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Prayer Man: A Memo to James Gordon


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Please share this film with us, Raymond, if you claim to have film of Baker entering the TSBD. Put your money where your mouth is.

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based on a websters collegiate edition 1976 which is based on websters new international 1961

Patsy :

one who is duped or victimised:SUCKER

Sucker:

a person easily cheated or deceived

I've got lots of other dictionaries but this one because it's US english of the right era is probably most appliccable. (yes based on a 1961 edition, but these things take years to put together and usage is relevant as to years pre 1961. What dictionaries were used in the south during LHO's earlier years?)

So, basically he is saying he was victimised, duped, cheated, or deceived. That's different from outright innocent. The way I read it is he is saying there is a conspiracy. He's there as a result of it.

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We have film of Baker entering the building, so there is nothing suspicious about that.

Actually we don't, J. Raymond. All we have is film of him or another motorcycle officer running towards the steps.

--Tommy :sun

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We have film of Baker entering the building, so there is nothing suspicious about that.

Actually we don't, J. Raymond. All we have is film of him or another motorcycle officer running towards the steps.

--Tommy :sun

Well if it is not Marion Baker shown in the Darnell film , then can you please name who it is?

Edited by J. Raymond Carroll
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Oh FFS.

Altgens 6 rubbish.

During the same show, Buell Wesley Frazier was

shown the same photo and identified the man-in-the-doorway as Lovelady, not Oswald. (Both these scenes were

edited out of the A&E 5-part showing in the early 1990's.

]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]

How do we know that "Prayer Man" is not Billy Lovelady?

Can Lovelady be seen somewhere else in that photo/film?

--Tommy :sun

Edited by Steven Gaal
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based on a websters collegiate edition 1976 which is based on websters new international 1961

Patsy :

one who is duped or victimised:SUCKER

Sucker:

a person easily cheated or deceived

I've got lots of other dictionaries but this one because it's US english of the right era is probably most appliccable. (yes based on a 1961 edition, but these things take years to put together and usage is relevant as to years pre 1961. What dictionaries were used in the south during LHO's earlier years?)

So, basically he is saying he was victimised, duped, cheated, or deceived. That's different from outright innocent. The way I read it is he is saying there is a conspiracy. He's there as a result of it.

Another Garrison Sucker.

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I don't know. I've really only seen the garrison tapes and read the book. He came across as a bit of a nut, but then I've never felt like diving into his version much so I cannot say whether my impression is relevant. I understand there are garrison experts who might have something to contribute.. I remember him (in the tape) saying Oswald was completely innocent. I suppose he had reasons for that.

AFA me copying out what's in a us dictionary and making a comment on that and me being sucked in by garrison. A bit of a stretch don't you think? I'm finding these twists of 'logic' a bit hard to follow.

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We have film of Baker entering the building, so there is nothing suspicious about that.

Actually we don't, J. Raymond. All we have is film of him or another motorcycle officer running towards the steps.

--Tommy :sun

Well if it is not Marion Baker shown in the Darnell film , then can you please name who it is?

J. Raymond,

Whoever it was (and I think it was Baker) he was unfortunately not filmed running up the steps and entering the TSBD. Almost, but not quite. Unfortunately, the cameraman started filming something else at that point.

Here's the pertinent, stabilized segment from the Darnell film.

Credit: Gerda Dunckel

prayermandesh12fps100c4k1m.gif

I think that this motorcycle cop probably did run up the steps because he's still running fast when he gets to them, and the tall man in the dark suit steps out of his way and motions him up the steps with his left hand.

Question: Could that be Lovelady rising up from a kneeling or sitting position on the far left side of the steps, or is it a woman wearing a light-colored head scarf (which looks like a face) walking slowly up them?

I personally think that Lovelady and Shelley were "captured" in the same film a few seconds earlier while walking down the Elm Street Extension, so IMHO that couldn't be Lovelady on the steps as the motorcycle copy is running towards them. I think it's a woman wearing a headscarf walking slowly up the steps.

When an earlier part Darnell's film is shown in super slow motion, I recognize the heads, hairlines, physiques, profiles, and clothing of L & S there on the Elm Street Extension sidewalk. Yes, I know that their testimony regarding their actions and the timing and Calvary and Truly and Baker is very problematic, but I still think it's Lovelady and Shelley walking down the Elm Street Extension sidewalk.

I am willing to be persuaded otherwise.

BTW, isn't that diminutive, hat-and-dark-suit-wearing Roy Truly standing several feet in front of "Stetson Man"? He turns and watches "Baker" after "Baker" has run past him. I'm not talking about the big, dumpy-looking guy (who is not wearing a suit) to the right of "Stetson Man," and who is turning and walking towards the TSBD. The guy I'm talking about is farther away, and to the left, more directly in front of "Stetson Man."

Who is that big, lumbering, dumpy-looking guy, anyway? Edit: I think it's Jack Edwin Dougherty, whom Truly described as "a great big husky fellow" in his WC testimony.

--Tommy :sun

Edited by Thomas Graves
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It doesn't prove a conspiracy, since there is the minute possibility of a different "lone nut" on the job. And if there was a conspiracy, it does not prove that LHO was not involved in it.

As my readers know, I believe Lee Oswald was a completely innocent man, who was framed for the Tippit murder and for the JFK

murder..

greg parker is an Oswald accuser who won't let go even when he knows that Lee is innocent!

And Carroll shoots as straight as a dog's hind leg. Let's put it this way, if Carroll had been the sniper, he wouldn't have needed no goddamn magic bullet.

What Carroll deliberately omitted from his quote because he is an amatuer putz is this: For the record - I have no doubt that there was a conspiracy and that Oswald's sole "connection" to it was as designated patsy. That case is coming.

Mister Parker is a GARRISON GROUPIE, conscious or unconscious I don't know which.

Lee Oswald told reporters: "They've taken me in because of the fact that I lived in the Soviet Union,

I'm just a Patsy."

The word "Patsy" has always meant nothing more than an innocent man falsely accused,

and you can find it frequently used in the popular novels of Michael Connelly, e.g. Trunk Music.

But Garrison gave it a special meaning, implying that Lee Oswald was an idiot who conspired

in his own undoing, and Garrison followers like Greg Parker have been attributing that special meaning to the word "Patsy" ever since.

Its a bummer when people don't understand the English language!

Lee Oswald said that he knew nothing about the assassination or the murder of J.D. Tippit

and his accusers, including Greg Parker and David Von Pein, are barking up the wrong tree

You're a complete nut case aren't you, boy-o?

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We have film of Baker entering the building, so there is nothing suspicious about that.

Actually we don't, J. Raymond. All we have is film of him or another motorcycle officer running towards the steps.

--Tommy :sun

Well if it is not Marion Baker shown in the Darnell film , then can you please name who it is?

The point is, whoever it was (and I think it was Baker) was not captured on film actually running up the steps and entering the TSBD. Almost, but not quite. Unfortunately, the cameraman started something different at that point and that scene is no longer in view.

Here's the pertinent stabilized segment from the Darnell film. I do believe that the policeman (Baker?) ran up the steps because the man in the dark suit at the base of the steps seems to step out of his way and motion him up them with his left arm.

Question: Is that Lovelady rising up from a kneeling or sitting position on the far left side of the steps, or is it a woman wearing a light-colored head scarf walking slowly up them? I personally think that Lovelady and Shelley were "captured" in the same film a few seconds earlier while walking down the sidewalk of the Elm Street Extension. When Gerda's clips are loading on my laptop and are being shown in slow motion, I think I recognize the heads, hairlines, physiques, profiles, and clothing of L & S. Yes, I know that their testimony regarding speaking with Gloria Calvary and seeing Truly and Baker enter the TSBD is very problematic, but I still think it's them walking down the Elm Street Extension.

Credit: Gerda Dunckel

prayermandesh12fps100c4k1m.gif

--Tommy :sun

edited and bumped

Edited by Thomas Graves
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Buell Wesley Frazier (11-22-63 affidavit for Dallas County, 24H209) “I was standing on the front steps of the building when the parade came by, and I watched the parade go by. After President Kennedy had got out of my sight, I heard three shots. I stood there, then people started running by, and I turned, and went back in the building.” (12-5-63 sworn statement to the U.S. Secret Service, CD87 p796) "I was standing on the front steps when the parade passed in front of the building. When the shooting occurred, I did not realize the shots were really shots until the second one. At first I thought it was backfire. I did not realize the shots had come from this building but thought they had come from somewhere around the triple underpass or railroad tracks." (3-11-64 testimony before the Warren Commission, 2H210-245) (On his location during the shooting) "I was standing on the steps there and watched for the parade to come by and so I did and I stood there until he come by." (On who was with him at this time) "I stayed around there pretty close to Mr. Shelley and this boy Billy Lovelady and just standing there, people talking and just talking about how pretty a day it turned out to be, because I told you earlier it was an old cloudy and misty day and then it didn't look like it was going to be a pretty day at all." (Anybody else?) "There was a lady there, a heavy-set lady who worked upstairs there whose name is Sarah something, I don't know her last name." (On the shooting) “just right after he went by he hadn’t hardly got by, I heard a sound and if you have ever been around motorcycles you know how they backfire, and so I thought one of them motorcycles backfired…but it wasn’t just a few seconds that, you know, I heard two more of the same type of, you know, sounds, and by that time people was running everywhere, and falling down and screaming, and naturally then I knew something was wrong…to be frank with you I thought it come from down there, where that underpass is.” (3-18-64 statement to the FBI, 22H647) “At the time President Kennedy was shot I was standing on the front steps of the Texas School Book Depository. I was with William H. Shelley…and Billy Lovelady.” (2-13-69 testimony in the trial of Clay Shaw) (On where he was standing when the shots were fired) "I watched the parade from the top of the steps there, the main entrance into Texas School Books." (When asked to point out this location on an exhibit) "Right here. It is the main entrance right here. There in the shadows you have several steps and a rail, and I was standing right there at the top of the rail." (When asked who he was standing with) "When I was standing there at the top of the stairs I was standing there by a heavyset lady who worked up in our office, her name is Sara, I forget her last name, but she was standing right there beside me when we watched the motorcade." (Anyone else?) "Right down in front of me at the bottom of the steps my foreman Bill Shelley and Billy Lovelady were standing there." (On the shooting) “Just right after they made the turn there was several motorcycle policeman leading the motorcade and right after they turned, after the car made the turn, it sounded like the motorcycles were backfiring… Shortly after there were two more in rapid succession.” (When asked if he knew they were rifle shots) "Well, the two that come in fast succession by that time, like I said, people were hollering, and then I recognized them, they were rifle shots." (When asked the time lapse between the first and second shots) "It was just a few seconds." (When asked the time lapse between the second and third) "When I heard the second noise, the third was followed nearly just right back to back. It was fired in rapid succession." (He was then asked to demonstrate the spacing of the shots by clapping his hands, but the spacing of his hand claps was not noted on the transcripts of the trial) (11-21-77 interview with HSCA investigators Moriarty and Day, edited down from a transcript provided by Richard Gilbride) "everybody was following the presidential motorcade...then I heard a loud sound--motorcycle backfire...from where I was standing, there was some trees and some people--so I actually couldn't see. But what had actually happened was the first shot...and then I heard the same sound. It wasn't anywheres even close to me...It was then that I realized--as people were beginning to run--and it became quite still. Before I had the chance to be heard, a sound--like a motorcycle backfire--what sounded like a backfire erupt." (When asked if the shots sounded the same) "the noises that I heard was all similar...they matched or they were from the 6th story...they seemed to be all pretty the same...Like I say, the first one that was fired, and then it seemed like it was only another few seconds and then they's coming up with another...they was in tandem. They was in the same area, the same direction. You know, like the same sound." (7-23-86 testimony in televised mock trial, On Trial: Lee Harvey Oswald) (When asked how many shots he heard) "Three." (When asked if he thought the shots came from the railroad) "Yes, sir, from the knoll there." (When asked again about the direction of the shots) "I thought they came from the knoll here." (He is then asked to write the words "grassy knoll" on a map of Dealey Plaza and put an X where he thought the shots had come from. He writes the words on the map to the west of the arcade, and then puts an X by these words at the northernmost point of the picket fence, in the railroad yards to the west of the arcade.)

(6-21-02 oral history with the Sixth Floor Museum) "I was standing at the top of the steps, the entrance, to the Texas School Book Depository. I was standing in the shadows...When they turned from Houston Street onto Elm there, and started down to the underpasses there, I remember I remarked to myself, I said, 'well, they look just like they do in the pictures'... (When asked how long it was after the limo had completed its turn onto Elm Street and started heading away that he heard the first shot) "It wasn't very long before there was a shot. And, as I said earlier, from listening to the motorcycles that was leading the President's car that had been backfiring, at first I thought it was a backfire from a motorcycle..." (When asked if the shot sounded like backfires) "Yes. But then shortly after, there was two more. By that time there was really chaos. There was people running and everything and you knew something wasn't right...I couldn't actually see what was going on in the President's car...After they had passed and dropped out of sight, I couldn't see what was going on." (When asked when he first realized Kennedy had been shot) "By the time the second and third shot was fired, I realized it wasn't a motorcycle backfire, because it had a different sound to it. And I realized someone was firing, and people was, as I said in that whole area there was running and falling down..." (When asked from where he thought the shots were fired) "The sound to me at that time sounded like it was coming from up above...the only thing I can say is that I realized it was gunfire, but to be specific as to what building it was coming from other than saying it was coming from up above where we were standing, I can't be more specific than that..." (When asked how many shots) "I heard three shots. There was one, and then there was, the other two was much closer in succession." (When asked the length of the shooting) "I don't know exact, but probably, I would probably say all, and this is probably, I don't know for a fact, I would probably say all three shots was taken within 15 seconds...There was the first one, and then the second and third one was just almost just back to back. It was very fast." (When asked the time between the last two shots) "I would probably say, maybe five seconds, if it was that long." (When asked if there could have been more or fewer than three shots) "Not fewer than three...I heard three." (When asked where the car was when the first shot was fired) "It wasn't very far after it dropped out of my sight...I couldn't see the car...The car was out of my view when the first shot was fired...(When attempting to clarify his approximation of 15 seconds for the shooting) "If you take and fire a shot say like for instance on the first second, and then the second shot might not have been somewhere until like the 8th to 10th seconds, and then the third one I would say somewhere between the 10th and 15th." (3-27-13 appearance at the Irving Central Library, video found online) "I heard the shots...I was standing back in the shadows there--when you walk into the Texas School Book Building today, if you walk up in there, there's a space there, and I was standing there watching the parade back in the shadows. You can't see me, but I was there. After the third shot, it was really mayhem there...Sarah, the lady I was standing by up on the top step back in the shadows, we looked at one another. We really didn't have a lot to say." (7-13-13 appearance at the Sixth Floor Museum, as shown on C-Span) (When asked how many shots he heard) "Shots. I heard three. In that presidential parade--it was being led by--and there was motorcycle policemen, and these motorcycle policemen were cutting their motorcycles on and off. If you know anything or you ride motorcycles you know that you can do that and make 'em backfire...So when the first shot occurred, I thought it was just a motorcycle backfiring. Then it wasn't long after that that there was two and the two were closer in succession than between the first and second. And then I realized that that wasn't a motorcycle backfire, it was somebody shooting a weapon. And down here in Dealey Plaza, it was total chaos. People was running and screaming and falling down and hollering." (When asked if he had a sense where the shots were coming from) "The first one, when I was standing back on the top of the steps, sounded like it come to my right down where the motorcade was, But then the second and third sounded much closer..." (When describing what happened after the shots, after a crying woman came up to him and the woman standing next to him and told them the President had been shot.) "We looked bewildered. I turned to Sarah and she said 'she said somebody has shot the President.' And I said 'I thought that's what she said.' She said 'she did say that.''' (Frazier had thereby confirmed that Sarah Stanton was standing with him on the top of the steps both before the shots, and for several minutes after.) (11-18-13 article in the Richmond Times-Dispatch) (On the shooting) "'The car turned, and boom — that first sound, that you never forget,' Allman said. 'It wasn’t the crack sound of a rifle. It was a loud boom sound.' Frazier also heard the sound, thinking one of the motorcycles escorting the limousine had backfired. 'And then shortly after that, I heard two more, and I realized then what I heard was someone firing a firearm,' Frazier said." (Interview conducted for 11-22-13 NBC program Where Were You?, found online 11-7-13) "I was standing on the top step on the first floor when you go out of the Texas school book building...And I was in the shadow..." (As to who was in the Altgens photo) "It was Billy Lovelady." (On the shots) "The first shot, when they were turning the corner there, they were being led by a group of motorcycle policemen, and they were cutting their motorcycles on and off and making them backfire. The first shot I thought it was someone (Tom Brokaw finishes his sentence "backfire") But then with the second and third I realized that it was no longer a backfire." (9-27-14 appearance at the AARC Conference in Bethesda, Maryland, video found on vimeo) (On seeing Jacqueline Kennedy) "I mentioned to a lady by the name of Sarah, when I was standing on the top steps of the school book depository, as the presidential parade come by. And I said to her 'Isn't she beautiful? She looks just like she does in the pictures.'" (When asked by Robert Groden the name of the person standing next to him at the time of the shooting) "The person standing next to me there during the parade and before the parade was a lady that worked upstairs and her name is Sarah...and her last name I don't remember right off. And then down in front of me was Mr. Shelley, a little bit over to my left. And real in the very bottom down there was my good friend Billy Lovelady. (Later) Billy was standing down there at the bottom of the steps in that famous picture...That was Billy Lovelady. And that pops up more than you want to know, and people try to say that that was Lee Oswald. But it was not."

Geez, people, Buell Frazier is a credible witness who claimed from the beginning that 1) the bag he saw in Oswald's possession was too small to hold the rifle; 2) he initially believed shots had been fired from the knoll area; and 3) the last two shots were much closer together than shots one and two. He is about as strong a witness for a conspiracy as there is.

Of course, he has also told us many times now that the person standing next to him was a woman named Sarah. This is an obvious reference to Sarah Stanton. But has anyone found her picture to compare to Prayer "Man"? I suspect not.

There's also this. Prayer Man appears to be much shorter than Frazier. It follows then that Prayer "Man" might very well be a woman. Was it Sarah Stanton? I don't know. But the argument we can assume it was Oswald even though no one saw Oswald on the steps and Oswald himself said he was in the building, is a weak one. Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence. Where is the extraordinary evidence?

Edited by Pat Speer
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The fact is that nobody said they saw ANYONE there. Even BWF who is looking right at him! Clearly someone was there. If not Oswald I throw the question back to you. How come nobody mentions this guy?

There are a bunch of people standing around. No one remembers this specific person. Maybe he wasn't that memorable, which would suggest it wasn't Oswald. I just don't get why the default is thinking it would have to be Oswald when he would be the most memorable person standing there.

Like I said earlier, it pompous to think we can recreate the entire scene to the millisecond based on testimony and literature, and in doing so come to wild conclusions that it MUST be Oswald just because we run into a void we can't account for.

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Buell Wesley Frazier (11-22-63 affidavit for Dallas County, 24H209) “I was standing on the front steps of the building when the parade came by, and I watched the parade go by. After President Kennedy had got out of my sight, I heard three shots. I stood there, then people started running by, and I turned, and went back in the building.” (12-5-63 sworn statement to the U.S. Secret Service, CD87 p796) "I was standing on the front steps when the parade passed in front of the building. When the shooting occurred, I did not realize the shots were really shots until the second one. At first I thought it was backfire. I did not realize the shots had come from this building but thought they had come from somewhere around the triple underpass or railroad tracks." (3-11-64 testimony before the Warren Commission, 2H210-245) (On his location during the shooting) "I was standing on the steps there and watched for the parade to come by and so I did and I stood there until he come by." (On who was with him at this time) "I stayed around there pretty close to Mr. Shelley and this boy Billy Lovelady and just standing there, people talking and just talking about how pretty a day it turned out to be, because I told you earlier it was an old cloudy and misty day and then it didn't look like it was going to be a pretty day at all." (Anybody else?) "There was a lady there, a heavy-set lady who worked upstairs there whose name is Sarah something, I don't know her last name." (On the shooting) “just right after he went by he hadn’t hardly got by, I heard a sound and if you have ever been around motorcycles you know how they backfire, and so I thought one of them motorcycles backfired…but it wasn’t just a few seconds that, you know, I heard two more of the same type of, you know, sounds, and by that time people was running everywhere, and falling down and screaming, and naturally then I knew something was wrong…to be frank with you I thought it come from down there, where that underpass is.” (3-18-64 statement to the FBI, 22H647) “At the time President Kennedy was shot I was standing on the front steps of the Texas School Book Depository. I was with William H. Shelley…and Billy Lovelady.” (2-13-69 testimony in the trial of Clay Shaw) (On where he was standing when the shots were fired) "I watched the parade from the top of the steps there, the main entrance into Texas School Books." (When asked to point out this location on an exhibit) "Right here. It is the main entrance right here. There in the shadows you have several steps and a rail, and I was standing right there at the top of the rail." (When asked who he was standing with) "When I was standing there at the top of the stairs I was standing there by a heavyset lady who worked up in our office, her name is Sara, I forget her last name, but she was standing right there beside me when we watched the motorcade." (Anyone else?) "Right down in front of me at the bottom of the steps my foreman Bill Shelley and Billy Lovelady were standing there." (On the shooting) “Just right after they made the turn there was several motorcycle policeman leading the motorcade and right after they turned, after the car made the turn, it sounded like the motorcycles were backfiring… Shortly after there were two more in rapid succession.” (When asked if he knew they were rifle shots) "Well, the two that come in fast succession by that time, like I said, people were hollering, and then I recognized them, they were rifle shots." (When asked the time lapse between the first and second shots) "It was just a few seconds." (When asked the time lapse between the second and third) "When I heard the second noise, the third was followed nearly just right back to back. It was fired in rapid succession." (He was then asked to demonstrate the spacing of the shots by clapping his hands, but the spacing of his hand claps was not noted on the transcripts of the trial) (11-21-77 interview with HSCA investigators Moriarty and Day, edited down from a transcript provided by Richard Gilbride) "everybody was following the presidential motorcade...then I heard a loud sound--motorcycle backfire...from where I was standing, there was some trees and some people--so I actually couldn't see. But what had actually happened was the first shot...and then I heard the same sound. It wasn't anywheres even close to me...It was then that I realized--as people were beginning to run--and it became quite still. Before I had the chance to be heard, a sound--like a motorcycle backfire--what sounded like a backfire erupt." (When asked if the shots sounded the same) "the noises that I heard was all similar...they matched or they were from the 6th story...they seemed to be all pretty the same...Like I say, the first one that was fired, and then it seemed like it was only another few seconds and then they's coming up with another...they was in tandem. They was in the same area, the same direction. You know, like the same sound." (7-23-86 testimony in televised mock trial, On Trial: Lee Harvey Oswald) (When asked how many shots he heard) "Three." (When asked if he thought the shots came from the railroad) "Yes, sir, from the knoll there." (When asked again about the direction of the shots) "I thought they came from the knoll here." (He is then asked to write the words "grassy knoll" on a map of Dealey Plaza and put an X where he thought the shots had come from. He writes the words on the map to the west of the arcade, and then puts an X by these words at the northernmost point of the picket fence, in the railroad yards to the west of the arcade.)

(6-21-02 oral history with the Sixth Floor Museum) "I was standing at the top of the steps, the entrance, to the Texas School Book Depository. I was standing in the shadows...When they turned from Houston Street onto Elm there, and started down to the underpasses there, I remember I remarked to myself, I said, 'well, they look just like they do in the pictures'... (When asked how long it was after the limo had completed its turn onto Elm Street and started heading away that he heard the first shot) "It wasn't very long before there was a shot. And, as I said earlier, from listening to the motorcycles that was leading the President's car that had been backfiring, at first I thought it was a backfire from a motorcycle..." (When asked if the shot sounded like backfires) "Yes. But then shortly after, there was two more. By that time there was really chaos. There was people running and everything and you knew something wasn't right...I couldn't actually see what was going on in the President's car...After they had passed and dropped out of sight, I couldn't see what was going on." (When asked when he first realized Kennedy had been shot) "By the time the second and third shot was fired, I realized it wasn't a motorcycle backfire, because it had a different sound to it. And I realized someone was firing, and people was, as I said in that whole area there was running and falling down..." (When asked from where he thought the shots were fired) "The sound to me at that time sounded like it was coming from up above...the only thing I can say is that I realized it was gunfire, but to be specific as to what building it was coming from other than saying it was coming from up above where we were standing, I can't be more specific than that..." (When asked how many shots) "I heard three shots. There was one, and then there was, the other two was much closer in succession." (When asked the length of the shooting) "I don't know exact, but probably, I would probably say all, and this is probably, I don't know for a fact, I would probably say all three shots was taken within 15 seconds...There was the first one, and then the second and third one was just almost just back to back. It was very fast." (When asked the time between the last two shots) "I would probably say, maybe five seconds, if it was that long." (When asked if there could have been more or fewer than three shots) "Not fewer than three...I heard three." (When asked where the car was when the first shot was fired) "It wasn't very far after it dropped out of my sight...I couldn't see the car...The car was out of my view when the first shot was fired...(When attempting to clarify his approximation of 15 seconds for the shooting) "If you take and fire a shot say like for instance on the first second, and then the second shot might not have been somewhere until like the 8th to 10th seconds, and then the third one I would say somewhere between the 10th and 15th." (3-27-13 appearance at the Irving Central Library, video found online) "I heard the shots...I was standing back in the shadows there--when you walk into the Texas School Book Building today, if you walk up in there, there's a space there, and I was standing there watching the parade back in the shadows. You can't see me, but I was there. After the third shot, it was really mayhem there...Sarah, the lady I was standing by up on the top step back in the shadows, we looked at one another. We really didn't have a lot to say." (7-13-13 appearance at the Sixth Floor Museum, as shown on C-Span) (When asked how many shots he heard) "Shots. I heard three. In that presidential parade--it was being led by--and there was motorcycle policemen, and these motorcycle policemen were cutting their motorcycles on and off. If you know anything or you ride motorcycles you know that you can do that and make 'em backfire...So when the first shot occurred, I thought it was just a motorcycle backfiring. Then it wasn't long after that that there was two and the two were closer in succession than between the first and second. And then I realized that that wasn't a motorcycle backfire, it was somebody shooting a weapon. And down here in Dealey Plaza, it was total chaos. People was running and screaming and falling down and hollering." (When asked if he had a sense where the shots were coming from) "The first one, when I was standing back on the top of the steps, sounded like it come to my right down where the motorcade was, But then the second and third sounded much closer..." (When describing what happened after the shots, after a crying woman came up to him and the woman standing next to him and told them the President had been shot.) "We looked bewildered. I turned to Sarah and she said 'she said somebody has shot the President.' And I said 'I thought that's what she said.' She said 'she did say that.''' (Frazier had thereby confirmed that Sarah Stanton was standing with him on the top of the steps both before the shots, and for several minutes after.) (11-18-13 article in the Richmond Times-Dispatch) (On the shooting) "'The car turned, and boom — that first sound, that you never forget,' Allman said. 'It wasn’t the crack sound of a rifle. It was a loud boom sound.' Frazier also heard the sound, thinking one of the motorcycles escorting the limousine had backfired. 'And then shortly after that, I heard two more, and I realized then what I heard was someone firing a firearm,' Frazier said." (Interview conducted for 11-22-13 NBC program Where Were You?, found online 11-7-13) "I was standing on the top step on the first floor when you go out of the Texas school book building...And I was in the shadow..." (As to who was in the Altgens photo) "It was Billy Lovelady." (On the shots) "The first shot, when they were turning the corner there, they were being led by a group of motorcycle policemen, and they were cutting their motorcycles on and off and making them backfire. The first shot I thought it was someone (Tom Brokaw finishes his sentence "backfire") But then with the second and third I realized that it was no longer a backfire." (9-27-14 appearance at the AARC Conference in Bethesda, Maryland, video found on vimeo) (On seeing Jacqueline Kennedy) "I mentioned to a lady by the name of Sarah, when I was standing on the top steps of the school book depository, as the presidential parade come by. And I said to her 'Isn't she beautiful? She looks just like she does in the pictures.'" (When asked by Robert Groden the name of the person standing next to him at the time of the shooting) "The person standing next to me there during the parade and before the parade was a lady that worked upstairs and her name is Sarah...and her last name I don't remember right off. And then down in front of me was Mr. Shelley, a little bit over to my left. And real in the very bottom down there was my good friend Billy Lovelady. (Later) Billy was standing down there at the bottom of the steps in that famous picture...That was Billy Lovelady. And that pops up more than you want to know, and people try to say that that was Lee Oswald. But it was not."

Geez, people, Buell Frazier is a credible witness who claimed from the beginning that 1) the bag he saw in Oswald's possession was too small to hold the rifle; 2) he initially believed shots had been fired from the knoll area; and 3) the last two shots were much closer together than shots one and two. He is about as strong a witness for a conspiracy as there is.

Of course, he has also told us many times now that the person standing next to him was a woman named Sarah. This is an obvious reference to Sarah Stanton. But has anyone found her picture to compare to Prayer "Man"? I suspect not.

There's also this. Prayer Man appears to be much shorter than Frazier. It follows then that Prayer "Man" might very well be a woman. Was it Sarah Stanton? I don't know. But the argument we can assume it was Oswald even though no one saw Oswald on the steps and Oswald himself said he was in the building, is a weak one. Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence. Where is the extraordinary evidence?

A credible witness?

Where did he usually eat his lunch? He can't even keep that straight because he gave two different stories.

Why did Linnie-Mae rush off to tell the cops at 3pm that Oswald had a long package that she thought was "suspicious" that morning when Buell claims he told her the night before he came home early to get curtain rods.

Why is Edward Shields telling the HSCA that there was no one with Frazier that morning and when asked where is rider is, he said he let him off at the front entrance.

Why is Wes talking decades later about seeing Oswald leaving after the assassination?

If it's Stanton (are you for real on that?), why did he claim he couldn't ID who it was when shown? In fact, why did he initially refuse to ID even himself?

Why did Linnie-Mae send the cops to Parkland looking for him?

Why was he even having an extended visit with a man who he had to avoid when living in Huntsville?

Why of all the days did he dawdle so much that he claims Oswald got 50 yards ahead? He claims it was his usual practice, yet Oswald never gets ahead any other time.

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