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David,

My point with the diagram is that even after alteration, Boswell describes the results of a shot from the front...

I was adding to your post:

Chris Newton, on 26 Nov 2013 - 5:41 PM, said:snapback.png

In Vinces thread on Sam Kinney, the ex- SS agent states there was blood and brains all over the windshield of "Lucy", the followup car. More evidence of a shot from the front. LN'ers will argue that Lucy drove through the cloud of gore that's been removed from the extant Zapruder film, of course.

Not sure what this has to do with Oswald leaving the TSBD but....

And I agree this has nothing to do with Oswald leaving the TSBD and I don't want to Hijack this thread any further...

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After several weeks of canvassing hardline Lone Nut Theory believers over on Duncan's forum for credible alternatives to Oswald as Prayer Man, the results are as follows:

They've got nothing.

They've thrown the world and his brother at that doorway, and not a single suggestion has come close to holding up under close inspection.

It started with Steve Barber taking one look at Prayer Man and identifying him confidently as Billy Lovelady.

And that about set the standard intellectually for the WC defenders' subsequent suggestions.

**

Meanwhile over on alt.assassination.jfk, Lone Nut propagandist John McAdams has blocked discussion of the topic--while happily facilitating endless discussion of Ralph Cinque's barmy Altgens-Doorman claims.

Prayer Man is evidently too toxic for Professor Factoid.

**

As of this, the 50th anniversary of President Kennedy's assassination, there remains only one viable candidate for Prayer Man:

ZACYFZQ.jpg

Bump.

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Maybe this can shed some light....

The one area I did not colorize is the area that confuses me the most...

That arm SEEMS to belong to Lovelady yet is crossing in FRONT of the black man who is standing at least a few feet to his right.

Can anyone offer a color for that area that makes sense... and there is any chance "prayer man" is somehow captured there?

Altgensdoorwayblowup-colorized_zpse78168

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It's MY understanding--correct or not--that Prayer Man is BEHIND Lovelady, and hidden from view due to the angle of the Altgens photo. Prayer Man is shown to be in the "absolute" corner of the step area, which is not visible in the Altgens photos.

Edited by Mark Knight
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Not that I've seen Bob.... if so, he did an disappearing act with his hand and fingers.....

Also curious the distinction between Lovelady's pants and the man in the suit...

Download the image and try out a few options... I've tried, I've blown this up to 10 times the size to see if there are any clues...

Here is the same image without Lovelady colorized... sure LOOKS like his arm... but that's not possible

Altgensdoorwayblowup-colorized-butnotlov

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Not that I've seen Bob.... if so, he did an disappearing act with his hand and fingers.....

Also curious the distinction between Lovelady's pants and the man in the suit...

Download the image and try out a few options... I've tried, I've blown this up to 10 times the size to see if there are any clues...

Here is the same image without Lovelady colorized... sure LOOKS like his arm... but that's not possible

Altgensdoorwayblowup-colorized-butnotlov

I think I am mistaken, Dave. I wish I could find the thread that talked about this. My memory tells me it was not the arm of the black guy but the guy just to the left of him. He is grey in your photo and you can just see his head. As you say, though, where are the fingertips?

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Didn't someone point out, a while back, that the arm actually belongs to the black man?

This may be what you are referring to, Robert. It is contained in a letter from Richard E. Sprague to Beverly Brunson.

"What you think is Lovelady's left arm is actually the arm of a negro waving in

front of Lovelady. Not the negro in the doorway just in front of him, but another

one, standing on the sidewalk. The man to Lovelady's left is shading his eyes

with his hands as were three other people standing in the doorway. This is

revealed by the Hughes film, one frame of which was in Life last November.

None of these people move their hands perceptibly or throw anything."

http://jfk.hood.edu/Collection/Weisberg%20Subject%20Index%20Files/B%20Disk/Brunson%20Beverly/Item%2005.pdf

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I'm working on some different options - yet if you look closely, that "raised arm" seems to NOT be connected to anything....

Yet I know that light and angles can make things look very different from what they are...

I will post what I can figure out

DJ

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It helps to see other photos from different angles to have a clearer perspective where everybody is. While this frame from the Weigman film isn't exactly the same moment, the President's car has just gone past, a couple of ladies seem to be reacting and a man is looking back over his shoulder obviously distracted by something behind him.

image_zpsd0c7d9e5.jpg

Clearly Prayer Man wouldn't be seen from Altgens position

I think the only part of the black man's body visible from Altgen's position would be his head.

His neck is obscured by the hair of another person standing further along Elm St which also makes it impossible to actually see if Lovelady's arm is crossing in front of the black man. Lovelady is too far away from the black man for that to happen anyway.

Whoever Prayer Man is, he didn't see the President get shot and wouldn't have been immediately aware of what had happened.

If it is Oswald, his mind must have begun racing as things started to dawn on him...

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Blair, actually if one could project that fellows view it might be towards the DalTex. I once did a quick head count of the people looking up and back at the

time of the shooting and more were looking back to the DalTex than up to the top of the TSBD. Certainly people were looking to both as if they heard

noise further to the east of the TSBD.

In regard to this thread though, what had just happened was unclear to a great many people on the scene, especially those east on the street towards

the TSBD, only the folks down by the head shot immediately knew what was going on. The fact that it was a real attack on the President and not just

firecrackers or somebody shooting off a gun for show or in protest took some time to jell....I clearly recall hearing early news reports that just talked about "shots fired".

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