The Errors of my Ways

[Len Colby]

So you think Cleland was "in on it"? And as you noted Rummy was just "down the hall from...the War Room".

[Ron Ecker]

So you think Cleland was "in on it"?

No, I have no idea what was going on with Cleland. I think the comment you quoted that he made to Myers in the confirmation hearing may have been dripping with sarcasm, as if he was saying, "Lucky we were meeting where we did, you no-good *********."

It is also worth noting that Cleland was removed from the 9/11 Commission (i.e. given a nice cushy job by the Bush Administration which required him to "resign" from the commission).

And as you noted Rummy was just "down the hall from...the War Room".

Yes, without the curiosity of a cat as to what the War Room or anyone else knew about what was happening in the attack on America. But nice of you to defend that -- I can't say it.

[Len Colby]

So you think Cleland was "in on it"?

No, I have no idea what was going on with Cleland. I think the comment you quoted that he made to Myers in the confirmation hearing may have been dripping with sarcasm, as if he was saying, "Lucky we were meeting where we did, you no-good *********."

I doubt it he made a few similar comments on other occasions:

CNN, November 20, 2001

KING: Senator Cleland, where were you on the morning of -- of that horrible morning of September 11? CLELAND: Believe it or not, I was meeting with the new chairman of the joint chiefs of staff, in my office at the very moment that the Pentagon was hit. And -- shortly after the World Trade Center was hit -- and he and I now look at one another with a sense of awe that I'm glad he was not -- and he is glad that he wasn't walking around the Pentagon, where he could have gotten killed and he was instead in my office, meeting with me as a member of the Armed Services Committee.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0111/20/lkl.00.html

Atlanta Journal-Constitution, 16th June 2003

I would like to fast-forward to September 11, 2001. I was in my office in the Senate discussing the future of American defenses, particularly against worldwide terrorism, with the new Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Gen. Meyers. The first plane had already hit the World Trade Center and Gen. Meyers bolted from his seat. We rushed into an adjoining office as we saw on TV the second plane slam into the second tower. Gen. Meyers rushed out of my office, headed for the Pentagon. At that moment, the Pentagon was hit.

http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/metro/insider/0603/061603.html

It is also worth noting that Cleland was removed from the 9/11 Commission (i.e. given a nice cushy job by the Bush Administration which required him to "resign" from the commission).

Nah, you've been reading too much David Ray Grifter. Cleland resigned for two reasons one was frustration over how the Bush Administration was stonewalling the commission, the to join the board of the Export-Import Bank but “Senate Democrats announced [in the summer of 2003] that they had recommended him for a Democratic slot on the board”, were they “in on it” too?

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/12/05/us/ex-senator-will-soon-quit-9-11-panel-leaving-gap-for-victims-advocates.html

And as you noted Rummy was just "down the hall from...the War Room".

Yes, without the curiosity of a cat as to what the War Room or anyone else knew about what was happening in the attack on America. But nice of you to defend that -- I can't say it.

I'm not saying it was the right thing to do, but I don't see this as evidence of foreknowledge. Let's not forget there were no know hijackings at the time two planes that left Logan minutes apart for LAX had crashed into the two iconic towers of the same complex in NYC everyone might have suspected there was more to come

[Ron Ecker]

Atlanta Journal-Constitution, 16th June 2003

I would like to fast-forward to September 11, 2001. I was in my office in the Senate discussing the future of American defenses, particularly against worldwide terrorism, with the new Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Gen. Meyers. The first plane had already hit the World Trade Center and Gen. Meyers bolted from his seat. We rushed into an adjoining office as we saw on TV the second plane slam into the second tower. Gen. Meyers rushed out of my office, headed for the Pentagon. At that moment, the Pentagon was hit.

http://www.ajc.com/m...603/061603.html

So who do you believe? Cleland says they saw the second plane hit and Myers rushed out. Myers said no one told him about the second plane and he didn't rush anywhere, he left Cleland's office when their meeting was concluded (just about the time the Pentagon was hit). I would believe Cleland over Myers. So do you have any theory as to why Myers would lie through his teeth about it? The Family Steering Committee wanted some explanation of Myers' story, but again the 9/11 Commission didn't have the guts to ask him, even though he appeared twice before the commission. Do you have any theory as to why the commission wouldn't ask him to explain his story?

These are rhetorical questions, because as I said earlier in the thread you seem bound and determined to accept the official story no matter what. I really don't want to spend more time on it, though I believe the time in this thread has not been wasted. I have encountered no one in any forum who has offered any reasonable explanation of the behavior of Rumsfeld and Myers during the attacks (as described in their very own words), and you haven't either, because it's impossible.

[Len Colby]

Actually Ron it's a bit more complex than that, Cleland and Myers varied a bit on the details of i] if they were told about the 2^nd crash during the meeting or if they found out after it ended and ii] when exactly the latter left for the Pentagon. One could chalk that up to in precise memories or conspiracy, I assume you will go with the latter but would be gained by lying about such matters?

http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a903myerslearns#a903myerslearns

[Ron Ecker]

Cleland and Myers varied a bit on the details of i] if they were told about the 2^nd crash during the meeting or if they found out after it ended

Baloney. Myers categorically stated that no one told them about the 2nd crash, and that he left the meeting just about the time the Pentagon was hit. If they were told during the meeting, why in the world would Myers state that they weren't? And if they weren't told during the meeting, why the hell not? Cleland said that they were, which is the only believable scenario, which makes Myers a xxxx, and Myers had to know that Cleland knew he was a xxxx. But did Myers have any need to worry? Of course not.

One could chalk that up to in precise memories or conspiracy, I assume you will go with the latter

That's right. That's why you can't be argued with. IMO these guys (Myers and Rumsfeld) were practically confessing by their (in)actions that they knew what was happening beforehand. There is no other explanation.

what would be gained by lying about such matters?

Lying was apparently the order of the day as far as the attacks were concerned. This was not the only lie Myers told, and other military officers lied time after time. I know you're aware that the 9/11 Commission considered having some of them charged for lying, but of course the Commission didn't have the guts to do it.

Edited April 12, 2013 by Ron Ecker

[Len Colby]

Cleland and Myers varied a bit on the details of i] if they were told about the 2^nd crash during the meeting or if they found out after it ended

Baloney. Myers categorically stated that no one told them about the 2nd crash, and that he left the meeting just about the time the Pentagon was hit. If they were told during the meeting, why in the world would Myers state that they weren't? And if they weren't told during the meeting, why the hell not? Cleland said that they were, which is the only believable scenario, which makes Myers a xxxx, and Myers had to know that Cleland knew he was a xxxx. But did Myers have any need to worry? Of course not.

Wrong again Ron look at the provided link from one of your favored sources.

One could chalk that up to in precise memories or conspiracy, I assume you will go with the latter

That's right. That's why you can't be argued with. IMO these guys (Myers and Rumsfeld) were practically confessing by their (in)actions that they knew what was happening beforehand. There is no other explanation.

what would be gained by lying about such matters?

Lying was apparently the order of the day as far as the attacks were concerned. This was not the only lie Myers told, and other military officers lied time after time. I know you're aware that the 9/11 Commission considered having some of them charged for lying, but of course the Commission didn't have the guts to do it.

Dodge noted

[Steven Gaal]

THREAD TOPIC ERROR OF COLBY'S WAYS

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ OK WISDOM CAN CORRECT

Ecclesiastes 12:9-14

New International Version (NIV)

The Conclusion of the Matter

⁹ Not only was the Teacher wise, but he also imparted knowledge to the people. He pondered and searched out and set in order many proverbs. ¹⁰ The Teacher searched to find just the right words, and what he wrote was upright and true.

¹¹ The words of the wise are like goads, their collected sayings like firmly embedded nails—given by one shepherd.^[a]12 Be warned, my son, of anything in addition to them.

Of making many books there is no end, and much study wearies the body.

¹³ Now all has been heard;

here is the conclusion of the matter:

Fear God and keep his commandments,

for this is the duty of all mankind.

¹⁴ For God will bring every deed into judgment,

including every hidden thing,

whether it is good or evil.

Footnotes:

1. Ecclesiastes 12:11 Or Shepherd
   

[Steven Gaal]

- Truthers go on and on about the militarily exercises that day but failed to show that there were more than normal or that they adversely effected response times. // END COLBY

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

BALONEY

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Point ME-2: The Claim that the Military Exercises Did Not Delay

the Response to the 9/11 Attacks

<< Previous Point, Next Point >>

Introduction

Until September 11, 2001, the North American Aerospace Defense Command (NORAD) conducted four major annual war exercises a year.¹ These aerial practice drills, run cooperatively with the US Strategic Command and the US Space Command, simulated war situations for a period of one or two weeks.

The two largest, Global Guardian and Vigilant Guardian, were command level (high level) exercises that ran together, involved all levels of command, and were designed to exercise most aspects of the NORAD mission.

Global Guardian also linked with other exercises sponsored by the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and the Unified Commands — which included Amalgam Warrior, Apollo Warrior, and Crown Vigilance.²

These exercises, traditionally held in October or November, were all running on September 11, 2001.

The Official Account

The 9/11 Commission Report states that when Boston FAA Flight Center called NEADS (NORAD’s Northeast Air Defense Sector) to report the hijacking of Flight 11, NEADS asked, “Is this real world or exercise?”³

The Commission’s footnote to this question reported that the large-scale exercise Vigilant Guardian, which postulated a bomber attack from the former Soviet Union, had not compromised the military response.⁴ This statement reflected the claims of several military officers:

• According to General Ralph Eberhart, Commander of NORAD at Peterson Air Force Base, “it took about 30 seconds” to make the adjustment to the real-world situation.⁵
  

• According to Robert Marr, “we found that the response was, if anything, expedited by the increased number of staff at the sectors and at NORAD because of the scheduled exercise.”⁶
  

• General Richard Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, concurred, saying in 2005 that the exercises “actually enhanced the response.”⁷
  

The Best Evidence

I. Although the 9/11 Commission mentioned only one military exercise – Vigilant Guardian – that was scheduled for 9/11, evidence shows that at least 12 exercises had been scheduled for that day:

1. Vigilant Guardian: An annual NORAD exercise held traditionally in October,⁸ often in conjunction with Global Guardian.⁹ On 9/11, all levels of command at NORAD Headquarters, including NEADS, were participating in this command-post exercise (CPX),¹⁰ “24/7”.¹¹
   
2. Global Guardian: A massive annual Command Post-Exercise (CPX) and Field Training Exercise (FTX),¹² which was sponsored jointly by the U.S. Strategic Command, US Space Command, and NORAD, and was linked to Vigilant Guardian and Amalgam Warrior.¹³Global Guardian is traditionally held in October or November each year.¹⁴ According to a military newspaper dated March 23, 2001,¹⁵ the over-arching Global Guardian exercise had indeed been originally scheduled for October,¹⁶ but was subsequently moved to early September.
   
3. Crown Vigilance was sponsored by Air Combat Command and was linked to Global Guardian.¹⁷
   
4. Amalgam Warrior was also running — a large-scale live-fly exercise involving two or more NORAD regions, traditionally held twice a year in April and October.¹⁸
   
5. Amalgam Virgo: NORAD officers told the 9/11 Commission Team 8: “On 9/11 there were two FDX exercises planned: Amalgam Virgo and Amalgam Warrior.“¹⁹
   
6. Northern Vigilance: A large annual real-world NORAD operation that on 9/11 diverted much of the US air defense fleet to Canada and Alaska to counteract a Russian drill.²⁰ This operation involved NORAD’s Cheyenne Mountain Operations Center (CMOC) in Colorado.²¹
   
7. Apollo Guardian, linked to Global Guardian and run by the US Space Command, was also running on September 11, 2001. “Hijacks were included in these exercises to exercise transition in Rules of Engagement (ROE).”²²
   
8. W-105at Otis Air Force Base: Six F-15′s from Otis (out of a contingent of 18) took off on a routine ocean training exercise at 9:00 AM, eight minutes after two “alert” F-15′s on the same runway were scrambled in response to the first WTC attack. The six training jets were recalled at 9:25 AM to be armed and to join the response.²³
   

Andrews Air Force Base (outside Washington, DC): There were only seven pilots available in the AAFB 121st Fighter Squadron on 9/11 because many had not returned from the large-scale training exercise “Red Flag” in Las Vegas.²⁴ Three F-16 fighter jets took off on a training exercise at 8:36 AM from Andrews AFB and did not return until 2:35 PM. Flight strips indicated that Andrews-based fighters were not scrambled in response to the hijackings until 11:12 AM.²⁵

1. New Jersey Air National Guard: When the World Trade Center was hit, two F-16 fighters from the 177th Fighter Wing based in Atlantic City were on a routine training mission eight minutes flying time away from New York, but the pilots were not informed of the hijackings until after the second Tower was hit at 9:03 AM. Two other fighters from this Wing were also on a routine training exercise. No jets took off from Atlantic City in response to the attacks until after the Pentagon was hit at approximately 9:37.²⁶
   
2. Washington DC Army Aviation Support Unit: Members of this Unit were attending annual weapons training, 90 minutes drive away.²⁷ The Unit’s mission was to maintain “a readiness posture in support of contingency plans,” to exercise “operational control” of the Washington area airspace, and to provide “aviation support for the White House, US government officials, Department of Defense, Department of the Army, and other government agencies,”²⁸ including the Pentagon.
   

National Reconnaissance Office: NRO, a large intelligence agency of the Department of Defense, had planned a 9:32 AM simulation of a small plane crashing into one its own towers near Washington’s Dulles Airport.²⁹

The rescheduling from October to early September of seven aerial drills — the two largest having been Global Guardian and Vigilant Guardian, and the five related aerial drills that accompanied them — resulted in an unprecedented number of simultaneous drills that morning.

This was an enormous departure from other years.

These drills included at least two hijackings (a Boeing 747 flying from Tokyo to Anchorage, and a Korean Airlines Boeing 747 flight from Seoul to Anchorage),³⁰ and one drill in which a plane was planned to simulate hitting a building (the National Reconnaissance Office).

II. One would expect that having so many exercises would have caused some confusion, which might have slowed down the military response. Indeed, statements to this effect have been made:

• According to a summary of a 9/11 Commission interview with Canadian Lt. Gen. Rick Findley, who was at NORAD as the Battle Staff Director at Cheyenne Mountain Operations Center (CMOC) on September 11,2001, there was, following the second attack on the Twin Towers, “confusion as to how many, and which aircraft, were hijacked. There was no situational awareness that was directly credible, and CMOC was relying on the communications over the phone lines with its operations sectors. Findley opined that AA 11 was reported still airborne and headed towards Washington, D.C. because of the added confusion of many hijack reports.”³¹
  

• At Andrews Air Force Base outside Washington, DC, FAA Air Traffic Controller James Ampey, stationed at Andrews Tower, reported in a 9/11 Commission interview that there were an unusually high number of aircraft taking-off and landing at Andrews that morning because previously scheduled military exercises were underway. The radar screens were showing “emergencies all over the place.”³²
  

• General Larry Arnold, commander of NORAD’s Continental U.S. Region, said: “By the end of the day, we had 21 aircraft identified as possible hijackings.”³³
  

• Pentagon spokeswoman Victoria Clarke: “There were lots of false signals out there. There were false hijack squawks, and a great part of the challenge was sorting through what was a legitimate threat and what wasn’t.”³⁴
  

• FAA Deputy Administrator, Monte Belger, said:“Between 9:20-9:45 there were many confusing reports about various aircraft being unaccounted for.”³⁵
  

• An independent study in 2011 gave detailed accounts of nine falsely reported hijackings on 9/11, plus nine other reported aircraft emergencies.³⁶
  

Conclusion

Because of the rescheduling of military exercises normally scheduled for different times, there were an extraordinary number of exercises underway the morning of September 11, 2001.

The Department of Defense and the 9/11 Commission failed to report all but one of the exercises that occurred that morning.

They also denied that such exercises slowed down military responses to the attacks.

Had the 9/11 Commission reported the full extent of the exceptional number of exercises it knew were operating that morning, the above-quoted statements by military officers such as Eberhart, Marr, and Myers – that the exercises did not, by causing confusion, slow down the military response – would have seemed implausible.

Any new investigation should probe the fact that, taken together, this evidence suggests that:

(1) the Pentagon, after creating conditions that confused the military response to the attacks, sought to cover up its creation of these conditions, and that

(2) the 9/11 Commission facilitated this cover-up by not making public the information held in its records cited above.

<< Previous Point, Next Point >>

References for Point ME-2

1. Steven Komarow and Tom Squitieri, “NORAD Had Drills of Jets as Weapons,” USA Today, April 19, 2004.

2. GlobalSecurity.org. “Global Guardian.”

3.The 9/11 Commission Report: Final Report of the National Commission on Terrorist Attacks upon the United States, Authorized Edition (New York: W. W. Norton, 2004), 20.

4. The 9/11 Commission Report, 458, note 116.

5.The 9/11 Commission Report, 458, note 116.

6. Ibid.

7. Myers said: “The important thing to realize is that North American Aerospace Defense Command was responsible [for managing the wargames]. These are command post exercises; what that means is that all the battle positions that are normally not filled are indeed filled; so it was an easy transition from an exercise into a real world situation. It actually enhanced the response; otherwise, it would take somewhere between 30 minutes and a couple of hours to fill those positions, those battle stations, with the right staff officers.” “Transcript of Representative Cynthia McKinney’s Exchange with Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Richard Myers, and Under Secretary of Defense (Comptroller) Tina Jonas,” March 11th, 2005.

8. “NORAD Exercises Hijack Summary, 1998-2001,” a “Commission Sensitive” document. Vigilant Guardian hijack exercises took place October 25-27, 1998 and October 16-23, 2000. See: Senate Hearing 108-875, “Implications for the Department of Defense and Military Operations of Proposals to Reorganize the United States Intelligence Community,” August 16 and 17, 2004.

9. “Vigilant Guardian,” Global Security.

10. A command-post exercise (CPX) is one “in which the forces are simulated, involving the commander, the staff, and communications within and between headquarters.” See “Dictionary of Military and Associated Terms,” (US Department of Defense), 2005.

11. See the August 20, 2001, “Memorandum from Col. Robert Marr,” at the NEADS Command Center, outlining the 24/7 Operations that would be conducted September 10-13, 2001. The exercise included injects, or simulated track inputs, onto NORAD radar screens.

12. “Exercise Global Guardian 2001-2 Joint After Action Report,” US Strategic Command, Offutt AFB, Nebraska.

13. United States. Department of Defense. “Examples of U.S. Strategic Command Nuclear Exercise Activities,” 1997?

14. Hans N. Kristensen, “Taking the Pulse of the US Nuclear Arsenal,” Washington, DC, Basic, 1998. Global Guardian began on October 22, 2003. See: Hans M. Kristensen, “Global Strike: A Chronology of the Pentagon’s New Offensive Strike Plan,” Federation of American Scientists, 2006.

15. “21st Space Wing Priorities,” Space Observer, March 23, 2001, p. 2.

16.Global Guardian had been originally scheduled for October 22-31, 2001, according to NBC military analyst William M. Arkin, in his book, Code Names: Deciphering U.S. Military Plans, Programs and Operations in the 9/11 World, Steerforth, 2005, p. 379. See also the 2002 date, October 17 to 25.

17. GlobalSecurity.org, “Global Guardian.”

18.Amalgam Warrior took place October 15-20, 1996. It included the 101^st Fighter Squadron from Otis Air Force Base. It took place on October 27, 2000.

19. 9/11 Commission interview with Merchant and Goddard, “Memorandum for the Record: NORAD Field Site Visit: Interview with Major Paul Goddard (Canadian Forces), and Ken Merchant,” March 4, 2004.

20. Lieutenant-General Ken Pennie, Deputy Commander-in-Chief of NORAD, said that “NORAD-allocated forces will remain in place until the end of the Russian exercise. NORAD conducted operation Northern Denial from December 1 to 14, 2000 in response to a similar, but smaller scale, Russian deployment.” “NORAD Maintains Northern Vigilance,” NORAD News, Sept. 9, 2001.

Toronto Star, Dec. 9, 2001, “Northern Guardian” and “Northern Vigilance” (NORAD exercises on 911/2001); and originalToronto Star abstract.

21. 9/11 Commission “Memorandum for the Record,” Interview with NORAD Deputy Commander, Lieutenant General Rick.Findley, Canadian Forces (CF),” March 1, 2004.

22. 9/11 Commission interview with Merchant and Goddard.

23. TSgt. Bruce Vittner, “Historian’s Report for Sept. 11, 2001,” p. 2.

9/11 Commission, “Memorandum for the Record: Initial overview of Otis AFB operations by Colonel Paul Worcester,” October 14, 2003.

25.Lynn Spencer, “Touching History: The Untold Story of the Drama that Unfolded in the Skies Over America on 9/11,” Free Press, p. 156.

25. 9/11 Commission, “Memorandum for the Record: Visit to Reagan National Airport Control Tower in Alexandria, VA and Andrews Air Force Base Control Tower,” July 28, 2003.

26. Mary Lou Vocale, “Guard Tempo of Operation Noble Eagle,” Code One Magazine, Fourth Quarter 2002.

27. United States Army. Center of Military History. “Interview of CW2 (Chief Warrant Officer) _____,” (tape transcription), no date.

28. Jody T. Fahrig, “Davison Army Airfield Hosts Open House,” May 7, 1999.

29. 9/11 Commission. “Early Morning Flight Activity, September 11, 2001: Exercise Concept” (Commission Sensitive Document), Faxed July 3, 2003, 07:39 AM.

John J. Lumpkin, “Agency planned exercise on Sept. 11 built around a plane crashing into a building,” Associated Press, August 21, 2002.

30. 9/11 Commission. “NORAD Exercises Hijack Summary” (Commission Sensitive), no date.

31. 9/11 Commission, “Memorandum for the Record,” Interview with NORAD Deputy Commander, Lieutenant General Rick Findley, Canadian Forces (CF),” March 1, 2004.

32. 9/11 Commission, “Memorandum for the Record: Visit to Reagan National Airport Control Tower in Alexandria, VA and Andrews Air Force Base Control Tower,” July 28, 2003.

33. “Conversation With Major General Larry Arnold, Commander, 1st Air Force, Tyndall AFB, Florida,” Code One, January 2002.

34. “Chilling Audio From 9/11 Hijack Played at Hearing,” aired June 17, 2004.

35. 9/11 Commission, “Memorandum for the Record,” November 24, 2003.

36. Shoestring, “The Many False Hijackings of 9/11,” April 10, 2011.

This post is also available in: French, Italian

Edited April 13, 2013 by Steven Gaal

[Ron Ecker]

Wrong again Ron look at the provided link from one of your favored sources.

If you are referring to the History Commons link you provided, it is not one of my "favored sources," since I've never heard of it. As for the Myers quotes that I now find there in which he says they were told of the second plane and he left the meeting, that is news to me, thanks for the link. So Myers has flatly contradicted himself. The same article quotes from the interview that I was aware of, in which Myers says flatly "told no one told us" about the second plane, and he left the meeting about the time the Pentagon was hit. That, according to the other statements, is a flat-out lie, and he obviously had to know he was lying.

what would be gained by lying about such matters?

Lying was apparently the order of the day as far as the attacks were concerned. This was not the only lie Myers told, and other military officers lied time after time. I know you're aware that the 9/11 Commission considered having some of them charged for lying, but of course the Commission didn't have the guts to do it.

Dodge noted

Are you trying to deny that Myers and other military officials lied their tails off about 9/11? Why they would do that is obvious to me, given everything else about 9/11. As to why Myers would specifically lie about not being told about the second plane, I believe I asked you if you had a theory as to why he would do that, and you didn't respond to the question (dodge noted), unless your reference elsewhere to "imprecise memory or conspiracy" was meant as an answer. I doubt seriously that the Acting Chairman of the Joint Chiefs or anyone else in such a position of national defense authority on 9/11 have imprecise memories about what they heard and did, since ordinary citizens in this country remember exactly where they were and what they were doing when these events unfolded.

Indeed, in taking another look at the chronology of Myers' statements, it seems pretty clear that his claim that no one told them was his original story, told only a few weeks after 9/11. He changed his story in later statements when his original story wouldn't fly, i.e. was unbelievable. This fits the pattern of the military in general changing it story about 9/11, the original (and thus probably the correct) official military story being that no aircraft were launched until after the Pentagon was hit. When that wouldn't fly, the story was changed, oh yeah we did launch aircraft before the Pentagon was hit. The story was later changed again, until as noted earlier, the 9/11 Commission considered having these people charged with perjury.

Edited April 14, 2013 by Ron Ecker

[Steven Gaal]

RON

THANK YOU FOR YOUR POSTING BUT COLBY WOULDNT EVEN BELIEVE THE VIDEO TAPPED CONFESSIONS OF THE PLOTTERS OF 911.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Its 9/10 midnight and my patient is asleep,ventilator working fine. Ray Taliaferro 810 KGO is ripping "W" a new one fom 12:08 to 12:59. When he states,"Its a failed Presidency,a failed Presidency and he has only one thing left to do,only one thing knowing the Bush's and I'll tell you after the break,after the break. " So KGO news is done and now its 9/11 @ 1:08 PST and Ray comes back on the air. Ray with energy,"Its a failed Presidency and the only thing left for him to do is have a terror attack outside the United States." (HE REPEATED THAT AGAIN). As he is repeating himself I am thinking ,"No RAY no !! ,'W' will have a terror attack inside the US,a terror attack inside the US". Its 1:09 PST 9/11. JFK slowly,slowly faded away as number one to me after so many years.

########################

Why were certain people warned not to fly

on or about September 11 (or even earlier),

and not the rest of us?

Ashcroft Flying High, CBS News, July 26, 2001:

“In response to inquiries from CBS News over why Ashcroft was traveling exclusively by leased jet aircraft instead of commercial airlines, the Justice Department cited what it called a ‘threat assessment’ by the FBI, and said Ashcroft has been advised to travel only by private jet for the remainder of his term.”

Dan Rather: Bush Issued Bogus Terror Alert to Cover Up 9-11 Bungle

, NewsMax.com, May 22, 2002:

“

After the CBS news anchor's interview, NBC Pentagon correspondent Jim Miklaszewski called Imus to correct the record, explaining that Ashcroft's decision not to fly commercial aircraft last summer was prompted by threats against his life - and had no connection whatsoever to pre-Sept. 11 intelligence information.

”

“A senior official at the CIA said he was unaware of specific threats against any Cabinet member, and Ashcroft himself, in a speech in California, seemed unsure of the nature of the threat.” -

Ashcroft Flying High

, CBS News,

July 26, 2001

Thanks to

BuzzFlash.com

for this catch.

Heads-Up To Ashcroft Proves Threat Was Known Before 9/11

, H

arley Sorensen, SF Gate, June 3, 2002

:

“Bush knew something was going to happen involving airplanes. He just didn't know what or exactly when. His attorney general, John Ashcroft, knew. His national security advisor, Condoleezza Rice, knew. They all knew… On July 26, 2001, cbsnews.com reported that John Ashcroft had stopped flying on commercial airlines… The FBI did advise Ashcroft to stay off commercial aircraft. The rest of us just had to take our chances…

“On July 5, 2001, according to a recent Washington Post article, the White House called together officials from a dozen federal agencies to give them a warning.

“‘Something really spectacular is going to happen here, and it's going to happen soon,’ the officials were told by the government's top counterterrorism official, Richard Clarke.

“Clarke considered the threat sufficiently important to direct every counterintelligence office to cancel vacations and get ready for immediate action, the Post reported.”

Who Did It?,David Ruppe, ABCNews.com, September 11, 2001

“Most recently, on Friday, Sept. 7, the State Department issued a worldwide alert warning ‘American citizens may be the target of a terrorist threat from extremist groups with links to [Osama bin Laden's] al Qaeda organization.’”

Willie Brown got low-key early warning about air travel, Phillip Matier and Andrew Ross, San Francisco Chronicle, September 12, 2001:

“For Mayor Willie Brown, the first signs that something was amiss came late Monday when he got a call from what he described as his airport security - - a full eight hours before yesterday's string of terrorist attacks -- advising him that Americans should be cautious about their air travel.”

‘We’ve Hit the Targets’, Michael Hirsh, Newsweek, September 13, 2001 issue:

“NEWSWEEK has learned that while U.S. intelligence received no specific warning, the state of alert had been high during the past two weeks, and a particularly urgent warning may have been received the night before the attacks, causing some top Pentagon brass to cancel a trip. Why that same information was not available to the 266 people who died aboard the four hijacked commercial aircraft may become a hot topic on the Hill.”

Rushdie 'given US air ban week before terrorist attacks', Ananova, September 27, 2001:

“Salman Rushdie says US authorities banned him from taking internal flights a week before the terrorist attacks.

“He thinks officials were aware of an imminent terrorist strike.”

Rushdie's air ban, James Doran, The Times of London, September 27, 2001:

“THE author Salman Rushdie believes that US authorities knew of an imminent terrorist strike when they banned him from taking internal flights in Canada and the US only a week before the attacks.”

[The above article is no longer available on the Times' website.--Caro]

Instant Messages To Israel Warned Of WTC Attack, Brian McWilliams, NewsbytesNews Network (a division of The Washington Post Company), September 27, 2001:

“Officials at instant-messaging firm Odigo confirmed today that two employees received text messages warning of an attack on the World Trade Center two hours before terrorists crashed planes into the New York landmarks.”

Court-appointed commander, Editorial, Arkansas Times, May 24, 2002:

“We know now that the Bush administration received numerous warnings of impending terrorist attacks, some arriving almost on the eve of the Sept. 11 disaster, and did next to nothing. Well, it did slip word to John Ashcroft, our faith-based attorney general, and Ashcroft stopped flying on commercial aircraft. Faith has its limitations.”

What Did They Know Page

Last changed: December 13, 2009

Edited April 13, 2013 by Steven Gaal

[Len Colby]

RON

THANK YOU FOR YOUR POSTING BUT COLBY WOULDNT EVEN BELIEVE THE VIDEO TAPPED CONFESSIONS OF THE PLOTTERS OF 911.

LOL hilarious since you don't believe OBL's confession tape or the pilot's martyr videos or even acknowledgements from some of the hijacker's families they were involved.

As for the rest if you do a forum search you'll see we've already been over the rest. I'm not really into rehash. Most, if not all, were debunked years ago by 9/11 Myths

http://911myths.com/index.php/Foreknowledge

[Len Colby]

- Truthers go on and on about the militarily exercises that day but failed to show that there were more than normal or that they adversely effected response times. // END COLBY

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BALONEY

How many times have we been over this krapola? OK highlight just the part which documents how the exercises delayed response times. Since the late 1990s there had been only 16 jets at 8 bases on scramble alert, only 4 of which were anywhere near the events in question. And on 9/11 the 2 F-15s at Otis AFB on Cape Cod and the 2 F-16s at Langley AFB in southeastern VA were on alert unaffected by any of the exercises.

[Len Colby]

Wrong again Ron look at the provided link from one of your favored sources.

If you are referring to the History Commons link you provided, it is not one of my "favored sources," since I've never heard of it.

That's another name/site for Thompson's 9/11 Timeline which you've cited in the past.

Are you trying to deny that Myers and other military officials lied their tails off about 9/11?

No, just not about this.

Why they would do that is obvious to me, given everything else about 9/11. As to why Myers would specifically lie about not being told about the second plane, I believe I asked you if you had a theory as to why he would do that, and you didn't respond to the question ("Dodge noted"), unless your reference elsewhere to "imprecise memory or conspiracy" was meant as an answer. I doubt seriously that the Acting Chairman of the Joint Chiefs or anyone else in such a position of national defense authority on 9/11 have imprecise memories about what they heard and did, since ordinary citizens in this country remember exactly where they were and what they were doing when these events unfolded.

Why not? Bush claimed to have seen the 1^st crash on a TV at the school just before he went into the classroom.

Indeed, in taking another look at the chronology of Myers' statements, it seems pretty clear that his claim that no one told them was his original story, told only a few weeks after 9/11. He changed his story in later statements when his original story wouldn't fly, i.e. was unbelievable.

Can you point to anyone who questioned this BEFORE he changed his story? Also note that 2 days after 9/11 he seemed to indicate he'd was made aware of the 2^nd crash shortly after it happened. When asked by Sen. Nelson about the air response to flight 77 he said “I spoke, after the second tower was hit, I spoke to the commander of NORAD, General Eberhart. And at that point, I think the decision was at that point to start launching aircraft.”

RON:

This fits the pattern of the military in general changing it story about 9/11, the original (and thus probably the correct) official military story being that no aircraft were launched until after the Pentagon was hit. When that wouldn't fly, the story was changed, oh yeah we did launch aircraft before the Pentagon was hit. The story was later changed again, until as noted earlier, the 9/11 Commission considered charging these people with perjury.

Point to where any USG officials said they were sure no fighters were launched till after the Pentagon was hit. No one really disputes that fighters were launched from Otis before the 2^nd crash.

[Steven Gaal]

hilarious since you don't believe OBL's confession tape or the pilot's martyr videos or even acknowledgements from some of the hijacker's families they were involved. // END COLBY

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WHEN HAVE I DONE THAT ??? PLEASE NO WORDS IN MY MOUTH.