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Dale Myers, Don Thomas, & The Murder Of Officer Tippit


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You are a Goddamn fool.

I knew I would very likely hit a nerve with Farley by pointing out his last post regarding the bus and cab (wherein Farley totally changes all the evidence to his liking so that he can pretend his favorite patsy Lee Oswald was totally innocent).

BTW, the above quote from Lee Farley is way out of bounds, per this forum's rules, and should definitely be deleted (with a proverbial "warning" mail coming from Evan Burton as well).

Let's not get into your inability to see through the bucket of **** you have your head in.

Yeah, it's always best to pretend that the Dallas Police Department and the FBI wanted to jump through numerous ridiculous and complicated hoops regarding the "bus" and the "cab" rides to frame a guy named Oswald -- even though those same authorities had plenty of evidence to prove Oswald's guilt ALREADY.

Great plan. Looks like they probably put Farley in charge of that scheme. Sounds like he'd be just the person to orchestrate such totally unnecessary nonsense.

And do me a favour? Shove your "sickening" comments where the sun don't shine because, let's face it, what I really think about you, I'm unfortunately not allowed to say.

You already did when you broke forum rules by calling me a "Goddamn fool" just a minute ago. Why stop there, Farley? I can take it. My skin's thick enough. (After all, it's "extra crispy". Right?)

And the day I'll do an evidence-mangling conspiracy theorist like Lee Farley any favors (or even any British favours) is the day when Lee Harvey Oswald's innocence in the JFK and Tippit murders is proved. In other words, it's never going to happen.

Oh and yeah, before I forget, in addition to McWatters not IDing Oswald, you do know that Whaley didn't either[?] Or is that information not in your stinking bucket?

You just don't give a damn how much revising of history and the facts you have to do in order to clean the skirts of your lover boy, Lee Oswald, do you?

Truly pa-thet-ic. (As usual.)

There's one born every day.

And Lee Farley is living proof.

Have a great day.

(And tomorrow will be even better! Because I think Farley plans on resurrecting the false story about how Oswald was such a lousy rifleman, he couldn't hit the broad side of a barn. And the day after that, Farley will be spreading the additional hunk of misinformation about how the Warren Commission was boxing itself in to a 5.6-second timeline for the shooting of President Kennedy. I can't wait.)

Edited by David Von Pein
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The FBI and the DPD had to get him [Lee Oswald] out of that Rambler and onto McWatter's [sic] bus.

TIME OUT FOR A REALITY BREAK HERE!! (Thank you.)

Surely Lee Farley MUST realize how totally silly he sounds when he purports such total nonsense.

Because why on Earth would the FBI and/or the DPD feel the need to jump through so many hoops regarding Lee Harvey Oswald--even if we make the kooky assumption that they WERE wanting to frame him for JFK's murder?

IOW, why not just say that Oswald took the cab to his roominghouse, and skip the unnecessary bus "story"?

By adding a story about a bus, the "plotters" (FBI/DPD/Mother Teresa, et al) now only add more complications and hazards to the "Let's Frame Oswald" plot that so many of you conspiracy-happy folks like to think really took place on November 22nd.

Via a phony bus story, the authorities now have to have more and more people in their hip pockets to tell lies for them (mainly Mary E. Bledsoe in this bus instance), PLUS they've got to plant a phony bus transfer in Oswald's pocket after he's arrested.

And please note that bus driver Cecil McWatters apparently resisted the FBI's and Mother Teresa's attempts to place Oswald on his bus, because McWatters refused to make a positive identification of Oswald.

The evidence we have tells us he [LHO] wasn't on the bus. The evidence tells us he wasn't in the cab.

Good God, what crap you're spewing here, Lee.

Of course, the exact OPPOSITE is the truth regarding Lee Harvey Oswald's bus and cab rides on November 22nd, 1963 -- i.e., the evidence that exists demonstrates beyond ALL reasonable doubt that Oswald was, in fact, a passenger on Cecil McWatters' bus AND a passenger in William Whaley's taxicab on 11/22/63.

But it's always nice to know that conspiracy theorists like Lee Farley are still hard at work at revising the true facts surrounding JFK's tragic murder.

Well, maybe "nice" is the wrong word to use there -- "pathetic" is a more appropriate term for what people like Farley are doing to the evidence in the JFK and Tippit cases. (And "sickening", too.)

http://JFK-Archives.blogspot.com/2010/06/william-whaley.html

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc151/David_Von_Pein/MISCELLANEOUS%20JFK-RELATED%20PHOTOS/222OswaldsBusTransfer.gif

this has to be torture for you David Von Pein. Nothing, N-O-T-H-I-N-G seems to be going well for lone nut jobs here, there and EVERYWHERE for that matter :ice . But harken, my words of wisdom: there's a few counter positions open at a KFC (if you can handle the stink, that is) near you.

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this has to be torture for you David Von Pein. Nothing seems to be going well for lone nut jobs here, there and EVERYWHERE for that matter.

Oh, I wouldn't say that, Davey. After all, posting on the Internet has given me the thrilling opportunity to meet up with a fabulous researcher like you -- David "Gotta Gird Them Loins" Healy -- who is a man who thinks that it's quite possible that Marilyn Sitzman and Abe Zapruder were never on the pedestal in Dealey Plaza at all on 11/22/63.

And, I ask you, who WOULDN'T want to be enlightened and lectured by a smart man like that?

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The simple fact of the matter is your bucket that your head is stuck inside [of] is stinking this ken up.

With conspiracy theorists like Lee Farley mangling the evidence (and mangling regular ol' common sense, to boot) on a daily basis here in the Conspiracy Heaven known as "The Education Forum", this "ken" can hardly get any stinkier.

BTW, since you mentioned non sequiturs, did you hear Groden on a recent radio interview say that he thinks SIX shots totally MISSED the President's limousine during the assassination in Dallas? And Bob also said that Connally was hit "FOUR TIMES" and Kennedy was hit "FOUR TIMES" by bullets.

Sounds like Robert G. is now up to FOURTEEN SHOTS in Dealey Plaza.

Sorry, Don Adams, your 11-shot scenario has now been officially surpassed.

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Actually, I agree with Myers on this one, up until he drags me into it.

I heard Don Thomas give a COPA talk in Dallas in November 2002, and thought his power point presentation on the acoustics was pretty good.

http://www.parapolit...opa2002gallery/

Then I read the chapter on the Tippit murder that was posted at Mary Ferrell and was quite surprised at how sloppy it is and mish mash of all the CT books that have been written, and confusing things even more by quoting Dale Myers and bringing in the Carl Mather/Collins Radio episode, mixing it in with the other leads, some of which

were run down and explained long ago.

http://www.maryferre...sPageId=1538456

I was dismayed, because I think the acoustical evidence - the echo pattern analysis and fingerprint of the Dealey Plaza acostics can be developed into real forensic evidence, and Thomas should have stuck to the science and the scientific methods that can be used to refine what we know and how we know it.

I recently came across a hard copy of an article I wrote about the acoustic evidence years ago, before the articles and books were written by Thomas and Myers, that I posted here:

http://jfkcountercou...laza-echos.html

Thomas might understand and promote the acoustical evidence accurately, but when it came to the Tippit murder, he was all over the place and seems like he is really speculating off the wall.

While Thomas mentions the Carl Mather episode, he doesn't really drag me into it, like Dale Myers does in his review of a book that doesn't mention me at all.

Why drag me into it? As all of my research and writing on this still stands solid today, and has been developed even further than what Myers cites, and Thomas doesn't mention me at all, why am I part of Myers' review of Thomas' book?

Thomas doesn't even cite my work in his notes - but instead cites the HSCA, which published the information under the title "The Wise Allegation," although Wes doesn't make any allegations, and neither do I.

In fact, most of what Dale Myers writes is true - Thomas seems to speculate a lot about things that are open to be speclated about.

But the Carl Mather/Collins Radio connection has nothing to do with anything that Thomas wrote other than his own bone headed speculations, and Myers inference that it has something to do with me.

The fact that Dale Myers has to drag my research through this mud bath is what startles me, as I certainly don't want Myers to be trying to explain my research and work any more than I want Thomas to do it.

And I have a tape recorded interview with Wes Wise in which he says that he kept the piece of paper Mr. White wrote the license plate tag number, and promised Mr. White that he wouldn't be involved, but the FBI broke Wise's promise and did intimidate White and didn't bother to properly question Mather as he should have been, and neither did CBS, who tried, nor did the HSCA question Mather even though he was given immunity from prosecution to do so.

I'm sorry to hear that Mr. Mather has passed away before he could be properly questioned by anyone.

While I agree with most of what Myers says about Thomas' chapter on the Tippit murder, I resent Myers for wrongfully associating my research and work with the work of Thomas and now his own, neither of which can be considered encompasing or comprehensive of what is known about the murder of JD Tippit.

Bill Kelly

http://jfkcountercoup.blogspot.com/

Good grief Bill, you make it sound like you didn't even read the article.

Myers quite obviously "drags you into it" because after dealing with Don Thomas's outright deception of the facts of Wes Wise allegation regarding T.F. White and Carl Mather, Myers then has to deal with Thomas' claims that Mather's connection to Collins Radio is "particularly disturbing because Collins Radio was a front for the CIA," which is sourced to Anthony Summers which in turn is sourced to none other than YOU.

So of course Myers deals with your Collins Radio issue.

Stop acting like Myers singled you out for some nefarious reason. The fact is that Myers is reviewing what Thomas wrote and Thomas brought it up.What do you expect him to do, ignore it? God forbid he do that, you'd be all over him about it, as you have in the past..

Excuse me, but my name nor my work, nor the work of Tony Summers is footnoted nor mentioned in Don Thomas' book or chapter on the Tippit Murder. If Myers wants to deal with my research and articles on Collins Radio and its connections to the assassination of President Kennedy or the murder of JD Tippit then let's discuss it, but why entwine it with Thomas' book?

My DC COPA presentation, the publication of the article in Backchannels and my update of the article on the Collins Radio Connections were all written over a decade ago, so why does Myers suddenly bring it up here and now, and confuse it with Thomas' book, which I agree with Myers is not an accurate portrait of the evidence in the murder of JD Tippit.

I'm glad Thomas doesn't cite my work or Summers' work, because I don't think Thomas has a handle on the Tippit murder evidence or witnesses, though I agree with him that the official story is wrong.

But why would I even want to entangle my work with Thomas', who I believe doesn't present the best evidence in the best fashion, or Myers, who I believe intentionally attempts to decieve people with the way he approaches the murder of Tippit and attempts to portray it? Both of these guys are wrong, one being a wildly speculative Conspiracy Theorists and the other being a narrow minded Lone Nutter, both with preconceived notions of what happened at 10th and Patton and false perceptions of who Lee Harvey Oswald was and what he did that day.

I am well prepared to discuss my work, my research and my articles, but I won't do it on Dale Myers false terms, wrongfully implicating me with Don Thomas, who I have appeared with once at a COPA conference but never talked to or communicated with, and trying to ride my work on the back of his speculative thoeories that I disagree with.

My Collins Radio Connection has been out there for over fifteen years and finally Dale Myers gets around to trying to debunk it, using Don Thomas' weak soap box as the place to do it?

No, Good Grief, give me a freakin' break, will ya?

You want to deal with me, and what I wrote? Deal with me.

Dale Myers wants to deal with my work then deal with me, don't go dilly dallying and dancing around Don Thomas.

The very week Dale Myers book came out, I read it and discussed it with a criminal justice class that I was asked to give a talk to about the Kennedy assassination.

I pointed out to the class the very aspects of the book that were intentionally deceptive, then a week later, the class flew to Dallas and I introduced them to Wes Wise,

who took them on a tour of the assassination sites in Dallas, including the El Chino Mexican restaurant in Oak Cliff.

I also met Dale Myers at the Sixth Floor gift shop where he was signing copies of his book, and I asked him about the Wes Wise - White incident,

and when he denied its signifiance, I pulled a copy of Tony Summers' book Not In Your Lifetime - off the shelf - (who says they don't carry conspiracy books?),

and I pointed out the signifance, which he apprently still denies.

That night, with the criminal justice class and Tink Thompson, I attended a program at the 7th Floor with some of the reporters who covered the assassination,

including Wes Wise, who later became a mayor of Dallas.

In any case, Dale Myers has known all about the Collins Radio Connection and my research, and the references in Tony Summers' book for over a decade, and

I don't appreciate him mixing it up with Don Thomas' stuff because I don't think Thomas has a handle on the Tippit murder, and should stick to the scientific and

acoustical evidence, where he is on more firm ground.

So Todd, my old train mate, if you or Dale want to discuss the Collins Radio Connections then lets do it, but don't confuse people any more than they are after reading Dale's book,

or Thomas' work, since I'm not mentioned in either, and I prefer it that way.

Bill Kelly

http://jfkcountercou...io-connections/

Bill,

You wrote;

QUOTE ON

"...Excuse me, but my name nor my work, nor the work of Tony Summers is footnoted nor mentioned in Don Thomas' book or chapter on the Tippit Murder..."

QUOTE OFF

Well Bill, I've got news for you despite your claim to the contrary the work of Tony Summers is most certainly footnoted and mentioned in Don Thomas' book and chapter on the Tippit murder. And that Summers reference is to one William Kelly.

You are William Kelly, correct?

Here's an excerpt from p.529 of Thomas' Tippit chapter in Hear No Evil:

QUOTE ON

"Carl Mather worked at Collins Radio in Richardson, Texas. 134 This information is particularly disturbing because Collins radio was a front for the CIA. This was revealed when a ship leased by Collins radio was used in Operation AMTRUNK, a raid by CIA trained anti-Castro exiles on Cuba.135"

QUOTE OFF

Footnote 135 mentioned above is on page 535 of Thomas' book and reads…

QUOTE ON

"135: Collins Radio and the REX: in Summers (1998) p.405. Collins Radio was involved in top secret Naval communications systems work through its vice-president, Henry C. Bruton. Bruton and his wife were family friends of the deMohrenschildt's who on one occasion brought Oswald to meet the Brutons at their home (Epstein (1978) pp.183-185)"

QUOTE OFF

Page 405 of Tony Summer's 1998 book Not In Your Lifetime contains footnote 35 which reads…

QUOTE ON

"Note 35: The author is indebted to researcher William Kelly for his summary of this episode. Kelly points out that the owner of the car in question, aside from being a friend of Tippit's, worked for Collins Radio in nearby Richardson, Texas. That same month, Collins Radio had received publicity in connection with its lease of a ship, the Rex, involved in a CIA operation to land commandos in Cuba. Alleged assassin Oswald had been introduced to a Collins executive, retired Admiral Chester Bruton, by George deMohrenschildt. (Research supplied to the author by William Kelley; and see deMohrenschildt references in this book.)"

QUOTE OFF

How did you ever miss this?

Todd

So the footnote in Tony Summer's book that references my research and 1994 DC COPA abstract is more significant than anything else that Thomas wrote in his book that was published this year?

I am truely honored, and humbled that after over fifteen years, Dale Myers wants to address my work, though I'm dismayed that he would do it while reviewing and attacking somebody else's book.

But first, I just want to reiterate that I am not going to argue or even talk about anything Myers writes about Thomas before he brings up my name because I don't think Thomas has a good handle on the Tippit murder evidence although he shows quite clearly that it doesn't fit together, and the official story is most certainly wrong, and that Olsen is a questionable suspect and probably a Right Copper that Ruby had been dealing with for years. I also think that Thomas clearly establishes that the police radio transmissions contain significant evidence, the point I think he started out to do before he got tangled up with the other evidence in the case.

For instance, Thomas tries to confuse the Dealey Plaza Rambler with a Pontiac station wagon in Oak Cliff that they put an APB out on, and that I recall reading some police report from Grand Prarie or some suburb where a cop stopped the Pontiac and identified the passengers. And Thomas apparently didn't know of or doesn't know of Richard Bartholomew's published and posted article on the history of the Rambler and the fact that it was photographed in Dealey Plaza and that others besides Craig saw it. And Thomas didn't know about my work on Collins because he would have cited it instead of the HSCA reports and Summers.

So Thomas is not familiar with the most up to date work on either the Pontiac, the Rambler or Collins, so why is he writing about them?

As for Myers, most of what he says about Thomas may be true, but the first thing he attacks Thomas on is wrong, and that is JD Tippit was not named Jefferson Davis Tippit because Tippit filled out an offical form that used that name, something Dale Myers should know. It is true that Tippit preferred to be called "JD" and was named "JD" by his father, but Myers' assertion that it "didn't mean anything," is not true either since the father said he was named after a book he read and liked, "JD of the Mountains."

Now maybe "JD of the Mountains" was named after Jefferson Davis or maybe not, but it certainly means something and not nothing, as Myers has claimed.

So if we can separate what Thomas says from what Myers says he says and what they referenced to a book that footnotes me, then maybe we can discuss that aspect of the case, if you really want to.

Bill Kelly

http://jfkcountercoup.blogspot.com/

The Tippit Murder: Why Conspiracy Theorists Can't Tell the Truth about the Rosetta Stone of the Case Against Lee Harvey Oswald

By Dale K. Myers

The Mexican Restaurant

Finally, Mr. Thomas tells us that while the Warren Commission insisted that Oswald did not have an escape plan or confederates, the evidence for both was "right under their noses." [153]

What evidence did everyone miss, you ask?

Mr. Thomas writes that cab driver William Whaley dropped Oswald off at the corner of Neely and N. Beckley, one block shy of the El Chico Mexican restaurant, one of a chain of restaurants in the Dallas area.

"Was Oswald to meet someone there, or just hungry for nachos?" Thomas asks. "Perhaps apprehensive about what awaited him at the restaurant Oswald scurried back to his boarding house to get his pistol."

Stop right there. So, Thomas believes that Oswald planned to rendezvous with his "handlers" at the El Chico restaurant, eh? And the evidence for this is what, exactly? Mr. Thomas offers nothing, except his own clairvoyance regarding the deceased Oswald's private thoughts. But wait, there's more.

Mr. Thomas writes, "Leaving his boarding house Oswald retraced his steps and returned to the corner of Eighth and N. Beckley. But instead of entering the Mexican restaurant, Oswald turned east and headed into the neighborhoods." [154]

Stop. Once again, how does Thomas know that Oswald's destination was the corner of Eighth and Beckley (as opposed to any other corner along his route) or that he intended to go inside the Mexican restaurant? Instead of facts, we get nothing but assumptions and speculation Thomas-style.

Again, continuing with the big conspiracy, Thomas writes, "Three short blocks later [actually it's four blocks according to Thomas' own map], at Tenth and Patton, Tippit brought him about at gunpoint. Was Tippit trying to retrieve Oswald and force him back to the rendezvous?" [155]

Stop, stop, STOP! Ladies and gentlemen, there is absolutely nothing in the way of facts to support any of this nonsense. It is pure speculation on Thomas' part. There is no evidence that Oswald intended to meet anyone at the El Chico restaurant or that Officer Tippit was a party to such a rendezvous. It's bullxxxx from beginning to end.

Of course, anyone familiar with the Tippit case knows exactly why Thomas is tossing out the idea that Oswald intended to meet someone at the El Chico restaurant.

One of the well-known stories surrounding the Tippit shooting is one that surfaced twelve days after the assassination.

According to the story, at about 2:00 p.m. on the day of the assassination, T.F. White, a mechanic working at Mack Pate's Garage located next door to the El Chico Restaurant, spotted a spotted a red 1957 Plymouth sedan speeding west on Davis. The car eventually returned to the area and parked next to the El Chico Restaurant adjacent to the garage. The car was slightly hidden by a billboard, and to the mechanic, the driver appeared to be hiding. Suspicious, White crossed the street for a closer look. When he got to within 10 to 15 yards, White got a look at the side of the man's face. The mechanic jotted down the car's license number, Texas PP 4537. The man sat in the car for a short period of time, then drove off at high rate of speed heading west on West Davis Street. Despite the mechanic's suspicions, he did not call police. That night, while watching television coverage of the assassination, White saw a picture of Lee Harvey Oswald and recognized him as the driver of the red Plymouth. The incident was never reported, according to White, because he was afraid. [156]

White later told the FBI that he changed his mind about the car, believing it to be a red 1961 Ford Falcon rather than a red 1957 Plymouth.

An FBI investigation into White's story, however, determined that the license plate, Texas PP 4537, was issued for a 1957 Plymouth, light blue over medium blue in color, owned by Carl A. Mather. Mr. Mather also owned another car, a 1954 Ford station wagon, white over light blue in color, which was driven primarily by his wife.

Mr. Mather and his wife were friends of the J.D. Tippit family before the Mathers moved to Garland, Texas in 1961.

At about 2:00 p.m. on November 22, Mr. Mather left his place of employment at Collins Radio in Richardson, Texas, drove home to pick up his wife and kids, and proceeded to the Tippit home to offer their condolences.

When the FBI informed White that the license number checked out to be a light blue over medium blue 1957 Plymouth (and not the red 1957 Plymouth or 1961 Ford Falcon reported by White), and that Oswald was arrested at the Texas Theater (8 blocks southwest of the restaurant) at about the time he claimed to have seen him, White said that he thought he had obtained the correct plate number and that he thought Oswald might possibly be identical to the man he saw in the red car. [157]

So, how does Mr. Thomas tell the T.F. White story?

According to Thomas, 'White noticed a car [which Thomas describes as "a light-colored station wagon with a luggage rack"] parked behind the restaurant with two individuals lingering nearby. The mechanic explained that his suspicions were aroused in part by the fact that emergency vehicles were racing through the neighborhood with their sirens blaring, suggesting that the police were searching for someone. There was something surreptitious in their behavior such that White put down his tools and walked across the street to get a closer look. On his approach however, the men jumped in their car and sped away headed west on Eighth Street. One of the men, according to White, who claims to have gotten a good look at his face, looked just like the man that he later saw on television accused of shooting President Kennedy Lee Harvey Oswald." [158]

Stop! How does a red 1957 Plymouth sedan with a single occupant turn into a light-colored station wagon with two occupants? Apparently, anything is possible in the fantasy world of conspiracy being created by Mr. Thomas!

In fact, why have the Oswald look-alike merely sitting in his car (as the mechanic reported), when it's so much more sinister to have him standing outside the car talking with his co-conspirator? Better yet, why have the single occupant sitting in the car for a short period after the mechanic crosses the street and jots down the license plate number (as the mechanic reported), when its much more exciting to have two men jump in the car and speed off just as the mechanic approaches the car?

Why in the world is Mr. Thomas so bent on changing so many aspects of mechanic T.F. White's story?

Because altering the facts allows Mr. Thomas to make a connection between a white Pontiac station wagon linked to the Kennedy assassination and the Tippit murder.

The station wagon

Shortly after Tippit's murder, Dallas police were dispatched to a service station on West Davis, located four miles west of the El Chico restaurant. The attendant had called after seeing a rifle or shotgun laying in the backseat of a 1961 or '62 Pontiac station wagon occupied by two men. The car was last seen heading east on West Davis in the general direction of the El Chico restaurant. [159]

In an effort to make the connection between the gas station attendant's observation and the Kennedy assassination stronger, Mr. Thomas reminds his readers of Deputy Sheriff Roger Craig's claim that he saw an Oswald look-alike jump into a light-colored Nash Rambler station wagon with a luggage rack in front of the Book Depository, which then headed off in the general direction of the service station on West Davis. [160]

The gas station attendant, like the mechanic at Mack Pate's Garage, had written down the license plate number of the suspect station wagon. But just like the mechanic, the number written down by the attendant turned out to be issued for a car other than the Pontiac station wagon he described in this case, a 1961 Ford Falcon. [161]

When the officer investigating indicated that he was going to head down toward the Tippit shooting scene to join in the search for Tippit's killer, the dispatcher instructed him to check to see if the station wagon was at the scene of the shooting. [162]

Similar connections were drawn between the Pontiac station wagon and the Tippit shooting by the Dallas County Sheriff's radio dispatcher, who was obviously monitoring Dallas police radio communications. [163]

Mr. Thomas opines, "To make such an explicit connection between the station wagon and the suspect in the Tippit and JFK shooting there must have been more information available than that heard in the radio log. What did the dispatcher know and when did he know it?"

What in the world makes Mr. Thomas think that there has to be anything more than what is on the police recordings? After all, this is a city wide emergency of the highest order. The president of the United States has been shot and now a Dallas police officer. In that kind of a situation, law enforcement is grabbing at anything and everything that might possibly be connected in an effort to apprehend those responsible.

The big conspiracy

How does Mr. Thomas bring all of this information together into the big conspiracy?

According to Thomas, "The police radio log is the Rosetta Stone of the assassination. Among other clues the radio log shows that Tippit was dispatched to Lee Harvey Oswald's neighborhood and not on routine patrol when he stopped Oswald as the official version claimed. Moreover, the radio dispatchers had linked suspects in a station wagon to both the assassination and to the Tippit shooting. In subsequent investigation the FBI discovered that suspects in a station wagon belonging to Carl Mather, a close friend of Tippit, were reported lurking at the very location, a Mexican restaurant, identified as Lee Harvey Oswald's immediate destination following the assassination. The evidence clearly implicates Tippit and his colleagues as accessories after the fact." [164]

Once again, like everything that has gone before, not one word of this silliness is true.

First, there wasn't any subsequent FBI investigation that found "suspects in a station wagon belonging to Carl Mather" lurking in the parking lot of the El Chico Mexican restaurant. In fact, according to T.F. White's story there was only one individual, an Oswald look-alike, sitting in a sedan, not a station wagon.

Second, and more important, the FBI investigation found that the mechanic's story didn't check out. The license plate number that White scribbled down was registered to Mather's light blue over medium blue1957 Plymouth sedan, not a red Plymouth or Ford as the mechanic claimed.

Third, the vehicle with the registered license plate number that the mechanic had written down Mather's 1957 Plymouth was in Richardson, Texas, at the time of the reported sighting. Mr. Mather's other car was a white over light blue 1954 Ford station wagon, not the 1961 Pontiac wagon described by a gas station attendant the station wagon Mr. Thomas envisions ferrying assassins between the Kennedy and Tippit shooting scenes.

The only link between the red automobile seen by mechanic T.F. White and the white 1961 Pontiac station wagon seen by a gas station attendant is that both vehicles were seen at businesses located four miles apart on West Davis.

Finally, the only evidence that the El Chico restaurant was Oswald's destination after the assassination is Mr. Thomas' own unsupported claim.

Collins Radio and Carl Mather

You might be wondering why all the fuss about Carl Mather?

Conspiracy theorists long ago fingered Carl Mather as part of the big conspiracy because of his employment at Collins Radio, although it's never been explained exactly how he was involved.

Mr. Thomas writes that Mather's connection to Collins Radio is "particularly disturbing because Collins Radio was a front for the CIA," [165] citing conspiracy author Anthony Summers' 1998 book Not in Your Lifetime, [166] who in turn cites the work of one of the cofounders of the Coalition on Political Assassinations (COPA), William E. Kelly, Jr.

According to Kelly, Collins Radio became a major defense contractor during World War II and later supplied and maintained the equipment used by the Voice of America, all of the manned NASA space flights, the Strategic Air Command, and the equipment used for CIA-backed paramilitary operations against Guatemalan and Cuban. [167]

One of those operations, a late October, 1963, raid against Cuba involved the CIA-backed anti-Castro commando group Commandos Mambises and the Rex, a vintage early 1940's era U.S. Navy patrol boat leased by Collins Radio for electronic and oceanographic research. [168]

Mr. Thomas writes in Hear No Evil (without citation) that among the Commandos Mambises raiders "were some of the same Alpha-66 Cubans" that had been meeting at the home of Jorge Salazar at 3128 Harlandale in Oak Cliff, and that Oswald had been seen there. [169]

Mr. Salazar, an anti-Castro Cuban exile who resided at 3126 Harlandale (not 3128), [170] hosted meetings for the Dallas chapter of three combined anti-Castro organizations: Alpha 66, the Second National Front of Escambray (SNFE), and the Revolutionary Movement of the People (MRP). Contrary to Thomas' claim, there is no evidence that members of Commandos Mambises attended any of these meetings. [171]

The idea that Oswald had been to Salazar's Oak Cliff residence was the result of a report filed by Dallas deputy sheriff E.R. "Buddy" Walthers on November 23 and supplemented on November 26.

Deputy Walthers said that an informant (his mother-in-law according to page 45 of Eric Tagg's 1998 book Brush with History: A Day in the Life of Deputy E. R. Walthers) told him that "for the past few months at a house at 3128 Harlendale (sic) some Cubans had been having meetings on the weekends and were possibly connected with the 'Freedom For Cuba Party' of which Oswald was a member," and that "sometime between seven days before the president was shot and the day after he was shot these Cubans moved from this house. My informant stated that subject Oswald had been to this house before." [172]

Of course, Oswald was the one-man member of the pro-Castro New Orleans chapter of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee (a chapter of his own creation); the political opposite of the anti-Castro Cubans meeting in Oak Cliff. More important, there has never been any evidence that Oswald had actually been to the house on Harlandale Street, located five miles southeast of his room on N. Beckley Avenue.

Other tenuous links between Collins Radio and the Kennedy assassination have been offered as evidence of some kind of connection including a report that a reservation was made at Jack Ruby's Carousel Club for a large party of Collins Radio employees a week before the assassination, the fact that Oswald's widow married a former Collins Radio employee, and that Oswald himself reportedly considered getting a job at Collins Radio following his return from the Soviet Union. [173]

So what does any of this have to do with Carl Mather?

Mr. Mather, who died in 2003, told HSCA investigators in 1978 that he had been with Collins Radio for 21 years, had a security clearance, and had traveled overseas for the company on numerous occasions. He was chiefly involved with "the installation of special electronic gear in aircraft. One such assignment caused him to be quartered in Brandywine, Maryland, as he worked for some period of time at Andrews Air Force Base working on Air Force Two Vice President [Lyndon] Johnson's plane at that time." [174]

Mr. Mather's supervisor described him as "the most competent, dependable man deserving of the highest trust. He considered him outstanding." [175]

On the day of the assassination, Mather told investigators, he was working at the Collins Radio Shop in Richardson, Texas. [176]

While conspiracy advocates have pitched the HSCA's May, 1978, request for a grant of immunity for Mr. Mather as some sort of admission that Mather had something to hide, the request was part of a routine legal matter to get around Mather's previous security clearance oath.

Although the HSCA obtained the grant of immunity, there is no indication that Mather was ever reinterviewed. [177]

Look, there is nothing to indicate that Carl Mather or anyone he knew was connected to the shooting of J.D. Tippit or the assassination of President Kennedy.

The only reason Mather's name came up is because mechanic T.F. White jotted down the license plate number of a red Plymouth or Falcon that turned out to be registered to a two tone blue Plymouth owned by Mather. Not only didn't the color match the description given by White, but Mather was in a different part of the city at the time of the sighting. A reasonable person might conclude that the mechanic didn't get the correct license plate number.

But when have reason and facts ever stood in the way of conspiracy theorists bent on reshaping history?

For instance, William Kelly, the COPA co-founder, claims (without citation) that the FBI falsified a 1963 report on the incident by changing the mechanic's description of the car from a two tone blue Plymouth (matching Mather's vehicle) to a red Ford Falcon. [178]

But this is utter nonsense. Wes Wise, the former Dallas mayor who initially brought the T.F. White story to the attention of the FBI in 1963, told the bureau then that White said the car was a red 1957 Plymouth sedan (later thought to be a red Ford Falcon), and Wise was still telling the same story to HSCA investigators in 1977 the car the mechanic saw was red in color. [179]

I know the mismatch in color spoils the big conspiracy but what else are we to believe? Are we supposed to believe that Wes Wise is in collusion with the FBI to suppress the truth about the car seen by T.F. White?

And what exactly is Carl Mather's involvement in the alleged plot to kill Kennedy and Tippit? Are we supposed to believe that Mather transferred his own personal license plates to another vehicle in some sort of half-baked black op for the CIA?

Mr. Kelly opines that the reason that the Mather story "was not properly investigated, and remains uninvestigated today, is because such an inquiry actually does lead to the heart of the plot to murder not only Dallas policeman J.D. Tippit, but as many believe, is tied directly to the assassination of President Kennedy." [180]

Rubbish. Obviously, the Mather lead was investigated twice! And in both instances the evidence led nowhere. And that's what really bothers the conspiracy buffs, doesn't it?

END MYERS REVIEW EXCERPT

TODD VAUGHN CITING FOOTNOTES:

Here's an excerpt from p.529 of Thomas' Tippit chapter in Hear No Evil:

QUOTE ON

"Carl Mather worked at Collins Radio in Richardson, Texas. 134 This information is particularly disturbing because Collins radio was a front for the CIA. This was revealed when a ship leased by Collins radio was used in Operation AMTRUNK, a raid by CIA trained anti-Castro exiles on Cuba.135"

QUOTE OFF

Footnote 135 mentioned above is on page 535 of Thomas' book and reads…

QUOTE ON

"135: Collins Radio and the REX: in Summers (1998) p.405. Collins Radio was involved in top secret Naval communications systems work through its vice-president, Henry C. Bruton. Bruton and his wife were family friends of the deMohrenschildt's who on one occasion brought Oswald to meet the Brutons at their home (Epstein (1978) pp.183-185)"

QUOTE OFF

Page 405 of Tony Summer's 1998 book Not In Your Lifetime contains footnote 35 which reads…

QUOTE ON

"Note 35: The author is indebted to researcher William Kelly for his summary of this episode. Kelly points out that the owner of the car in question, aside from being a friend of Tippit's, worked for Collins Radio in nearby Richardson, Texas. That same month, Collins Radio had received publicity in connection with its lease of a ship, the Rex, involved in a CIA operation to land commandos in Cuba. Alleged assassin Oswald had been introduced to a Collins executive, retired Admiral Chester Bruton, by George deMohrenschildt. (Research supplied to the author by William Kelley; and see deMohrenschildt references in this book.)"

Edited by William Kelly
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Actually, I agree with Myers on this one, up until he drags me into it.

I heard Don Thomas give a COPA talk in Dallas in November 2002, and thought his power point presentation on the acoustics was pretty good.

http://www.parapolit...opa2002gallery/

Then I read the chapter on the Tippit murder that was posted at Mary Ferrell and was quite surprised at how sloppy it is and mish mash of all the CT books that have been written, and confusing things even more by quoting Dale Myers and bringing in the Carl Mather/Collins Radio episode, mixing it in with the other leads, some of which

were run down and explained long ago.

http://www.maryferre...sPageId=1538456

I was dismayed, because I think the acoustical evidence - the echo pattern analysis and fingerprint of the Dealey Plaza acostics can be developed into real forensic evidence, and Thomas should have stuck to the science and the scientific methods that can be used to refine what we know and how we know it.

I recently came across a hard copy of an article I wrote about the acoustic evidence years ago, before the articles and books were written by Thomas and Myers, that I posted here:

http://jfkcountercou...laza-echos.html

Thomas might understand and promote the acoustical evidence accurately, but when it came to the Tippit murder, he was all over the place and seems like he is really speculating off the wall.

While Thomas mentions the Carl Mather episode, he doesn't really drag me into it, like Dale Myers does in his review of a book that doesn't mention me at all.

Why drag me into it? As all of my research and writing on this still stands solid today, and has been developed even further than what Myers cites, and Thomas doesn't mention me at all, why am I part of Myers' review of Thomas' book?

Thomas doesn't even cite my work in his notes - but instead cites the HSCA, which published the information under the title "The Wise Allegation," although Wes doesn't make any allegations, and neither do I.

In fact, most of what Dale Myers writes is true - Thomas seems to speculate a lot about things that are open to be speclated about.

But the Carl Mather/Collins Radio connection has nothing to do with anything that Thomas wrote other than his own bone headed speculations, and Myers inference that it has something to do with me.

The fact that Dale Myers has to drag my research through this mud bath is what startles me, as I certainly don't want Myers to be trying to explain my research and work any more than I want Thomas to do it.

And I have a tape recorded interview with Wes Wise in which he says that he kept the piece of paper Mr. White wrote the license plate tag number, and promised Mr. White that he wouldn't be involved, but the FBI broke Wise's promise and did intimidate White and didn't bother to properly question Mather as he should have been, and neither did CBS, who tried, nor did the HSCA question Mather even though he was given immunity from prosecution to do so.

I'm sorry to hear that Mr. Mather has passed away before he could be properly questioned by anyone.

While I agree with most of what Myers says about Thomas' chapter on the Tippit murder, I resent Myers for wrongfully associating my research and work with the work of Thomas and now his own, neither of which can be considered encompasing or comprehensive of what is known about the murder of JD Tippit.

Bill Kelly

http://jfkcountercoup.blogspot.com/

Good grief Bill, you make it sound like you didn't even read the article.

Myers quite obviously "drags you into it" because after dealing with Don Thomas's outright deception of the facts of Wes Wise allegation regarding T.F. White and Carl Mather, Myers then has to deal with Thomas' claims that Mather's connection to Collins Radio is "particularly disturbing because Collins Radio was a front for the CIA," which is sourced to Anthony Summers which in turn is sourced to none other than YOU.

So of course Myers deals with your Collins Radio issue.

Stop acting like Myers singled you out for some nefarious reason. The fact is that Myers is reviewing what Thomas wrote and Thomas brought it up.What do you expect him to do, ignore it? God forbid he do that, you'd be all over him about it, as you have in the past..

Excuse me, but my name nor my work, nor the work of Tony Summers is footnoted nor mentioned in Don Thomas' book or chapter on the Tippit Murder. If Myers wants to deal with my research and articles on Collins Radio and its connections to the assassination of President Kennedy or the murder of JD Tippit then let's discuss it, but why entwine it with Thomas' book?

My DC COPA presentation, the publication of the article in Backchannels and my update of the article on the Collins Radio Connections were all written over a decade ago, so why does Myers suddenly bring it up here and now, and confuse it with Thomas' book, which I agree with Myers is not an accurate portrait of the evidence in the murder of JD Tippit.

I'm glad Thomas doesn't cite my work or Summers' work, because I don't think Thomas has a handle on the Tippit murder evidence or witnesses, though I agree with him that the official story is wrong.

But why would I even want to entangle my work with Thomas', who I believe doesn't present the best evidence in the best fashion, or Myers, who I believe intentionally attempts to decieve people with the way he approaches the murder of Tippit and attempts to portray it? Both of these guys are wrong, one being a wildly speculative Conspiracy Theorists and the other being a narrow minded Lone Nutter, both with preconceived notions of what happened at 10th and Patton and false perceptions of who Lee Harvey Oswald was and what he did that day.

I am well prepared to discuss my work, my research and my articles, but I won't do it on Dale Myers false terms, wrongfully implicating me with Don Thomas, who I have appeared with once at a COPA conference but never talked to or communicated with, and trying to ride my work on the back of his speculative thoeories that I disagree with.

My Collins Radio Connection has been out there for over fifteen years and finally Dale Myers gets around to trying to debunk it, using Don Thomas' weak soap box as the place to do it?

No, Good Grief, give me a freakin' break, will ya?

You want to deal with me, and what I wrote? Deal with me.

Dale Myers wants to deal with my work then deal with me, don't go dilly dallying and dancing around Don Thomas.

The very week Dale Myers book came out, I read it and discussed it with a criminal justice class that I was asked to give a talk to about the Kennedy assassination.

I pointed out to the class the very aspects of the book that were intentionally deceptive, then a week later, the class flew to Dallas and I introduced them to Wes Wise,

who took them on a tour of the assassination sites in Dallas, including the El Chino Mexican restaurant in Oak Cliff.

I also met Dale Myers at the Sixth Floor gift shop where he was signing copies of his book, and I asked him about the Wes Wise - White incident,

and when he denied its signifiance, I pulled a copy of Tony Summers' book Not In Your Lifetime - off the shelf - (who says they don't carry conspiracy books?),

and I pointed out the signifance, which he apprently still denies.

That night, with the criminal justice class and Tink Thompson, I attended a program at the 7th Floor with some of the reporters who covered the assassination,

including Wes Wise, who later became a mayor of Dallas.

In any case, Dale Myers has known all about the Collins Radio Connection and my research, and the references in Tony Summers' book for over a decade, and

I don't appreciate him mixing it up with Don Thomas' stuff because I don't think Thomas has a handle on the Tippit murder, and should stick to the scientific and

acoustical evidence, where he is on more firm ground.

So Todd, my old train mate, if you or Dale want to discuss the Collins Radio Connections then lets do it, but don't confuse people any more than they are after reading Dale's book,

or Thomas' work, since I'm not mentioned in either, and I prefer it that way.

Bill Kelly

http://jfkcountercou...io-connections/

Bill,

You wrote;

QUOTE ON

"...Excuse me, but my name nor my work, nor the work of Tony Summers is footnoted nor mentioned in Don Thomas' book or chapter on the Tippit Murder..."

QUOTE OFF

Well Bill, I've got news for you – despite your claim to the contrary the work of Tony Summers is most certainly footnoted and mentioned in Don Thomas' book and chapter on the Tippit murder. And that Summers reference is to one William Kelly.

You are William Kelly, correct?

Here's an excerpt from p.529 of Thomas' Tippit chapter in Hear No Evil:

QUOTE ON

"Carl Mather worked at Collins Radio in Richardson, Texas. 134 This information is particularly disturbing because Collins radio was a front for the CIA. This was revealed when a ship leased by Collins radio was used in Operation AMTRUNK, a raid by CIA trained anti-Castro exiles on Cuba.135"

QUOTE OFF

Footnote 135 mentioned above is on page 535 of Thomas' book and reads…

QUOTE ON

"135: Collins Radio and the REX: in Summers (1998) p.405. Collins Radio was involved in top secret Naval communications systems work through its vice-president, Henry C. Bruton. Bruton and his wife were family friends of the deMohrenschildt's who on one occasion brought Oswald to meet the Brutons at their home (Epstein (1978) pp.183-185)"

QUOTE OFF

Page 405 of Tony Summer's 1998 book Not In Your Lifetime contains footnote 35 which reads…

QUOTE ON

"Note 35: The author is indebted to researcher William Kelly for his summary of this episode. Kelly points out that the owner of the car in question, aside from being a friend of Tippit's, worked for Collins Radio in nearby Richardson, Texas. That same month, Collins Radio had received publicity in connection with its lease of a ship, the Rex, involved in a CIA operation to land commandos in Cuba. Alleged assassin Oswald had been introduced to a Collins executive, retired Admiral Chester Bruton, by George deMohrenschildt. (Research supplied to the author by William Kelley; and see deMohrenschildt references in this book.)"

QUOTE OFF

How did you ever miss this?

Todd

So the footnote in Tony Summer's book that references my research and 1994 DC COPA abstract is more significant than anything else that Thomas wrote in his book that was published this year?

I am truely honored, and humbled that after over fifteen years, Dale Myers wants to address my work, though I'm dismayed that he would do it while reviewing and attacking somebody else's book.

But first, I just want to reiterate that I am not going to argue or even talk about anything Myers writes about Thomas before he brings up my name because I don't think Thomas has a good handle on the Tippit murder evidence although he shows quite clearly that it doesn't fit together, and the official story is most certainly wrong, and that Olsen is a questionable suspect and probably a Right Copper that Ruby had been dealing with for years. I also think that Thomas clearly establishes that the police radio transmissions contain significant evidence, the point I think he started out to do before he got tangled up with the other evidence in the case.

For instance, Thomas tries to confuse the Dealey Plaza Rambler with a Pontiac station wagon in Oak Cliff that they put an APB out on, and that I recall reading some police report from Grand Prarie or some suburb where a cop stopped the Pontiac and identified the passengers. And Thomas apparently didn't know of or doesn't know of Richard Bartholomew's published and posted article on the history of the Rambler and the fact that it was photographed in Dealey Plaza and that others besides Craig saw it. And Thomas didn't know about my work on Collins because he would have cited it instead of the HSCA reports and Summers.

So Thomas is not familiar with the most up to date work on either the Pontiac, the Rambler or Collins, so why is he writing about them?

As for Myers, most of what he says about Thomas may be true, but the first thing he attacks Thomas on is wrong, and that is JD Tippit was not named Jefferson Davis Tippit because Tippit filled out an offical form that used that name, something Dale Myers should know. It is true that Tippit preferred to be called "JD" and was named "JD" by his father, but Myers' assertion that it "didn't mean anything," is not true either since the father said he was named after a book he read and liked, "JD of the Mountains."

Now maybe "JD of the Mountains" was named after Jefferson Davis or maybe not, but it certainly means something and not nothing, as Myers has claimed.

So if we can separate what Thomas says from what Myers says he says and what they referenced to a book that footnotes me, then maybe we can discuss that aspect of the case, if you really want to.

Bill Kelly

http://jfkcountercoup.blogspot.com/

Okay, You want me to deal with this? I will try: MY REPONSE IN CAPS.

The Tippit Murder: Why Conspiracy Theorists Can't Tell the Truth about the Rosetta Stone of the Case Against Lee Harvey Oswald

By Dale K. Myers

The Mexican Restaurant

Finally, Mr. Thomas tells us that while the Warren Commission insisted that Oswald did not have an escape plan or confederates, the evidence for both was "right under their noses." [153]

What evidence did everyone miss, you ask?

Mr. Thomas writes that cab driver William Whaley dropped Oswald off at the corner of Neely and N. Beckley, one block shy of the El Chico Mexican restaurant, one of a chain of restaurants in the Dallas area.

"Was Oswald to meet someone there, or just hungry for nachos?" Thomas asks. "Perhaps apprehensive about what awaited him at the restaurant Oswald scurried back to his boarding house to get his pistol."

Stop right there. So, Thomas believes that Oswald planned to rendezvous with his "handlers" at the El Chico restaurant, eh? And the evidence for this is what, exactly? Mr. Thomas offers nothing, except his own clairvoyance regarding the deceased Oswald's private thoughts. But wait, there's more.

BK: I AGREE, THERE'S NOTHING TO SUPPOSE THAT OSWALD WAS HEADING TOWARDS THE EL CHICO RESTAURNAT BUT INSTEAD, HE WAS PRACTICING STANDARD INTELLIGENCE TRADECRAFT AND WENT PAST HIS DESTINATION, HIS ROOMING HOUSE, AND WALKED BACK IN ORDER TO DETERMINE IF THERE WAS ANYONE FOLLOWING HIM. I HAVE NO SUSPICION THAT OSWALD INTENDED TO MEET ANYONE AT EL CHICO RESTAURANT OR ANYWHERE ELSE.

Mr. Thomas writes, "Leaving his boarding house Oswald retraced his steps and returned to the corner of Eighth and N. Beckley. But instead of entering the Mexican restaurant, Oswald turned east and headed into the neighborhoods." [154]

Stop. Once again, how does Thomas know that Oswald's destination was the corner of Eighth and Beckley (as opposed to any other corner along his route) or that he intended to go inside the Mexican restaurant? Instead of facts, we get nothing but assumptions and speculation – Thomas-style.

Again, continuing with the big conspiracy, Thomas writes, "Three short blocks later [actually it's four blocks according to Thomas' own map], at Tenth and Patton, Tippit brought him about at gunpoint. Was Tippit trying to retrieve Oswald and force him back to the rendezvous?" [155]

Stop, stop, STOP! Ladies and gentlemen, there is absolutely nothing in the way of facts to support any of this nonsense. It is pure speculation on Thomas' part. There is no evidence that Oswald intended to meet anyone at the El Chico restaurant or that Officer Tippit was a party to such a rendezvous. It's bullxxxx from beginning to end.

BK: AGREED IT IS BULLxxxx FROM BEGINNING TO END.

Of course, anyone familiar with the Tippit case knows exactly why Thomas is tossing out the idea that Oswald intended to meet someone at the El Chico restaurant.

One of the well-known stories surrounding the Tippit shooting is one that surfaced twelve days after the assassination.

According to the story, at about 2:00 p.m. on the day of the assassination, T.F. White, a mechanic working at Mack Pate's Garage located next door to the El Chico Restaurant, spotted a spotted a red 1957 Plymouth sedan speeding west on Davis. The car eventually returned to the area and parked next to the El Chico Restaurant adjacent to the garage. The car was slightly hidden by a billboard, and to the mechanic, the driver appeared to be hiding. Suspicious, White crossed the street for a closer look. When he got to within 10 to 15 yards, White got a look at the side of the man's face. The mechanic jotted down the car's license number, Texas PP 4537. The man sat in the car for a short period of time, then drove off at high rate of speed heading west on West Davis Street. Despite the mechanic's suspicions, he did not call police. That night, while watching television coverage of the assassination, White saw a picture of Lee Harvey Oswald and recognized him as the driver of the red Plymouth. The incident was never reported, according to White, because he was afraid. [156]

BK: THAT'S A REAL NICE SUMMARY DALE, THOUGH I DON'T REMEMBER WHITE ACTUALLY SEEING THE CAR IN MOTION UNTIL IT LEFT THE PARKING LOT, THOUGH THAT MIGHT HAVE BEEN WHAT HE SAID. I THINK HE JUST SAW THE CAR PARKED SUSPICIOUSLY BEHIND A BILLBOARD AND ITS SOLE OCCUPANT APPEARING AS IF HE WAS AVOIDING THE POLICE WHO WERE THE ONES SPEEDING UP AND DOWN THE STREET.

White later told the FBI that he changed his mind about the car, believing it to be a red 1961 Ford Falcon rather than a red 1957 Plymouth.

BK: NOW YOU WAIT A MINUTE - AND STOP RIGHT THERE. THIS IS A MECHANIC YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT, AN ELDERLY MECHANIC WHO KNOWS CARS IF HE KNOWS ANYTHING ELSE IN THE WORLD, AND HE CERTAINLY KNOWS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A 1961 RED FORD FALCON AND 1957 PLYMOUTH. AND IF YOU KNOW THE STORY AS TOLD BY WES WISE, WHO TOLD IT TO ME ON THE RECORD, HE PROMISED MR. WHITE THAT HE WOULDN'T GET WHITE INVOLVED, AND WOULD MOVE BEYOND WHAT HE TOLD HIM AND INVESTIGATE THE OWNER OF THE CAR, BUT INSTEAD, ONCE THE OWNER WAS DETERMINED TO BE A FRIEND OF J.D. TIPPIT AND WENT TO THE TIPPIT HOUSE WITHIN HOURS OF THE MURDER, THE FBI INSTEAD WENT TO MR. WHITE AND INTIMIDATED HIM AND ALL OF A SUDDEN THE 1957 PLYMOUTH APPEARS FOR THE FIRST TIME IN AN FBI REPORT THAT I DON'T BELIEVE AND IS THROWN ON THE HEAP OF FALSE FBI RECORDS THAT MAKE EVERYTHING THEY INVESTIGATE SUSPECT. INSTEAD OF INTERVIEWING THE OWNER OF THE CAR THEY EYEBALL IN THE DRIVEWAY WITH THE LICENESE PLATE THAT MR. WHITE WROTE DOWN - THE 57 PLYMOUTH, THEY GO BACK TO MR. WHITE AND INTIMIDATE HIM. NOW THAT'S BULLxxxx IN MY BOOK.

An FBI investigation into White's story, however, determined that the license plate, Texas PP 4537, was issued for a 1957 Plymouth, light blue over medium blue in color, owned by Carl A. Mather. Mr. Mather also owned another car, a 1954 Ford station wagon, white over light blue in color, which was driven primarily by his wife.

Mr. Mather and his wife were friends of the J.D. Tippit family before the Mathers moved to Garland, Texas in 1961.

At about 2:00 p.m. on November 22, Mr. Mather left his place of employment at Collins Radio in Richardson, Texas, drove home to pick up his wife and kids, and proceeded to the Tippit home to offer their condolences.

When the FBI informed White that the license number checked out to be a light blue over medium blue 1957 Plymouth (and not the red 1957 Plymouth or 1961 Ford Falcon reported by White), and that Oswald was arrested at the Texas Theater (8 blocks southwest of the restaurant) at about the time he claimed to have seen him, White said that he thought he had obtained the correct plate number and that he thought Oswald might possibly be identical to the man he saw in the red car. [157]

BK: YEA, MR. WHITE STICKS TO HIS STORY AND THEY DON'T BOTHER INTERVIEWING MATHER, WHO WORKS FOR COLLINS RADIO, A COMPANY THAT THE NEW YORK TIMES IDENTIFIED ON ITS FRONT PAGE ON NOVEMBER 1, 1963 AS A COMPANY THAT OWNED THE SHIP THE REX THAT THE CIA USED TO RUN TERRORISTS COMMANDOS INTO CUBA, INCLUDING A TEAM THAT WAS PICKED UP AND ARRESTED BY THE CUBANS AND WHO CONFESSED THEY WERE TO USE THE HIGH POWERD RIFLES WITH SCOPES THEY WERE ARRESTED WITH TO TRY TO ASSASSINATE CASTRO. BUT OF COURSE NONE OF THE DALLAS POLICE READ THE NEW YORK TIMES SO THEY WERE IN THE DARK ABOUT THAT, BUT THE FBI SHOULD HAVE KNOWN ABOUT IT AND INQUIRED, BUT THEY DON'T BOTHER QUESTIONING MATHER AT ALL!

BK: AND I AGREE, WHILE DALE MYERS AT LEAST GETS ONE PARAGRAPH ABOUT MR. WHITE CORRECT, THOMAS IS OFF THE WALL ABOUT HIS INTERPRETATION OF EVENTS AND I CAN'T SUPPORT HIM THERE EITHER.

So, how does Mr. Thomas tell the T.F. White story?

According to Thomas, 'White noticed a car [which Thomas describes as "a light-colored station wagon with a luggage rack"] parked behind the restaurant with two individuals lingering nearby. The mechanic explained that his suspicions were aroused in part by the fact that emergency vehicles were racing through the neighborhood with their sirens blaring, suggesting that the police were searching for someone. There was something surreptitious in their behavior such that White put down his tools and walked across the street to get a closer look. On his approach however, the men jumped in their car and sped away headed west on Eighth Street. One of the men, according to White, who claims to have gotten a good look at his face, looked just like the man that he later saw on television accused of shooting President Kennedy – Lee Harvey Oswald." [158]

Stop! How does a red 1957 Plymouth sedan with a single occupant turn into a light-colored station wagon with two occupants? Apparently, anything is possible in the fantasy world of conspiracy being created by Mr. Thomas!

In fact, why have the Oswald look-alike merely sitting in his car (as the mechanic reported), when it's so much more sinister to have him standing outside the car talking with his co-conspirator? Better yet, why have the single occupant sitting in the car for a short period after the mechanic crosses the street and jots down the license plate number (as the mechanic reported), when its much more exciting to have two men jump in the car and speed off just as the mechanic approaches the car?

Why in the world is Mr. Thomas so bent on changing so many aspects of mechanic T.F. White's story?

Because altering the facts allows Mr. Thomas to make a connection between a white Pontiac station wagon linked to the Kennedy assassination and the Tippit murder.

The station wagon

Shortly after Tippit's murder, Dallas police were dispatched to a service station on West Davis, located four miles west of the El Chico restaurant. The attendant had called after seeing a rifle or shotgun laying in the backseat of a 1961 or '62 Pontiac station wagon occupied by two men. The car was last seen heading east on West Davis in the general direction of the El Chico restaurant. [159]

BK: I DON'T MAKE ANY CONNECTION BETWEEN THE PONTIAC STATION WAGON AND MR. WHITE AND CARL MATHER'S PLYMOUTH OR THE RAMBLER STATION WAGON, AND THOMAS DOES NOTHING BUT DISCREDIT HIMSELF BY TRYING TO MINGLE THEM ALL TOGETHER. BUT DON'T MINGLE THEM WITH MY RESEARCH.

In an effort to make the connection between the gas station attendant's observation and the Kennedy assassination stronger, Mr. Thomas reminds his readers of Deputy Sheriff Roger Craig's claim that he saw an Oswald look-alike jump into a light-colored Nash Rambler station wagon with a luggage rack in front of the Book Depository, which then headed off in the general direction of the service station on West Davis. [160]

The gas station attendant, like the mechanic at Mack Pate's Garage, had written down the license plate number of the suspect station wagon. But just like the mechanic, the number written down by the attendant turned out to be issued for a car other than the Pontiac station wagon he described – in this case, a 1961 Ford Falcon. [161]

BK: NOW THIS IS REALLY INCREDIBLE BUT I DON'T BELEVE IT EITHER. YOU MEAN TO TELL ME THAT THEY TRACED THE LICENSE NUMBER FOR THE PONTIAC STATION WAGON WITH THE RIFLE AND TWO GUYS IN IT THAT GOT GAS IN OAK CLIFF AND IT CAME BACK AS A 1961 FORD FALCON? IT WASN'T SUPPOSED TO BE RED BY ANY CHANCE, WAS IT? MAYBE THAT'S WHERE THE 1961 RED FORD FALCOLN CAME IN TO THE PICTURE, SINCE I DON'T BELIEVE IT ORIGINATED WITH MR. WHITE?

When the officer investigating indicated that he was going to head down toward the Tippit shooting scene to join in the search for Tippit's killer, the dispatcher instructed him to check to see if the station wagon was at the scene of the shooting. [162]

Similar connections were drawn between the Pontiac station wagon and the Tippit shooting by the Dallas County Sheriff's radio dispatcher, who was obviously monitoring Dallas police radio communications. [163]

Mr. Thomas opines, "To make such an explicit connection between the station wagon and the suspect in the Tippit and JFK shooting there must have been more information available than that heard in the radio log. What did the dispatcher know and when did he know it?"

What in the world makes Mr. Thomas think that there has to be anything more than what is on the police recordings? After all, this is a city wide emergency of the highest order. The president of the United States has been shot and now a Dallas police officer. In that kind of a situation, law enforcement is grabbing at anything and everything that might possibly be connected in an effort to apprehend those responsible.

The big conspiracy

How does Mr. Thomas bring all of this information together into the big conspiracy?

According to Thomas, "The police radio log is the Rosetta Stone of the assassination. Among other clues the radio log shows that Tippit was dispatched to Lee Harvey Oswald's neighborhood and not on routine patrol when he stopped Oswald as the official version claimed. Moreover, the radio dispatchers had linked suspects in a station wagon to both the assassination and to the Tippit shooting. In subsequent investigation the FBI discovered that suspects in a station wagon belonging to Carl Mather, a close friend of Tippit, were reported lurking at the very location, a Mexican restaurant, identified as Lee Harvey Oswald's immediate destination following the assassination. The evidence clearly implicates Tippit and his colleagues as accessories after the fact." [164]

Once again, like everything that has gone before, not one word of this silliness is true.

First, there wasn't any subsequent FBI investigation that found "suspects in a station wagon belonging to Carl Mather" lurking in the parking lot of the El Chico Mexican restaurant. In fact, according to T.F. White's story there was only one individual, an Oswald look-alike, sitting in a sedan, not a station wagon.

Second, and more important, the FBI investigation found that the mechanic's story didn't check out. The license plate number that White scribbled down was registered to Mather's light blue over medium blue1957 Plymouth sedan, not a red Plymouth or Ford as the mechanic claimed.

Third, the vehicle with the registered license plate number that the mechanic had written down – Mather's 1957 Plymouth – was in Richardson, Texas, at the time of the reported sighting.

BK: AGREED, IT'S ALL BULLxxxx, EXCEPT THAT MATHER WROTE DOWN THE CORRECT LICENSE PLATE OF THE CAR AND IT WAS TRACED TO TIPPIT'S GOOD FRIEND CARL MATHER WHO CLAIMED TO BE IN RICHARDSON, TEXAS AT THE COLLINS RADIO CORPORATION PLANT WHERE HE WORKED ON RADIOS THAT INCLUDED RADIOS ON THE PLANE USED BY THE VICE PRESIDENT OF THE USA. BUT NEITHER THE FBI, NOR THE DALLAS PD OR ANYONE BOTHERED TO GO OUT TO RICHARDSON AND INQUIRE ABOUT WHETHER MATHER WAS ACTUALLY THERE OR WHETHER THE CAR WAS THERE OR IF MATHER LOOKED LIKE OSWALD OR SOMEONE HAD BORROWED THE CAR WHILE MATHER WAS AT WORK. WHITE'S WRITING DOWN THE LICENSE NUMBER AND THE NUMBER MATCHING MATHER'S CAR CANNOT BE DISMISSED, NO MATTER HOW HARD YOU WANT IT TO JUST GO AWAY.

Mr. Mather's other car was a white over light blue 1954 Ford station wagon, not the 1961 Pontiac wagon described by a gas station attendant – the station wagon Mr. Thomas envisions ferrying assassins between the Kennedy and Tippit shooting scenes.

The only link between the red automobile seen by mechanic T.F. White and the white 1961 Pontiac station wagon seen by a gas station attendant is that both vehicles were seen at businesses located four miles apart on West Davis.

BK: THERE IS NO CONNECTION AND THOMAS WAS WRONG FOR TRYING TO MAKE ONE.

Finally, the only evidence that the El Chico restaurant was Oswald's destination after the assassination is Mr. Thomas' own unsupported claim.

BK: AGREED, THE EL CHICO RESTAURANT WAS NOT OSWALD'S DESTINATION AT ANY TIME.

Collins Radio and Carl Mather

You might be wondering why all the fuss about Carl Mather?

Conspiracy theorists long ago fingered Carl Mather as part of the big conspiracy because of his employment at Collins Radio, although it's never been explained exactly how he was involved.

BK: CONSPIRACY THEORIEST DON'T HAVE TO EXPLAIN HOW ANYBODY WAS INVOLVED, THEY JUST HAVE TO PROVE THAT THE LONE ASSASSIN MYTH IS WRONG AND THERE WAS A CONSPIRACY, WHICH HAS BEEN DONE. WHAT HAS TO BE EXPLAINED AND STILL CAN BE EXPLAINED IF IT IS PROPERLY INVESTIGATED IS WHAT MATHER'S CAR WAS DOING WITHIN A FEW BLOCKS OF TIPPIT'S MURDER WITH A MAN IDENTIFIED AS THE PRESIDENT'S ACCUSED ASSASSIN BEHIND THE WHEEL. THAT QUESTION HAS NEVER BEEN EVEN ADDRESSED THOUGH IT SHOULD BE EASILY ANSWERED IF THE RIGHT PEOPLE ARE ASKED THE RIGHT QUESTIONS.

Mr. Thomas writes that Mather's connection to Collins Radio is "particularly disturbing because Collins Radio was a front for the CIA," [165] citing conspiracy author Anthony Summers' 1998 book Not in Your Lifetime, [166] who in turn cites the work of one of the cofounders of the Coalition on Political Assassinations (COPA), William E. Kelly, Jr.

BK: OKAY, SO NOW I'M INVOLVED, EVEN THOUGH I'M ONLY LISTED AS A FOOTNOTE IN THE BOOK CITED BY THOMAS AS THE SOURCE FOR HIS MISADVENTURES.

According to Kelly, Collins Radio became a major defense contractor during World War II and later supplied and maintained the equipment used by the Voice of America, all of the manned NASA space flights, the Strategic Air Command, and the equipment used for CIA-backed paramilitary operations against Guatemalan and Cuban. [167]

One of those operations, a late October, 1963, raid against Cuba involved the CIA-backed anti-Castro commando group Commandos Mambises and the Rex, a vintage early 1940's era U.S. Navy patrol boat leased by Collins Radio for electronic and oceanographic research. [168]

BK: OKAY WE GOT THAT RIGHT, SO FAR.

Mr. Thomas writes in Hear No Evil (without citation) that among the Commandos Mambises raiders "were some of the same Alpha-66 Cubans" that had been meeting at the home of Jorge Salazar at 3128 Harlandale in Oak Cliff, and that Oswald had been seen there. [169]

BK: WELL, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THOMAS' SOURCE IS, BUT BILL TURNER WRITES ABOUT THE COMMANDOS MABISES IN HIS BOOKS THE FISH IS RED AND REARVIEW MIRROR, AS HE INTERVIEWED SOME OF THEM, AND THEY DID USE THE REX TO GET TO CUBA FOR SOME OF THEIR MISSIONS. BRAD AYERS ALSO ACCOMPANIED SOME CUBAN RAIDERS ON A MISSION TO CUBA USING THE REX. IN ADDITION, AFTER THE ASSASSINATION THE DALLAS SHRIFFS OFFICE DISCOVERED THAT OSWALD WAS SAID TO HAVE BEEN AT THE ALPHA 66 HOUSE ON HALANDALE, AND ONE OF THOSE WHO WERE THERE WAS MISIDENTIFIED AS OSWALD WHILE DRIVING IN OKLAHOMA AFTER THE ASSASSINATION, SO THERE WAS SOME RESEMBLANCE BETWEEN OSWALD AND AT LEAST ONE OF THE ALPHA 66 MEMBERS WHO WERE AT THE HARLANDALE HOUSE.

Mr. Salazar, an anti-Castro Cuban exile who resided at 3126 Harlandale (not 3128), [170] hosted meetings for the Dallas chapter of three combined anti-Castro organizations: Alpha 66, the Second National Front of Escambray (SNFE), and the Revolutionary Movement of the People (MRP). Contrary to Thomas' claim, there is no evidence that members of Commandos Mambises attended any of these meetings. [171]

BK: I DON'T KNOW OF ANY EVIDENCE THE COMMANDOS MAMBISES WERE AT HARLANDALE EITHER, BUT THEY MOST CERTAINLY WERE ABOARD THE REX, THE CIA SONSORED SHIP THAT DELIVERED TERRORISTS AND ASSASSINS TO CUBA, INCLUDING MAMBISES, AND WAS CONNECTED TO COLLINS RADIO CO. OF RICHARDSONS, TEXAS, WHERE TIPPIT'S GOOD FRIEND CARL MATHER WORKED ON THE RADIOS ON THE PLANE USED BY LBJ, AND WHOSE CAR WAS SEEN A FEW BLOCKS FROM HIS GOOD FRIEND JD TIPPIT'S MURDER SCENE BEING DRIVEN BY SOMEONE IDENTIFIED AS THE PERSON ACCUSED OF KILLING THE PRESIDENT.

The idea that Oswald had been to Salazar's Oak Cliff residence was the result of a report filed by Dallas deputy sheriff E.R. "Buddy" Walthers on November 23 and supplemented on November 26.

Deputy Walthers said that an informant (his mother-in-law according to page 45 of Eric Tagg's 1998 book Brush with History: A Day in the Life of Deputy E. R. Walthers) told him that "for the past few months at a house at 3128 Harlendale (sic) some Cubans had been having meetings on the weekends and were possibly connected with the 'Freedom For Cuba Party' of which Oswald was a member," and that "sometime between seven days before the president was shot and the day after he was shot these Cubans moved from this house. My informant stated that subject Oswald had been to this house before." [172]

Of course, Oswald was the one-man member of the pro-Castro New Orleans chapter of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee (a chapter of his own creation); the political opposite of the anti-Castro Cubans meeting in Oak Cliff. More important, there has never been any evidence that Oswald had actually been to the house on Harlandale Street, located five miles southeast of his room on N. Beckley Avenue.

BK: SO MAYBE ONE OF THE CUBANS WAS MISTAKEN FOR OSWALD, AS THE ONE IN OKLAHOMA WAS MOST DEFINATELY MISTAKEN FOR HIM, YET THIS GROUP ESCAPED THE SURVEY OF GROUPS WHO COULD HAVE TAKEN ACTION AGAINST THE PRESIDENT WHILE HE WAS IN DALLAS, AND SHOULD HAVE BEEN ON THE SECRET SERVICE WATCH LIST - JUST AS OSWALD SHOULD HAVE BEEN SINCE HE WAS ASSOCIATED WITH TWO GROUPS WHO WERE ON THE DPD CIS WATCH LIST - THE FPCC AND THE ACLU. BUT AS PHIL MELANSON POINTS OUT IN HIS BOOK ON THE HISTORY OF THE SECRET SERVICE, BOTH THE ALPHA 66 AT HARLANDALE AND OSWALD WERE NOT RED FLAGGED BUT SHOULD HAVE BEEN, AT LEAST ACCORDING TO THEIR RULES.

Other tenuous links between Collins Radio and the Kennedy assassination have been offered as evidence of some kind of connection including a report that a reservation was made at Jack Ruby's Carousel Club for a large party of Collins Radio employees a week before the assassination, the fact that Oswald's widow married a former Collins Radio employee, and that Oswald himself reportedly considered getting a job at Collins Radio following his return from the Soviet Union. [173]

So what does any of this have to do with Carl Mather?

BK: NO, THE QUESTION IS WHAT DOES CARL MATHER HAVE TO DO WITH COLLINS, AND THE VP'S RADIO COMMUNICATIONS, AND THE CAR SEEN NEAR THE MURDER OF HIS GOOD FRIEND JD TIPPIT? THE OTHER COLLINS RADIO CONNECTIONS ONLY GIVE CREEDENCE TO THE IDEA THAT THERE'S SOMETHING GOING ON OVER IN RICHARDSON, TEXAS THAT DESERVES SOMEONE CHECKING OUT WHAT MATHER WAS DOING THAT DAY, WHERE HIS CAR WAS AT THE TIME. AND WHAT WAS COLLINS REALLY DOING IN ITS ASSOCIATION WITH THE CIA, THE REX, THE ANTI-CASTRO COMMANDO ASSASSINS AT JMWAVE AND THE RADIO COMMUNICATIONS ABOARD AF1 AND OTHER EXECUIVE AND SAC AIRCRAFT? THAT COLLINS EMPLOYEES WENT TO RUBY'S CLUB THE WEEK BEFORE THE ASSASSINATION, THAT MARINA MARRIED A COLLINS EMPLOYEE AND THAT OSWALD WAS INTRODUCED TO ADML. BRUTON OF COLLINS BY DEMOHRENSCHILDT AND EXPRESSED INTEREST IN WORKING AT COLLINS IS ALL GRAVEY. THE BOTTOM LINE IS THAT NOBODY WENT OUT TO RICHARDSON TO EVEN TRY TO GET ANSWERS TO THESE QUESTIONS. AND STILL HAVEN'T.

Mr. Mather, who died in 2003, told HSCA investigators in 1978 that he had been with Collins Radio for 21 years, had a security clearance, and had traveled overseas for the company on numerous occasions. He was chiefly involved with "the installation of special electronic gear in aircraft. One such assignment caused him to be quartered in Brandywine, Maryland, as he worked for some period of time at Andrews Air Force Base working on Air Force Two – Vice President [Lyndon] Johnson's plane at that time." [174]

BK: YES, MATHER'S BASIC BACKGROUND WAS OBTAINED, I THINK BY MORARITY, WHO I TRACKED DOWN AND TALKED WITH ON THE PHONE BUT WHO REMAINED FAITHFUL TO HIS SECURITY OATH WHICH PREVENTED HIM FROM TALKING ABOUT ANYTHING HE DID FOR HSCA, OTHER THAN TO SAY THAT EVERYTHING HE DID WAS PASSED ON DIRECTLY TO G. ROBERT BLAKEY. BLAKEY, THE CHIEF COUNSEL, WAS THE ONE PERSON HE SAID "WHO KNEW EVERYTING" AND GOT ALL THE REPORTS THAT WERE GENERATED. AND WE KNOW THAT BLAKEY GAVE MATHER IMMUNITY FROM PROSECUTION TO ANSWER QUESTIONS UNDER OATH, BUT NEVER BOTHERED TO QUESTION HIM.

Mr. Mather's supervisor described him as "the most competent, dependable man deserving of the highest trust. He considered him outstanding." [175]

BK: HE WOULD HAVE MADE A VERY GOOD WITNESS AND I WOULD BELIEVE WHATEVER HE WOULD HAVE SAID.

On the day of the assassination, Mather told investigators, he was working at the Collins Radio Shop in Richardson, Texas. [176]

While conspiracy advocates have pitched the HSCA's May, 1978, request for a grant of immunity for Mr. Mather as some sort of admission that Mather had something to hide, the request was part of a routine legal matter to get around Mather's previous security clearance oath.

Although the HSCA obtained the grant of immunity, there is no indication that Mather was ever reinterviewed. [177]

BK: HE WAS NEVER INTERVIEWED, OTHER THAN TO ANSWER A FEW BASIC QUESTIONS POSED TO HIM BY HSCA INVESTIGATOR MORIARITY, WHO ADMITTED HE DIDN'T KNOW THE BIG PICTURE OR WHY HE WAS EVEN QUESTIONING MATHER OR THE SIGNIFANCE OF HIS TESTIMONY, THAT WAS NEVER OBTAINED.

Look, there is nothing to indicate that Carl Mather or anyone he knew was connected to the shooting of J.D. Tippit or the assassination of President Kennedy.

BK: LOOK, THERE'S NOTHING TO INDICATE CARL MATHER OR ANYONE HE KNEW WAS CONNECTED TO THE SHOOTING OF J.D. TIPPIT OR THE ASSASSINATION OF PRESIDENT KENNEDY OTHER THAN THE FACT THAT HIS CAR WAS SEEN WITHIN BLOCKS OF THE SCENE OF HIS GOOD FRIEND TIPPIT'S MURDER AND THAT THE PERSON ACCUSED OF KILLING TIPPIT AND THE PRESIDENT WAS SEEN IN MATHER'S CAR.

The only reason Mather's name came up is because mechanic T.F. White jotted down the license plate number of a red Plymouth or Falcon that turned out to be registered to a two tone blue Plymouth owned by Mather. Not only didn't the color match the description given by White, but Mather was in a different part of the city at the time of the sighting. A reasonable person might conclude that the mechanic didn't get the correct license plate number.

BK: NO, A REASONABLE PERSON WOULD CONCLUDE THAT IT WAS IMPOSSIBLE FOR THE MECHANIC WHO KNOWS CARS TO CONFUSE THE MAKE AND MODEL, AND TO WRITE DOWN BY ACCIDENT A LICENSE NUMBER THAT WOULD EXACTLY CORRESPOND TO NOT ONLY THE TYPE OF CAR HE FIRST REPORTED BUT TO THE GOOD FRIEND OF THE MURDERED VICTIM, AND THAT WITHIN TWO HOURS THAT SAME CAR WOULD BE AT THE HOME OF TIPPIT SO MATHER COULD PAY HIS CONDOLENCES. THE ODDS OF WHITE ACCIDENTLY COMING UP WITH THAT LICENSE PLATE NUMBER ARE SO ASTRONOMICAL THAT YOU COULDN'T GET ODDS ON IT IN IRELAND, WHERE THEY GIVE ODDS ON EVERYTHING. WHITE GOT THE NUMBER RIGHT, IT WAS A 57 PLYMOUTH, IT BELONGED TO CARL MATHER, CARL MATHER WORKED AT COLLINS RADIO, COLLINS RADIO WAS IN BED WITH THE CIA AT JMWAVE AND TRIED TO KILL CASTRO BUT KENNEDY IS THE ONE WHO ENDS UP DEAD.

But when have reason and facts ever stood in the way of conspiracy theorists bent on reshaping history?

BK: I DON'T LIKE CONSPIRACY THEORISTS EITHER, AND I THINK THOMAS DID A REAL DISSERVICE TO THOSE WHO SEEK THE TRUTH BY CONFUSING THE TIPPIT MURDER CRIME SCENE EVIDENCE, BUT I KNOW THAT THE OFFICIAL STORY IS WRONG AND THAT ONE OF THE CONSPIRACY THEORIES IS RIGHT - THE ONE THAT EXPLAINS THE ASSASSINATION AND THE MURDER OF TIPPIT THE WAY THAT IT REALLY HAPPENED.

For instance, William Kelly, the COPA co-founder, claims (without citation) that the FBI falsified a 1963 report on the incident by changing the mechanic's description of the car from a two tone blue Plymouth (matching Mather's vehicle) to a red Ford Falcon. [178]

BK: OKAY, SO WHITE TELLS WES WISE ONE STORY, AND WISE PROMISES WHITE THAT HE WON'T BE INVOLVED IN THE INVESTIGATION, AND THAT THEY WILL FOLLOW THE LEAD WHEREEVER IT GOES. BUT INSTEAD, THE FBI GO OUT TO MATHER'S HOUSE AND FIND THE TWO TONE BLUE AND WHITE 57 PLYMOUTH WITH THE CORRECT TAGS, JUST AS MR. WHITE WROTE THEM DOWN RIGHT THERE IN THE DRIVEWAY. THEY KNOCK ON THE DOOR AND MRS. MATHER SAYS HER HUSBAND IS AT WORK AT COLLINS RADIO, AND THAT YES, HE HAD THE PLYMOUTH WITH HIM ON THE DAY OF THE ASSASSINATION, UNTIL ABOUT TWO O'CLOCK WHEN HE CAME HOME AND PICKED HER UP AND THEY WENT TO THE TIPPIT HOUSE TO PAY THEIR CONDOLENSES TO THE FAMILY OF THEIR GOOD FRIEND. BUT INSTEAD OF GOING OUT TO RICHARDSON TO INTERVIEW MATHER AND OTHER WORKERS AT COLLINS AND FIND OUT WHO WAS DRIVING THE PLYMOUTH AROUND OAK CLIFF THAT DAY, THE FBI GO BACK TO MR. WHITE, WHO WES WISE PROMISED WOULDN'T GET INVOLVED. NOW MR. WHITE IS INVOLVED, AND HE KNOWS THAT THE GUY HE THOUGHT HE SAW IN THE PLYMOUTH AT THE MEXICAN RESTAURANT WAS MURDERD WHILE IN DALLAS POLICE CUSTODY, AND HERE'S THE FBI AT HIS FRONT DOOR QUESTIONING HIM WHEN WES WISE PROMISED HIM THEY WOULDN'T INVESTIGATE HIM BUT RATHER WOULD INVESTIGATE THE OWNER OF THE CAR HE SAW. AND SUDDENLY A 61 RED FORD FALCON APPEARS ON THE FBI REPORT. WHO BELIEVES THAT?

NOW IF I READ DALE MYERS RIGHT, THE PONTIAC STATION WAGON TAGS WERE SUPPOSED TO BE REGISTERED TO A 61 FORD FALCON? THAT SOUNDS PRETTY SUSPICIOUS TO ME.

But this is utter nonsense. Wes Wise, the former Dallas mayor who initially brought the T.F. White story to the attention of the FBI in 1963, told the bureau then that White said the car was a red 1957 Plymouth sedan (later thought to be a red Ford Falcon), and Wise was still telling the same story to HSCA investigators in 1977 – the car the mechanic saw was red in color. [179]

BK: AND I TALKED WITH WES WISE AND HAVE HIM ON TAPE SAYING THAT MR. WHITE WAS POSITIVE ABOUT THE LICENSE NUMBER, AS HE WROTE IT DOWN AND GAVE THIS EVIDENCE TO WISE, AND THAT THE COLOR WAS NOT THAT SIGNFICANT AND MAYBE WHITE, WHO WAS ELDERLY AT THE TIME, WAS POSSIBLY COLOR BLIND. BUT REGARDLESS OF THE COLOR, HE SAID IT WAS A 57 PLYMOUTH AND HAD THE CORRECT LICENSE TAG NUMBER THAT IS NOT IN DISPUTE, EXCEPT FOR THOSE WHO WANT TO BELIVE THAT MR. WHITE ACCIDENTLY WROTE DOWN THE WRONG NUMBER THAT JUST HAPPENED TO TRACE TO THE VICTIM'S GOOD FRIEND.

I know the mismatch in color spoils the big conspiracy but what else are we to believe?

BK: THE ONLY THING WE NEED TO BELIEVE IS THAT THE FBI USED THE COLOR DISCREPENCY THEY INVENTED TO DISCREDIT MR. WHITE AND NOT TO BOTHER EVEN QUESTIONING MATHER, AND THEIR DECEPTION WAS SUCCESSFUL AS MATHER WAS NEVER PROPERLY QUESTIONED BY ANYONE.

Are we supposed to believe that Wes Wise is in collusion with the FBI to suppress the truth about the car seen by T.F. White?

BK: NO ONE BELIEVES THAT WES WISE WAS IN COLLUSION WITH THE FBI, AS HE TOLD THEM HE PROMISED WHITE THAT THEY WOULDN'T INVESTIGATE HIM, BUT THEY DID. WISE KNOWS THE FBI BETRAYED HIM AS WELL AS MR. WHITE AND ONLY PROTECTED MATHER FROM HAVING TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS OR REVEAL THE TRUTH, WHATEVER IT IS.

And what exactly is Carl Mather's involvement in the alleged plot to kill Kennedy and Tippit? Are we supposed to believe that Mather transferred his own personal license plates to another vehicle in some sort of half-baked black op for the CIA.

BK: NO, NO ONE IS SAYING EXACTLY WHAT CARL MATHER'S INVOLVEMENT WAS, OTHER THAN WHAT WE ALREADY KNOW - THAT HIS CAR WAS SEEN NEAR THE MURDER OF HIS GOOD FRIEND JD TIPPIT BEING DRIVEN BY A MAN ACCUSED OF BEING THE PERSON WHO ASSASSINATED THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES, AND THAT HE WAS NEVER PROPERLY QUESTIONED ABOUT IT.

Mr. Kelly opines that the reason that the Mather story "was not properly investigated, and remains uninvestigated today, is because such an inquiry actually does lead to the heart of the plot to murder not only Dallas policeman J.D. Tippit, but as many believe, is tied directly to the assassination of President Kennedy." [180]

BK: WELL, THAT ONLY HOLDS TRUE IF THE THE MURDER OF TIPPIT IS CONNECTED TO WHAT HAPPENED AT DEALEY PLAZA, AND THOSE WHO CLAIM OSWALD IS RESPONSIBLE FOR BOTH SEEM TO THINK SO.

Rubbish. Obviously, the Mather lead was investigated – twice! And in both instances the evidence led nowhere. And that's what really bothers the conspiracy buffs, doesn't it?

BK: HOW WAS IT INVESTIGATED TWICE? IT WAS NEVER INVESTIGATED. THE FBI WENT TO MATHER'S FRONT DOOR, TALKED WITH HIS WIFE AND THEN WENT AND TRIED TO DISCREDIT WHITE RATHER THAN QUESTION MATHER. THE HSCA INVESTIGATOR HAD A CONVERSATION WITH MATHER BUT THEY NEVER QUESTIONED HIM, SO OF COURSE THIS LEAD WENT NOWHERE. ANYONE WHO WANTED TO REALLY KNOW WHAT HAPPENED WOULD HAVE DETERMINED IF MATHER LOOKED LIKE OSWALD, OR WHETHER SOMEONE ELSE WAS DRIVING MATHER'S CAR IN OAK CLIFF THAT DAY, AND WHO AT COLLINS RADIO WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR HANDING THEIR AF1 RADIO COMMUNICATIONS, AND WHO RAN THEIR REX OPERATION WITH JMWAVE, AND WHAT MARINA'S HUSBAND DID AT COLLINS BEFORE THEY GOT MARRIED, AND WHO AT COLLINS WENT TO RUBY'S CLUB THAT WEEK, AND ONE QUESTION WOULD LEAD TO ANOTHER, BUT NONE OF THEM WERE ASKED, LET ALONE ANSWERED.

END MYERS REVIEW EXCERPT

TODD VAUGHN CITING FOOTNOTES:

Here's an excerpt from p.529 of Thomas' Tippit chapter in Hear No Evil:

QUOTE ON

"Carl Mather worked at Collins Radio in Richardson, Texas. 134 This information is particularly disturbing because Collins radio was a front for the CIA. This was revealed when a ship leased by Collins radio was used in Operation AMTRUNK, a raid by CIA trained anti-Castro exiles on Cuba.135"

QUOTE OFF

Footnote 135 mentioned above is on page 535 of Thomas' book and reads…

QUOTE ON

"135: Collins Radio and the REX: in Summers (1998) p.405. Collins Radio was involved in top secret Naval communications systems work through its vice-president, Henry C. Bruton. Bruton and his wife were family friends of the deMohrenschildt's who on one occasion brought Oswald to meet the Brutons at their home (Epstein (1978) pp.183-185)"

QUOTE OFF

Page 405 of Tony Summer's 1998 book Not In Your Lifetime contains footnote 35 which reads…

QUOTE ON

"Note 35: The author is indebted to researcher William Kelly for his summary of this episode. Kelly points out that the owner of the car in question, aside from being a friend of Tippit's, worked for Collins Radio in nearby Richardson, Texas. That same month, Collins Radio had received publicity in connection with its lease of a ship, the Rex, involved in a CIA operation to land commandos in Cuba. Alleged assassin Oswald had been introduced to a Collins executive, retired Admiral Chester Bruton, by George deMohrenschildt. (Research supplied to the author by William Kelley; and see deMohrenschildt references in this book.)"

Edited by William Kelly
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Jim DiEugenio, as we all know, doesn't care how many people he calls liars. In fact, to DiEugenio, the more people he can call liars, the better he likes it.

E.G., per DiEugenio, all of these people were (or are) liars: Mary Bledsoe, William Whaley, Wes Frazier, Linnie Randle, Roy Truly, Harry Olsen, Marrion Baker, Will Fritz, Henry Wade, Ruth Paine, John McAdams, Dave Perry, Dale Myers, the entire Warren Commission, most of the HSCA and its staff, most of the FBI, the Clark Panel, Marina Oswald, and hundreds more.

And now David Von Pein is a xxxx, per Jim:

"And then you [DVP] later admit it [the SBT] is not a fact, it's just the way things had to happen. Which means it is not a fact. Period. In other words you were covering up--lying really--for a xxxx [Dale Myers]."

The conspiracy clowns have been busy breaking forum policy in this thread, indeed.

I also find it very humorous to see the way Jimbo somehow has managed to segue from my saying that the Single-Bullet Theory is a fact (which it is, of course) to my somehow "lying" when I ALSO said another factual truth -- i.e., that the SBT is the only way it could have happened on Elm Street, given the way the two victims were lined up in the limousine.

IOW -- A DOUBLE-TRUTH turns into a LIE, per the strange logic of James "Everybody's A xxxx" DiEugenio.

Unbelievable.

Have fun with your fellow CT coconuts in Hawaii in April 2011, Jimbo. (And hopefully, Robert Groden will talk in depth about those SIX SHOTS that he thinks totally missed the Presidential automobile. I doubt that even Jim Fetzer or Brian David Andersen could hold back their laughter after Groden utters that theory.)

Edited by David Von Pein
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Guest Tom Scully

David Von Pein,

"You've done enough. Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? Have you left no sense of decency?"

http://print.dailymirror.lk/opinion1/28924.html

Oh, democracy, what damn lies are told in thy name

Friday, 03 December 2010 00:00

The state is the root of deception. The WikiLeaks exposé shows that the state resorts to lies and deception. It has evil motives such as toppling an elected government — as in the case of Turkey where, according to WikiLeaks postings, the United States had reportedly held discussions with Turkey's powerful military about overthrowing the Islamic-rooted government of Prime Minister Recep Tayyib Erdogan. In another case that undserscores the double-dealings or duplicity of states, Saudi Arabia is alleged to have exhorted the United States to attack Iran, which the Saudis would in public diplomacy describe as a friendly brotherly state. In yet another WikiLeaks exposé, the Gordon Brown government in Britain conspired to foil the Chilcot Inquiry into all aspects of the invasion of Iraq. According to WikeLeaks cables, a British Defence Ministry official had promised the United States that the Brown government had "put measures in place to protect your interests" during the inquiry.

In Yemen, according to WikiLeaks cables, the government gave the Americans licence to kill Yemeni people identified as al-Qaeda members or supporters. "We'll continue saying the bombs are ours, not yours," Yemeni President Ali Abdullah Saleh is reported to have told General David Petraeus in January 2010. The cover-up was so blatant that Yemen's prime minister joked about how the president had "lied" to his parliament about the strikes.

The issue here is not whether WikiLeaks's decision to publish hundreds of thousands of secret diplomatic cables is right or wrong or whether it has endangered national security or put soldiers and officers involved in harm's way but whether the people could be lied to. It appears that States believe that the people, whom the states govern, rule or oppresses, can be and should be lied to because many of them are incapable of understanding the state's behaviour. The state insists that lies and deception are part of statecraft and necessary tools to protect itself and the people it governs, rules or oppresses....

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I suggest the removal from this forum of Von Pain, Burton, Lamson, Colby, Lewis and others of that ilk, so research may proceed without harassment of EVERY posting by them.

IOW -- Leave us CTers alone in our playpen of make-believe conspiracy. We don't need no stinking LNers confronting us with the actual evidence in the case! To hell with the evidence (and LNers like "Von Pain")!

Edited by David Von Pein
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I suggest the removal from this forum of Von Pain, Burton, Lamson, Colby, Lewis and others of that ilk, so research may proceed without harassment of EVERY posting by them.

IOW -- Leave us CTers alone in our playpen of make-believe conspiracy. We don't need no stinking LNers confronting us with the actual evidence in the case! To hell with the evidence (and LNers like "Von Pain")!

Why would you not want to keep DVP and the Lone Nutters from posting? I think they add some interest to the debate, and in fact there wouldn't be any debate without them.

While I have to stop my original research in order to respond to their critiques and attacks, I'd rather hear the objections to my work and respond to it than not hear the objections at all.

I don't think it is difficult to overcome the objections of the LNs, though it is important to hear them to make sure they can be overcome.

And there's no fun in agreeing with everyone, so its nice to know there are still some radical extremists who want to try to defend the undefensible.

BK

Edited by William Kelly
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You will complain to the moderators: "That meanie DiEugenio, I mean all I did was insult his mother. And look at what he calls me."

I didn't "insult" your mother and you know it. I was insulting YOU, Jimbo, a few months ago when I implied that you wouldn't believe anything your mother told you (i.e., implying this: YOU DON'T TRUST ANYBODY). Surely you understand the difference.

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It's nice to know there are still some radical extremists who want to try to defend the undefensible.

All evidence in the JFK & Tippit murders points to one person (Oswald).

And yet anyone who believes Oswald was a lone assassin in those two murders is a "radical extremist".

Beautiful, Bill. :)

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