A key factor in the shooting

[Scott Kaiser]

Ok, I've studied those frames in all sorts of ways allowing for fore shortening, changes in distance, movements so fast they leave a smear during the time of exposure, the springiness of the seat, car movements . all sorts of changes for quite some time and taking into account the speed and direction of major ejecta, I don't think a conclusion to this can be had unless a truly comprehensive study is done.

Jackie chased a piece of JFK's head over the back/left part of the car. Shots from the rear do not propel large fragments in the opposite direction...the man's head was not moving at impact...any fragments would be gone - past the influence of any "head jerks" or spinal column reactions. The vast majority of debris from an impact like that goes the same direction that the bullet was going.

You can add to that - that the car was actually going forward (or maybe almost stopped but definitely slowing) at the point of impact. Any forward (and slowing) momentum would actually (slightly) push the debris from impact forward - yet it did as expected and went back and to the left - from a close shot with a high powered rifle from the Grassy Knoll.

I can't believe we are even discussing this.

The vast majority of debris "from an impact" like that goes the same direction that the bullet was going.

Not true, anyone who has ever been hurt themselves on "impact" knows that the tissue and or blood will travel in "SEVERAL" different directions. back and to the left are Custards famous last words, I mean Kevin Costner.

[David S. Brownlee]

Not true, anyone who has ever been hurt themselves on "impact" knows that the tissue and or blood will travel in "SEVERAL" different directions. back and to the left are Custards famous last words, I mean Kevin Costner.

Not true...later, small portions go in all directions...but larger portions of matter which are blown off at impact..go in the direction of the force that is the primary mover.

This is getting beyond silly - shoot a watermellon (which we do often for fun) - almost ALL of the debris goes in exactly the direction of the incoming bullet that hit it. It's simple physics.

...and it doesn't matter what happens after impact - all the stuff is already blown in the direction that the bullet was going.

Honestly...I would be willing to put a spotless handkerchief down in front of a ripe pumpkin or watermellon (two feet in front) and bet $50 that after I shot the mellon with my SKS there would be no spots on the handkerchief (and fifty dollars is real money to me).

Edited August 20, 2011 by David S. Brownlee

[Scott Kaiser]

Not true, anyone who has ever been hurt themselves on "impact" knows that the tissue and or blood will travel in "SEVERAL" different directions. back and to the left are Custards famous last words, I mean Kevin Costner.

Not true...later, small portions go in all directions...but larger portions of matter which are blown off at impact..go in the direction of the force that is the primary mover.

This is getting beyond silly - shoot a watermellon (which we do often for fun) - almost ALL of the debris goes in exactly the direction of the incoming bullet that hit it. It's simple physics.

...and it doesn't matter what happens after impact - all the stuff is already blown in the direction that the bullet was going.

Honestly...I would be willing to put a spotless handkerchief down in front of a ripe pumpkin or watermellon (two feet in front) and bet $50 that after I shot the mellon with my SKS there would be no spots on the handkerchief (and fifty dollars is real money to me).

I'm just wondering what kind of gun you use that gets an object to travel in the same direction? A bb-gun perhaps? I have one of those too, a "SKS". Its called a Scott Kaiser Special. Hope you enjoy your little clip below and I only take cash, no credit cards or checks please.

Thank you!

[David S. Brownlee]

I'm just wondering what kind of gun you use that gets an object to travel in the same direction? A bb-gun perhaps? I have one of those too, a "SKS". Its called a Scott Kaiser Special. Hope you enjoy your little clip below and I only take cash, no credit cards or checks please.

Thank you!

Alright fella...I used the SKS as an example of a moderate velocity firearm. I also have three .22s (one a target model) which go off (depending on ammo variety) at about a thousand FPS muzzle velocity, a .357 Mag which has about the same. An SKS and an AK-47 which pump the lead at about 1800 fps muzzle velocity, a .270 Winchester which pops em out at around 2800 fps with a 130 grain bullet...and a 7MM Remington Magnum which hits 3000 fps muzzle velocity with a 130 grain...slightly less with a 150 grain.

I shoot all of these guns on the range routinely and at a friends place where we set up "fun" targets.

So PLEASE don't talk to me about BB-Guns and how smart you are. I started shooting .22s when I was seven years old pal. You obviously know very little when it comes to firearms.

Ooooh 100 posts .... .

..and P.S....it did look like maybe 10% of the melon actually came a bit forward in those shots. Next time I'm at my buddy's place I will make a point of laying down a Hanky and trying what I said. If you are right I will accept defeat...which I seriously doubt (but the bet thing was just me trying to make a point - us Mormons don't gamble).

Edited August 20, 2011 by David S. Brownlee

[Scott Kaiser]

I'm just wondering what kind of gun you use that gets an object to travel in the same direction? A bb-gun perhaps? I have one of those too, a "SKS". Its called a Scott Kaiser Special. Hope you enjoy your little clip below and I only take cash, no credit cards or checks please.

Thank you!

Alright fella...I used the SKS as an example of a moderate velocity firearm. I also have three .22s (one a target model) which go off (depending on ammo variety) at about a thousand FPS muzzle velocity, a .357 Mag which has about the same. An SKS and an AK-47 which pump the lead at about 1800 fps muzzle velocity, a .270 Winchester which pops em out at around 2800 fps with a 130 grain bullet...and a 7MM Remington Magnum which hits 3000 fps muzzle velocity with a 130 grain...slightly less with a 150 grain.

I shoot all of these guns on the range routinely and at a friends place where we set up "fun" targets.

So PLEASE don't talk to me about BB-Guns and how smart you are. I started shooting .22s when I was seven years old pal. You obviously know very little when it comes to firearms.

Ooooh 100 posts .... .

..and P.S....it did look like maybe 10% of the melon actually came a bit forward in those shots. Next time I'm at my buddy's place I will make a point of laying down a Hanky and trying what I said. If you are right I will accept defeat...which I seriously doubt (but the bet thing was just me trying to make a point - us Mormons don't gamble).

That 10% you saw coming from that watermelon would have been the same results when Kennedy got SHOT FROM THE REAR, the other 89% went everywhere else with most of the blood splatter on Mrs. Kennedy and that 1% ended up on the back of the trunk of the car. I'm glad to see you know your ballistic mathematics it doesn't take long to refresh your memory after watching a few youtube shows, huh?

I like that cheers one you got going but its not here, could you teach me how to do it, I'm big on the smiley faces.

Edited August 20, 2011 by Scott Kaiser

[David S. Brownlee]

That 10% you saw coming from that watermelon would have been the same results when Kennedy got SHOT FROM THE REAR, the other 89% went everywhere else with most of the blood splatter on Mrs. Kennedy and that 1% ended up on the back of the trunk of the car. I'm glad to see you know your ballistic mathematics it doesn't take long to refresh your memory after watching a few youtube shows, huh?

I like that cheers one you got going but its not here, could you teach me how to do it, I'm big on the smiley faces.

Well 10% versus 90%...I'll stick with the 90%. I'll take those odds every day.