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Alterationists: Thoughts from Gary Mack.


Guest Duncan MacRae

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Agreed, I'm also most interested in the timing of Lee's entry to this Forum...coincidence, or just in time to cast a very hidden doubt on those who think the Z-film and many others [motion and still] were altered by the very same persons [entities] that murdered our President and our Polity. Just wondering out loud.....

Peter, I don’t understand the point you are making. Are you suggesting that anyone who disagrees with Jack is part of some sort of conspiracy? Why cannot people like Lee be able to disagree with Jack?

Conversely why cannot people like Jack be able to disagree with Lee...or anyone else?

You can disagree with me whenever you want Jack. I haven't got any issue with you personally.

I will argue against some of your "beliefs" and things you consider "facts" in the Kennedy Assassination and disagree with them in the manner I see fit at that moment in time.

I think some of the messages addressed to you over the last day or two have gone over the line somewhat but I don't think you do yourself any favours sometimes.

The above message from John was actually written in reply to Mr/Mrs/Ms Lemkin's detestable comments about me and motives for joining this board.

Hope you're well

Lee

ah, you're being patronizing there Lee. Argue beliefs? How the hell do you do that?

Listen, some here have been studying this case since before you were born. Most here are looking for answers, NOT childish, distracting debate. That's for the junior varsity and there's particularly plenty of those lone nut trolls here... and they ALL love to argue... (there's a reason this forum does as well as it does and it's called the Zapruder film)

Do us a favor layout some of your Lee Harvey Oswald material. Anything new and exciting? Let's see what you have? And please, develop a thicker skin, especially if you plan on sticking around...

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Agreed, I'm also most interested in the timing of Lee's entry to this Forum...coincidence, or just in time to cast a very hidden doubt on those who think the Z-film and many others [motion and still] were altered by the very same persons [entities] that murdered our President and our Polity. Just wondering out loud.....

Peter, I don’t understand the point you are making. Are you suggesting that anyone who disagrees with Jack is part of some sort of conspiracy? Why cannot people like Lee be able to disagree with Jack?

Conversely why cannot people like Jack be able to disagree with Lee...or anyone else?

You can disagree with me whenever you want Jack. I haven't got any issue with you personally.

I will argue against some of your "beliefs" and things you consider "facts" in the Kennedy Assassination and disagree with them in the manner I see fit at that moment in time.

I think some of the messages addressed to you over the last day or two have gone over the line somewhat but I don't think you do yourself any favours sometimes.

The above message from John was actually written in reply to Mr/Mrs/Ms Lemkin's detestable comments about me and motives for joining this board.

Hope you're well

Lee

Why the insults to Peter calling him Mrs/Ms? Peter teaches at the college level in Europe and

was researching JFK before you were born. I am surprised you did not include ethnic slurs

against this fine man.

Jack

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I'll be studying it after you're gone Healy.

9 out of 10 of your contributions on this forum are pathetic and pitiful. I can only assume your obsession with trolls is because you perhaps look like one? Do me a favour? Change your picture. It does nothing for what little credibility you have left as a photography "expert" and it makes me feel sick.

And the day I ever do as you tell me to do is the day I'll go and ask for professional mental health treatment.

Don't ever try to tell me what to do again. Okay?

your unworthy of all this attention your receiving, Lee. Sure you haven't tried to float your LHO script to some unsuspecting theatrical organization? :lol:

Carry on son, we know where you stand or lie?

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I'll be studying it after you're gone Healy.

9 out of 10 of your contributions on this forum are pathetic and pitiful. I can only assume your obsession with trolls is because you perhaps look like one? Do me a favour? Change your picture. It does nothing for what little credibility you have left as a photography "expert" and it makes me feel sick.

And the day I ever do as you tell me to do is the day I'll go and ask for professional mental health treatment.

Don't ever try to tell me what to do again. Okay?

your unworthy of all this attention your receiving, Lee. Sure you haven't tried to float your LHO script to some unsuspecting theatrical organization? :lol:

Carry on son, we know where you stand or lie?

Don't you have the thick skin you want others to have David?

son, when you publish get back to me... till then, continue taking pages out of the David Von Pein playbook. P.S. he can't write either....

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I'll be studying it after you're gone Healy.

9 out of 10 of your contributions on this forum are pathetic and pitiful. I can only assume your obsession with trolls is because you perhaps look like one? Do me a favour? Change your picture. It does nothing for what little credibility you have left as a photography "expert" and it makes me feel sick.

And the day I ever do as you tell me to do is the day I'll go and ask for professional mental health treatment.

Don't ever try to tell me what to do again. Okay?

This is BS, this guy should be banned

Dont ever talk to Mr Healy like that

Your a nobody

You know nothing

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I'll be studying it after you're gone Healy.

9 out of 10 of your contributions on this forum are pathetic and pitiful. I can only assume your obsession with trolls is because you perhaps look like one? Do me a favour? Change your picture. It does nothing for what little credibility you have left as a photography "expert" and it makes me feel sick.

And the day I ever do as you tell me to do is the day I'll go and ask for professional mental health treatment.

Don't ever try to tell me what to do again. Okay?

This is BS, this guy should be banned

Dont ever talk to Mr Healy like that

Your a nobody

You know nothing

Living up to your own high expectations again.

Thats right

The real reason you are here is coming out now, at first your stupid sideways comments about alteration almost let you slide in under the door

But your real reason is to attack Jack and others who believe in alteration

Your not a researcher, your not a student of the assassination, you dont care about JFK or the crime at all

Your last 5 posts have made that perfectly clear

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I'll be studying it after you're gone Healy.

9 out of 10 of your contributions on this forum are pathetic and pitiful. I can only assume your obsession with trolls is because you perhaps look like one? Do me a favour? Change your picture. It does nothing for what little credibility you have left as a photography "expert" and it makes me feel sick.

And the day I ever do as you tell me to do is the day I'll go and ask for professional mental health treatment.

Don't ever try to tell me what to do again. Okay?

This is BS, this guy should be banned

Dont ever talk to Mr Healy like that

Your a nobody

You know nothing

Living up to your own high expectations again.

Lee...you got off on the wrong foot here. Take a long nap and start all over. Tell us about

your JFK research and what you believe. Maybe some have been too quick to judge because

of that chip on your shoulder. Take a long breath. Count ten. Forget the past. Start again.

If you are genuine, you can do it. Many researchers are misunderstood.

Jack

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I'll be studying it after you're gone Healy.

9 out of 10 of your contributions on this forum are pathetic and pitiful. I can only assume your obsession with trolls is because you perhaps look like one? Do me a favour? Change your picture. It does nothing for what little credibility you have left as a photography "expert" and it makes me feel sick.

And the day I ever do as you tell me to do is the day I'll go and ask for professional mental health treatment.

Don't ever try to tell me what to do again. Okay?

This is BS, this guy should be banned

Dont ever talk to Mr Healy like that

Your a nobody

You know nothing

Living up to your own high expectations again.

Thats right

The real reason you are here is coming out now, at first your stupid sideways comments about alteration almost let you slide in under the door

But your real reason is to attack Jack and others who believe in alteration

Your not a researcher, your not a student of the assassination, you dont care about JFK or the crime at all

Your last 5 posts have made that perfectly clear

That's called fighting back. Like you're doing now. Nothing like hypocrisy in living color.

So you think its ok to talk to David like that?

Its not ok

I was all for answering your questions and helping you with any research you might be doing up until you decided to insult David

And David can defend himself, but im letting you know that I think its BS, and the only people on this forum that you target are alteratonits

The fact that you attcked him like that shows me that you are here for one reason, to cause problems

Edited by Dean Hagerman
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David

In response to your post above I over-reacted. I apologize. Was at the end of my tether with insinuations and snapped. I feel your post could have been worded better and less patronizing but I went OTT.

Lee

Thanks, Lee. I thought we were gonna lose you there for a second. I agree with Jack for a change in that sometimes things get heated and we all need to take a deep breath. The alterationists totally believe they have proved their case, and are deeply suspicious of anyone as yet not convinced, and arguing against them. Healy, in particular, enjoys taking the P out of those arguing against alteration, even though he himself is not entirely convinced by many of the arguments.

In a better world, we'd all be more civil, but this isn't that world.

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  • 1 month later...
Pam,

Duncan asked permission from Gary to post this--Gary did not ask him to.

Many people post what others say. Can we look at content instead of folks involved?

Since this is an important subject, we need all of the information we can get.

Thanks, Duncan!!

Kathy

So Duncan has an association with Gary Mack. How would he have found out what Von Pein said unless Gary Mack told him? So Gary Mack gets to post things on the sly. When was the last time he posted something himself -- about anything?

Kathy C (The Gary Macker) :huh:

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Information received from David Von Pein. Permission granted to me by Gary Mack to post on the Education Forum.

Email:

I am continually astonished at how little the alterationists know

about the Zapruder film and its history. Now, led by Doug Horne and

others, they are whining about needing a test film from the Zapruder

camera to see if its images have the same camera artifacts as the

assassination film. Their "thinking" is that the test film won't

match and that will prove the original film is a fake. But many such

original reels exist and most, if not all, have been available at the

National Archives for decades!

The alterationists didn't know, until I told Duncan MacRae, that the

Zapruder camera was used by the FBI for re-creations in Dealey Plaza

on May 23-24, 1964, and that the resulting film reels are at NARA II

in College Park, MD. The films presumably contain similar

intersprocket images and artifacts as those in the assassination

film. (The extremely poor quality You Tube version of one of the

reels is not an accurate representation of its image quality.)

How could the alterationists not know that? The man the FBI assigned

to investigate and analyze the assassination films, Lyndal Shaneyfelt,

testified that he used the original Zapruder, Orville Nix and Marie

Muchmore cameras. There are news films and photographs showing those

cameras sitting atop the Zapruder pedestal the day of the test!

Nor, apparently, do the alterationists know about other test reels

shot with the Zapruder camera within days and years of the

assassination. As noted in The Sixth Floor Museum's Zapruder

chronology [linked below:]

Zapruder Film Chronology

the FBI first borrowed Zapruder's camera on December 4, 1963, for

testing. "On December 20, the bureau concluded, 'This camera when

operated at normal 'run' speed operates at 18.3 frames per second.'

This 'clock' was later used to determine the timing of specific events

as seen in the film."

The timing test, which was duplicated by Bell & Howell in December

1966, involved loading the camera and filming a clock with an accurate

second hand, then counting the number of frames that were exposed over

specific times. Barring any peculiarity with the lighting on the

clocks, all such test reels will certainly reveal the same

intersprocket images and artifacts as Mr. Zapruder's famous film.

What all this means is that when Zapruder's camera was still in the

same condition as the day of the assassination, and when Kodachrome II

film and processing were easily available, government and private

company investigations of the operating characteristics yielded

multiple test reels that can be studied and measured.

There was no need in 1996 for the ARRB to borrow Zapruder's camera for

use in Dallas, nor was there a need in 2000 for Rollie Zavada to use

it for his follow-up study of the original film. There was no need

because test films already existed and they are available for

examination in one form or another.

And yet, the alterationists remain completely ignorant of their

existence. Amazing!

Gary Mack

It isn't amazing that there exists at least two films made from Zapruder's camera in the NARA that can be forensically compared to the extant original Z-film, and "alterantionists" appear ignorant of that fact, what's amazing is the HSCA, the ARRB, Zavada and everyone else who thinks this important, including the Sixth Floor Museum, have not had these films forensically compared to the original Z-film at the NARA.

It's not the responsiblity of the "alterationists" to do this, but it was the responsiblity of the HSCA, the ARRB and those who maintain the uncontested chain of custody of this film to do it.

And apparently it has yet to be done.

Bill Kelly

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