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Who was QJ/WIN


Tim Gratz
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1 hour ago, Rich Pope said:

QJ/Win is Michael Mertz who often used the name Jean Souetre.

That does not seem to be an opinion shared by anyone else. I asked you about QJWIN on another thread because you mentioned Corsican assassins. 

Soietre is French, but no matter, the others you mention were Corsican. QJWIN was more likely a contact used to hire criminals for dirty work, rather than operational himself. Also, there is some question as to whether it was one man or a small operation of some kind, since there were offices in a few cities including Los Angeles identified as QJWIN. 

The book QJWIN: Who Killed JFK and Why has not been released, and the release date has been changed several times. In addition, the authors are now both releasing books separately from each other. I’ve no idea what the backstory is, but I’m concerned. I know this because I preordered the book many months ago on Amazon, and their updated release dates make it clear that the authorship has changed. 

 

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Rich - I’ve read the documents that imply he was QJWIN. They refer to payments made to an individual named Mankel. Darned if I can find any documents on his background on the Internet. If you have some I’d like to see it. Meanwhile I would suggest that Mankel might be a cutout. Clearly the identity of QJWIN could be explosive info leading to the coup plotters. 

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Yes Rich - but the Mankel evidence is more recent. In any case if I offended you please accept my apology. 

Im actually trying to engage you because it seems that so few around here give credence to the French and Corsican connection, or to Permindex/CMC. So when you named 4 assassins I took the bait. You started this thread with your own story and seemed fearful, and you made comments implying we should all be very careful who we trust. Well, it’s hard to know isn’t it? I’ve had my doubts here several times. But I try not to broadcast them. I mean, what good can come of that?

is QJWIN important to your theory?

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9 minutes ago, Rich Pope said:

Paul,

You never offended me one bit!  You've been very kind and I appreciate that.  People are passionate about the assassination and that shouldn't be taken as an insult at all.  When people put in a lot of effort and energy researching the assassination, a certain level of ownership comes with it so if you disagree with their conclusions, they sometimes take it the wrong way.  But trust me, you have not done that to me.

Anything you want to discuss would be greatly appreciated.

Rich

Ok Rich - Thanks for that. Since a few posters think they have a handle on me, think that I’m close minded or heavy handed, and since we’re on a thread about QJWIN, I’ll share with you my working theory. 

I don’t think the operation was any one particular agency, rather individuals from many places, including CIA, Pentagon, Dallas officials. I think it was a right wing coup designed to thwart any attempts to change the status quo, which was the Cold War and the corporate profits it created. JFK was moving too far towards peace. The shooters were outsourced through QJWIN and ZRRIFLE - Bill Harvey. Dallas officials got JFK into the kill zone where a military style triangulation of fire ambush awaited. Not everything went smoothly after the fact - clearly. I don’t see that as proof that the organizers were low level. Who ordered the hit? I believe the pecking order is Pentagon first, in this case US Army. The attempts on DeGaulle seem to me to be a window into how things went down. You mentioned Frenchman Jean Souetre. Did you know that as a representative of the French renegade OAS, he visited Banister in New Orleans and Walker in Dallas in 1963? Banister sent money to OAS. Who else was funding OAS? According to DeGaulle and SDECE it was Permindex and Centro Mondiale Commerciale.

Ive been reading Mort Sahl’s book Heartland. He spent 4 years with Garrison, who he says referred to the US security establishment as the Fourth Reich. Even if one finds quotes of Garrison blaming the CIA, it’s far too limited a view of Garison’s theory. He indicted Clay Shaw without knowing that Shaw was a CIA asset. I’m not sure he had any idea of Permindex ties with European fascists. Where I’m going with this is to suggest that the conspiracy was supranational. Walker and Banister were clearly tied to an International right wing movement. Anti-Communism was the overall rationale, but we should not forget that US southern racists used antiCommunism as a cover for their segregationist views. Strange bedfellows within the worldwide antiCommunist movement were not really so strange. International Drug trade generating huge profits to the international banking community, post war Nazis and fascists well funded by the careful and crafty Martin Bormann and his organization, interlocking corporate directorships that led to very few Nazis actually being punished for their crimes, secret deals between Allen Dulles and many Nazis including Reinhardt Gehlen. I could go on, but I’m sure you get the picture of how I see the backdrop to the milieu that fought JFK and ultimately killed him. 

How was the order handed down? I don’t know. We never will. There is no document, no paper trail. I imagine that the actual orders were verbal, and came from corporate leaders to the military. 

What do you think happened? 

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3 minutes ago, Paul Brancato said:

Ok Rich - Thanks for that. Since a few posters think they have a handle on me, think that I’m close minded or heavy handed, and since we’re on a thread about QJWIN, I’ll share with you my working theory. 

I don’t think the operation was any one particular agency, rather individuals from many places, including CIA, Pentagon, Dallas officials. I think it was a right wing coup designed to thwart any attempts to change the status quo, which was the Cold War and the corporate profits it created. JFK was moving too far towards peace. The shooters were outsourced through QJWIN and ZRRIFLE - Bill Harvey. Dallas officials got JFK into the kill zone where a military style triangulation of fire ambush awaited. Not everything went smoothly after the fact - clearly. I don’t see that as proof that the organizers were low level. Who ordered the hit? I believe the pecking order is Pentagon first, in this case US Army. The attempts on DeGaulle seem to me to be a window into how things went down. You mentioned Frenchman Jean Souetre. Did you know that as a representative of the French renegade OAS, he visited Banister in New Orleans and Walker in Dallas in 1963? Banister sent money to OAS. Who else was funding OAS? According to DeGaulle and SDECE it was Permindex and Centro Mondiale Commerciale.

Ive been reading Mort Sahl’s book Heartland. He spent 4 years with Garrison, who he says referred to the US security establishment as the Fourth Reich. Even if one finds quotes of Garrison blaming the CIA, it’s far too limited a view of Garison’s theory. He indicted Clay Shaw without knowing that Shaw was a CIA asset. I’m not sure he had any idea of Permindex ties with European fascists. Where I’m going with this is to suggest that the conspiracy was supranational. Walker and Banister were clearly tied to an International right wing movement. Anti-Communism was the overall rationale, but we should not forget that US southern racists used antiCommunism as a cover for their segregationist views. Strange bedfellows within the worldwide antiCommunist movement were not really so strange. International Drug trade generating huge profits to the international banking community, post war Nazis and fascists well funded by the careful and crafty Martin Bormann and his organization, interlocking corporate directorships that led to very few Nazis actually being punished for their crimes, secret deals between Allen Dulles and many Nazis including Reinhardt Gehlen. I could go on, but I’m sure you get the picture of how I see the backdrop to the milieu that fought JFK and ultimately killed him. 

How was the order handed down? I don’t know. We never will. There is no document, no paper trail. I imagine that the actual orders were verbal, and came from corporate leaders to the military. 

What do you think happened? 

That is excellent, Paul. Thank you.

One question,

Do you see the Navy, or ONI, as having put a few necessary grams on the scale that led to the tip?

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54 minutes ago, Michael Clark said:

That is excellent, Paul. Thank you.

One question,

Do you see the Navy, or ONI, as having put a few necessary grams on the scale that led to the tip?

I’m not exactly sure what you mean. But in any case I don’t see strict divisions between branches of military, or between military and CIA. They work together. 

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4 minutes ago, Paul Brancato said:

I’m not exactly sure what you mean. But in any case I don’t see strict divisions between branches of military, or between military and CIA. They work together. 

Ok.

You said: "Who ordered the hit? I believe the pecking order is Pentagon first, in this case the US Army. "

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Paul Brancato said:

 You mentioned Frenchman Jean Souetre. Did you know that as a representative of the French renegade OAS, he visited Banister in New Orleans and Walker in Dallas in 1963?

Paul,

 

Jean-Rene said he was never in the U.S. He said that in the 1970's, 1980's and 1990's.

 

Steve Thomas

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1 minute ago, Steve Thomas said:

Paul,

 

Jean-Rene said he was never in the U.S. He said that in the 1970's, 1980's and 1990's.

 

Steve Thomas

You mean Souetre?

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Thanks for the info that he denied being in the US. What do you make of the whole French story - that he had been in Dallas, info coming from French Intelligence? Or Fensterwald’s FOIA request detailing Souetre’s visits? Do you believe him when he says he wasn’t in the US? Or are you just adding his denial to the mix? 

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28 minutes ago, Paul Brancato said:

Thanks for the info that he denied being in the US. What do you make of the whole French story - that he had been in Dallas, info coming from French Intelligence? Or Fensterwald’s FOIA request detailing Souetre’s visits? Do you believe him when he says he wasn’t in the US? Or are you just adding his denial to the mix? 

Paul,

 

Read this document carefully. The French said that he had been expelled from either Fort Worth or Dallas within 48 hours of the assassination. They also said that they didn't know if he had been expelled to either Canada or Mexico.

Sandwiched in the middle of those two unclear statements is this definitive line, "He was in Fort Worth on the morning of 22 November and in Dallas in the afternoon."

 

This last sentence does not say that this information came from the French.

How could the French be so hazy or unclear about the information in the first two sentences, but so declarative about the last?

I think that last sentence was cleverly inserted by the CIA into the information the French had provided to the FBI.

 

cia-souetre.jpg.27eb050a8cefceca7e3296e18797a5e3.jpg

 

Steve Thomas

 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Steve Thomas said:

Paul,

 

Read this document carefully. The French said that he had been expelled from either Fort Worth or Dallas within 48 hours of the assassination. They also said that they didn't know if he had been expelled to either Canada or Mexico.

Sandwiched in the middle of those two unclear statements is this definitive line, "He was in Fort Worth on the morning of 22 November and in Dallas in the afternoon."

 

This last sentence does not say that this information came from the French.

How could the French be so hazy or unclear about the information in the first two sentences, but so declarative about the last?

I think that last sentence was cleverly inserted by the CIA into the information the French had provided to the FBI.

 

cia-souetre.jpg.27eb050a8cefceca7e3296e18797a5e3.jpg

 

Steve Thomas

 

 

 

I’ve noticed the strange wording but didn’t suspect an insertion. What do you make of that? 

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Just now, Paul Brancato said:

I’ve noticed the strange wording but didn’t suspect an insertion. What do you make of that? 

Paul,

 

You asked me, " Do you believe him when he says he wasn’t in the US? Or are you just adding his denial to the mix?"

 

Larry Hancock once asked me if I thought  Souetre was an assassin, and I told him no. I told Larry that I think Jean-Rene was a patriot, as he understood patriotism to be; but an assassin, no. At this stage, I believe him when he says he wasn't here in the U.S.

 

As far as Document 632-796, we don't know who wrote it, or when. This is only one paragraph of a larger document that the CIA did not see fit to provide.

Why?

 

Steve Thomas

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