"JFK, Oswald and the Raleigh Connection"

[Don Roberdeau]

Good Day.... FYI....

http://www.indyweek.com/indyweek/jfk-oswald-and-the-raleigh-connection/Content?oid=3192079

**NOTE** There are additional article key considerations for your further reading provided by links from within the actual article

(QUOTE)

JFK, Oswald and the Raleigh Connection

by Randolph Benson

The call slip showing Oswald tried to place a collect call to John Hurt of Raleigh

It was 11:30 on a foggy night in Raleigh on Saturday, Nov. 23, 1963. The

previous afternoon, President John F. Kennedy had been shot on the

streets of Dallas. Just a block from the North Carolina State Capitol, at

201 Hillsborough St., Apartment No. 1 was about to be thrust into one of

the most profound mysteries behind the assassination. And it would be a

generation before its meaning would be understood.

That night, nearly 1,200 miles away at the Dallas Municipal Building,

Alveeta A. Treon arrived for her shift at the telephone switchboard.

Treon would relieve her co-worker, Louise Swinney, who had been given

orders by their supervisor to assist two men in listening to a call that

would come through their switchboard. Treon assumed the men were

Secret Service. She suspected that Lee Harvey Oswald, the accused

assassin being held in the downstairs jail, would be making another call.

He had already phoned his Russian wife, Marina, and an ACLU lawyer in

New York. This call, however, was different.

Oswald rang the switchboard at a quarter till 12, Raleigh time. Swinney

took the call and scribbled Oswald's information as the two men listened

in.

"I was dumbfounded at what happened next," Treon later told a former

Senate investigator. "Swinney told [Oswald], 'I'm sorry, the number

doesn't answer.' Swinney then unplugged and disconnected Oswald

without ever really trying to put the call through."

Afterward, Swinney tore the sheet from her note pad and threw it into

the trash. She left, her shift having ended.

Treon retrieved the wadded piece of paper from the trash and copied the

information onto a standard long-distance telephone call slip to save as a

souvenir. The slip reveals that Oswald had given Treon the name "John

Hurt of Raleigh, N.C."

After the release of the Warren Report, the U.S. government's official

version of the assassination, in 1964, a CBS poll found that more than 40

percent of Americans surveyed said there was more to the assassination

than the U.S. government had revealed. In 1976, a Gallup Poll found that

81 percent believed in a conspiracy. A recent CBS survey found that 90

percent of Americans reject the Warren Commission's conclusions.

In the nearly 50 years since President Kennedy's assassination, hundreds

of respected researchers have dedicated decades of their lives in their

search for the truth, not just about the assassination but for what they

describe as America's hidden history: How the "official version" of events

is promoted by the U.S. government and perpetuated by a cooperative,

if not complicit media.

Although many are professional investigators, photo analysts,

pathologists, journalists, historians or lawyers, most approach the

assassination not as a vocation but as an avocation. An engineer

conducted crucial studies of the president's autopsies. A flight attendant

performed respected research into Oswald's ties to military intelligence. A

high school teacher uncovered important information about the Texas

connection. And key facts about JFK's Vietnam withdrawal directive was

revealed by a Southern California real estate agent.

Grover Proctor, a Raleigh native, is among the researchers. A university

dean and statistical analyst, he now lives in Cary and has become widely

recognized as a meticulous and respected researcher. Every major

discussion of the assassination that includes facts about Oswald's call

cites his work. His website was awarded the JFK Site Award in 1997.

(Yes, there are enough websites on the assassination to justify awards.)

In fact, because of Proctor, Oswald's attempt to reach out to John Hurt

has become known as the Raleigh Call.

Nine years after the assassination, Proctor, then a graduate student at

Wayne State University in Michigan, was transfixed as the Watergate

scandal unfolded on television.

"Every evening, several of my friends and I would sit glued to the news,

fascinated by the unfolding constitutional drama," Proctor said. "Late-

night discussions inevitably gravitated to the conspiracy being brought to

light by the televised hearings—and to the wider subject of political

conspiracies in general."

A friend of Proctor handed him a paperback copy of A Heritage of Stone,

a book by New Orleans District Attorney Jim Garrison that concluded that

the Kennedy assassination was plotted and executed by the CIA.

"Until then, I had never given the assassination a second thought,"

Proctor recalled. "I reasoned, 'They know who did it, right? What's the

big deal?' But both Watergate and this book told me to ask, 'Could there

have been a conspiracy in Dallas?'

"Already disturbed by the high crimes and misdemeanors of a fallen

president as a result of the Watergate scandal, I was shaken to the

core. Watergate had already convinced me that the government could lie

to its own people. This book forced me to ask the question whether

sometimes it also kills them."

It was through the work of independent researcher Michael Canfield that

a copy of the Raleigh Call slip first became public. He secured a copy of

the slip, which became available as the result of a Freedom of

Information lawsuit filed by a civil rights activist, while conducting

research for the 1975 book Coup d'Etat in America. The book, co-

authored with Alan Weberman, was the first major work to deal with the

Raleigh Call, and the slip was reprinted in the appendix.

On the slip were two numbers attributed to a "John Hurt": one for a John

W. Hurt, one for a John D. Hurt. Canfield called both numbers. John W.

Hurt turned up nothing of interest. However, when Canfield spoke to

John D. Hurt, he sat stunned, silent when Hurt revealed, "I was in the

counterintelligence corps in the Army during World War II."

That Oswald called a former military intelligence officer from jail—only to

be assassinated by Jack Ruby a little more than 12 hours later—was

notable and, to that point, publicly undisclosed.

Proctor became aware of Oswald's attempted call while riding on a train

from Hartford to New York in 1980. Proctor was engrossed in Anthony

Summers' book about the assassination, Conspiracy, when he came

across a short paragraph about Oswald's call from jail: "The note

preserved by Mrs. Treon reportedly shows that Oswald booked a call to

Area Code 919."

Proctor says: "I remember being pulled up short after reading that,

thinking, 'Something about that sounds familiar.' It took a few seconds,

but then I realized the area code 919 was Raleigh, my hometown."

Proctor later dialed the first number on the phone slip and, to his

surprise, John D. Hurt answered and confirmed the revelations in

Canfield's book.

In the way in which researchers have built upon one another's work to

add to the wealth of information about the assassination, Proctor took

the Raleigh Call a step further: Suspecting that Oswald had intelligence

connections, he interviewed a former CIA agent.

Victor Marchetti was a 14-year veteran of the CIA who had served as

executive assistant to then-Deputy Director Richard Helms. Marchetti

had also written extensively about the Raleigh Call in The CIA and the

Cult of Intelligence, the first book on the assassination censored by the

U.S. government.

In an interview with Proctor, Marchetti stated that in calling Hurt,

Oswald was clearly following standard procedure for a CIA asset under

duress. This includes contacting his case officer through a "cut-out," an

intermediary with no direct involvement in an operation—John Hurt.

"[Oswald] was probably calling his cut-out. He was calling somebody who

could put him in touch with his case officer," Marchetti told Proctor. "He

couldn't go beyond that person. There's no way he could. He just had to

depend on this person to say, 'OK, I'll deliver the message.' Now, if the

cut-out has already been alerted to cut him off and ignore him, then ..."

Here is an excerpt from Proctor's interview with Marchetti:

Proctor: OK, if someone was an agent, and he was involved in

something, and nobody believes he is an agent ... He is arrested, and

trying to communicate, let's say, and he is one of you guys. What is the

procedure?

Marchetti: I'd kill him.

Proctor: If I was an agent for the [Central Intelligence] Agency, and I

was involved in something involving the law domestically and the FBI,

would I have a contact to call?

Marchetti: Yes.

Proctor: A verification contact?

Marchetti: Yes, you would.

Proctor: Would I be dead?

Marchetti: It would depend on the situation. If you get into bad trouble,

we're not going to verify you. No how, no way.

Proctor: But there is a call mechanism set up.

Marchetti: Yes.

Proctor: So it is conceivable that Lee Harvey Oswald was ....

Marchetti: That's what he was doing. He was trying to call in and say,

"Tell them I'm all right."

Proctor: Was that his death warrant?

Marchetti: You betcha.

Whether the switchboard operator connected Oswald's call is irrelevant,

especially since there appeared to be government agents monitoring the

activity. His intentions were enough. As Marchetti told Proctor: "This

time [Oswald] went over the dam, whether he knew it or not, or whether

they set him up or not. He was over the dam. At this point it was

executive action." Assassination.

Proctor says he remembers thinking, as he had Marchetti on the phone:

"I have really stepped over into a place where I have NO referent at all. I

had no background for the necessarily dirty world of spycraft. I suppose

now, 30-plus years later, I have just about the same reaction."

Raleigh wasn't Oswald's only connection to North Carolina. Although the

U.S. government has contended that Oswald defected to the Soviet

Union, he had been spotted at the Illusionary Warfare Training base in

Nags Head, which instructed young idealists to be fake defectors to the

Soviet Union.

Marchetti wrote that the program created "young men who were made to

appear disenchanted, poor, American youths who had become turned off

and wanted to see what communism was all about."

The existence of the Nags Head base was confirmed in the 2004

testimony of former CIA pilot William "Tosh" Plumlee:

"When I later learned [in November 1963] that Oswald had been arrested

as the lone assassin, I remembered having met him on a number of

previous occasions which were connected with intelligence training

matters, first at Illusionary Warfare Training in Nags Head, North Carolina,

then in Honolulu at radar installation and at Oahu's Wheeler Air Force

Base, then in Dallas at an Oak Cliff safe house on North Beckley Street

run by Alpha 66's Hernandez group, who had worked out of Miami prior to

the assassination."

Oswald's intelligence connections were further verified in a 1975

congressional investigation.

In September of that year, U.S. Rep. Richard Schweiker was appointed

to chair the Select Committee to Study Governmental Operations with

Respect to Intelligence Activities. Schweiker had the credentials for the

job: He had served on the Church Committee, which revealed gross

misconduct of the CIA, FBI and the military in their surveillance of U.S.

citizens.

The Select Committee was tasked to investigate intelligence agencies

with respect to the JFK assassination. Afterward, Schweiker revealed:

"We do know Oswald had intelligence connections. Everywhere you look

with him, there are the fingerprints of intelligence."

A year later, Congress launched another investigation, this one by the

House Select Committee on Assassinations (HSCA), also charged with

probing the assassinations of JFK and the Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.

Surell Brady was on the committee's staff and investigated the Raleigh

Call. Brady wrote an exhaustive 28-page report outlining Canfield and

Weberman's findings. Although the report clearly states that Oswald

attempted to call a former military intelligence officer with whom he had

no identifiable ties, that detail was omitted from the HSCA Final Report.

The trend of ignoring provocative evidence in government investigations

continued.

The Raleigh Call remains one of the most disturbing, unexplained and

ignored aspects of the JFK assassination. In an interview Proctor

conducted with HSCA Chief Counsel G. Robert Blakey, he reaffirmed what

has become the last official word on Oswald's attempted call. "I consider

it unanswered," Blakey said, "and I consider the direction in which it went

substantiated and disturbing, but ultimately inconclusive. The bottom line

is, it's an unanswerable mystery."

As we enter the 50th year after the assassination, expect an onslaught

of books, television programs and movies pertaining to the assassination.

Virtually every network will produce a show purporting to have the

definitive word on the JFK assassination. Judging from previous efforts,

they will likely support the conclusions of the Warren Commission and not

those of the government's more recent investigations. And odds are good

that researchers who have uncovered key documents will be, at best,

dismissed.

You can find the enormous body of work at Andy Winiarczyk's Last

Hurrah Bookshop in Williamsport, Pa., the world's definitive book store

devoted to the JFK assassination. The three-story converted house

reveals the massive scale of independent research: more than 2,000

titles. Of those, only a small minority reflect the Warren Report.

The rest document the indefatigable work of independent researchers

such as Proctor, whose findings have added up into a coherent and

compelling counter-narrative. "In many cases, researchers fight the

institutions for years—FOIA request after FOIA request—trying to get

one document pertaining to one tiny piece of evidence," said Andy, as

he's known among his fellow researchers. "When they finally get that

piece of information, they piece it together with their previous research

or with the research of others, and then write a book. And while that

one book might be incomplete, taken in toto with the work of the

research community, the truth behind the assassination becomes quite

clear."

Despite the 2,000 titles at the Last Hurrah, most of the national

attention given to books about the assassination has focused on just

two works that defend the government's official version: MSNBC

contributor Gerald Posner's best-seller Case Closed, published in 1993,

and 2007's Reclaiming History by former Los Angeles prosecutor Vincent

Bugliosi.

Posner's Case Closed was released in time for the 30th anniversary of the

assassination. "It caught this incredible wave," Andy says. "It appeared

on the desks of all the major media who would say, 'We don't have to

read anymore, we don't have to trouble ourselves, here's someone who's

sorted it all out.'"

But Posner's research was selective. Although he reviewed the 26

volumes of the Warren Report, Andy says, "he found what he wished to

find. But he didn't go really much beyond that."

Nonetheless, Posner made the press rounds: 60 Minutes, network

specials, the Sunday morning political roundtables and even the morning

shows. Posner appeared on the Today Show in the now infamous

segment "Truth or Conspiracy." Host Katie Couric proclaimed that the

three to four years Posner spent on the case amounted to "tons and

tons of research."

While Case Closed was a best-seller, Bugliosi's 1,648-page defense of the

Warren Report hovered at No. 800 in the Amazon rankings. Yet even at

that length, the book ignores the staggering 6 million documents that

have been released under the JFK Records Act, as well as the mountains

of independent research.

The book's dismal sales didn't dissuade media outlets from booking its

author. A staunch supporter of the Warren Report, Bugliosi appeared on

The Colbert Report, The Daily Show, C-Span and 20/20 to herald his

confirmation of the government's version of events—and in doing so,

marginalizing the work and evidence that counters that view.

"The dismissal and ostracizing of the pro-conspiracy group—including

independent researchers, members of Congress and congressional

investigators—continues [to this day]," Proctor says.

The media's role in perpetuating the official government version is

significant—and very effective. And for good reason: Reporters and

editors have helped the government itself.

Among the revelations of the Church Committee hearings was CIA

Document #1035-960. This document, dated Jan. 4, 1967, and marked

"PSYCH" for Psychological Warfare, directs CIA agents to counter critics

of the Warren Report by using "liaison and friendly elite contacts

(especially politicians and editors)" and "to employ propaganda assets to

answer and refute the attacks of the critics."

Those cozy relationships were revealed in 1977, when Washington Post

reporter Carl Bernstein—who had earned fame from his groundbreaking

Watergate coverage—wrote extensively on information released by the

Church Committee. His article detailing revelations of the committee

hearings, The CIA and the Media, appeared in the Oct. 20, 1977, issue of

Rolling Stone. The article exposed details of Operation Mockingbird, the

CIA's effort to control the media.

Through documentary evidence, Bernstein revealed a list of high-profile

media organizations that willingly cooperated with the CIA: These include

ABC, NBC, the Associated Press, Reuters, Newsweek, The Miami Herald

and even The Saturday Evening Post. "But the most valuable of these

associations, according to CIA officials, has been with The New York

Times, CBS, and Time Inc.," Bernstein wrote. Quoting an unnamed CIA

agent, Bernstein added, "One reporter is worth 20 agents."

Yet some of the most strident voices against the idea of conspiracy have

recanted, Proctor said. Case in point: Robert MacNeil of the

MacNeil/Lehrer NewsHour, who recently stated in a filmed interview for

the documentary Beyond JFK: "We've seen revealed one conspiracy after

another. Anybody would have to be a fool, nowadays, to dismiss

conspiracies. And perhaps we lived in a fool's paradise before the

Kennedy assassination."

Even New York Times columnist Tom Wicker, a former defender of the

Oswald-as-lone-nut theory, reconsidered his position. "I think there's

enough evidence now that there's certainly doubts about that," wrote

Wicker, a North Carolina native.

There are many psychological theories that people innately need to

believe in conspiracies. However, Walt Brown, author of numerous books

on the JFK assassination and a college history professor, offers a counter

view: "Imagine the police come to your house to tell you that, God

forbid, your daughter has been killed. Once you get it together, you ask,

'What happened?' Well, the cop tells you, we're not sure. It's either a

psycho that got loose from the asylum or a bunch of Hell's Angels that

killed her.

"In this scenario, the guy from the asylum was just one of those fluke

things that happens: an accident. At least it wasn't systemic,

institutional and organized. Well, Lee Oswald is the accident and

conspiracy is systemic. As a father, I'm going to pray for the accident."

John Judge, co-founder and director of the Coalition on Political

Assassinations, put it best: "The political paralysis in America is based on

the fact that we are allowed to believe anything but to know nothing,

[author] Martin Schotz said so perceptively in History Will Not Absolve

Us," Judge said. "And if you cannot know, you cannot act." That's

precisely why, Judge believes, the word of independent researchers is so

important.

Will we ever know the truth? We may already. "Who is to say that,

somewhere in that morass of opinion and deception, the real answer

hasn't already been revealed?" Proctor says. "The government and the

press—by abrogating their responsibilities—have deprived us of the

normal and official venues for discerning the truth."

It's important to know the truth about the Kennedy assassination not

only to correct the historical record but to reveal the motivations for

obscuring it in the first place. The knowledge should prompt us to be

circumspect about what we "know," and to question other official

versions of contemporary events.

"Why is it important?" Proctor asks. "For the same reason it was

important to Galileo to correct the prevailing official position that the sun

revolved around the earth. Those who have devoted their lives,

resources and intellect to trying to uncover the truth about the Kennedy

assassination have decided that, twice now, the U.S. government has

been less than candid about its conclusions on who killed the President

of the United States. At the level of American politics and freedom itself,

can there be a more worthy cause?"

______________________

Randolph Benson is an award-winning, Durham-based filmmaker. His films

have garnered the Gold Medal in the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and

Sciences' Student Academy Awards and a Kodak Excellence in Filmmaking

Award at the Cannes Film Festival, among others. His work has been

featured on the Bravo Network, the Independent Film Channel and UNC-

TV as well as several international channels.

His current project, The Searchers, is a portrait of researchers of the

Kennedy assassination. The film is slated for a spring release.

A graduate of Wake Forest University and the North Carolina School of

the Arts, Benson has taught at the Center for Documentary Studies at

Duke University for more than 10 years. Contact him at

rbenson@thesearchersfilm.com

(END QUOTE)

Best Regards in Research,

++Don

Donald Roberdeau

U.S.S. John F. Kennedy, CV-67, plank walker

Sooner, or later, The Truth emerges Clearly

For your key considerations....

Homepage: President KENNEDY "Men of Courage" speech, and Assassination Evidence, Witnesses, Suspects + Outstanding Researchers Discoveries and Considerations.... http://droberdeau.bl...ination_09.html

Dealey Plaza Map Detailing 11-22-63 Victims precise locations,

Witnesses, Films & Photos, Evidence, Suspected bullet trajectories, Important

information & Considerations, in One Convenient Resource.... http://img831.images...dated110110.gif

(updated map coming in 2012)

Visual Report: "The FirstBullet Impact Into President Kennedy: while JFK

was Hidden Under the 'magic-limbed-ricochet-tree' ".... http://img504.images...k1102308ms8.gif

Visual Report: Reality versus C.A.D. : the Real World, versus, Garbage-In, Garbage-Out.... http://img248.images...ealityvscad.gif

Discovery: "Very Close JFK Assassination Witness ROSEMARY WILLIS Zapruder Film Documented 2nd Headsnap: West, Ultrafast, and Directly Towards the Grassy Knoll".... http://educationforu...?showtopic=2394

T ogether

E veryone

A chieves

M ore

For the United States:

http://www.dhs.gov/dhspublic/

[Len Colby]

There are a few problems with the hullabaloo over the “Raleigh call”:

- There is no solid evidence LHO tried to make the call all we have are the comments of a witness not directly involved and a scrap of paper she produced of unknown provenance.

- Even IF the story were true we don’t know which John Hurt he was trying to reach.

- There is no evidence the John Hurt who was in Army Intelligence continued in the Army let alone an intel service after 1945.

- I've seen no evidence there was an "Illusionary Warfare Training" base or program.

- The fact that LHO did NOT know the guy’s phone number suggests he was not a contact. Don’t forget that he was able to memorize the Marine manual, but we are to believe he could remember a 10 digit phone number.

- AFAIK no one has explained why Hurt would have volunteered he had worked in intelligence if he was somehow involved in the plot.

- I have seen no evidence there ever was an "Illusionary Warfare Training" program or base.

Edited November 15, 2012 by Len Colby

[Mark Knight]

Jim Root and Robert Howard, members of this forum, have done extensive research on the Raleigh call. I understand that their research is ongoing.

[Guest Tom Scully]

Mark, need I remind you where we have been, and where we will now go? It is time to cast the bait in the hope someone will take it

and lose control of their emotions. Then, posts will be reported to moderators. Round and round we go, over and over. The "fisherman" then baits a new hook and casts it in the direction of another fish.

The Raleigh, N.C. phone call was referred to in this article by Proctor:

http://www.maryferre...747&relPageId=6

and in this document which refers to Navy Code 30 operations but doesn't give the location.

http://www.maryferre...absPageId=70399

http://www.maryferre...absPageId=40639

See also this note written by Ira David Wood III at http://www.blackopfo...php?topic=263.0

AUTHOR'S NOTE: Detailed information regarding the Raleigh telephone call was initially uncovered by Grover Proctor and Bernie Reeves and first reported in The Spectator, Raleigh, N.C.

Secret Service agent Abraham Bolden was the duty officer for the Secret Service's Chicago office on the weekend of the assassination. He states that the Secret Service office in Dallas contacted him late on the evening of the 23rd and requested a report on any phonetic spelling of "Hurt" or "Heard."

Gerry Patrick Hemming states that the CIA had access to "call forwarding" during the 50s and 60s - well before the general public knew of it. According to Hemming, "Call Forwarding," at this time, was a secret service available to various intelligence agencies. It is possible, therefore, that Oswald's Raleigh call was forwarded once it was routed through Raleigh, N.C. Hemming suggests that the call was possibly routed to either the Elizabeth City or Nags Head area of North Carolina.

The Warren Commission Report merely states that: "Between 4 and 4:30 p.m., Oswald made two telephone calls to Mrs. Ruth Paine at her home in Irving; at about 5:30 p.m. he was visited by the president of the Dallas Bar Association with whom he spoke for about 5 minutes. From 6 to 7:15 p.m. Oswald was interrogated once again in Captain Fritz' office and then returned to his cell. At 8 p.m. he called the Paine residence again and asked to speak to his wife, but Mrs. Paine told him that his wife was no longer there." The telephone call to Raleigh, NC is not mentioned by the Warren Commission. WC

SO - it IS possible that the call was routed to Nags Head ... but we do have a CIA base in Elizabeth City.

On a personal note, I know a lot of people on North Carolina's Outer Banks where Nags Head is located. There were, of course, cottages along the beach during the time Oswald could've received his training as a defector there - but the population was small enough so that the influx of even a dozen or so military personnel would've been noted. This, as I discovered, is the case. People I've talked to there remember around a dozen men who were sent to the Coast Guard station on the Outer Banks. The "word" was that they were recovering alcoholics involved in a program to rehabilitate them. Oswald could very well have been among them. So, Marchetti may be correct in asserting that Oswald quite probably received some of his training as a defector at or near Nags Head, North Carolina.

http://cryptome.org/...vey-eyeball.htm

Harvey Point Defense Testing Activity

Elizabeth City, NC

The Harvey Point facility was established in World War II as an operating base for blimps conducting anti-submarine surveillance of the Atlantic coast. It is used by CIA's Directorate of Operations for personnel training in explosives, paramilitary combat, and other clandestine warfare techniques.

Specifically,

the Point is where "hardcore" paramilitary ops are worked on

. The Farm teaches basics, relative to work done at the Point, from a paramilitary perspective. A course called AET, or Applied Explosive Techniques, is just one example. US Navy SEALs are frequently trained in this course of instruction. The group called SAD, or

Special Activities Division

, which is part of DS&T teaches many of these courses as well. SAD is an office devoted to sabotage techniques and blowing things up. They run training all the time--were responsible for the mining of the harbors down south about 10 years ago. SAD also runs EOD courses for the Secret Service.

Within the CIA's Directorate of Operation the areas are broken into the following organizational structures--divisions and staffs and branches, respectively. There is a PM Branch (or paramilitary branch) and their staff is called the Special Activities Staff or SAS. The Special Activities Staff is on par with CAG (Combat Applications Group, formerly Delta) and DevGroup (Naval SpecWar Development Group, former Seal Team 6) as far as operational ability and missions profile. It is considered a special mission unit [sMU], and carried out special collection activites (LRSU ops, etc), sabotage, friendly personnel/material recovery, threat pers/material snatches, BDAs, CT osp, raids, hostage rescue and other activities as directed by the President.

The SAS is a little known group working within the DO's paramilitary structure and is divided into branches: Ground Branch (handles land-based paramilitary combat, special collection activities, sabo, LRSU ops and training of agency personnel in counter terror/counter surv techniques at Camp Peary, Harvey Point, and two other areas within CONUS). The Maritime Branch handles all waterborne activites, such as the jet ski training in the Nevada lakes during the gulf war buildup as part of a insertion/Hostage rescue op. The Air Branch is the modern day version of Air America but to the entire world. Air Branch supplies al planes, helos and related air assets to the agency. If a bigwig needs to fly from HQ to STC (STC is agency parlance for Special Training Center, or Peary) they call on Air Branch, which is in the basement of the agency. If Ground branch needs an air platform for an insertion, they call on Air Branch.

Source

[Walters, Robert, "Going Underground,"

Inquiry,

2 February 1991, pages 12-16.]

I'm still trying to figure out which "giant Navy base" at Nag's Head, NC that Jim is talking about. I can't find a base AT Nags Head...there's the Naval base at Stumpy Point, NC [which, oddly enough, has no name listed on Google Maps]...and across East Lake I find Naval Air Station Chambers, listed on Google Maps as Norfolk, VA...but at Nags Head, I find nothing related to a naval base.

So which base is Jim talking about? Does this base have a name, as most do?

FWIW, in September, 1963 a patent was awarded in Canada for a "call forwarding arrangement" :

http://brevets-patents.ic.gc.ca/opic-cipo/cpd/eng/patent/671260/summary.html

Edited November 16, 2012 by Tom Scully

[Len Colby]

LOL I seriously doubt LHO or 'Tosh' trained at the Stumpy Point facility, it is an offshore weapons range.

http://hamptonroads....target-nc-coast

Elizabeth City is not a likely candidate either it is much larger than and 60 miles from Nags Head. Why would anyone describe it as Nag's Head? If any thing they would have referenced its location to more famous Cape Hatteras or Kitty Hawk And a Coast Guard Station which occasionally received some winos? Puleeze. And Nags Head was and is too small to hide a secret facility it is 1000 - 2000 feetwide and a couple miles long. The facility seems have been made up of whole cloth by Plumlee and Marchetti.

As for Hurt he had serious mental problems which dated to the mid-50s, more Chief Inspector Charles Dryfus than Bond or Smiley

http://www.groverpro...fk-hurtbio.html

Edited November 16, 2012 by Len Colby

[Len Colby]

Mark, need I remind you where we have been, and where we will now go? It is time to cast the bait in the hope someone will take it

and lose control of their emotions. Then, posts will be reported to moderators. Round and round we go, over and over. The "fisherman" then baits a new hook and casts it in the direction of another fish.

LOL a mod baits, then complains about baiting.

[David Lifton]

Good Day.... FYI....

http://www.indyweek.com/indyweek/jfk-oswald-and-the-raleigh-connection/Content?oid=3192079

**NOTE** There are additional article key considerations for your further reading provided by links from within the actual article

(QUOTE)

JFK, Oswald and the Raleigh Connection

by Randolph Benson

The call slip showing Oswald tried to place a collect call to John Hurt of Raleigh

It was 11:30 on a foggy night in Raleigh on Saturday, Nov. 23, 1963. The

previous afternoon, President John F. Kennedy had been shot on the

streets of Dallas. Just a block from the North Carolina State Capitol, at

201 Hillsborough St., Apartment No. 1 was about to be thrust into one of

the most profound mysteries behind the assassination. And it would be a

generation before its meaning would be understood.

[snipped . . to save space. DSL]

http://www.dhs.gov/dhspublic/

FWIW: I pursued this matter in the late 1960s. I called the number and spoke with John Hurt. Somewhere in one of my audio tape storage boxes, is a 5" reel of BASF tape on which the call was recorded. I do not remember the details today, but it was a fairly detailed, lengthy call, and I was satisfied, at the time, and after that call, that John Hurt was an alcoholic and that this lead was worthless. Today, over 40 years afterwards, I cannot recollect the details of that call--except that it proved to my satisfaction (and I was plenty curious at the time) that this particular lead (and the phone number) went nowhere.

If time and funds permitted (and they don't) I would be glad to go to the boxes of audiotapes that I have stored, locate this tape, and have it digitized, so that everyone could listen to it.

DSL

11/16/12; 10:35 AM

Los Angeles, California

Edited November 16, 2012 by David Lifton

[Mark Knight]

Mark, need I remind you where we have been, and where we will now go? It is time to cast the bait in the hope someone will take it

and lose control of their emotions. Then, posts will be reported to moderators. Round and round we go, over and over. The "fisherman" then baits a new hook and casts it in the direction of another fish.

LOL a mod baits, then complains about baiting.

I get it now. I read you loud and clear, Mr. Scully...and Mr. Colby.

This forum is no longer about the JFK assassination; it's about the personalities of the few remaining argumentative posters, and playing "bait" and "gotcha."

What a waste of such a once-valuable educational resource.

[J. Raymond Carroll]

I was satisfied, at the time, and after that call, that John Hurt was an alcoholic and that this lead was worthless.

If time and funds permitted (and they don't) I would be glad to go to the boxes of audiotapes that I have stored, locate this tape, and have it digitized, so that everyone could listen to it.

DSL

11/16/12; 10:35 AM

Los Angeles, California

Don't waste your time or money, David. The SUPPOSED Raleigh call is just another piece of fiction.

As I recall, this all stems from a lady who claims that she retrieved a note from the garbage,

copied it in her own handwriting, and then threw away the original,

even though the original (if there was one) would be a historic document.

If I am remembering correctly, this lady stuck to her story

only until she was asked to affirm it under penalty of perjury.

As for Victor Marchetti, I don't think it would be prudent to consider him a reliable source.

[J. Raymond Carroll]

As for Victor Marchetti, I don't think it would be prudent to consider him a reliable source.

On re-reading Grover Proctor's article, I see that none other than Bernard Fensterward

also features prominently in this piece of fiction.

No doubt serious students have their own questions

about Fensterward's mischief-making in this case.

http://www.groverproctor.us/jfk/jfk80.html

[Ken Pierce]

Mark, need I remind you where we have been, and where we will now go? It is time to cast the bait in the hope someone will take it

and lose control of their emotions. Then, posts will be reported to moderators. Round and round we go, over and over. The "fisherman" then baits a new hook and casts it in the direction of another fish.

LOL a mod baits, then complains about baiting.

I get it now. I read you loud and clear, Mr. Scully...and Mr. Colby.

This forum is no longer about the JFK assassination; it's about the personalities of the few remaining argumentative posters, and playing "bait" and "gotcha."

What a waste of such a once-valuable educational resource.

I couldn't agree more and I'm equally disappointed. Another example of this is the Thomas Graves thread. Thankfully, there remains a few whose posts I appreciate and eagerly anticipate, such as Bill Kelly. I must say, I miss the old days of civil discourse, back when James Richards was here. That being said, I appreciate John providing this forum, despite it's flaws. I suspect there will be some who think or say that I don't have the right to state this opinion, with me being someone who doesn't post. But, I say I do, as a member since 2007 and someone who has read nearly every thread ever posted on this forum. I just choose not to post. Happy Thanksgiving.

[Len Colby]

Good Day.... FYI....

http://www.indyweek.com/indyweek/jfk-oswald-and-the-raleigh-connection/Content?oid=3192079

**NOTE** There are additional article key considerations for your further reading provided by links from within the actual article

(QUOTE)

JFK, Oswald and the Raleigh Connection

by Randolph Benson

The call slip showing Oswald tried to place a collect call to John Hurt of Raleigh

It was 11:30 on a foggy night in Raleigh on Saturday, Nov. 23, 1963. The

previous afternoon, President John F. Kennedy had been shot on the

streets of Dallas. Just a block from the North Carolina State Capitol, at

201 Hillsborough St., Apartment No. 1 was about to be thrust into one of

the most profound mysteries behind the assassination. And it would be a

generation before its meaning would be understood.

[snipped . . to save space. DSL]

http://www.dhs.gov/dhspublic/

FWIW: I pursued this matter in the late 1960s. I called the number and spoke with John Hurt. Somewhere in one of my audio tape storage boxes, is a 5" reel of BASF tape on which the call was recorded. I do not remember the details today, but it was a fairly detailed, lengthy call, and I was satisfied, at the time, and after that call, that John Hurt was an alcoholic and that this lead was worthless. Today, over 40 years afterwards, I cannot recollect the details of that call--except that it proved to my satisfaction (and I was plenty curious at the time) that this particular lead (and the phone number) went nowhere.

If time and funds permitted (and they don't) I would be glad to go to the boxes of audiotapes that I have stored, locate this tape, and have it digitized, so that everyone could listen to it.

DSL

11/16/12; 10:35 AM

Los Angeles, California

This is such an obvious red herring I’m surprised anyone takes it seriously. As for the navy base near Elizabeth it was really run by the CIA but only starting in 1961.

NY Times 1998:

“In fact, Harvey Point is the place where, for the last 37 years, the Central Intelligence Agency has run secret paramilitary and counter-terrorism courses for thousands of its officers and select foreigners -- most recently, the Palestinian security forces, according to intelligence officials. Established weeks after the 1961 Bay of Pigs invasion, this school for spies has been shielded by secrecy, security fences and cypress trees festooned with Spanish moss ever since.”

http://www.nytimes.com/1998/03/20/world/is-the-explosion-noisy-base-a-cia-spy-school-what-base.html

Wikipedia:

Courthouse records indicate that in November 1942 the United States Navy purchased the point, roughly 1,200 acres (5 km²), for $41,751. The Navy then constructed an air station on the property for use during World War II. During WWII Harvey Point was used as a seaplane base.

After the war, the air station was deactivated until 1958 when the Navy announced Harvey Point would serve as the testing grounds for the Martin P6M Seamaster, an experimental long-range bomber. The project was thrown out in August 1959 when the Navy determined the aircraft wasn't successful enough for it to continue providing support for the program. Then, in 1961, the Navy returned to the property and announced that the property was closed to the public; it has remained that way ever since.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvey_Point#World_War_II

See here for more:

http://cryptome.org/eyeball/harvey/harvey-eyeball.htm

And as Ray Carroll pointed out the story makes no sense the operator claims to have tossed the original note and only came forward with her fable 5 – 7 years after the fact. She also claims the Secret Service wanted to listen in to the call but her collegue "[Louise] Swinney told [Oswald], 'I'm sorry, the number doesn't answer.' Swinney then unplugged and disconnected Oswald without ever really trying to put the call through."

And Davd I'm sure there are people who would be willing to digitilize those tapes or help you do so and there is free/cheap software that could facilitate the process.

[Len Colby]

Mark, need I remind you where we have been, and where we will now go? It is time to cast the bait in the hope someone will take it

and lose control of their emotions. Then, posts will be reported to moderators. Round and round we go, over and over. The "fisherman" then baits a new hook and casts it in the direction of another fish.

LOL a mod baits, then complains about baiting.

I get it now. I read you loud and clear, Mr. Scully...and Mr. Colby.

This forum is no longer about the JFK assassination; it's about the personalities of the few remaining argumentative posters, and playing "bait" and "gotcha."

What a waste of such a once-valuable educational resource.

I couldn't agree more and I'm equally disappointed. Another example of this is the Thomas Graves thread. Thankfully, there remains a few whose posts I appreciate and eagerly anticipate, such as Bill Kelly. I must say, I miss the old days of civil discourse, back when James Richards was here. That being said, I appreciate John providing this forum, despite it's flaws. I suspect there will be some who think or say that I don't have the right to state this opinion, with me being someone who doesn't post. But, I say I do, as a member since 2007 and someone who has read nearly every thread ever posted on this forum. I just choose not to post. Happy Thanksgiving.

Point taken, from now on I'll try to look the other way when sand is kicked in my face.

[J. Raymond Carroll]

I received this email from Gary Mack:

There is apparent film confirmation, and I have seen it: http://educationforu...420#entry232462

Gary

Gary is referring to an earlier thread which I must admit I had forgotten.

In that thread Gary stated

There is very good reason to believe the Dallas call really was outgoing. I've seen some ABC News film of their reporter, Bill Lord, on Sunday morning prior to Oswald being shot. Lord reported what he had learned from a DPD source which was that Oswald attempted to make a long distance call the night before but was told the call could not go through. Whether the intended recipient was John Hurt is, of course, unknown. But the event and phraseology certainly sound like the Hurt story.

Gary

Whether John Hurt was the intended recipient is unknown...... well that's a bit of a problem, ain't it.

And it's a pity Bill Lord did not identify his source,

so there was no way for anyone to check.

Under the Federal Rules, there are 24 exceptions to the rule against hearsay evidence.

Bill Lord's statement does not come under any of these exceptions

so it is not evidence ...... of anything.

I submit that the story of the SUPPOSED Raleigh phone call

rests soley on an uncorroborated witness,

and that "witness" refused to sign her name

to such a silly story.

[Len Colby]

I showed Louise Swinney, a Xerox copy of the slip containing information on a phone call placed by Lee Harvey Oswald to John Hurt, Raleigh, N.C. on November 23, 1963 and bearing her signature. She stated that it was defintely[ sic. ] not her signature. She was upset that someone had signed her name. She stated that she never handled a call from Oswald to John Hurt. She stated that she only handled a call from Oswald to Lawyer Apt [ sic. ] and another one that she cannot remember, but it was not to John Hurt. Mrs. Swinney insisted on giving me samples of her handwriting and told me that she would have no reason to lie. She stated that only someone working in the switchboard room could have made that out and Alveeeta Treon [ sic. ] was the only other person working that night. Signature: Harold A. Rose

http://www.groverproctor.us/jfk/jfk-1978-04-20-Swinney-OCR.html

Did Alveeta Treon originally claim the slip was the original?

Edited November 18, 2012 by Len Colby