. LBirdJ was just plain old "B". I got LOTS of lowdown on her from the late Madeleine Brown. After LBJ died, it was Bird who managed to get cut off LBJ's monthly stipend to his son, Steven Brown. Madeleine also believed it was she who had Steve "kidnapped" and injected with cancer cells. She knew about Lyndon's other love children, and used it for blackmail. She was his partner in crime. Lots more, according to Madeleine. Jack ********************************************************************** "Lots more, according to Madeleine." Words spoken of a "woman scorned," perhaps? Listen, Jack. I'm not advocating these people. I'm merely trying to put another slant on it because I don't follow the trail to Dallas, I follow it to Wall Street. But to get back to the case in point, LBJ was responsible for bringing NASA, and aeronautical research to the southland [Houston, Cape Kennedy]. Also, there were more casualties and deaths under Nixon's term, than under LBJ's. And, it was Nixon who expanded the war into Cambodia, destabilizing that country, and causing a multi-million person genocide. If the Joseph Alsop/LBJ transcripts of their telephone conversations concerning the creation of the Warren Commission are correct, then LBJ is extremely peripheral, or not involved, at all, in the assassination, except for aforeknowledge from Dulles and the Brown Brothers of Tejas. If anything, LBJ was an unwitting tool to get JFK down to Tejas into the killing field. And, if anyone should get a finger pointed at them it should be ["future" Republican party man] Connally. Maybe, Connally saw the future. Republicans were going to take control [wink, wink] via their dirty tricks campaigns. "Madeleine also believed it was she who had Steve "kidnapped" and injected with cancer cells." Statements, such as that one, only serve to give credence to what Judyth says she was involved in. "She knew about Lyndon's other love children, and used it for blackmail. She was his partner in crime." Blackmail? Of whom? Women claiming that LBJ fostered their illegitimate children? It sounds as if these women were looking to blackmail him, and Bird was only doing her part in looking out for her own family's "best interests." I'm sure it ain't as cut and dry as Madeleine Brown claimed. Thanks, Terry. Madeleine did not consider herself "a woman scorned". She still "loved" Lyndon till the end, despite knowing of his crimes. She considered Lady Bird a witch. Regarding young Steve suddenly contracting cancer and dying...I was around when it happened. Madeleine and Steve had been attending Jim Marrs' classes on the assassination, along with Jean Hill, and we all got to know them well. Steve was the image of "young Lyndon" of photographs. One Thursday night, only Jean showed up, and told the class that Madeleine had called her in a panic...STEVE HAD DISAPPEARED from Dallas. To make a long story short, about a month later, she discovered that STEVE WAS IN A HOSPITAL IN WASHINGTON DC, SUFFERING FROM AN UNKNOWN ILLNESS. How he got there was a mystery. In a few months she returned to the classes, quiet and subdued, and would not talk about Steve. About a year later he had died from cancer. She connected his strange disappearance with his death. Not many youths his age die of cancer. She blamed Lady Bird for arranging Steve's death. As for other love children, she only mentioned one (THIS IS UNVERIFIABLE) and I will repeat only what she told me. One of Lyndon's other mistresses (Madeleine thought there were several) in HOUSTON became pregnant, and Lyndon "arranged for her to marry his friend Jack Valenti". According to Madeleine Lady Bird was very aware of Lyndon's indiscretions and used them to her advantage. Maybe blackmail is not the right word, but Bird used her knowledge to influence Valenti to stay in line after LBJ was gone, according to Madeleine. She possibly also used what she knew to keep Lyndon in line. It was very clear that when Lyndon died, payments to Steven through a Dallas lawyer STOPPED because of Lady Bird. She did not want siblings popping out of the woodwork to contest the vast inheritances of Lynda Bird and Lucy Baines...HER kids. But we will never know for sure, will we? TEXAS IN THE MORNING is well worth reading. Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Mauro Posted July 15, 2007 Share Posted July 15, 2007 Whether or not LBJ was a conspirator or even had knowledge of an assassination plot, I submit the following two points about him:(1) He was pretty clearly politically corrupt, was he not? (2) On the other hand, he had some significant accomplishments, primarily among them the civil rights legislation of the mid-sixties. (3) Yet on the other hand, he will long be remembered for the escalation of the war in Vietnam and the incredible number of deaths on both sides of that war. Speaking of which, I want to go back to the intellectual dishonesty of Robert Strange MacNamara who David Talbot quotes as having been told by KFK that the was in Vietnam was unwinnable. I have reservations about whether MacNamara is speaking honestly about JFK's position. If he is not, he is a xxxx. But if he is, that only further indicts him as one of the architects of the war under LBJ. Back to Lady Bird, I suspect many of us here believe she probably went to her grave with at least some knowledge of facts about the assassination. *************************************************************************** He also brought electricity to the rural south during, and following The Depression, and World War II. I believe he was more a victim of circumstances when it comes to what happened to JFK, and even with the escalation of Vietnam. I honestly don't believe he actually realized what was going to happen. And, I find it inconceivable that he would have condoned it, or that it even needed his final seal of approval. It was out of his hands. Everything he was supposed to have said at the Murchison's house that night was out of sheer bravado, and more than likely aimed at RFK. Players such as Hoover, Dulles, Helms, and the rest of that team of operators, had LBJ's Achilles' heel, with all they had on him concerning prior corruption, wheeling and dealing, and Bobby Baker. I still believe he was nothing more than a corn pone hayseed who made good, strictly on his reputation as an early politician who originally set about to help the poor workers of The Depression Era. Somewhere along the way, from the early 1950's through the 1960's he made some dishonest deals, that may have even involved murder, but I'm not convinced that he was totally unaware of the havoc that was being wrought in his name. Yet, by the time he may have become aware, or learned of what his handlers had partaken in to keep him elected and in office, he more than likely found that he was in too deep, over his head, and owed too many to have been able to extract himself from the tangled web he had woven for himself. I also think that Lady Bird was merely a product of her times and of her own family's legacy. It must have been hard, even seemed futile at times, to have to stand in the footsteps JFK and Jackie had left imprinted on The White House, as well as on the heart and memory of a whole nation that had been thrust into a perpetual state of mourning. "Convince a person against their will, and they are of the same opinion still." LBainesJ was a SOAB. LBirdJ was just plain old "B". I got LOTS of lowdown on her from the late Madeleine Brown. After LBJ died, it was Bird who managed to get cut off LBJ's monthly stipend to his son, Steven Brown. Madeleine also believed it was she who had Steve "kidnapped" and injected with cancer cells. She knew about Lyndon's other love children, and used it for blackmail. She was his partner in crime. Lots more, according to Madeleine. Jack ********************************************************************** "Lots more, according to Madeleine." Words spoken of a "woman scorned," perhaps? Listen, Jack. I'm not advocating these people. I'm merely trying to put another slant on it because I don't follow the trail to Dallas, I follow it to Wall Street. But to get back to the case in point, LBJ was responsible for bringing NASA, and aeronautical research to the southland [Houston, Cape Kennedy]. Also, there were more casualties and deaths under Nixon's term, than under LBJ's. And, it was Nixon who expanded the war into Cambodia, destabilizing that country, and causing a multi-million person genocide. If the Joseph Alsop/LBJ transcripts of their telephone conversations concerning the creation of the Warren Commission are correct, then LBJ is extremely peripheral, or not involved, at all, in the assassination, except for aforeknowledge from Dulles and the Brown Brothers of Tejas. If anything, LBJ was an unwitting tool to get JFK down to Tejas into the killing field. And, if anyone should get a finger pointed at them it should be ["future" Republican party man] Connally. Maybe, Connally saw the future. Republicans were going to take control [wink, wink] via their dirty tricks campaigns. "Madeleine also believed it was she who had Steve "kidnapped" and injected with cancer cells." Statements, such as that one, only serve to give credence to what Judyth says she was involved in. "She knew about Lyndon's other love children, and used it for blackmail. She was his partner in crime." Blackmail? Of whom? Women claiming that LBJ fostered their illegitimate children? It sounds as if these women were looking to blackmail him, and Bird was only doing her part in looking out for her own family's "best interests." I'm sure it ain't as cut and dry as Madeleine Brown claimed. Thanks, Terry. Madeleine did not consider herself "a woman scorned". She still "loved" Lyndon till the end, despite knowing of his crimes. She considered Lady Bird a witch. Regarding young Steve suddenly contracting cancer and dying...I was around when it happened. Madeleine and Steve had been attending Jim Marrs' classes on the assassination, along with Jean Hill, and we all got to know them well. Steve was the image of "young Lyndon" of photographs. One Thursday night, only Jean showed up, and told the class that Madeleine had called her in a panic...STEVE HAD DISAPPEARED from Dallas. To make a long story short, about a month later, she discovered that STEVE WAS IN A HOSPITAL IN WASHINGTON DC, SUFFERING FROM AN UNKNOWN ILLNESS. How he got there was a mystery. In a few months she returned to the classes, quiet and subdued, and would not talk about Steve. About a year later he had died from cancer. She connected his strange disappearance with his death. Not many youths his age die of cancer. She blamed Lady Bird for arranging Steve's death. As for other love children, she only mentioned one (THIS IS UNVERIFIABLE) and I will repeat only what she told me. One of Lyndon's other mistresses (Madeleine thought there were several) in HOUSTON became pregnant, and Lyndon "arranged for her to marry his friend Jack Valenti". According to Madeleine Lady Bird was very aware of Lyndon's indiscretions and used them to her advantage. Maybe blackmail is not the right word, but Bird used her knowledge to influence Valenti to stay in line after LBJ was gone, according to Madeleine. She possibly also used what she knew to keep Lyndon in line. It was very clear that when Lyndon died, payments to Steven through a Dallas lawyer STOPPED because of Lady Bird. She did not want siblings popping out of the woodwork to contest the vast inheritances of Lynda Bird and Lucy Baines...HER kids. But we will never know for sure, will we? TEXAS IN THE MORNING is well worth reading. Jack ******************************************************************************** "Regarding young Steve suddenly contracting cancer and dying...I was around when it happened. Madeleine and Steve had been attending Jim Marrs' classes on the assassination, along with Jean Hill, and we all got to know them well. Steve was the image of "young Lyndon" of photographs. One Thursday night, only Jean showed up, and told the class that Madeleine had called her in a panic...STEVE HAD DISAPPEARED from Dallas. To make a long story short, about a month later, she discovered that STEVE WAS IN A HOSPITAL IN WASHINGTON DC, SUFFERING FROM AN UNKNOWN ILLNESS. How he got there was a mystery. In a few months she returned to the classes, quiet and subdued, and would not talk about Steve. About a year later he had died from cancer. She connected his strange disappearance with his death. Not many youths his age die of cancer. She blamed Lady Bird for arranging Steve's death." I've seen pictures of Steven and there was no doubt he was LBJ's son. Is it your impression that Valenti, being as close to the Johnson's as he was, may have been coerced into setting up this kidnapping, and contraction of CA into Steven's body, by dubious means a la an Ochsner, Ferrie, Mary Sherman diabolical scheme created to infect Castro? That Valenti, at the behest of Lady Bird, was able to facilitate this horrible death upon LBJ's progeny, born in the stark resemblance of her husband? Did Steven have any recollection of the abduction, was he lucid enough to remember anything surrounding his disappearance, his captors, how he ended up in D.C., the name of the hospital, was it the NIH? What condition he was in when he was found? It's preposterous, in my humble opinion, that Lady Bird was able to wield such control over LBJ and Valenti, to the point of contracting a murder on her rival's illegitimate son. It also seems preposterous that LBJ would've allowed himself to be, excuse the expression, pussy-whipped into submission by Lady Bird. I know her family was powerful in the Lone Star State, but to be able to effect an execution, using the prescribed method originally concocted for the elimination of Castro, seems incredible, and as I said before, gives more credence to what Ed Haslam and Judyth have to say, in that regard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack White Posted July 15, 2007 Share Posted July 15, 2007 Whether or not LBJ was a conspirator or even had knowledge of an assassination plot, I submit the following two points about him:(1) He was pretty clearly politically corrupt, was he not? (2) On the other hand, he had some significant accomplishments, primarily among them the civil rights legislation of the mid-sixties. (3) Yet on the other hand, he will long be remembered for the escalation of the war in Vietnam and the incredible number of deaths on both sides of that war. Speaking of which, I want to go back to the intellectual dishonesty of Robert Strange MacNamara who David Talbot quotes as having been told by KFK that the was in Vietnam was unwinnable. I have reservations about whether MacNamara is speaking honestly about JFK's position. If he is not, he is a xxxx. But if he is, that only further indicts him as one of the architects of the war under LBJ. Back to Lady Bird, I suspect many of us here believe she probably went to her grave with at least some knowledge of facts about the assassination. *************************************************************************** He also brought electricity to the rural south during, and following The Depression, and World War II. I believe he was more a victim of circumstances when it comes to what happened to JFK, and even with the escalation of Vietnam. I honestly don't believe he actually realized what was going to happen. And, I find it inconceivable that he would have condoned it, or that it even needed his final seal of approval. It was out of his hands. Everything he was supposed to have said at the Murchison's house that night was out of sheer bravado, and more than likely aimed at RFK. Players such as Hoover, Dulles, Helms, and the rest of that team of operators, had LBJ's Achilles' heel, with all they had on him concerning prior corruption, wheeling and dealing, and Bobby Baker. I still believe he was nothing more than a corn pone hayseed who made good, strictly on his reputation as an early politician who originally set about to help the poor workers of The Depression Era. Somewhere along the way, from the early 1950's through the 1960's he made some dishonest deals, that may have even involved murder, but I'm not convinced that he was totally unaware of the havoc that was being wrought in his name. Yet, by the time he may have become aware, or learned of what his handlers had partaken in to keep him elected and in office, he more than likely found that he was in too deep, over his head, and owed too many to have been able to extract himself from the tangled web he had woven for himself. I also think that Lady Bird was merely a product of her times and of her own family's legacy. It must have been hard, even seemed futile at times, to have to stand in the footsteps JFK and Jackie had left imprinted on The White House, as well as on the heart and memory of a whole nation that had been thrust into a perpetual state of mourning. "Convince a person against their will, and they are of the same opinion still." LBainesJ was a SOAB. LBirdJ was just plain old "B". I got LOTS of lowdown on her from the late Madeleine Brown. After LBJ died, it was Bird who managed to get cut off LBJ's monthly stipend to his son, Steven Brown. Madeleine also believed it was she who had Steve "kidnapped" and injected with cancer cells. She knew about Lyndon's other love children, and used it for blackmail. She was his partner in crime. Lots more, according to Madeleine. Jack ********************************************************************** "Lots more, according to Madeleine." Words spoken of a "woman scorned," perhaps? Listen, Jack. I'm not advocating these people. I'm merely trying to put another slant on it because I don't follow the trail to Dallas, I follow it to Wall Street. But to get back to the case in point, LBJ was responsible for bringing NASA, and aeronautical research to the southland [Houston, Cape Kennedy]. Also, there were more casualties and deaths under Nixon's term, than under LBJ's. And, it was Nixon who expanded the war into Cambodia, destabilizing that country, and causing a multi-million person genocide. If the Joseph Alsop/LBJ transcripts of their telephone conversations concerning the creation of the Warren Commission are correct, then LBJ is extremely peripheral, or not involved, at all, in the assassination, except for aforeknowledge from Dulles and the Brown Brothers of Tejas. If anything, LBJ was an unwitting tool to get JFK down to Tejas into the killing field. And, if anyone should get a finger pointed at them it should be ["future" Republican party man] Connally. Maybe, Connally saw the future. Republicans were going to take control [wink, wink] via their dirty tricks campaigns. "Madeleine also believed it was she who had Steve "kidnapped" and injected with cancer cells." Statements, such as that one, only serve to give credence to what Judyth says she was involved in. "She knew about Lyndon's other love children, and used it for blackmail. She was his partner in crime." Blackmail? Of whom? Women claiming that LBJ fostered their illegitimate children? It sounds as if these women were looking to blackmail him, and Bird was only doing her part in looking out for her own family's "best interests." I'm sure it ain't as cut and dry as Madeleine Brown claimed. Thanks, Terry. Madeleine did not consider herself "a woman scorned". She still "loved" Lyndon till the end, despite knowing of his crimes. She considered Lady Bird a witch. Regarding young Steve suddenly contracting cancer and dying...I was around when it happened. Madeleine and Steve had been attending Jim Marrs' classes on the assassination, along with Jean Hill, and we all got to know them well. Steve was the image of "young Lyndon" of photographs. One Thursday night, only Jean showed up, and told the class that Madeleine had called her in a panic...STEVE HAD DISAPPEARED from Dallas. To make a long story short, about a month later, she discovered that STEVE WAS IN A HOSPITAL IN WASHINGTON DC, SUFFERING FROM AN UNKNOWN ILLNESS. How he got there was a mystery. In a few months she returned to the classes, quiet and subdued, and would not talk about Steve. About a year later he had died from cancer. She connected his strange disappearance with his death. Not many youths his age die of cancer. She blamed Lady Bird for arranging Steve's death. As for other love children, she only mentioned one (THIS IS UNVERIFIABLE) and I will repeat only what she told me. One of Lyndon's other mistresses (Madeleine thought there were several) in HOUSTON became pregnant, and Lyndon "arranged for her to marry his friend Jack Valenti". According to Madeleine Lady Bird was very aware of Lyndon's indiscretions and used them to her advantage. Maybe blackmail is not the right word, but Bird used her knowledge to influence Valenti to stay in line after LBJ was gone, according to Madeleine. She possibly also used what she knew to keep Lyndon in line. It was very clear that when Lyndon died, payments to Steven through a Dallas lawyer STOPPED because of Lady Bird. She did not want siblings popping out of the woodwork to contest the vast inheritances of Lynda Bird and Lucy Baines...HER kids. But we will never know for sure, will we? TEXAS IN THE MORNING is well worth reading. Jack ******************************************************************************** "Regarding young Steve suddenly contracting cancer and dying...I was around when it happened. Madeleine and Steve had been attending Jim Marrs' classes on the assassination, along with Jean Hill, and we all got to know them well. Steve was the image of "young Lyndon" of photographs. One Thursday night, only Jean showed up, and told the class that Madeleine had called her in a panic...STEVE HAD DISAPPEARED from Dallas. To make a long story short, about a month later, she discovered that STEVE WAS IN A HOSPITAL IN WASHINGTON DC, SUFFERING FROM AN UNKNOWN ILLNESS. How he got there was a mystery. In a few months she returned to the classes, quiet and subdued, and would not talk about Steve. About a year later he had died from cancer. She connected his strange disappearance with his death. Not many youths his age die of cancer. She blamed Lady Bird for arranging Steve's death." I've seen pictures of Steven and there was no doubt he was LBJ's son. Is it your impression that Valenti, being as close to the Johnson's as he was, may have been coerced into setting up this kidnapping, and contraction of CA into Steven's body, by dubious means a la an Ochsner, Ferrie, Mary Sherman diabolical scheme created to infect Castro? That Valenti, at the behest of Lady Bird, was able to facilitate this horrible death upon LBJ's progeny, born in the stark resemblance of her husband? Did Steven have any recollection of the abduction, was he lucid enough to remember anything surrounding his disappearance, his captors, how he ended up in D.C., the name of the hospital, was it the NIH? What condition he was in when he was found? It's preposterous, in my humble opinion, that Lady Bird was able to wield such control over LBJ and Valenti, to the point of contracting a murder on her rival's illegitimate son. It also seems preposterous that LBJ would've allowed himself to be, excuse the expression, pussy-whipped into submission by Lady Bird. I know her family was powerful in the Lone Star State, but to be able to effect an execution, using the prescribed method originally concocted for the elimination of Castro, seems incredible, and as I said before, gives more credence to what Ed Haslam and Judyth have to say, in that regard. I NEVER SAID ANY SUCH THING AS WRITTEN ABOVE. I DID NOT SAY THAT VALENTI HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE DEATH OF STEVE BROWN. I DID NOT SAY ANY OF THE PREPOSTEROUS THINGS QUOTED OR IMPLIED. I SAID WHAT I SAID AND NOTHING ELSE. I REQUEST THAT YOU RETRACT YOUR IMPLICATION THAT I SAID THESE THINGS. I ONLY QUOTED THINGS TOLD ME BY MADELEINE. SHE DID NOT TELL ME ANY OF THESE THINGS. PLEASE REREAD WHAT I SAID. JACK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Mauro Posted July 15, 2007 Share Posted July 15, 2007 Whether or not LBJ was a conspirator or even had knowledge of an assassination plot, I submit the following two points about him:(1) He was pretty clearly politically corrupt, was he not? (2) On the other hand, he had some significant accomplishments, primarily among them the civil rights legislation of the mid-sixties. (3) Yet on the other hand, he will long be remembered for the escalation of the war in Vietnam and the incredible number of deaths on both sides of that war. Speaking of which, I want to go back to the intellectual dishonesty of Robert Strange MacNamara who David Talbot quotes as having been told by KFK that the was in Vietnam was unwinnable. I have reservations about whether MacNamara is speaking honestly about JFK's position. If he is not, he is a xxxx. But if he is, that only further indicts him as one of the architects of the war under LBJ. Back to Lady Bird, I suspect many of us here believe she probably went to her grave with at least some knowledge of facts about the assassination. *************************************************************************** He also brought electricity to the rural south during, and following The Depression, and World War II. I believe he was more a victim of circumstances when it comes to what happened to JFK, and even with the escalation of Vietnam. I honestly don't believe he actually realized what was going to happen. And, I find it inconceivable that he would have condoned it, or that it even needed his final seal of approval. It was out of his hands. Everything he was supposed to have said at the Murchison's house that night was out of sheer bravado, and more than likely aimed at RFK. Players such as Hoover, Dulles, Helms, and the rest of that team of operators, had LBJ's Achilles' heel, with all they had on him concerning prior corruption, wheeling and dealing, and Bobby Baker. I still believe he was nothing more than a corn pone hayseed who made good, strictly on his reputation as an early politician who originally set about to help the poor workers of The Depression Era. Somewhere along the way, from the early 1950's through the 1960's he made some dishonest deals, that may have even involved murder, but I'm not convinced that he was totally unaware of the havoc that was being wrought in his name. Yet, by the time he may have become aware, or learned of what his handlers had partaken in to keep him elected and in office, he more than likely found that he was in too deep, over his head, and owed too many to have been able to extract himself from the tangled web he had woven for himself. I also think that Lady Bird was merely a product of her times and of her own family's legacy. It must have been hard, even seemed futile at times, to have to stand in the footsteps JFK and Jackie had left imprinted on The White House, as well as on the heart and memory of a whole nation that had been thrust into a perpetual state of mourning. "Convince a person against their will, and they are of the same opinion still." LBainesJ was a SOAB. LBirdJ was just plain old "B". I got LOTS of lowdown on her from the late Madeleine Brown. After LBJ died, it was Bird who managed to get cut off LBJ's monthly stipend to his son, Steven Brown. Madeleine also believed it was she who had Steve "kidnapped" and injected with cancer cells. She knew about Lyndon's other love children, and used it for blackmail. She was his partner in crime. Lots more, according to Madeleine. Jack ********************************************************************** "Lots more, according to Madeleine." Words spoken of a "woman scorned," perhaps? Listen, Jack. I'm not advocating these people. I'm merely trying to put another slant on it because I don't follow the trail to Dallas, I follow it to Wall Street. But to get back to the case in point, LBJ was responsible for bringing NASA, and aeronautical research to the southland [Houston, Cape Kennedy]. Also, there were more casualties and deaths under Nixon's term, than under LBJ's. And, it was Nixon who expanded the war into Cambodia, destabilizing that country, and causing a multi-million person genocide. If the Joseph Alsop/LBJ transcripts of their telephone conversations concerning the creation of the Warren Commission are correct, then LBJ is extremely peripheral, or not involved, at all, in the assassination, except for aforeknowledge from Dulles and the Brown Brothers of Tejas. If anything, LBJ was an unwitting tool to get JFK down to Tejas into the killing field. And, if anyone should get a finger pointed at them it should be ["future" Republican party man] Connally. Maybe, Connally saw the future. Republicans were going to take control [wink, wink] via their dirty tricks campaigns. "Madeleine also believed it was she who had Steve "kidnapped" and injected with cancer cells." Statements, such as that one, only serve to give credence to what Judyth says she was involved in. "She knew about Lyndon's other love children, and used it for blackmail. She was his partner in crime." Blackmail? Of whom? Women claiming that LBJ fostered their illegitimate children? It sounds as if these women were looking to blackmail him, and Bird was only doing her part in looking out for her own family's "best interests." I'm sure it ain't as cut and dry as Madeleine Brown claimed. Thanks, Terry. Madeleine did not consider herself "a woman scorned". She still "loved" Lyndon till the end, despite knowing of his crimes. She considered Lady Bird a witch. Regarding young Steve suddenly contracting cancer and dying...I was around when it happened. Madeleine and Steve had been attending Jim Marrs' classes on the assassination, along with Jean Hill, and we all got to know them well. Steve was the image of "young Lyndon" of photographs. One Thursday night, only Jean showed up, and told the class that Madeleine had called her in a panic...STEVE HAD DISAPPEARED from Dallas. To make a long story short, about a month later, she discovered that STEVE WAS IN A HOSPITAL IN WASHINGTON DC, SUFFERING FROM AN UNKNOWN ILLNESS. How he got there was a mystery. In a few months she returned to the classes, quiet and subdued, and would not talk about Steve. About a year later he had died from cancer. She connected his strange disappearance with his death. Not many youths his age die of cancer. She blamed Lady Bird for arranging Steve's death. As for other love children, she only mentioned one (THIS IS UNVERIFIABLE) and I will repeat only what she told me. One of Lyndon's other mistresses (Madeleine thought there were several) in HOUSTON became pregnant, and Lyndon "arranged for her to marry his friend Jack Valenti". According to Madeleine Lady Bird was very aware of Lyndon's indiscretions and used them to her advantage. Maybe blackmail is not the right word, but Bird used her knowledge to influence Valenti to stay in line after LBJ was gone, according to Madeleine. She possibly also used what she knew to keep Lyndon in line. It was very clear that when Lyndon died, payments to Steven through a Dallas lawyer STOPPED because of Lady Bird. She did not want siblings popping out of the woodwork to contest the vast inheritances of Lynda Bird and Lucy Baines...HER kids. But we will never know for sure, will we? TEXAS IN THE MORNING is well worth reading. Jack ******************************************************************************** "Regarding young Steve suddenly contracting cancer and dying...I was around when it happened. Madeleine and Steve had been attending Jim Marrs' classes on the assassination, along with Jean Hill, and we all got to know them well. Steve was the image of "young Lyndon" of photographs. One Thursday night, only Jean showed up, and told the class that Madeleine had called her in a panic...STEVE HAD DISAPPEARED from Dallas. To make a long story short, about a month later, she discovered that STEVE WAS IN A HOSPITAL IN WASHINGTON DC, SUFFERING FROM AN UNKNOWN ILLNESS. How he got there was a mystery. In a few months she returned to the classes, quiet and subdued, and would not talk about Steve. About a year later he had died from cancer. She connected his strange disappearance with his death. Not many youths his age die of cancer. She blamed Lady Bird for arranging Steve's death." I've seen pictures of Steven and there was no doubt he was LBJ's son. Is it your impression that Valenti, being as close to the Johnson's as he was, may have been coerced into setting up this kidnapping, and contraction of CA into Steven's body, by dubious means a la an Ochsner, Ferrie, Mary Sherman diabolical scheme created to infect Castro? That Valenti, at the behest of Lady Bird, was able to facilitate this horrible death upon LBJ's progeny, born in the stark resemblance of her husband? Did Steven have any recollection of the abduction, was he lucid enough to remember anything surrounding his disappearance, his captors, how he ended up in D.C., the name of the hospital, was it the NIH? What condition he was in when he was found? It's preposterous, in my humble opinion, that Lady Bird was able to wield such control over LBJ and Valenti, to the point of contracting a murder on her rival's illegitimate son. It also seems preposterous that LBJ would've allowed himself to be, excuse the expression, pussy-whipped into submission by Lady Bird. I know her family was powerful in the Lone Star State, but to be able to effect an execution, using the prescribed method originally concocted for the elimination of Castro, seems incredible, and as I said before, gives more credence to what Ed Haslam and Judyth have to say, in that regard. I NEVER SAID ANY SUCH THING AS WRITTEN ABOVE. I DID NOT SAY THAT VALENTI HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE DEATH OF STEVE BROWN. I DID NOT SAY ANY OF THE PREPOSTEROUS THINGS QUOTED OR IMPLIED. I SAID WHAT I SAID AND NOTHING ELSE. I REQUEST THAT YOU RETRACT YOUR IMPLICATION THAT I SAID THESE THINGS. I ONLY QUOTED THINGS TOLD ME BY MADELEINE. SHE DID NOT TELL ME ANY OF THESE THINGS. PLEASE REREAD WHAT I SAID. JACK ********************************************************* This being the offending paragraph: "Is it your impression that Valenti, being as close to the Johnson's as he was, may have been coerced into setting up this kidnapping, and contraction of CA into Steven's body, by dubious means a la an Ochsner, Ferrie, Mary Sherman diabolical scheme created to infect Castro? That Valenti, at the behest of Lady Bird, was able to facilitate this horrible death upon LBJ's progeny, born in the stark resemblance of her husband?" I, THERESA C. MAURO, HEREBY RETRACT ALL IMPLICATIONS I MAY HAVE MADE BY POSTING THE ABOVE PARAGRAPH THAT MIGHT OR COULD BE MISCONSTRUED AS STATEMENTS HAVING BEEN MADE BY JACK WHITE. On this day, the 15th of July, in the year, 2007. Although, I am totally unaware that I made these implications in Jack's name. I am very sorry to have misinterpreted this. So much for trying to put two and two together. The text below is what prompted me to ask. Aside from the fact that Jack Valenti's name was one of the people attempting to censor the last three installments of TMWKK. He apparently wielded enough clout to do so, at Lady Bird's request, or in her name, or at her family's request, therein. "As for other love children, she only mentioned one (THIS IS UNVERIFIABLE) and I will repeat only what she told me. One of Lyndon's other mistresses (Madeleine thought there were several) in HOUSTON became pregnant, and Lyndon "arranged for her to marry his friend Jack Valenti". According to Madeleine..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack White Posted July 16, 2007 Share Posted July 16, 2007 Thanks, Terry. Perhaps my writing was not as clear as it should be. I was just trying to tell things said to me by Madeleine. I have no personal knowledge that what she said was true, and I draw no personal conclusions from it. But she was personally involved with these people, and I have found no reason to disbelieve her. I think she has been unfairly ridiculed by researchers to discredit her story. Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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