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Frame 216


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If the Stemmon's sign top edge (blue line) creates a shield between foreground and background objects, how is it possible for the cycle fender to appear on the backside of the sign?

Also, the upper ghost image area (just below the red line) appears to include the bottom edge of the sign. This is at an approx 4.5 degree angle.

Shouldn't this be level in accordance with the top of the sign?

thanks,

chris

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If the Stemmon's sign top edge (blue line) creates a shield between foreground and background objects, how is it possible for the cycle fender to appear on the backside of the sign?

Also, the upper ghost image area (just below the red line) appears to include the bottom edge of the sign. This is at an approx 4.5 degree angle.

Shouldn't this be level in accordance with the top of the sign?

thanks,

chris

Chris...this looks very significant. You ought to run it by Costella.

Jack

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If the Stemmon's sign top edge (blue line) creates a shield between foreground and background objects, how is it possible for the cycle fender to appear on the backside of the sign?

Also, the upper ghost image area (just below the red line) appears to include the bottom edge of the sign. This is at an approx 4.5 degree angle.

Shouldn't this be level in accordance with the top of the sign?

thanks,

chris

Nothing unusual about the MC. It's just specular highlights that excited the surrounding film grains and exposed them,"eating" away the sign. I see this all the time in my work. I can post examples of this if you like.

The sign, the ONLY way the top and bottom edges of the sign can be parallel is is they were photographed EXACTLY and directly square with the camera. Very easy to test for those so inclined.

Edited by Craig Lamson
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Nothing unusual about the MC. It's just specular highlights that excited the surrounding film grains and exposed them,"eating" away the sign. I see this all the time in my work. I can post examples of this if you like.

Please do so.

Lets start with 216 first. You can see this process in action on both the Queen Mary and the JFK limo. Notice how the specular highlights from the windshield frames excite the surrounding film grains, expose them, and see this expanded highlight "eat away" the surrounding darker tones.

Did they not teach you this stufff in "film school" ?

You need more?

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You know Craig, this is why so many people are put off by you.

You make a simple offer of evidence.

I ask you to present what you offered.

You don't and then you make a snide and cheap remark about me.

When in fact, all I did was take you up on your original offer.

Not a good way to win converts to your cause or influence people.

You need to look in the mirror jimbo....your slip is showing....

Beside, you ASSUME I'm trying to make converts or influence people. I don't give a fig about either. People need to check this stuff for themself. I just offer tools. They can decide what to do with them.

Edited by Craig Lamson
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If the Stemmon's sign top edge (blue line) creates a shield between foreground and background objects, how is it possible for the cycle fender to appear on the backside of the sign?

Also, the upper ghost image area (just below the red line) appears to include the bottom edge of the sign. This is at an approx 4.5 degree angle.

Shouldn't this be level in accordance with the top of the sign?

thanks,

chris

Throughout the Zapruder film, white or shiny objects often seemed to be much larger than they really were, due to the glare of the sun. For example, look at the grill of the limousine in frame 165. Notice that the glare extends well above the top of the grill.

165.jpg

This false enlargement of the object occurs in the camera which was not capable of handling that much light, not in the real world. So, the edges of the distortion can overlap other objects in the photo, even if they are between the camera and the object.

Edited by Robert Harris
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Everyone has missed Chris' point...it had to do with the image in the intersprocket area, not the bleed onto the top of the sign.

No Jack..YOU seemed to have missed part of the post.

"If the Stemmon's sign top edge (blue line) creates a shield between foreground and background objects, how is it possible for the cycle fender to appear on the backside of the sign?"

Not only has the "great photo expert" Jack White failed photo 101, he also fails READING 101....

Great job there Jack.

Besides the question of the bottom edge of the sign as seen in the ghost image is also a non issue. Chris gets a break, he is just learning. You on the other hand, should be well aware of the issue and why it is what it is. You are not. Your photographic ignorance is showing once again.

Edited by Craig Lamson
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Everyone has missed Chris' point...it had to do with the image in the intersprocket area, not the bleed onto the top of the sign.

This article explains the ghost images in the intersprocket area. Contrary to Marsh's boasting that he figured it all out in 5 seconds, I believe he made a phone call to Bell & Howell :D

http://home.comcast.net/~the-puzzle-palace/zapruder.htm

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Everyone has missed Chris' point...it had to do with the image in the intersprocket area, not the bleed onto the top of the sign.

This article explains the ghost images in the intersprocket area. Contrary to Marsh's boasting that he figured it all out in 5 seconds, I believe he made a phone call to Bell & Howell :D

http://home.comcast.net/~the-puzzle-palace/zapruder.htm

The issue is not how images are formed in the intersprocket area, but rather one about the angle of the bottom edge of the sign in relation to the top edge.

Again it is nothing unusual and it can be easily tested by anyone with the desire to do so.

Edited by Craig Lamson
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Just to complete this....notice the specular on the rim eating away the tire....

That's the opposite effect though, isn't it Craig? Chris was inquiring about how a background image (fender) appears to be eating away a foreground image (sign). Not the other way around. I suppose if you could show us the TIRE (background) eating away at the RIM (foreground) that would be different.

I think you chose a very poor example.

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Just to complete this....notice the specular on the rim eating away the tire....

That's the opposite effect though, isn't it Craig? Chris was inquiring about how a background image (fender) appears to be eating away a foreground image (sign). Not the other way around. I suppose if you could show us the TIRE (background) eating away at the RIM (foreground) that would be different.

I think you chose a very poor example.

No, its a PERFECT example, you just appear to not have the intelligence to understand.

The emulsion of film or a digital sensor has NO CLUE if something is in front of or behind something. It's a 2d representation of a 3d scene.

Why don't you get back to us when you have aqquired a clue.

Edited by Craig Lamson
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Just to complete this....notice the specular on the rim eating away the tire....

That's the opposite effect though, isn't it Craig? Chris was inquiring about how a background image (fender) appears to be eating away a foreground image (sign). Not the other way around. I suppose if you could show us the TIRE (background) eating away at the RIM (foreground) that would be different.

I think you chose a very poor example.

I think he has a point.

Geez Craig, didn't you go to photography school?

But look out Greg, Lammy will insult his way out.

So tell us jimmy, how does the film know?

This should be priceless....

Edited by Craig Lamson
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