Newseum displays "Oswald's shirt": Proof that he was Doorman!

[Chris Davidson]

Look at Robin's own video. The man he pretends to be Lovelady has his checkered shirt buttoned up to the neck.

But Doorman has his shirt open, not buttoned up to the neck. Therefore, this person cannot possibly be Doorman.

A little help from Hughes.

chris

[Robin Unger]

Thanks Chris

[Thomas Graves]

Look at Robin's own video. The man he pretends to be Lovelady has his checkered shirt buttoned up to the neck.

But Doorman has his shirt open, not buttoned up to the neck. Therefore, this person cannot possibly be Doorman.

A little help from Hughes.

chris

Chris and Robin,

It's absolutely BLOWS MY MIND that after all these years you don't realize that all of the photos and films taken that day in Dealey Plaza were faked, and that the conspirators even went so far as to arrange for a Fake Lovelady to stand in front of the TSBD after the assassination just in case he happened to get caught on film by photographers like John Martin and Robert Hughes! And how do we know that it was a fake Lovelady that they got on film? Because the dude had his shirt buttoned all the way up! That fact, given the fact that "Oswald's shirt" in Altgens-6 was unbuttoned at least halfway, absolutely proves that this professional actor who was caught on film after the assassination was a Fake Lovelady! Only a moron or a shill (or a latter-day co-conspirator?) would deny it or have the gall to suggest that the real Lovelady had, after the assassination, simply decided to button his shirt up. And, "Why in the world," any self-respecting RESEARCHER must ask, "would the so-called "Real Lovelady" have done such a silly, silly thing?" The moron would probably reply that the real Lovelady may have intuited that there were several very busy photographers in front of the TSBD right after the assassination and, being a little self-conscious about having his shirt unbuttoned so dang far, decided to make himself a bit more "socially-presentable" to the at-that-time-emerging "hot media" Marshall McLuhan world by BUTTONING THE SUCKER UP. But such a simple explanation would be unbelievably simple and therefore SILLY, wouldn't it?

So, Chris and Robin, please don't waste your time trying to spot bad guys doing bad things in the photos, and don't even think about trying to thwart our efforts to photographically prove that Oswald was edited out of any exonerating photos and films. Yes, I know that it hard to "prove a negative of a positive of a negative of a positive...." But hey, where there's a will there's a way!

Chris and Robin, don't even try to analyze the photos and films except, of course, to look for indications of alteration or fabrication, because all of your so-called "normal" efforts are doomed to failure and that means, of course, that it's virtually impossible that you'll ever get any positive clues, photographically-speaking, about who killed JFK.

And don't think about analyzing all them documents neither 'cause they all been faked, too...

Oh, and as regards the clip from the Hughes film that Chris posted above on this thread and which purports to show Lovelady wearing his shirt unbuttoned after the assassination, all I can say is, "NICE TRY, CHRIS!" Anyone with a bare minimum of two (2) functioning brain cells and one (1) working eye can SEE that it's faked!

PS-- Anyone who disagrees with me on any of the above is, at best just being childish, childish, childish, childish, childish, childish, childish...

( Tommy )

Edited March 1, 2013 by Thomas Graves

[Don Jeffries]

What I can't understand is the massively irrational resistance to simple questions

that settle the matter decisively. I have asked Robin Unger whether, if Lovelady

was wearing the red-and-white, vertically striped short-sleeved shirt he wore for

the FBI, then could Lovelady possibly have been Doorman? The answer is, "No!"

But Robin Unger turns into a mass of quivering jello and won't answer the question.

WHY NOT?

Similarly, he posts film footage showing a man wearing the red-and-black-with-white

lines shirt often claimed to have been THE SHIRT LOVELADY WAS REALLY WEARING

but when I point out that that shirt is BUTTONED TO THE NECK, WHILE DOORMAN'S

SHIRT IS OBVIOUSLY NOT, which means that HE CANNOT HAVE BEEN DOORMAN. But

Robin is not willing to admit it. Again, this is a simple but decisive point based upon

evidence he has presented. The man in the checkered shirt CANNOT BE DOORMAN.

WHY NOT ADMIT IT?

Then he runs away and stars musing about the FBI, where he is off-base once again.

J. Edgar asked for proof that Doorman was Lovelady. But Billy arrived wearing a red-

and-white, vertically striped short-sleeved shirt, which they photographed and sent to

FBI Headquarters. They were not about to disappoint the director, so they sent him

their report and stated that it proved Doorman was Lovelady--and hoped he wouldn't

notice and they would not be sacked or sent to Siberia! Robin suggests that Lovelady

"innocently" wore the wrong shirt. But that is simply absurd! How could anyone go to

the FBI to show them the shirt he was wearing during the assassination of the President

of the United States and INNOCENTLY WEAR THE WRONG SHIRT? And he confirmed

it was the shirt he had been wearing with Jones Harris, when he interviewed Lovelady.

WHY IS ROBIN GRASPING AFTER STRAWS?

His last line of defense is to ask, "Where was Billy?" But we have figured out where he

was. I have asked these simple questions as a test of Robin's research integrity as to

whether he is even willing to admit OBVIOUS ANSWERS TO SIMPLE QUESTIONS that

go against his preferred position. You can see how he has responded. So many have

gone so far out on a limb to attack me and Richard and Ralph for research that has the

consequence of blowing the case wide open BECAUSE IT IS SUCH A SIMPLE PROOF

THAT THE WHOLE GOVERNMENT'S POSITION WAS FABRICATED FROM THE START.

Everyone KNEW that Lee was in the doorway and cannot have been a shooter! But that

could not be admitted without implicating key officials in a massive and detailed cover-up.

SO WHERE WAS BILLY?

Jim, here's my attempt to make your same points without your trademark style, which seems to turn the majority of readers off, so that they ignore the strength of your arguments:

I can't understand theresistance to an issue that would settle the matter decisively. I have asked Robin Unger whether, if Lovelady was wearing the red-and-white, vertically striped short-sleeved shirt he wore for the FBI, then could Lovelady possibly have been Doorman?

Robin has posted film footage showing a man wearing the red-and-black-with-white lines shirt often claimed to have been the shirt Lovelady was really wearing. I point out that that shirt is buttoned to the neck, while doorman's shirt is obvioulsy not. This would mean he cannot have been doorman. This is a simple but decisive point based upon evidence he himself has presented. The man in the checkered shirt cannot be doorman.

J. Edgar Hoover asked for proof that Doorman was Lovelady. But Billy arrived wearing a red-and-white, vertically striped short-sleeved shirt, which they photographed and sent to FBI Headquarters. They were not about to disappoint the director, so they sent him their report and stated that it proved Doorman was Lovelady--and hoped he wouldn't notice and they would not be sacked or sent to Siberia! Robin suggests that Lovelady "innocently" wore the wrong shirt. How could anyone go to the FBI to show them the shirt he was wearing during the assassination of the President of the United States and innocently wear the wrong shirt? And he confirmed it was the shirt he had been wearing with Jones Harris, when he interviewed Lovelady.

Robin asks, "Where was Billy?" But we have figured out where he was.You can see how he has responded. So many have attacked me and Richard and Ralph for research that has the consequence of blowing the case wide open because it is such a simple proof that the whole government's position was fabricated from the start.

Everyone knew that Lee was in the doorway and cannot have been a shooter. But that could not be admitted without implicating key officials in a massive and detailed cover-up.

For what it's worth....

Edited March 1, 2013 by Don Jeffries

[Thomas Graves]

What I can't understand is the massively irrational resistance to simple questions

that settle the matter decisively. I have asked Robin Unger whether, if Lovelady

was wearing the red-and-white, vertically striped short-sleeved shirt he wore for

the FBI, then could Lovelady possibly have been Doorman? The answer is, "No!"

But Robin Unger turns into a mass of quivering jello and won't answer the question.

WHY NOT?

Similarly, he posts film footage showing a man wearing the red-and-black-with-white

lines shirt often claimed to have been THE SHIRT LOVELADY WAS REALLY WEARING

but when I point out that that shirt is BUTTONED TO THE NECK, WHILE DOORMAN'S

SHIRT IS OBVIOUSLY NOT, which means that HE CANNOT HAVE BEEN DOORMAN. But

Robin is not willing to admit it. Again, this is a simple but decisive point based upon

evidence he has presented. The man in the checkered shirt CANNOT BE DOORMAN.

WHY NOT ADMIT IT?

Then he runs away and stars musing about the FBI, where he is off-base once again.

J. Edgar asked for proof that Doorman was Lovelady. But Billy arrived wearing a red-

and-white, vertically striped short-sleeved shirt, which they photographed and sent to

FBI Headquarters. They were not about to disappoint the director, so they sent him

their report and stated that it proved Doorman was Lovelady--and hoped he wouldn't

notice and they would not be sacked or sent to Siberia! Robin suggests that Lovelady

"innocently" wore the wrong shirt. But that is simply absurd! How could anyone go to

the FBI to show them the shirt he was wearing during the assassination of the President

of the United States and INNOCENTLY WEAR THE WRONG SHIRT? And he confirmed

it was the shirt he had been wearing with Jones Harris, when he interviewed Lovelady.

WHY IS ROBIN GRASPING AFTER STRAWS?

His last line of defense is to ask, "Where was Billy?" But we have figured out where he

was. I have asked these simple questions as a test of Robin's research integrity as to

whether he is even willing to admit OBVIOUS ANSWERS TO SIMPLE QUESTIONS that

go against his preferred position. You can see how he has responded. So many have

gone so far out on a limb to attack me and Richard and Ralph for research that has the

consequence of blowing the case wide open BECAUSE IT IS SUCH A SIMPLE PROOF

THAT THE WHOLE GOVERNMENT'S POSITION WAS FABRICATED FROM THE START.

Everyone KNEW that Lee was in the doorway and cannot have been a shooter! But that

could not be admitted without implicating key officials in a massive and detailed cover-up.

SO WHERE WAS BILLY?

Jim, here's my attempt to make your same points without your trademark style, which seems to turn the majority of readers off, so that they ignore the strength of your arguments:

I can't understand theresistance to an issue that would settle the matter decisively. I have asked Robin Unger whether, if Lovelady was wearing the red-and-white, vertically striped short-sleeved shirt he wore for the FBI, then could Lovelady possibly have been Doorman?

Robin has posted film footage showing a man wearing the red-and-black-with-white lines shirt often claimed to have been the shirt Lovelady was really wearing. I point out that that shirt is buttoned to the neck, while doorman's shirt is obvioulsy not. This would mean he cannot have been doorman. This is a simple but decisive point based upon evidence he himself has presented. The man in the checkered shirt cannot be doorman.

J. Edgar Hoover asked for proof that Doorman was Lovelady. But Billy arrived wearing a red-and-white, vertically striped short-sleeved shirt, which they photographed and sent to FBI Headquarters. They were not about to disappoint the director, so they sent him their report and stated that it proved Doorman was Lovelady--and hoped he wouldn't notice and they would not be sacked or sent to Siberia! Robin suggests that Lovelady "innocently" wore the wrong shirt. How could anyone go to the FBI to show them the shirt he was wearing during the assassination of the President of the United States and innocently wear the wrong shirt? And he confirmed it was the shirt he had been wearing with Jones Harris, when he interviewed Lovelady.

Robin asks, "Where was Billy?" But we have figured out where he was.You can see how he has responded. So many have attacked me and Richard and Ralph for research that has the consequence of blowing the case wide open because it is such a simple proof that the whole government's position was fabricated from the start.

Everyone knew that Lee was in the doorway and cannot have been a shooter. But that could not be admitted without implicating key officials in a massive and detailed cover-up.

For what it's worth....

Don,

With, of course, some minor editing, like, for example--

"I can't understand the resistance to an issue that would, I feel, settle the matter decisively."

and,

"The man in the checkered shirt cannot have been the doorman, unless he (for some inexplicablye reason) buttoned up his shirt shortly after the assassination."

(etc.)

Thank you,

--Tommy

Edited March 1, 2013 by Thomas Graves

[Robin Unger]

Quote:

Robin asks, "Where was Billy?" But we have figured out where he was.

Oh yeh that's right !

They turned him into a black Hole.

[Robin Unger]

Quote:

And he confirmed it was the shirt he had been wearing with Jones Harris, when he interviewed Lovelady.

Where can i find the Jones Harris interview. ?

Please post the evidence that the FBI specifically asked Lovelady to make sure that he wore the "doorman shirt " when going to have his photo's taken.

Edited March 1, 2013 by Robin Unger

[Robin Unger]

Quote:

I can't understand theresistance to an issue that would settle the matter decisively. I have asked Robin Unger whether, if Lovelady was wearing the red-and-white, vertically striped short-sleeved shirt he wore for the FBI, then could Lovelady possibly have been Doorman?

That whole sequence defies Logic.

on the one hand, we are expected to believe that Lovelady told the FBI, that the "red and white striped short sleeve shirt" that he was wearing during the photo session

was the same shirt he was wearing on 22/11/63

While at the same time, identifying himself as being the individual wearing the "brown check long sleeved shirt". commonly known as doorman, who appeared in many newspapers in Altgen's 6

and that the FBI didn't ask him any questions, to try to clarify the discrepancies in his story. ? ( before sending of that rediculous explanation to Hoover ? )

Edited March 1, 2013 by Robin Unger

[Robin Unger]

Anybody who has followed Chris's posts over the years know that he is an " Alterationist "

so it appears you are taking aim at one of your own Thomas.

By the way Alterationist or not, i consider Chris to be a friend, we collaborated on a projects on Duncan's Forum along with Martin Hinrichs and others.( Rosemary Willis in Dorman )

Bernice is also an Alterationist, and i consider her to be a friend

So you see, i am not against ALL alterationist.

Just the blowhards and big heads, who try to ram this crap down our throats.

[Len Colby]

Anybody who has followed Chris's posts over the years know that he is an " Alterationist "

so it appears you are taking aim at one of your own Thomas.

Tommy was being tounge in cheek, he's one of us Yes Chris is an alterationist, but even like most of them he seems not to be buying this Lovelady krapola.

So you see, i am not against ALL alterationist.

Just the blowhards and big heads, who try to ram this crap down our throats.

Huh?????

There's no one like that on this forum!

[Guest James H. Fetzer]

The exhibited shirt looks (to me anyway) more like the doorman shirt than the checked shirt which Lovelady may or may not have been wearing. That is not to say that I think the exhibited shirt IS the Doorman shirt. I think there appears to be several inconsistencies, however these may be explained by cleaning/pressing.

The Doorman shirt looks nothing like the vertically striped shirt that Lovelady was pictured wearing.

Neither shirt that Lovelady is alleged to have worn on the day looks like the Doorman shirt to me.

And if I may ask what might be an embarrassing (to me) question - did not Oswald change his shirt at his rooming house after leaving the TSBD? If this is the case, then the shirt Oswald was wearing when arrested was not the shirt he wore to work that morning.

Martin, Thanks for a rational response to the evidence. Even the Warren Commission concluded that he had not changed his shirt. And it would have been a remarkable coincidence indeed had he changed his shirt and yet it corresponded so closely to the shirt on the man in the doorway!

[Guest James H. Fetzer]

Anybody who has followed Chris's posts over the years know that he is an " Alterationist "

so it appears you are taking aim at one of your own Thomas.

By the way Alterationist or not, i consider Chris to be a friend, we collaborated on a projects on Duncan's Forum along with Martin Hinrichs and others.( Rosemary Willis in Dorman )

Bernice is also an Alterationist, and i consider her to be a friend

So you see, i am not against ALL alterationist.

Just the blowhards and big heads, who try to ram this crap down our throats.

Thanks, Don, for the kinder and gentler phrasing. Why does it not surprise me that Robin Unger is STILL grasping after straws, STILL not answering simple questions with obvious answers, and attacking me for embarrassing him by displaying the proof that Doorman was Oswald.

(1) The Altgens6 has OBVIOUSLY been altered (where we have Obfuscated Man (with his face obscured), Black Tie Man (both in front of and behind Doorman at the same time), Doorman (with a missing left shoulder), and the anomalous appearance of the profile of a black man.

(2) The shirt and undershirt on Doorman bears striking similarity to the shirt and undershirt Oswald was wearing. In other articles on this subject, Richard Hooke has established more than 27 features of both shirts that make their identity beyond doubt (which I will gladly recommend).

(3) The shirt that Billy Lovelady shows the FBI was a red-and-white, vertically striped short-sleeved shirt. They took photos of it, they described it in their letter to J. Edgar, and Billy confirmed it was the shirt he had been wearing to Jones Harris. It is not even remotely like Doorman's shirt.

(4) The only other candidate is a man filmed in front of the Book Depository wearing a black-and-white checkered shirt, which is not even a close match. He is bulging at the seams; Doorman is not. His shirt is buttoned up to the top; Doorman's is not. And he does not look like Lovelady.

(5) The dispute is whether Doorman was Oswald or Lovelady. There are massive similarities between Oswald and his shirt and the shirt of Doorman. There are blatant dissimilarities with Lovelady's shirt and with the checkered shirt. It cannot have been Billy or Gorilla Man. It was Lee.

The discrepancy between a person's professed beliefs and those that are rational, given the available evidence, is a measure of their degree of irrationality. In this case, the divergence between Robin Unger's professed beliefs and what is rational under the circumstances is staggering.

I have been trying to keep the argument as simple as possible. The reasons for excluding Checkered Shirt Man are extensive and go far beyond that his shirt is buttoned to the top. He is also too robust to be Doorman and his shirt itself is not the same. All these are grounds to exclude him.

The reason I have pressed Robin Unger on this is because it constitutes a litmus test of research integrity. Not only do we have proof that Doorman resembles Oswald and his shirt (given they made some tweaks) but that Doorman is clearly not Lovelady or Gorilla Man. Yet he is unwilling to admit it.

Edited March 1, 2013 by James H. Fetzer

[Guest James H. Fetzer]

Here is one of Richard's studies demonstrating 27 features that are the same between those shirts:

Here is a reconstruction of how they imposed features of Lovelady over Oswald to obfuscate his identity:

The problem historically has been focusing on the obfuscated face rather than the more telling clothing.

Edited March 1, 2013 by James H. Fetzer

[Thomas Graves]

Anybody who has followed Chris's posts over the years know that he is an " Alterationist "

so it appears you are taking aim at one of your own Thomas.

Tommy was being tongue in cheek, he's one of us

[...]

That's right, Len, it was my spoof of a particular member of this forum whom Robin has (correctly, imho) alleged is a "blowhard."

FWIW, I, too, am an "alterationist" since I do believe that the (exit) wound in the lower right rear of JFK's head was photographically touched up/obscured in the Z-film and in the autopsy photos and x-rays. But do I believe that the Z-film was massively altered? No.

AND THE FACT THAT ROBIN DIDN'T PICK UP ON MY POST'S BEING WAS A SPOOF ON "BLOWHARD" IS ABSOLUTELY MIND-BOGGLING ! (Laughing Out Loud)

--Tommy

Edited March 1, 2013 by Thomas Graves

[Robin Unger]

WC CE -1480

Click on image to view full size.

Quote:

Jones Harris flew to Dallas, met with Lovelady and talked with him for about a quarter of an hour.

Lovelady told him yes, it was he standing in the doorway.

Lovelady also told him that the FBI had taken several pictures of him, presumably to compare with the AP picture

of the assassination scene.

Lovelady also said that on November 22 he was wearing a red and white striped sports shirt buttoned near the neck

Edited March 1, 2013 by Robin Unger