Why Beverley Oliver Is Not The Babushka Lady

[William Kelly]

Mary's statement about women's ankles may be the only dumb thing I ever heard her say.

Beverly was a teenager in 1963, and quite slim. At the time Mary met her she had had a

child and was an adult about 75 pounds heavier than in 1963. A heavier person has heavier

ankles. Besides, there is no definitive photo in Dealey Plaza from which the thinness/thickness

of her ankles can be determined.

Jack

Duke wrote: Mary related how she hadn't believed Beverly was the Babushka Lady at first because, she said, TBL had thick ankles, which Beverly did (in '92) and does not. "Women's ankles don't change," Mary said, pointing out something that I, for one, had never noticed before, the shape of a woman's ankles. Since that time almost 20 years ago, I've noticed women's ankles - particularly the thicker ones - and have even tried to decide for myself whether TBL has thick or thin ankles. I'm undecided on this point, but lean toward them being thick. Beverly's are unquestionably not thick, and if Mary's point was accurate, they never could have been

You know Jack,

I was thinking the same thing, but was just going to let Duke believe what he wants.

I know two women whose ankles swell up and down all the time, mainly because of water accumluation.

Water pills must be taken to prevent congential heart failure and the swelling of the ankles is the first sign the doctors say to look for.

So ankles don't stay the same.

And another thing he said:

Duke: Here we get the impression that it was the Warren Report alone that said Jack had dinner with his sometimes partner Paul, when in fact Ralph Paul himself said that he had dinner with Ruby.

BK: I rechecked Ralph Paul's testimony, and both times he testifimed they failed to ask him about having dinner with Ruby on Thursday, though Paul volunteers this on both occassions, they let it slide and never ask him. Paul says he had Ruby had dinner at either Egyptian or Delmonicos, and that he never met or heard of Larry Meyers. Now I'm not calling Paul a lier, I'm just saying he could have had dinner with Ruby earlier in the evening and Ruby could have went to Egyptian with Meyers and Oliver late, as it was between 10 pm and midnight, late for dinner. Nor were the others who were known to have seen Ruby at the Egyptian questioned about who he was with, including the ad salesman from the Dallas Morning News who also provided an alibi for Ruby at the time of the assassination.

Duke: Yet Beverly introduces another twist, suggesting that she had dinner with the typically asexual Ruby as some sort of "special guest" (really? why was she such an apple in his eye that he'd single her out to accompany him?) along with one Larry Meyers, thus "proving" that Ruby did not have dinner with Paul, but with Meyers and her, the big bad Report - and Ralph Paul - lying once again. If that was so, then Beverly can presumably tell us whether there where two or three other people also part of that party, and who they were, right?

What proof is there of any of these assertions? Things aren't so just because one wants them to be.

BK: And the reason Ruby asked Beverly Oliver out with him that night was because he was meeting Larry Meyers, who Ruby had met earlier at the Carousl Club when Meyers was with Jean Aase, the "dumb but accomidating broad" that he brought down from Chicago. Ruby thought Meyers was going to be with a women so he brought along a date too. But since Meyers was also meeting his brother and his wife, who were attending the Pepsi convention, and he was a married man, Jean Aase was left out of the proceedings.

What I get out of all of this is that Beverly Oliver accompanied Ruby and Meyers to the Egyptian (or if Beverly is mistaken and it wasn't Meyers but Ralph Paul, so be it), and while there Ruby and Meyers/Paul went into the back office to make a/some phone call(s). And since Campisis are known gamblers, running junkets to Vegas, and connected to known mob bosses, the phone should have been tapped. And DPD officer Joe Cody and Dallas Sheriff's offficer Al Maddox both say that that particular phone was used to call Campisi's friend in New Orleans, Carlos Marcello, who later became Larry Meyers golf partner.

The thing about the Babes of Dealey Plaza is that they don't know what they know is important.

BK

[Duke Lane]

Do you have a copy of "How to Build and Maintain an Effective and Long-Lasting Love Life" by John Wayne Gacy by any chance Duncan?

Or alternatively, "Making Up "Factual" Stories About Attending Police Line-Ups" by Duncan MacRae with a forward by Howard Brennan?

I don't have either Lee, but if I happen to come accross them, I'll swap them both for your copies of.

"How to stop myself from being a complete moron every time I open my mouth" by Lee Farley with a foreward by Noddy and PC Plod.

and

"How to stop myself from being a complete moron every time I open my mouth, Volume 2" ( The first Volume didn't work ) by Lee Farley with yet another foreward by Noddy and PC Plod"

Deal. Although volume 2 is a bit samey you'll certainly learn a lot from reading them.

And in return I'll get to find out how you consistently manage to turn BS into "facts."

Well, all of this is certainly adding to our collective knowledge and advancing the discussion!

[Robert Harris]

Mary's statement about women's ankles may be the only dumb thing I ever heard her say.

Beverly was a teenager in 1963, and quite slim. At the time Mary met her she had had a

child and was an adult about 75 pounds heavier than in 1963. A heavier person has heavier

ankles. Besides, there is no definitive photo in Dealey Plaza from which the thinness/thickness

of her ankles can be determined.

Jack

Duke wrote: Mary related how she hadn't believed Beverly was the Babushka Lady at first because, she said, TBL had thick ankles, which Beverly did (in '92) and does not. "Women's ankles don't change," Mary said, pointing out something that I, for one, had never noticed before, the shape of a woman's ankles. Since that time almost 20 years ago, I've noticed women's ankles - particularly the thicker ones - and have even tried to decide for myself whether TBL has thick or thin ankles. I'm undecided on this point, but lean toward them being thick. Beverly's are unquestionably not thick, and if Mary's point was accurate, they never could have been

You know Jack,

I was thinking the same thing, but was just going to let Duke believe what he wants.

I know two women whose ankles swell up and down all the time, mainly because of water accumluation.

Water pills must be taken to prevent congential heart failure and the swelling of the ankles is the first sign the doctors say to look for.

So ankles don't stay the same.

And another thing he said:

Duke: Here we get the impression that it was the Warren Report alone that said Jack had dinner with his sometimes partner Paul, when in fact Ralph Paul himself said that he had dinner with Ruby.

BK: I rechecked Ralph Paul's testimony, and both times he testifimed they failed to ask him about having dinner with Ruby on Thursday, though Paul volunteers this on both occassions, they let it slide and never ask him. Paul says he had Ruby had dinner at either Egyptian or Delmonicos, and that he never met or heard of Larry Meyers. Now I'm not calling Paul a lier, I'm just saying he could have had dinner with Ruby earlier in the evening and Ruby could have went to Egyptian with Meyers and Oliver late, as it was between 10 pm and midnight, late for dinner. Nor were the others who were known to have seen Ruby at the Egyptian questioned about who he was with, including the ad salesman from the Dallas Morning News who also provided an alibi for Ruby at the time of the assassination.

Duke: Yet Beverly introduces another twist, suggesting that she had dinner with the typically asexual Ruby as some sort of "special guest" (really? why was she such an apple in his eye that he'd single her out to accompany him?) along with one Larry Meyers, thus "proving" that Ruby did not have dinner with Paul, but with Meyers and her, the big bad Report - and Ralph Paul - lying once again. If that was so, then Beverly can presumably tell us whether there where two or three other people also part of that party, and who they were, right?

What proof is there of any of these assertions? Things aren't so just because one wants them to be.

BK: And the reason Ruby asked Beverly Oliver out with him that night was because he was meeting Larry Meyers, who Ruby had met earlier at the Carousl Club when Meyers was with Jean Aase, the "dumb but accomidating broad" that he brought down from Chicago. Ruby thought Meyers was going to be with a women so he brought along a date too. But since Meyers was also meeting his brother and his wife, who were attending the Pepsi convention, and he was a married man, Jean Aase was left out of the proceedings.

What I get out of all of this is that Beverly Oliver accompanied Ruby and Meyers to the Egyptian (or if Beverly is mistaken and it wasn't Meyers but Ralph Paul, so be it), and while there Ruby and Meyers/Paul went into the back office to make a/some phone call(s). And since Campisis are known gamblers, running junkets to Vegas, and connected to known mob bosses, the phone should have been tapped. And DPD officer Joe Cody and Dallas Sheriff's offficer Al Maddox both say that that particular phone was used to call Campisi's friend in New Orleans, Carlos Marcello, who later became Larry Meyers golf partner.

The thing about the Babes of Dealey Plaza is that they don't know what they know is important.

BK

In 1963 Texas, gay men would make a point of going out with a woman occasionally in order to keep up the appearance that they were straight. It is not at all surprising that Ruby would have invited her to dinner.

[William Kelly]

Mary's statement about women's ankles may be the only dumb thing I ever heard her say.

Beverly was a teenager in 1963, and quite slim. At the time Mary met her she had had a

child and was an adult about 75 pounds heavier than in 1963. A heavier person has heavier

ankles. Besides, there is no definitive photo in Dealey Plaza from which the thinness/thickness

of her ankles can be determined.

Jack

Duke wrote: Mary related how she hadn't believed Beverly was the Babushka Lady at first because, she said, TBL had thick ankles, which Beverly did (in '92) and does not. "Women's ankles don't change," Mary said, pointing out something that I, for one, had never noticed before, the shape of a woman's ankles. Since that time almost 20 years ago, I've noticed women's ankles - particularly the thicker ones - and have even tried to decide for myself whether TBL has thick or thin ankles. I'm undecided on this point, but lean toward them being thick. Beverly's are unquestionably not thick, and if Mary's point was accurate, they never could have been

You know Jack,

I was thinking the same thing, but was just going to let Duke believe what he wants.

I know two women whose ankles swell up and down all the time, mainly because of water accumluation.

Water pills must be taken to prevent congential heart failure and the swelling of the ankles is the first sign the doctors say to look for.

So ankles don't stay the same.

And another thing he said:

Duke: Here we get the impression that it was the Warren Report alone that said Jack had dinner with his sometimes partner Paul, when in fact Ralph Paul himself said that he had dinner with Ruby.

BK: I rechecked Ralph Paul's testimony, and both times he testifimed they failed to ask him about having dinner with Ruby on Thursday, though Paul volunteers this on both occassions, they let it slide and never ask him. Paul says he had Ruby had dinner at either Egyptian or Delmonicos, and that he never met or heard of Larry Meyers. Now I'm not calling Paul a lier, I'm just saying he could have had dinner with Ruby earlier in the evening and Ruby could have went to Egyptian with Meyers and Oliver late, as it was between 10 pm and midnight, late for dinner. Nor were the others who were known to have seen Ruby at the Egyptian questioned about who he was with, including the ad salesman from the Dallas Morning News who also provided an alibi for Ruby at the time of the assassination.

Duke: Yet Beverly introduces another twist, suggesting that she had dinner with the typically asexual Ruby as some sort of "special guest" (really? why was she such an apple in his eye that he'd single her out to accompany him?) along with one Larry Meyers, thus "proving" that Ruby did not have dinner with Paul, but with Meyers and her, the big bad Report - and Ralph Paul - lying once again. If that was so, then Beverly can presumably tell us whether there where two or three other people also part of that party, and who they were, right?

What proof is there of any of these assertions? Things aren't so just because one wants them to be.

BK: And the reason Ruby asked Beverly Oliver out with him that night was because he was meeting Larry Meyers, who Ruby had met earlier at the Carousl Club when Meyers was with Jean Aase, the "dumb but accomidating broad" that he brought down from Chicago. Ruby thought Meyers was going to be with a women so he brought along a date too. But since Meyers was also meeting his brother and his wife, who were attending the Pepsi convention, and he was a married man, Jean Aase was left out of the proceedings.

What I get out of all of this is that Beverly Oliver accompanied Ruby and Meyers to the Egyptian (or if Beverly is mistaken and it wasn't Meyers but Ralph Paul, so be it), and while there Ruby and Meyers/Paul went into the back office to make a/some phone call(s). And since Campisis are known gamblers, running junkets to Vegas, and connected to known mob bosses, the phone should have been tapped. And DPD officer Joe Cody and Dallas Sheriff's offficer Al Maddox both say that that particular phone was used to call Campisi's friend in New Orleans, Carlos Marcello, who later became Larry Meyers golf partner.

The thing about the Babes of Dealey Plaza is that they don't know what they know is important.

BK

In 1963 Texas, gay men would make a point of going out with a woman occasionally in order to keep up the appearance that they were straight. It is not at all surprising that Ruby would have invited her to dinner.

Except Robert, Ruby wan't gay, he had an on and off girlfriend.

BK

[Robert Harris]

Duncan, over the years a number of researchers have made the missing motorcyclist argument. This rider was Douglas Jackson, and he was eventually interviewed by the FBI. That Beverly brought this up in an interview does not suggest to me that she was not in Dealey Plaza om 11-22, but that she spent too much time with CTs afterward, and that her recollections of the shooting were forever tainted by this exposure.

She also claimed she saw the back of Kennedy's head explode--something pushed by no other eyewitness, save Jean Hill. When one studies Hill's statements, however, one sees that she only came to say this after years of hanging with the CT crowd. I suspect the same is true with Oliver.

She may have been a witness, but what she claims to have witnessed is undoubtedly suspect.

Just a small correction Pat. It is true that the back of the head was not blown out at 313, but it certainly was a fraction of a second later.

I see hair on a badly damaged back of the skull, and a large defect at the top of the head above the ear...exactly what's shown in the autopsy photos and x-rays. Are you claiming you see a hole on the back of the head? And, if so, can you explain to us what happened to the blood that erupted from this hole?

Pat I am disappointed that you dropped this issue without replying to the brief article I linked for you. In particular, I hope you will look at the last image in the article.

http://jfkhistory.com/LastShot/BOHDamage.html

At some point in time, a large section of skull in the upper-rear of the head was blown to the rear, taking with it hair and scalp that had previously been superior to it, but remained suspended in the scalp - exactly as Dr. Boswell described.

THAT is what Beverly Oliver would have seen less than half a second after the explosion at 313 and whether it was technically in the "back" of the head or not, it certainly would have given that appearance.

Of course, what is important is not where that damage was located on the head. What is important is WHEN it was inflicted.

[Bernice Moore]

GIFS FROM THE NIX FILM...I CANNOT DELETE THE DOUBLE OF THE GIF, I CANNOT FIND OUT HOW TO IN THE EDIT...THANKS..B

Edited June 26, 2010 by Bernice Moore

[Robert Harris]

Mary's statement about women's ankles may be the only dumb thing I ever heard her say.

Beverly was a teenager in 1963, and quite slim. At the time Mary met her she had had a

child and was an adult about 75 pounds heavier than in 1963. A heavier person has heavier

ankles. Besides, there is no definitive photo in Dealey Plaza from which the thinness/thickness

of her ankles can be determined.

Jack

Duke wrote: Mary related how she hadn't believed Beverly was the Babushka Lady at first because, she said, TBL had thick ankles, which Beverly did (in '92) and does not. "Women's ankles don't change," Mary said, pointing out something that I, for one, had never noticed before, the shape of a woman's ankles. Since that time almost 20 years ago, I've noticed women's ankles - particularly the thicker ones - and have even tried to decide for myself whether TBL has thick or thin ankles. I'm undecided on this point, but lean toward them being thick. Beverly's are unquestionably not thick, and if Mary's point was accurate, they never could have been

You know Jack,

I was thinking the same thing, but was just going to let Duke believe what he wants.

I know two women whose ankles swell up and down all the time, mainly because of water accumluation.

Water pills must be taken to prevent congential heart failure and the swelling of the ankles is the first sign the doctors say to look for.

So ankles don't stay the same.

And another thing he said:

Duke: Here we get the impression that it was the Warren Report alone that said Jack had dinner with his sometimes partner Paul, when in fact Ralph Paul himself said that he had dinner with Ruby.

BK: I rechecked Ralph Paul's testimony, and both times he testifimed they failed to ask him about having dinner with Ruby on Thursday, though Paul volunteers this on both occassions, they let it slide and never ask him. Paul says he had Ruby had dinner at either Egyptian or Delmonicos, and that he never met or heard of Larry Meyers. Now I'm not calling Paul a lier, I'm just saying he could have had dinner with Ruby earlier in the evening and Ruby could have went to Egyptian with Meyers and Oliver late, as it was between 10 pm and midnight, late for dinner. Nor were the others who were known to have seen Ruby at the Egyptian questioned about who he was with, including the ad salesman from the Dallas Morning News who also provided an alibi for Ruby at the time of the assassination.

Duke: Yet Beverly introduces another twist, suggesting that she had dinner with the typically asexual Ruby as some sort of "special guest" (really? why was she such an apple in his eye that he'd single her out to accompany him?) along with one Larry Meyers, thus "proving" that Ruby did not have dinner with Paul, but with Meyers and her, the big bad Report - and Ralph Paul - lying once again. If that was so, then Beverly can presumably tell us whether there where two or three other people also part of that party, and who they were, right?

What proof is there of any of these assertions? Things aren't so just because one wants them to be.

BK: And the reason Ruby asked Beverly Oliver out with him that night was because he was meeting Larry Meyers, who Ruby had met earlier at the Carousl Club when Meyers was with Jean Aase, the "dumb but accomidating broad" that he brought down from Chicago. Ruby thought Meyers was going to be with a women so he brought along a date too. But since Meyers was also meeting his brother and his wife, who were attending the Pepsi convention, and he was a married man, Jean Aase was left out of the proceedings.

What I get out of all of this is that Beverly Oliver accompanied Ruby and Meyers to the Egyptian (or if Beverly is mistaken and it wasn't Meyers but Ralph Paul, so be it), and while there Ruby and Meyers/Paul went into the back office to make a/some phone call(s). And since Campisis are known gamblers, running junkets to Vegas, and connected to known mob bosses, the phone should have been tapped. And DPD officer Joe Cody and Dallas Sheriff's offficer Al Maddox both say that that particular phone was used to call Campisi's friend in New Orleans, Carlos Marcello, who later became Larry Meyers golf partner.

The thing about the Babes of Dealey Plaza is that they don't know what they know is important.

BK

In 1963 Texas, gay men would make a point of going out with a woman occasionally in order to keep up the appearance that they were straight. It is not at all surprising that Ruby would have invited her to dinner.

Except Robert, Ruby wan't gay, he had an on and off girlfriend.

BK

Hmm.. well, I think the jury still may be out on that one. Ruby was a real a.h. but there isn't a single case that I'm aware of, of him getting frisky with his dancers or any other women for that matter.

But getting back to Beverly. What is her reply to the argument that Regis Kennedy was in N.O. on 11/25? Is there any possibility that she encountered him in the A.M. and that he flew in to question Martin in the afternoon - or that she just got the date wrong?

[William Kelly]

Mary's statement about women's ankles may be the only dumb thing I ever heard her say.

Beverly was a teenager in 1963, and quite slim. At the time Mary met her she had had a

child and was an adult about 75 pounds heavier than in 1963. A heavier person has heavier

ankles. Besides, there is no definitive photo in Dealey Plaza from which the thinness/thickness

of her ankles can be determined.

Jack

Duke wrote: Mary related how she hadn't believed Beverly was the Babushka Lady at first because, she said, TBL had thick ankles, which Beverly did (in '92) and does not. "Women's ankles don't change," Mary said, pointing out something that I, for one, had never noticed before, the shape of a woman's ankles. Since that time almost 20 years ago, I've noticed women's ankles - particularly the thicker ones - and have even tried to decide for myself whether TBL has thick or thin ankles. I'm undecided on this point, but lean toward them being thick. Beverly's are unquestionably not thick, and if Mary's point was accurate, they never could have been

You know Jack,

I was thinking the same thing, but was just going to let Duke believe what he wants.

I know two women whose ankles swell up and down all the time, mainly because of water accumluation.

Water pills must be taken to prevent congential heart failure and the swelling of the ankles is the first sign the doctors say to look for.

So ankles don't stay the same.

And another thing he said:

Duke: Here we get the impression that it was the Warren Report alone that said Jack had dinner with his sometimes partner Paul, when in fact Ralph Paul himself said that he had dinner with Ruby.

BK: I rechecked Ralph Paul's testimony, and both times he testifimed they failed to ask him about having dinner with Ruby on Thursday, though Paul volunteers this on both occassions, they let it slide and never ask him. Paul says he had Ruby had dinner at either Egyptian or Delmonicos, and that he never met or heard of Larry Meyers. Now I'm not calling Paul a lier, I'm just saying he could have had dinner with Ruby earlier in the evening and Ruby could have went to Egyptian with Meyers and Oliver late, as it was between 10 pm and midnight, late for dinner. Nor were the others who were known to have seen Ruby at the Egyptian questioned about who he was with, including the ad salesman from the Dallas Morning News who also provided an alibi for Ruby at the time of the assassination.

Duke: Yet Beverly introduces another twist, suggesting that she had dinner with the typically asexual Ruby as some sort of "special guest" (really? why was she such an apple in his eye that he'd single her out to accompany him?) along with one Larry Meyers, thus "proving" that Ruby did not have dinner with Paul, but with Meyers and her, the big bad Report - and Ralph Paul - lying once again. If that was so, then Beverly can presumably tell us whether there where two or three other people also part of that party, and who they were, right?

What proof is there of any of these assertions? Things aren't so just because one wants them to be.

BK: And the reason Ruby asked Beverly Oliver out with him that night was because he was meeting Larry Meyers, who Ruby had met earlier at the Carousl Club when Meyers was with Jean Aase, the "dumb but accomidating broad" that he brought down from Chicago. Ruby thought Meyers was going to be with a women so he brought along a date too. But since Meyers was also meeting his brother and his wife, who were attending the Pepsi convention, and he was a married man, Jean Aase was left out of the proceedings.

What I get out of all of this is that Beverly Oliver accompanied Ruby and Meyers to the Egyptian (or if Beverly is mistaken and it wasn't Meyers but Ralph Paul, so be it), and while there Ruby and Meyers/Paul went into the back office to make a/some phone call(s). And since Campisis are known gamblers, running junkets to Vegas, and connected to known mob bosses, the phone should have been tapped. And DPD officer Joe Cody and Dallas Sheriff's offficer Al Maddox both say that that particular phone was used to call Campisi's friend in New Orleans, Carlos Marcello, who later became Larry Meyers golf partner.

The thing about the Babes of Dealey Plaza is that they don't know what they know is important.

BK

In 1963 Texas, gay men would make a point of going out with a woman occasionally in order to keep up the appearance that they were straight. It is not at all surprising that Ruby would have invited her to dinner.

Except Robert, Ruby wan't gay, he had an on and off girlfriend.

BK

Hmm.. well, I think the jury still may be out on that one. Ruby was a real a.h. but there isn't a single case that I'm aware of, of him getting frisky with his dancers or any other women for that matter.

But getting back to Beverly. What is her reply to the argument that Regis Kennedy was in N.O. on 11/25? Is there any possibility that she encountered him in the A.M. and that he flew in to question Martin in the afternoon - or that she just got the date wrong?

He didn't get frisky with his dancers because he was a pro, a professonal, and treated them with some respect.

I don't know what her reply is to the attempt to discredit her by saying agent Regis Kennedy wasn't someplace she said he was.

Someone should ascertain where all the law enforcement officers were at the time of the assassination because some don't have an alibi.

BK

[Robert Howard]

Without delving into the deterioration of this thread. There is one very tragic thing about all of this. Unfortunately, since we all can't agree on anything, I am not sure if anything can be improved on excepting a "new" thread on the Forum about the Cherami drug deal that ostensibly soured on November 27, 1963. I also want to point out that after getting into a maddening search for Lt. Francis Fruge's depo, some 50 pages, it has been declassified but neither maryferrell, nor history matters, has it. Which is not anyone's fault, but simply what is the reality of the situation.

In the DPE Vol 11 Issue 1, a researcher named John Johnson wrote an article quite good, in which it appeared from the article that he had read Fruge's deposition. BTW the person who found Cherami's body also had that Odom surname.

Getting back on point regarding Beverly Oliver, I remember reading in her book an account

where she flew with Jack Ruby to Houston pre-assassination with Andy Anderson as the pilot,

So that kind of gets your attention since Galveston isn't far from Houston, almost an hour drive, if you interested in the Rose Cherami botched opium transaction. I'm sure the French Connection is a matter

worthy of consideration, plus the fact that the site of the meeting was connected to the Rice Hotel

which besides being a geographical area associated with the opium deal gone south was also in the vicinity

where Thursday November 21, 1963 sightings of Jack Ruby were reported, and which are specifically mentioned in WC documents.

Furthermore is the following document: But first I will denote that my big fear about anything less than an unequivocal factual determination that relies on the passenger list of the Maturata, which allegedly only extends to November 7, 1958, is that the "person" will have a very respectable academic background that is apparent to anyone now, but that said person was far from an academic in November 1963......

Point being: Unless all i's are dotted and t's crossed, it will be a field day for another looney conspiracy theory, which can't be proven.

http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=62480
see page 69
JAMES E. BEAIRD, 1478 South Main Street, advised that in 1955 to 1957
he resided in the Houston, Texas, area and sold automobiles for a dealer in
Houston, Texas. During that time he became acquainted with many people
in the area of Seabrook and Kemah. He had some friends that he played
poker with in the Kemah, Texas area; one of those friends was JACK RUBY
who shot LEE HARVEY OSWALD. He explained that, JACK RUBY was,
at that time, in the business of selling guns to FIDEL CASTRO in Cuba. He
further explained that, during the middle 1950’s, the United States was not
too concerned with FIDEL CASTRO, inasmuch as CASTRO had not gained control
of Cuba, and it was not known at that time that CASTRO had communist
connections.
Mr. JAMES E. BEAIRD explained that JACK RUBY stored guns and ammunition
in a two-story house between the waterfront and railroad tracks in Kemah, Texas
and would take the guns and ammunition to Cuba, mainly on weekends. He stated
that he personally saw many boxes of new guns, including automatic rifles and
handguns, stored in the two-story house and placed on a boat for shipment.
He related that JACK RUBY had a boat about 50 feet long which appeared to be
government surplus, similar to a military landing craft or LST. He stated that
each time the boat left with guns and ammunition JACK RUBY was on the boat.
Mr. BEAIRD advised that he had recently returned from Kamah, Texas where
visiting and noticed that the area in which the old two-story house stood
is now built up with new buildings. He advised that he did not remember names
of persons with whom JACK RUBY was in business at the time and thought nothing
of the matter until after President KENNEDY was shot. Since the assassination
of President KENNEDY there has been so much speculation as to possible foreign
connections and he thought it better not to mention his knowledge of JACK RUBY
in Kamah, Texas. He advised that he could not remember any specific dates
regarding this associations with JACK RUBY nor dates that JACK RUBY
transported guns and ammunition to CASTRO in Cuba.

Edited November 9, 2013 by Robert Howard

[David Andrews]

Duplicate, sorry.

Edited November 10, 2013 by David Andrews

[David Andrews]

I have read speculation that Babushka Lady was the older looking woman crossing the street in this Cancellare photo, the smallish woman with glasses at center, to the right and ahead of African-American man in the hat. Any arguments for or against?

I could not upload a larger scan of the photo, sorry. See Robin Unger's gallery.

Edited November 10, 2013 by David Andrews

[Thomas Graves]

I don't know whether [beverly Oliver is] the Babuska Lady or not, but the B-Lady certainly looks like she is filming the assassination.

Whether or not she is the Babuska Lady, Beverly Oliver certainly knew Jack Ruby, she worked at the Colony Club, she knew a guy named Larry Ronco who worked for Kodak and at the Texas State Fair and she was with Jack Ruby and Larry Meyers when they had dinner at the Egyptian Lounge on the night before the assassination, contrary to the Warren Report that says Ruby was with Ralph Paul.

I don't know what it is, but there seems to be a spate of attacks on witnesses on this forum and wonder why these witnesses are so threatening and if this is contageous?

BK

bumped

[Thomas Graves]

I don't know whether [beverly Oliver is] the Babuska Lady or not, but the B-Lady certainly looks like she is filming the assassination.

Whether or not she is the Babuska Lady, Beverly Oliver certainly knew Jack Ruby, she worked at the Colony Club, she knew a guy named Larry Ronco who worked for Kodak and at the Texas State Fair and she was with Jack Ruby and Larry Meyers when they had dinner at the Egyptian Lounge on the night before the assassination, contrary to the Warren Report that says Ruby was with Ralph Paul.

I don't know what it is, but there seems to be a spate of attacks on witnesses on this forum and wonder why these witnesses are so threatening and if this is contageous?

BK

bumped

Paul Brancato,

I'm not a great student of the "Was Beverly Oliver Babushka Lady" subject yet, but the impression I have so far is that she's the Real Deal, but was, unfortunately, tricked by Mikkonen of Finland into believing that she had filmed something which was actually filmed by Orville Nix from the "infield grass."

Another example of her being naiive and a bit uninformed is that in one of her video presentations I watched recently,

she calls what is obviously the Nix film (with the limo travelling from right to left) the Zapruder film!" To me, that's such a glaring mistake as to preclude her from intentionally having done that in the hope of hoodwinking people who are interested in the assassination of JFK (and who are, therefore, probably already familiar with the Z-fim and know that the limo goes from left to right in it).

The only other problem I have with her at the moment is the fact that she identified the tall FBI agent who took her film on the evening of 11/25/63 as Regis Kennedy, who, allegedly, was in New Orleans at the time.

-- Tommy

Edited September 15, 2016 by Thomas Graves

[Sandy Larsen]

I don't know whether [beverly Oliver is] the Babuska Lady or not, but the B-Lady certainly looks like she is filming the assassination.

Whether or not she is the Babuska Lady, Beverly Oliver certainly knew Jack Ruby, she worked at the Colony Club, she knew a guy named Larry Ronco who worked for Kodak and at the Texas State Fair and she was with Jack Ruby and Larry Meyers when they had dinner at the Egyptian Lounge on the night before the assassination, contrary to the Warren Report that says Ruby was with Ralph Paul.

I don't know what it is, but there seems to be a spate of attacks on witnesses on this forum and wonder why these witnesses are so threatening and if this is contageous?

BK

bumped

What I've highlighted in red above is the impression I've gotten since becoming a member of the forum. So far, every time I've asked another member why they believe a particular witness is a phony, I've receive IMO lame reasons..

Nevertheless I'm glad there are those on the forum who look for and share reasons not to believe a witness. They save me a lot of time and effort in doing so myself.

[Thomas Graves]

I don't know whether [beverly Oliver is] the Babuska Lady or not, but the B-Lady certainly looks like she is filming the assassination.

Whether or not she is the Babuska Lady, Beverly Oliver certainly knew Jack Ruby, she worked at the Colony Club, she knew a guy named Larry Ronco who worked for Kodak and at the Texas State Fair and she was with Jack Ruby and Larry Meyers when they had dinner at the Egyptian Lounge on the night before the assassination, contrary to the Warren Report that says Ruby was with Ralph Paul.

I don't know what it is, but there seems to be a spate of attacks on witnesses on this forum and wonder why these witnesses are so threatening and if this is contageous?

BK

bumped

What I've highlighted in red above is the impression I've gotten since becoming a member of the forum. So far, every time I've asked another member why they believe a particular witness is a phony, I've receive IMO lame reasons..

Nevertheless I'm glad there are those on the forum who look for and share reasons not to believe a witness. They save me a lot of time and effort in doing so myself.

Sandy,

Happy to oblige.

BTW, what do you think of my previous post (# 73)?

No comment?

Anybody?

-- Tommy

[edit]

Note that in Muchmore 42 (which correlates with Zapruder 287), we can see Babushka Lady's brownish (wicker?) purse at her left front, and what looks like a strap going diagonally across her back to that purse. The strap is going over her right shoulder.

Credit: Jerry Organ ttp://www.geocities.ws/shotonelm/Knoll/babushka.html

I don't see the purse or the strap (unless that's it way down there just above her hip) on the woman in this photo below (by Cancellar? Allen?), leading me to believe that THIS woman is not Babushka Lady. Also, in a different photo of a younger-looking "Babushka Lady," she's definitely wearing sunglasses. The woman in the below photo appears to be wearing glasses. But are they sunglasses? (IDK) Perhaps the strap IS there, and can be seen in a blowup of this photo?

Edited September 15, 2016 by Thomas Graves