Judyth Vary Baker: Living in Exile

[Greg Burnham]

It appears to me that Jim's passion causes him to express his profound frustration in ways that are less than effective at times. However, his considerable contribution to this thread's substance far outweighs those outbursts. In fact, some (but not all) of those outbursts are quite understandable, IMO.

On the other hand, there are those who have contributed virtually nothing--or next to nothing--to the substance of the thread that are posting nearly 100% ad hominem attacks against him--the attacks aren't even against Judyth! I would think that one's legacy in any thread should reside in their contribution of substance to the resolution of the debate, rather than their penchant for targeting any individual.

[Glenn Viklund]

On the other hand, there are those who have contributed virtually nothing--or next to nothing--to the substance of the thread that are posting nearly 100% ad hominem attacks against him--the attacks aren't even against Judyth! I would think that one's legacy in any thread should reside in their contribution of substance to the resolution of the debate, rather than their penchant for targeting any individual.

Greg,

It's really nice that you like Jimmy.

But I think, honestly, we know that by now.

Glenn

[Guest James H. Fetzer]

CONCLUDING REFLECTIONS FROM MY PSY OPS EXPERT

The perfect Cover Story for closing Ochsner's Program down, instituting a complete cover-up, and taking the program super deep black

What a perfect cover story for shutting down Ochsner's program>>>AN ACCIDENT with the particle accelerator at the lab. A horrendous accident that requires the immediate mercy killing of the victim, so that if any real investigation is allowed it will lead to Ochsner and/or his key subordinates as either murderers or accessories to murder and accessories after the fact (this is best described as a "situationally mandated human compromise" involving an unwilling murderer(s) who must act out of compassion and have a long term motivation to keep silent about everything even peripherally associated).

And of course Inca could be linked to the JFK Assassination and to Ochsner and his associate Oswald too if necessary. So you can see that the super-slick intel faction did a pretty good job creating massive motivation for everyone to keep quiet about Ochsner's program and refrain from any investigation which could easily bring down the whole Ochsner clinic and the whole public health system.

Jim, these extraordinary historical mega-event turning points (like the JFK assassination) which redirect history are almost always a convergence of motives between the powerful super-elites and factions at the very top of the shadow govt. LBJ was perhaps the final catalyst and it is likely the the super-slick faction manipulated circumstances to bring immediate legal threats against him related to the Bobby Baker boxcar leases for boxcars that never existed. Now this is how these super-slick intel folk's work. They play all sides against the middle and manipulate conditions and settings to obtain the outcomes they want.

The bottom line is this Jim. The super-slicks realized that Dr. Sherman had either discovered the cure for the viral chains contaminating the vaccines or was very close, and knew that she was basically an honest honorable person who would talk to the WC investigators when they met with her. They knew she would tell the truth of what she knew to them only and they did not want it in any record. They also realized that the program needed to be taken completely deep black (above top secret).

They had come to understand that DNA and RNA warfare was their key to total spectrum dominance at home and in the battlefield in the future and the ultimate cure for overpopulation and a pesky public and congress that might did too deep into their affairs. They also understood that the vaccine contaminated with viral chains needed to be continued to make the cancer industry strong as well as big medicine and big pharma too. Big profits were at stake. And of course the potential for controlled eugenics and mind control was now well within reach.

One key lead which could be followed would be to find where the particle accelerator was moved too. It is unlikely equipment that expensive would be junked. It may have been moved to a super-secure base such as at Fort Detrick, MD Army Biological Weapons Laboratory, Dugway proving grounds, Dulce NM underground base or area 51 S9 papoose lake in Nevada or some other facility, or may have been sold to a close foreign ally like Israel (hint, hint).

Anyone who studies big pharma and its history in detail soon realizes that there is a big involvement of the wall street Nazi sympathizers who financed the Nazi movement starting in the 1920's and "traded with that enemy" throughout WW2.

Well Jim, by now you can see that by your focusing on Ed Haslam's excellent research and the important history provided by JVB, you have taken the JFK assassination to a whole new level and in a whole new direction. You have now thrown the current work of several major researchers into full tilt and shown that they were pursuing the wrong trail. And these folks are in shock and dismay because of it. And then you have the usual cadre of WC apologists and Lone Nutters that for years have kept pushing their company lines whether they knew they were dupes or not or even worked as an asset of the company, which some clearly have. Finally Jim you have driven a stake through the heart of their nefarious nonsensical arguments. And they are hopping mad and are attempting to discredit you and insult you at every opportunity. Their arguments are empty and their true colors are now openly displayed for all who love truth to see. These folks are doofuses and have collapsed under their own absurdities.

You have picked up where Garrison has left off. And you have taken the JFK Assassination investigation in a whole new, unexpected direction which has FULLY EXPOSED THE INTERSECTION OF THE MOB, INTEL, THE MILITARY, THE US PUBLIC HEATH SERVICE, BIG PHARMA, THE CANCER INSTITUTE AND BIG MEDICINE.

Highest commendations are due to you, Ed Haslam and Judyth Vary for making such groundbreaking excellent contributions.

Jim, this recent breakthrough in the JFK Assassination is the biggest discovery in the last twenty years and DIRECTLY TIES TO THE CURRENT HEALTH OF THE US POPULATION, CURRENT VACCINATIONS, EUGENICS, SUPER DEEP BLACK ADVANCED BIO-WARFARE, BIG PHARMA, AND BIG MEDICINE.

Could this discovery and new turn in the JFK Investigation be any bigger than this????

No wonder such long term and extensive psyops have been brought against JVB over so many years and no wonder so many WC apologists, Lone-Nutters and others have tried to discredit yours and Judyth Vary's postings on the Educational Forum even resorting to petty insults and glaring lies against you and Judyth Vary.

Jim, you turned the Educational Forum into a temporary and very large Rorshach Inkblot Test and hooked many enemies of the truth without their understanding that they took the bait. This gives you a big snapshot into how cover-ups are run long term. You hooked the doofuses and elicited them to give themselves away. And you also exposed some researchers who have likely been going off down the wrong rabbit hole.

Again congratulations for hitting another grand slam home run. I am most appreciative of your continuing and excellent work for the last 20 years I have followed it.

Edited April 26, 2010 by James H. Fetzer

[Kevin Greenlee]

Ms. Baker-

you wrote "AFTER A DECADE, THE PETTINESS OF THE ARGUMENTS THROWN AGAINS ME ARE ALL FOCUSED ON ONE THING: CHARACTER ASSASSINATION. FIND SOMETHING--ANYTHING--TO DISCREDIT HER."

i hope you will agree that that description does not apply to me. where others (justifiably, in my view) focused on the weakest elements of your account, i looked at that portion of it that mr. fetzer deemed to be the strongest- the list of 17 points. the first point- that you were lured to new orleans by dr. ochsner- was one he claimed was both important and well supported. so i asked him to support it. he responded by repeatedly attacking me. this proves to me he does not have the evidence to support the claim. do you? if so, i would love to see it.

mr. burnham-

it is true that mr. fetzer is coming under heavy attack here. i suggests the attacks come because of the tone he has created. he has, for instance, said many unpleasant things about me- apparently because i asked him to share evidence for a claim he described as "well supported." was that an unreasonable question on my part? now he accuses me- without evidence- of posting another man's words under my own name. that is an attack on my integrity. am i to sit back and ignore that just because some might feel mr. fetzer has contributed more of substance to the thread? does contributing "substance" give you a right to belittle and attack others? leave me out of it- a few posts back he described kathy as "someone incapable of thinking." are people supposed to sit back and silently tolerate that sort of bullying behavior?

mr. fetzer-

in my last post, i wondered if you had the integrity to retract or back up your groundless accusation that Josiah thompson is the secret author of my posts. you did not- why does that not surprise me?

you also suggested i am not familiar with your work. that is not true. due to circumstances not within my control, i listened to every single one of your appearances on black op radio- more than once. since then, i have maintained an occasional morbid fascination with your work not only in the JFK case but also 9/11 (ironically enough, mr. fetzer, you will recall that your stature amongst 9/11 truthers took a severe blow after you advocated for the ridiculous theories of an unusual woman named Judy. history repeats itself!).

glenn-

what excuse do you think jim 'n' judy will offer for not letting the book barb posted be subjected to handwriting analysis?

[Glenn Viklund]

Jim, you turned the Educational Forum into a temporary and very large Rorshach Inkblot Test and hooked many enemies of the truth without their understanding that they took the bait. This gives you a big snapshot into how cover-ups are run long term. You hooked the doofuses and elicited them to give themselves away. And you also exposed some researchers who have likely been going off down the wrong rabbit hole.

Again congratulations for hitting another grand slam home run. I am most appreciative of your continuing and excellent work for the last 20 years I have followed it.[/b]

"Finally Jim you have driven a stake through the heart of their nefarious nonsensical arguments. And they are hopping mad and are attempting to discredit you and insult you at every opportunity. Their arguments are empty and their true colors are now openly displayed for all who love truth to see. These folks are doofuses and have collapsed under their own absurdities."

Yup, he knows what he's talking about. You are sent from heaven and the rest of us are evil. Agreed.

Edited April 25, 2010 by Glenn Viklund

[Glenn Viklund]

Ms. Baker-

you wrote "AFTER A DECADE, THE PETTINESS OF THE ARGUMENTS THROWN AGAINS ME ARE ALL FOCUSED ON ONE THING: CHARACTER ASSASSINATION. FIND SOMETHING--ANYTHING--TO DISCREDIT HER."

i hope you will agree that that description does not apply to me. where others (justifiably, in my view) focused on the weakest elements of your account, i looked at that portion of it that mr. fetzer deemed to be the strongest- the list of 17 points. the first point- that you were lured to new orleans by dr. ochsner- was one he claimed was both important and well supported. so i asked him to support it. he responded by repeatedly attacking me. this proves to me he does not have the evidence to support the claim. do you? if so, i would love to see it.

mr. burnham-

it is true that mr. fetzer is coming under heavy attack here. i suggests the attacks come because of the tone he has created. he has, for instance, said many unpleasant things about me- apparently because i asked him to share evidence for a claim he described as "well supported." was that an unreasonable question on my part? now he accuses me- without evidence- of posting another man's words under my own name. that is an attack on my integrity. am i to sit back and ignore that just because some might feel mr. fetzer has contributed more of substance to the thread? does contributing "substance" give you a right to belittle and attack others? leave me out of it- a few posts back he described kathy as "someone incapable of thinking." are people supposed to sit back and silently tolerate that sort of bullying behavior?

mr. fetzer-

in my last post, i wondered if you had the integrity to retract or back up your groundless accusation that Josiah thompson is the secret author of my posts. you did not- why does that not surprise me?

you also suggested i am not familiar with your work. that is not true. due to circumstances not within my control, i listened to every single one of your appearances on black op radio- more than once. since then, i have maintained an occasional morbid fascination with your work not only in the JFK case but also 9/11 (ironically enough, mr. fetzer, you will recall that your stature amongst 9/11 truthers took a severe blow after you advocated for the ridiculous theories of an unusual woman named Judy. history repeats itself!).

glenn-

what excuse do you think jim 'n' judy will offer for not letting the book barb posted be subjected to handwriting analysis?

Kevin,

I'd rather not know. Like most of us, I've seen it all.

The two of them are, as has been said, a match made in heaven.

On the other hand, Barb has continously demolished JudyFetz and their crap, so I do have faith..hehe.. still.

Edited April 25, 2010 by Glenn Viklund

[William Kelly]

Prof. Fetzer has stated that I have endorsed the idea that the particle accellerator was at David Ferrie's apartment. I have done no such thing.

I accept the fact that it was at the Public Health Hospital, and I ask two questions:

1) Who is the OTHER Judyh Vary Baker who Ed Haslam met?

2) Why did Oswald make a fake vaccine card from the Public Health Hospital bearing the name of Dr. Alek Hidell?

What could he have possibly used it for?

And my questions are not directed at Prof. Fetzer, who doesn't seem to be able to undertand anything and makes simple things confusing.

BK

QUOTE (Jack White @ Apr 22 2010, 05:16 PM)

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.ph...&pid=190450

But Jim...Mary Sherman died at home in her apartment. If the LINEAR ACCELERATOR was located in the Public Health Hospital, how could it have been responsible for her death?

Have you read the reports of her death?

In post #1479, I identified the location of the linear particle accelerator:

None of it can be known with certainty, but the basic elements are very strongly supported. It would be a mistake to suppose that every aspect of her story has to be supported to the same degree as every other. Among the 17 findings that Haslam enumerates, which I have reiterated above, the most important and best supported concern Judyth's ability to conduct reseach on cancer, that she was induced to come to New Orleans by Alton Ochsner, that she met and worked with Mary Sherman, David Ferrie, and Lee Oswald, that Mary was killed by a massive source of electricity (almost certainly the linear particle accelerator at the Public Health Hospital), and that Judyth was summarily dismissed by Ochsner after she complained about the prisoner who was used in a (fatal) experiment conducted without informed consent.

In post #1495, he asks if the accelerator was located in Ferrie's apartment or lab across the street. Not to put too fine a point on it but, given this post, how can post #1474 be truthful?

QUOTE (Jack White @ Apr 22 2010, 04:32 PM)

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.ph...&pid=190422

Here is a LINEAR PARTICLE ACCELERATOR. Did David Ferrie have his in his apartment

or his laboratory across the street?

Jack

I still have two unanswered questions on the table.

Who was the OTHER Judyth Vary Baker who Ed Haslam met?

And why did Oswald forge a fake vaccine card with Dr. Alek Hidel's name on it from the

US Public Service Hospital in New Orleans?

What could he have possibly used this card for? Was it necessary to get a visa to Mexico? Did he want to establish the existence of Dr. Hidell? Can anyone think of another good reason to create such a card?

Oswald reportedly checked out this hospital as a potential place for his second daughter to be born, but that plan was thwarted when Marina wrote to Ruth Paine via Art Young and said she would go with her to Texas for the baby to be born.

This is the hospital where the partical accellerator was said to be located, the one that killed Mary Sherman, though according to EH she was moved to her apartment to make it appear she was the victim of an intruder.

Of course there is the world's largest and new particle accellerator in Switzerland that also recently made the news:

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=15727

A would-be saboteur arrested today at the Large Hadron Collider in Switzerland made the bizarre claim that he was from the future. Eloi Cole, a strangely dressed young man, said that he had travelled back in time to prevent the LHC from destroying the world.

http://crave.cnet.co.uk/gadgets/0,39029552,49305387,00.htm

The LHC successfully collided particles at record force earlier this week, a milestone Mr Cole was attempting to disrupt by stopping supplies of Mountain Dew to the experiment's vending machines. He also claimed responsibility for the infamous baguette sabotage in November last year.

Mr Cole was seized by Swiss police after CERN security guards spotted him rooting around in bins. He explained that he was looking for fuel for his 'time machine power unit', a device that resembled a kitchen blender.

Police said Mr Cole, who was wearing a bow tie and rather too much tweed for his age, would not reveal his country of origin. "Countries do not exist where I am from. The discovery of the Higgs boson led to limitless power, the elimination of poverty and Kit-Kats for everyone. It is a communist chocolate hellhole and I'm here to stop it ever happening."

This isn't the first time time-travel has been blamed for mishaps at the LHC. Last year, the Japanese physicist Masao Ninomiya and Danish string-theory pioneer Holger Bech Nielsen put forward the hypothesis that the Higgs boson was so "abhorrent" that it somehow caused a ripple in time that prevented its own discovery.

Professor Brian Cox, a former CERN physicist and full-time rock'n'roll TV scientist, was sympathetic to Mr Cole. "Bless him, he sounds harmless enough. At least he didn't mention bloody black holes."

Mr Cole was taken to a secure mental health facility in Geneva but later disappeared from his cell. Police are baffled, but not that bothered.

[Glenn Viklund]

Jimmy,

I'll repeat this;

"It's quite nice to be mediocre. Nice to be a "nobody". I really enjoy being on top of expectations as a nobody; you, on the other hand, is a "somebody" who continuosly fail to meet expectations. So, let me ask you again, are you sure you want to enter the ring, about her asylum issues? A good advice would be to never enter the ring; you are bound to lose. "

Let's discuss the asylum issue, where you claim some dishonest doings of mine.

Which part of these dishonest claims is it that you want me to paste a copy to Edu?

Please let me know.

[Kathleen Collins]

Kathy,

Have you ever done any research? Did you think I had to read HARVEY & LEE to find the pages that concern "Lee"'s alleged "missing tooth"? Are you aware the book is organized in chronological fashion, that I had asked Jack to tell me the alleged differences between them, and that, when I encountered this "missing tooth" business, I tracked it down?

I mean, really! I have published more than 150 articles and reviews, my 29th book will appear next month, and I have received many honors and awards for my research. Yet you think JUDYTH would have to point out passages for me? I dare say, you have utterly no idea what you are talking about. Judyth does not even have a copy of HARVEY & LEE!

Did it even cross your mind that, after my reply to Dixie Dea in post #1575, which repeated points I had made in earlier posts, Judyth responded separately in post #1598? Would it have made sense for us to make separate posts if we were in synch about this? You appear to be a dear, but one more example of someone incapable of thinking things through.

Jim

Have I ever done any research? In my own limited (i.e., money) way, yes. As a matter of fact, the book we're discussing now I began to proof-read for a second edition. The reprint never happened. But I'm very well-versed in Harvey and Lee.

What happened to Lee after he was flown out of Dallas? John Armstrong believed he came back after a time with the name Donald O. Norton. Armstrong literally chased this guy around the country because of this belief. Yet, I don't know how Armstrong found out about Donald O. Norton, but he wasn't going to publish this part of the story unless he had absolute proof.

Now when I was on Rich's forum, the belief was the man people thought was Lee Oswald (Donald O. Norton) was a redhead and had a brother also a redhead. I believe that I have photos of Norton, which I found on the Internet, knowing his interests. I also saw a photo of a curious-looking man and as the photo came downwards the name was "Ralph Geb." I wrote the name down and googled it later on and was shocked. "Ralph Geb" was involved with impersonating LHO before the assassination.

I felt this was important, but nobody seemed interested. Rich had gotten seriously ill. He said to me he didn't care if Lee Oswald showed up that day and confessed.

I wish John Armstrong would write his book on Donald O. Norton.

Since 1979 I became interested in a murder that was committed in Nov. 1963 in West Hollywood. Karyn Kupcinet was the daughter of Chicago columnist and talk show host, Irv Kupcinet. I have collected things about her and read anything I could about her. In the mid-90's no one on the Internet knew anything about her. Now she has become popular because, firstly, my diligence. Also, it's an unsolved celebrity murder and had to do, imo, with Jack Ruby. Most people around her believed Hope Lange's brother, David, killed her. But there are some of us who think there may be a connection with the Chicago Mob. I understand a Private Detective is looking into it. I don't want to be off-topic, so I'll stop here.

Don't say I never did any research. Do you know how much I wish to go to the conventions held in Dealey Plaza and elsewhere? Don't have the dough yet.

And (sniff!), that's my sad story...

Kathy C

Edited April 26, 2010 by Kathleen Collins

[Kathleen Collins]

PARTING REFLECTIONS FROM JIM AND JUDYTH VARY BAKER ABOUT THIS THREAD

NOTE: Since Tracy posted "THE END", which was my favorite of the entire thread, there has been

-- I wrote THE END.

Kathy C

[Glenn Viklund]

Jimmy,

With all due respect,

"I mean, really! I have published more than 150 articles and reviews, my 29th book will appear next month,"

If these publications show the same lack of judgement, lack of objectivity and the same bias you've shown here, it should be no surprise these questions are raised.

And still, you are dodging the bullet.

[Greg Burnham]

[snip] I also saw a photo of a curious-looking man and as the photo came downwards the name was "Ralph Geb." I wrote the name down and googled it later on and was shocked. "Ralph Geb" was involved with impersonating LHO before the assassination.

I felt this was important, but nobody seemed interested. Rich had gotten seriously ill. He said to me he didn't care if Lee Oswald showed up that day and confessed. [snip]

Kathy C

Hi Kathy,

It's interesting that you bring up Ralph Geb. One of my friends (now deceased) --Jay Harrison--formerly with the Dallas Police Dept. among other things, was very interested in Ralph Geb, as well. J asked me to research him many years ago. It might be worth its own thread because I'd like to know what you found. I had a lot of trouble gathering any info about him that was pertinent to the subject.

[Greg Burnham]

Greg,

It's really nice that you like Jimmy.

But I think, honestly, we know that by now.

Glenn

Glenn,

My post has nothing to do with my personal likes or dislikes. I am not taking sides with Jim, if you haven't noticed, due to our relationship. Moreover, I am resisting vilifying you for reasons that you may or may not well deserve--because such behavior on my part would serve no purpose. There is no reason to egg me on either. That doesn't work with me.

[Greg Burnham]

[snip] mr. burnham-

it is true that mr. fetzer is coming under heavy attack here. i suggests the attacks come because of the tone he has created. he has, for instance, said many unpleasant things about me- apparently because i asked him to share evidence for a claim he described as "well supported." was that an unreasonable question on my part? now he accuses me- without evidence- of posting another man's words under my own name. that is an attack on my integrity. am i to sit back and ignore that just because some might feel mr. fetzer has contributed more of substance to the thread? does contributing "substance" give you a right to belittle and attack others? leave me out of it- a few posts back he described kathy as "someone incapable of thinking." are people supposed to sit back and silently tolerate that sort of bullying behavior?

Kevin,

I displayed a "general garment" without naming names in my post. Are you claiming a custom fit? On the other hand, perhaps my observation doesn't apply to you? That's not for me to determine and I didn't point any fingers. It was just meant as food for thought...

[Barb Junkkarinen]

Viklund may be the greatest mediocrity to post on this thread. Not only did Judyth have friends who could vouch for her status but the fact that she remained in Sweden long after she would have been deported if his reports were true demonstrated that they were false on their face. There has been no merit to anything he has posted.

You are entitled to your opinion, of course .... on what Glenn or anyone else has contributed, as well as on the Judyth claims overall, but your opinion is overwhelmingly all that you have contributed. Odd for a former professor of critical thinking and logic and one who likes to promote himself as a great researcher, to run with what a claimant says and declare it fact, the "real deal." Of course you have been told this by most who have appeared in this thread, but you pay no attention and continue with your pomp. Which proves nothing about the case and whether or not Judyth's story has any place in it. But it does say a lot about you.

Glenn Viklund posted personal knowledge from actually speaking to the migration department in Sweden, his home country. He got copies of the public documents. He provided a translation of what the court decisions and other papers and items from Swedish to English ... and those were acknowledged to be exactly right by a long time member of this forum, another native Swedish speaker, John Dolva. A link to the actual documents themselves were posted. The name of his contact at the migration department, her email address, land address and phone number were all posted so that anyone could double check the information.

Did you do that?

A simple, everything laid out for you, step .... no real research for you to do ... everything there for you to simply fact check with the Swedish government. Yet you didn't contact the migration department and check on it, did you? Of course you didn't! And why not .... because you've got Judyth telling you things were different and her telling you that she has friends in Sweden who will vouch for what she says.

Absurd. You've run with everything the claimant tells you on nothing but her sayso. Ridiculous! And you have the gall to question the research abilities and integrity of others ... to speak as if from the mount like you are Yoda, the great teacher, like the circus ringmaster who tells people what will happen and when ... and how?

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Most here have demonstrated that they prefer basing those opinions on some actual information, documentation and facts. Judyth's sayso is not enough, and since you don't seem to have noticed, despite everyone's best efforts .... neither is yours.

Judyth has not been documented to have been a witness to Oswald or anything else in New Orleans in 1963. Her claims are in question ... but you are allowing her to be her own self-verifier ...and then proclaiming her your "real deal" based on that. How much more circular could this non-reasoning get?

And, please, Haslam's book, nor any other, is the answer to anything regarding Judyth. No need to repeat posting chapters and that argument. As yourself noted, Judyth is an astute researcher. And she has rendered herself useless as a witness except for anything that can be documentably verified.

Your opinion is that she is the "real deal." Others disagree. To try and beat other people over the head with your truth, repeat repeat repeating the same non-evidence over and over .... and the rest of the time denigrating those who see it differently than you do ... is not only not doing yourself any favors as far as credibility goes, but it has been devastating to Judyth as well. What you have managed to do, bombastically, is show over and over again that she, and you, have no documentable support for her claims regarding New Orleans and Oswald.